Microfilters (for BT Broadband/Homehub)??
Allan
I think it comes with 2 microfilters.
On the basis that there should be a filter on each phone in the house
(she has 3), I think I need to get a third one.
Can you get them reasonably easily (e.g. Homebase appear to doa Commtel
model), and are they acceptable, or do I need a BT supplied filter?
TIA
Allan
v.me...@i.do.not.believe.it
Why aren't phones made with the microfilters built in ?
Peter
>Can you get them reasonably easily (e.g. Homebase appear to doa Commtel
>model), and are they acceptable, or do I need a BT supplied filter?
You should be able to get them quite easily, though prices in some chains
may be excessive. No, do not need anything specific from BT to match. I
would consider buying a couple (one as a spare /future use) from a firm,
such as Solwise (.co.uk) which isn't excessive on either charge for the
product, or cost of delivery.
The Natural Philosopher
because if you totally filter the socket before splitting to extensions,
you don't need more than one filter anyway.
Nevermind, in a few years it will ALL be VOIP anyway, and you will
simply plug a set of standard phones into your router.
Andrew Benham
You don't need BT to supply them.
I tend to use microfilters from
http://www.adslnation.com/products/index.php
as they work OK and get good reviews.
Peter Crosland
news:i4bq2k$b2g$1...@speranza.aioe.org...
They are first class and in fact I would go so far as to say that they are
the canine gonads!. I recently had the opportunity to dissect one of the
filters supplied by BT with their Business Hub AKA 2Wire 2700HGV. Although
the components were of reasonable quality the design was poor compared with
the ADSL Nation ones.
Peter Crosland
Graham.
"The Natural Philosopher" <t...@invalid.invalid> wrote in message news:i4birq$24t$4...@news.albasani.net...
> v.me...@i.do.not.believe.it wrote:
>> On Mon, 16 Aug 2010 12:30:06 +0100, Allan <inv...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>
>>> Just ordered BT Broadband/Homehub for my Mum, arriving next week.
>>> I think it comes with 2 microfilters.
>>> On the basis that there should be a filter on each phone in the house (she has 3), I think I need to get a third one.
>>> Can you get them reasonably easily (e.g. Homebase appear to doa Commtel model), and are they acceptable, or do I need a BT
>>> supplied filter?
>>> TIA
>>> Allan
>>
>> Why aren't phones made with the microfilters built in ?
>
> because if you totally filter the socket before splitting to extensions, you don't need more than one filter anyway.
Correct, and despite most ISPs not mentioning it, a single central filter is
always better than filtering multiple extension sockets.
If your incoming line goes to an NTE5 master socket, a replacement
filtered faceplate (not an i-plate) implements this neatly.
--
Graham.
%Profound_observation%
DC
In what specific way ?
--
The End
Mark
I'd recommend this too. It works very well.
I would not, however, recommend BT broadband. Everyone I know who has
used them has been very dissatisfied and most have switched to other
ISPs ASAP.
--
(\__/) M.
(='.'=) Due to the amount of spam posted via googlegroups and
(")_(") their inaction to the problem. I am blocking some articles
posted from there. If you wish your postings to be seen by
everyone you will need use a different method of posting.
Peter Crosland
news:ekgj66tha18759j3b...@4ax.com...
Perhaps inferior would be a better word than poor. However the main
difference is the ADSL Nation ones are an active design using transisters to
filter the signals.
Peter Crosland
Sir Micheal Rake
>
> Perhaps inferior would be a better word than poor. However the main
> difference is the ADSL Nation ones are an active design using
> transisters to filter the signals.
>
> Peter Crosland
Did you mean: transistors?
When attempting to speak authoritatively on a subject, please spell the
key word correctly. Thank you.
John
> On Mon, 16 Aug 2010 22:22:38 +0100, "Graham." <m...@privacy.net> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> "The Natural Philosopher" <t...@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
>> news:i4birq$24t$4...@news.albasani.net...
>>> v.me...@i.do.not.believe.it wrote:
>>>> On Mon, 16 Aug 2010 12:30:06 +0100, Allan
>>>> <inv...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>>>
>
> I would not, however, recommend BT broadband. Everyone I know who has
> used them has been very dissatisfied and most have switched to other
> ISPs ASAP.
