FM portable radio with good battery life

[Tony Gamble]

My Sony ICF-7600D is showing signs of its age as only one of the two
'tone' settings works. I need to be thinking of a replacement.

I only listen to BBC4 or LBC when I am getting ready to tackle the day!

I am not interested in DAB as it seems to be accompanied by short
battery life. The ones I have looked at seem to last about ten hours and
that is too much hassle for an old soak like me.

The Sony is about the size and weight of two packs of cards. I really
don't want anything bigger or heavier.

Loudspeaker? Yes, decent volume for when I am shaving or boiling the
kettle for my early morning tea.

Your suggestions please.

Tony

[Max Demian]

I've got the original Roberts Play, which is very good. It has DAB, but
the battery life is good and it can be powered by rechargeable batteries
which can be charged in situ. It's small, at 16.5x11x4cm, and sounds
very good for its size.

Unfortunately it may be hard to get hold of as it has been superseded by
other Roberts models. The nearest appears to be the Play 20, available
from the Radio Times shop:
https://rtshop.radiotimes.com/products/roberts-play-20-radio

--
Max Demian

[Roderick Stewart]

The Roberts Play 20 perhaps?

Small, powered by four AA cells either disposable or rechargeable, or
directly from charger/PSU, FM and DAB, single built-in loudspeaker or
listen in stereo on headphones, rubber buffer covering all four edges
and no protruding control knobs to break off if you drop it.

The original has a small monochrome LC screen and five preset station
buttons. (Five presets for each waveband). There is a later version
which has a colour screen and four preset buttons, though the
description claims 20 station presets, so I'm not sure how they
achieve that.

Rod.

[Tony Gamble]

Thanks Max and Rod.

Looks close to what I was hoping for.

Tony

[Dave W]

On Mon, 11 Jul 2022 15:54:17 +0100, Tony Gamble

A duff tone control sounds like an easy mend to me. It's only a slide
switch that adds a capacitor - probably a bad switch contact.
--
Dave W

[Tony Gamble]

On 12/07/2022 19:33, Dave W wrote:

>
> A duff tone control sounds like an easy mend to me. It's only a slide
> switch that adds a capacitor - probably a bad switch contact.

Dave. Good shot. I was not going to mention it but the slider failed
after the last battery change. A day later it repaired itself so now
both settings are OK. It must have been what you suggested.

However, it is not going to work forever and my wife has a similar sized
radio that she uses in the early morning and it will surely die sometime
so I need to know what is the best replacement.

Tony

[SH]

Some Mobile phones actually come with FM radio onboard. Only really
usuable if you live in a strong signal area where an FM aerial is not
needed.....

[charles]

In article <talkgg$29srd$1...@dont-email.me>,

The headphone lead is the aerial

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle

[Brian Gaff]

Almost anything, then with no DAB. I don't know specific models, but an old
design analogue tuned ones batteries last seemingly for ever. Also of course
the size of said batteries is important. Try to find one using double As, I
find the triple a sets very likely to go down pretty fast.
Brian

--

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"Tony Gamble" <tonyg...@compuserve.com> wrote in message
news:jj28c8...@mid.individual.net...

[Brian Gaff]

No neither am I but I'd dispute the battery life on dry cells if you use
dab. It is however very sensitive on fm and dab and having the stereo for
phones can be handy, but if you don't need that some of the lesser known fm
only radios with knobs are fine.

Brian

--

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"Roderick Stewart" <rj...@escapetime.myzen.co.uk> wrote in message
news:d5vnch5u2v23apbpb...@4ax.com...

[Brian Gaff]

Yes a tiny squirt of contact cleaner will normally fix the tone switches.
I'd not expect portables to last more than 10 years, but I have one here
that dates back to the 80s

Brian

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"charles" <cha...@candehope.me.uk> wrote in message
news:5a07443c...@candehope.me.uk...

[MB]

On 13/07/2022 09:55, Brian Gaff wrote:
> Almost anything, then with no DAB. I don't know specific models, but an old
> design analogue tuned ones batteries last seemingly for ever. Also of course
> the size of said batteries is important. Try to find one using double As, I
> find the triple a sets very likely to go down pretty fast.
> Brian

Though I suspect that many analogue radios now use "digits" in the
decoding. I used to notice that one of mine had a slight delay when an
older radio (presume true analogue) radio could also be heard.

