Phonetics
David Wynne-Griffiths
read, but on the TV the Blessed Tony talked about returning to
phonetics as a tried and trusted method which advanced reading ages
by up to a year. Can anyone with experience in primary school
teaching please explain what were the methods of teaching reading
which are now to be abandoned?
--
~~~~~~~~~~
David W-G
~~~~~~~~~~
Aonghas P MacKenzie
from David Wynne-Griffiths <dav...@zetnet.co.uk> contains these words:
No experience of primary teaching, but I understand that the methods
to be discarded are the erstwhile trendy 'they'll learn when they are
ready' dogma, and other similar remnants of the disgraced
featherbrained 'Progressive' movement in education.
The recent findings of a university team are that the teaching by
'static phonetics' is adequate, and usually results in children
attaining the correct levels of skill for their age - which follows,
doesn't it?
Static phonetics is the taking of words like 'cat' and 'dog',
pointing out the sounds that the letters make, and progressing from there.
Dynamic phonetics has been shown to have advantages over static:
children tend to attain a higher reading age than normal. Dynamic
phonetics (as I understand it) is taking letters and small groups of
letters, and with them demonstrating the sounds they make, then
building up words with these 'building blocks'.
We shall just have to wait and see if the projected improvement on
Tony's static dynamics programme is sufficient to sweep the
'Progressive' trendies away for good - and I use the word 'good' advisedly!
--
Aonghas Mackenzie
an.b...@zetnet.co.uk
Fiona Cope
from David Wynne-Griffiths <dav...@zetnet.co.uk> contains these words:
..Can anyone with experience in primary school
> teaching please explain what were the methods of teaching reading
> which are now to be abandoned?
Haven't heard the announcements David, and as the English/Welsh
system is different from the Scottish, I probably have no right to
comment anyway. Also it's many years since I had a class of my own to
teach to read and my own children are now 11 and nearing 14. <I
wasn't working in schools while my children were small, then returned
to do some supply teaching. <age 5-12> Had my own nursery class <age
3-5> within the primary school for a couple of years but have not
been in the education system for a few years now. <cheers quietly..;))>>
I'm presuming the same as Oingas, that the proposed changes are a
reaction to years of laissez-faire progressive-type approaches which
perhaps haven't worked as well as its exponents would have liked. I
just feel sorry for some of the children who have perhaps not
advanced as well or as quickly as they might otherwise have done,
although, do remember a lecturer telling us that "a child will learn
despite you." This may sound shocking and callous, but it's true to
a certain extent - as soon as babies are born they are reacting to
their environment and young children pick things up very quickly.
I didn't teach my own children *formally* at home as I don't believe
in the extreme 'hot-housing' techniques <especially with *very* young
children> that some possibly well-intentioned parents have tried, and
also respected the methods their school was using.
We did as many parents do - when they were babies/toddlers, we talked
to them, laughed with them, played nursery rhyme type games, songs
with them, and read to them and shared and discussed picture books
with them, listened to their 'stories' and involved them in many day
to day activities. They would search for items in the supermarket for
us, starting to recognise pictures and words, and help me baking,
finding ingredients, etc. These type of interactive activities bring
in many aspects - colour, shape, number - and all the above mentioned
activities are pre-cursors to reading, all helping the child's speech
development and therefore their reading readiness.
For young children, play is their work. They will play despite us <as
they will learn despite us> but development throught play can be
enhanced and brought on through providing some materials <not always
expensive> and appropriate situations. <When our children were tiny
they banged on saucepans with wooden spoons and made shakers with
containers and dried peas. They also had plenty of books <and were
members of the library at a very early age with their own tickets and
got to stamp their own books> and the usual toys as well.> I took our
boys from an early age to playgroups where the mums played with the
children and it gave them opportunities to have their first
experiences playing with other children and dealing with the ensuing
experiences <!> in a controlled environment. Young children play
alone at first, absorbed in only what they are doing, then perhaps
watching others. The parallel play stage can cause the adults anxiety
when they try to encourage little Johnny to play with Jimmy, but they
just aren't ready for that stage and play alongside each other, but
not involving each other.
Our children then attended a nursery class within the primary school
at the age of three until five. This was only for a couple of hours
or so, but was without the parent and gave them more opportunity for
more social play - the children progressing through the different
stages of play, through to partnership play and group play. My
assistant and I tried to provide an interesting environment for the
children in our nursery class - we tried to give them the attention
they needed, listen to and converse with them, play with them as well
as giving them opportunities for solitary and group play and new experiences.
