Destructive Vizsla.

[Eve]

Elaine, I have a re-homed Viz called Hector. He is so destructive.
So far he has chewed holes in every duvet in the house, we can't have
cushions on the chairs or sofas,t He has eaten tee shirts,
Underwear, bed throws, a mattress topper, and lots of other stuff I
am sure that I have forgotten about . When we picked him up from
his original home, we saw that he had wrecked the
place. Every kitchen unit was stripped of its veneer, the leather
was stripped off the dining room chairs, the sofa was destroyed,
most of the carpets in the house were partly destroyed.
He was only six months when we got him, and at the time I put the
destruction down to him spending all day, and most of the evening
alone in the house while she worked. He is
a bright little boy and a joy to be around, his tail wags all the
time. He had got a great personality, a huge enthusiasm for life, and
gets on very well with my other Viz. They get at least
2/3 hours free running a day, with a lead walk morning and evening. I
am retired, so they have someone at home with them all day, So I
guess his chewing must be a habit from his last home.
Sort of like biting your nails? I would not be without him ,and
would love to work him, but unfortunately there is nowhere where we
live, or near by to train him up, even though we live in very rural
Hertfordshire. Most of the working dogs on shoots here are labs.

Katy, Rufus and Hector.

[Chrissie Diron]

Hi Katy

Whilst it's true that some habits really are hard to break and this destructive chewing could reduce with time and stability in Hector's life (you are providing all the right ingredients for that - company, exercise, stimulation), it might be worth considering that there is something more underlying the behaviour, i.e. pain from physical or emotional baggage of yesteryear. There are a number of hands-on therapies to relax the body and break down these memories, as well as remedies to help clear emotional stuff. If you are interested in that, I will expand. Don't forget that some sort of physical pain may also manifest as an outlash on the surroundings. I'd get him thoroughly checked over. Obviously nobody wins when a dog is destructive and in my experience, this level of destruction is a very distorted behaviour, not normal for a Vizsla (destuffing a toy or two or wanting to chew on bones or chews being the norm). As for training him in Herts, I have a friend in that part of the world with a LH Weimaraner and she is going to some sort of training with him, so I could ask her if that's open to Vizzies too? 

From Chrissie and the Vitali Vizslas

Independent Norwex Consultant
Kick the chemical habit - go green and be clean, naturally! 

www.vitalk9.ca
www.canine-health-concern.org.uk
www.aunaturelk9s.com

[Elaine Bradley]

Hi Katy

Where in Herts are you? I too live in Herts and have started taking Evie
out on a shoot with a friend who is an A panel pointer/setter judge and who
has made up FT champions in Irish setters. Evie has been on 2 shoots (with
his labradors), just to get used to the atmosphere and the sounds and has
done some fantastic retrieves (set up after the shoot) but also one during a
drive to retrieve a winged partridge, which she did beautifully, gently and
to hand, the bird still alive and not a mark on it!! My friend is going to
help me train Evie. The GSP Club do have training classes in Essex.

Poor Hector, at least he's getting lots of attention now. Evie (and the
others) have been contained in the kitchen/dining room/conservatory today, I
should have done it all along but my older ones have never been any problem
and have always had the run of the house!! I'm sure she'll grow out of it,
she just needs to be doing something all the time, but right now she's fast
asleep on the sofa next to me, like butter wouldn't melt in her mouth!!!

Elaine & Evil Evie (plus the 3 angels - Abbie, Willow & Seren)

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[Ros Leighton]

Hi Eve, this doesn't sound like totally 'normal' Vizsla behaviour to me, and
sounds like some stress response is involved. There are two things that I
wonder about this - one is does he have 'pica' - an compulsive behavioural
chewing condition. There's lots of information about it on the net, and you
may need to seek veterinary/behaviourist treatment.

I wondered if Hector has developed some separation anxiety behaviours?
Though the circumstances you've described don't sound entirely typical.

