TS590-SG with WSJTX

[K4NDN]

Hi all,

I am hoping to get some assistance with a setup for Don, WX4C. 

Don is running a Kenwood TS590-SG with Signalink on a Win 10 Dell machine with no serial port. We have connected the 590 to the Dell using the COMM port on the rig to a USB on the Dell. The Dell recognizes the Com port as Port 5 and it is decoding the signals well. We have set the 590 menu setting properly, We do have CODEC recognized and verified as working. For the life of me we cannot get the 590 to TX. We have installed the software from the Kenwood site to accommodate this function. Every setting that we have tried in WSJT has failed. Each attempt results in an error message:"Hamlib error: IO error while opening connection to rig"

If anyone has experience with this particular configuration would you please point me in the right direction?

Many thanks, 73- de K4NDN

[Mark Whitis]

There is a good chance another program already has the serial port open.

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[km4...@gmail.com]

The computer has no serial 

Sent from my iPhone

[Mark Whitis]

USB to serial embedded in the signalink for push to talk control.
What you described as com5

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Sent from smartphone.  Please excuse typos and transcription errors.

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[Nathan Simmons]

Couple questions here,

(a) Is the SignaLink one of the USB variety? 

(b)I assume you are using a USB to Serial adaptor for use with the radi interface?

If you are indeed using a SignaLink USB go into Audio settings if WSJT-X and set the input and output devices to as follows:

Input: Microphone (USB Audio CODEC)

Output: Speakers (USB Audio CODEC)

in rig settings try setting the rig to none and the transmit method to VOX. This should allow the the SignaLink to key the radio. If this works. Now go and triple check which COM port the radio interface is on (beware there may possibly be more then one depending on how the radio is interfaced.) Select the proper com port in the program, then select the proper rig, now click teat CAT. This will check and the CAT config and the ability to communicate with the radio. If the test is successful you are almost good to go. Why almost? In my experiance with WSJT-X one needs to set the polling cycles alot higher. I set mine to 60s. The reason is, my radio would key up then the program was poll the radio for current setting etc, and the polling would effectively cancel out the PTT command reguardless of if the command was via the interface. Or via thw SignaLink key line.

Hope this helps,

73,

Nate

Now working JT65 from Wyoming

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[Nathan Simmons]

I do not believe this is correct. The SignaLink works as an USB Audio Device, Basically it is a USB soundcard. When sound is present the SignaLink keys the radio via the key line in the 13 Pin DIN connection. I use a SignaLink and there is no USB to serial converter within the SignaLink. It just shows up in Computer Manager as a USB Audio Device. The Radio interface for rig control is a separate interface cable.

Another Good question to be asked however is Does this radio have a built in USB connection? If so this would be a much easier way to go.

73,

Nate

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KI4MSK 

[Mark Whitis]

My original comment regarding the likelyhood of different software applications fighting over the (virtual) serial port still stands. 

Above and beyond the sound card to convey the audio, a rig interface needs a way to activate the push to talk.   There are a number of methods used by rig interfaces to activate PTT:

   - RTS or DTR, + or minus polarity, on a real RS-232 serial port or an emulated (USB) one.

   - Parallel port (obsolete)

   - a tone on the second (right) audio channel

   - using the radios built in VOX

   - using a VOX circuit built into the rig interface.  

   - commands sent over a CAT/CI-V or RS-232 interface

   - RTS or DTR pin on real or emulated RS-232 serial port that carries CAT/CI-V data.

   - A hybrid where you can use more than one of the above methods.

Signallink documentation is terrible.   They have a lot of verbiage without ever actually giving you the information you actually need.  Apparently, built in VOX is what signallink usb does and it has a knob to adjust the delay and no one setting will work for all modes and there is no setting that will actually work properly for some modes (voice - which can contain long pauses).   So, yes, Nathan is apparently correct that the signalink USB doesn't have the built in USB-to-serial converter that it should have but there is still one being used  somewhere else in the system (built into the radio or built into a cable).  And, thus, my original comment still stands.

