Re: FW: [NMCycling] Hillsboro results

[David Halliburton]

Frank,

 

Here is the latest outline of a Camino Encantado Cup USAC series.

 

http://nmors.org/uploads/Camino_Encantado_Cup_-_2008.pdf

There was much input and back and forth by some promoters and racers, and many possibilities were proposed, considered and revised or abandoned.

 

Other than Randy Corcoran, no promoters other than those listed on the series outline have affirmatively stated whether they want to join in this type of series.  Nor have I heard of other promoters organizing a different series.  I am still waiting for a final confirmation from Randy that this outline will look for his race and that his event intends to participate.

 

Now that Hillsboro is done, we need to see if those results can be preped to match this format.  If not, we need to see what changes may be necessary and feasible.

Look the outline over and let me know what further thoughts you have.

 

At bottom of this note, I copy a couple of summations I have previously provided in answer to questions on the series.  I propose to also copy this note to the general NMCycling list for general info and perhaps yet further insights.

 

DaveH

============

 

Pertinent FAQs:

 

 

Masters 35+ (includes ALL masters racers) - race group
Masters 45+ (includes ALL masters 45 and up) - race subgroup
Masters 55+ (includes only masters 55 and up) - race subgroup

 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

No.  35+ is ALL masters.  45+ is ALL masters 45 and up (including the 55 and up racers).  55+ is just the 55+.  So, if a 60yo masters is top overall, he is in for the $$$, the 45+ prizes AND the 55+ prizes.  It pays to be old and fast.  :-)

 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

In reference to Tour del Paso '08 question:

 

The Masters race is open to racers who are 35+ and who are Cat 3, 4 or 5.

 

This should be consistent with prior years in the NMRS/ACA format where masters was open to Cat 3,4s of a certain age.

 

There is a separate Cat 3 age open race.  A 35+ cat 3 can choose between the Masters race or the Cat 3 (age open) race.  Likewise, a Cat 4 or 5 35+ racer can choose to do the Cat 4/5 race instead of the Masters race.

No racer under 35 will be in the Masters racing group.

 

A Cat 1,2 has to race the Cat 1,2 regardless of his age.

 

The cash prizes for the Masters are for the whole 35+ group.  There will also be separate (non-cash but still nice) prizes for the 45+ and 55+ subgroups.

 

Last year had the "B" group that was Masters 40-49 Cat 3-4 and the "D" group that was Masters 50+.  We did run both masters groups together.  We also had a combined prize list for the B&D group.

So, it looks like what is different this year is that
-Masters are one race group of 35+ Cat 3,4,5s
-We have a money prize list for the top finishers in the overall Masters race group;
-We have a separate goods prize list for the 45+ and 55+ Masters subgroups.
-It is 35+, 45+ and 55+; It is NOT 35-44; 45-54 and 55+
-This means that a fast 55+ Masters racer could collect on the money, the 45+ prizes AND the 55+ prizes.

 

On Wed, Mar 19, 2008 at 6:00 AM, Al Watters <awat...@justdealwithit.com> wrote:

Dave,

 

Can you answer Frank's question and copy me?

 

Al Watters

New Frontiers Information Systems

7 Hacienda Ct.

Los Lunas, NM 87031

(505) 865-6973 Office

(505) 865-6025 Fax

(505) 944-6345 Cell

awat...@JustDealWithIt.com

USAC New Mexico Representative

usc...@JustDealWithIt.com 

 

CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This email message, including any attachments, is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential information.  Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited.  If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply email and destroy all copies of the original message including any attachments.

---

From: losa...@att.net [mailto:losa...@att.net]
Sent: Wednesday, March 19, 2008 00:14
To: David Rutledge
Cc: awat...@justdealwithit.com
Subject: Re: [NMCycling] Hillsboro results

 

Hi David,

Thanks for the posting and thanks for the well run (and fun) races (and especially for keeping the Masters and 3s seperate at the start).

 

I also have some questions that I'm not sure whether or not you can answer (maybe Al can).

 

Do you know what the NM Cup Series really consists of?  For Masters, are there break-outs by age 35+, 45+, 55 + or not?  Based on the Omnium results, it doesn't appear that there are any break-outs... so why run seperate categories anyway if there are no seperate prizes for each category and the prizes stop at 3rd place for the combined Omnium only.  How are Cup Series points for the omnium distributed anyway? or for any NM cup series race for that matter. Is it first through ten?, or fifteen? Within age category?, or on mixed category overall?  What does the cup series winner receive?  A jersey? a "Cup"? What?

Do out-of-staters like the Masters Omnium overall winner from Arizona get NM points or not?

 

Masters racing in NM was never intended to included Cat 1/2s,  35 year olds against 60+ cat 3/4s.

Has anyone in NM now running races under the USA cycling banner given this any thought at all? 

 

No one has explained any of this to me or any one else as far as I can tell.  Is anything posted somewhere on another website?

 

Please help.