The exercise sounds almost excessive on a daily basis - 2/3 hours + two
other walks? Am I right in this? Sometimes in 'stressy' dogs, over exercise
can create problems. I'd try making at least one of your sessions a very
formal training session, using his brain and strengthening his relationship
with you. You don't say how long you've had him?

So, you might want to have a read of the info on the web and maybe a talk to
your vet to see if they think it's more than just 'naughtiness'. If it's
either of the above conditions the sooner you get to work on the problems,
the sooner you'll have another lovely Vizsla in your home.

Good luck
Cheers
Ros

[Ros Leighton]

Woops, meant to ask Eve, with regard to the chewing of things/pica
relationship - does Hector also swallow them?

[Bodi]

Hello Katy

Having read this I am not sure if I have interepted correctly.

It does sound like some of his behaviour is attention seeking.

If the free running is left in a garden then this is different to
being walked and then let off lead to venture. If this is the case I
would recommend that you when you walk in the morning on the lead you
can take Hector to a place where he can then be let off the lead where
he can free run and if interested play ball etc. I personally feel
that if you tried this when he was back in the house he might be ready
to relax and sleep.

I am not an expert and may have misinterupted if so I am really
sorry.

When Hector takes and chews cushions etc this kind of behaviour is
normally for attention. You could try replacing what he chews with
what you want him to chew (his toys and bones). If he does need some
Hector time and attention and still young he probably would like to
play some games to stimulate him and prevent the chewing. Our dog as a
puppy was a terror for grabbing cushions but luckily he never chewed
what wasn't his but with the cushions we would ignore him until he
dropped then give him a treat or replace the cushion with his toy,
You have to be careful that when he takes something that is not his if
you respond he has got your attention and will use to always get
attention.

Hope I have not offended you with my interpretation

Good luck

Sharon

[Ros Leighton]

Well spotted Sharon - My interpretation was that the dogs were out 3 times a
day, one of which was an off lead run of 2/3 hours. Be interesting to see
which it is. How important it is to get all the details when thinking about
a problem!

And yes, of course substituting appropriate chewing toys is a great
suggestion.
Cheers
Ros

-----Original Message-----
From: ukvi...@googlegroups.com [mailto:ukvi...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf

[Eve]

Hi Ros, thanks for the info, I will do some research into that. Re
exercise. I have always felt a bit guilty that they were not getting
enough, that
is a bit of a relief. No wonder Rufus is reluctant to go out on his
evening walks. Before I got Rufus , my first Vizsla, I read up on the
breed to make
sure we would be right for each other, and exercise seemed to be so
important for them. I think I have overdone it it seems. LOL! I have
had Hector
for just over two years. He is a little pocket Rocket, not too
boisterous in the house, but always up for going out, even if it is
just for a lead walk, or to
visit my neighbour. They are rarely left alone in the house, there is
always one of us in. I do have to say, he is getting better,not half
as bad as when
I first got him. Sometimes when I am playing with him on the bed or
sofa, he will get excited and start nibbling the duvet or throws, and
it needs two or
three no's to make him stop
Eve

[Eve]

Hi Sharon, we are lucky enough to live near a huge tract of land
comprising of woods,rough ground and fields with tons of rabbits.
Perfect for off lead. Apart from the land tract, I am surrounded
with lots lovely walks with rivers and ponds,and ancient woodland. All
off lead walking, dog heaven we all think. As for the garden, they
hardly go out there except for a pee or when we are out
there, it is a large garden all grass with some fruit trees, so I
don't know why that is. I always imagined standing at the kitchen sink
and watching my dogs playing in the garden, but when I am at
the sink, they are usually on the sofa in the living room.
They have tons of toys, mostly Kong, as Hector will destroy normal
toys in an instant. When we first got Hector, Rufus had a pink rubber
pig that he had had for about a six months, Hector destroyed
it in two days The ones they play with mostly is the tug rope. I do
think that most of the problem with Hector is, I have not done enough
to occupy his very bright brain.
Please don't worry about offending, I welcome everyone's thoughts, and
advice

Eve.