And yet here I am, having been a beta tester for BT Internet since its
inception (at a time when 14.4kbps dial-up modems were considered
blisteringly fast), still with them after all that time, and having had just
one problem in all that time - and that was dealt with very quickly and
efficiently. Nothing whatsoever wrong with BT Broadband except perhaps
they're slightly on the expensive side.
Mark
Lucky you. However the majority of people do not share your opinion.
The Natural Philosopher
He couldn't have meant transistors because ADSL nation filters are
passive like everyone else's.
Least ways mine is, and their specs mention only passive components.
http://www.adslnation.com/products/xf-1e.php
"The XF-1e contains four high quality ferrite cores to ensure that
accurate frequency separation is achieved.
Accurate separation ensures that overspill is minimised. Overspill is
where the ADSL signal leaks in to the voice frequency range or speech
interferes with the ADSL signal. The high quality, low tolerance
components used in the XF-1e ensure that your ADSL service will run at
maximum performance and that your telephone calls will be free of
interference.
Designed to exceed the the BT SIN 346 v2.2 guidelines for UK
microfilters the XF-1e offers complete compatibility with BT services
such as CLI (Caller ID).
The XF-1e is designed for maximum compatibility with even the most
complex telephone equipment. Fully compatible with DECT cordless phones
and PABX systems."
You would have thought they would say if they were active.
I would say, its *probably* not legal to use active filters, anyway. And
there are good reason why that is so. They would likely be worse performers.
http://www.btwebworld.com/sinet/346v2p8.pdf
is the spec, and it doesn't specifically prohibit them, but the specs
would be hard to achieve with a powered active device, and I am not sure
where the power would come from. BT don't like other things than phones
drawing power.
But hey, It's Peter fucking killfiled Crosland. So all bets are off.
Andrew Benham
> He couldn't have meant transistors because ADSL nation filters are
> passive like everyone else's.
http://www.adslnation.com/support/filters.php
"The XF-1e uses transistors to actively remove the ADSL signal
from the telephone equipment."
Sir Micheal Rake
As do several others - but don't point that out to the doofus. Peter may
have fucked up his spelling, but at the back of the class once more is
the group idiot: 'The Natural Phillosopher'. Nobody likes a know-all, but
everyone laughs at a know-fuckall.
John
> On Tue, 17 Aug 2010 10:39:01 +0100, "John" <g...@way.com> wrote:
>
>> Mark wrote:
>>> On Mon, 16 Aug 2010 22:22:38 +0100, "Graham." <m...@privacy.net>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "The Natural Philosopher" <t...@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
>>>> news:i4birq$24t$4...@news.albasani.net...
>>>>> v.me...@i.do.not.believe.it wrote:
>>>>>> On Mon, 16 Aug 2010 12:30:06 +0100, Allan
>>>>>> <inv...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>
>>> I would not, however, recommend BT broadband. Everyone I know who
>>> has used them has been very dissatisfied and most have switched to
>>> other ISPs ASAP.
>>
>> And yet here I am, having been a beta tester for BT Internet since
>> its inception (at a time when 14.4kbps dial-up modems were considered
>> blisteringly fast), still with them after all that time, and having
>> had just one problem in all that time - and that was dealt with very
>> quickly and efficiently. Nothing whatsoever wrong with BT Broadband
>> except perhaps they're slightly on the expensive side.
>
> Lucky you. However the majority of people do not share your opinion.
I'd suggest that the majority do. As the squeaky wheel gets the oil, so you
only hear from people who have complaints. The vast majority of BT Broadband
customers are silent and stay where they are because they are happy with the
product and service they get.
The Natural Philosopher
transistor radios' we used to get where three of them were soldered into
the board, but did nothing. :-)
Last place I would attempt active filtering is at the end of a BT line...
The Natural Philosopher
Oh dear. Cant spell philosopher and wants to be a knight.
Kill file for you.
Graham.
