CSP that allows vagrant

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Norman Robins

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Apr 27, 2021, 11:37:10 PM4/27/21
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I want to set up a vagrant machine in the cloud. I got a machine at lined only to find out they do not allow VMs. Anyone know a CSP that will allow me to run a vagrant VM?

dnmo...@gmail.com

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Apr 28, 2021, 9:02:53 AM4/28/21
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Which CSP are you using? VM's inside VM's is a pretty common occurrence but the BIOS needs to be set up to allow Virtualization inside Virtualization (e.g. VT-x settings)
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Norman Robins

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Apr 28, 2021, 9:07:21 AM4/28/21
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I tried using Linode but they do not allow VMs. I know AWS also does not. Do you know of one who does?

dnmo...@gmail.com

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Apr 28, 2021, 10:39:46 AM4/28/21
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A VM is different than a container in many ways, one of which how the virtualized hardware functions, e.g. disk space. 

In AWS you can use a BARE METAL instance type if you absolutely need a VM inside a machine
Apparently in Linode, if you have a BARE METAL machine, you can do VM inside a machine
VMWare also has a s similar experience but be sure to enable the VT-x settings

I think what you could probably get away with is Docker inside a VM which functions similarly but without ties to hardware - https://www.vagrantup.com/docs/providers/docker/basics


Norman Robins

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Apr 28, 2021, 11:10:55 AM4/28/21
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I have a vagrant VM that just works. I have a need to get it up and running in the cloud quickly. I have tried to deploy it on bare metal (without vagrant) and ran into issues. Issues that can probably be solved but I am looking for the quickest path. 

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Antony Stone

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Apr 28, 2021, 11:27:22 AM4/28/21
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On Wednesday 28 April 2021 at 17:10:37, Norman Robins wrote:

> I have a vagrant VM that just works. I have a need to get it up and running
> in the cloud quickly.

Please define "cloud" - which hosting provider do you need to install this on?
They do vary, and the methods of installing Vagrant varies between providers.

> I have tried to deploy it on bare metal (without vagrant) and ran into
> issues.

It might help if you tell us what these "issues" are.

> Issues that can probably be solved but I am looking for the quickest path.

Quickest path to...? What, specifically, are you trying to achieve?

> On Wed, Apr 28, 2021 at 7:39 AM dnmo...@gmail.com wrote:
> > A VM is different than a container in many ways, one of which how the
> > virtualized hardware functions, e.g. disk space.
> >
> > In AWS you can use a BARE METAL instance type if you absolutely need a VM
> > inside a machine
> > Apparently in Linode, if you have a BARE METAL machine, you can do VM
> > inside a machine
> > VMWare also has a s similar experience but be sure to enable the VT-x
> > settings
> >
> > I think what you could probably get away with is Docker inside a VM which
> > functions similarly but without ties to hardware -
> > https://www.vagrantup.com/docs/providers/docker/basics
> >
> >
> > On Wednesday, April 28, 2021 at 9:07:21 AM norman....@gmail.com wrote:
> >> I tried using Linode but they do not allow VMs.

This I do not understand. I have two Linode VMs running MariaDB very nicely.

> >> I know AWS also does not. Do you know of one who does?

I've no idea about VMs on AWS, but you can certainly run Vagrant there.

https://www.vagrantup.com/docs/plugins/providers

> >> On Wednesday, April 28, 2021 at 6:02:53 AM UTC-7 dnmo...@gmail.com wrote:
> >>> Which CSP are you using? VM's inside VM's is a pretty common occurrence
> >>> but the BIOS needs to be set up to allow Virtualization inside
> >>> Virtualization (e.g. VT-x settings)
> >>>
> >>> On Tuesday, April 27, 2021 at 11:37:10 PM norman....@gmail.com wrote:
> >>>> I want to set up a vagrant machine in the cloud. I got a machine at
> >>>> lined only to find out they do not allow VMs. Anyone know a CSP that
> >>>> will allow me to run a vagrant VM?


Antony.

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Norman Robins

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Apr 28, 2021, 11:39:16 AM4/28/21
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On Wed, Apr 28, 2021 at 8:27 AM Antony Stone <Antony...@vagrant.open.source.it> wrote:
On Wednesday 28 April 2021 at 17:10:37, Norman Robins wrote:

> I have a vagrant VM that just works. I have a need to get it up and running
> in the cloud quickly.

