Re: Netflix on old Android?

[Indy Jess John]

On 18/01/2022 07:46, Charlie+ wrote:
> Hi All , I gave my old Android (4.2 Lollipop probably ~10 years old)
> tablet to grand children to use hopefully on Netflix.
> They find that it can not complete the Netflix password login,
> correct password but no handshake, no error message, just reverts to the
> login page.
> Anyone know what the problem might be?
> Maybe the O/S and tablet WiFi hardware is just too old? C+

I have an old tablet which has Android 4.3 (I think; it is the Icecream
version) on it. I found out years ago that the particular tablet
doesn't have a hardware feature that is a mandatory feature for Android
5 and upwards, so I would never be able to update the OS any further.

I am guessing that the Netflix password feature is trying to use the
missing hardware feature (which improved security) and is failing
because of it.

I still use my ancient tablet, but only as an e-book reader.

Jim

[Brian Gaff (Sofa)]

Yes if you cannotupdate it to near the latest version of Android, it cannot
work. I don't know specifics, but I've certainly heard it before. I'm told
even a budget priced Amazon Fire tablet can be used though.
Brian

--

This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
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Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
"Charlie+" <cha...@xxx.net> wrote in message
news:78rcuglfdphgncbph...@4ax.com...
> Hi All , I gave my old Android (4.2 Lolipop probably ~10 years old)
> tablet to grand children to use hopfully on Netflix.

[Andy Burns]

Charlie+ wrote:

> Anyone know what the problem might be?
> Maybe the O/S and tablet WiFi hardware is just too old? C+

I booted up my old nexus1 phone for a laugh the other day, anything that relies
on modern SSL/TLS is out of luck, it wouldn't surprise me if that's your issue.

[Roderick Stewart]

On Tue, 18 Jan 2022 08:16:47 +0000, Charlie+ <cha...@xxx.net> wrote:

>On Tue, 18 Jan 2022 08:02:09 +0000, Indy Jess John
><bathwa...@OMITTHISgooglemail.com> wrote as underneath :

>Hi Jim thanks for the info, yes thought it might be something like that
>:( Bin job then. Wasteful... Android seems to be up to about v13 now. C+

It's forced obsolescence. We're in for a similar story in 2025 when
support for Windows 10 runs out and the world discovers the full
significance of the fact that more than half of all computers will not
run Windows 11. Because Microsoft has decided not to allow it.

For hundreds of millions of computers, many of which will have
potentially many more years of life left in them, the choice will
effectively be Linux or landfill - which do we think is more likely?

Rod.

[Jeff Layman]

Good question. I've been running Linux Mint for about 6 years, and most
of it would be usable as (and could be made to look like) a Windows
setup. Even updating is easy, and can be automatic. But who would the
average ex-Windows user turn to for support? Unfortunately, most
wouldn't know what a terminal is or how to use it if push came to shove.

On a selfish basis, I hope they'll buy new machines which will run
Windows 11, 12, 13, etc. Otherwise, if more and more start using Linux,
it'll attract the attention of the malware writers. I haven't wasted
money on an antivirus product since I changed to Mint, and don't want to
start going down that road

--

Jeff

[MB]

On 18/01/2022 10:08, Roderick Stewart wrote:

> For hundreds of millions of computers, many of which will have
> potentially many more years of life left in them, the choice will
> effectively be Linux or landfill - which do we think is more likely?

I have not seen anything to suggest that Windows 10 will stopping
working, it will just not get updates.

How much software continues to be updated indefinitely free of charge?

I wonder what proportion of Windows users never bother with updates anyway?

[Roderick Stewart]

Indeed it won't stop working, but the lack of security fixes means it
will be unwise to continue using it. Same story as XP and 7.

Microsoft said that Windows 10 was going to be the last distinct
version, and would be supported on any computer it was installed on
for the life of the computer. They appear to have reneged on that.

If you leave Windows 10 alone, it will apply the important system
updates all by itself. You can postpone them, but only for a limited
time. Eventually it will do them regardless, so even the technically
ignorant will always have a reasonably up to date system.

