Serpentine 4 Loops

[Shima Costar]

4is too many straight strides across x. Should be more like 1.5-2. You Also really want to really show the change on bend and just touch the long side. I think of it more like riding a large figure 8. [Eta squaty figure 8]

Lol I thought you might be asking because you encountered the same judge I did at a starter HT last fall. I rode the serpentine as two half circles and she proceeded to explain to me afterwards how that was incorrect because I was actually supposed to do this insane drunken weaving thing across the diagonal. It was a fix-a-test so she coached me through her version of the movement several times and it was bananas. As someone who has competed up to GP dressage and has a pretty good understanding of dressage geometry, I was quite stumped.

In riding a serpentine, its curve is that of a circle til you reach to center line. In a two loop in a small arena the circle is one-half of a 20m. No corners , no straightness on the wall.

On the centerline 1, max 2 straight steps while changing bend and posting diagonals, if dealing with rising trot. Practice a tidy posting diagonal change. Then off to your second 1/2 20m circle

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What is a three loop serpentine in the dressage arena? The serpentine with several loops touching the long side of the arena consists of half circles connected by a straight line. When crossing the centerline, the horse should be parallel to the short side. Depending on the size of the half circles, the straight connection varies in length.

So, the correction for this is that the rider really needs to clarify the exact layout of the lines and the spaces of the arena, and just by disciplining that line, the rider is going to be better in controlling the horses stiff side and weak side to make them more equilateral.

In the change of direction in a three loop serpentine, your outside rein has four jobs: steering, containment to bend, speed control and roundness. Meanwhile, your inside rein only has two jobs: initiation of flexion and initiation of bend.

Riding a serpentine not only helps the horse become more supple from left to right and right to left, but it also teaches the rider to change the direction of their weight, where the inside leg goes, what the inside leg is doing and changing from the new inside leg to the new outside rein as they come across the center line in those moments of being parallel to the short side.

We have been training in both 40 x 20 and 60 x 20 arenas and have found our shape can sometimes be compromised when changing between arena sizes. For this reason, the following exercise has helped us; the guide poles gave us something to focus on and aim for. Then, after riding the exercise a few times in walk, then trot, we removed the poles.

In lower level dressage tests three or four loop serpentines are usually ridden in trot. At more advanced levels these are ridden in collected canter with simple or flying changes each time you cross the center line.

The below table shows what the judge is looking for throughout your three-loop serpentine and the corresponding faults which will lose you marks in your dressage test if you do not meet the requirements of the move.

Ensure you study the arena plan very carefully in order to set this exercise up correctly so that you know exactly where your loops should start and finish and get used to riding a correct three-loop serpentine.

Begin riding the serpentine at either A or C. To create the first loop ride a half circle, either 20m or 13.3m depending on your arena size, making sure that your horse is bending through his body around your inside leg. Do not ride into the corners of the arena as you are riding a half-circle.

As with any exercise, it is important to practise this on both reins. Remember your horse will usually find one rein easier than the other as they are naturally right or left-hoofed and it may take time to make them supple to both directions.

The only solution I came across to use a software like LoopCAD and lay out the loops there and then export as dwg and link it in my model. Disadvantage is that it requires forth-back exporting and buying of a software. I tried the demo and it also doesn't lay out the way I want it (I want to lay it out so that in the future one could cut into the floor and only loses one loop)

My other idea is to create areas on an area plan for each loop and then describe if it is a "single wall serpentine" ("or counter flow tubing layout") and if it has 6", 12" etc. tube spacing. and then have some details as example how that looks like.

for the actual design (determining spacing, flow rate etc. ) I use a manufacturer software. So all I need is a tool or method to visualize to contractor where to use what spacing, layout and what loop goes to what manifold. somehow being able to schedule total tubing would be great too.

I am not sure. May be you can use electrical cables I believe. I can understand it wont make sense to add an electrical tool. But that is what we can do if we need it modeled.

The other way is creating your own family of radiant floor. That will make more sense. If you are good in family creation it will be bit easy...!

Let me know if it works..!

I'm not sure if electrical cables will really help since they don't create the loops for radiant heating (the serpentine loops etc.). they would be like normal lines for that purpose. the same I'm also not sure how to create a family smart enough to make loops.

Perhaps you can create an In-Place model with as a Sweep Extrusion and an Electrical Connector (if desired). Using such a method, you can easily draw the Sketch Path in the serpentine shape and then apply a circular Profile. This will be pretty easy to modify later, if needed.

A more elaborate solution would be to create a parametric Family (which you could NOT assign to a system Category such as Conduits) that can be reused in other Projects. Such a Family could also be as simple as a Detail Item Family so you don't bulk up your file size by physically modeling all of the loops.

We placed a couple of runs with U returns, then arrayed the system together. Not as worried about maintaining the connected systems, although you could do this by placing the returns first, then adding the piping between the returns using the grips. There just isn't a super fast way to do this...yet...

I played a bit more with the LoopCAD software and it actually is a nice layout software and also calculates the flowrates, dT, pressure drop etc. I was able to do some fake-layout, export as dwg and link into my Revit project (s. attached screenshot from Revit) where it will tell exactly how to route what loop, how long it is etc.

There is no way I can create my own Revit family or addin to do the same thing. It would be nice to do in Revit, but this may be one of the examples where an external software is needed. So I decided to just buy that software, even for the one project it will save me more time than it costs. The manufacturer offers a free design software, but without graphic layout.

I think most designs rely on manufacturer layout. The danger is that layout may be done cheaper (fewer loops. wider spacing) than I'm comfortable with. and from my research with tubing manufacturers I concluded they will charge for the layout either by ft or as % of material cost. So me providing detailed layout should save money somewhere. (no, I don't mean to advertise products)

thanks for bringing up here...we had also used the ACAD dwg to plan view method when we first started doing these, but long term, I think it needs to be a system, so it can be accounted for, and coordinated for interferences...we really don't want to core drill through a radiant line...

You mean the coordiantion with all the stuff in the flooring (trench trains, man holes, floor boxes..)? What I try is to export a dwg from Revit with all the obstacles and import in LoopCAD. Then lay out loops around those obstacles, export as dwg and link back to Revit.

The problem will be when you add something in Revit (i.e. new floor boxes), then you have to do that over and adjust the loops. There still will be some field coordination for the exact locations or floor items... but the bid-package layout should then already be 99% correct.

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