MALI HAS JUST DEFINITIVELY PUT AN END TO ITS DEPENDENCE ON FRANCE

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Toyin Falola

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Aug 4, 2023, 1:20:56 PM8/4/23
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MALI HAS JUST DEFINITIVELY PUT AN END TO ITS DEPENDENCE ON FRANCE

BY CANCELING THE 11 COLONIAL AGREEMENTS IMPOSED ON AFRICAN COUNTRIES SINCE 1960.


BREAKING OF THE COLONIAL AGREEMENTS WITH FRANCE. I INVITE YOU TO UNDERSTAND THE MALIAN CASE AGAINST IMPERIALIST FRANCE🇫🇷


After independence, 14 French-speaking countries signed 11 agreements with France which are as follows :


AGREEMENT n⁰1:


THE COLONIAL DEBT TO REPAY THE BENEFITS OF COLONIZATION.


That is to say that the newly independent states must reimburse the cost of the infrastructures built by France during the colonization.

We are always looking for the details of the costs, the evaluation of the benefits and the payment conditions imposed by France on African countries.


AGREEMENT N⁰ 2 :


THE AUTOMATIC CONFISCATION OF NATIONAL FINANCIAL RESERVES.


That is to say that African countries must deposit their financial reserves with the Banque de France. Thus, France has been "guarding" the financial reserves of fourteen African countries since 1961: Benin, Burkina Faso, Guinea Bissau, Ivory Coast, Mali, Niger, Senegal, Togo, Cameroon, the Central African Republic, Chad, Congo-Brazzaville, Equatorial Guinea and Gabon.


Thus, the governance of monetary policies remains asynchronous and incomplete due to the fact that it is managed directly by the French government, without any link with the financial authorities of countries such as ECOWAS or CEMAC.


Thus, due to the conditions that bind the banks of the 14 countries of the CFA economic and financial zones, they are obliged to keep 65% of their foreign exchange reserves in an operations account maintained by the French Treasury, as well as an additional 20% in order to cover "financial risks".


In addition, the banks of the CFA zones impose a credit limit on each member country, equivalent to 20% of state revenues in the current budget year, although the BEAC or the BCEAO have higher withdrawal possibilities from the French Treasury. These withdrawals must first be the subject of the agreement of the French Treasury.

The final decision therefore rests with the French Treasury, which has itself invested the reserves of African countries on the Paris stock exchange.


In other words, 85% of African financial reserves are deposited in an operation account controlled by the French administration.


The two banks in the CFA zone are African by their names, but do not decide any of the monetary policies by themselves.

The worst thing is that the countries themselves do not even know how much of their financial reserves are due to them.


AGREEMENT n⁰3 :


THE RIGHT OF FIRST REFUSAL ON ANY RAW OR NATURAL RESOURCE DISCOVERED IN THE COUNTRY.


That is to say that France has the first right to purchase the natural resources of the land of its former colonies. It is only after France has said: "I am not interested", that African countries are allowed to look for other partners.


AGREEMENT n⁰4 :


PRIORITY TO FRENCH INTERESTS AND COMPANIES IN PUBLIC PROCUREMENT AND PUBLIC TENDERS.


In the awarding of public contracts, French companies have priority over tenders. Even if African countries can get better value for money elsewhere.


As a result, in most of the former French colonies, all the economic levers of the countries are in the hands of French expatriates. In Côte d'Ivoire, for example, French companies own and control all major public services including water, electricity, telephone, air transport, ports and major banks. It is the same in trade, construction and agriculture.


AGREEMENT n⁰5 :


EXCLUSIVE RIGHT TO PROVIDE MILITARY EQUIPMENT AND TRAIN MILITARY OFFICERS OF THE COLONIES.


Thanks to a sophisticated system of scholarships, grants, and the "defense agreements" attached to the colonial pact, Africans must send their senior officers for training in France and are obliged to provide themselves with military equipment with France.


AGREEMENT n⁰6 :


THE RIGHT FOR FRANCE TO DEPLOY TROOPS AND INTERVENE MILITARILY IN THE COUNTRY TO DEFEND ITS INTERESTS.


Under the so-called "defense agreements" attached to the colonial pact, France has the right to intervene militarily in African countries, and also to permanently station troops in military bases and installations, entirely managed by the French.


AGREEMENT n⁰7 :


THE OBLIGATION TO MAKE FRENCH THE OFFICIAL LANGUAGE OF THE COUNTRY AND THE LANGUAGE FOR EDUCATION.


An organization for the French language and the dissemination of French culture has even been created. It is called the "Francophonie" and has several satellite organizations. These organizations are affiliated to and controlled by the French Minister of Foreign Affairs.


AGREEMENT n⁰8 :


THE OBLIGATION TO USE THE CFA FRANC (FRANC OF THE FRENCH COLONIES IN AFRICA).*


Although this system is not shared by the European Union, the French colonies are forced to use the FCFA exclusively.


AGREEMENT n⁰9 :


THE OBLIGATION TO SEND TO FRANCE, AN ANNUAL BALANCE SHEET AND A REPORT ON THE STATE OF RESERVES. NO REPORT, NO MONEY.


That is to say that the director of the central banks of the former colonies presents the said report at the annual meetings of the Ministers of Finance on the former colonies. This report is then compiled by the Banque de France and the French Treasury.


AGREEMENT n⁰10 :


RENOUNCE ANY MILITARY ALLIANCE WITH OTHER COUNTRIES, UNLESS AUTHORIZED BY FRANCE.


Most of these countries only have military alliances with their ex-colonizers simply because France forbade them any other military alliance.


AGREEMENT n⁰11 :


THE OBLIGATION TO ALLY WITH FRANCE IN THE EVENT OF WAR OR A GLOBAL CRISIS.


More than a million African soldiers fought for the defeat of Nazism and fascism during the Second World War. Now that France is militarily linked to the European Union, NATO and the United States, Africa will de facto be committed to the side of France in the event of the 3rd World War.


Dear fellow Africans, eleven (11) agreements are still in force between France and the 14 countries of the CFA zone, and no French media or their so-called African specialists will ever talk about these sinister agreements that have been imposed on the African countries of the CFA zone.


Dear compatriots, that is why we do not stop denouncing this colonization which has now been practiced since 1960, by interposed persons, that is to say by leaders of their choices whom they support and whom they protect by imposing dictatorship on them in front of their own peoples.


What interests us today among these eleven agreements is the tenth (n⁰ 10) which says that the 14 countries of the CFA zone through the agreement, are not authorized to have a military alliance with other countries and are also not authorized to buy military equipment in another European country without the authorization of France,

that is why Mali has been blocked until today. But the situation has been unblocked, Mali can now freely cooperate with all the countries of the planet without asking France for permission.


DEAR COMPATRIOTS, IN VIEW OF ALL THESE MORAL, PHYSICAL AND PSYCHOLOGICAL SCAMS, THE NEW AFRICAN GENERATION MUST DO ITS PART TO RESTORE THE NATIONAL ACHIEVEMENTS OF OUR CONTINENT IN ORDER TO LEAVE A WORTHY LEGACY TO FUTURE GENERATIONS.


