Why is traffic worse on a monday morning?
bolta...@boltar.world
mondays? Or is the morning commute one day a week enough for them and the
rest of the week they take the bus or are they simply still suffering from
w/e hangovers and so drive around at 20mph everywhere causing queues? I just
don't get it.
B2003
Derek C
People are more likely to be dozy and get up later on Monday mornings,
hence the rush hour becomes more concentrated. When I commuted to work
by car, it was amazing how much clearer the roads were during school
holidays, and also the traffic tended to be lighter on Friday
mornings, unless a Bank Holiday followed. A subject for a Ph.D. study
perhaps?
Derek C
bolta...@boltar.world
Derek C <del.co...@tiscali.co.uk> wrote:
>hence the rush hour becomes more concentrated. When I commuted to work
>by car, it was amazing how much clearer the roads were during school
>holidays, and also the traffic tended to be lighter on Friday
School hols certainly make a big difference. There should be a half mile
parking and drop off exclusion zone around all schools between 8am and 9.30am
to discourage lazy women from using cars to take little jemima to school
instead of just walking the half mile from their house.
B2003
GT
news:idie5h$rb1$1...@speranza.aioe.org...
I'm sorry, but you'll have to include me in that too - I take the car, drop
the boy off at school, then continue to my work. If I walked to school, then
home again for my car I'd be about 45 minutes late for work!!
bolta...@boltar.world
"GT" <a@b.c> wrote:
>I'm sorry, but you'll have to include me in that too - I take the car, drop
>the boy off at school, then continue to my work. If I walked to school, then
>home again for my car I'd be about 45 minutes late for work!!
Why can't he walk there on his own or get the bus?
B2003
GT
news:idig96$ft$1...@speranza.aioe.org...
Sorry, should have said *boys*, but to answer your question directly:
because they are 3 and 6 and have to cross 2 main roads!
bolta...@boltar.world
Why is a 3 year old going to the same school as a 6 year old?
B2003
GT
news:idikql$ap4$1...@speranza.aioe.org...
Nursery is the building next door, 6-year old goes to the school.
john wright
> On Dec 6, 10:12 am, boltar2...@boltar.world wrote:
>> Compared to other weekday mornings that is. Are there people who only work
>> mondays? Or is the morning commute one day a week enough for them and the
>> rest of the week they take the bus or are they simply still suffering from
>> w/e hangovers and so drive around at 20mph everywhere causing queues? I just
>> don't get it.
> People are more likely to be dozy and get up later on Monday mornings,
> hence the rush hour becomes more concentrated. When I commuted to work
> by car, it was amazing how much clearer the roads were during school
> holidays, and also the traffic tended to be lighter on Friday
> mornings, unless a Bank Holiday followed. A subject for a Ph.D. study
> perhaps?
Without a Ph.D in it I think it might be reasonable to surmise that
since most schools take a dim view of students gong on holiday in term
time the only time parents can go away is when schools themselves are on
holiday.
It doesn't take more than reduction of about 10% of traffic movement to
cause a really noticeable change in the conditions
--
John Wright
Blasphemy - a victimless crime.
Dr Zoidberg
<bolta...@boltar.world> wrote in message
news:idicup$ogq$1...@speranza.aioe.org...
people taking long weekends I suppose
--
Alex
GT
news:4cfcd773$0$13581$c3e8da3$fe0...@news.astraweb.com...
The daft thing is that parents aren't supposed to use the car park - that is
supposed to be visitors only, so we have to park out on the road in front of
the school!
bolta...@boltar.world
"GT" <a@b.c> wrote:
>>> Why is a 3 year old going to the same school as a 6 year old?
>>
>> Nursery is the building next door, 6-year old goes to the school.
>
>The daft thing is that parents aren't supposed to use the car park - that is
>supposed to be visitors only, so we have to park out on the road in front of
>the school!
I'm sure they could walk a short distance down the road on their own so
you don't have to park right outside or you could accompany them on a
5 min walk. Are you really that pressed for time in the mornings? Could you
not just get out of bed a bit earlier?
B2003
pete
on friday afternoon (the other noticably bad time) are driving the return
leg of that journey.
However, there is some, small, balance that friday mornings are typically
easier for travelling than any other wekday morning, as some of the friday
travellers take the day off, hence reducing the peak-morning load.
If you want the theory, look into "queuing theory". In particular the
mathematical modelling around "service time" compared to queue length.