The biggest stumbling block against Linux is that one of its greatest
strengths is also its greatest weakness. The fact that anybody with
the necessary skills can have a go at customising it has resulted in a
bewildering variety of different versions, many of which look nothing
like Windows at all and would probably daunt any newcomer for that
reason alone. What it needs is more publicity directing people towards
the ones that look most like Windows - and for my money the clear
winner would be Linux Mint/Cinnamon - describing how easy it is to
obtain and install. It should also be emphasised that if a system
becomes so snarled up as to be unusable, a complete reinstall can
usually be done in less time than it would take most people to learn
how to diagnose the problem and fix it the "clever" way. On my PC
that's about twenty minutes from a blank partition to a usable system.
I mostly use Windows because I'm accustomed to it and I like it, but
could move permanently to Liuux if I had to. If only more people knew
how easy it was.

Rod.

[Max Demian]

On Tue, 18 Jan 2022 11:18:18 +0000, MB <M...@nospam.net> wrote:

I just installed vanilla Windows 7 on a 10 year old Dell laptop and
it worked fine until the HDD failed. No updates (possible) and no
antivirus. Should I replace the HDD for £25 or so? Maybe.

--
Max Demian

[Indy Jess John]

On 18/01/2022 13:15, Roderick Stewart wrote:
> If you leave Windows 10 alone, it will apply the important system
> updates all by itself. You can postpone them, but only for a limited
> time. Eventually it will do them regardless, so even the technically
> ignorant will always have a reasonably up to date system.

And that is the drawback to continuing to use Windows 10 after the end
of life.

I was happily using Win7 until the last update before the end of life
date crippled some of the functions I was using and I had to undo that
last update and change the settings to "Never update" to get the system
back to its previous usability and to keep the MS sabotage packages from
destroying it again[1]. Without the update I undid, and the later "last
ever" update which I understand made Win7 virtually unusable according
to a friend of mine who had to upgrade to W10 to get his system working
the way he wanted it. Clearly MS wanted to prevent the XP scenario where
too many users just kept using it.

Because it is only possible to delay W10 updates and not block them
completely, there is nothing a W10 user can do to prevent MS making W10
retention difficult and a W11 update necessary.

As for making Linux look like Windows, I have done that for a friend of
mine. However she had been concerned about MS discontinuing support for
Vista which she had been using, and for that replacement I found Linux
Mint Mate a closer match for Vista than Cinnamon was.[2]

[1] I am aware that the general concern is that W7 without updates has
security holes, but I had installed all the patches up to when MS tried
to discourage me from keeping W7 and I am sensible enough not to click
on anything I am not expecting and to assume that unexpected e-mails are
trojans to be deleted, and I access only a limited set of websites, so I
am not likely to encounter rogue HTML which is where the real danger lies.

[2] I didn't tell her I was installing Linux. To this day she still
thinks I managed to get hold of an upgraded Vista.

Jim

[Indy Jess John]

I would. Dell laptops last a long time.
Just a tip though - the early Dell laptops used a disc which had an
extended IDE interface (the usual double row if interface pins plus some
extra one providing power). You can still get them (I bought a
refurbished one on e-bay when I wanted more disc capacity than was
originally fitted), and I found a compatible one by searching for a disc
for my specific Dell model. You are unlikely to find a 10-year-old Dell
with a SATA drive.

I am a little concerned about no anti-virus unless you are only going to
run it without an internet connection. Avast is free and pretty good,
and it can spot viruses and trojans in incoming e-mails. Kaspersky is a
good free anti-virus but I got really fed up with its constant nagging
after each update to add facilities which are only available in the
paid-for version, though the nagging pop-up doesn't say that.

Jim

[Jim Lesurf]

In article <ss67lq$dq5$1...@dont-email.me>, MB <M...@nospam.net> wrote:
> On 18/01/2022 10:08, Roderick Stewart wrote:
> > For hundreds of millions of computers, many of which will have
> > potentially many more years of life left in them, the choice will
> > effectively be Linux or landfill - which do we think is more likely?

> I have not seen anything to suggest that Windows 10 will stopping
> working, it will just not get updates.

> How much software continues to be updated indefinitely free of charge?

Need to unpack "updated" to make a fair response, I think. If it means "add
useful new features" then,, yes, a payment makes sense. But if it is simply
to let it go on working on an existing system where it had worked or
bugfix, and then I'd have regarded 'foc' as reasonable for commercial
items.

> I wonder what proportion of Windows users never bother with updates
> anyway?