GRAH KOSSI-KOSSI.


Geopolitical Strategy


MAXIMUM SHARING PLEASE.


🇩🇿🇧🇯 🇧🇫 🇧🇮 🇨🇲 🇰🇲 🇨🇮 🇩🇯 🇬🇦 🇬🇳 🇬🇶 🇲🇬 🇲🇱

🇳🇪 🇨🇫 🇨🇩 🇨🇬 🇸🇳 🇸🇨 🇹🇩 🇹🇬 🇷🇼 🇲🇦 🇲🇷 🇹🇳



Harrow, Kenneth

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Aug 4, 2023, 2:24:40 PM8/4/23
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this does not seem credible to me.
ken

kenneth harrow

professor emeritus

dept of english

michigan state university

517 803-8839

har...@msu.edu

From: usaafric...@googlegroups.com <usaafric...@googlegroups.com> on behalf of Toyin Falola <toyin...@austin.utexas.edu>
Sent: Friday, August 4, 2023 12:49 PM
To: dialogue <USAAfric...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: USA Africa Dialogue Series - MALI HAS JUST DEFINITIVELY PUT AN END TO ITS DEPENDENCE ON FRANCE
 
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Victor Okafor

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Aug 4, 2023, 3:14:44 PM8/4/23
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Friends:
Given the terms of the 11 obnoxious agreements, the screaming headline, "MALI HAS JUST DEFINITIVELY PUT AN END TO ITS DEPENDENCE ON FRANCE" is an oxymoron of sorts. I beg to advance the following substitute: "MALI HAS JUST DEFINITIVELY PUT AN END TO ITS SERVITUDE RELATIONSHIP WITH FRANCE." For, under the 11 agreements, it is France (the neocolonial master) that depends upon its African neo-colonies for her own economic benefits at the expense of those African societies like a blood-sucking leech. The arrogant, condescending and paternalistic nature of the stipulations of these 11 agreements is mind-boggling! 

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--
Sincerely,

Victor O. Okafor, Ph.D.
Professor and Head
Department of Africology and African American Studies
Eastern Michigan University
Food for Thought: 
"The limits of tyrants are prescribed by the endurance of those whom they oppress." -- Frederick Douglass


Oluwatoyin Adepoju

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Aug 4, 2023, 5:13:16 PM8/4/23
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How did the African countries agree to such horrible terms in the first place?

Toyin 

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/usaafricadialogue/CAO3oEcxhkZ5aaaKw0YX%2BOC_Od%2BVySS%3Dw7VGSJ1Q7dN2%3DchBqiA%40mail.gmail.com.

Harrow, Kenneth

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Aug 5, 2023, 1:13:57 AM8/5/23
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Toyin, without seeing a really credible source, this reads like trolling. There were obviously dependency conditions, but these points appear wacky to me.
Ken
From: usaafric...@googlegroups.com <usaafric...@googlegroups.com> on behalf of Oluwatoyin Adepoju <ovde...@gmail.com>
Sent: Friday, August 4, 2023 4:30:13 PM
To: usaafricadialogue <usaafric...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: USA Africa Dialogue Series - MALI HAS JUST DEFINITIVELY PUT AN END TO ITS DEPENDENCE ON FRANCE
 

Cornelius Hamelberg

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Aug 5, 2023, 8:16:10 AM8/5/23
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Former French colonies paying colonial tax?


Incredible and incroyable mean one and the same thing: 


11 COLONIAL AGREEMENTS IMPOSED ON AFRICAN COUNTRIES SINCE 1960.



Emeagwali, Gloria (History)

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Aug 5, 2023, 9:28:47 PM8/5/23
to Oluwatoyin Adepoju, usaafricadialogue
Toyin Adepoju 
You only have to look at the
negotiations and negotiators
in South Africa in the 1990s
to know how challenging  it is to 
usher in true independence.
Pro-Independence 
negotiators  are anxious, hopeful,
and at times forgetful of the
wily and cunning strategies of
the colonizer- negotiators that they
 are dealing with. Some are
threatened, intimidated and 
even assassinated.
In the case of South Africa, following 
the negotiations, the 
Central Bank and the Treasury were
to be run by the same apartheid
 forces- and even the same people,
after Black majority rule.
The ANC negotiators were caught 
off guard because they had their
eyes on the political - and less so
on the economic, confessed
Gumede, one of the negotiators.
 The South African apartheid 
administration arranged for a huge 
loan of $850m from the IMF,
 on the verge of negotiations and 
that meant that the ANC Freedom 
Charter plans for
nationalization, land reform,
free educ etc would be  a pipe dream.
IMF  Structural Adjustment
neo-liberalism won. The new regime
would be stuck with a $4.5 billion 
debt repayment bill.They had to give
 hefty lifelong pensions to apartheid 
era civil servants and sell off rather 
than nationalize land etc. 
(Naomi Klein,2007).Some of these
demands were baked in the cake.
Negotiators such as Mbeki did
not help matters.

The point is that before and
during negotiations the colonizers
are ready to give up political power
but  not economic control.
France was worse than most.

“France agreed to “grant” independence
 on the condition that 
African leaders sign “cooperation 
agreements”
 in areas such as raw materials, 
foreign trade, currency management, 
diploma- cy, higher education,
 civil aviation, military cooperation, 
etc. (Pigeaud and Sylla 2018, 27–33). 
In the monetary realm, these agreements 
implied that the newly independent 
countries would remain in the CFA 
franc zone. Repression and elite 
cooptation helped France deal rather
 successfully with African heads of 
state aspiring for more autonomy.
 In the 1960s, except for Sekou Touré, 
who managed to exit Guinea from
the CFA franc zone, the other “dissidents” 
among African leaders, like Modibo 
Keita (Mali) and Sylvanus Olympio 
(Togo), were thwarted in their ambitions
 (Pigeaud and Sylla 2018, 63–79).”

“Thwarted” is a nice word for 
assassinated, in this case.

“TheAfrica Report “is blatantly pro-France
but I have found ample sources 
on the French Faustian “colonial pact “
 on google scholar.
The interesting thing about history 
is that it is often too horrible   to be
believed. It is easier and more
comforting  to believe the
world of fiction, of course.
 



Professor Gloria Emeagwali
Prof. of History/African Studies, CCSU
africahistory.net; vimeo.com/ gloriaemeagwali
Recipient of the 2014 Distinguished Research
Excellence Award, Univ. of Texas at Austin;
2019 Distinguished Africanist Award
New York African Studies Association
Sent: Friday, August 4, 2023 4:30 PM
To: usaafricadialogue <usaafric...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: USA Africa Dialogue Series - MALI HAS JUST DEFINITIVELY PUT AN END TO ITS DEPENDENCE ON FRANCE
 

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Oluwatoyin Adepoju

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Aug 5, 2023, 9:29:25 PM8/5/23
to Emeagwali, Gloria (History), usaafricadialogue
thanks Gloria.

one may add the particularly nasty story of Haiti to the picture.

toyin

Victor Okafor

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Aug 7, 2023, 11:50:59 AM8/7/23
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The facts speak for themselves. They have been in the public domain for decades. But to perhaps satisfy your craving for a "credible" source, here we go:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oKY6GYLU9vw&t=28s

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/usaafricadialogue/IA1PR12MB8287C9D267A5D674F7B5E892DA09A%40IA1PR12MB8287.namprd12.prod.outlook.com.