We encouraged them and gave them the means to be more
self-sufficient. Well-meaning but busy harassed mums hurried them in
and pulled off their coats, etc - we tried to take time to let the
children fasten their own buttons, zips. They had their own peg with
a picture which they recognised and their name. We had a system for
snack time where they found their own name card and posted it to show
that they had had snack - they took turns <names on a list> to help
to prepare the fruit, etc for snack. <Debbie, sorry Debs will know
*all* about all this!!>
The furniture was all child-sized and anything which wasn't was
adapted to suit and everything designed and presented so that the
children didn't need to keep asking for help. <the teacher as
enabler> The children soon got into the routine <young children
actually like and feel safe with routines> of washing their hands,
getting their own snack, eating in a social setting, then washing up
afterwards. The work that was done in the nursery was an extension of
what the parents do with the children at home and it is very much in
partnership with the family.
We didn't teach them to read formally in the nursery class, but all
the activities were increasing their readiness for reading, writing,
counting, etc. and with liaison with the infant teacher <hopefully in
the same school so the child is familiar with everything> the move to
P1 is easy and the infant teacher can then take them on from there.
The multi-level approaches taken to teaching a child to read are
quite numerous and often individual to the child, teacher, Head
Teacher, Education Authority and the whole thing is quite a complex
story. Still involves play especially in the early stages and still
involves listening skills as well as other multi-sensory stimulation
<not that type Adrain> and activities involving memory and recall.
<all their past experience of the rhythm of nursery rhymes has
helped> I believe that once something has been understood, eg.
multiplication tables, it should be committed to memory for quick and
easy recall which will last pretty well throughout life. I
unfortunately had a battle with our children's teacher who was also
the Head Teacher, who thought that learning tables, etc was old
fashioned and got them to merely write out the tables in the back of
their jotters. I asked my sons how they did their sums and they said
they looked up the tables in the back of the jotter. I asked the
teacher in desperation how on earth they were meant to manage in
later life if they were shopping for 7 tins of baked beans in the
supermarket and they didn't happen to have their jotter with them.
She agreed eventually. <She also did not believe in formal spelling
either at first until we queried it, and called a parent a dinosaur
previously when they enquired about it. The parent withdrew their
child from the school and put the child to another school.>
I've already written *far* too much and am busy with numerous other
things ATM, but...it is a long and complex subject with a combination
of many approaches IMO. When I had P1s they would draw a picture.
Being self-obsessed little beings <normal> it was usually me, Mummy,
Daddy, brother, dog, house, whatever. I got them to tell me about
the picture and I wrote at the top or bottom what they were telling
me and read it back to them. <their first stories> For writing, they
would eventually write over my writing, then progress to copying it
underneath, then progress to writing their own little story. <This
was quite a few years ago and approaches may well have changed!>
We would also have things labelled - door, window, table, etc. The
last I knew many of the schools here were using the Oxford Reading
Tree <reading scheme> which seemed very good. Had a recognisable
group of characters who were featured throughout the scheme. The
first books were purely the story told in pictures for the children
to discuss with the teacher and parents, then introducing one or two
key words. When I taught we had the first words written on small
cards in tins and the children practised at home also. <Partly the
Look & Say method> Started with lower case letters first before
introducing capitals. Gradually, as their vocabulary increased new
words were written in a jotter or on a marker.
I also used phonic methods. We called it 'sounds' in the classroom
and would start with the sounds of various single letters - to avoid
confusion, I called 'c' curly c <the sound c> and 'k' kicking k, etc.
We'd then have blends - learning say the ending 'a' plus 't' makes 'at',
then put the learned single sounds in front -
m at
c at
s at
h at etc, etc.
Many of the schools here use the Letterland scheme - each letter has
a picture and a name - Hairy Hat Man, Dippy Duck. Lots of games and
activities for learning and reinforcing.
And so on...and so forth...
I did feel sorry for a friend of mine who spent a period of time at
another primary school. <as a child in the sixties.> They appeared to
be guinea pigs at the time for a phonic scheme <which I believe now
to have been 'i.t.a' - initial teaching alphabet> which involved
phonic spellings which had to be learned only to be 'unlearned' later.
Eg:
No Character Name Example Traditional Spelling
1 ae <joined> ae raet rate
3 c kee cat cat
7 g gae gun gun
10 j jae jieant giant
Apparently there was to be no formal teaching of spelling until the
children are reading fairly fluently. As a result it was expected
that the children would write very freely, being unhampered by
emphasis on correct spelling.
