Fwd: Wole Soyinka and the Rivers State Dinner Controversy: Soyinka and Amaechi's Response and Rejoinders to Those [Facebook Debates]
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Oluwatoyin Adepoju
Jan 8, 2016, 10:50:03 AM1/8/16
to Edo Global, Ra'ayi Riga, Yan, USAAfricaDialogue, WoleSoyinkaSociety
See posts and rich debates at respective links
Might require a Facebook account, which is a must for following developments in contemporay Nigerian history
3. WHEN CORRUPTION FIGHTS BACK: Critical Questions for Embattled Professor Wole Soyinka
4. 80th Birthday Dinner: Soyinka replies Rivers govt
5. Nobel laureate, Professor Wole Soyinka has described as ‘abominable distractions,’ statement by the Rivers State Commissioner for Information, Dr Austin Tam-George, that the state would demand a refund from him (Soyinka) if it is confirmed that he collected cash from the N82 million allegedly spent by immediate-past Governor, Rotimi Amaechi on a dinner to honour him
6. " When I learnt of the scandalous accusation of a dinner worth N82 million Naira in my honour, I thought it was one of those accusations from politicians to lug me, into murky political waters. But having received an instrument from the Rivers state government to corroborate its stance. I'm even more saddened, and would like to posit, that I was only treated to a dinner, by the Rt. Hon. Chibuike Rotimi Amaechi administration. And I ingested only foods and drinks, and afterwards retired to the Rivers state government guest house, where I laid my head, and flew back to Lagos the next day. I wasn't vouchsafed with any pecuniary advancement or benefaction, that would worth that amount. I still would not want to probe into the catering and logistical implications of that dinner in my honour. However, my cogitation navigates, to what I will refer to as, corruption backed up by the absence of a public procurement act, by that government. It's either I was used as conduit to loot the treasury of Rivers state by that government or some contractors were not sincere. " ~~Prof Wole Soyinka
7. Soyinka and the Pornography of Excess.
1. Chukwudi Iwuchukwu
·
N82m Dinner: Prof Soyinka replies Wike, says he can't ask his hosts "how much they spend"
2. Amaechi denies spending N82m on dinner for Soyinka, dares Wike to go to court3. WHEN CORRUPTION FIGHTS BACK: Critical Questions for Embattled Professor Wole Soyinka
4. 80th Birthday Dinner: Soyinka replies Rivers govt
5. Nobel laureate, Professor Wole Soyinka has described as ‘abominable distractions,’ statement by the Rivers State Commissioner for Information, Dr Austin Tam-George, that the state would demand a refund from him (Soyinka) if it is confirmed that he collected cash from the N82 million allegedly spent by immediate-past Governor, Rotimi Amaechi on a dinner to honour him
6. " When I learnt of the scandalous accusation of a dinner worth N82 million Naira in my honour, I thought it was one of those accusations from politicians to lug me, into murky political waters. But having received an instrument from the Rivers state government to corroborate its stance. I'm even more saddened, and would like to posit, that I was only treated to a dinner, by the Rt. Hon. Chibuike Rotimi Amaechi administration. And I ingested only foods and drinks, and afterwards retired to the Rivers state government guest house, where I laid my head, and flew back to Lagos the next day. I wasn't vouchsafed with any pecuniary advancement or benefaction, that would worth that amount. I still would not want to probe into the catering and logistical implications of that dinner in my honour. However, my cogitation navigates, to what I will refer to as, corruption backed up by the absence of a public procurement act, by that government. It's either I was used as conduit to loot the treasury of Rivers state by that government or some contractors were not sincere. " ~~Prof Wole Soyinka
7. Soyinka and the Pornography of Excess.
8. Nobel laureate, Professor Wole Soyinka has described as ‘abominable distractions,’ statement by the Rivers State Commissioner for Information, Dr Austin Tam-George, that the state would demand refund from him (Soyinka) if he collected cash from the N82 million alleg
9. News: N82million ill-fated Wole Soyinka Dinner : Nobel Laureate says it's not his business to know how much was expended by his friend
10. Probe Me, Soyinka Dares EFCC
11. Former Rivers State Governor, Rotimi Amaechi has denied allegations that he hosted Nobel laureate, Wole Soyinka to an N82 million dinner while in office.
12. Soyinka responds to Rivers govt's call for his probe over "N82 million dinner"
kenneth harrow
Jan 8, 2016, 11:29:13 AM1/8/16
to usaafric...@googlegroups.com
hard to fathom this story, for me, without looking up the exchange
rate for naira. i got $1=200 naira; one naira= half a cent.
so, one million naira = $5,000.
80 million naira, $400,000 should feed trump for a week!
or lots of the rest of us for many years.
and you say, they only had roast beef sandwiches?
to come to the more serious reflection, how many occasions do the super rich spend a fortune on catered or restaurant meals. literally a thousand or more dollars. maybe even $5000 for a business meal, with expensive wines.
how many poor use food stamps?
that is the injustice that demands , at a minimum, the politics of bernie sanders, and at the maximum a revolutionary change to the neoliberal globalization that has spawned such inequality in the recent decades?
ken
so, one million naira = $5,000.
80 million naira, $400,000 should feed trump for a week!
or lots of the rest of us for many years.
and you say, they only had roast beef sandwiches?
to come to the more serious reflection, how many occasions do the super rich spend a fortune on catered or restaurant meals. literally a thousand or more dollars. maybe even $5000 for a business meal, with expensive wines.
how many poor use food stamps?
that is the injustice that demands , at a minimum, the politics of bernie sanders, and at the maximum a revolutionary change to the neoliberal globalization that has spawned such inequality in the recent decades?
ken
--
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-- kenneth w. harrow professor of english michigan state university department of english 619 red cedar road room C-614 wells hall east lansing, mi 48824 ph. 517 803 8839 har...@msu.edu
Moses Ebe Ochonu
Jan 8, 2016, 12:03:31 PM1/8/16
to USAAfricaDialogue
Oh Ken, your American innocence is a joy to behold. Aww, you think dinner means dinner! I am sorry but I couldn't resist poking some fun as I was laughing hard here. In Nigeria, as in most African countries, a dinner is not just the food and drinks. A dinner is a euphemism for much more; it is not to be taking literally, although they seemed to have had roast beef as you said. So no need for all the arithmetic breakdowns and dollar comparisons. The 80 Million Naira was not spent on food and drinks alone. There must have been several contractors and subcontractors associated with this "dinner"--some whose purposes may have been to provide the "during" and "after" dinner entertainment, among other accompaniments.
On a serious note, without pronouncing one way or the other on the merit or veracity of the allegation since details are just emerging, this is clearly a political move designed to damage two APC/Buhari sympathizers at once--Soyinka and Amaechi. But that does not mean that it is not a legitimate allegation. As Governor of the oil rich Rivers State, Amaechi was known for feting the literati and literary folks in lavish parties and other expensive gestures of patronage (he was an English major in college and perhaps likes to see himself as a patron of the literary arts if not a literary mind). So let Kongi and Amaechi defend themselves as I am sure they can.
kenneth harrow
Jan 8, 2016, 12:37:50 PM1/8/16
to usaafric...@googlegroups.com
a sidebar here:
i have been to a good number of events sponsored or organized by toyin falola. they are a bit different from others i've attended--and that is a considerable number. he supports bringing young african scholars, giving them an opportunity by presenting their work, or by hearing other scholars, including both african and western. he doesn't splurge on high honoraria--as would be demanded by the likes of spike lee, say, or skip gates, or toni morrison, whom you mostly can't reach without going through their agents.
he really makes the speakers participate in the agenda of fostering african scholarship in this way. it is another kind of commitment, and his exuberance and decency require us to be idealists.
this is not about toyin, and his honors, multiple and deserved as they are. it is about a dinner. a simple dinner; an occasion to hear a speaker, to reflect on literary and political and philosophical values; to build an intellectual, and incidentally, a political constituency committed to making an african intellectual cohort come to life--one that is welcoming, not elitist and exclusive, much less dependent.
political leadership and intellectual profundity/honesty tend to be at odds with each other. their goals, their attachments to power, and with power the perks, are and ought to be at odds. we need to be at a distance not only to criticize power, but more important, to understand it, freely, and equally important to be able to critique and criticize it freely.
we need a free press; but they work ONLY on the surface of events. scholars, like those on this list, must understand the larger political and economic systems, and the ideologies that drive them
that's why adesokan's book reiterates the term "neoliberal global order" instead of just "global order" because the two are linked, and to understand neoliberalism one needs more than sound bites from editorialists. one needs book-length studies by scholars.
if that goes out the window, and the cry for technology drowns the intellectual voices, we will all build a society that is comfortable for those who know how to make profits, but not a better world.
a brief note of thank you to toyin falola. not everyone knows this about his commitment, if they see only his personal accomplishments. he uses them for a purpose that is not the same as that of the politicians. the more it is known, perhaps the more it will offer the kind of inspiration for what we all should be striving to support.
ken
(thanks moses, as always!)
i have been to a good number of events sponsored or organized by toyin falola. they are a bit different from others i've attended--and that is a considerable number. he supports bringing young african scholars, giving them an opportunity by presenting their work, or by hearing other scholars, including both african and western. he doesn't splurge on high honoraria--as would be demanded by the likes of spike lee, say, or skip gates, or toni morrison, whom you mostly can't reach without going through their agents.
he really makes the speakers participate in the agenda of fostering african scholarship in this way. it is another kind of commitment, and his exuberance and decency require us to be idealists.
this is not about toyin, and his honors, multiple and deserved as they are. it is about a dinner. a simple dinner; an occasion to hear a speaker, to reflect on literary and political and philosophical values; to build an intellectual, and incidentally, a political constituency committed to making an african intellectual cohort come to life--one that is welcoming, not elitist and exclusive, much less dependent.
political leadership and intellectual profundity/honesty tend to be at odds with each other. their goals, their attachments to power, and with power the perks, are and ought to be at odds. we need to be at a distance not only to criticize power, but more important, to understand it, freely, and equally important to be able to critique and criticize it freely.
we need a free press; but they work ONLY on the surface of events. scholars, like those on this list, must understand the larger political and economic systems, and the ideologies that drive them
that's why adesokan's book reiterates the term "neoliberal global order" instead of just "global order" because the two are linked, and to understand neoliberalism one needs more than sound bites from editorialists. one needs book-length studies by scholars.
if that goes out the window, and the cry for technology drowns the intellectual voices, we will all build a society that is comfortable for those who know how to make profits, but not a better world.
a brief note of thank you to toyin falola. not everyone knows this about his commitment, if they see only his personal accomplishments. he uses them for a purpose that is not the same as that of the politicians. the more it is known, perhaps the more it will offer the kind of inspiration for what we all should be striving to support.
ken
(thanks moses, as always!)