Please define "cloud" - which hosting provider do you need to install this on? 
They do vary, and the methods of installing Vagrant varies between providers.

Cloud == a computer that is not my own, that people with the needed auth and perms can access. I don't care which CSP I use as long as I can run my vagrant VM. 


> I have tried to deploy it on bare metal (without vagrant) and ran into
> issues.

It might help if you tell us what these "issues" are.

The app does not work correctly. Too many issues and too complex to go into here, and not in scope for this group.  

> Issues that can probably be solved but I am looking for the quickest path.

Quickest path to...?  What, specifically, are you trying to achieve?

I am trying to bring up my app using vagrant and virtual box at a CSP. The app runs fine on my Mac with vagrant and VB. Now I need to get up and running at a CSP ASAP. 

Antony Stone

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Apr 28, 2021, 11:43:25 AM4/28/21
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On Wednesday 28 April 2021 at 17:38:59, Norman Robins wrote:

> On Wed, Apr 28, 2021 at 8:27 AM Antony Stone wrote:
>
> Cloud == a computer that is not my own, that people with the needed auth
> and perms can access. I don't care which CSP I use as long as I can run my
> vagrant VM.

So, why not just use AWS?

> > https://www.vagrantup.com/docs/plugins/providers

Antony.

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How many Prolog programmers does it take to change a lightbulb?
No.

Norman Robins

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Apr 28, 2021, 12:06:50 PM4/28/21
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On Wed, Apr 28, 2021 at 8:43 AM Antony Stone <Antony...@vagrant.open.source.it> wrote:
On Wednesday 28 April 2021 at 17:38:59, Norman Robins wrote:

> On Wed, Apr 28, 2021 at 8:27 AM Antony Stone wrote:
>
> Cloud == a computer that is not my own, that people with the needed auth
> and perms can access. I don't care which CSP I use as long as I can run my
> vagrant VM.

So, why not just use AWS?

AWS does not support running a VM on an EC2 instance. I was not aware AWS offered bare metal that does support VMs, but it seems they do. Will look into that.

dnmo...@gmail.com

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Apr 28, 2021, 12:35:32 PM4/28/21
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Vagrant is a way to be able to programmatically provision virtualized hardware (networking, cpu, ram) through a Provider e.g. Docker, VMware or, Virtualbox. It sounds like you already have an existing VM Linode available to use so using vagrant to spin up another VM isn't needed. 

Presuming you are using Ansible. Chef, Salt or something like it, to programmatically set up the VM  you would use Vagrant to run your Ansible playbook on the existing VM inside your inventory (the IP address for the Linode VM)

Norman Robins

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Apr 28, 2021, 1:01:52 PM4/28/21
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It is needed as what I have in my box and vagrant file work and my app runs. Trying to recreate that without VB and vagrant is very time consuming and error prone. No not using any other tools - this is a one off. I just copy the box file and the vagrant file and run vagrant up and I am running. 

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Antony Stone

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Apr 28, 2021, 1:02:32 PM4/28/21
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On Wednesday 28 April 2021 at 18:06:32, Norman Robins wrote:

> On Wed, Apr 28, 2021 at 8:43 AM Antony Stone wrote:
> > On Wednesday 28 April 2021 at 17:38:59, Norman Robins wrote:
> > > On Wed, Apr 28, 2021 at 8:27 AM Antony Stone wrote:
> > >
> > > Cloud == a computer that is not my own, that people with the needed
> > > auth and perms can access. I don't care which CSP I use as long as I
> > > can run my vagrant VM.
> >
> > So, why not just use AWS?
>
> AWS does not support running a VM on an EC2 instance. I was not aware AWS
> offered bare metal that does support VMs, but it seems they do. Will look
> into that.

Sorry, I thought you were trying to run Vagrant.

> > > > https://www.vagrantup.com/docs/plugins/providers

I have no idea whether you can get a "standard" VM in AWS, but you certainly
can with Linode (which you mentioned earlier).

I think I'm confused as to whether you're trying to install on a VM or trying
to install with Vagrant.