I wonder, why Windows. 8-]

Jim

--
Please use the address on the audiomisc page if you wish to email me.
Electronics https://www.st-andrews.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scots_Guide/intro/electron.htm
biog http://jcgl.orpheusweb.co.uk/history/ups_and_downs.html
Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html

[Jim Lesurf]

In article <ss675r$ag9$1...@dont-email.me>, Jeff Layman

<jmla...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
> Good question. I've been running Linux Mint for about 6 years, and most
> of it would be usable as (and could be made to look like) a Windows
> setup. Even updating is easy, and can be automatic. But who would the
> average ex-Windows user turn to for support? Unfortunately, most
> wouldn't know what a terminal is or how to use it if push came to shove.

Given how many people may be affected, maybe there's a business-model in
some people offerring a 'works in a famiiliar way' service that installs a
Doze-alike linux setup and helping previously doze-captured people to use
it. If nothing else it might embarass/pressure MS into actually helping
people rather than facilitating ripping them off.

That said, the consumer mindset many people have been conditioned into
"that anything more than three years old is 'too old' " may dominate.

[Java Jive]

On 18/01/2022 12:25, Jim Lesurf wrote:
>
> Given how many people may be affected, maybe there's a business-model in
> some people offerring a 'works in a famiiliar way' service that installs a
> Doze-alike linux setup and helping previously doze-captured people to use
> it. If nothing else it might embarass/pressure MS into actually helping
> people rather than facilitating ripping them off.

It's a long time since I tried it, but I thought that was the thinking
behind PCLinuxOS?

--

Fake news kills!

I may be contacted via the contact address given on my website:
www.macfh.co.uk

[Java Jive]

On 18/01/2022 14:17, Indy Jess John wrote:
>
> On 18/01/2022 13:52, Max Demian wrote:
>>
>> I just installed vanilla Windows 7 on a 10 year old Dell laptop and
>> it worked fine until the HDD failed. No updates (possible) and no
>> antivirus. Should I replace the HDD for £25 or so? Maybe.
>
> I would.  Dell laptops last a long time.
> Just a tip though - the early Dell laptops used a disc which had an
> extended IDE interface (the usual double row if interface pins plus some
> extra one providing power).  You can still get them (I bought a
> refurbished one on e-bay when I wanted more disc capacity than was
> originally fitted), and I found a compatible one by searching for a disc
> for my specific Dell model.  You are unlikely to find a 10-year-old Dell
> with a SATA drive.

Yes, that is a major difficulty, however, you could buy a SATA drive and
put it in one of these, if only if it was still available ...

https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B00JJC07Q2/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o03_s00

... which is what I did on my Dell Latitude D610 when its HD finally
died. The BIOS stage of the boot slows to crawl because, despite it
having the correct boot order telling it to boot only from the CD-Drive,
it still insists on waiting for the non-existent HD in the HD drive bay
to time-out, then it beeps with a warning message about the missing
drive, and manually pressing <F1> then continues the boot with
everything working normally thereafter. It's a nuisance, but at least
it still works.

You may be able to find the same converter somewhere else such as eBay.

> I am a little concerned about no anti-virus unless you are only going to
> run it without an internet connection.  Avast is free and pretty good,
> and it can spot viruses and trojans in incoming e-mails.  Kaspersky is a
> good free anti-virus but I got really fed up with its constant nagging
> after each update to add facilities which are only available in the
> paid-for version, though the nagging pop-up doesn't say that.

Yes, I'm using ClamAV on my XP machines, but they don't normally need to
go on the internet anyway.

[Theo]

Charlie+ <cha...@xxx.net> wrote:
> Hi All , I gave my old Android (4.2 Lolipop probably ~10 years old)
> tablet to grand children to use hopfully on Netflix.

> They find that it can not complete the Netflix password login,
> correct password but no handshake, no error message, just reverts to the
> login page.
> Anyone know what the problem might be?
> Maybe the O/S and tablet WiFi hardware is just too old? C+

Does the Play Store still work? (I think it had stopped being 'Android Market'
by then).

If so, try updating to the latest Netflix app. It's possible there may be a
newer one that supports whatever changes Netflix have made to their system.

https://www.apkmirror.com/apk/netflix-inc/netflix/#variants
suggests the most recent build to support Android 4.0 was in 2015, although
that could just be the last time somebody uploaded the apk to their archive.

It seems like everything much more recent is Android 5.0+ only.

One thing you might investigate is whether there's a custom ROM for your
tablet to run a newer Android on it. LineageOS is a good starting point for
custom ROMs, although it depends on your model. Otherwise there might be a
forum on xda-developers for your model with users posting their own custom
ROMs.