In this case, it looks like the original poster claims he has connected the computer to the "comm" port on the radio which is a RS-232 port which will require using a usb to serial converter/  When I responded that the error message from hamlib suggests that it is unable to open that serial port (which usually happens because another program is using it), he responded inappropriately that there was no serial port on the computer.  In this case , you may have a choice whether to trigger PTT using the vox circuit built into the signalink or by a command over the OMM port.

That radio also has a USB port which apparently emulates a USB to serial adapter connected to the radio.   So, it is possible the original poster, has connected a plain USB cable from the PC to the radio, though this is inconsistent with the original wording.     The USB interface is  also apparently able to carry audio to and from the PC which makes the signallink completely unnecssary except perhaps as an overpriced and poor fidelity audio isolator.  A USB-to-serial converter, whether internal or external to the radio or rig interface, counts as a serial port (although a rather poor one) to the software on the computer. 

hamlib is a library that programs control various ham radios over real or emulated (USB) serial ports.  WSJT and other programs use it to talk to the radio to control and monitor the radio.    

If you have another program on the computer that is trying to talk to the virtual serial port at the same time as WSJT, then there will be a conflict.  Some of these other programs include:

  - ham radio deluxe  (see below)

  - chirp or other radio programming software

  - fldigi or other digital mode software

  - logging software (communicates with radio to get frequency/band/mode/power information to log and in some cases may also allow changing)

  - rigctl, flrig, or other rig control software

Ham radio deluxe is a special case because it can be set up to use the CAT/CI-V/COMM and PTT interfaces while also providing an emulated port (that speaks kenwood protocol) that other software can use to control the radio simultaneously.     This requires you to lie to other software (such as WSJT, fldigi, etc) about what what port the radio is connected to, what the transceiver model is, and which method to use to control PTT).   Furthermore, this other software will now only work when ham radio deluxe is running.   Which means you could also probably get the error message in question because you weren't running ham radio deluxe at the time you used WSJT.    So, depending on configuration, you could get the error message because you were running ham radio deluxe or because you weren't.  

Note that it isn't clear if the USB and RS-232 COMM ports on the back of this radio is isolated.  The word isolation does not appear anywhere in the TS-590SG in-depth manual.  So assume it is not isolated.  Please see my previous message on a different thread (concerning signalink and RF/ground interference) on valleyhams for information on un-isolated rig interfaces and proper grounding of your power supply at the radio end instead of the power supply end (beware of internal ground connections on power supply made without your knowledge or consent).

 WSJT is configured to use some form of comm port serial control but the signallink is using fake VOX PTT control and the alternate method of PTT control is interfering with using the VOX because WSJT gives up when it fails to use the other method.   So, as a temporary workaround, you could tell WSJT not to use any method of PTT control and let the signalink handle it (at the expense of communicating frequency/band/mode/power/etc. information between radio and software and at the expense of PTT that works in all modes including voice through the computer).

Recap, some reasons why you are getting the error message and the transmitter isn't keying up.

   - multiple applications are fighting over the same (virtual) serial port to control the radio

   - WSJT is configured to use the wrong serial port.   This also includes the case, mentioned by another poster, where windoze has moved the serial port to

     a different COMM port designation behind your back.

   - WSJT is configured to control the radio through ham radio deluxe's fake virtual rig control interface and ham radio deluxe isn't running.

   - missing drivers

The signalink USB is overpriced and underpowered.   The things a rig interface should do for you:

   - optical isolation:   signalink USB: POOR (very poor audio fidelity)

   - CAT/CI-V communication with radio: signalink USB: FAIL, no attempt

   - PTT control:signalink USB: POOR.    It does a poor job using a fake VOX.

   - Morse code keying: signalink USB: FAIL.  no attempt

   - (optional) eliminate need for external USB audio interface or tying up PC audio interface: signalink USB: pass.  

   - I/Q quadrature direct conversion "audio" IF connection between rig (such as kantronix KX-3 or softrock) and PC: signalink USB: FAIL, no attempt

   - audio recording of contacts made through radio mic/headset: signalink USB: FAIL, no attempt

   - filtering of audio contacts DSP made through radio mic/headset: signalink USB: FAIL, no attempt

The last two are difficult due to all the incompatible mic/headset interfaces out there and you can use a computer headset instead.

-- 
Nathan Simmons
train...@gmail.com
http://www.t-51.org
KI4MSK 

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