Antony.

--
Ramdisk is not an installation procedure.

Norman Robins

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Apr 28, 2021, 1:07:10 PM4/28/21
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On Wed, Apr 28, 2021 at 10:02 AM Antony Stone
<Antony...@vagrant.open.source.it> wrote:
>
> On Wednesday 28 April 2021 at 18:06:32, Norman Robins wrote:
>
> > On Wed, Apr 28, 2021 at 8:43 AM Antony Stone wrote:
> > > On Wednesday 28 April 2021 at 17:38:59, Norman Robins wrote:
> > > > On Wed, Apr 28, 2021 at 8:27 AM Antony Stone wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Cloud == a computer that is not my own, that people with the needed
> > > > auth and perms can access. I don't care which CSP I use as long as I
> > > > can run my vagrant VM.
> > >
> > > So, why not just use AWS?
> >
> > AWS does not support running a VM on an EC2 instance. I was not aware AWS
> > offered bare metal that does support VMs, but it seems they do. Will look
> > into that.
>
> Sorry, I thought you were trying to run Vagrant.

That is exactly what I am trying to do. Run vagrant at a CSP.

> > > > > https://www.vagrantup.com/docs/plugins/providers
>
> I have no idea whether you can get a "standard" VM in AWS, but you certainly
> can with Linode (which you mentioned earlier).
>
> I think I'm confused as to whether you're trying to install on a VM or trying
> to install with Vagrant.

I have a VM at Linode but it does not support running VB and vargant.

Antony Stone

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Apr 28, 2021, 1:12:11 PM4/28/21
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On Wednesday 28 April 2021 at 19:06:53, Norman Robins wrote:

> On Wed, Apr 28, 2021 at 10:02 AM Antony Stone wrote:
> >
> > Sorry, I thought you were trying to run Vagrant.
>
> That is exactly what I am trying to do. Run vagrant at a CSP.

Now I realise that you are trying to run Vagrant *inside a VM* at a service
provider. I didn't get that bit before. I thought Vagrant running at AWS
would be good for you.

> > > > > > https://www.vagrantup.com/docs/plugins/providers

> > I think I'm confused as to whether you're trying to install on a VM or
> > trying to install with Vagrant.
>
> I have a VM at Linode but it does not support running VB and vargant.

Out of interest, why are you trying to get a hosted virtual machine inside
which you can run another virtual machine, inside which you can run vagrant,
inside which you can run whatever application/s you're ultimately interested
in having online?

It seems like an extraordinarily convoluted way of using up the computing
resources you're paying for, on something other than the application/s.


Antony.

--
Having been asked for a reference for this man,
I can confirm that you will be very lucky indeed
if you can get him to work for you.

Norman Robins

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Apr 28, 2021, 1:15:29 PM4/28/21
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On Wed, Apr 28, 2021 at 10:12 AM Antony Stone
<Antony...@vagrant.open.source.it> wrote:
>
> On Wednesday 28 April 2021 at 19:06:53, Norman Robins wrote:
>
> > On Wed, Apr 28, 2021 at 10:02 AM Antony Stone wrote:
> > >
> > > Sorry, I thought you were trying to run Vagrant.
> >
> > That is exactly what I am trying to do. Run vagrant at a CSP.
>
> Now I realise that you are trying to run Vagrant *inside a VM* at a service
> provider. I didn't get that bit before. I thought Vagrant running at AWS
> would be good for you.
>
> > > > > > > https://www.vagrantup.com/docs/plugins/providers
>
> > > I think I'm confused as to whether you're trying to install on a VM or
> > > trying to install with Vagrant.
> >
> > I have a VM at Linode but it does not support running VB and vargant.
>
> Out of interest, why are you trying to get a hosted virtual machine inside
> which you can run another virtual machine, inside which you can run vagrant,
> inside which you can run whatever application/s you're ultimately interested
> in having online?

Because time is of the essence and using vagrant just works.

> It seems like an extraordinarily convoluted way of using up the computing
> resources you're paying for, on something other than the application/s.

I have tried getting the app running without vagrant and VB and ran
into many issues. If I could just copy my box and vagrant file and run
vagrant up that would be much faster than debugging.