>>>
>>>They are first class and in fact I would go so far as to say that they are
>>>the canine gonads!. I recently had the opportunity to dissect one of the
>>>filters supplied by BT with their Business Hub AKA 2Wire 2700HGV. Although
>>>the components were of reasonable quality the design was poor compared with
>>>the ADSL Nation ones.
>>
>> In what specific way
>
> Perhaps inferior would be a better word than poor. However the main difference is the ADSL Nation ones are an active design using
> transisters to filter the signals.
When I get a moment I will sketch out a schematic, but a brief inspection
of the PCB suggested to me that the transistors sniffed the RF and held two relays
closed which each switched in part of the filter.
Or to put it another way the filter was partially switched out when ADSL was
not present.
The only advantage I could see was perhaps more "top" in the POTS
response when your modem was switched off.
1) not that I have ever noticed any lack of HF response using a filter
2) not a lot of use in an "always on" situation.
I am willing to be corrected on how these things work.
Does anyone know?
--
Graham.
%Profound_observation%
The Natural Philosopher
usually 'one way'
I cant off hand think of a way to have a two wire bidirectional filter
that is stable and bi directional and cheaper or better than a carefully
crafted suite of coils and capacitors ad resistors. In fact this sort of
circuit is universally passive.
Let's face it, the main purpose of the filter is to stop random
telephone impedances disturbing the ADSL frequencies. If you want
better, add more coils and capacitors.
Graham.
"The Natural Philosopher" <t...@invalid.invalid> wrote in message news:i4f3i3$b38$1...@news.albasani.net...
And what better way to switch lumped L-C networks than with a relay
or two as in my devices.
But as you imply, once you have designed a better filter network, why would
you want to switch bits out?
--
Graham.
%Profound_observation%
The Natural Philosopher
like Crosland and Little Lord Fauntleroy?
Seems an eminently reasonable and moral business position to take, to me.
;-)
Sir Micheal Rake
> Oh dear. Cant spell philosopher and wants to be a knight.
>
> Kill file for you.
A fair cop, but still does not deflect the fact you are a know-fuckall
liar.
Mark
How come they regularly come near the bottom of customer satisfaction
surveys then? I accept your point that most satisfied customers are
silent, but this effect would not favour any one ISP over another.
This is coupled with the fact that /everyone/ I know personally who
used BT broadband was extremely dissatisifed with them and all, bar
one, has left. My mother was litterally in tears over the problems
she had with BT broadband. She was left without broadband for weeks
and, as far as I can tell, this was entirely avoidable. In addition
they told her a complete load of bullshit like she could not use
wireless and wired connections to her router at the same time!!!!
Sir Micheal Rake
> How come they regularly come near the bottom of customer satisfaction
> surveys then?
Because they are probably the largest provider in the UK and the sheer
scale of their customer base gives rise to a higher statistic? Because
some ISP's seem to partake in bullshiting and nefarious 'biggin up' of
their so called 'excellent' credentials - notably AAISP, IDNET & ZEN
>
> This is coupled with the fact that /everyone/ I know personally who used
> BT broadband was extremely dissatisfied with them and all
So you recommend who?
I've yet to find a single ISP in the UK that are any better than 'shit'
when a fault springs up - with Newnet being nearly an exception. In
effect you are just talking about 'shades of shit' in such circumstances.
Howard Neil
On 18/08/2010 09:54, Mark wrote:
> How come they regularly come near the bottom of customer satisfaction
> surveys then? I accept your point that most satisfied customers are
> silent, but this effect would not favour any one ISP over another.
>
> This is coupled with the fact that /everyone/ I know personally who
> used BT broadband was extremely dissatisifed with them and all, bar
> one, has left. My mother was litterally in tears over the problems
> she had with BT broadband. She was left without broadband for weeks
> and, as far as I can tell, this was entirely avoidable. In addition
> they told her a complete load of bullshit like she could not use
> wireless and wired connections to her router at the same time!!!!
If it is of any help, I run a small business trying to solve the
computer problems that people have. It seems that the majority of my
customers (mostly people with very little computer knowledge) have BT
Broadband and most of them are happy with it.
Those that dislike it (and, in some cases, who have moved to another
ISP) are mainly concerned about the appalling customer service. They
particularly dislike trying to explain concepts to someone in Mumbai who
is just trying to link what they are being told with a computer screen.
