A different view to John Kayode Fayemi
Augustine Togonu-Bickersteth
A slightly different view from Dr John K Fayemi, visiting professor, Kings college, London. Who has called for an alternative politics in nigeria I think we can have an ibadan solution to the Nigerian presidency by constituting the idea of nigerian president - in - Council just like olubsdam in Council the council would be made up of some or all the leafing presidential candidates and their decisions or advise based on their collective manifestos would be binding òn the nigerian president. Upgrade to a smarter GmailOPEN'100 per cent We did not copy the USA Constitution properly this might explain why it is not working for us in nigeriaFor instance in the USA the states have their individual constitutions and the Governors are referred to as commander in chief we should also not forget, DIversity, equity and sustainability, inclusivity.we should use our ballpoint pens to actualise all these not email or social media, geta stamp, envelope and writing paper and in your long hand wtrite to your elected representatives at the three tiers calling for restructuring. you could also photocopy and circulate in yur community calling for restructuring .,democracy calls for citizens participation,24 7 365 ,not just on election day.. Let my people Go! 100 per cent local government Autonomy!! There are federal laws, state laws and local government laws.so there should be federal police, state police and local government police. Nigerian governors are guilty of the sane crime they are accusing the federal government of Muhammad buhari in choosing not to grant 100 per cent autonomy to the local governments and the council's They choose to use the local government chairman perhaps as errand boys to award contract and to win elections and probably to divert funds. Same with the councillors Ideally, the sharing formula should be 60 per cent to the local government, 30 to the states and 10 per cent to the federal government. The state governors control too much including the commissioner's, members of the House of assembly, local government chairmen and councillors! That's perhaps why the system is not working. The Governor's should be limited to the commissioners. The others having 100 per cent autonomy. The Governor's should be based in small towns and the biggest cities should have mayors. This is how it should be.so it is in the USA; The Governors have centrifugal force. That is forces acting out. Widespread! And the mayors of the metropolitan cities have Centripetal force. Forces acting in. concentrated at the centre. a good book to read is titled,When mayors rule the world..this would attact more competent people to contesting for seat of local government In this way we would have persons competent enough to be president of Nigeria as local government chairman and hence an explosion of development #develop
cornelius...@gmail.com
Augustine Togonu-Bickersteth
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cornelius...@gmail.com
Lord Augustine,
If, in all seriousness, this is a suggestion that you have tabled for discussion, then obviously there is a (at least, one) problem which needs to be discussed.
But, if quite unlike you, the suggestion is being made in jest or in Heaven, then it's exactly as we say in Nigeria, "No Problem" - and there you have it.
Please forgive me, I’m no constitutional lawyer or town clerk; on your part it could be a loosely-worded first draft of a very well-intentioned proposal, but as presently worded the main problem to be anticipated is so glaring !
If , as you say, “ the council would be made up of some or all the leading presidential candidates and their decisions or advise based on their collective manifestos would be binding on the nigerian president” -
depending on what you mean by “ binding on ” the wording is crucial here, since quite literally it could mean that the president - in this case dear President Bola Ahmed Tinubu or any other Nigerian President would be like a dancing chimpanzee in the pocket of the council, dancing like a puppet to their demands - their melody. In short it would amount to the dictatorship of the council , since that suggestion as I understand it, empowers the members of such a council - if wishes were horses, let’s say “the leading presidential candidates” namely Alhaji Atiku AbuBakr & Peter Obi ( the losers) “and their decisions or advice based on their collective manifestos would be binding òn the nigerian president”
In other words, it would be the dictatorship of the miserable losers.
Of course, I may have misunderstood your clear text.
Of relevance :
“ In his book “ Seven Types of Ambiguity” (1930) , Empson ... .showed how language could be open-ended without being misleading. Ambiguity, he suggested, is not a defect but part of the richness of language. Rather than signifying equivocation or confusion, ambiguous expressions allow us to describe a fluid and paradoxical world.
Empson applied this account of ambiguity chiefly to poetry, but it is also illuminating when applied to religion and atheism. Describing ambiguity as “ any verbal nuance, however slight, which gives room for alternative reactions to the same piece of language”, he observed that “any prose statement could be called ambiguous”
( From page 7 of John Gray : Seven Types of Atheism
Mr cornelius Hamelberg is there a problem here?