Theo

[Max Demian]

On Tue, 18 Jan 2022 14:17:30 +0000, Indy Jess John
<bathwa...@OMITTHISgooglemail.com> wrote:
> On 18/01/2022 13:52, Max Demian wrote:

> > I just installed vanilla Windows 7 on a 10 year old Dell laptop
and
> > it worked fine until the HDD failed. No updates (possible) and no
> > antivirus. Should I replace the HDD for £25 or so? Maybe.
> >
> I would. Dell laptops last a long time.
> Just a tip though - the early Dell laptops used a disc which had an
> extended IDE interface (the usual double row if interface pins plus
some
> extra one providing power). You can still get them (I bought a
> refurbished one on e-bay when I wanted more disc capacity than was
> originally fitted), and I found a compatible one by searching for a
disc
> for my specific Dell model. You are unlikely to find a 10-year-old
Dell
> with a SATA drive.

It's an N5030 and certainly has a SATA drive. I've just bought an
Asus with a 128 GB SSD as a replacement.

> I am a little concerned about no anti-virus unless you are only
going to
> run it without an internet connection. Avast is free and pretty
good,
> and it can spot viruses and trojans in incoming e-mails. Kaspersky
is a
> good free anti-virus but I got really fed up with its constant
nagging
> after each update to add facilities which are only available in the
> paid-for version, though the nagging pop-up doesn't say that.

Thanks for the tip. I might fix the Dell as it is otherwise in good
condition.

--
Max Demian

[Woody]

Go have a look in Computer Exchange (uk.webuy.com) - one in pretty well
every medium sized town or larger. You will likely be able to get a
branded s/h HDD with minimum 2 year guaranatee for the money you want to
spend.

BEWARE: look at the connector in your HDD and make sure whether it is
parallel or SATA. Parallel has a single connector of two rows of gold
pins: if it is SATA it has two separate connectors, one bigger than the
other. It should also say SATA on the label. If your machine is SATA
then you could also consider a SSD which is significantly faster than a
conventional HDD. I have a Dell E6410 which is probably 10 years old and
the SSD works perfectly.

[Indy Jess John]

On 18/01/2022 16:07, Java Jive wrote:
> On 18/01/2022 12:25, Jim Lesurf wrote:
>>
>> Given how many people may be affected, maybe there's a business-model in
>> some people offerring a 'works in a famiiliar way' service that installs a
>> Doze-alike linux setup and helping previously doze-captured people to use
>> it. If nothing else it might embarass/pressure MS into actually helping
>> people rather than facilitating ripping them off.
>
> It's a long time since I tried it, but I thought that was the thinking
> behind PCLinuxOS?
>

Underlying the later Apple Mac computers is a Unix core with the Mac
GUI, a combination which was maintained by Apple.

It is difficult to see how PCLinuxOS could continue to look like Windows
without Microsoft's co-operation, and why would they do that?

Jim

[Roderick Stewart]

On Tue, 18 Jan 2022 13:59:55 +0000, Indy Jess John
<bathwa...@OMITTHISgooglemail.com> wrote:

>Because it is only possible to delay W10 updates and not block them
>completely, there is nothing a W10 user can do to prevent MS making W10
>retention difficult and a W11 update necessary.

If they did decide to implement that, I wonder what it would do to a
system on which Windows 11 will not run?

I've yet to check the source, but I have heard that according to one
survey more than half the business computers in existence do not
satisfy the requirements that Microsoft has decided to impose for
Windows 11. It seems quite plausible to me, and also likely that the
proportion for domestic computers will not be very different. None of
my own computers will run it, nor any others I'm aware of in at least
three other family setups, though they're all working fine and there
is no reason to suppose they couldn't continue to run for many years.

These computers will not stop working per se when support runs out,
but it's not beyond the bounds of possibility that some sensitive
websites such as banks may refuse entry to systems that are not up to
date, so computers that will not run the latest software will
gradually become impractical to keep.

Unless Microsoft change their policy it looks as though the world is
facing an obcene amount of electronic waste in the next few years.

There are several things they could do. For example, maybe they could
continue to support Windows 10 but only on computers that are logged
in with a Microsoft account? Wouldn't that be fun?

Rod.

[Roderick Stewart]

On Tue, 18 Jan 2022 13:52:32 +0000, Max Demian
<max_d...@bigfoot.com> wrote:

>I just installed vanilla Windows 7 on a 10 year old Dell laptop and
>it worked fine until the HDD failed. No updates (possible) and no
>antivirus. Should I replace the HDD for £25 or so? Maybe.