You will find that as the utilisation of a system gets closer to its
capacity, the same sized increase in utilisation causes a markedly
non-linear increase in queuing (or journey) time. So, when roads are 90%
an increase in traffice of 2 or 3 percent causes an increase in journey
times.
However, when roads are running at 95% capacity, the same increase
in traffic causes a much, much greater delay. A side effect is that
the time needed to clear traffic after an incident also increases
hugely when there's very little spare road capacity.
--
http://thisreallyismyhost.99k.org/0620101214005723351.php
bolta...@boltar.world
pete <no-one_...@notatthisaddress.com> wrote:
>non-linear increase in queuing (or journey) time. So, when roads are 90%
>an increase in traffice of 2 or 3 percent causes an increase in journey
>times.
>However, when roads are running at 95% capacity, the same increase
>in traffic causes a much, much greater delay. A side effect is that
Didn't know that, but it would explain why there can be queues for no
apparent reason when there appears to be only slightly more cars on the
road that at another time when there were much fewer queues.
B2003
GT
news:idiop5$jl2$1...@speranza.aioe.org...
There's no way I'm letting a 3-year old walk to nursery on his own. Not even
the last 20 yards. its supposed to be a 20 limit along there, but even the
police cars cruise past at over 30 (and yes, I phoned to complain).
Besides - I have to take him into the nursery and do the shoes and coat
palava + he can't reach the sign-in sheet!
Getting out of bed earlier won't change the times that the school and
nursery accept children! The nursery starts at 9am and they complain if you
take kids in before 8:50. I have to leave them and then drive the 30-40+
minutes to work and I'm supposed to start at 9:30. My work are
'understanding'!
bolta...@boltar.world
"GT" <a@b.c> wrote:
>Getting out of bed earlier won't change the times that the school and
>nursery accept children! The nursery starts at 9am and they complain if you
>take kids in before 8:50. I have to leave them and then drive the 30-40+
>minutes to work and I'm supposed to start at 9:30. My work are
>'understanding'!
Fair enough. But how does he get home then , or does he have to stay there
until 6pm or whever you get back from work?
B2003
Nightjar
When I went to infants' school (I'm now a pensioner), the mothers ran an
informal rota to pick up children at specific points and walk them the
rest of the way into school and back again after. These days they call
it a walking bus and seem to think it is something new.
Colin Bignell
GT
news:idis7p$rkj$1...@speranza.aioe.org...
'er in doors collects them, but can't always drop them off - she works some
mornings.
FrengaX
I have no idea of the numbers involved, but there's a significant
number of people who have to weekly commute from their home to where
they happen to be working. This may be contractors/consultants, whose
work moves around from contract to contract, or permanent staff whose
job has moved, yet they prefer the weekly commute/staying away from
home than moving their whole family to a new location. When I've been
doing the Monday morning trip up the M6, a significant number of the
cars are repmobile types with a number of shirts hanging in the back,
thus reinforcing my theory.
Friday evenings are even worse with all those folk going home, plus
the weekend getaways.
Clive George
Under bloater's scheme, you just need to drop the kid half a mile away.
Doesn't he have legs?
Mark Goodge
>
>If you want the theory, look into "queuing theory". In particular the
>mathematical modelling around "service time" compared to queue length.
>You will find that as the utilisation of a system gets closer to its
>capacity, the same sized increase in utilisation causes a markedly
>non-linear increase in queuing (or journey) time. So, when roads are 90%
>an increase in traffice of 2 or 3 percent causes an increase in journey
>times.
>However, when roads are running at 95% capacity, the same increase
>in traffic causes a much, much greater delay. A side effect is that
>the time needed to clear traffic after an incident also increases
>hugely when there's very little spare road capacity.
That's also why the anti-road arguments that improvements aren't worth it
as "they just shift the queue to the next worst bottleneck" are specious.
An improvement of only a few percent in the capacity of a road that is
reaching its limit will generate a significant benefit in throughput. In
some cases, such an improvement can be obtained simply by moving a few
white lines.
Mark
--
Blog: http://mark.goodge.co.uk
Stuff: http://www.good-stuff.co.uk
Mark Goodge
typed:
>I have no idea of the numbers involved, but there's a significant
>number of people who have to weekly commute from their home to where
>they happen to be working. This may be contractors/consultants, whose
>work moves around from contract to contract, or permanent staff whose
>job has moved, yet they prefer the weekly commute/staying away from
>home than moving their whole family to a new location. When I've been
>doing the Monday morning trip up the M6, a significant number of the
>cars are repmobile types with a number of shirts hanging in the back,
>thus reinforcing my theory.