On Thursday, September 14, 2023, cornelius...@gmail.com <cornelius...@gmail.com> wrote:"... we can have an ibadan solution to the Nigerian presidency by constituting the idea of nigerian president - in - Council just like olubsdam in Council the council would be made up of some or all the leafing presidential candidates and their decisions or advise based on their collective manifestos would be binding òn the nigerian president." ?On Wednesday, 13 September 2023 at 23:21:22 UTC+2 Augustine Togonu-Bickersteth wrote:A slightly different view from Dr John K Fayemi, visiting professor, Kings college, London. Who has called for an alternative politics in nigeria I think we can have an ibadan solution to the Nigerian presidency by constituting the idea of nigerian president - in - Council just like olubsdam in Council the council would be made up of some or all the leafing presidential candidates and their decisions or advise based on their collective manifestos would be binding òn the nigerian president. Upgrade to a smarter GmailOPEN'100 per cent We did not copy the USA Constitution properly this might explain why it is not working for us in nigeriaFor instance in the USA the states have their individual constitutions and the Governors are referred to as commander in chief we should also not forget, DIversity, equity and sustainability, inclusivity.we should use our ballpoint pens to actualise all these not email or social media, geta stamp, envelope and writing paper and in your long hand wtrite to your elected representatives at the three tiers calling for restructuring. you could also photocopy and circulate in yur community calling for restructuring .,democracy calls for citizens participation,24 7 365 ,not just on election day.. Let my people Go! 100 per cent local government Autonomy!! There are federal laws, state laws and local government laws.so there should be federal police, state police and local government police. Nigerian governors are guilty of the sane crime they are accusing the federal government of Muhammad buhari in choosing not to grant 100 per cent autonomy to the local governments and the council's They choose to use the local government chairman perhaps as errand boys to award contract and to win elections and probably to divert funds. Same with the councillors Ideally, the sharing formula should be 60 per cent to the local government, 30 to the states and 10 per cent to the federal government. The state governors control too much including the commissioner's, members of the House of assembly, local government chairmen and councillors! That's perhaps why the system is not working. The Governor's should be limited to the commissioners. The others having 100 per cent autonomy. The Governor's should be based in small towns and the biggest cities should have mayors. This is how it should be.so it is in the USA; The Governors have centrifugal force. That is forces acting out. Widespread! And the mayors of the metropolitan cities have Centripetal force. Forces acting in. concentrated at the centre. a good book to read is titled,When mayors rule the world..this would attact more competent people to contesting for seat of local government In this way we would have persons competent enough to be president of Nigeria as local government chairman and hence an explosion of development #develop
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Augustine Togonu-Bickersteth
Lord Augustine,
If, in all seriousness, this is a suggestion that you have tabled for discussion, then obviously there is a (at least, one) problem which needs to be discussed.
But, if quite unlike you, the suggestion is being made in jest or in Heaven, then it's exactly as we say in Nigeria, "No Problem" - and there you have it.
Please forgive me, I’m no constitutional lawyer or town clerk; on your part it could be a loosely-worded first draft of a very well-intentioned proposal, but as presently worded the main problem to be anticipated is so glaring !
If , as you say, “ the council would be made up of some or all the leading presidential candidates and their decisions or advise based on their collective manifestos would be binding on the nigerian president” -
depending on what you mean by “ binding on ” the wording is crucial here, since quite literally it could mean that the president - in this case dear President Bola Ahmed Tinubu or any other Nigerian President would be like a dancing chimpanzee in the pocket of the council, dancing like a puppet to their demands - their melody. In short it would amount to the dictatorship of the council , since that suggestion as I understand it, empowers the members of such a council - if wishes were horses, let’s say “the leading presidential candidates” namely Alhaji Atiku AbuBakr & Peter Obi ( the losers) “and their decisions or advice based on their collective manifestos would be binding òn the nigerian president”
In other words, it would be the dictatorship of the miserable losers.
Of course, I may have misunderstood your clear text.