It had been a major research project of the Reading Research Unit of
London University but stopped in 1967 due to lack of funds.
Fiona
David Wynne-Griffiths
development of the original method. I think we did most of the
things that Fiona lists with our children, and we let them proceed at
their own pace. My first two children were very bright and Camilla
was reading by the time she was three. Ralph took a little longer.
Jamie started to read when he was about 5, and I well remember the
magic night when he first read his bed time story to us.
Grandson Robert started at primary school in September. At first he
came home with books he said he had 'read' but that meant only that
he could identify the objects and connect them to the words.
However, two months later and at the age of 4 1/2 he is beginning to
read. He brings home a reading book every night which we have to
listen to him reading, and his progress is excellent.
My best birthday card last week was entirely made by Robert who wrote
the messages both on the cover and inside. Atworth is an amazing
little school with a most active PTA, and several dragons with
formidable fund raising ability. As a result it is exceptionally
well equipped with computers and there are masses of books. They
even have a swimming pool!
Incidentally my twin grandchildren prosper. Alice has overtaken the
normal weight for a baby of her age, and George is well up to the
average weight for age. They are, of course, both absolutely gorgeous!
Aonghas P MacKenzie
APM
(Was going to post your tape today but - - - )
Helen Deborah Vecht
Another method is 'look and say' which relies on a combination of
word recognition and guesswork. This has been the cause of much grief
and many howlers. Kids who pick up things fast might not have had
much trouble. The lack of logic made learning to read long or
unfamiliar words difficult.
Then there was the Initial Teaching Alphabet (ITA) remember that? It
fast went the way of the dodo.
Helen (plumbing the depths of her ignorant memory...)
Elaine Jones
<URL:mailto:co...@zetnet.co.uk> wrote:
>
> I also used phonic methods. We called it 'sounds' in the classroom
> and would start with the sounds of various single letters - to avoid
> confusion, I called 'c' curly c <the sound c> and 'k' kicking k, etc.
> We'd then have blends - learning say the ending 'a' plus 't' makes 'at',
> then put the learned single sounds in front -
>
> m at
> c at
> s at
> h at etc, etc.
I remember the teacher using this method when I started school (early 50s)
and being thouroughly bored stiff as I could already read fluently, without
speaking aloud - Mum simply used to tell me what a word was.
Her theory was that I learnt to read from the wildflower and bird book,
knowing the names and associating the printed words.
--
...ElaineJ... Visit Jones' Pages at http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/ejones
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David Wynne-Griffiths
from Helen Deborah Vecht <helen...@zetnet.co.uk> contains these words:
> I think the term should be 'phonics' not phonetics.
According to the dictionary either will do.
Gerald L R Stubbs
from Helen Deborah Vecht <helen...@zetnet.co.uk> contains these words:
> I think the term should be 'phonics' not phonetics.
> Another method is 'look and say' which relies on a combination of
> word recognition and guesswork. This has been the cause of much grief
> and many howlers. Kids who pick up things fast might not have had
> much trouble. The lack of logic made learning to read long or
> unfamiliar words difficult.
> Then there was the Initial Teaching Alphabet (ITA) remember that? It
> fast went the way of the dodo.
> Helen
My own view of the thing is that a) No mammal enjoys pain.
b) There is a standard for the
English language.
Combine a and b, and there is no trouble in teaching small,
human mammals to use the language correctly from the word go.
Anything else is pinko liberalism. Useless.
--
Stubbsy stu...@zetnet.co.uk
<:)(((((><<
Gerald L R Stubbs
from Aonghas P MacKenzie <an.b...@zetnet.co.uk> contains these words:
> No experience of primary teaching, but I understand that the methods
> to be discarded are the erstwhile trendy 'they'll learn when they are
> ready' dogma, and other similar remnants of the disgraced
> featherbrained 'Progressive' movement in education.
<big snip>
> We shall just have to wait and see if the projected improvement on
> Tony's static dynamics programme is sufficient to sweep the
> 'Progressive' trendies away for good - and I use the word 'good' advisedly!
> Aonghas
I am glad to see, Oingas, that you do not promote anything
that you commented on, above.
Kinder should be taught our language, as they will use it
in their future life, from the word go.
If they are laggardly or unwilling to learn, then it should
be beaten into them until they manage to comprehend.
Blair is an ass and is pandering to the Liberals.
Liberals read the Grauniad and tread a poncy, politically-
correct, wishy-washy, hurt no one, aren't we all friends,
not in the real world line.