Antony Stone

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Apr 28, 2021, 1:18:23 PM4/28/21
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On Wednesday 28 April 2021 at 19:15:12, Norman Robins wrote:

> On Wed, Apr 28, 2021 at 10:12 AM Antony Stone wrote:

> > Out of interest, why are you trying to get a hosted virtual machine
> > inside which you can run another virtual machine, inside which you can
> > run vagrant, inside which you can run whatever application/s you're
> > ultimately interested in having online?
>
> Because time is of the essence and using vagrant just works.
>
> I have tried getting the app running without vagrant and VB and ran
> into many issues. If I could just copy my box and vagrant file and run
> vagrant up that would be much faster than debugging.

I can only continue to wonder why you don't run Vagrant on AWS, then, and just
skip all the virtual server stuff.

https://www.vagrantup.com/docs/plugins/providers


Antony.

--
90% of networking problems are routing problems.
9 of the remaining 10% are routing problems in the other direction.
The remaining 1% might be something else, but check the routing anyway.

Norman Robins

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Apr 28, 2021, 1:21:38 PM4/28/21
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On Wed, Apr 28, 2021 at 10:18 AM Antony Stone
<Antony...@vagrant.open.source.it> wrote:
>
> On Wednesday 28 April 2021 at 19:15:12, Norman Robins wrote:
>
> > On Wed, Apr 28, 2021 at 10:12 AM Antony Stone wrote:
>
> > > Out of interest, why are you trying to get a hosted virtual machine
> > > inside which you can run another virtual machine, inside which you can
> > > run vagrant, inside which you can run whatever application/s you're
> > > ultimately interested in having online?
> >
> > Because time is of the essence and using vagrant just works.
> >
> > I have tried getting the app running without vagrant and VB and ran
> > into many issues. If I could just copy my box and vagrant file and run
> > vagrant up that would be much faster than debugging.
>
> I can only continue to wonder why you don't run Vagrant on AWS, then, and just
> skip all the virtual server stuff.
>
> https://www.vagrantup.com/docs/plugins/providers

I guess I don't understand what this means. If I create an EC2
instance at AWS and run vagrant up I get 'AMD-V is not available' When
I asked them they said EC2 instances do not support running VMs.

Antony Stone

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Apr 28, 2021, 1:25:13 PM4/28/21
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On Wednesday 28 April 2021 at 19:21:20, Norman Robins wrote:

> On Wed, Apr 28, 2021 at 10:18 AM Antony Stone wrote:
> >
> > I can only continue to wonder why you don't run Vagrant on AWS, then, and
> > just skip all the virtual server stuff.
> >
> > https://www.vagrantup.com/docs/plugins/providers
>
> I guess I don't understand what this means. If I create an EC2
> instance at AWS and run vagrant up I get 'AMD-V is not available' When
> I asked them they said EC2 instances do not support running VMs.

Hm.

In that case, I'm sorry, but I can't help you further - I've never actually
run Vagrant on AWS - I was just aware that this documentation existed and
thought that it sounded like an ideal solution to your requirement.

Maybe someone else here who actually has done Vagrant on AWS can comment
further.


Regards,


Antony.

--
I wasn't sure about having a beard at first, but then it grew on me.

dnmo...@gmail.com

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Apr 28, 2021, 2:12:14 PM4/28/21
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As mentioned before you need what is called a :"bare metal" tyoe of VM, AWS has  m5, r5 or z1d - https://aws.amazon.com/about-aws/whats-new/2019/02/introducing-five-new-amazon-ec2-bare-metal-instances/, Linode has their version - https://www.linode.com/products/bare-metal/

Jim McGinness

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Apr 28, 2021, 6:12:34 PM4/28/21
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There are vagrant plugins to instantiate vagrant VMs on AWS, Linode, and DigitalOcean, among others. I've personally succeeded in getting the Linode and DigitalOcean ones up to the point of "vagrant ssh". But you don't get to pick arbitrary box files.

But the way you're using terms makes me think you mean something different from what the rest of the world means. Are you looking for a VPS that itself can host VMs? There are probably some out there, but you should probably examine very carefully your reasons for thinking that's what you need. For all the scenarios I can imagine, it's at least one surplus level of virtualization.

 -- jmcg

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