Emmanuel Udogu
Jan 8, 2016, 2:31:54 PM1/8/16
to usaafric...@googlegroups.com
My view on this thread
Such a possible “political fund raising activity” represents one of
the peculiar contrivances or strategies applied by politicians to
“milk” the state and national coffers. I have argued—and still
argue—that this administration should call for a thorough auditing of
the accounts of the 36 states and the Federal Capital City Abuja. As I
posited in an earlier submission on this forum, the powerful “gang of
two” Generals Buhari and Idiagbon, stressed to my satisfaction in the
early 1980s the criticality of auditing state and national budgets.
Indeed, some of you would recall what Governor Ibori did to the
treasury of Delta State partially because there was lack of authentic
auditing of the state’s budget.
It would behoove this administration to undertake this important step
within the context of the current superb policy of fighting corruption
in our polity. Put in another way, he could call upon or challenge the
country to fight two overlapping battles—“the War against Corruption
and the War against Indiscipline.” In this way, it would be the
country and not the president, APC and PDP going after the “Ali Babas
and their forty thieves” for rubbing our future generations of their
patrimony.
I have deliberately revived the highly contested policy of “War
against Indiscipline” for a reason. Indeed, I have done so against the
backdrop of the discourses (on this forum and elsewhere) during the
Obasanjo regime when our Vice President alleged that he and his boss
shared amongst themselves the extra proceeds from crude oil when the
price spiked above the budgeted $100 or so a barrel mark. I would
argue that it was because of fiscal “indiscipline” and “corruption”
that our leaders who should have invested the extra cash in the
country’s infrastructure did not.
Ike Udogu
>>> <https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=1185652274796894&set=a.722503234445136.1073741825.100000563983468&type=3>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> <https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=1185652274796894&set=a.722503234445136.1073741825.100000563983468&type=3>
>>>
>>> 7.Soyinka and the Pornography of Excess
>>>
>>> <https://www.facebook.com/groups/spacesforchange/permalink/1002394989842266/>.
>>>
>>> 9.News: N82million ill-fated Wole Soyinka Dinner : Nobel Laureate
>>> <mailto:USAAfricaDial...@googlegroups.com>
>> har...@msu.edu <mailto:har...@msu.edu>
>> <mailto:USAAfricaDialogue%2Bsub...@googlegroups.com>
Such a possible “political fund raising activity” represents one of
the peculiar contrivances or strategies applied by politicians to
“milk” the state and national coffers. I have argued—and still
argue—that this administration should call for a thorough auditing of
the accounts of the 36 states and the Federal Capital City Abuja. As I
posited in an earlier submission on this forum, the powerful “gang of
two” Generals Buhari and Idiagbon, stressed to my satisfaction in the
early 1980s the criticality of auditing state and national budgets.
Indeed, some of you would recall what Governor Ibori did to the
treasury of Delta State partially because there was lack of authentic
auditing of the state’s budget.
It would behoove this administration to undertake this important step
within the context of the current superb policy of fighting corruption
in our polity. Put in another way, he could call upon or challenge the
country to fight two overlapping battles—“the War against Corruption
and the War against Indiscipline.” In this way, it would be the
country and not the president, APC and PDP going after the “Ali Babas
and their forty thieves” for rubbing our future generations of their
patrimony.
I have deliberately revived the highly contested policy of “War
against Indiscipline” for a reason. Indeed, I have done so against the
backdrop of the discourses (on this forum and elsewhere) during the
Obasanjo regime when our Vice President alleged that he and his boss
shared amongst themselves the extra proceeds from crude oil when the
price spiked above the budgeted $100 or so a barrel mark. I would
argue that it was because of fiscal “indiscipline” and “corruption”
that our leaders who should have invested the extra cash in the
country’s infrastructure did not.
Ike Udogu
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> <https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=1185652274796894&set=a.722503234445136.1073741825.100000563983468&type=3>
>>>
>>> 2. Amaechi denies spending N82m on dinner for Soyinka, dares Wike
>>> to go to court
>>> <https://www.facebook.com/Premiumtimes/posts/959616887409259>
>>> 2. Amaechi denies spending N82m on dinner for Soyinka, dares Wike
>>> to go to court
>>>
>>> 3. WHEN CORRUPTION FIGHTS BACK: Critical Questions for Embattled
>>> Professor Wole Soyinka
>>>
>>> <https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=988522437876273&id=378378918890631>
>>> 3. WHEN CORRUPTION FIGHTS BACK: Critical Questions for Embattled
>>> Professor Wole Soyinka
>>>
>>>
>>> 4. 80th Birthday Dinner: Soyinka replies Rivers govt
>>> <https://www.facebook.com/vanguardngr/posts/1253201034704990>
>>> 4. 80th Birthday Dinner: Soyinka replies Rivers govt
>>>
>>> 5. Nobel laureate, Professor Wole Soyinka has described as
>>> ‘abominable distractions,’ statement by the Rivers State
>>> Commissioner for Information, Dr Austin Tam-George, that the
>>> state would demand a refund from him (Soyinka) if it is confirmed
>>> that he collected cash from the N82 million allegedly spent by
>>> immediate-past Governor, Rotimi Amaechi on a dinner to honour him
>>>
>>> <https://www.facebook.com/informationnigeria/posts/10153568890739822>
>>> 5. Nobel laureate, Professor Wole Soyinka has described as
>>> ‘abominable distractions,’ statement by the Rivers State
>>> Commissioner for Information, Dr Austin Tam-George, that the
>>> state would demand a refund from him (Soyinka) if it is confirmed
>>> that he collected cash from the N82 million allegedly spent by
>>> immediate-past Governor, Rotimi Amaechi on a dinner to honour him
>>>
>>>
>>> 6. " When I learnt of the scandalous accusation of a dinner worth
>>> N82 million Naira in my honour, I thought it was one of those
>>> accusations from politicians to lug me, into murky political
>>> waters. But having received an instrument from the Rivers state
>>> government to corroborate its stance. I'm even more saddened, and
>>> would like to posit, that I was only treated to a dinner, by the
>>> Rt. Hon. Chibuike Rotimi Amaechi administration. And I ingested
>>> only foods and drinks, and afterwards retired to the Rivers state
>>> government guest house, where I laid my head, and flew back to
>>> Lagos the next day. I wasn't vouchsafed with any pecuniary
>>> advancement or benefaction, that would worth that amount. I still
>>> would not want to probe into the catering and logistical
>>> implications of that dinner in my honour. However, my cogitation
>>> navigates, to what I will refer to as, corruption backed up by
>>> the absence of a public procurement act, by that government. It's
>>> either I was used as conduit to loot the treasury of Rivers state
>>> by that government or some contractors were not sincere. " ~~Prof
>>> Wole Soyink
>>>
>>> <https://www.facebook.com/christabel.amachree/posts/1048129758541004>a
>>> 6. " When I learnt of the scandalous accusation of a dinner worth
>>> N82 million Naira in my honour, I thought it was one of those
>>> accusations from politicians to lug me, into murky political
>>> waters. But having received an instrument from the Rivers state
>>> government to corroborate its stance. I'm even more saddened, and
>>> would like to posit, that I was only treated to a dinner, by the
>>> Rt. Hon. Chibuike Rotimi Amaechi administration. And I ingested
>>> only foods and drinks, and afterwards retired to the Rivers state
>>> government guest house, where I laid my head, and flew back to
>>> Lagos the next day. I wasn't vouchsafed with any pecuniary
>>> advancement or benefaction, that would worth that amount. I still
>>> would not want to probe into the catering and logistical
>>> implications of that dinner in my honour. However, my cogitation
>>> navigates, to what I will refer to as, corruption backed up by
>>> the absence of a public procurement act, by that government. It's
>>> either I was used as conduit to loot the treasury of Rivers state
>>> by that government or some contractors were not sincere. " ~~Prof
>>> Wole Soyink
>>>
>>>
>>> 7.Soyinka and the Pornography of Excess
>>>
>>> <https://www.facebook.com/groups/spacesforchange/permalink/1002394989842266/>.
>>>
>>> 8. Nobel laureate, Professor Wole Soyinka has described as
>>> ‘abominable distractions,’ statement by the Rivers State
>>> Commissioner for Information, Dr Austin Tam-George, that the
>>> state would demand refund from him (Soyinka) if he collected cash
>>> from the N82 million alleg
>>>
>>> <https://www.facebook.com/DailyIndependentNigeria/posts/1084350931616448>
>>> 8. Nobel laureate, Professor Wole Soyinka has described as
>>> ‘abominable distractions,’ statement by the Rivers State
>>> Commissioner for Information, Dr Austin Tam-George, that the
>>> state would demand refund from him (Soyinka) if he collected cash
>>> from the N82 million alleg
>>>
>>>
>>> 9.News: N82million ill-fated Wole Soyinka Dinner : Nobel Laureate
>>> says it's not his business to know how much was expended by his
>>> friend
>>>
>>> <https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=988609801200870&id=378378918890631>
>>> friend
>>>
>>>
>>> 10. Probe Me, Soyinka Dares EFCC
>>>
>>> <https://www.facebook.com/BlacknaijaOnline/photos/a.511663762223943.1073741828.504507682939551/1017497794973868/?type=3>
>>> 10. Probe Me, Soyinka Dares EFCC
>>>
>>>
>>> 11. Former Rivers State Governor, Rotimi Amaechi has denied
>>> allegations that he hosted Nobel laureate, Wole Soyinka to an N82
>>> million dinner while in office.