I think my Roberts Stream 94i runs several hours on battery, I keep
meaning to check it! I tend to only use that now, my two old Pure
radios probably destined for the dump.

[Max Demian]

On 13/07/2022 09:28, charles wrote:
> In article <talkgg$29srd$1...@dont-email.me>,
> SH <i.l...@spam.com> wrote:
>> On 13/07/2022 05:47, Tony Gamble wrote:
>>> On 12/07/2022 19:33, Dave W wrote:

>>>> A duff tone control sounds like an easy mend to me. It's only a slide
>>>> switch that adds a capacitor - probably a bad switch contact.
>>>
>>> Dave. Good shot. I was not going to mention it but the slider failed
>>> after the last battery change. A day later it repaired itself so now
>>> both settings are OK. It must have been what you suggested.
>>>
>>> However, it is not going to work forever and my wife has a similar sized
>>> radio that she uses in the early morning and it will surely die sometime
>>> so I need to know what is the best replacement.

>> Some Mobile phones actually come with FM radio onboard. Only really
>> usuable if you live in a strong signal area where an FM aerial is not
>> needed.....
>
> The headphone lead is the aerial

...usually. ("Modern" phones don't an FM tuner at all as it is so five
years ago.)

And then you need a proper speaker, wired or Bluetooth.

--
Max Demian

[Max Demian]

On 13/07/2022 09:59, Brian Gaff wrote:

> No neither am I but I'd dispute the battery life on dry cells if you use
> dab. It is however very sensitive on fm and dab and having the stereo for
> phones can be handy, but if you don't need that some of the lesser known fm
> only radios with knobs are fine.

This one even has long wave:
https://www.argos.co.uk/product/8883205

It's cheap, but effectively battery only, though you can fit
rechargeables and charge them externally.

Or https://www.argos.co.uk/product/8242303 if you don't mind Bush stuff.
(Some of their stuff is good.) Both are available in black or white.

So many thingies to buy. When I get fed up with them I give them to
charity shops.

--
Max Demian

[NY]

"Max Demian" <max_d...@bigfoot.com> wrote in message
news:JN-dndJdLsfHJlP_...@brightview.co.uk...
> ...usually. ("Modern" phones don't [have] an FM tuner at all as it is so

> five years ago.)
>
> And then you need a proper speaker, wired or Bluetooth.

Yes, my "new" Samsung Galaxy S7 phone (new when I bought it a few years ago)
doesn't have an FM radio, whereas my older Samsung Galaxy S2 did. If I
understand correctly, the S7 sold in some countries (eg USA) has FM, but the
one sold in the UK (and maybe mainland Europe) doesn't (or it's disabled at
the hardware level). Why?

Some form of private listening device (eg wired or Bluetooth earphones) is
essential if you to avoid disturbing everyone else around you.

[Roderick Stewart]

On Wed, 13 Jul 2022 13:57:03 +0100, Max Demian
<max_d...@bigfoot.com> wrote:

>Or https://www.argos.co.uk/product/8242303 if you don't mind Bush stuff.
>(Some of their stuff is good.) Both are available in black or white.

This one looks similar to part of a consignment of family junk I've
been given for disposal via Ebay (because nobody else can use a
computer apparently) though I'll probably end up disposing of this one
in the bin. It has that soft furry matt finish that might be appealing
to some when new, but it has gone tacky with age and is horrible even
to touch. Even if it worked properly (half the display is blank) I'd
still feel embarrassed to give it away for nothing.

Rod.

[SH]

On 13/07/2022 13:57, Max Demian wrote:
> On 13/07/2022 09:59, Brian Gaff wrote:
>
>> No neither am I but I'd dispute the  battery life on dry cells if you use
>> dab. It is however very sensitive on fm and dab  and having the stereo
>> for
>> phones can be handy, but if you don't need that some of the lesser
>> known fm
>> only radios with knobs are fine.
>
> This one even has long wave:
> https://www.argos.co.uk/product/8883205
>

Wow.... is ther *anything* left on LW?

Last I heard was that Droitwich LW will close when the last Klystron
dies as they are very ikd technology and getting harder to repair or
replace....

[NY]

"Roderick Stewart" <rj...@escapetime.myzen.co.uk> wrote in message

news:lpitch5qs6pirsljk...@4ax.com...

> It has that soft furry matt finish that might be appealing
> to some when new, but it has gone tacky with age and is horrible even
> to touch.