 

I and others my age take a lot of risks to race, and with my osteoporosis weakened bones, I need something to offset those risks.  Win or lose, I never actually expect to ever win a prize and usually don't (even though I had two overall Masters (45+) second places last year (Highway 6 and Bonanza Creek)), so I really just race for the competition of winning points only (and for the last five years, a jersey).  However, in my 55+ category, if after getting top 5 in the TT and top 5 in the RR and then not even a mention in your omnium overall results (as there was no breakout by age groups), It looks to me like no points can ever be won (even by Phil Shew)!  I'm thinking of maybe just hanging up my race wheels and sticking to brevets, its cheaper and there's no stress.   Any thoughts?

 

Thanks again,

Frank Pabian

P.S.  In talking recently to Doug Steibler (who at 63, is many months away from healing from a broken femur in crash a month ago), Doug said that the irony of it all was that the NMRS was created originally many years ago just for Masters only (as they had no hope of competing against the younger stronger As and Bs).  Then, later, all categories had a a seperate NMRS competition.  But now, we've come full circle, where the real Masters (not 35+ cat 1s) seem to have been left out in the cold.

-------------- Original message from David Rutledge <rutl...@nmsu.edu>: --------------


> Hey NM, AZ, TX, and SD racers,
>
> go to http://ziavelo.googlepages.com/hillsbororesults
>
> to see the results in pdf. format.
>
> dave
>
> ~
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> To unsubscribe: send a request to Cliff: lou...@swcp.com

--
--
www.nmors.org
http://gotdirtnm.blogspot.com

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^ ^ ^

[Perez, Joshua]

Thanks Dave for more clarifications. Is there some other raw format for each race finish over the Hillsboro weekend? Like you noted, the results currently posted aren't in much of a format...at all.

gracias
JP

http://nmors.org/uploads/Camino_Encantado_Cup_-_2008.pdf

DaveH
============

*Pertinent FAQs:*

Masters 35+ (includes ALL masters racers) - race group
Masters 45+ (includes ALL masters 45 and up) - race subgroup
Masters 55+ (includes only masters 55 and up) - race subgroup

~~~~~~~~~~~~~

No. 35+ is ALL masters. 45+ is ALL masters 45 and up (including the 55 and
up racers). 55+ is just the 55+. So, if a 60yo masters is top overall, he
is in for the $$$, the 45+ prizes AND the 55+ prizes. It pays to be old and
fast. :-)

~~~~~~~~~~~~~

*In reference to Tour del Paso '08 question:*

The Masters race is open to racers who are 35+ and who are Cat 3, 4 or 5.

This should be consistent with prior years in the NMRS/ACA format where
masters was open to Cat 3,4s of a certain age.

There is a separate Cat 3 age open race. A 35+ cat 3 can choose between the
Masters race or the Cat 3 (age open) race. Likewise, a Cat 4 or 5 35+ racer
can choose to do the Cat 4/5 race instead of the Masters race.

No racer under 35 will be in the Masters racing group.

A Cat 1,2 has to race the Cat 1,2 regardless of his age.

The cash prizes for the Masters are for the whole 35+ group. There will
also be separate (non-cash but still nice) prizes for the 45+ and 55+
subgroups.

Last year had the "B" group that was Masters 40-49 Cat 3-4 and the "D" group
that was Masters 50+. We did run both masters groups together. We also had
a combined prize list for the B&D group.

So, it looks like what is different this year is that
-Masters are one race group of 35+ Cat 3,4,5s
-We have a money prize list for the top finishers in the overall Masters
race group;
-We have a separate goods prize list for the 45+ and 55+ Masters subgroups.

-It is 35+, 45+ and 55+; It is *NOT* 35-44; 45-54 and 55+

-This means that a fast 55+ Masters racer could collect on the money, the
45+ prizes AND the 55+ prizes.

On Wed, Mar 19, 2008 at 6:00 AM, Al Watters <awat...@justdealwithit.com>
wrote:

> Dave,
>
>
>
> Can you answer Frank's question and copy me?
>
>
>
> Al Watters
>
> New Frontiers Information Systems
>
> 7 Hacienda Ct.
>
> Los Lunas, NM 87031
>
> (505) 865-6973 Office
>
> (505) 865-6025 Fax
>
> (505) 944-6345 Cell
>
> awat...@JustDealWithIt.com
>
> USAC New Mexico Representative
>
> usc...@JustDealWithIt.com
>
>
>
> CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This email message, including any attachments, is
> for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential
> information. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is
> prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the
> sender by reply email and destroy all copies of the original message
> including any attachments.

> ------------------------------
>
> *From:* losa...@att.net [mailto:losa...@att.net]
> *Sent:* Wednesday, March 19, 2008 00:14
> *To:* David Rutledge
> *Cc:* awat...@justdealwithit.com
> *Subject:* Re: [NMCycling] Hillsboro results

[Cliff Loucks]

Yes, yes, you're proposal to get this out through the bike-races list
is valid and overdue in my estimation. Repeated postings like this
help more then hurt in this major transition year.

Now back to the dirty side of racing for me,
--Cliff

_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/
Dopeler effect: The tendency of stupid ideas to seem smarter when
they come at you rapidly.

Cliff Loucks
Albuquerque, New Mexico

[David Halliburton]

I was sort of waiting to see how Hillsboro worked out.

 

Many active promoters/racers are already on or checking this group.

 

I'll get something posted out today.

 

.d.