Remember, these customers have absolutely no knowledge of the correct
terms to use and just try to describe the problem in context with their
normal life. There is an instant communication breakdown and many
frustrations.
--
Howard Neil
The Natural Philosopher
It is as you say, the execrable support you don't get.
I found the same on voice.
The openreach engineers who come to fix wires are mostly excellent. Its
fighting through the bulllshit barriers to get them ..simple answer -
use 3rd party ISP's who have the same access to open reach that BT does,
at far less hassle.
Mark
<s...@bt.com> wrote:
>On Wed, 18 Aug 2010 09:54:13 +0100, Mark wrote:
>
>> How come they regularly come near the bottom of customer satisfaction
>> surveys then?
>Because they are probably the largest provider in the UK and the sheer
>scale of their customer base gives rise to a higher statistic?
The satisfaction surveys compare the ratio of satisfied customers to
unsatisfied (or, to be pedantic, average out the individual scores).
Therefore size is irrelevent.
>>
>> This is coupled with the fact that /everyone/ I know personally who used
>> BT broadband was extremely dissatisfied with them and all
>
>So you recommend who?
>
>I've yet to find a single ISP in the UK that are any better than 'shit'
>when a fault springs up - with Newnet being nearly an exception. In
>effect you are just talking about 'shades of shit' in such circumstances.
No ISP is perfect but there is a significant variation in quality.
Personally I would chose an ISP at the better end of the scale, rather
than at the worst. I am wouldn't rely on one recommendation from
usenet (even mine). Look at the reviews and choose for yourself.
Mark
Customer service is an important part of the whole package. I don't
believe you can decouple it from the rest.
Sir Micheal Rake
> The satisfaction surveys compare the ratio of satisfied customers to
> unsatisfied (or, to be pedantic, average out the individual scores).
> Therefore size is irrelevent.
I disagree. The likelihood of satisfied customers (aka 'anoraks') of gay
little nieche ISP's like AAISP, ZEN, IDNET etc leaving good reviews -v-
the likelyhood of the average BT, Plusnet, TalkTalk customer doing the
same?
People tend to whine when the chips are down and therefore xcale must say
something.
Tell you what, why don't BT just turn off their network for a week and
then you'll see how good your ISP's are and how much money they have
invested in providing internet connectivity :-)
The Natural Philosopher
>
> Customer service is an important part of the whole package. I don't
> believe you can decouple it from the rest.
Tell that to BT :-)
Looking back, the 15% more I pay for everything that has good support ad
hassle free service, from my shoe supplier, to my PC supplier, to where
I get my cars serviced..or my ISP..is worth it.
Its not just the cost, itself, its the huge impact it has on other issues.
Time spent arguing with suppliers is time not spent making money etc.
One piece of kit that you simply throw away because its cheaper than
spending weeks of lawyers letters and court time..pays for 6 units you
might have bought cheaper.
I would say frustration with customer services is the MAJOR reason for
churning.
People will put up with low bandwith, and other restrictions but they
wont put up with a problem that is not being addressed.
Mark
<t...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>Mark wrote:
>>
>> Customer service is an important part of the whole package. I don't
>> believe you can decouple it from the rest.
>
>Tell that to BT :-)
>
>Looking back, the 15% more I pay for everything that has good support ad
>hassle free service, from my shoe supplier, to my PC supplier, to where
>I get my cars serviced..or my ISP..is worth it.
>
>Its not just the cost, itself, its the huge impact it has on other issues.
>
>Time spent arguing with suppliers is time not spent making money etc.
Agreed. This is exactly the reason why I would not even buy a "good"
product from a "bad" company.
>One piece of kit that you simply throw away because its cheaper than
>spending weeks of lawyers letters and court time..pays for 6 units you
>might have bought cheaper.
>
>I would say frustration with customer services is the MAJOR reason for
>churning.
>
>People will put up with low bandwith, and other restrictions but they
>wont put up with a problem that is not being addressed.
Some companies never learn though. They will give major discounts for
new customers but fail to notice they are losing many existing
customers due to poor service. It's much easier to keep customers
than attract new ones.