>>> <https://www.facebook.com/pulsenigeria247/posts/986987091394719>
>>> 11. Former Rivers State Governor, Rotimi Amaechi has denied
>>> allegations that he hosted Nobel laureate, Wole Soyinka to an N82
>>> million dinner while in office.
>>>
>>> 12. Soyinka responds to Rivers govt's call for his probe over
>>> "N82 million dinner
>>> <https://www.facebook.com/Premiumtimes/posts/959393767431571>"
>>> 12. Soyinka responds to Rivers govt's call for his probe over
>>> "N82 million dinner
>>>
>>> For more type 'Wole Soyinka' into facebook search
>>>
>>> --
>>> Listserv moderated by Toyin Falola, University of Texas at Austin
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>>> For more type 'Wole Soyinka' into facebook search
>>>
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>>
>> --
>> kenneth w. harrow
>> professor of english
>> michigan state university
>> department of english
>> 619 red cedar road
>> room C-614 wells hall
>> east lansing, mi 48824
>> ph.517 803 8839 <tel:517%20803%208839>
>>
>> --
>> kenneth w. harrow
>> professor of english
>> michigan state university
>> department of english
>> 619 red cedar road
>> room C-614 wells hall
>> east lansing, mi 48824
>> har...@msu.edu <mailto:har...@msu.edu>
>>
>> --
>> Listserv moderated by Toyin Falola, University of Texas at Austin
>> To post to this group, send an email to
>> USAAfric...@googlegroups.com
>> <mailto:USAAfric...@googlegroups.com>
>> --
>> Listserv moderated by Toyin Falola, University of Texas at Austin
>> To post to this group, send an email to
>> USAAfric...@googlegroups.com
>> <mailto:USAAfricaDialogue%2Bsub...@googlegroups.com>
>> Current archives at http://groups.google.com/group/USAAfricaDialogue
>> Early archives at
>> http://www.utexas.edu/conferences/africa/ads/index.html
>> ---
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>> --
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>> To post to this group, send an email to
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Salimonu Kadiri
Jan 8, 2016, 3:23:06 PM1/8/16
to usaafric...@googlegroups.com
Once, there was a boy-child who told his father: when I grow up I am going to marry your mother. The father retorted, it is impossible. The boy screamed back to the father: why is it impossible for me to marry your mother when you are married to my own mother? The father conceded non-adult reasoning to his boy-child and told him that he would understand at a ripe age why it is impossible for him to marry his mother. I am seeing non-adult way of reasoning in this so called Soyinka's dinner, most especially, when it is being peddled as something designed to damage Soyinka and Amechi, two sympathizers of Buhari's regime.
Chibuike Amechi has no immunity against prosecution. Therefore, if the current government is in possession of any document implicating him (Amechi) in fraud or embezzlement when he was governor of Rivers State, the best thing to do is to charge him to court. As Soyinka could not have been the only person at the dinner, it would be proper to name other dinner attendees beside Soyinka and charge them all to court if participating in such dinner is criminal.
S.Kadiri
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 2016 11:01:07 -0600
Subject: Re: USA Africa Dialogue Series - Fwd: Wole Soyinka and the Rivers State Dinner Controversy: Soyinka and Amaechi's Response and Rejoinders to Those [Facebook Debates]
From: meoc...@gmail.com
To: usaafric...@googlegroups.com
Chibuike Amechi has no immunity against prosecution. Therefore, if the current government is in possession of any document implicating him (Amechi) in fraud or embezzlement when he was governor of Rivers State, the best thing to do is to charge him to court. As Soyinka could not have been the only person at the dinner, it would be proper to name other dinner attendees beside Soyinka and charge them all to court if participating in such dinner is criminal.
S.Kadiri
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 2016 11:01:07 -0600
Subject: Re: USA Africa Dialogue Series - Fwd: Wole Soyinka and the Rivers State Dinner Controversy: Soyinka and Amaechi's Response and Rejoinders to Those [Facebook Debates]
From: meoc...@gmail.com
To: usaafric...@googlegroups.com
Bode
Jan 8, 2016, 5:50:41 PM1/8/16
to 'Ikhide' via USA Africa Dialogue Series
Ken,
You have addressed your moving words to Professor Falola, but they are a reflection of your graciousness and genuine commitment to African scholars and scholarship. I cannot forget what Professor Folu Ogundimu said to me when I first arrived in the US some 16 years ago and was still staying at your place. He said you are one of the few he knows with foresight, intellectual and political. Your great insight is reflected in your comments. Manthia Diawara told me when I visited NYU several years ago that he does not know where you get the energy from to sustain the rigorous level of engagement you have with scholarship and activism. I have always been in awe of how you worked harder than any of us, your students. Your sensitivity and temperament are still things I hope to emulate. I could not help pointing out the delightful irony that what you appreciate in Professor Falola are the same things that we appreciate about you! I think every single word in your note of thanks to Professor Falola are insufficient to describe your own graciousness, brilliance, commitment, and humanity.
Happy New Year!
Yours truly,
Bode
kenneth harrow
Jan 8, 2016, 6:16:29 PM1/8/16
to usaafric...@googlegroups.com
thank you bode.
i am 72 years old, and definitely feel the weight of my years. i hope to be deserving of your high praise, as long as i can. my reward is in seeing you and the other wonderful grad students i've known succeed. i hope to be reading about your work for many years.
toyin will play a role, too, in the success of our field, and people like you who enrich it with hard work and great brilliance.
ken
i am 72 years old, and definitely feel the weight of my years. i hope to be deserving of your high praise, as long as i can. my reward is in seeing you and the other wonderful grad students i've known succeed. i hope to be reading about your work for many years.
toyin will play a role, too, in the success of our field, and people like you who enrich it with hard work and great brilliance.
ken
Salimonu Kadiri
Jan 9, 2016, 12:26:15 PM1/9/16
to usaafric...@googlegroups.com
Thank you Kenneth for approximating the alleged 82 million naira dinner for Soyinka to 400,000 dollars. That is a huge amount of money as you have observed. Unfortunately, Nigerians don't have respect for figures especially when they pertain to elections and money. The commissioner that is making allegation of eighty-two million dollars dinner is appointed and serving under a governor whose election has just been nullified by the Appeal Court in Nigeria because he was declared elected by votes that exceeded the total number of registered voters in Rivers State. It was for the same reason that the elections of over half of members of Rivers State House of Assembly have been nullified by the Appeal Court. The legitimacy of the current Rivers State government is yet to be finally decided by the Supreme Court. The figure being bandied by the Rivers State Commissioner as a dinner cost may not be true in as much as it has not been substantiated with any document. It is worth remembering that Rivers State House of Assembly was closed down from July 2014 because five members of the House, backed by President Jonathan with Federal Police, claimed the right to suspend twenty-seven members of the House and to impeach the Governor of the State, Chibuike Amechi. Yes, in Nigeria's numerical structure, five is greater than twenty-seven!!
The ruling elites in Nigeria do not simply see governance as a means of food distribution among themselves and in which they eat on behalf of their respective ethnic group but as an opportunity to steal appropriated developmental money. On November 13, 2007, the Executive Director, United Nations Office on Drug and Crime (UNODC), Antonio Maria Costa, was a speaker at a three-day 6th national seminar organised by the Economic and Financial Crimes Commission (EFCC), in Abuja. Antonio Maria Costa told his audience that between 1960, when Nigeria became independent and 1999, when democracy was restored, a sum of four-hundred billion dollars ($400 billion) was stolen and stashed away in foreign banks by a generation of corrupt rulers. He lamented thus, "If you were to put $400 billion bills in a row, you will make a path from here to the moon and back not once but 75 times. Think of how different Nigeria would have looked today (if the money had been used to develop Nigeria)." On December 5, 2007, the Nigerian media carried the news that the chairman of EFCC, Nuhu Ribadu, accused the United Nations of withholding information regarding the $400 billion stolen from Nigeria and kept in Europe and the US. It is an irony of fate that those who received Black slaves and colonized the Black man are also the receivers and keepers of stolen developmental money not only from Nigeria but entire Africa. Again, stolen $400 billion would have caused a revolt in other countries but not in Nigeria where figures have no value. So, the alleged $400,000 dinner is nothing to talk about when compared to $400 billion.
S.Kadiri
The ruling elites in Nigeria do not simply see governance as a means of food distribution among themselves and in which they eat on behalf of their respective ethnic group but as an opportunity to steal appropriated developmental money. On November 13, 2007, the Executive Director, United Nations Office on Drug and Crime (UNODC), Antonio Maria Costa, was a speaker at a three-day 6th national seminar organised by the Economic and Financial Crimes Commission (EFCC), in Abuja. Antonio Maria Costa told his audience that between 1960, when Nigeria became independent and 1999, when democracy was restored, a sum of four-hundred billion dollars ($400 billion) was stolen and stashed away in foreign banks by a generation of corrupt rulers. He lamented thus, "If you were to put $400 billion bills in a row, you will make a path from here to the moon and back not once but 75 times. Think of how different Nigeria would have looked today (if the money had been used to develop Nigeria)." On December 5, 2007, the Nigerian media carried the news that the chairman of EFCC, Nuhu Ribadu, accused the United Nations of withholding information regarding the $400 billion stolen from Nigeria and kept in Europe and the US. It is an irony of fate that those who received Black slaves and colonized the Black man are also the receivers and keepers of stolen developmental money not only from Nigeria but entire Africa. Again, stolen $400 billion would have caused a revolt in other countries but not in Nigeria where figures have no value. So, the alleged $400,000 dinner is nothing to talk about when compared to $400 billion.
