Question on if Yojimbo keeps documents inside of the program or if I can still view it's contents from other apps.

[Kip Vaughan]

I heard that Yojimbo stores documents dirrectly in the program. Does that mean if I import a document into Yojimbo I won't be able to view it from within Punakea / HoudahSpot / Finder? I could see that as being a problem as I rely on other file navigation programs. Could someone tell me how this works? Thank you

[Patrick Woolsey]

That's correct; Yojimbo does directly store any info you add or import:

<http://www.barebones.com/support/yojimbo/faqs.html#importing>

since its purpose is not to be a file manager like the Finder, but rather
to store, organize & retrieve information without worrying about files. :)



Regards,

Patrick Woolsey
==
Bare Bones Software, Inc. <http://www.barebones.com>
P.O. Box 1048, Bedford, MA 01730-1048

[Kip Vaughan]

Will the tags that I create in Yojimbo show up in HoudahSpot and Punakea and visa versa? There are features from those programs that I would still like to rely on and end not up being entirely dependent on Yojimbo. If Yojimbo is based on the same tagging technology built into OS X it seems like compatibility with other products wouldn't be a problem. Is that true?

[Patrick Woolsey]

At 15:28 -0700 07/19/2012, Kip Vaughan wrote:
>Will the tags that I create in Yojimbo show up in HoudahSpot and Punakea
>and visa versa? There are features from those programs that I would still
>like to rely on and end not up being entirely dependent on Yojimbo. If
>Yojimbo is based on the same tagging technology built into OS X it seems
>like compatibility with other products wouldn't be a problem. Is that true?

Yojimbo's tags are specific to the information stored within it, and there
is no cross-over between it and apps like the ones you mention (which apply
their own tagging method to files).


[PS: The OS does not currently provide tagging features.]

[Kip Vaughan]

I thought that openmeta was built into the OS but I guess that is an open source project that is outside of the OS. If I understand correctly the programs I mentioned earlier rely on openmeta. This is the reason I can tag something in HoudahSpot and then open it in Punakea or Yep. It is a big disadvantage to not have the tagging open to other apps; Firefox and Lightroom have closed tagging as well and it can be frustrating since all my tagged bookmarks and photos won't show up in any other program. It is nice that you can tag bookmarks in Yojimbo but I would really like for the same tagged bookmark to show up in my web browser as well.

[Patrick Woolsey]

At 12:41 -0700 07/20/2012, Kip Vaughan wrote:
>I thought that openmeta was built into the OS but I guess that is an open
>source project that is outside of the OS. If I understand correctly the
>programs I mentioned earlier rely on openmeta. This is the reason I can
>tag something in HoudahSpot and then open it in Punakea or Yep. It is a
>big disadvantage to not have the tagging open to other apps; Firefox and
>Lightroom have closed tagging as well and it can be frustrating since all
>my tagged bookmarks and photos won't show up in any other program. It is
>nice that you can tag bookmarks in Yojimbo but I would really like for the
>same tagged bookmark to show up in my web browser as well.

Yes, OpenMeta is a third-party project, and the file management apps you
mention do use it.

To be really useful, a shared tag system would have to be both universally
available and broadly adopted, i.e. not only by file managers and Yojimbo,
but by web browsers (Safari, Firefox, Chrome) and other apps (Address Book,
iPhoto, iWork, etc).

[Kip Vaughan]

I guess I don't understand the reason why some apps rely on a closed tagging solution. Does the closed tag solution provide any functionality that the open tag solution doesn't have? Do you know why developers haven't decided on a tag standard yet?

[Jan Erik Moström]

On 2012-07-23, at 01:51 , Kip Vaughan wrote:

> I guess I don't understand the reason why some apps rely on a closed tagging solution. Does the closed tag solution provide any functionality that the open tag solution doesn't have? Do you know why developers haven't decided on a tag standard yet?

I will make a few guesses:

+ If I were a developer and had a working tagging solution I would not spend the time to port to another non-standard solution. If were to implement a new product and had no previous tagging solution then I would be OK to use a 3rd party solution (given that the licensing is OK)

+ I guess that the reason that there is no standard is because Apple own the OS and the file system and until (if they ever will) they decide on a solution there is no standard on the Mac

- jem

[Bill]

I'm not sure that this makes sense.  What is this "open tagging solution?"

Yojimbo is a database.  You put documents in the Yojimbo database, and then you can tag and sort them within Yojimbo.  Yojimbo contains and manages these documents.  Note that Yojimbo _does_ also make its internal data available to Spotlight, so if you do searches within OS X, you will see the results in its searches.

However, at this time, there are a few (major, IMO) downsides to Yojimbo's Spotlight integration:

1)  Tags aren't used.  It's just contained text.  So if I have a few tags on a Yojimbo item, and search Spotlight for those tags, they will not appear (GRRR)

2)  Yojimbo doesn't support Quicklook yet, now a year after Lion shipped.  So if I get a Yojimbo result in Spotlight, I get an icon and a big blob of the form GUID.yojimboitem.  I cannot see what the item is without opening Yojimbo.