>
>Friday evenings are even worse with all those folk going home, plus
>the weekend getaways.
Fridays, though, tend to have the load spread out more than Monday
mornings. That's because it's more culturally acceptable to finish early on
a Friday than it is to start late on a Monday. And finish times in general
tend to be more variable than start times.
The Medway Handyman
We have hundreds of contractors around here working on the Isle of Grain,
Monday mornings are murder.
Apparently there are more RTC's on a Wednesday than any other day. I wonder
why that is?
--
Dave - The Medway Handyman
www.medwayhandyman.co.uk
Chris Bartram
Wed/Thurs. Monday & Friday not so bad.
GT
news:UdqdnSndqcKvgGDR...@brightview.co.uk...
No, its OK - that was just to encourage lazy women - I'm a man, so I'm not
included in that. I presume everyone who lives within half-a-mile of the
schools are also excluded from the on-street parking bans too?!
JNugent
> <bolta...@boltar.world> wrote:
>> On Mon, 6 Dec 2010 10:57:56 -0000
>> "GT"<a@b.c> wrote:
>>> I'm sorry, but you'll have to include me in that too - I take the car,
>>> drop the boy off at school, then continue to my work. If I walked to
>>> school, then home again for my car I'd be about 45 minutes late for work!!
>> Why can't he walk there on his own or get the bus?
> Sorry, should have said *boys*, but to answer your question directly:
> because they are 3 and 6 and have to cross 2 main roads!
And even more directly: Why should they?
Mr Pounder
<bolta...@boltar.world> wrote in message
news:idicup$ogq$1...@speranza.aioe.org...
> Compared to other weekday mornings that is. Are there people who only work
> mondays? Or is the morning commute one day a week enough for them and the
> rest of the week they take the bus or are they simply still suffering from
> w/e hangovers and so drive around at 20mph everywhere causing queues? I
> just
> don't get it.
>
> B2003
A lot of people work away from home - hence the traffic.
Friday is the coming home day - hence the traffic.
I used to leave in the early hours of the morning; but I was stupid and got
no thanks for it.
Mr Pounder
>
>
Harry Bloomfield
> Compared to other weekday mornings that is. Are there people who only work
> mondays? Or is the morning commute one day a week enough for them and the
> rest of the week they take the bus or are they simply still suffering from
> w/e hangovers and so drive around at 20mph everywhere causing queues? I just
> don't get it.
>
> B2003
Monday mornings and Friday afternoons are the worst. I put it down to
the fact that some people will be travelling to places where they will
stay for the entire week in - lots of people do that, including myself
at variuos times in my life. I'm now home every night of the week.
--
Regards,
Harry (M1BYT) (L)
http://www.ukradioamateur.co.uk
Adrian
sounding much like they were saying:
> Monday mornings and Friday afternoons are the worst. I put it down to
> the fact that some people will be travelling to places where they will
> stay for the entire week in - lots of people do that, including myself
> at variuos times in my life. I'm now home every night of the week.
The "Go away for the weekend" traffic seems to be concentrated to Friday
evenings, but the "Come back from the weekend" traffic seems to be split
between Monday morning and Sunday evening.
Harry Bloomfield
> I travel to Sheffield by train once a week and it's noticeable how much
> busier the trains are on Mondays and Fridays. I can understand Friday
> nights because it's people going away for the weekend, but why Monday
> mornings? Surely the weekenders would have come home on Sunday night? Perhaps
> there are a lot of people who work away from home suring the week?
I took particular notice yesterday (Friday) - there was a gradual build
up of lots of extra Friday traffic, starting at around 1 PM. I saw
queues which would simply not be there the rest of the week.
As I'm on the road much of the day every day, with usually some choice
as to where and when I go, I tend to restrict my travel on Friday
afternoons to shorter distances, rather than waste time in traffic.
Derek G.
>I travel to Sheffield by train once a week and it's noticeable how much
>busier the trains are on Mondays and Fridays. I can understand Friday
>nights because it's people going away for the weekend, but why Monday
>mornings? Surely the weekenders would have come home on Sunday night? Perhaps
>there are a lot of people who work away from home suring the week?
Nowadays there is a hapless, itinerant, section of the population I
call the "Bed and breakfast flexitimers", (self explanatory I think).