Depends on what you intend to use it for. If you do manage to get a
replacement hard drive, you've nothing to lose by trying Linux Mint,
which *is* supported with updates (and for now at least will be a less
likely target for malware anyway), and will use up less disk space and
run faster. It doesn't look exactly like Windows, but it's similar and
you'll be surprised how easy it is to get used to it.

Rod.

[Java Jive]

AFAIAA, PCLinuxOS is maintained, like many distros, by volunteers, their
problem being to make the 'Look & Feel' like Windows enough to be easy
for Windows users to adapt to, while making it different enough to avoid
Microsoft suing.

[SH]

Just like Aldi then! :-)

[Alexander]

"Roderick Stewart" <rj...@escapetime.myzen.co.uk> wrote in message news:6q3duglb0afhp3bef...@4ax.com...

>
> It's forced obsolescence. We're in for a similar story in 2025 when
> support for Windows 10 runs out and the world discovers the full
> significance of the fact that more than half of all computers will not
> run Windows 11. Because Microsoft has decided not to allow it.

There's a very simple workaround to bypass the "lockout" that
MS have imposed to prevent installation on older hardware.
It installed on a machine from 2010 here without problems.

Driver compatibility remains an issue for some however - that
depends on the specific hardware you're using, and isn't
guaranteed.

[Jim Lesurf]

In article <ss7kuq$49o$2...@dont-email.me>, Indy Jess John

You probably can't make it identical down to all the icons, etc. But can
make it generally behave in the same ways in terms of interface and put the
visual changes into the 'user customised' range. MS don't own the concept
of the WIMP, etc.

FWIW I tend to use ROX-Filer on Linux as it gives me an interface
reasonably like my preferred RISC OS desktop. But one of the points of
Linux is that it can be arranged to present as the user wishs.

BTW IIUC MS have contributed code to Linux. I think they've also
'borrowed' from some Linux ideas as well. But can't really say as I stopped
needing to ever use MS some decades ago, thank heavens.

The real hurdle is, I think, as I wrote earlier. That people have either
never heard of Linux, or have been lead to feel it is "too difficult" in
some way. So don't try it. Given that most people have little background in
computing *outwith* using MS or specific things at work, they shy away. It
is understandable, but a mental trap. Similarly, I guess many people don't
think of items like a modern 'mobile device' as a 'computer', either.

[Jim Lesurf]

In article <ss6okg$5ok$2...@dont-email.me>, Java Jive <ja...@evij.com.invalid>

wrote:
> > Given how many people may be affected, maybe there's a business-model
> > in some people offerring a 'works in a famiiliar way' service that
> > installs a Doze-alike linux setup and helping previously doze-captured
> > people to use it. If nothing else it might embarass/pressure MS into
> > actually helping people rather than facilitating ripping them off.

> It's a long time since I tried it, but I thought that was the thinking
> behind PCLinuxOS?

I can't recall the name(s) but I think there have been attempts in the
past.

I suspect they've tended not to become adopted for a variety of reasons
based largely on people being 'trained' into using Windows and its standard
progs, not educated to be able to use computers. Certainly in the UK some
decades ago arrangements in schools changed when they were forced to take
on governing boards that included local 'promotors' of Doze PCs who wanted
the students trained for office jobs, not have them learn about computing
or how to program. Training and habituation tended to replace education.

The result has been "Keep a tight grip of nurse for fear of something
worse" amongst those who emerge in many cases. Curiously, at much the same
time FE and apprenticeships had much support removed and students were
encouraged to feel that they had to go to Uni and get a 'degree'.

Also, of course, most people have no real idea about Linux or believe it is
like it was some decades ago and that you have to spend all your time
typing arcane commands into a terminal, and it taking great skill/patience
to install.

[charles]

In article <59ad30f...@audiomisc.co.uk>,

Jim Lesurf <no...@audiomisc.co.uk> wrote:
> In article <ss6okg$5ok$2...@dont-email.me>, Java Jive <ja...@evij.com.invalid>
> wrote:
> > > Given how many people may be affected, maybe there's a business-model
> > > in some people offerring a 'works in a famiiliar way' service that
> > > installs a Doze-alike linux setup and helping previously doze-captured
> > > people to use it. If nothing else it might embarass/pressure MS into
> > > actually helping people rather than facilitating ripping them off.

