Are Freeview PVRs a dying breed?

[Jeff Layman]

Has any company brought out a decent, reliable PVR in the past few
years? I was reading an article about the "forthcoming" Manhattan T4-R
which seems it keeps getting put back. See
<https://www.cordbusters.co.uk/manhattan-t4-t4r-freeview-boxes-delayed/>.

Apart from Manhattan, the only PVRs which are easily available nowadays
are from Humax or Panasonic, and the models are very limited.
Panasonic's in particular, seem to be available only in combination with
DVD/Blu-Ray, and aren't recent. Humax's Aura range appear to be ok,
although some issues are raised in reviews. It also has, IMHO, an
association with Google I could do without (and as it uses Android that
isn't going to change).

My Panasonic DMR-HWT130 is now over 9 years old, and although it works
well (with an external timer to disconnect it from the power every day
for 15 minutes, or else it can lock up!), it must surely be on limited
time. Anyone here using an Aura without problem? I had a Humax 9200T for
years, and it was fine, but it's YouView replacement was unreliable to
say the least.

--

Jeff

[SH]

If its Freeview you are after, have you considered a siliconduist
HDHomeRun with its 4 tuners? you will require a home network though

IF any of your TV's are "smart", you can download and run the HDHomeRun
App or if you use Plex or VLC.

If you have a NAS, you can either buy a licence from SiliconDust for teh
ability to record to HDD or you can roll your own using PLex, MythTV,
Emby, Channels, etc.

[Brian Gaff]

Myself if somebody included the talking features we have now, into a pvr, it
would suit me fine. I don't need the picture, but nobody ever did oone
except the TVonics, which are of course no longer made, though one company
is selling refurbished ones, but I feel stocks are getting low. These have
ssds, and replacement capacitors and updated software. Brian

--

--:
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...
bri...@blueyonder.co.uk
Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
"Jeff Layman" <Je...@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
news:uere2f$1qc0a$1...@dont-email.me...

[Jeff Layman]

It all seems rather complicated compared to a standard PVR. No doubt
once it's set up it's pretty straightforward.I couldn't see a HDHomeRun
App available for my Panasonic Smart TV.

Out of interest, are the recordings you make MP4 files or something else?

--

Jeff

[Scott]

On Mon, 25 Sep 2023 08:49:35 +0100, Jeff Layman <Je...@invalid.invalid>
wrote:

Have you checked for software updates?

I am having no issues with my Humax. Periodically they put rescue
machines on the market so this may be of interest to you.

[SH]

Records in MPG which is MPEG, but many NASses can transcode on the fly
upon demand or you can do a bulk one off conversion using Handbrake or
FFMPEG or something similar

[SH]

P.S this is a FAQ if you would like to know more...

https://www.silicondust.com/support/faq/

[SH]

On 25/09/2023 11:57, SH wrote:

and if its Freesat you are interested in, then look at the Kathrein EXIP
414 (4 tuners) or the Kathrein EXIP 418 (8 tuners)

VLC, DVB viewer, Kodi, Channels and various others can be used to view
Sat>IP streams. I expect MythTV, BeyondTV, NextPVR, Plex etc can record
to hard disc but may need a plugin or two.

[SH]

and https://www.silicondust.com/dvr-service/#what

[NY]

"SH" <i.l...@spam.com> wrote in message news:uerfg8$1qi72$1...@dont-email.me...

> If you have a NAS, you can either buy a licence from SiliconDust for teh
> ability to record to HDD or you can roll your own using PLex, MythTV,
> Emby, Channels, etc.

I have a roll-your-own PVR setup: Raspberry Pi running TVHeadend with a
DVB-S2 tuner and a dual-tuner DVB-T2 tuner. I record to an external spinning
HDD, then copy from here to a Windows PC that runs Plex - that PC allows me
to edit out commercials and continuity, and has a large enough case to take
a 4 TB HDD for recorded TV.

It's a shame that Plex server (on Windows or Pi) and Plex client (eg on
Roku) are necessary. It would be so much easier if there was a PC
(Windows/Unix) which had a simple "ten-foot" UI and VLC, so you could
navigate directly to a folder and a file within it, and then play over the
network directly from the server, without all the pointless transcoding from
the MPEG/H264 .ts file to whatever format Plex client wants. Is there less
processor load on a client if it displays Plex format (with transcoding load
on the server) than if it decodes MPEG/H264 from a network share, where the
server is just sharing a raw .ts file with standard SAMBA protocol? Is that
why the Plex architecture is used?