Dompere, Kofi Kissi

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Aug 7, 2023, 3:12:30 PM8/7/23
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                GREETINGS ALL.

THANK YOU VICTOR FOR REMINDING US OF THIS PIECE AND ITS RELEVANCE TO THE GENERAL AFRICAN STRUGGLE

AND NIGER IN PARTICULAR AND ADDITIONALLY CONDITIONS IN MALI, BUKENA FASO WITH ALGERIA LIBERATION WAR AGAINST FRANCE

AND THE UNWAVERING SUPPORT BY KWAME NKRUMAH. THE PROBLEM WITH SO CALLED AFRICAN INTELLECTUALS IS SUBSTENTIAL NUMBER OF

US DO NOT READ OTHER AFRACAN SERIOUS TRANSFORMATIVE WORKS. THIS IS ALSO IN RESPONSE TO KEN’S

“Toyin, without seeing a really credible source, this reads like trolling. There were obviously dependency conditions, but these points appear wacky to me.

Ken”

 

1 NKRUMAH’S “NEOCOLONIALISM”

2 DIOP’S “BLACK AFRICA”

3 DOMPERE’S , a) AFRICAN UNITY”, b)THE THEORY OF CATYEGORIAL CONVERSION” AND c)THETHEORY OF PHILOSOPHICAL CONSCIENCISM

4 AY IKWEI ARMAH “TWO THOPUSAND SEASONS”

FOR MORE CREDIBLE SOURCE SEE THESE SITES:

 

SOME IMPORTANT SITES FOU PICTUTRES OF ATROCITIES AGAINST AFRICAN PEOPLE

 

AFRICAN SLAVERY

 

https://video.search.yahoo.com/yhs/search;_ylt=AwrEZ7AQHPdg9RkA0B0PxQt.;_ylu=Y29sbwNiZjEEcG9zAzIEdnRpZANDMjAxNF8xBHNlYwNzYw--?p=AFRICAN+SLAVERY&type=wncy_omxmedia_16_18&param1=1&param2=f%3D7%26b%3Dchmm%26cc%3Dus%26pa%3DWincy%26cd%3D2XzuyEtN2Y1L1Qzu0Czz0C0B0BzztD0D0BzyyBzyyBzy0ByDtN0D0Tzu0StCyDzzyDtN1L2XzutAtFtBtCtFtCtFtCtN1L1Czu1StN1L1G1B1V1N2Y1L1Qzu2StCyBtA0BzztCzzzytGyCyB0EzztGyC0C0BzztGtCyCyBzztG0F0E0CyDyByD0EyC0C0F0D0B2QtN1M1F1B2Z1V1N2Y1L1Qzu2SzzyD0ByByBtAzy0DtG0Czy0DyCtGyEtDtA0CtGzz0DzyyEtGtCzzzz0BtDyDtB0E0E0E0AtC2QtN0A0LzutB%26cr%3D236646580%26a%3Dwncy_omxmedia_16_18%26os_ver%3D6.1%26os%3DWindows%2B7%2BEnterprise&hsimp=yhs-fullyhosted_003&hspart=iry&ei=UTF-8&fr=yhs-iry-fullyhosted_003&turl=https%3A%2F%2Ftse1.mm.bing.net%2Fth%3Fid%3DOVP.4Gfje89bA_H2S8S8aPOUQwHgFo%26pid%3DApi%26w%3D148%26h%3D78%26c%3D7&rurl=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DdX_tkBvH87k&tit=Africa+to+America%3A+The+Odyssey+of+Slavery&pos=1&vid=1da11b61f45802848b69703523150f68&sigr=SgoOot5UF.VG&sigt=5ePLFHLPPvI9&sigi=0tS66LEOVqwp

 

USA

https://images.search.yahoo.com/yhs/search;_ylt=AwrCmnr5HPdg5XsAewIPxQt.;_ylu=Y29sbwNiZjEEcG9zAzIEdnRpZANDMjAxNF8xBHNlYwNzYw--?p=UNITED+STATES+AND+SLAVERY&type=wncy_omxmedia_16_18&param1=1&param2=f%3D7%26b%3Dchmm%26cc%3Dus%26pa%3DWincy%26cd%3D2XzuyEtN2Y1L1Qzu0Czz0C0B0BzztD0D0BzyyBzyyBzy0ByDtN0D0Tzu0StCyDzzyDtN1L2XzutAtFtBtCtFtCtFtCtN1L1Czu1StN1L1G1B1V1N2Y1L1Qzu2StCyBtA0BzztCzzzytGyCyB0EzztGyC0C0BzztGtCyCyBzztG0F0E0CyDyByD0EyC0C0F0D0B2QtN1M1F1B2Z1V1N2Y1L1Qzu2SzzyD0ByByBtAzy0DtG0Czy0DyCtGyEtDtA0CtGzz0DzyyEtGtCzzzz0BtDyDtB0E0E0E0AtC2QtN0A0LzutB%26cr%3D236646580%26a%3Dwncy_omxmedia_16_18%26os_ver%3D6.1%26os%3DWindows%2B7%2BEnterprise&hsimp=yhs-fullyhosted_003&hspart=iry&ei=UTF-8&fr=yhs-iry-fullyhosted_003

 

CUBA AND SLAVERY

 

https://images.search.yahoo.com/yhs/search?p=cuba+and+slavery&fr=yhs-iry-fullyhosted_003&type=wncy_omxmedia_16_18&hspart=iry&hsimp=yhs-fullyhosted_003&imgurl=http%3A%2F%2Fupload.wikimedia.org%2Fwikipedia%2Fcommons%2F1%2F15%2FSlaves_Unloading_Ice_in_Cuba_1832.jpg#id=6&iurl=http%3A%2F%2Fupload.wikimedia.org%2Fwikipedia%2Fcommons%2F1%2F15%2FSlaves_Unloading_Ice_in_Cuba_1832.jpg&action=close

 

FRANCE AND SLAVERY

https://images.search.yahoo.com/yhs/search;_ylt=AwrNa1ivLtFkTEwgeQAPxQt.;_ylu=Y29sbwNiZjEEcG9zAzIEdnRpZAMEc2VjA3Nj?p=french+and+slavery&type=fc_A29EA22DCF1_s69_g_e_d112522_n0670_c24&param1=7&param2=eJw1jksOgzAMRK%2FiJUgo2AECFdueoFvEIoUUIgJBfETV09eRWnnzZsYeebB9U7ePOyHKKlNN0i6sUZXIGCIiWUjJomMhcwa7BhsrUZCgMhcqrA7Gs3vujKdmmv3HOqfTQiBEl116f%2B2wHEAosAY2VF7DW%2BUx6HV15jLPyR5pkZUiUxBN4zG7BJydDAymm3wM3bj52aRE3BgGdv3Sm%2F2fmH74ZXRD%2Fquqvk2rPwI%3D&hsimp=yhs-2461&hspart=fc&ei=UTF-8&fr=yhs-fc-2461