S.Kadiri
Subject: Re: USA Africa Dialogue Series - Fwd: Wole Soyinka and the Rivers State Dinner Controversy: Soyinka and Amaechi's Response and Rejoinders to Those [Facebook Debates]
kenneth harrow
Jan 9, 2016, 2:22:44 PM1/9/16
to usaafric...@googlegroups.com
what a shame!
in some countries, (burkina), one could imagine a revolution. even in s africa, the revolution against white rule was also against money and privilege. i think i have read that some of the resentments up north are tied to the sense that the money is not coming there, where it should; just as the revolt in the delta has been justified on the ground that the oil flows out, but the money for it doesn't come back in.
there is a lot of violence in nigeria. the more there is money, graft, corruption, the more one might imagine, eventually, instability. a poorer sahelian country, with little to steal, comparatively, might be protected against this internal conflict....
i am not stating that just because oil comes from one region (in the u.s., that is texas, and alaska), that those people should benefit from it more than other citizens. but the resentments would be enormous were there not to be some kind of sharing, and in the case of nigeria, perhaps these are multiplied by what you are writing, salimonu, about the corruption of the state stealing the money, not just failing to distribute equitably among the citizenry.
k
in some countries, (burkina), one could imagine a revolution. even in s africa, the revolution against white rule was also against money and privilege. i think i have read that some of the resentments up north are tied to the sense that the money is not coming there, where it should; just as the revolt in the delta has been justified on the ground that the oil flows out, but the money for it doesn't come back in.
there is a lot of violence in nigeria. the more there is money, graft, corruption, the more one might imagine, eventually, instability. a poorer sahelian country, with little to steal, comparatively, might be protected against this internal conflict....
i am not stating that just because oil comes from one region (in the u.s., that is texas, and alaska), that those people should benefit from it more than other citizens. but the resentments would be enormous were there not to be some kind of sharing, and in the case of nigeria, perhaps these are multiplied by what you are writing, salimonu, about the corruption of the state stealing the money, not just failing to distribute equitably among the citizenry.
k
Michael Afolayan
Jan 10, 2016, 5:39:48 AM1/10/16
to usaafric...@googlegroups.com
Two things:
First of all, without moon-walking back to the conversation triggered a few days ago, I would like to say Ken's observation of Professor Falola is right on the money. Indeed, it's what has been well known to a critical mass on this and some other networks over the years. It further underscores those factors responsible for the making of a catalyst for progress. Not one bit surprised. I'll leave it at that. . . .
Secondly, at the risk of being misconstrued as committing a fallacy of illicit minor, I would like to say that the N82m dinner is not only a euphemism for corruption - after all, we all know that corruption has blended snugly into the culture of contemporary Nigeria, it is a metaphor for how the gospel of corruption is spread home and abroad; left, right, and center. I have a theory, and I stand corrected; but my people would say the unwise farmer who harvests and eats its yam tubers prematurely always wants everyone else to do likewise. This poor translation does not do a good job to deliver my point here but the idea is that the patriarchs (and matriarchs, I must add) of the obvious endemic culture of corruption at the home front have found a way of bringing as many as possible (suspecting or unsuspecting citizens) under their wings and within a close proximity of the natural curse that comes with their deeds. Here is what I am saying:
I cannot in good conscience exonerate Professor Soyinka regarding this matter as I do not know what transpired in the "dinning" process, but I would not be surprised if the 80th birthday "dinner" was just a convenient trap to bamboozle the big shot into believing his friend was truly feting him, not knowing the so-called friend's hidden agenda was simply to use the big name of the big man as the mule to ship the "national cake" (a.ka. N82m) out of the government house, unbeknown to the mule. Therefore, when the strong climber (gburu) is dragged out of the thick forest, a wide range of forest shrubs is dragged along. The attention automatically shifts from the culprit, "gburu" and all eyes are turned to the forest shrubs, which now must have littered the roadside fully noticed by all passersby. Who would hear the name "Wole Soyinka" and remember to notice one "Amaechi" in the mix? I doubt it! If this tactic does not work, the politician is going to be "sick" very soon and travel overseas, sending images of sorry conditions to the gullible citizenry. Nowhere does the theater of corruption provide such comedies of lamentation at the expense of the working class than in the home front. You ask, how on earth would every thief become suddenly sick only after stealing for themselves an equivalent of what should be meant for millions of citizens? In the Shakespearean language, these politicians are the "ruins of the noblest (working Nigerians) that ever lived in the tide of times!" But I refrain from uttering the words of Mark Anthony in Julius Caesar to predict their future. All I can say is "All days belong to the thief . . ."
These diabolical stratagems of corrupt politicians have preyed on the gullibility of many public figures, who are, for the most part, book smart but deficient in street-smartness. Case in point: I spent quality time with the wife of the late Tai Solarin (TS), Mama Sheila, a few years before her passing. When, out of curiosity, I asked her if she knew of any particular regret/s that her iconic husband, TS, ever entertained, she told me categorically that it was having anything to do with the Nigerian government, which used his name to execute their pathological corruption and ending up to embarrass him in the process. My point is this: I would be surprised if Professor Soyinka knew of the amount of money to change hands or the 84 million Naira tab that would cap the multimillion Naira 80th birthday dinner before attending it. I would not be surprised if he did not know; and I would be disappointed, grossly and painfully disappointed, if he did.
Michael O. Afolayan
From the Land of Lincoln
Mobolaji Aluko
Jan 10, 2016, 6:35:02 AM1/10/16
to USAAfrica Dialogue
Salimonu Kadiri:
I am interested in accountability. The accuser - and the accused - should be able to reconcile the following straw table:
STRAW DRAFT:
PLANNING COMMITTEE WORK PROGRAM
RIVERS STATE DINNER FOR SOYINKA
|
Implementation |
Naira Value |
|
1. Venue |
|
|
2. Transportation |
|
|
3. Security |
|
|
4. Food |
|
|
5. Brochure & printing |
|
|
6. Advertisements and Publicity |
|
|
7. Awards |
|
|
8. Accommodations for special guests |
|
|
9. Music |
|
|
10. Reception |
|
|
11. Registration |
|
|
12. Ushers |
|
|
13. Special Guests Honorarium |
|
|
14. Lecture hall & Equipment |
|
|
15. Outdoor activities & site seeing |
|
|
16. Media |
|
|
17. Technology |
|
|
18. TOTAL |
82,000,000.00 |
And there you have it.
Bolaji Aluko
M Buba
Jan 10, 2016, 9:07:40 AM1/10/16
to usaafric...@googlegroups.com
My Dear Brother Michael,
I'm totally with you both on the celebration of TF's mentoring and nurturing powers, as well as the power of muck (of corruption) to stick and smear.
I've always thought that corrupt practices are far more difficult to address than grand thefts of public funds. My experience (especially) at the Senate has forced me to conclude that everyone is assumed to have a price at which she/he will succumb to the dictates of corrupt public officers and business moguls. It was never about money per se, but the alleviation of one's unfulfilled needs; first-class travels, admissions/guardianship of kids abroad, medical care abroad, Rolex watches and Montblanc pens, and of course grand (homecoming) receptions for our talents from yonder. Even on our campuses, VCs and their lieutenants are regularly showered with small acts of 'kindness' in the form of perfumes, prayer mats and rosaries (!) by staff earning less than 1/4 of bosses' salary.
In other words, short of always saying NO to THEM and their (corrupt) practices (or quitting), there's no hiding place for good people in this country. They'll rope you in, and you won't know what hit you, in spite of the Nobel and other notable laurels.
Malami
Prof Malami Buba
Department of English Language & Linguistics
Sokoto State University
PMB 2134, Birnin-Kebbi Rd,
Sokoto, NIGERIA
Adeshina Afolayan
Jan 10, 2016, 10:08:16 AM1/10/16
to usaafric...@googlegroups.com
In other words, as far as corruption and corrupt practices are concerned, if you can't beat them, join them. And the joining is more lucrative than the beating. Corruption in Nigeria has created its own unique rationality that not only inberts the rational-irrational dynamics, but also consigns those who want to escape its tentacle to a minority and pathetic corner. When you refuse to join, your own people, possibly your wife even, sneer at your "stupidity": God has open the door for you to partake of the good of the land, yet you stand back and spew some foolish moral nonsense! Osi laa pa e ku (pocerty will hang you!)
In the midst of those who participate, you actually become stupid. The look you get is that of pity. Your morality leaves you dangling...all alone. The point is that only very few can dangle all alone, with the consequence that the participants' pool keeps increasing.
Malami is right; the righteous is not safe in Nigeria. The status market is an alluring one; no one wants to be left behind in the acquisition of the good things of life. And since your hard work and meagre returns on hard work aren't sufficient guarantees to enter that market, the alternative offers instant gratification. Added to this are also societal pressures: school fees, kinship pressures, religious responsibilities, social requirements, etc.
So, if you don't want to join the corrupt circle, you are in extreme danger. Do you therefore join and escape the odium of being the wretched of Nigeria?
Adeshina Afolayan
Salimonu Kadiri
Jan 10, 2016, 12:23:58 PM1/10/16
to usaafric...@googlegroups.com
Bolaji Aluko,
I associate myself with your interest in accountability. The accuser should be able to furnish the public with the 17-point implementation program contained in your table below. So far the accused, Chibuike Amechi has told the public that he did not spend N82 million for Wole Soyinka's dinner but not how much he actually spent. Pressure should be brought on the accuser to substantiate his accusation of N82 million cost of dinner for Wole Soyinka, if he/she is not just throwing out figure to discredit Amechi and Soyinka.
S. Kadiri
Date: Sun, 10 Jan 2016 12:03:02 +0100
I associate myself with your interest in accountability. The accuser should be able to furnish the public with the 17-point implementation program contained in your table below. So far the accused, Chibuike Amechi has told the public that he did not spend N82 million for Wole Soyinka's dinner but not how much he actually spent. Pressure should be brought on the accuser to substantiate his accusation of N82 million cost of dinner for Wole Soyinka, if he/she is not just throwing out figure to discredit Amechi and Soyinka.
S. Kadiri
Date: Sun, 10 Jan 2016 12:03:02 +0100
Subject: Re: USA Africa Dialogue Series - Fwd: Wole Soyinka and the Rivers State Dinner Controversy: Soyinka and Amaechi's Response and Rejoinders to Those [Facebook Debates]
Segun Ogungbemi
Jan 10, 2016, 3:14:28 PM1/10/16
to usaafric...@googlegroups.com, usaafric...@googlegroups.com
A drowning man will always want to hold on to something whether it can save him or not. Wike and his cohorts will like to blackmail a man of substance before they are shown the way out. There is no hiding place for them.