Of relevance :
“ In his book “ Seven Types of Ambiguity” (1930) , Empson ... .showed how language could be open-ended without being misleading. Ambiguity, he suggested, is not a defect but part of the richness of language. Rather than signifying equivocation or confusion, ambiguous expressions allow us to describe a fluid and paradoxical world.
Empson applied this account of ambiguity chiefly to poetry, but it is also illuminating when applied to religion and atheism. Describing ambiguity as “ any verbal nuance, however slight, which gives room for alternative reactions to the same piece of language”, he observed that “any prose statement could be called ambiguous”
( From page 7 of John Gray : Seven Types of Atheism
On Thursday, 14 September 2023 at 11:42:08 UTC+2 Augustine Togonu-Bickersteth wrote:
Mr cornelius Hamelberg is there a problem here?
On Thursday, September 14, 2023, cornelius...@gmail.com <cornelius...@gmail.com> wrote:"... we can have an ibadan solution to the Nigerian presidency by constituting the idea of nigerian president - in - Council just like olubsdam in Council the council would be made up of some or all the leafing presidential candidates and their decisions or advise based on their collective manifestos would be binding òn the nigerian president." ?On Wednesday, 13 September 2023 at 23:21:22 UTC+2 Augustine Togonu-Bickersteth wrote:A slightly different view from Dr John K Fayemi, visiting professor, Kings college, London. Who has called for an alternative politics in nigeria I think we can have an ibadan solution to the Nigerian presidency by constituting the idea of nigerian president - in - Council just like olubsdam in Council the council would be made up of some or all the leafing presidential candidates and their decisions or advise based on their collective manifestos would be binding òn the nigerian president. Upgrade to a smarter GmailOPEN'100 per cent We did not copy the USA Constitution properly this might explain why it is not working for us in nigeriaFor instance in the USA the states have their individual constitutions and the Governors are referred to as commander in chief we should also not forget, DIversity, equity and sustainability, inclusivity.we should use our ballpoint pens to actualise all these not email or social media, geta stamp, envelope and writing paper and in your long hand wtrite to your elected representatives at the three tiers calling for restructuring. you could also photocopy and circulate in yur community calling for restructuring .,democracy calls for citizens participation,24 7 365 ,not just on election day.. Let my people Go! 100 per cent local government Autonomy!! There are federal laws, state laws and local government laws.so there should be federal police, state police and local government police. Nigerian governors are guilty of the sane crime they are accusing the federal government of Muhammad buhari in choosing not to grant 100 per cent autonomy to the local governments and the council's They choose to use the local government chairman perhaps as errand boys to award contract and to win elections and probably to divert funds. Same with the councillors Ideally, the sharing formula should be 60 per cent to the local government, 30 to the states and 10 per cent to the federal government. The state governors control too much including the commissioner's, members of the House of assembly, local government chairmen and councillors! That's perhaps why the system is not working. The Governor's should be limited to the commissioners. The others having 100 per cent autonomy. The Governor's should be based in small towns and the biggest cities should have mayors. This is how it should be.so it is in the USA; The Governors have centrifugal force. That is forces acting out. Widespread! And the mayors of the metropolitan cities have Centripetal force. Forces acting in. concentrated at the centre. a good book to read is titled,When mayors rule the world..this would attact more competent people to contesting for seat of local government In this way we would have persons competent enough to be president of Nigeria as local government chairman and hence an explosion of development #develop
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cornelius...@gmail.com
Lord Augustine Togonu-Bickersteth,
No flattery or insincerity please!
The wise men are three
In order of seniority
Claude Kayat, Mikael W Gejel, Samir
(Not Shamir )
Many thanks for clearing this up. Indeed, “binding” is a strong word and we must always read the fine print above where it says, “Sign Here!”
I can imagine you, stiff upper lip, sitting in the Sierra Leone House of Lords or the Nigerian Senate and holding forth….
So , you mean that if your dream were to be fulfilled overnight ,with or without acrimony, and for the good of the country only, Atiku and Obi would be ganging up against Mr. President to give him their sense of direction , of course, only in a consultative capacity.