Aaaargh. That matt finish is horrible, even when new, and when it starts to
ooze and go tacky it is vile. My wife's keyboard was coated with it, and
once the coating started to go tacky I cleaned it all off with meths to get
back to the bare plastic. It took a long time because it quickly got
absorbed into the cotton wool or paper towel that I was using, so I ended up
spreading it rather than removing it, until I got wise to what was happening
and started to change the towel very frequently.

It's like that matt, slightly rubbery finish that you get on the cover of
some paperback books. It makes me cringe to touch it ;-)

[Tony Gamble]

On 13/07/2022 06:17, SH wrote:
Only really
> usuable if you live in a strong signal area where an FM aerial is not
> needed.....
>
>

And a mobile phone with a speaker loud enough to listen to against the
noise of a boiling kettle or a shower.

Come off it. I want a wireless not a scratchy amplified phone.

Tony

[Brian Gaff]

Yes my Sonus 1 Pure is a very good talking alarm clock.
I have a Sangean multiband radio bought in1985, and it still goes. Its a
tad scratchy in the volume slider, and the band switch really wants taking
to bits and cleaning, but in general for the very low price it has served me
well. They probably went bust by now, since its not the first time I've
heard of their radios still going. Not a digit in sight. Single conversion
superhet of course and has long wave, what more could you want.

Brian

--

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"MB" <M...@nospam.net> wrote in message news:tam4ce$2b8qt$1...@dont-email.me...

[SH]

A wireless? Oooh that takes me back a long time!

I remebre Mullard PCL86 valves and having to run an earth wire from the
wireless set to an external earth stake.... oh and that cats whisker
that was used as a tuning aid.....

[Max Demian]

On 13/07/2022 16:40, SH wrote:
> On 13/07/2022 15:05, Tony Gamble wrote:
>> On 13/07/2022 06:17, SH wrote:

>>   Only really
>>> usuable if you live in a strong signal area where an FM aerial is not
>>> needed.....

>> And a mobile phone with a speaker loud enough to listen to against the
>> noise of a boiling kettle or a shower.
>>
>> Come off it. I want a wireless not a scratchy amplified phone.

> A wireless? Oooh that takes me back a long time!

No, "wireless" is modern, as in Wi-Fi.

> I remebre Mullard PCL86 valves and having to run an earth wire from the
> wireless set to an external earth stake.... oh and that cats whisker
> that was used as a tuning aid.....

So many wrong things in that sentence...

--
Max Demian

[Indy Jess John]

On 13/07/2022 16:40, SH wrote:

> I remember Mullard PCL86 valves

In a radio? I remember the PC series valves in TVs but all the radios I
have seen used the EC series of valves.

Jim

[Ashley Booth]

Portable radios used valves begining with D (1.4v heaters)

--


--
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus

[Roderick Stewart]

On 13 Jul 2022 20:34:18 GMT, "Ashley Booth" <remo...@snglinks.com>
wrote:

>Indy Jess John wrote:
>
>> On 13/07/2022 16:40, SH wrote:
>> > I remember Mullard PCL86 valves
>>
>> In a radio? I remember the PC series valves in TVs but all the
>> radios I have seen used the EC series of valves.
>>
>> Jim
>
>Portable radios used valves begining with D (1.4v heaters)
>
>--

Some radio used the U type valves. Constant current like P type, but
lower current (100mA I think) so you could wire them in series with a
big resistor and save the cost of a transformer.

But mind your fingers because the metalwork might be live.

Rod.

[SH]

On 13/07/2022 17:14, Max Demian wrote:
> On 13/07/2022 16:40, SH wrote:
>> On 13/07/2022 15:05, Tony Gamble wrote:
>>> On 13/07/2022 06:17, SH wrote:
>
>>>   Only really
>>>> usuable if you live in a strong signal area where an FM aerial is
>>>> not needed.....
>
>>> And a mobile phone with a speaker loud enough to listen to against
>>> the noise of a boiling kettle or a shower.
>>>
>>> Come off it. I want a wireless not a scratchy amplified phone.
>
>> A wireless? Oooh that takes me back a long time!
>
> No, "wireless" is modern, as in Wi-Fi.
>

I think you are showing your age here as a Gen Z :-))

"Wireless" to me is a colloquialism refers to a specific generation of
radios that was based on vacuum valve technology or older tech to
recieve MW, LW, Sometimes SW and somwetimes FM like these:

https://duckduckgo.com/?q=vintage+wireless+valve+radios&atb=v314-1&iar=images&iax=images&ia=images

Ths would be from around early 1900s to probably the 1950s when
Shockley, Brittain and Bardeen invented the transistorin 1948.