Mark
<s...@bt.com> wrote:
>On Wed, 18 Aug 2010 11:02:26 +0100, Mark wrote:
>
>> The satisfaction surveys compare the ratio of satisfied customers to
>> unsatisfied (or, to be pedantic, average out the individual scores).
>> Therefore size is irrelevent.
>
>I disagree. The likelihood of satisfied customers (aka 'anoraks') of gay
>little nieche ISP's like AAISP, ZEN, IDNET etc leaving good reviews -v-
>the likelyhood of the average BT, Plusnet, TalkTalk customer doing the
>same?
Then we'll have to agree to disagree. I can see no reason why a
higher proportion of happy customers of small ISPs would fail to
review them than those of a large ISP.
Even if you accept there is such an effect how do you explain the
difference in ratings between different /large/ ISPs (or different
small ISPs for that matter)? For example why should PN rate more
highly than BT?
The Natural Philosopher
I have to disagree. That's why BT is running all the Adam and Mum shite.
They spend money on that kind of crap, pull in new customers, and that's
that. With luck the 10% they lose in 18 months because they haven't a
single monkey that knows what ADSL means on the end of the line, is
neither here nor there.
Marketing is cheaper than support.
Bullshit is cheaper than quality.
Saying microfilters 'have two transistors' is cheaper than putting in 4
extra coils. WAY cheaper.
Some idiot will believe it means something special, and buy it.
Sir Micheal Rake
> Bullshit is cheaper than quality.
>
Which explains why you have such a high posting rate here.
alexd
Micheal Rake chose the tried and tested strategy of:
> some ISP's seem to partake in bullshiting and nefarious 'biggin up' of
> their so called 'excellent' credentials - notably AAISP, IDNET & ZEN
Cite?
--
<http://ale.cx/> (AIM:troffasky) (UnSoEs...@ale.cx)
21:45:18 up 4 days, 32 min, 5 users, load average: 0.00, 0.02, 0.04
Qua illic est accuso, illic est a vindicatum
The Natural Philosopher
> Meanwhile, at the uk.telecom.broadband Job Justification Hearings, Sir
> Micheal Rake chose the tried and tested strategy of:
>
>> some ISP's seem to partake in bullshiting and nefarious 'biggin up' of
>> their so called 'excellent' credentials - notably AAISP, IDNET & ZEN
>
> Cite?
>
Well I found IDnet to deliver exactly what they said on the tin, no more
and no less.
Not the cheapest, but matched my requirements perfectly.
The general comments I read on te sites I checked also seemed balanced
an fair.
Sir Micheal Rake
> Meanwhile, at the uk.telecom.broadband Job Justification Hearings, Sir
> Micheal Rake chose the tried and tested strategy of:
>
>> some ISP's seem to partake in bullshiting and nefarious 'biggin up' of
>> their so called 'excellent' credentials - notably AAISP, IDNET & ZEN
>
> Cite?
My own personal opinion and based on experience of dealing with these so
called 'elite' ISPs. I hold the view that Thinkbroadband is easily
'tainted'.
I believe *you* are one such contributor Alex. When an ISP starts
offering referral 'rewards' they will encourage link spamming in forums
and general abuse.
IDNET appear to have won the 2010 award for lamest ISP to resolve a
fault. There was quite a long thread recently on a well known forum {+
which oddly enough 'vanished' into thin air +} where they took 21 days to
fix a simple fault. For 14 of those days the fault was directly in the
hands of one of their directors, Simon Davies. It materialised he was
about as useful as taking a long shit - lamer than a one legged fucking
horse, in fact. Still, some people continue to wear those shit coloured
spectacles.
Graham Murray
> Mark wrote:
>>
>> Customer service is an important part of the whole package. I don't
>> believe you can decouple it from the rest.
>
> Tell that to BT :-)
BT should already know that because they offer "the most complete
broadband package"[1] :)
[1] According to their current TV adverts anyway.
The Natural Philosopher
> The Natural Philosopher <t...@invalid.invalid> writes:
>
>> Mark wrote:
>>> Customer service is an important part of the whole package. I don't
>>> believe you can decouple it from the rest.