But do note that a "standard tagging solution" really doesn't mean anything.  There is not any agreed upon standard: OpenMeta may be "open" but it is not native functionality in OS X, and I don't know how it would really make sense in a database application such as Yojimbo anyway.

[Kip Vaughan]

Yeah, the more I work with software that uses tags the more I realize the importance of there needing to be an operation that is managed by the OS for other software to rely on. I have been using Default Folder X to set my tags in the save as dialog box but I find that it doesn't save the tags at all if I write the tags from the export menu of an Adobe application. Had the tagging been built into the OS Adobe would have been aware of this problem and would try to offer a fix for it but as a 3rd party product I don't see them willing to put forth the effort to do that. In Mountain Lion apple seems to be moving away from the hierarchical system approach to some degree so I am hoping that they will realize how much they need to build tagging support into their OS. I am surprised it has taken them so long.

[Kip Vaughan]

If Yojimbo makes it's internal data available on Spotlight and products like HoudahSpot are mainly just a front end to spotlight it seems like that means the Yojimbo features would show up in HS? Or does that mean that the tags would not due to the fact that Yojimbo doesn't support openmeta?

[Steve Kalkwarf]

On Jul 27, 2012, at 1:30 PM, Kip Vaughan <vaugh...@gmail.com> wrote:

> If Yojimbo makes it's internal data available on Spotlight and products like HoudahSpot are mainly just a front end to spotlight it seems like that means the Yojimbo features would show up in HS? Or does that mean that the tags would not due to the fact that Yojimbo doesn't support openmeta?

Yes, querying should work. However, any tags added through HoudahSpot won't be visible within Yojimbo.

Steve

[Kip Vaughan]

That will be a problem since the most common place for me to add tags is in the save as dialog box via default folder x. If yojimbo had a feature that was similiar to the save as dialog then I could see that being a viable solution but if I have to first save it to the finder and then drag it into yojimbo that would get to be a pain to do with every file. Is there a way for yojimbo to make a save as dialog box that would add the files to it's database instead?

[Kip Vaughan]

[Steve Kalkwarf]

On Jul 30, 2012, at 6:35 PM, Kip Vaughan <vaugh...@gmail.com> wrote:

> That will be a problem since the most common place for me to add tags is in the save as dialog box via default folder x. If yojimbo had a feature that was similiar to the save as dialog then I could see that being a viable solution but if I have to first save it to the finder and then drag it into yojimbo that would get to be a pain to do with every file. Is there a way for yojimbo to make a save as dialog box that would add the files to it's database instead?

It's important to understand that Yojimbo doesn't keep files of any sort. The workflow you're describing seems like it's more suited to an application like Eagle Filer, which "collects" files, as opposed to Yojimbo, which gathers data.

Steve

[Charlie Garrison]

Good morning,

On 30/07/12 at 3:36 PM -0700, Kip Vaughan <vaugh...@gmail.com> wrote:

>Is there a way for yojimbo to make a save as dialog box that
>would add the files to it's database instead?

I haven't been following the whole thread, so not sure if this
would help. But what about the option to Print to PDF, which
also includes Print PDF to Yojimbo. You can add tags as part of
that process.


Charlie

--
Ꮚ Charlie Garrison ♊ <garr...@zeta.org.au>

O< ascii ribbon campaign - stop html mail - www.asciiribbon.org
〠 http://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc1855.txt

[Steven J Klein]

On Jul 31, 2012, at 8:34 AM, Steve Kalkwarf wrote:
> It's important to understand that Yojimbo doesn't keep files of any sort.

So when I drag a PDF into Yojimbo, what, exactly, gets imported?


Regards,
--
Steven Klein Computer Service
Apple & A+ Certified
Your Mac, PC & Network Expert
Phone: (248) YOUR-MAC
or (248) 968-7622

[Rich Siegel]

On Wednesday, August 1, 2012, Steven J Klein

<steven...@gmail.com> wrote:

>So when I drag a PDF into Yojimbo, what, exactly, gets imported?

The data is copied from your PDF and the data is stored in the
database. No information about the originating file is retained.
(Nor, in fact, is any notion retained that the data in fact came
from a file.)

R.
--
Rich Siegel Bare Bones Software, Inc.
<sie...@barebones.com> <http://www.barebones.com/>

Someday I'll look back on all this and laugh... until they
sedate me.

[Patrick Woolsey]

Steven J Klein <steven...@gmail.com> sez:

>On Jul 31, 2012, at 8:34 AM, Steve Kalkwarf wrote:
>> It's important to understand that Yojimbo doesn't keep files of any sort.
>
>So when I drag a PDF into Yojimbo, what, exactly, gets imported?
>

The data which that PDF contains will just be added to Yojimbo's own
storage system instead of a stand-alone file.