Now Wi Fi, means to me the transmission of digital data rather than
audio modulated ont o a FM or AM carrier and Wi Fi operates on 2.4 GHz
or 5 GHz, which is much higher frequencies than FM/AM/LW/MW/SW.


>> I remember Mullard PCL86 valves and having to run an earth wire from

>> the wireless set to an external earth stake.... oh and that cats
>> whisker that was used as a tuning aid.....
>
> So many wrong things in that sentence...
>

Cats Whisker: http://vintageradio.me.uk/crystal/catswhisker.htm

https://rileyjshaw.com/blog/the-cats-whisker-detector

Re the Mullard PCL86 I was alomost there-ish

http://www.r-type.org/exhib/aai0028.htm

Its used in the audio stages of a TV reciever so yes, this tyype of
valve was seen in TVs rather than in radios.

[tony sayer]

In article <tamp1b$2dcpv$1...@dont-email.me>, SH <i.l...@spam.com> scribeth
thus

A "P" CL used in a mains radio, seems odd?...
--
Tony Sayer


Man is least himself when he talks in his own person.

Give him a keyboard, and he will reveal himself.

[tony sayer]

In article <tamiqv$2cnaa$1...@dont-email.me>, SH <i.l...@spam.com> scribeth
thus

Klystron eh? At Droitwich, do tell us more;?...

[tony sayer]

In article <tam4ce$2b8qt$1...@dont-email.me>, MB <M...@nospam.net> scribeth
thus

Can you not find a half decent Grundig on fleabay?, got and old Elite
boy out in the shed OK runs off the mains adapter but they were very
good in their day and even now would knock the crap out of more modern
units!...

[SH]

On 14/07/2022 09:29, tony sayer wrote:
> In article <tamiqv$2cnaa$1...@dont-email.me>, SH <i.l...@spam.com> scribeth
> thus
>> On 13/07/2022 13:57, Max Demian wrote:
>>> On 13/07/2022 09:59, Brian Gaff wrote:
>>>
>>>> No neither am I but I'd dispute the  battery life on dry cells if you use
>>>> dab. It is however very sensitive on fm and dab  and having the stereo
>>>> for
>>>> phones can be handy, but if you don't need that some of the lesser
>>>> known fm
>>>> only radios with knobs are fine.
>>>
>>> This one even has long wave:
>>> https://www.argos.co.uk/product/8883205
>>>
>>
>> Wow.... is ther *anything* left on LW?
>>
>> Last I heard was that Droitwich LW will close when the last Klystron
>> dies as they are very ikd technology and getting harder to repair or
>> replace....
>
> Klystron eh? At Droitwich, do tell us more;?...

https://www.theguardian.com/media/2011/oct/09/bbc-radio4-long-wave-goodbye

Its definately valves, I seem to recall Thyratrons or klystrons
mentioned elsewhere and probably due to sloppy journailism :-)

[Indy Jess John]

"Wireless" describes the receiver. "Radio" describes the transmitter.
Both are correct, and both must exist for either to be useful.

Jim

[Roderick Stewart]

On Thu, 14 Jul 2022 09:46:06 +0100, Indy Jess John
<bathwa...@OMITTHISgooglemail.com> wrote:

>"Wireless" describes the receiver. "Radio" describes the transmitter.
>Both are correct, and both must exist for either to be useful.

The popular terms just seem to have been a matter of changing fashion
over the years. Originally there were "wireless telegraphy" and
"wireless telephony" to distinguish them from the previous inventions
that used wires to convey the information, and later it became usual
to abbreviate them.

I think nowadays most people would assume "wireless" meant computer
connections and "radio" meant broadcasts that you'd listen to, but
they both really refer to different uses of the same thing.

The one I can't explain is "wi-fi". It seems to have taken hold as the
term everybody now understands for wireless when used with computer
networking signals, but where did such a peculiar expression come
from? Maybe words don't have logical derivations any more. Maybe
somebody used it once and just liked the sound of it and it stuck. If
anybody knows a definitive explanation I'd be interested.

Rod.

[Robin]

On 14/07/2022 10:15, Roderick Stewart wrote:
<snip.