>> Tell that to BT :-)
>
> BT should already know that because they offer "the most complete
> broadband package"[1] :)
support is not part of that package.
>
> [1] According to their current TV adverts anyway.
if you believe adverts, you are already lost.
alexd
Micheal Rake chose the tried and tested strategy of:
> On Wed, 18 Aug 2010 21:46:10 +0100, alexd wrote:
>
>> Meanwhile, at the uk.telecom.broadband Job Justification Hearings, Sir
>> Micheal Rake chose the tried and tested strategy of:
>>
>>> some ISP's seem to partake in bullshiting and nefarious 'biggin up' of
>>> their so called 'excellent' credentials - notably AAISP, IDNET & ZEN
>> Cite?
> My own personal opinion and based on experience of dealing with these so
> called 'elite' ISPs. I hold the view that Thinkbroadband is easily
> 'tainted'.
Let's clarify something here: "bullshiting and nefarious 'biggin up'" refers
to astroturfing, but you can't even come close to proving that they might
have been engaged in it? Surely the best place to be reporting this kind of
behaviour is to the owners of Thinkbroadband, not spraying it across Usenet.
If the organisations you're referring to wanted to be complete cunts about
it you could find yourself on the end of a libel writ, so perhaps you should
be a little bit more circumspect about what you say if you've got nothing to
back it up with.
> I believe *you* are one such contributor Alex. When an ISP starts
> offering referral 'rewards' they will encourage link spamming in forums
> and general abuse.
If you're intimating that I've been been astroturfing for those three then
you're mistaken. I've never used said ISPs, and all I use Thinkbroadband for
is the odd speed test.
--
<http://ale.cx/> (AIM:troffasky) (UnSoEs...@ale.cx)
19:34:26 up 4 days, 22:21, 6 users, load average: 0.01, 0.01, 0.00
Sir Micheal Rake
> Meanwhile, at the uk.telecom.broadband Job Justification Hearings, Sir
> Micheal Rake chose the tried and tested strategy of:
>
>> On Wed, 18 Aug 2010 21:46:10 +0100, alexd wrote:
>>
>>> Meanwhile, at the uk.telecom.broadband Job Justification Hearings, Sir
>>> Micheal Rake chose the tried and tested strategy of:
>>>
>>>> some ISP's seem to partake in bullshiting and nefarious 'biggin up'
>>>> of their so called 'excellent' credentials - notably AAISP, IDNET &
>>>> ZEN
>>> Cite?
>> My own personal opinion and based on experience of dealing with these
>> so called 'elite' ISPs. I hold the view that Thinkbroadband is easily
>> 'tainted'.
>
> Let's clarify something here: "bullshiting and nefarious 'biggin up'"
> refers to astroturfing, but you can't even come close to proving that
> they might have been engaged in it?
I suggest that *you* have taken part in it - and continue to do so. If
you don't like that, fucking sue me gay boy.
alexd
Micheal Rake chose the tried and tested strategy of:
> If you don't like that, fucking sue me gay boy.
http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2004/3/19/
--
<http://ale.cx/> (AIM:troffasky) (UnSoEs...@ale.cx)
21:07:45 up 5 days, 23:55, 6 users, load average: 0.28, 0.31, 0.21
The Natural Philosopher
> Meanwhile, at the uk.telecom.broadband Job Justification Hearings, Sir
> Micheal Rake chose the tried and tested strategy of:
>
>> If you don't like that, fucking sue me gay boy.
>
> http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2004/3/19/
>
Might be worth removing from my killfile just to watch the show.
Trolls today, just ain't what they used to be. No stomach, the kids of
today.
Why, when I were a lad... ;-)
Sir Micheal Rake
Said the 'dodgy' Doctor Michael Jerrard Black - born 3rd Oct 1971 and
resident at Black Barn, Pyehurn Farm, Pyehurn Lane, Horsford, Norwich,
Norfolk, NR10 3DY.
How is Audrey - used to be Muir didn't it?
Like the sexed up and made up qualifications Michael. Portsmouth Uni (aka
Polytechnic) tell me you never did any kind of masters there and as for
the Russian University - you are fucking joking, right?
Dickhead.