Much as what goes on in the commons especially at the PMQS which I have also followed for decades…
Surprise, surprise. A few days ago Sweden’s Minister of Foreign Affairs Tobias Billström was to be found discharging himself creditably on BBC HARDtalk. Looking forward to some of the movers and shakers in President Tinubu’s cabinet being grilled by Stephen Sackur, after President Tinubu has been in the saddle for a while.
I suppose that Atiku is going to fade into oblivion, not “good riddance”, and not a nice thing to wish for an ambitious politician, but who knows, although he's not getting any younger he might be the comeback kid; Muhammadu Buhari was only fourth time lucky, so Atiku too might go for the presidency again. At this point I think that Obi is finished goods, especially after what he is alleged to have pleaded with his Big Daddy Bishop Oyedepo, begging to enlist the Christian sector of the electorate to support him because the election was actually a contest between good and evil, not a tribal war e.g. between tribes that hate one another but a “religious war”// JIHAD - at the ballot box. I doubt that Muslims in the North, South, West or even in the East are ever going to vote for him again. But who knows, Jesus having already died for his sins, in the future Obi might win on a Christian-Christian ticket.
I like some of what you say about curbing the powers of the already too powerful governors. Give them an inch they take a yard . Make each and every one of them commander-in-chief of the local police or military, and in some of the ethnic enclaves yearning to be totally autonomous and roaring to be free you’d have created another problem : the possibility of easy secession: Things fall apart, the centre cannot hold…
I think that I heard Atiku saying on the BBC , that the state governors/ state military and police should be given greater local powers ( funding) - to fight terrorism. At the time when he was saying this I thought that it was merely some subtle backhand canvassing - a direct appeal to the governors and wannabe governors - ” Vote for me!” and you’ll get more of everything - funding etc etc etc
After reading what Baba Kadiri wrote here about the actual powers of a Nigerian “Commander-in-Chief “ I wonder is this still the case?
Imagine if Nigeria was a monarchy and Nigeria had a (one) king like Saudi Arabia, Morocco…
Interesting piece of history : How YHWH Became King of the Universe
Thank you wise Mr Hamelberg. I think binding is a strong word but at the same time it would be pitiable if their supermarket of ideas are thrown through the window.
On Thursday, September 14, 2023, cornelius...@gmail.com <cornelius...@gmail.com> wrote:Lord Augustine,
If, in all seriousness, this is a suggestion that you have tabled for discussion, then obviously there is a (at least, one) problem which needs to be discussed.
But, if quite unlike you, the suggestion is being made in jest or in Heaven, then it's exactly as we say in Nigeria, "No Problem" - and there you have it.
Please forgive me, I’m no constitutional lawyer or town clerk; on your part it could be a loosely-worded first draft of a very well-intentioned proposal, but as presently worded the main problem to be anticipated is so glaring !
If , as you say, “ the council would be made up of some or all the leading presidential candidates and their decisions or advise based on their collective manifestos would be binding on the nigerian president” -
depending on what you mean by “ binding on ” the wording is crucial here, since quite literally it could mean that the president - in this case dear President Bola Ahmed Tinubu or any other Nigerian President would be like a dancing chimpanzee in the pocket of the council, dancing like a puppet to their demands - their melody. In short it would amount to the dictatorship of the council , since that suggestion as I understand it, empowers the members of such a council - if wishes were horses, let’s say “the leading presidential candidates” namely Alhaji Atiku AbuBakr & Peter Obi ( the losers) “and their decisions or advice based on their collective manifestos would be binding òn the nigerian president”
In other words, it would be the dictatorship of the miserable losers.
Of course, I may have misunderstood your clear text.
Of relevance :
“ In his book “ Seven Types of Ambiguity” (1930) , Empson ... .showed how language could be open-ended without being misleading. Ambiguity, he suggested, is not a defect but part of the richness of language. Rather than signifying equivocation or confusion, ambiguous expressions allow us to describe a fluid and paradoxical world.
Empson applied this account of ambiguity chiefly to poetry, but it is also illuminating when applied to religion and atheism. Describing ambiguity as “ any verbal nuance, however slight, which gives room for alternative reactions to the same piece of language”, he observed that “any prose statement could be called ambiguous”
( From page 7 of John Gray : Seven Types of Atheism
On Thursday, 14 September 2023 at 11:42:08 UTC+2 Augustine Togonu-Bickersteth wrote:Mr cornelius Hamelberg is there a problem here?