[Recuer...@aol.com]

Hi Eve,

 

I really agree with Ros about not over exercising stressy dogs. I have a few stressy clients and always exercise them less. They get lots of time spent with them and we do some puzzle toy time. Also hand feeding plays a big part in my relationship with such personality types, they tend to look to me for things to chew instead of chewing my house, lol! Every stressy HPR on my books is stick thin so hand feeding through the day helps them gain much needed weight and you can see them calm down more and more as the weight goes on.

 

My own Vizslas and GSPs get one walk a day, longer in summer but in bad weather/dead of winter it may only be 30 minutes. They are all different and my young girl of nearly 2yrs old is a huge character but they all sleep lots in the day whilst I am in the shower, cleaning etc.

 

Best bit of advice anyone gave me was never over exercise a young dog as it will become like an Olympic champion who can handle more and more and more exercise!

 

Also, we give Aconite 1m and Ignatia 200c to stressy dogs incase they have experienced trauma, grief or shock during their lives.

 

What about a babygate at the bottom of the stairs to restrict access to areas when you aren't with the little fella? We do that too.

 

Best wishes,

Vicky

 

Vicky Martin
To The Manor Bourne luxury home boarding for dogs.
www.tothemanorbourne.com

Recuerdo Magyar Vizslak & Keigame GSPs
A Dog is for LIFE - NOT for Puppy Farming!

[Susie Zarpanely]

Hi Eve
 
It sounds like the introduction of a crate in your household might be a good idea too! Obviously very slowly and carefully but for his safety and your peace of mind not to mention your pocket!!! Am I reading your post right is he really getting 3 hours free running walks? If so the adrenaline created by so much excersise could well be fuel to your problems
There is loads of training help in Hertfordshire but you would need to work on calming him before you start. Patience is a great asset to a gundog. Utility gundog club( Herts area) is run by Sue Searle mainly retrievers but they can teach the retrieving aspects, Mary Jane Opie runs a multi breed group at Rabley Willow HPRs welcome. Chiltern Gundog club caters for all breeds. David Winser teaches HPRs in groups or 1-1 in Cambridge near Huntingdon( his details can be found via the German Longhaired Pointer Club) and GSP Club have 2 branches north of the river Harlow( Eastern Counties) and Dartford (South Eastern Counties) You could also try the Gundog Club. All these are on the web except Mary Jane whose contact details I can look up for you. I presume the Pointer /Setter man Elaine is talking about is Peter Herd.... not many better than him!!!
You might find that Linda Tellington-Jones book entitled Getting in touch with your dog, helpful in creating a relaxed confident dog who can put the past behind him. The T touches are really good at influencing behaviour and relaxing so that performance is enhanced.
Do let us know how he gets on
 
Susie

[Eve]

Hi Vicky, you are right, Hector is quite thin compared to Rufus. Hector is fine in the house, he sleeps a lot during the day. I was a bit worried about this, as I thought they slept too much.

He is a huge character and very vocal. He will tell you exactly what is on his mind,  and moans and groans a lot.

30 minutes,  wish I had of known that when I have been standing in a field,  in freezing cold rain, wind and snow. Mine seem to like the milder/cold weather to summer. In summer I exercise 

in the early morning or evening.

I have a baby gate, but have never used it. I don't think I could stand the noisy outrage, but I will give it a go.

Thanks.

Eve.

<img_0307.jpg>

Recuerdo Magyar Vizslak & Keigame GSPs
A Dog is for LIFE - NOT for Puppy Farming!

[Elaine Bradley]

Got it in one Susie, yes Peter Heard.  He is a very good friend of mine, my dogs go to his boarding kennels and they love it there!!  We've known each other for more years than I care to remember and he's probably forgotten more things about working gundogs dogs that most people have ever known!! 