>
> The one I can't explain is "wi-fi". It seems to have taken hold as the
> term everybody now understands for wireless when used with computer
> networking signals, but where did such a peculiar expression come
> from? Maybe words don't have logical derivations any more. Maybe
> somebody used it once and just liked the sound of it and it stuck. If
> anybody knows a definitive explanation I'd be interested.
>

Brand chosen and used by the The Wireless Ethernet Compatibility
Alliance in 1999

"WECA also unveiled Wi-Fi, the new consumer brand identity for the IEEE
802.11 High Rate (HR) Standard. The Wi-Fi brand name represented in a
consumer friendly logo will serve as the awarded "seal of approval" for
those WECA member products that have successfully completed the
prescribed interoperability testing. Customers from enterprises to
consumers can be assured that products bearing this logo will work
together. "



--
Robin
reply-to address is (intended to be) valid

[Java Jive]

On 14/07/2022 10:15, Roderick Stewart wrote:
>

> The one I can't explain is "wi-fi". It seems to have taken hold as the
> term everybody now understands for wireless when used with computer
> networking signals, but where did such a peculiar expression come
> from? Maybe words don't have logical derivations any more. Maybe
> somebody used it once and just liked the sound of it and it stuck. If
> anybody knows a definitive explanation I'd be interested.

I have no actual knowledge about this, but rightly or wrongly I've
always assumed it was some marketing man's adaptation of HiFi.

So why don't I actually look it up, instead of just speculating? Indeed!

https://www.google.com/search?q=where+did+the+term+WiFi+come+from%3F&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8

"Wi-Fi, often referred to as WiFi, wifi, wi-fi or wi fi, is often
thought to be short for Wireless Fidelity but there is no such thing.
The term was created by a marketing firm because the wireless industry
was looking for a user-friendly name to refer to some not so
user-friendly technology known as IEEE 802.11."

--

Fake news kills!

I may be contacted via the contact address given on my website:
www.macfh.co.uk

[Mark Carver]

Klystrons are only of use at UHF, (and the bottom end of SHF) ?

[MB]

On 14/07/2022 09:43, SH wrote:

> https://www.theguardian.com/media/2011/oct/09/bbc-radio4-long-wave-goodbye
>
> Its definately valves, I seem to recall Thyratrons or klystrons
> mentioned elsewhere and probably due to sloppy journailism:-)

I would not class a tabloid like The Grauniad as a reliable source!

They originally claimed the valves were difficult to obtain but others
said they could still be obtained. But they were expensive and the site
is very expensive to run for a small number of listeners - I have not
listened to Long Wave for years but reception here is very poor.

[MB]

On 14/07/2022 10:15, Roderick Stewart wrote:

> The popular terms just seem to have been a matter of changing fashion
> over the years. Originally there were "wireless telegraphy" and
> "wireless telephony" to distinguish them from the previous inventions
> that used wires to convey the information, and later it became usual
> to abbreviate them.

I can't remember seeing the term "wireless telephony" used.

It is usually WT = Wireless Telegraphy and RT = Radio Telephony.

[Tony Gamble]

On 14/07/2022 09:32, tony sayer wrote:

>
> Can you not find a half decent Grundig on fleabay?, got and old Elite
> boy out in the shed OK runs off the mains adapter but they were very
> good in their day and even now would knock the crap out of more modern
> units!...
>

Any specific model to look for, Tony?

Must be battery.

Tony

[David Woolley]

On 14/07/2022 10:15, Roderick Stewart wrote:

> The popular terms just seem to have been a matter of changing fashion
> over the years.

Wireless Telegraphy was a legal term, defined by statute, as well, and
which included transmission:
<https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/Geo6/12-13-14/54/section/19/enacted>.

[Max Demian]

On 14/07/2022 09:26, tony sayer wrote:
> In article <tamp1b$2dcpv$1...@dont-email.me>, SH <i.l...@spam.com> scribeth
> thus

>> A wireless? Oooh that takes me back a long time!
>>
>> I remebre Mullard PCL86 valves and having to run an earth wire from the
>> wireless set to an external earth stake.... oh and that cats whisker
>> that was used as a tuning aid.....

> A "P" CL used in a mains radio, seems odd?...

Yes, an AC/DC mains radio would chain the heaters but only require
100mA, not the 300mA ones that TVs used. And probably wouldn't need an
earth stake. And cats whiskers are used in an AM demodulator [1] not for
tuning.