Give me Jimmy Knapp (sp.) any day. At least I know what he
stands for. I can hit him. I can't hit a liberal, they
move with the shadows.
--
Stubbsy stu...@zetnet.co.uk
<:)(((((><<
Debbie Panks
from Fiona Cope <co...@zetnet.co.uk> contains these words:
same here.
> We did as many parents do - when they were babies/toddlers, we talked
> to them, laughed with them, played nursery rhyme type games, songs
> with them, and read to them and shared and discussed picture books
> with them, listened to their 'stories' and involved them in many day
> to day activities. They would search for items in the supermarket for
> us, starting to recognise pictures and words, and help me baking,
> finding ingredients, etc. These type of interactive activities bring
> in many aspects - colour, shape, number - and all the above mentioned
> activities are pre-cursors to reading, all helping the child's speech
> development and therefore their reading readiness.
I agree with this. It is the 'quality time' (I hate those words)
spent talking to a child, giving them appropriate words for their age.
Rebecca had books ( board and fabric from when she was about 6 months
and I spent time going through them ie: this is a duck. Ducks say quack.
Oh look this is a ball, its a yellow one. I would try to say
something different
but mostly reinforce the words.
> For young children, play is their work. They will play despite us <as
> they will learn despite us> but development throught play can be
> enhanced and brought on through providing some materials <not always
> expensive> and appropriate situations.
The more variety of materials the better. My favourite was cornflour
with just enough water to make it run until you touched it but then
go solid. We also used wood chip and straw instead of the sandpit with
animals or people
I took our
> boys from an early age to playgroups
Rebexcca went to work with me at 14 months old. She loved it and they
were differnt experiences to her home ones.
> Our children then attended a nursery class within the primary school
> at the age of three until five.
Rebecca attended a state nursery school from 3-4 and a nursery class
at her school
for one term.
> We encouraged them and gave them the means to be more
> self-sufficient. Well-meaning but busy harassed mums hurried them in
> and pulled off their coats, etc - we tried to take time to let the
> children fasten their own buttons, zips. They had their own peg with
> a picture which they recognised and their name. We had a system for
> snack time where they found their own name card and posted it to show
> that they had had snack - they took turns <names on a list> to help
> to prepare the fruit, etc for snack. <Debbie, sorry Debs will know
> *all* about all this!!>
Yes standard practice, trying to encourage independance.At the nursery Rebecca
went to they were provided with a jug with Milk or water and had to
pour their own drink.
> The furniture was all child-sized and anything which wasn't was
> I've already written *far* too much and am busy with numerous other
> things ATM, but...it is a long and complex subject with a combination
> of many approaches IMO. When I had P1s they would draw a picture.
> Being self-obsessed little beings <normal> it was usually me, Mummy,
> Daddy, brother, dog, house, whatever. I got them to tell me about
> the picture and I wrote at the top or bottom what they were telling
> me and read it back to them. <their first stories> For writing, they
> would eventually write over my writing, then progress to copying it
> underneath, then progress to writing their own little story. <This
> was quite a few years ago and approaches may well have changed!>
they still do that in Rebeccas school but in reception she is now
enocoraged to right and spell words themselves, spelling them out.
The teacher then corrects one or two words but not all mistakes so
as not to make the child feel incapable.
.Debs.. who understood and agreed with all you said.
Fiona Cope
from Debbie Panks <deb...@zetnet.co.uk> contains these words:
> .Debs.. who understood and agreed with all you said.
Thanks, do you think you'll go back to being a nursery nurse?
Fi
Rodney Wakefield
from Elaine Jones <ela...@cae-coed.zetnet.co.uk> contains these words:
> I remember the teacher using this method when I started school (early 50s)
> and being thouroughly bored stiff as I could already read fluently, without
> speaking aloud - Mum simply used to tell me what a word was.
> Her theory was that I learnt to read from the wildflower and bird book,
> knowing the names and associating the printed words.
IIRC, we taught Fleur to read with the Ladybird Ant and Bee book.
English was her main achievement in her Gcses with A+ A(Lit and
Lang). We too told her what a word was, also using bird and animal books.
Rod
Debbie Panks
from Fiona Cope <co...@zetnet.co.uk> contains these words:
> Fi
I am not sure. I work at playgroup one morning a week at the moment.
I am having problems with my rightv leg at the moment. It means
I can't kneel down and get to the childrens level. they did
say the bone is bruised and that it may be arthritis or the cold.
....Debs......