 

Elaine

 

----- Original Message -----

[Eve]

Today I  cut down their free running time to an hour, and the world didn't end.  They came home and slept as usual.  It is very helpful to me, as I am now not worrying about  not giving them enough exercise.

Both the boys have had crates since puppy-hood.  I am thinking about getting in touch with Peter Herd, as I have heard a lot of good things about him.

The T touch I have heard about and will look into it.  Both boys love being pinched softly, it sends Hector especially into a blissful trance.

Eve.

[Sandra J Mulroney]

Hi Eve
I have been quietly reading this thread with great interest. I cannot add
any more pearls of wisdom as I think everything has been covered but I
thought I'd tell you about my eldest girl as through the carnage I've had
many years of joy.
Toff was the most destructive beast going! She did thousands of pounds worth
of damage, eating cameras, phones, the bed head, the mattress, skirting
boards, a chest of drawers, all my old college books and at one point was
just one chapter behind me throughout a Jilly Cooper..... Everything I owned
had teeth marks!
She was/is far from being a stressy dog. She is just stubborn as a mule and
enjoyed being bad!!
With the use of a crate, training her basic gundog skills and restricting
her toys to ones that stimulated her mind more, by the time she was two, she
was trustworthy with fixtures and fittings! BUT.... she then turned her
attention to being a master criminal! She learnt how to open both the fridge
and the oven and emptied them! The dog gate lock was "picked" and a whole
cooked chicken roasting in the oven disappeared!!!
It was when we moved that the real change came about... we went from a
cul-de-sac to living on the Village High Street. Toff loves it! She sits in
the window and watches the world go by and is as good as gold when we are
out!
She is now almost 14. Toys still get mauled and just the other week she
started destuffing her duvet right in front of me and then looked at me as
if to say " Go on then????"Be cross with me! Bet you won't!" She then
presented me with a piece of stuffing laid across my knee and went to sleep
happy!
We also have Toffs great, great niece who (touch wood) has never chewed and
is a goody two shoes in comparison! All we have to do when we go out is to
leave the tv on as Skye will watch it for hours!
It sounds to me like Hector has got the most wonderful home and will enjoy
anything and everything you do with him. He's a very lucky boy to have found
you! Good luck with all your efforts.
Regards
Sandra, Toff and Skye

-----Original Message-----
From: ukvi...@googlegroups.com [mailto:ukvi...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf

Of Eve
Sent: 13 January 2011 14:51
To: ukvi...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Destructive Vizsla.

Katy, Rufus and Hector.

--

[Eve]

Oh Sandra, thank you so much for posting this, it made me laugh out
loud, a lot. "Everything I owned had teeth marks" very funny. She
sounds like a very bright girl. Hector will also destroy things
in front of us , and I too fail to be cross with him, I just can't.
He is reprimanded though, and his crimes are firmly pointed out to him.

I don't believe Hector is a stressy dog ether, he has such enthusiasm
for life, loves everybody, everything' and lives life at full tilt.
But the two of do need a bit of work, and I am looking forward to
to getting started with the gun-dog training.
I think that he is a lot brainier then me, so it will be interesting.

Now Rufus, my other Viz , who I have had since he was a puppy, is as
good as gold, calm,laid back, good recall, (most of the time) has a
soft mouth and will hand things back to you, and sometimes he will
hand them to Hector., who trots along behind us with bunny in
mouth, and entrails dragging. I am always worried about coming face
to face with a family with small children.
His toys lasted for ages, that is till Hurricane Hector hit us.

I have been very lucky with Rufus, and his breeder has been
fantastic. Both boys go back to her for their holidays every year in
the beautiful New Forest. From what I hear, Hector behaves beautifully
when he is there. Only one incident where he stripped some bark from
an apple tree in the garden.

I would like to thank every body for their input, and very welcome
advice, I will keep you posted on our progress.
Eve.