I am not a spokesman of Wole Soyinka, but the very little I know about him is that he would not have asked Rotimi Amechi to honor him with a dinner.
On getting to the arena of the dinner, does anyone expect the celebrant to ask his host the cost of the dinner?
If the accuser has evidence let him go to court to present it and stop the cheap blackmail.
Segun Ogungbemi.
Sent from my iPhone
Segun Ogungbemi.
Sent from my iPhone
Salimonu Kadiri
Jan 10, 2016, 3:14:38 PM1/10/16
to usaafric...@googlegroups.com
My point is this: I would be surprised if Professor Soyinka knew of the amount of money to change hands or the 84 million Naira tab would cap the multimillion Naira 80th birthday dinner before attending it. I would not be surprised if he did not know; and I would be disappointed, grossly and painfully disappointed, if he did (know) - Michael O. Afolayan.
Is it not an exercise in futility to assume or speculate that Wole Soyinka knew, in advance, that the cost of the dinner to which he was invited would cost, according to MOA, 84 million Naira tab? Is it normal for any invitee to a dinner to ask how much the host is going to spend to host the dinner?Although Wole Soyinka was eighty at the time of the dinner, there was no indication that he was suffering from dementia. Thus, if Wole Soyinka's host had told him that he was being invited to come and gorge on nicely salted rogue dinner of N82 million, Soyinka would not have honoured the invitation, just as he refused to accept national honour award from President Jonathan in 2013 because Abacha was also awarded national honour posthumously and was to be received by his son, Mohammed Abacha, at the same occasion.
The cost of the dinner, according to the Rivers State Commissioner, was N82 million, but MOA has increased it to N84 million. If MOA consciously or unconsciously could increase the amount of money spent for the dinner with two million naira, how then can one be sure that Rivers State Commissioner has not with malicious intention increased the amount of money spent for the Wole Soyinka's dinner from, maybe, eight-thousand and two hundred naira (N8,200) or eighty-two thousand and two hundred naira (N82,000) to eighty-two million naira (N82,000,000)? Instead of speculating and jumping into conclusion we should ask the accuser to support his accusation with verifiable vouchers and receipts covering total expenditure of the dinner. Similarly, former Governor Amaechi should tell us how much he actually spent on the dinner. In the absence of rendered public account, we should stop discussing shadow and ghost cost of the said dinner.
S.Kadiri
Date: Sun, 10 Jan 2016 08:16:36 +0000
From: usaafric...@googlegroups.com
To: usaafric...@googlegroups.com
Is it not an exercise in futility to assume or speculate that Wole Soyinka knew, in advance, that the cost of the dinner to which he was invited would cost, according to MOA, 84 million Naira tab? Is it normal for any invitee to a dinner to ask how much the host is going to spend to host the dinner?Although Wole Soyinka was eighty at the time of the dinner, there was no indication that he was suffering from dementia. Thus, if Wole Soyinka's host had told him that he was being invited to come and gorge on nicely salted rogue dinner of N82 million, Soyinka would not have honoured the invitation, just as he refused to accept national honour award from President Jonathan in 2013 because Abacha was also awarded national honour posthumously and was to be received by his son, Mohammed Abacha, at the same occasion.
The cost of the dinner, according to the Rivers State Commissioner, was N82 million, but MOA has increased it to N84 million. If MOA consciously or unconsciously could increase the amount of money spent for the dinner with two million naira, how then can one be sure that Rivers State Commissioner has not with malicious intention increased the amount of money spent for the Wole Soyinka's dinner from, maybe, eight-thousand and two hundred naira (N8,200) or eighty-two thousand and two hundred naira (N82,000) to eighty-two million naira (N82,000,000)? Instead of speculating and jumping into conclusion we should ask the accuser to support his accusation with verifiable vouchers and receipts covering total expenditure of the dinner. Similarly, former Governor Amaechi should tell us how much he actually spent on the dinner. In the absence of rendered public account, we should stop discussing shadow and ghost cost of the said dinner.
S.Kadiri
Date: Sun, 10 Jan 2016 08:16:36 +0000
From: usaafric...@googlegroups.com
To: usaafric...@googlegroups.com
Kasim Alli
Jan 10, 2016, 4:33:31 PM1/10/16
to usaafric...@googlegroups.com
A more basic question is: Should any state funds (even one Naira) be used to fund a birthday party for anybody?
Kasim Alli.
Sent from my iPad
Sent from my iPad
--
Mobolaji Aluko
Jan 11, 2016, 8:26:18 AM1/11/16
to USAAfrica Dialogue
Kasim Alli:
Yes, a state function can be serendipitiously arranged to honor a worthy person to coincide with his birthday. The ONLY event, of course, will not be his BIRTHDAY - just a party, a cake, a birthday song, and bye-bye - but maybe an exhibition, a major speech both by celebrant and organizer, a symposium, etc. to benefit society.
I do not believe that governance even in the midst of our difficulties should be antiseptically ascetic. It just has to be done with modicum.
And certainly N82 million is off the top - but was it N82 million? Inquiring minds want to know.
And there you have it.
Bolaji Aluko
PS: Before I became VC, I was opposed to "Security Vote." As an executive in Nigeria, you find that you NEED security vote! :-) It just has to be modest - that is compared to all your other expenses - and NOT used merely to ENHANCE your salary. And you should be ready, willing and able to account for it upon request - not necessarily with receipts, but with honor - and not say "No...I don't have to account for it at all."
dijiaina
Jan 11, 2016, 8:26:18 AM1/11/16
to usaafric...@googlegroups.com
Dear Alli,
Yes, state fund can be used to celebrate icons and, or their birthdays. The value of such activities cannot be quantified, especially in moulding the mind of future generation. Cast your mind off Nigeria or Prof Soyinka and think of a birthday bash for President Nelson Mandela when he was alive.
Ayandiji
Segun Ogungbemi
Jan 11, 2016, 8:26:19 AM1/11/16
to usaafric...@googlegroups.com, usaafric...@googlegroups.com
Of course not Kasim. Bit if someone wants to honor you with a dinner on your birthday, do you ask him the source for the dinner?
It will be an insult to ask such a stupid question, Methinks.
It will be an insult to ask such a stupid question, Methinks.
Segun Ogungbemi
Sent from my iPhone
Sent from my iPhone
Salimonu Kadiri
Jan 11, 2016, 9:17:13 AM1/11/16
to usaafric...@googlegroups.com
Has any evidence been produced that the birthday dinner was financed by the government of the Rivers State or Chibuike Amaechi as a private person, even though he was the governor of the State? Should we rely on rumour that the birthday dinner was funded with state money?
Subject: Re: USA Africa Dialogue Series - Fwd: Wole Soyinka and the Rivers State Dinner Controversy: Soyinka and Amaechi's Response and Rejoinders to Those [Facebook Debates]
From: usaafric...@googlegroups.com
Date: Sun, 10 Jan 2016 15:57:59 -0500
To: usaafric...@googlegroups.com
Date: Sun, 10 Jan 2016 15:57:59 -0500
To: usaafric...@googlegroups.com
Moses Ebe Ochonu
Jan 11, 2016, 10:04:39 AM1/11/16
to USAAfricaDialogue
These are the kinds of discussions for which Ikhide's voice is needed. He would not stand for all the prevarication and specious justifications. Soyinka is not a foreign dignitary. He is a private citizen of Nigeria. If Amaechi used Rivers State funds to throw a lavish birthday party for him, it is wrong--as simple as that. It is corruption. The man is not even from Rivers, nor did he ever play a role in the public life of the state, so the argument cannot be made that "we are honoring or celebrating a former this or that of the state" or we are celebrating "one of our own." That's not even to talk of the obvious profligacy of spending a whopping 82 million on a birthday party, if true.
Mobolaji Aluko
Jan 11, 2016, 11:22:14 AM1/11/16
to USAAfrica Dialogue
Moses:
Please stop calling up Ikhide, who you have chided for excessive wailing: speak for yourself, plese.
Nobody is saying that N82 million should be spent on Soyinka's birthday....but knowing those who are making the claim, one can very much guess that it is most likely a specious allegation to smear Amaechi, and even Soyinka himself. How come that the government of the day has not been able to determine how much Soyinka was paid directly, and they want to ask Soyinka himself directly?
What stupidity is that?
But I state that a government can STAGE a cultural fiesta to DELIBERATELY coincide with an icon that it wants to celebrate, and I personally see no problem with that.
Bolaji Aluko
Moses Ebe Ochonu
Jan 11, 2016, 11:44:05 AM1/11/16
to USAAfricaDialogue
"But I state that a government can STAGE a cultural fiesta to DELIBERATELY coincide with an icon that it wants to celebrate, and I personally see no problem with that."
Bolaji,
But is that what the event was, a cultural fiesta? You seem to be clearing a lot of potential exculpatory space for Amaechi with the introduction of this cultural fiesta angle. And yes, both the accuser and the accused have to divulge how much and for what specific purpose the N82 million (or whatever the amount was) was spent on. It's not enough for Amaechi to simply deny spending 82 million on the birthday party. How much did he spend and on what items? Wike, too, has to disclose the specific expenditure items his government discovered in respect of the Soyinka event.
My problem with the trajectory and tenure of the discussion is the sly, cunning way some respondents were already exonerating Amaechi and discrediting Wike's allegation. Sure, politics is implicated in the allegation; I stated that in my first post on this subject. Wike wants to get at Amaechi and Soyinka is both collateral damage and the intellectual celebrity that will guarantee coverage. But how does that make the allegation itself false as some folks are already insinuating even in the absence of any credible defense on the part of Amaechi/Soyinka?
Finally, I think Ikhide's acerbic style, not my measured tone, is the appropriate rebuke to those (not you) who are shamelessly dismissing the allegation or exonerating Amaechi for purely predictable partisan reasons. There is a time and place for sharp rebuke, and I think this occasion calls for it.