[Tweed]

NY <m...@privacy.invalid> wrote:
> "SH" <i.l...@spam.com> wrote in message news:uerfg8$1qi72$1...@dont-email.me...
>> If you have a NAS, you can either buy a licence from SiliconDust for teh
>> ability to record to HDD or you can roll your own using PLex, MythTV,
>> Emby, Channels, etc.
>
> I have a roll-your-own PVR setup: Raspberry Pi running TVHeadend with a
> DVB-S2 tuner and a dual-tuner DVB-T2 tuner. I record to an external spinning
> HDD, then copy from here to a Windows PC that runs Plex - that PC allows me
> to edit out commercials and continuity, and has a large enough case to take
> a 4 TB HDD for recorded TV.
>
>

Do you get the time to watch the programmes after doing all that?

[Woody]

Yes they are because the manufacturers assume that everyone now has fast
broadband and will use iPlayer, ItvX etc etc to watch programmes they
have missed. However if you want to record something for posterity then
it needs a bit of technical know-how as is seen in the newsgroup. Your
average Joe Public wouldn't stand a chance.

[Jeff Layman]

This average JL doesn't stand much of a chance, either! :-(

--

Jeff

[R. Mark Clayton]

Probably because most TV's can record off air to a USB drive, even our small kitchen one (2016).

OTOH with BBC iPlayer or ITVX one can view missed programs at one's leisure, so I haven't used the feature for ages (used to record HIGNIFY if going out on Friday evening.

[Jeff Layman]

On 25/09/2023 18:19, R. Mark Clayton wrote:
> On Monday, 25 September 2023 at 08:49:40 UTC+1, Jeff Layman wrote:
>> Has any company brought out a decent, reliable PVR in the past few
>> years? I was reading an article about the "forthcoming" Manhattan T4-R
>> which seems it keeps getting put back. See
>> <https://www.cordbusters.co.uk/manhattan-t4-t4r-freeview-boxes-delayed/>.
>>
>> Apart from Manhattan, the only PVRs which are easily available nowadays
>> are from Humax or Panasonic, and the models are very limited.
>> Panasonic's in particular, seem to be available only in combination with
>> DVD/Blu-Ray, and aren't recent. Humax's Aura range appear to be ok,
>> although some issues are raised in reviews. It also has, IMHO, an
>> association with Google I could do without (and as it uses Android that
>> isn't going to change).
>>
>> My Panasonic DMR-HWT130 is now over 9 years old, and although it works
>> well (with an external timer to disconnect it from the power every day
>> for 15 minutes, or else it can lock up!), it must surely be on limited
>> time. Anyone here using an Aura without problem? I had a Humax 9200T for
>> years, and it was fine, but it's YouView replacement was unreliable to
>> say the least.
>>
>> --
>>
>> Jeff
>
> Probably because most TV's can record off air to a USB drive, even our small kitchen one (2016).

But in general they don't have two tuners, so you can't watch one
programme whilst recording another (I don't know if it's possible if you
have a freesat and freeview TV).

> OTOH with BBC iPlayer or ITVX one can view missed programs at one's leisure, so I haven't used the feature for ages (used to record HIGNIFY if going out on Friday evening.

I tend to agree, but I don't think that all programmes are available.
And that seems particularly true of the C4, C5, and other streams, where
programmes might be available for only a month after they were first
transmitted.

--

Jeff

[MikeS]

I know you said "in general" but my mid-range Panasonic TV has twin
Freeview and twin Freesat tuners. It just came that way rather than
being a deliberate choice by me so I have always assumed that this
facility must be fairly common.

[alan_m]

On 25/09/2023 16:31, Woody wrote:

> Yes they are because the manufacturers assume that everyone now has fast
> broadband and will use iPlayer, ItvX etc etc to watch programmes they
> have missed. However if you want to record something for posterity then
> it needs a bit of technical know-how as is seen in the newsgroup. Your
> average Joe Public wouldn't stand a chance.
>

My Enigma 2 PVR box running OpenVix can record the same as any other PVR
box. The recording can be exported over wired ethernet (or wi-fi) to a
PC where you have a choice of archiving media. BTW, I record mainly to
just jump through adverts or for things like F1 to avoid all the pundit
BS before and after the race.

--
mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk

[David Wade]

On 25/09/2023 16:31, Woody wrote:

I checked and for example, the more expensive Panasonics like mine still
are dual tuner with USB record. So yes you need to plug in an external
USB drive but it does most of what a standalone PVR does.

The LG range only seems to have only one Tuner so not as good...

... but pretty sure the market for standalone PVRs is rapidly shrinking.
Like many, most people don't see the need.

The Freeview agreement also runs out next year. Will the Freeview items
stop working at this point?

Dave

[Clive Page]

On 25/09/2023 16:31, Woody wrote:

> Yes they are because the manufacturers assume that everyone now has fast broadband and will use iPlayer, ItvX etc etc to watch programmes they have missed. However if you want to record something for posterity then it needs a bit of technical know-how as is seen in the newsgroup. Your average Joe Public wouldn't stand a chance.