 

GERMANY AND SLAVERY

https://images.search.yahoo.com/yhs/search;_ylt=AwrCmnr5HPdg5XsAewIPxQt.;_ylu=Y29sbwNiZjEEcG9zAzIEdnRpZANDMjAxNF8xBHNlYwNzYw--?p=UNITED+STATES+AND+SLAVERY&type=wncy_omxmedia_16_18&param1=1&param2=f%3D7%26b%3Dchmm%26cc%3Dus%26pa%3DWincy%26cd%3D2XzuyEtN2Y1L1Qzu0Czz0C0B0BzztD0D0BzyyBzyyBzy0ByDtN0D0Tzu0StCyDzzyDtN1L2XzutAtFtBtCtFtCtFtCtN1L1Czu1StN1L1G1B1V1N2Y1L1Qzu2StCyBtA0BzztCzzzytGyCyB0EzztGyC0C0BzztGtCyCyBzztG0F0E0CyDyByD0EyC0C0F0D0B2QtN1M1F1B2Z1V1N2Y1L1Qzu2SzzyD0ByByBtAzy0DtG0Czy0DyCtGyEtDtA0CtGzz0DzyyEtGtCzzzz0BtDyDtB0E0E0E0AtC2QtN0A0LzutB%26cr%3D236646580%26a%3Dwncy_omxmedia_16_18%26os_ver%3D6.1%26os%3DWindows%2B7%2BEnterprise&hsimp=yhs-fullyhosted_003&hspart=iry&ei=UTF-8&fr=yhs-iry-fullyhosted_003

 

GERMANY AND NAMIBIA

https://images.search.yahoo.com/yhs/search;_ylt=AwrEzOCbHfdg6j4AZT02nIlQ;_ylu=c2VjA3NlYXJjaARzbGsDYnV0dG9u;_ylc=X1MDMTM1MTE5NTcwMgRfcgMyBGFjdG4DY2xrBGNzcmNwdmlkAzhidk5zREV3TGpKcUNGSndXY1UxakFGc01UTTRMZ0FBQUFDdmdKTVYEZnIDeWhzLWlyeS1mdWxseWhvc3RlZF8wMDMEZnIyA3NhLWdwBGdwcmlkA2JqcWZGUi5SU25HTGRteDljZmllZUEEbl9zdWdnAzAEb3JpZ2luA2ltYWdlcy5zZWFyY2gueWFob28uY29tBHBvcwMwBHBxc3RyAwRwcXN0cmwDBHFzdHJsAzM2BHF1ZXJ5A0dFUk1BTlklMkMlMjBTTEFWRVJZJTIwQU5EJTIwTkFNSUJJQQR0X3N0bXADMTYyNjgwNzY2NQ--?p=GERMANY%2C+SLAVERY+AND+NAMIBIA&fr=yhs-iry-fullyhosted_003&fr2=sb-top-images.search&ei=UTF-8&x=wrt&type=wncy_omxmedia_16_18&hsimp=yhs-fullyhosted_003&hspart=iry&param1=1&param2=f%3D7%26b%3Dchmm%26cc%3Dus%26pa%3DWincy%26cd%3D2XzuyEtN2Y1L1Qzu0Czz0C0B0BzztD0D0BzyyBzyyBzy0ByDtN0D0Tzu0StCyDzzyDtN1L2XzutAtFtBtCtFtCtFtCtN1L1Czu1StN1L1G1B1V1N2Y1L1Qzu2StCyBtA0BzztCzzzytGyCyB0EzztGyC0C0BzztGtCyCyBzztG0F0E0CyDyByD0EyC0C0F0D0B2QtN1M1F1B2Z1V1N2Y1L1Qzu2SzzyD0ByByBtAzy0DtG0Czy0DyCtGyEtDtA0CtGzz0DzyyEtGtCzzzz0BtDyDtB0E0E0E0AtC2QtN0A0LzutB%26cr%3D236646580%26a%3Dwncy_omxmedia_16_18%26os_ver%3D6.1%26os%3DWindows%2B7%2BEnterprise&y=Search

 

HANKS

KOFI ( RESEARCH PROFESSOR : DECISION THEORY AND MATHEMATICAL SCIENCES”}

 

 

From: 'Victor Okafor' via USA Africa Dialogue Series <usaafric...@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Monday, August 7, 2023 4:50 AM
To: usaafric...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: USA Africa Dialogue Series - MALI HAS JUST DEFINITIVELY PUT AN END TO ITS DEPENDENCE ON FRANCE

 

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Harrow, Kenneth

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Aug 7, 2023, 11:43:08 PM8/7/23
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I have no doubts about atrocities against africans, to kofi’s list many might be added. Easily enough. Starting w the monstrosities of King leopold’s Ghost. Nonetheless, we have to retain our sense of judgment of what appears credible what is perhaps trolling.
One is not an apologist for anything in asking for credibility,
Ken
From: 'Dompere, Kofi Kissi' via USA Africa Dialogue Series <usaafric...@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Monday, August 7, 2023 1:56:44 PM
To: usaafric...@googlegroups.com <usaafric...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: RE: USA Africa Dialogue Series - MALI HAS JUST DEFINITIVELY PUT AN END TO ITS DEPENDENCE ON FRANCE
 

Victor Okafor

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Aug 8, 2023, 8:28:36 AM8/8/23
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Is this an example of obfuscation? 

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/usaafricadialogue/IA1PR12MB82875D87870C2E5D0EDAC50FDA0CA%40IA1PR12MB8287.namprd12.prod.outlook.com.

Harrow, Kenneth

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Aug 8, 2023, 12:02:52 PM8/8/23
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Hi victor, what i had in mind was the list of agreements with the french after colonialism. 
Ken
From: 'Victor Okafor' via USA Africa Dialogue Series <usaafric...@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, August 8, 2023 7:15:18 AM
To: usaafric...@googlegroups.com <usaafric...@googlegroups.com>

segun...@gmail.com

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Aug 8, 2023, 4:56:17 PM8/8/23
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Toyin, I think they were coerced to sign the 11  agreements. 
Segun Ogungbemi. 

Sent from my iPhone

On Aug 5, 2023, at 7:16 AM, Cornelius Hamelberg <cornelius...@gmail.com> wrote:



Victor Okafor

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Aug 8, 2023, 4:57:43 PM8/8/23
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Yes, the ignominious, atrocious and dehumanizing list has been the subject of public discussions for years. All this time, there has been no question about their authenticity. The video clip that I shared with you all yesterday (in order to partly address your curiosity) featured an explanation of their origins and political economic implications by a former African Union (AU) Ambassador to the United States, Her Excellency Arikana Chihombori-Quao. If you may recall, a few years ago, she was booted out of that diplomatic position for daring to raise an alarm about those monumentally exploitative colonial agreements (or should I say, re-colonization agreements) between France and the affected French-speaking African countries. Yes, recolonization agreements!
 