Mobolaji Aluko
Jan 11, 2016, 12:21:41 PM1/11/16
to USAAfrica Dialogue
Moses:
Let us admit it: we are in a silly political season, in this "body language" environment of change. There are those who are supportive or oppositional to Wike, Amaechi or Soyinka, no matter what - and a lot of people in-between. So in this triangular environment, you will see all shades of reactions to these latest allegations - or this latest N82 allegation - which did not come out when Amaechi was first "extensively investigated" an indicted in the days leading up to his confirmation as Minister first being held up and later confirmed.
My own position is horror about the N82 million figure, but skeptical of it because of its source. If the allegation had come out saying that Soyinka was paid Y million, the musicians were paid X million, security was Z million, etc., then one would have seen exactly what items were EXCESSIVE in the N82 million. The accuser has the onus here, not necessarily the honoree Soyinka at all, or even Amaechi, who may simply say that the records are there already, and he is ready to accept or deny the figures stated.
You and I are NOT politicians, even if we are very much interested in politics, and I don't think we should jump up and down when one politician attacks another. But yes, you can expect people to SUPPORT those who they think they know their priors. You would hope that if you were accused of some heinous crime, many would come to your aid BEFORE they knew all the facts, EVEN if you later turned out to have done the crime, God forbid. No one should then be accused of shamelessly supporting you, when in fact you have not done anything prior to suggest you would do the crime.
And there you have it.
Bolaji Aluko
Bayo Amos
Jan 11, 2016, 12:38:08 PM1/11/16
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*****Former Rivers State information Commissioner, Mrs Ibim Semenitari has declared that for months, officials of the current administration in Rivers State were looking for “evidence” to justify their much-touted corruption allegation against the former administration of Hon. Chibuike Amaechi. And last week, they finally “found” one.
She said that at a lavish press conference in Port Harcourt, the Rivers State Commissioner of Information and Communications, Dr. Austin Tam-George, called on anti-corruption agencies to investigate the expenditure of N82 million made to host Nobel Laureate, Prof. Wole Soyinka, during his 80th birthday celebration.
In a statement signed by Beke Anyalewechi, Special Assistant, Media to the acting Managing Director of Niger Delta Development Commission (NDDC) she said “Unfortunately, and perhaps to show the sinister intent of the whole issue, to which the Peoples Democratic Party (PDP) has also shown undue excitement, references were made to Prof. Soyinka as a “friend of Amaechi”, without putting in context what necessitated the honour for the Nobel Laureate by the then Rivers State Government”.
It stated that “while the whole claim is nothing but bare-faced lies deliberately hatched to smear the literary scholar as well as the acting MD of NDDC, it is a shame that officials of government would indulge in this kind of gimmicky just to settle petty scores.
“We feel particularly sorry that Tam-George, barely a week in office, has manifested such gross incompetence in the procedures of his office as spokesman of government.”
The statement further explained that the background to the decision of the then Rivers State Government to honour Prof. Soyinka, his family and friends, had a link to the great literary feat the then Administration of Hon. Amaechi achieved in securing Port Harcourt as the UNESCO World Book Capital City 2014. The feat, which put not only Rivers State but indeed Nigeria on the global map, had not happened before and one of the people who assisted in that regard was Prof. Soyinka, a cerebral literary icon, an authority in global literature and The Arts generally.
She wondered how the total amount of N82 million could be spent on the dinner alone, as Tam-George, PDP and their cohort would want the world go to bed with.
Semenitari said it was not true that N82 million was spent on dinner alone and challenged him to release the entire documents as contained in “Mrs. Ibim Semenitari’s Memo REF: MOI/COM/C./82/Vol. III/227 to cover Dance Drama by University of Port Harcourt Arts Village; Great Singha & His Highlife Band; Set Design, Stage Lighting & Costume Design; Costume Design & Stage Property; Dinner; Transportation and Accommodation of guests from outside the country and those outside Rivers State; Decoration; Travels & Logistics, etc.”
According to the former Commissioner “Indeed, nothing can be more callous than the imputation that the dinner was because Prof. Soyinka “is a friend of Amaechi”. Having turned down several other overtures for an open honour to his enormous contributions to the growth of the literary industry in Rivers State, it was a decision of the State Executive Council to celebrate a man who had been a strong DNA in the birth of Garden City Literary Festival (later Port Harcourt Literary Festival) which catapulted the state to a global player in The Arts.”
“Rather than face his urgent job as Information Commissioner to see whether he can help reposition an administration that is fast losing credibility in the eyes of civilized people in Rivers State, Tam-George would rather prefer to smear the exalted reputation of Prof. Soyinka, a man whose shoes’ lace he would be unable to untie all his life.”
The statement further said “We can forgive Tam-George’s attempts to smear the reputation and hard-work of Semenitari, who meritoriously served Rivers State for six years, since he must be suffering from a serious complex. But to drag the name of Prof. Soyinka into their coven of inferiority is beyond the pale.
“We, therefore, state unequivocally that if the media invitation to anti-crime agencies to probe Semenitari was on the expenditure of the N82 million, her doors are open any day, any time to welcome them.” the statement said.*****
Source:
Thanks,
Bayo.
Moses Ebe Ochonu
Jan 11, 2016, 12:52:16 PM1/11/16
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Bolaji:
I agreed with you until you wrote this:
"You would hope that if you were accused of some heinous crime, many would come to your aid BEFORE they knew all the facts, EVEN if you later turned out to have done the crime, God forbid. No one should then be accused of shamelessly supporting you, when in fact you have not done anything prior to suggest you would do the crime."
Am I right to read you as saying that if one is accused of corruption, people who knows one's prior conducts are right to defend the accused even "BEFORE they knew all the facts"? I disagree with this. What I would hope is that people who know or think they know my prior would withhold judgment either way until all the facts are out--until they know all the facts. Obviously I wouldn't want them or anyone for that matter to start pronouncing me guilty on the strength of a mere allegation, but I would also not want them to pronounce me innocent until they know the facts. Prior conduct and character can be a guide to present or future conduct, but people do change either because of personal evolution or environmental influences, or both. In fact your approach and mine, if I do say so myself, is the right one, which is to withhold judgment and ask both parties to divulge information they possess in regard to the allegation and for the accuser to provide specifics to back up the accusation.
Even if the accused is my friend and APPEARS innocent, I would not go public with a defense or exoneration until I knew all the facts.
Anyway sha, for me it is a good thing when politicians accuse each other of corruption or fight about such accusations. In most cases, it is the only opportunity for regular citizens like me to know the malfeasance that happen in the corridors of power, to know what the high and mighty do behind closed doors with our common patrimony. Without conflict among politicians, they usually keep these things secret, and adhere to the informal Mutually Assured Destruction (MAD) pact of silence and secrecy. This is why I welcome and get agitated about roforofo among politicians, especially when it has to do with allegations and counter-allegations of corruption.
Salimonu Kadiri
Jan 11, 2016, 1:46:44 PM1/11/16
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Had Wole Soyinka been a foreign dignitary, according to Moses Ochonu, Amaechi would have been justified if he used Rivers State funds to throw a lavish birthday party for him. Since, according to Moses Ochonu, Wole Soyinka is a private citizen of Nigeria, it is corruption "if Amaechi used Rivers State funds to throw a lavish birthday party for him." The man (Wole Soyinka) is not even from Rivers, nor did he ever play a role in the public life of the state - writes Moses Ochonu. Thus, had paternal and genealogical origin of Wole Soyinka been Rivers State and had he played a role in the public life of the state, Moses Ochonu would not have had any objection against the alleged N82 million birthday party for Soyinka by Amaechi. Like all human beings, Wole Soyinka did not choose his parents and as such which part of the world or of Nigeria he should have been born in order to be entitled to the alleged N82 million naira birthday party from Rivers State Government as desired by Moses Ochonu.
In the expression, "If Amaechi used Rivers State funds to throw a lavish birthday party for him (Soyinka), it is wrong - as simple as that. It is corruption;" Moses Ochonu confessed his uncertainty about Amaechi making use of Rivers State funds for the alleged N 82 million birthday dinner. And in his last sentence Moses Ochonu declared, "That's not even to talk of the obvious profligacy of spending a whopping 82 million on a birthday party, if true." Again Moses Ochonu does know IF IT IS TRUE that N82 million had been expended on a birthday party, yet he is lamenting over the absence of a verbal acrobat in this discussion as if his presence would have converted the manufactured figure to be true. Can't we learn to differentiate between brain and brawl? The burden of proof is on the accuser who should show us how he arrived at the total expenditure of N82 million for Soyinka's birth day dinner and until that is done I refuse to buy their hawked malicious propaganda.
S. Kadiri
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2016 08:35:38 -0600
Subject: Re: USA Africa Dialogue Series - Fwd: Wole Soyinka and the Rivers State Dinner Controversy: Soyinka and Amaechi's Response and Rejoinders to Those [Facebook Debates]
Cornelius Hamelberg
Jan 11, 2016, 6:56:16 PM1/11/16
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When certain discussions get a little too intense, comic relief and a little laughter is often the best medicine with which to calm things down a little…
Well, I did mention this to Ogbeni Kadiri, on the phone to him this afternoon, when we discussed this matter a little further – but this is just another slight aside:
Always at hand for some of the Big Grammar People, from Old Bill’s/ Mark Antony’s funeral oration is the option that “The evil that men do lives after them; The good is oft interrèd with their bones. So let it be with Caesar”. And then there’s the usual argument (the ethic of language propriety) often invoked by the morally pure, when any cherished interest of theirs is about to be challenged… more big grammar: De mortuis nil nisi bonum : “You should not speak evil of the dead” - in fulfilment of which maxim I once read the following sequence of cold facts followed by an opinion – it was an Israeli hard-line, right-winger :”Arafat is dead. Good!”
Coming to the point, as was reported in the Nigerian media, Melford Okilo, the then Governor of Rivers State spent eighty million Naira as funeral expenses, for the burial of his mother. This was in the good old days when the official rate of exchange was £1 Sterling to the Nigerian Naira - and what I most remember was Chief Okilo remonstrating and railing at those who looked askance at such exorbitant expenditures on behalf of he himself and his mother, at which his exact words were:
“So, you don’t want me to honour my mother?”