On Thursday, September 14, 2023, cornelius...@gmail.com <cornelius...@gmail.com> wrote:"... we can have an ibadan solution to the Nigerian presidency by constituting the idea of nigerian president - in - Council just like olubsdam in Council the council would be made up of some or all the leafing presidential candidates and their decisions or advise based on their collective manifestos would be binding òn the nigerian president." ?On Wednesday, 13 September 2023 at 23:21:22 UTC+2 Augustine Togonu-Bickersteth wrote:A slightly different view from Dr John K Fayemi, visiting professor, Kings college, London. Who has called for an alternative politics in nigeria I think we can have an ibadan solution to the Nigerian presidency by constituting the idea of nigerian president - in - Council just like olubsdam in Council the council would be made up of some or all the leafing presidential candidates and their decisions or advise based on their collective manifestos would be binding òn the nigerian president. Upgrade to a smarter GmailOPEN'100 per cent We did not copy the USA Constitution properly this might explain why it is not working for us in nigeriaFor instance in the USA the states have their individual constitutions and the Governors are referred to as commander in chief we should also not forget, DIversity, equity and sustainability, inclusivity.we should use our ballpoint pens to actualise all these not email or social media, geta stamp, envelope and writing paper and in your long hand wtrite to your elected representatives at the three tiers calling for restructuring. you could also photocopy and circulate in yur community calling for restructuring .,democracy calls for citizens participation,24 7 365 ,not just on election day.. Let my people Go! 100 per cent local government Autonomy!! There are federal laws, state laws and local government laws.so there should be federal police, state police and local government police. Nigerian governors are guilty of the sane crime they are accusing the federal government of Muhammad buhari in choosing not to grant 100 per cent autonomy to the local governments and the council's They choose to use the local government chairman perhaps as errand boys to award contract and to win elections and probably to divert funds. Same with the councillors Ideally, the sharing formula should be 60 per cent to the local government, 30 to the states and 10 per cent to the federal government. The state governors control too much including the commissioner's, members of the House of assembly, local government chairmen and councillors! That's perhaps why the system is not working. The Governor's should be limited to the commissioners. The others having 100 per cent autonomy. The Governor's should be based in small towns and the biggest cities should have mayors. This is how it should be.so it is in the USA; The Governors have centrifugal force. That is forces acting out. Widespread! And the mayors of the metropolitan cities have Centripetal force. Forces acting in. concentrated at the centre. a good book to read is titled,When mayors rule the world..this would attact more competent people to contesting for seat of local government In this way we would have persons competent enough to be president of Nigeria as local government chairman and hence an explosion of development #develop
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Salimonu Kadiri
Sent: 15 September 2023 10:48
To: USA Africa Dialogue Series <usaafric...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: USA Africa Dialogue Series - Re: A different view to John Kayode Fayemi
Augustine Togonu-Bickersteth
Although the Republican Constitution of 1963 titled the then President of Nigeria, Dr Nnamdi Azikiwe, as Commander in Chief of the Armed Forces, he was in reality a ceremonial President and not an Executive one. Despite Dr Nnamdi Azikiwe's academic qualification, as against the Prime Minister, Tafawa Balewa, who was an ordinary Grade II Teacher, he assumed that his title as Commander in Chief of the Armed Forces empowered him to command the Armed Forces into action. However, he was made to realise that the Royal Nigerian Army Act no. 26 of 1960 and the Royal Nigerian Navy Act no. 9 of 1960, which were still in force in 1965, were respectively under the general authority of the Defence Minister in matters of command, discipline and administration. The Council of Ministers and Prime Minister under the aforementioned Acts were vested with authority for the operational use and control of the armed forces and not the President in spite of his title, Commander in Chief of the Armed Forces.
On the contrary, the 1999 Constitution placed the executive deployment of the Armed Forces under the President. Whereas, a State Governor is the Chief Security Officer of his/her State, the power to deploy the Security Forces in any State in Nigeria is vested in the President.S. Kadiri
Sent: 15 September 2023 10:48
To: USA Africa Dialogue Series <usaafricadialogue@googlegroups.com>
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