I was and I am still puzzled about what seemed like your attempt to cast doubt about the authenticity of these atrocious agreements that have been the subject of public discussions and books over the decades. I suppose the enormity of the hegemony, the callous indifference to African humanity and welfare, the selfishness, the greed, the absolutely domineering and asymmetrical nature of the provisions caused you to wonder if such heavily asymmetrical documents could have been propounded by any human society at that point in the 20th century? Do you think the French authors of those documents operated from a standpoint that the African peoples they were dealing with were equal human beings? Had worse things not happened before that era in the trajectory of global geopolitics?

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/usaafricadialogue/IA1PR12MB8287565F0930253401A1A5E2DA0DA%40IA1PR12MB8287.namprd12.prod.outlook.com.

Harrow, Kenneth

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Aug 8, 2023, 5:41:11 PM8/8/23
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Victor, yours is a broad statement, an indictment. It includes claims about africans being forced to pour money into french banks, without justification. This seems to refer to the cfa agreements, right? I’ve commented twice on this, and maybe my very limited understanding of it needs to be refined. But tying the cfa to the franc, as originally, protected the cfa against inflation. The advantages might have been seen to lie with the africans more than the french. 
Other none cfa states sought to join, for economic reasons.
What happened with the nairia or cedi, in terms of inflation? Stabilizing the cfa protected it with trade agreements.
As far as claims re repayments to france, what has been the role of loans over the years? I would say there’s lots to criticize france for, and loans and interest figure in, although now it is imf world bank. But what has been driving the situation re loans? 
Is there someone who knows, really, about this agreement and its worth to african states?
Ken
From: 'Victor Okafor' via USA Africa Dialogue Series <usaafric...@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, August 8, 2023 1:20:13 PM
To: usaafric...@googlegroups.com <usaafric...@googlegroups.com>

Victor Okafor

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Aug 8, 2023, 5:41:11 PM8/8/23
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Of course, they were coerced during an era when those African countries had no big brother to bail them out in the event that France decided to renege on the independence promise. And, don't forget that granting political independence to those African countries was only an after-thought due the 2nd world war's weakening of French military prowess, for originally, France did not intend to let go of those colonies, which she deemed as external provinces of the French Republic. 

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/usaafricadialogue/A355D14B-2325-4BE5-BA5E-A53F98CE629F%40gmail.com.

Victor Okafor

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Aug 8, 2023, 5:41:20 PM8/8/23
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Of course, they were coerced during an era when those African countries had no big brother to bail them out in the event that France decided to renege on the independence promise. And, don't forget that granting political independence to those African countries was only an after-thought due the 2nd world war's weakening of French military prowess, for originally, France did not intend to let go of those colonies, which she deemed as external provinces of the French Republic. That's why in its colonial administration, France pursued an assimilation strategy, while Britain engaged in an indirect rule approach.


To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/usaafricadialogue/A355D14B-2325-4BE5-BA5E-A53F98CE629F%40gmail.com.

Harrow, Kenneth

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Aug 8, 2023, 5:42:57 PM8/8/23
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Last question. How do we square these colonial claims about african states paying france for colonialism with aid payments made to african states. This is from today’s Washington Post: “France and the European Union soon cut of hundreds of millions of dollars in aid....The United States followed suit and suspended $100 million in financial support..."
Ken
From: Harrow, Kenneth <har...@msu.edu>
Sent: Tuesday, August 8, 2023 5:05:54 PM

Oluwatoyin Adepoju

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Aug 8, 2023, 5:43:10 PM8/8/23
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Fine one Okafor

But....

How could the Africans have agreed to such horrible agreements?

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/usaafricadialogue/CAO3oEczEfbB_t2_-wijCptnLph-wYwe3D4L1XsTrZWE-d4PqDg%40mail.gmail.com.

Cornelius Hamelberg

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Aug 9, 2023, 12:23:33 AM8/9/23
to USA Africa Dialogue Series

“Every man got a right to decide his own destiny

And in this judgement, there is no partiality”


Survival 


Professor Harrow 


has said previously, 


“Ever since my earliest days i learned about american imperial adventures, especially in the vietnam years. I doubt chomsky would have said much i wouldn’t have agreed with.”


So, post The Boston Tea Party and the ire of  “No taxation without representation” resulting in this fire: The American War of Independence (1775-1783), post the French Revolution (1789-1799) post The Haitian Revolution ( 1791 -1804)  - for which Haiti is still being punished, post The American Civil War ( 1861 -1865)  and The Berlin Conference (1884 -1885), post The Algerian War of Independence  (1954 - 1962) and all the bloody wars before and all the genocidal wars thereafter, what have Uncle Sam, France, and the EU, learned? To oppress Africans as much as they can get away with, because “ God is Dead”? Africa as the source of a steady supply of raw materials and the dumping ground of all their industrial and nuclear waste? According to the old colonial pecking order, Africans soon to be a prime commodity in organ transfers, such as kidneys and other spare body parts?


Fast forward from  yesterday’s Apartheid South Africa, Korea, Mau Mau, Vietnam, and Zimbabwe, how much has changed with regard to the former colonies, apart from the change of the plantation superintendent’s colour, the manager remains the same, albeit unlike Lady Macbeth, the only thing that the not so enigmatic Macron does not say is,


 “ My hands are of your colour; but I shame 

 To wear a heart so white"


It's surprising that anyone could pretend to be surprised about this sort of state-of-the-art, one size fits all, standard Imperial policy ( I almost wrote “poetry” as if my name is Kipling), Professor Jeffery Sachs, speaking: https://www.instagram.com/reel/CtYI74KNWb_/

Harrow, Kenneth

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Aug 9, 2023, 12:31:27 AM8/9/23
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We want to see in neocolonialism the system put in place by great powers to sustain their domination over the weaker states. And in 1960 there was a lot of truth in that. But not the whole story. The "Third World" was born through the resistance of those same states, led by india and asian and african states. The original terms of dependency changed. The cold war reshaped the relations. Then came globalization.
None of this accords with the older 1960s models. Yet the rhetoric continues, as if nothing had changed.
Ken
Sent: Tuesday, August 8, 2023 5:24:53 PM

Mensah, Edward K

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Aug 9, 2023, 3:03:37 AM8/9/23
to Harrow, Kenneth, usaafric...@googlegroups.com
Ken, you seemed to be preoccupied with the 'protection of the cfa against inflation'  by comparing the behavior of the cfa to the naira and the cedi. And in other posts you suggested that I have overestimated the negative impacts of the onerous conditions that france placed on the francafrique before 'independence '.
I want to remind you that one can't overestimate the value of freedom.  Ghana and Nigeria made their own decisions to drop the pound in favor of the naira and the cedi. At least it was not an imposed decision and they will learn from the consequences of their decisions.  That's what freedom means, free to make your own mistakes.
Kwaku

From: usaafric...@googlegroups.com <usaafric...@googlegroups.com> on behalf of Harrow, Kenneth <har...@msu.edu>
Sent: Tuesday, August 8, 2023 4:05 PM

Harrow, Kenneth

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Aug 9, 2023, 11:32:07 AM8/9/23
to Mensah, Edward K, usaafric...@googlegroups.com
I cite the cfa since it’s a case i know about. I don’t know the upside of not having cfa as a currency. I don’t really think it is freedom that is in question, but rather an economic decision whose consequences could have negative sides too. For instance, when it was tied to the franc, if the franc fell, so did the cfa. Was it beneficial over the long run? I wonder. Perhaps might compare with the british pound versus the euro when the brits decided not to join the eurozone. Did it help or hurt them?
And is the almighty dollar not an international currency for exchange? I’ve heard that, not sure quite what that means.