> > It's a long time since I tried it, but I thought that was the thinking
> > behind PCLinuxOS?

> I can't recall the name(s) but I think there have been attempts in the
> past.

> I suspect they've tended not to become adopted for a variety of reasons
> based largely on people being 'trained' into using Windows and its
> standard progs, not educated to be able to use computers. Certainly in
> the UK some decades ago arrangements in schools changed when they were
> forced to take on governing boards that included local 'promotors' of
> Doze PCs

[Snip]
My wife's school went Windows because 'kind' parents passed on their out of
date machines when they re-equipped their offices.

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle

[charles]

In article <59ad4dca...@candehope.me.uk>, charles

I should have said "the school she taught at ...."

[williamwright]

On 19/01/2022 17:04, charles wrote:

>> [Snip] My wife's school went Windows because 'kind' parents passed on
>> their out of date machines when they re-equipped their offices.
>
> I should have said "the school she taught at ...."
>

I think we all assumed you meant the one where she was a cleaner...

Bill

[JNugent]

On side-glances at this thread, I keep reading the title as something to
do with Airfix.

[Roderick Stewart]

On Wed, 19 Jan 2022 10:53:21 +0000 (GMT), Jim Lesurf
<no...@audiomisc.co.uk> wrote:

>> It is difficult to see how PCLinuxOS could continue to look like Windows
>> without Microsoft's co-operation, and why would they do that?
>
>You probably can't make it identical down to all the icons, etc. But can
>make it generally behave in the same ways in terms of interface and put the
>visual changes into the 'user customised' range.

Linux Mint pretty much fulfills that requirement already without any
further customising at all-

Taskbar along the bottom of the screen - check.
(They don't call it a taskbar, but it's the same thing)

Button at bottom left corner to bring up a menu - check.

Info area at bottom right corner - check.

Windows that can be maximised, minimised resized, snapped left or
right and closed with the same controls as Windows - check.

Thus, all the main controls work in much the same way, and the rest is
just detail. Anyone who has a Windows computer, an iPhone and a TV
streaming device and thinks they couldn't cope with different
operating systems needs to have it pointed out that they already do.

Rod.

[Roderick Stewart]

On Wed, 19 Jan 2022 13:22:52 -0000, "Alexander" <no...@nowhere.fr>
wrote:

Could you tell us what this "very simple" workaround is? All the ones
I've seen described require several operations including diving into
obscure settings screens and meddling with registry settings.

In any case, it's clear that Microsoft are prepared to do something
deliberate to prevent their software working on hardware they don't
approve of, so there's no guarantee that they wouldn't block any
attempts to subvert this. I'd rather use something I can depend on.

Rod.

[Paul Ratcliffe]

On Wed, 19 Jan 2022 19:37:19 +0000, williamwright <wrights...@f2s.com>

wrote:

>>> [Snip] My wife's school went Windows because 'kind' parents passed on
>>> their out of date machines when they re-equipped their offices.
>>
>> I should have said "the school she taught at ...."
>>
>
> I think we all assumed you meant the one where she was a cleaner...

I think you mean a hygiene engineering technician.

What do they call dinner ladies these days?

[Indy Jess John]

Prestidigitators? They have to be magicians these days to make
nourishing meals from the paltry "per head" target.

Jim

[williamwright]

On 23/01/2022 11:08, Indy Jess John wrote:

> Prestidigitators?  They have to be magicians these days to make
> nourishing meals from the paltry "per head" target.
>
> Jim

No reason why the cost to parents can't be increased. Poor families get
free dinners anyway.

Bill

[Jim Lesurf]

In article <j54u49...@mid.individual.net>, williamwright

The risk is that the number of children who fail to get decent nourishment
might then increase because of "cannae be bothered" parents who can
(allegedly) "afford to pay"... but simply don't.

Thus enabling harm to children. Unless, of course, you also want intrusive
'inspectors' to go round checking and fining people who they decide haven't
provided for their kids as per regulations.

Given that the general education is paid for via taxation (inc rates)
rather than demand parents cough up, and that decent nourishment is needed
for children to learn effectively, it makes more sense for meals to simply
be a part of the basis of education at school, and thus funded via
taxation/rates. This helps avoid some children having an education limited
by the failures of their parents.

The main downside is that selfish skinflints might have to pay towards the
support of children. Not just fall on the 'Scrooge Excuse' - "Are there no
workhouses?"

Hence perhaps not quite "no reason" in reality. :-)