These people work late for long hours during the week on flexitime
because they are living on supermarket scran in a grotty B&B or poxy,
miserable (and nowadays as like as not decrepit) lodge, and have
nothing better to do of an evening.
They build up enough flexitime Tues, Weds, Thurs, to be able to knock
off early on Friday and bugger off home, and schlepp their sorry noses
back to the grindstone`sometime Monday morning.
This accounts for the phenomena you have observed.
Derek
Steve Firth
> > They build up enough flexitime Tues, Weds, Thurs, to be able to knock
> > off early on Friday and bugger off home, and schlepp their sorry noses
> > back to the grindstone`sometime Monday morning.
> >
> > This accounts for the phenomena you have observed.
>
> I suspect you're correct. Poor bastards.
Lot of northerners have to commute to jobs in the South, hence you will
find all transport busy Sunday night/Monday morning. Then they tend to
potter back home over an extended period so less of a crush on Friday,
but I've heard Great Western/Virgin plonking on that they don't have
enough rolling stock to cope with Fridays and the M1/M6 are gridlocked -
and I don't think it's all, or even mostly, Londoners heading for their
bijou weekend apartment in Doncaster.
For many years I was in the odd position of heading to Newcastle on Tyne
every week in order to work, and observing all the Geordies heading
south for the same reason. When I got up there everyone told me there
was no work in Geordyland - and they were puzzled when I pointed out
that I was there to work. As you know, I'm not underpaid.
The economy seems generally fucked with a real shortage of skills in
some sectors and a need for grunt work with no one local to do it in
others.
Peter Hill
But almost everyone is moving on a Friday, very few leave it to
Saturday morning. Saturday is bad after the shoppers get up and out on
the road. On Saturdays Radlett to Watford is a few min at 9am but can
take 2hrs after 10am.
The return journey about 1/2 have done it on Sunday Night as they were
weekend getaways and not go homes that leave it until Monday morning.
I go against the flow, it's far far easier. About 12 times a year I go
up (up to London) the M1 on Friday night, the traffic coming out of
London is stationary. I time my run late, later that all the going
home from work traffic and just before the road works being put out so
I do 120miles in under 2 hours (except for a few miles at each end
it's DC / M-way all the way). Sunday evening it's the other way round,
heavy traffic into London and light leaving, even lighter once north
of MK and then M6 junct.
--
Peter Hill
Spamtrap reply domain as per NNTP-Posting-Host in header
Can of worms - what every fisherman wants.
Can of worms - what every PC owner gets!
john wright
> Huge<Hu...@nowhere.much.invalid> wrote:
>
>>> They build up enough flexitime Tues, Weds, Thurs, to be able to knock
>>> off early on Friday and bugger off home, and schlepp their sorry noses
>>> back to the grindstone`sometime Monday morning.
>>>
>>> This accounts for the phenomena you have observed.
>>
>> I suspect you're correct. Poor bastards.
>
> Lot of northerners have to commute to jobs in the South, hence you will
> find all transport busy Sunday night/Monday morning. Then they tend to
> potter back home over an extended period so less of a crush on Friday,
> but I've heard Great Western/Virgin plonking on that they don't have
> enough rolling stock to cope with Fridays and the M1/M6 are gridlocked -
> and I don't think it's all, or even mostly, Londoners heading for their
> bijou weekend apartment in Doncaster.
>
> For many years I was in the odd position of heading to Newcastle on Tyne
> every week in order to work, and observing all the Geordies heading
> south for the same reason. When I got up there everyone told me there
> was no work in Geordyland - and they were puzzled when I pointed out
> that I was there to work. As you know, I'm not underpaid.
Perhaps that was the usual "skills gap" - i.e. you had skills the
locals did not have and the locals felt there was no work for the skills
they had. The economy will never be as flexible as politicians like to
see it while children need schooling and house prices not only
perpetually soar but are totally uneven across the country.
> The economy seems generally fucked with a real shortage of skills in
> some sectors and a need for grunt work with no one local to do it in
> others.
The general view amongst people I've talked to is that apprenticeships
should never have been undervalued the way they have and the
polytechnics provided a more than useful function as they were - much
more so than as universities. That represents the ambition of the senior
staff more than anything else.
My brother did *very* well on his apprenticeship/polytechnic based
education, becoming an electrician.
Whilst there is no doubt we need an educated workforce we also need one
that is diverse as well.
--
John Wright
Blasphemy - a victimless crime.