How mind is created

[Lokesh Sharma]

नमस्सर्वेभ्यः

According to Yoga Vasistha, mind creates the world as per it's desires. The body too is a creation of mind. Mind creates the web of जड and चेतन, otherwise everything is चिन्मात्र ब्रह्म. 

But how is the mind created? If mind is not created then how do you describe the world which cannot be established unless you accept the reality of the mind?

धन्यवादाः

[Jiva Das]

Lokesh: According to Yoga Vasistha, mind creates the world as per its desires. 

jd. Sanskrt translators use the word for *manas, *buddhi, and *citta. I suppose you mean *manas. 

It would be better in dealing with matters like this to give a quotation. 

"its desires"--I suppose you mean saMkalpa: and, while a saMkalpa may be a desire, 

it can also be a hatred. It is an attitude of mind, without bias, 

because it is a notion, a subtlety of Manas.Mind. 

Lo: The body too is a creation of mind. 

Mind creates the web of जड jaDa and चेतन cetana, 

jd: Who says Mind "creates"? Mind _is_ (*asti) and _becomes_ (*bhavati). 

Lo: otherwise everything is चिन्मात्र ब्रह्म cinmAtra brahma. 

jd. What is *cin.mAtra? Most people say "pure Consciousness". 

Well. *cit or *cin may be translated as Consciousness, 

but *mAtra does not mean "pure". 

A line of poetry is made of *mAtra.measures; 

*cinmAtra is not "pure" but a "complex" of things; 

so not empty but full. 

L: But how is the mind created? 

jd. from the TALKS of Ramana: 

t. 455.

Mrs. Dhar: I form part of the creation and so remain dependent. I cannot solve the riddle until I become independent. Yet I ask zrI bhagavan, should He not answer the question for me?

Ramana: Yes. It is bhagavan that says, "Become independent and solve the riddle yourself. It is for you to do it." Again: where are you now that you ask this question? Are you in the world, or is the world within you? You must admit that the world is not perceived in your sleep although you cannot deny your existence then. The world appears when you wake up. So where is it? Clearly the world is your thought. Thoughts are your projections. The 'I' is first created and then the world. The world is created by the 'I' which in its turn rises up from the Self. The riddle of the creation of the world is thus solved if you solve the creation of the 'I'. So I say, find your Self.

Again, does the world come and ask you "Why do 'I' exist? How was 'I' created?" It is you who ask the question. The questioner must establish the relationship between the world and himself. He must admit that the world is his own imagination. Who imagines it? Let him again find the 'I' and then the Self. Moreover, all the scientific and theological explanations do not harmonise. The diversities in such theories clearly show the uselessness of seeking such explanations. Such explanations are purely mental or intellectual and nothing more. Still, all of them are true according to the standpoint of the individual. There is no creation in the state of realisation. When one sees the world, one does not see oneself. When one sees the Self, the world is not seen. So see the Self and realise that there has been no creation. 

 

L: If mind is not created then how do you describe the world which cannot be established unless you accept the reality of the mind? 

jd. The Vaasishtha declares constantly the lack of Reality of both World and Mind. 

Mind is a Function, not a Creation, of Self, 

determined by prior experience in the form of vAsanA. 

That is *sat, being.so in *deza.kAla place&time.  

+++ 

We can continue this discussion by the Reply button, 

but I need you to define your terms as you understand them, 

and that will depend on where you learnes them. 

The Talks of Ramana are well worth exploring, 

for in the years that they were recorded, Ramana often dealt with the Vaasishtha. 

You can find my messy copy at 

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/y4estn1k7mq2jog/AABxMlSnQJzM_kGjmCjJpPGGa?dl=0

These are dialogs when Ramana first came to worldly fame. 

Enuf for now... 

xØx

 jd 

 

santoSaH paramo lAbhaH satsaGgaH paramA gatiH |
vicAraH paramaM jJAnaM zamo hi paramaM sukham ||

सन्तोषः परमो लाभः सत्सङ्गः परमा गतिः।
विचारः परमं ज्ञानं शमो हि परमं सुखम्॥
Contentment is the highest gain, Good Company the highest course,
Enquiry the highest wisdom, and Peace the highest enjoyment.
                             -- Yoga Vasishtha 

The complete YVFiles of this masterpiece can be found at

http://goo.gl/k3hRBX  

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[Lokesh Sharma]

I wish Samvid had translated the whole thing. Earlier I was of the opinion when I was a beginner that VLM translation is good. Now I know that it was a good attempt but it is useless.

Then I came across AB commentary, I felt I had discovered a treasure, it gave accurate meaning of many verses but later I saw he is inserting ideas from Shankara Advaita without any need, hence not illuminating the original idea. A commentator should never do this.

Bhaskarakanth tika is also there but it is extinct for most of the Nirvana Prakaran and only fragments of those are found.

BL Atreya books explaining Yoga Vasistha philosophy are the best translations so far.

I also saw your work, you have done a great job gathering all the translations at the same place but it too doesn't prove much useful sometimes because mostly I feel there's a flow missing when I read your translation. You seem to do word by word translation instead of capturing the intended meaning which is good in its own right but the mind has to do a lot more work to understand the intended meaning than to just look at the Sanskrit and get its meaning.

अतः कोपि न सम्यक् पूर्णः च अनुवादः न अस्ति इति द्रष्ट्वा अहम् स्वयं संस्कृतम् पठनम् आरब्धवान्। संस्कृतपठनं अधिकं फलं दीयते इति भाति यतोहि पारिभाषिकसंज्ञाः यथा चित् चेत्य तावत् सरलतया वयम् अन्ये भाषासु न वक्तुं शक्नुमः।

Even after learning Sanskrit I feel, there are certain hard verses like about प्राणायाम, वाक्, चिति etc which are hard to understand. It requires knowledge from other scriptures.

Also, Germans are translating Mokshopaya to German language. I didn't understand German so I took their translations and put it in Google Translate and DeepL, and surprisingly there were much better than VLM 😂 Just letting you know.

Anyway back to topic,

1. Yes I means मनस् by the word mind.

2. चिन्मात्र = चत् + मात्र = chit + only = only chit

3. The world which is right infront of us, how do you explain that if mind is unreal?

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