What’s the point here? I am asking questions that go beyond the surface accusations so as to ask why african states made the decisions they did. If the answer is, the french made them, etc., that becomes too superficial. For instance, the military agreements which obliged the french to intervene if an african state were facing an adversary or an internal risk. Was that good? Ahidjo was propped up by the french. Good for him. But for cameroon? Was that also good for france? Kwaku, i am interested in our conversations when we get into answers to questions that go beyond the surface.
Ken
From: Mensah, Edward K <deha...@uic.edu>
Sent: Wednesday, August 9, 2023 1:32:15 AM
To: Harrow, Kenneth <har...@msu.edu>; usaafric...@googlegroups.com <usaafric...@googlegroups.com>

Emeagwali, Gloria (History)

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Aug 9, 2023, 2:55:57 PM8/9/23
to Harrow, Kenneth, Mensah, Edward K, usaafric...@googlegroups.com





Professor Gloria Emeagwali
Prof. of History/African Studies, CCSU
africahistory.net; vimeo.com/ gloriaemeagwali
Recipient of the 2014 Distinguished Research
Excellence Award, Univ. of Texas at Austin;
2019 Distinguished Africanist Award
New York African Studies Association
Sent: Wednesday, August 9, 2023 10:04 AM
To: Mensah, Edward K <deha...@uic.edu>; usaafric...@googlegroups.com <usaafric...@googlegroups.com>

Subject: Re: USA Africa Dialogue Series - MALI HAS JUST DEFINITIVELY PUT AN END TO ITS DEPENDENCE ON FRANCE
 

EXTERNAL EMAIL: This email originated from outside of the organization. Do not click any links or open any attachments unless you trust the sender and know the content is safe.

I cite the cfa since it’s a case i know about. I don’t know the upside of not having cfa as a currency. I don’t really think it is freedom that is in question, but rather an economic decision whose consequences could have negative sides too. For instance, when it was tied to the franc, if the franc fell, so did the cfa. Was it beneficial over the long run? I wonder. Perhaps might compare with the british pound versus the euro when the brits decided not to join the eurozone. Did it help or hurt them?

Emeagwali, Gloria (History)

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Aug 10, 2023, 1:28:09 AM8/10/23
to Harrow, Kenneth, usaafric...@googlegroups.com
“France frames the deposit obligation removal as a gift, but the real gift has been Africa’s financing of the French Treasury….”Sylla et al.(2021)

What AID?


Professor Gloria Emeagwali
Prof. of History/African Studies, CCSU
africahistory.net; vimeo.com/ gloriaemeagwali
Recipient of the 2014 Distinguished Research
Excellence Award, Univ. of Texas at Austin;
2019 Distinguished Africanist Award
New York African Studies Association

From: usaafric...@googlegroups.com <usaafric...@googlegroups.com> on behalf of Harrow, Kenneth <har...@msu.edu>
Sent: Tuesday, August 8, 2023 5:15 PM

To: usaafric...@googlegroups.com <usaafric...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: USA Africa Dialogue Series - MALI HAS JUST DEFINITIVELY PUT AN END TO ITS DEPENDENCE ON FRANCE
 

EXTERNAL EMAIL: This email originated from outside of the organization. Do not click any links or open any attachments unless you trust the sender and know the content is safe.

Last question. How do we square these colonial claims about african states paying france for colonialism with aid payments made to african states. This is from today’s Washington Post: “France and the European Union soon cut of hundreds of millions of dollars in aid....The United States followed suit and suspended $100 million in financial support..."

Cornelius Hamelberg

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Aug 10, 2023, 1:28:09 AM8/10/23
to USA Africa Dialogue Series
They probably didn't read the fine print, just appended their signature with a flourish along the dotted lines where they read " Sign Here "

Victor Okafor

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Aug 10, 2023, 9:54:59 AM8/10/23
to usaafric...@googlegroups.com, Harrow, Kenneth
Deceptive language gymnastics is a typical tool of hegemony, neocolonialism, imperialism, and exploitation.

In addition to this example of French deception of tagging a fractional return of stolen African wealth as "aid " you may recall that during the colonial era, violent and bloody suppression of local community revolts by colonial armies (using weapons of mass destruction),  tended to be reported out as "pacification of the natives." 

Note that the practice and game of exportation of social imperialism and exploitative ideological tools and systems camouflaged as "aid" are not limited to the French. Today, such rhetorical strategies for mass deception and mass economic exploitation are still deployed by agents of oppression across the globe.

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/usaafricadialogue/BYAPR01MB45207A255EF04E5F7D364342DE13A%40BYAPR01MB4520.prod.exchangelabs.com.

Victor Okafor

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Aug 12, 2023, 2:07:16 AM8/12/23
to usaafric...@googlegroups.com, Mensah, Edward K

Watch this documentary on 

"How France Forces These 14 African Countries To Pay For Being Colonized..."


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ulATKEB2BbY


To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/usaafricadialogue/IA1PR12MB82875370F6ACECFA785FC249DA12A%40IA1PR12MB8287.namprd12.prod.outlook.com.

Mensah, Edward K

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Aug 12, 2023, 2:07:27 AM8/12/23
to Victor Okafor, usaafric...@googlegroups.com
Victor,

Thanks for forwarding this very important video about France's relationship with its 'former' colonies.  The person who should actually see this video is Ken who is a frequent contributor to discussions on this forum.
I read and love Ken's contributions. My problem is he fails to understand the negative impacts of the agreements France signed with its colonies before granting independence, from the point of view of the Africans. I am not talking about autarky here. The world is interdependent and will remain so for a long time.

 However, scholars like our own Ken keep emphasizing that benefits such as low inflation and stability of the monerary systems have conveyed tremendous benefits on the Francophone compared to countries like Ghana and Nigeria. These later countries have chosen their own paths and continue to make their own mistakes. At least, these are sovereign mistakes from which these countries can learn, granted, they are taking too long to learn. However, let us not forget that the value of freedom is immeasurable.

Kwaku
From: Victor Okafor <vok...@emich.edu>
Sent: Friday, August 11, 2023 3:07 PM
To: usaafric...@googlegroups.com <usaafric...@googlegroups.com>
Cc: Mensah, Edward K <deha...@uic.edu>

Harrow, Kenneth

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Aug 12, 2023, 6:30:53 PM8/12/23
to usaafric...@googlegroups.com, Victor Okafor
A footnote to my last posting. I believe i do appreciate that negative side of neocolonialism that followed upon independence. A lot of it served to keep dictators or ruling elites in power. Rare were any leftist regimes that survived. 
Things changed enormously from the time of the ideals of 1960. The occasional sankora stood out in opposition to the conservative figures or moderates, like senghor. 
Bekolo and teno made films about that period, that were humiliating. I remember that clearly.