And who – which of them had the liver ( or as the Krio people say in Sierra Leone, “ the liber”) to put it to him straight, that honouring mother can be as expensive as he likes but such expenses do not have to be at the expense of or footed by the peoples’ revenue lodged at the Rivers State oil treasury.
An aside within an aside: There’s much to learn from Bereshit 23 // Genesis 23 ( with reference to Genesis 23: 16 : “As the Talmud ( Bava Metzia 87a) explains each shekel that Abraham used to pay for the plot was worth 2,500 ordinary shekels( Rashi). Thus Abraham paid a total of one million ordinary shekels for the cave). This illustrates Abraham’s love for Sarah. He chose the finest burial site for her and did not haggle over the price. As the Midrash states, this is one of the three places where Scripture attests to the Jews’ uncontactable possession of the Holy Land. For the Cave of Machpelah, the site of the Temple and the Tomb of Joseph were all purchased without bargaining and paid for with unquestionable legal tender.” (The Stone edition Chumash, note on Page 109)
(So the story goes, the rumour circulating was that Muammar Gaddafi’s mother was a Jew. To put all speculation to rest he assembled his most honourable citizens to a face-to-face meeting at which he said “I hear that some people have been saying that my mother is a Jew. This is the opportunity for anyone who thinks that this is true to put his hand up and be counted!” Apparently it was not long after that meeting that he insisted that the Jews should have no rest and saw to it that the main highway that he was going to build, should cut right through the middle of the Jewish cemetery in Tripoli…
About funeral expenses, it was not so long ago, whilst we were discussing a funeral expense that my younger brother Ola told me, “Corn, if you want, I’ll give you a million dollar funeral!” – which got me feeling a little depressed –and of what use is a million dollars to me in heaven? Of course I would much prefer the million dollars here-now and not post-mortem.
The moral of this story is that we should celebrate the living.
So, what is a little $400,000 dinner for our Nobel Laureate and peace activist Baba Wole Soyinka?
Only asking Ogbeni Kadiri
Cornelius
Cornelius Hamelberg
Jan 11, 2016, 8:17:19 PM1/11/16
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PS. Erratum.
I erroneously wrote “uncontactable possession”
Correction: Should read: “this is one of the three places where Scripture attests to the Jews' incontestable possession of the Holy Land.”
ibdu...@gmail.com
Jan 12, 2016, 8:40:51 AM1/12/16
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Cornelius:
Wonder why you support and justify Zionist claims but opposed Apartheid.
Ib
---
Sent from my iPhone
Cornelius Hamelberg
Jan 12, 2016, 11:54:28 AM1/12/16
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I’m sure that what we want is a just solution to the problems facing all of us in post-Apartheid South Africa and not least of all in Syria, Iraq, Libya, Yemen, the growing sectarian divisions in the Shia dominated oil rich East in the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia, not to mention the Palestinian refugees scattered throughout the Arab world and beyond.
If you want to be religious about it, as you know, today, among the great grandchildren of Aba Abraham through his son Ishmael there are twenty two Arab States but not the one Israel of his son Isaac and his grandson Jacob and the tribes…
As I understand it, Zionism means the right of the Jewish people to their homeland
As clear as daylight too, I would add the right of the Igbo people to their homeland.
Do we have to labour through another discussion that wants to delegitimize Israel?
The Oslo accord is dead and it looks like the prospect of a two-state solution is rapidly fading.
We are about to discuss the al-Ghaib so I am listening to you, very attentively
Yours sincerely,
Cornelius
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Salimonu Kadiri
Jan 12, 2016, 2:50:02 PM1/12/16
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What a distraction!!! I cannot see any connection between the alleged N82 million dinner for Wole Soyinka hosted by Rivers State government in Nigeria under Amaechi and Zionism woven into the right of Igbo people to their homeland. Has Igbo people ever been denied the right to their homeland in Nigeria?
S. Kadiri
S. Kadiri
Salimonu Kadiri
Jan 12, 2016, 2:50:02 PM1/12/16
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Jesus must have had the African intellectual Pharisees in mind when he spoke of people seeing and not perceiving and hearing but not understanding according to Mathew Chapter 13. When peddlers of malicious propaganda cabled out the news that Rivers State government expended the sum of $410,000 to celebrate the birthday of Wole Soyinka and some of us doubted it, we are immediately clothed in the toga of defender of Wole Soyinka's profligacy and corruption by intellectual Pharisees. Thanks to the link posted by Bayo Amos, we now know that it was not only a dinner that was organised to commemorate the 80th birthday of Soyinka by the Rivers State government. In his post of 10 January 2016, Bolaji Aluko expressed his desire for accountability on the alleged N82 million dinner for Soyinka. Suspecting that if the sum of N82 million was ever expended for the said birth day honour, it could not have been on food and drinks alone, he accompanied his post with a 17 point program of implementation which should be accounted for item by item. That is the way intelligent people work and I associate myself with his reasoning in this regard on accountability.
The former Commissioner of Information in Rivers State, Mrs. Ibim Semenitari, has now denied that N82 million was spent on dinner alone as bandied by the current Commissioner of Information and Communication, Dr. Austin Tam-George. She challenged Dr. Tam-George to publish her Official Memo REF: MOI/COM/C./82/Vol. III/227 which is in his possession and which was to cover Dance Drama by University of Port Harcourt Arts Village; Great Singha & His Highlife Band; Set Design; Stage Lighting & Costume Design; Costume & Stage Property; Dinner; Transportation & Accommodation of Guests from outside the Country and those outside Rivers State; Decoration; Travels & Logistics, etc. That it was not a dinner as such, Mrs. Ibim Semenitari explained, "The decision of the then Rivers State Government to honour Professor Soyinka, his family, and friends, had a link to the great literary feat the then Administration of Hon. Amaechi achieved in securing Port Harcourt as the UNESCO World Book Capital City 2014. The feat, which put not only Rivers State but indeed Nigeria on the global map, had not happened before and one of the people who assisted in that regard was Prof. Soyinka ......." She continued, "Having turned down several other overtures for an open honour to his enormous contributions to the growth of literary industry in Rivers State, it was the decision of the State Executive Council to celebrate a man who had been a strong DNA in the birth of Garden City Literary Festival (later Port Harcourt Literary Festival) which catapulted the state to a global player in The Arts." From the above quoted part of Mrs. Semenitari's statements, Wole Soyinka would appear to be qualified for the N82 million birthday dinner in accordance with the postulation of Moses Ochonu that he ought to have played a role in the public life of River State. However, it is now certain that dinner was just a minor cost in the program and that the whole congregation could not have eaten and drunk for $401,000. The problem here is just that intellectual Pharisees are like crabs by nature, no matter what we do and no matter how we try, we can never make them walk straight, especially with there Pull Him Down (PhD) mentality.
S. Kadiri
Mobolaji Aluko
Jan 12, 2016, 3:22:58 PM1/12/16
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Salimonu Kadiri:
I fully endorse what you wrote below, even if it did not include the paragraph that had a name familiar to me in it! :-)
We are in a silly political season, and we "public intellectuals" are part of it, with academic gowns and caps of all colors and sizes.
And there you have it.
Bolaji Aluko
Shaking his head
Cornelius Hamelberg
Jan 12, 2016, 5:05:02 PM1/12/16
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I’m sorry. Ib’s post should have been the beginning of a new thread.
As you can see, I was merely answering a question that was addressed to me based on the assumption that I “support and justify Zionist claims but opposed Apartheid.”
(I could say that it’s 400 million Arabs - not to mention the other several million more brethren-in-the-faith and brothers-in-arms etc. that are oppressing the Jews of Palestine and that’s why Israel has not known a day of peace since 14 May 1948. But that is the sort of discussion that should be destined for a separate thread.)
If Ib’s tiny interjection is a distraction that ought to not rightfully belong to the subject heading of this thread you are at liberty to ignore or elegantly, even disdainfully side-step it if you so choose. Since you are perennially obsessed, I would say pathologically obsessed with the Igbo, you must understand that it’s possible that you are not alone in this. In an attempt to connect to the main theme of the thread I sneaked in the Igbo aspect of self-determination - which in some aspects is comparable to Israel’s (I can see that clearly) and you now ask whether the Igbo people have “ever been denied the right to their homeland in Nigeria”. My dear Ogbeni Kadiri, that’s precisely the Biafra question - the Biafrans maybe don’t want “a homeland in Nigeria” – they already have that – to a great extent and we are to suppose that they would much prefer their homeland to be an independent country OUTSIDE of what you call Nigeria.
I suppose that Israel too does not necessarily want to belong to the Arab League or to the Caliphate of Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi or any other caliphate for that matter.
The crowned King of Africa once tauntingly invited Israel to join the Arab League. I suggest that it wold have only been a matter of time before he could have been extending an invitation to his subjects South of the Sahara to join the aforementioned League or another League with another name but with very similar aspirations. My intuition is that an independent Biafra would not like to join either the Arab League or the OIC of which Nigeria is currently a member.
So you see the difference between a homeland in Nigeria and an Independent Biafra (or Igbo country of another name)
You must also understand, if you want, that that you cannot take away someone else’s freedom to think along his/ her own chosen trajectories. This means that I may/ can/ will if I so choose, reasonably talk about the Igbo people’s right to their home turf in the same breath that I talk about South African or any other freedom fighters. I don’t know to what extent you are familiar with Black Zionism as espoused by Marcus Garvey that Africans have a right to Africa but people from Freetown are generally aware of such matters…
Yours truly,
Menahem…
</blockquote
Salimonu Kadiri
Jan 14, 2016, 2:10:01 PM1/14/16
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Cornelius!!
You are at liberty to answer any question posed to you if you consider it relevant to the subject matter. But the distractive statement and not a question from IB to you was responded to distractively when it could wisely have said that you support and justify Zionist claim but opposed Apartheid because they are not the same. Instead you began to sing like a doped canary, "In an attempt to connect to the main theme of the thread, I sneaked in the Igbo aspect of self-determination - which in some aspects is comparable to Israel's ..."