I think they are making an assumption too far. I have broadband and sometimes when we miss a programme use iPlayer or ItvX or one of the others. But I still very much prefer to make a recording myself on our Humax recorder. With the latter I can find the programme we want in just a few seconds - typically takes a few minutes with the online systems. AND we can skip through the trailers and ads at speed, which is almost never possible online. And pause and skip forward and rewind work in a predictable and easily controllable fashion, which is almost never the case with the iPlayers of this world. I shall be very sorry if there are no more VCRs to buy when our Humax bites the dust.


--
Clive Page

[Peter Johnson]

On Tue, 26 Sep 2023 11:54:10 +0100, Clive Page <use...@page2.eu>
wrote:

>On 25/09/2023 16:31, Woody wrote:
>> Yes they are because the manufacturers assume that everyone now has fast broadband and will use iPlayer, ItvX etc etc to watch programmes they have missed. However if you want to record something for posterity then it needs a bit of technical know-how as is seen in the newsgroup. Your average Joe Public wouldn't stand a chance.
>
>I think they are making an assumption too far. I have broadband and sometimes when we miss a programme use iPlayer or ItvX or one of the others. But I still very much prefer to make a recording myself on our Humax recorder. With the latter I can find the programme we want in just a few seconds - typically takes a few minutes with the online systems. AND we can skip through the trailers and ads at speed, which is almost never possible online. And pause and skip forward and rewind work in a predictable and easily controllable fashion, which is almost never the case with the iPlayers of this world. I shall be very sorry if there are no more VCRs to buy when our Humax bites the dust.

I wouls expect manufactuers are responding to sales, or lack of
them.(My preference is for a box - I had three prgrammes being
recorded simultateously on my Humax Aura the other day.)

[Jeff Layman]

I doubt that's true of the latest Panasonics. I had a look and most only
have one tuner even if they can record (I found one with twin tuners).
An additional issue is that I believe the recorded file is encrypted.
Even with my TV, it states in the eHelp guide:
"The data recorded on the USB HDD with this TV can only be played back
on this TV. You cannot play back its content with another TV (including
the TV of the same model number) or any equipment."

And as streaming becomes more common, it will be less likely for
manufacturers to spend money on recording features which might never be
used.

--

Jeff

[Peter Johnson]

On Tue, 26 Sep 2023 16:32:51 +0100, Jeff Layman <Je...@invalid.invalid>
wrote:


>

>And as streaming becomes more common, it will be less likely for
>manufacturers to spend money on recording features which might never be
>used.

I have a Panasonic DMR-BWT850 from 2015 which has a 1Tb HDD and a
blue-ray player and recorder (two tuners). I kept it when I got the
Humuax Aura (three tuners) in December 2020 in case I ever wanted to
play any discs, of which I have a small number. I've rarely used it
for that and have never used it to record DVDs.

[Brian Gaff]

I never found recordable DVDs very reliable between machines. Lots of break
up etc.
These days I'd have thought most people use flash ram sticks for things
they wish to move between machines, assuming the copyright police have not
stopped you doing it.

Brian

--

--:
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...
bri...@blueyonder.co.uk
Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!

"Peter Johnson" <pe...@parksidewood.nospam> wrote in message
news:ief8hi11kdplinkfh...@4ax.com...

[alan_m]

On 28/09/2023 08:56, Brian Gaff wrote:

> I never found recordable DVDs very reliable between machines. Lots of break
> up etc.

I can remember when CDs/DVDs were hailed as the reliable way to archive
valuable records. 10 to 20 years on that has proved not to be the case,
especially with the writable spinning plastic disk varieties.

[JMB99]

On 28/09/2023 08:56, Brian Gaff wrote:

> I never found recordable DVDs very reliable between machines. Lots of
> break up etc. These days I'd have thought most people use flash ram
> sticks for things they wish to move between machines, assuming the
> copyright police have not stopped you doing it. Brian

I use to regularly send programmes on DVD / BR to some friends in the
colonies who wanted relief from the rubbish on American TV.

Rarely had any problems with the DVDs, I sometimes would check on an old
DVD player that I have but mostly did not bother. I just put them in a
standard C5 envelope also - adding protection increased the thickness
and put into a more expensive postal charge.

[Vir Campestris]

On 28/09/2023 09:30, alan_m wrote:
> I can remember when CDs/DVDs were hailed as the reliable way to archive
> valuable records. 10 to 20 years on that has proved not to be the case,
> especially  with the writable spinning plastic disk varieties.

<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_dark_age>

It's a known problem. At least in some circles...

Andy