But now is another age, as mbembe is arguing.
A corner appears to be turning.
Where will we go? We still have states like equatorial guinea where old fashioned dictatorship and total exploitation of resources obtain; how much better is it in burundi or the drc?
Ken
From: Harrow, Kenneth <har...@msu.edu>
Sent: Saturday, August 12, 2023 5:03:34 PM
To: usaafric...@googlegroups.com <usaafric...@googlegroups.com>; Victor Okafor <vok...@emich.edu>

Subject: Re: USA Africa Dialogue Series - MALI HAS JUST DEFINITIVELY PUT AN END TO ITS DEPENDENCE ON FRANCE
 
Dear kwaku, thanks for the kind words. I think i would want to emphasize my very limited knowledge over the costs and benefits of economic policies. I believe the african nations that joined the cfa system thought it benefitted them. And perhaps now it is no longer the case? I cite the issues of inflation and stability not to suggest that this system is ideal,but because i heard that this was a rationalization, not that i know which choice is ideal. And of course you are right to emphasize the value of autonomy.
Freedom is a big word. One could have one's own monetary system and wind up less free than your neighbor who opted to join the larger system. 
When you write the value of freedom is immeasurable, i agree. But knowing what conditions provide more or less freedom might not be so obvious.
Especially if you are a state with little power or wealth in a world where giant powers are duking it out.
I remember at one point ahidjo refused a french or american request--maybe it was for a vote. He decided to play it cool betweenthe great powers. And of course somalia played that game for years, as did the sudan. 
Freedom to me means freedom to make choices, and you can't make a choice unlessyou know the parameters that dictate the conditions of your choice
Ken
From: usaafric...@googlegroups.com <usaafric...@googlegroups.com> on behalf of Mensah, Edward K <deha...@uic.edu>
Sent: Friday, August 11, 2023 7:33:30 PM
To: Victor Okafor <vok...@emich.edu>; usaafric...@googlegroups.com <usaafric...@googlegroups.com>

Harrow, Kenneth

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Aug 12, 2023, 6:31:06 PM8/12/23
to usaafric...@googlegroups.com, Victor Okafor
Dear kwaku, thanks for the kind words. I think i would want to emphasize my very limited knowledge over the costs and benefits of economic policies. I believe the african nations that joined the cfa system thought it benefitted them. And perhaps now it is no longer the case? I cite the issues of inflation and stability not to suggest that this system is ideal,but because i heard that this was a rationalization, not that i know which choice is ideal. And of course you are right to emphasize the value of autonomy.
Freedom is a big word. One could have one's own monetary system and wind up less free than your neighbor who opted to join the larger system. 
When you write the value of freedom is immeasurable, i agree. But knowing what conditions provide more or less freedom might not be so obvious.
Especially if you are a state with little power or wealth in a world where giant powers are duking it out.
I remember at one point ahidjo refused a french or american request--maybe it was for a vote. He decided to play it cool betweenthe great powers. And of course somalia played that game for years, as did the sudan. 
Freedom to me means freedom to make choices, and you can't make a choice unlessyou know the parameters that dictate the conditions of your choice
From: usaafric...@googlegroups.com <usaafric...@googlegroups.com> on behalf of Mensah, Edward K <deha...@uic.edu>
Sent: Friday, August 11, 2023 7:33:30 PM

Oluwatoyin Adepoju

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Aug 13, 2023, 5:57:31 AM8/13/23
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Beautiful-

" Freedom to me means freedom to make choices, and you can't make a choice unless you know the parameters that dictate the conditions of your choice"

Ken Harrow 

Harrow, Kenneth

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Aug 14, 2023, 4:05:07 PM8/14/23
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what do we know about the person who made this video? what is his authority, knowledge?
(why can't he pronounce the word "coup"?)
ken

kenneth harrow

professor emeritus

dept of english

michigan state university

517 803-8839

har...@msu.edu

Sent: Sunday, August 13, 2023 5:52 AM

Michael Afolayan

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Aug 15, 2023, 1:15:15 AM8/15/23
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"what do we know about the person who made this video? what is his authority, knowledge?
(why can't he pronounce the word "coup"?)" Ken

Since this is taking us to a phonology class, judging by his accent, this fellow is American. But my question to Ken (and others) is, other than the Americanization of a French word, did this man make sense in this presentation?

Just curious!

MOA






Victor Okafor

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Aug 15, 2023, 1:15:16 AM8/15/23
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The contents of that video documentary are merely a recapitulation and a visual representation (a memory refresher, if you may) of a tune that is and should be familiar to any serious and up-to-date scholar of Africa's colonial and neo-colonial experiences. If they came across to anyone as a surprise or if they came across as beyond the pale to anyone, then that anyone needs to check the standpoint from which he/she watched it. While ordinarily, it is important to ascertain the authority and qualifications of a content creator, when the contents sound exceedingly familiar to scholars of the subject-area, the latter issues tend not to assume a degree of importance that it would have evoked had the contents been of a questionable nature. 

On the other hand, there are situations where the factuality of the contents is so overwhelming that apologists for neo colonial oppression and exploitation would resort to distraction—that is, efforts are launched to distract attention from the substance through an aspersion on the messenger. Is this not why in writing classes, students are counseled against adhominem?

And, if I may ask: what aspect or aspects of the contents of that video documentary struck anyone as unreal?


Harrow, Kenneth

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Aug 15, 2023, 9:59:36 AM8/15/23
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I watched the first couple of minutes, seconds. Coup is an english word, in which the p isn’t pronounced. Who cares? I don’t. But the opening of the video was already on a junior high school level of presentation, and the claims that “history” tells us were specious or juvenile. France certainly was neocolonialist in many ways. But it wasn’t by overthrowing oppositional african states that its neocolonialism worked.
It would be tedious for me to recite history that everyone more or less knows about the military agreements, the propping up of dictatorships, etc. 
the video starts off with more simplistic claims thaat i just don’t want to parse. 
Maybe it gets great,
But the beginning is poor, and by omitting any serious citation of authority, it seems to have the quality of thought of the filmmaker who probably made it for his class. Who knows?
Ken
From: 'Michael Afolayan' via USA Africa Dialogue Series <usaafric...@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Monday, August 14, 2023 9:12:23 PM

Mensah, Edward K

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Aug 16, 2023, 6:23:44 AM8/16/23
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Hi All,
For the purpose of full disclosure,  I have nothing against France.  I love that country and I have been serving as affiliate professor of economics in a major university in France since 2004. I have expressed these same views to my students and colleagues in France. Secondly,  I'm a Ghanaian-Chicagoan and an emeritus faculty at  one of the major universities in Chicago. I'm most fascinated about Al Capone stories.  He is reputed to have said that ..you can negotiate with anyone but it gets easier when the opponent sees the barrel of your gun. That seems to me like a French agreement with its colonies, no pun intended:-)
From: Mensah, Edward K <deha...@uic.edu>
Sent: Tuesday, August 15, 2023 10:21 PM