You are at liberty to answer any question posed to you if you consider it relevant to the subject matter. But the distractive statement and not a question from IB to you was responded to distractively when it could wisely have said that you support and justify Zionist claim but opposed Apartheid because they are not the same. Instead you began to sing like a doped canary, "In an attempt to connect to the main theme of the thread, I sneaked in the Igbo aspect of self-determination - which in some aspects is comparable to Israel's ..."
Why did you have to sneak in the Igbo aspect of self-determination in a N82 million dinner story? Are you not being ahistorical to compare your presumed Igbo self-determination with that of Israeli's? The emergence of Israel as the homeland of the Jews in 1948 was as a consequence of what happened to the Jews in Europe during the World War II. Perhaps it is very comfortable now for you to forget that neither Europe nor America loved the Jews in those days as they now pretend to do because of political convenience and advantages. William Shakespeare (should I remind you?), was not a German and Hitler was not even born in 1596, when he wrote the Merchant of Venice in which Shylock, the Jewish money lender was prepared to cut a pound of flesh from a fellow human being in default of payment. Reading about Shylock in the British Colonised Nigeria, I had very bad impression of the Jews without even knowing how a Jew looked like. Did Winston Churchill not assert that the Bolshevik revolution was perpetrated by the Jews? Have we not read Henry Ford's Book, The International Jew, published in the last century? Today, US is the greatest ally of Israel but it was not so in 1956 when the combined forces of Britain, France and Israel invaded Suez Canal that Egypt's Nasser had nationalized. Nasser turned to the then Soviet Union under the leadership of Nikita Khrushchev for military help. The intervention of USSR led to the military retreat of France, Israel and Britain from Suez Canal, followed by the resignation of Anthony Eden as British Prime Minister. Thenceforth, Britain, France, and Israel, in particular, learned that their foreign military adventure could not be carried out except under US military umbrella.
Anthropologically, the Jews migrated from their ancestral home in the Middle-east and were scattered throughout Europe before their persecution reached the stage it was in the World War II, and compelled them to return to their original homeland. Therefore, no sane person will ever equate the condition of Jews in pre-World War II Europe to that of Igbo in Nigeria. The Jews, never declared any part of Europe, and Germany in particular, as a Jewish republic; the Jews did not have any standing Army of their own to fight against any European country and they did not have a military leader in Europe like Ojukwu who on the 27th of May 1967 declared that no military power in Africa could subdue the Igbo Army. Can you state specifically which Jewish situations in pre-World War II are comparable to Igbo situations in Nigeria?
Putting salt on the injury, you wrote, ".... the Biafrans may be don't want 'a homeland in Nigeria' - they already have that - to a great extent and we (who are we?) are to suppose that they would much prefer their homeland to be an independent country outside of what you call Nigeria." If the Jews do not want to be incorporated into an Arab country, it makes sense because the Jews speak Hebrew and would like to conduct their affairs in Hebrew and not in Arabic language. In Nigeria the official language is English and the Igbo demand for Biafra is not induced by the desire to conduct their national affairs in Igbo language. That is even more obvious when it is realised that they include non-Igbo speaking ethnic groups in their Biafran nation. In November 2015, the Movement for the Actualisation of Sovereign State of Biafra (MASSOB) directed all Igbo in other parts of Nigeria to return to Igbo homeland but that directive is yet to be complied it by the Igbos. (www.vanguardngr.com/2015/11/return-to-the-southeast-massob-tells-igbo/). Tacitly referring to me you asserted that they (the Igbo) would much prefer their homeland to be an independent country outside what you call Nigeria. Nigeria existed before I was born and you cannot belittle her by suggesting that I gave the country the name. Perhaps you have forgotten that it was the same country you call Nigeria that sent soldiers to broker peace among warring Sierra Leoneans. I remember that in one of your altercations with Ogugua Anunoby, he labelled you as being obsessed with the Igbo since he observed that you always introduce Igbo into any exchange with him without cause. Misapplying Anunoby's observation about you on me, you now say I am pathologically obsessed with the Igbo. Saro man, you are pouring water on the back of a duck, it is a waste of your time and effort because the water won't stay there.
I should not have responded to your post if not for my observation that it is now becoming a trend in this forum to distract and digress from the main theme of discussion. A typical example was Anthony Chidi Opara's post of 6th January 2016, announcing the impending meeting of Ndi Igbo in Diaspora in Houston, Texas and in which the fate of the Igbo in Nigeria would be deliberated upon. What necessitated the meeting was outlined in the message. Instead of discussing the contents of the message in Chidi Opara's post, discussions degenerated into the origin of the name, Benin, Farooq Kperogi correctly pointed out that neither Bini nor Benin is indigenous to the Edo people and that Benin is indisputably a Portuguese domestication; remarks that the name of Benin was being imposed by the traditional elites was frowned upon by the moderator as not being respectful to the dictum of the archaic institution; and as if it is a custom for a child to choose his /her name, Uyiala Usuanlele remarked that Farooq is Arabic derived name and not Borgu. In the Nigerian context, the name Farooq is Muslim and it is identified with the Islamic religion just as Solomon, the first name of the current Oba of Benin before he ascended the throne and acquired new names, is a Christian name identified with Christianity. Angered by Uyiala Usuanlele personal attack, Farooq wrote, "This is my last post on this issue and on this forum." This is what happens with unnecessary distraction in discussions. Main reasons given by the Ndi Igbo in Diaspora for summoning their Houston's meeting are, Ndi Igbo have suffered genocide, pogrom, civil war, and continuous persecution in Nigeria. For decades we (the Ndi Igbo) have been exploited economically, dominated politically, segregated against, and humiliated spiritually. These are what the forum's discussions should have been about instead of the unnecessary digressions and distractions of Bini, Benin, Ibinu, Ubini etc.
Finally I expect non-wayward mind to agree with me that there is no logical association between the alleged N82 million Rivers State dinner for Wole Soyinka and Igbo Biafra cum Jewish Israel.
S.Kadiri
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 2016 14:00:14 -0800
Cornelius Hamelberg
Jan 14, 2016, 9:47:02 PM1/14/16
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Ogbeni Kadiri :
Am I answering a query from you? Am I obliged to answer a query from you?
I answered a question put to me by a very intelligent man Ibrahim Abdullah. You are not him.
I answered a question entirely unconnected with anything else preceding it in this or any other USA –Africa dialogue series thread. As I told you when you butted in, “Ogbeni Kadiri,
I’m sorry. Ib’s post should have been the beginning of a new thread.
As you can see, I was merely answering a question that was addressed to me based on the assumption that I “support and justify Zionist claims but opposed Apartheid.”
And yes, I am aware that Biafra is a very different piece of cake from the Holy Land that David Ben-Gurion is a different piece of cheese from your man Ojukwu. If I wanted to tear all that you have just said to bits I could do so. But that would be destructive on my part and you know that Beatles song that goes
“But when you talk about destruction
Don't you know that you can count me out?”
Indeed, “a little learning is a dangerous thing”. I did not wisely or unwisely wish to say that I “support and justify Zionist claim but opposed Apartheid because they are not the same" - these are not my thoughts. I don't even know what Ibrahim means by " Zionist claims" – he would have to define and even enumerate them for me to accept or reject them - and I should like to add, in case you don't know it, or are not aware of it, that you are not yet qualified to educate me on the history of the Jews, on the Second World War, on the Holocaust, on the History of Israel or the history of Palestine ( from Palestinian Muslim / Christian point of view) or indeed on the history of Islam in the heartland of Islam or on the very minute differences in belief and practice between the Sunni and the Shia- but you are at liberty to lecture me on the theories of Sufism and I will listen attentively to your views, but it would be far better for me, if you saved your breath.
It’s now 3.43 a.m. and I’m going to read my favourite book
Will maybe, kindly respond to what you have said, later.
Salimonu Kadiri
Jan 15, 2016, 9:31:07 AM1/15/16
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To be frank Cornelius, Ibrahim Abdullah was not asking you any question. He was actually wondering!!
S. Kadiri
Date: Thu, 14 Jan 2016 18:03:09 -0800
S. Kadiri
Date: Thu, 14 Jan 2016 18:03:09 -0800
Cornelius Hamelberg
Jan 15, 2016, 9:47:48 AM1/15/16
to USA Africa Dialogue Series
"In an attempt to connect to the main theme of the thread, I sneaked in the Igbo aspect of self-determination - which in some aspects is comparable to Israel's ..." because I think it is relevant comparison in the context of this Naija-dominated forum in which discussions and debates about Biafra have been a constant feature - and of course because I am obsessed with the Igbo people – and it is a positive obsession rooted in love, not hate.
How pedantic can you be! So, Oga Ibrahim Abdullah was "only wondering" and to his "wondering" you have provided your own lengthy answer by way of a critique of my own personal response to his wondering. I’ll tell you this: I went to Nigeria because of Apartheid South Africa.
I also humbly beg your pardon for having offended you Sir. I know that Nigeria existed before you were born. I know that unlike Jesus of Nazareth you have not been going around beating your chest and saying, “Before Abraham was, I am”. Proud Yoruba man, I was not trying to in any way “belittle “ your motherland (the most populous country in Africa, economic powerhouse of the continent etc.) “by suggesting that (you) gave the country the name Nigeria “ - ai beg - and a smally nation like little Sierra Leone is eternally grateful for the ECOMORG under Nigerian command for helping to put a stop to the RUF High Command. (You are of course aware of the origin and history of the name “Sierra Leone”?)
Of course, the names Salimonu and Kadiri also have their unique etymologies/ genealogies.
As your old friend wrote (published 1597): “What's in a name? That which we call a rose, by any other name would smell as sweet…”
Finally, for the sake of making you happy, let this wayward mind agree with you that under the heavens, “there is no logical association between the alleged N82 million Rivers State dinner for Wole Soyinka and Igbo Biafra cum Jewish Israel.” And to that you can piously add the good Arabic that you learned at the Quran School: “Amin”
From now on I'm going to be very sharp with you.
Wa Salaam
Cornelius
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