To: usaafric...@googlegroups.com <usaafric...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: USA Africa Dialogue Series - MALI HAS JUST DEFINITIVELY PUT AN END TO ITS DEPENDENCE ON FRANCE
 
Ken,
I have a couple issues with your narrative. It is well written,  as usual, but it misses some salient points. First,  when you refer to military agreements are you talking about agreements fairly negotiated or the
Al Capone type, shot gun agreements? I will maintain that these were imposed agreements. 
Note that France had 'signed' an agreement with Haiti in 1825 for the payment of the sum of 150 million French francs in reparations in return for the recognition of Haitian independence.  When could not find the money France forced Haiti to borrow the money from French banks and pay in 3 installments. That forced payment bankrupted Haiti untitoday.
Recently,  the celebrated French economist Thomas Piketty estimated that the amount paid to France is equivalent to $28 billion in current dollars. There is an effort by French intellectuals to force France to pay back Haiti.
Then there is the French Algerian war when Algeria refused to be part of France.
Close to home in Sub-Saharan Africa France destroyed most of the infrastructure in Guinea when Sekou Toure refused the 'agreement ' to use the cfa.
You see, one should be ware of these French agreements with her colonies. They look to me like Al Capone's shot gun agreements.
My view is that the current francophone youths are screaming..hell no, we can't take it anymore. But I'm not sure they know what the alternative means for them.
We need cool heads. France,  US, Ecowas must all think through the impendmess before the first shots of the avoidable was are fired.
Kwaku
Sent: Tuesday, August 15, 2023 8:52 AM

Mensah, Edward K

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Aug 16, 2023, 6:23:45 AM8/16/23
to usaafric...@googlegroups.com
Ken,
I have a couple issues with your narrative. It is well written,  as usual, but it misses some salient points. First,  when you refer to military agreements are you talking about agreements fairly negotiated or the
Al Capone type, shot gun agreements? I will maintain that these were imposed agreements. 
Note that France had 'signed' an agreement with Haiti in 1825 for the payment of the sum of 150 million French francs in reparations in return for the recognition of Haitian independence.  When could not find the money France forced Haiti to borrow the money from French banks and pay in 3 installments. That forced payment bankrupted Haiti untitoday.
Recently,  the celebrated French economist Thomas Piketty estimated that the amount paid to France is equivalent to $28 billion in current dollars. There is an effort by French intellectuals to force France to pay back Haiti.
Then there is the French Algerian war when Algeria refused to be part of France.
Close to home in Sub-Saharan Africa France destroyed most of the infrastructure in Guinea when Sekou Toure refused the 'agreement ' to use the cfa.
You see, one should be ware of these French agreements with her colonies. They look to me like Al Capone's shot gun agreements.
My view is that the current francophone youths are screaming..hell no, we can't take it anymore. But I'm not sure they know what the alternative means for them.
We need cool heads. France,  US, Ecowas must all think through the impendmess before the first shots of the avoidable was are fired.
Kwaku
Sent: Tuesday, August 15, 2023 8:52 AM

Harrow, Kenneth

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Aug 16, 2023, 9:01:47 AM8/16/23
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dear kwaku,
Thanks for your considered response. I am not sure what i wrote that might contradict what you wrote. The agreements made under neocolonial conditions in 1960 were no doubt like those you describe, but honestly i do not know the details of those agreements, and the posting shown here struck me as tendentious and probably inaccurate.
The only ones i know about are the military one and the cfa. The former committed the french to militarily supporting regimes, a number of which devolved into pure dictatorships.
As for guinea, sekou toure’s regime was a pretty awful dictatorship. I remember attending a wonderful session of ala or asa, with chris miller making that point, and then getting attacked for it. Manthia diawara laid it out best: toure was a hero for defying the french; but if any cared about the opposition who were killed and tortured, that might have mitigated the admiration for anyone who was fair minded.
I can't think of anything good to say about algeria; or madagascar, or tunisia or morocco, etc. 
the truth for me is that the french were conquerors who disguised the conquest under the rhetoric of "civilization".
I firmly believe the british were no better. For any french atrocity, we have brits in kenya and elsewhere, nigeria included with their conquest. And in cases, beginning with portugal, the slave trade generated the european involvement and latere psychology.
Haiti--agreed--another atrocity; like all slave owning islands turned into capitalist moneypots.

Still, after independence thousands of french lived in africa, andmany were there to provide aid, medical assistance, cultural support, etc. the people on this list appear unaware of that and paint with a broad brush anything french as if we were back in the days of colonialism or the slave trade. 
As for the current wave of antifrench sentiment in africa, it is probably a good thing. However, the notion that the russia propaganda machine is feeding it gives me the creeps--another neocolonialist power manipulating africans, and people on this list accepting it as if it were wonderful.
It is unconscionable nowadays to compare wagner's abuses with the french.
That doesn't excuse the continuations of any french neocolonial economic orders, but we can't really hold discussions, as you and i are doing, by distorting the current situation so strongly. 
Lastly, i am being put in a position that is attributed to me that i don't hold, more than once. What's that about?
Ken
Sent: Tuesday, August 15, 2023 11:21:29 PM

Victor Okafor

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Aug 16, 2023, 2:21:55 PM8/16/23
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As I understand it, in this threaded discussion, we are doing our humanly and scholarly best to shed light on Africa's neocolonial experiences, particularly the under-reported neocolonial economic exploitations of the current era, the euphemistic uses of the term "aid" to mask fractional givebacks of stolen Africanwealth, etc. The discussion is not about who likes or dislikes one neocolonial master or the other. 

Michael Afolayan

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Aug 16, 2023, 2:21:55 PM8/16/23
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Did Ken say "coup" is an English word? I say, no, it is not an English word; it has traveled a long way before being borrowed into the English vocabulary in the 15th century. But it really does not matter; I agree with Kwaku that the situation in the Francophone world today is akin to the insane person being pushed to the wall, as the Yoruba would describe the scenario. With nowhere else to go, the mad fellow must bite and bite hard; it might end up cracking and breaking a few teeth, but there does not seem to be a turning back at this point.

MOA

Harrow, Kenneth

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Aug 18, 2023, 10:17:34 PM8/18/23
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Dear michael and victor
First of all, borrowed? Words become domesticated. English is a mishmash of germanic, norse, french, celtic….who knows what. I eat things like ham (jambon) pork (porc), but not what the french call bacon.
I agree with the wonderfully powerful statement michael cites from kwaku about the madman. It’s been true for a long time that the powerless resistance has been a sort of mania.
I agree with victor that the neocolonialism has disguised its motives.
However, i don’t agree that all aid has been hypocritical and evil etc, and misrepresented either. As others would say, before you remove the aid that people are living on, you might want to check with them about living free or dying. The american patriot said, give me liberty or give me death.
He was speaking for himself, of course; and certainly not for slaves!
Ken
From: 'Victor Okafor' via USA Africa Dialogue Series <usaafric...@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, August 16, 2023 9:05:45 AM

Victor Okafor

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Sep 16, 2023, 12:57:54 PM9/16/23
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Here is additional food for thought on France's role in African affairs: Nigerians Accuse France Of Creating Boko Haram & Want Them Out Of Their Country - YouTube
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