[1] Often called the "detector" stage even in valve or transistor
radios, as it was first used to "detect" the presence of a carrier for
CW (Morse) transmissions.

--
Max Demian

[Max Demian]

On 14/07/2022 08:57, SH wrote:

> On 13/07/2022 17:14, Max Demian wrote:
>> On 13/07/2022 16:40, SH wrote:
>>> On 13/07/2022 15:05, Tony Gamble wrote:
>>>> On 13/07/2022 06:17, SH wrote:
>>
>>>>   Only really
>>>>> usuable if you live in a strong signal area where an FM aerial is
>>>>> not needed.....
>>
>>>> And a mobile phone with a speaker loud enough to listen to against
>>>> the noise of a boiling kettle or a shower.
>>>>
>>>> Come off it. I want a wireless not a scratchy amplified phone.
>>
>>> A wireless? Oooh that takes me back a long time!
>>
>> No, "wireless" is modern, as in Wi-Fi.

> I think you are showing your age here as a Gen Z :-))
>
> "Wireless" to me is a colloquialism refers to a specific generation of
> radios that was based on vacuum valve technology or older tech to
> recieve MW, LW, Sometimes SW and somwetimes FM like these:
>
> https://duckduckgo.com/?q=vintage+wireless+valve+radios&atb=v314-1&iar=images&iax=images&ia=images

> Ths would be from around early 1900s to probably the 1950s when
> Shockley, Brittain and Bardeen invented the transistorin 1948.

"Wireless" originally included transmission through the ground by
burying metal plates - used in WW1 for communication between trenches.

--------| |--------
Transmitter Receiver
--------| |--------

This would be for Morse code.

I did try doing it once with audio; it did sort of work, but with
limited range and there was mains hum.

Wireless communication using Hertzian waves was "radio".

> Now Wi Fi, means to me the transmission of digital data rather than
> audio modulated ont o a FM or AM carrier and Wi Fi operates on 2.4 GHz
> or 5 GHz, which is much higher frequencies than FM/AM/LW/MW/SW.
>
>
>>> I remember Mullard PCL86 valves and having to run an earth wire from
>>> the wireless set to an external earth stake.... oh and that cats
>>> whisker that was used as a tuning aid.....
>>
>> So many wrong things in that sentence...
>>
>
> Cats Whisker: http://vintageradio.me.uk/crystal/catswhisker.htm
>
> https://rileyjshaw.com/blog/the-cats-whisker-detector

Yes, a "detector" (originally to detect the carrier of Morse
transmissions). Nothing to do with tuning.

> Re the Mullard PCL86 I was alomost there-ish
>
> http://www.r-type.org/exhib/aai0028.htm
>
> Its used in the audio stages of a TV reciever so yes, this tyype of
> valve was seen in TVs rather than in radios.

--
Max Demian

[Jeff Layman]

On 14/07/2022 11:20, MB wrote:
> On 14/07/2022 09:43, SH wrote:
>> https://www.theguardian.com/media/2011/oct/09/bbc-radio4-long-wave-goodbye
>>
>> Its definately valves, I seem to recall Thyratrons or klystrons
>> mentioned elsewhere and probably due to sloppy journailism:-)
>
> I would not class a tabloid like The Grauniad as a reliable source!

I don't think that its format is the point. I see that the article is 11
years old, and retains the problems from many years before:

"This article was amended on 10-11 October 2011 to correct references to
Droitwitch and Drotwitch, to Droitwich."

Perhaps they bought their spoolchuckers many years ago for a knockdown
price! :-)

--

Jeff

[Jim Lesurf]

In article <b1be470d-1ff6-cdf7...@compuserve.com>, Tony

Gamble <tonyg...@compuserve.com> wrote:

> Come off it. I want a wireless not a scratchy amplified phone.

I bought a cheap FM radio 'kit' board+bits from CPC and added a speaker and
small battery holders. Result isn't anything like 'Hi Fi' but works OK in
the bathroom. Since then I think they've replaced that kit with a different
one. Not tried that, but it is a cheap experiment if you have a spare small
speaker.

Jim

--
Please use the address on the audiomisc page if you wish to email me.
Electronics https://www.st-andrews.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scots_Guide/intro/electron.htm
biog http://jcgl.orpheusweb.co.uk/history/ups_and_downs.html
Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html

[Brian Gaff]

I had a yought boy with a few shortwave bands medium fm and long. Was very
good.

Brian

--

--:
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...
bri...@blueyonder.co.uk
Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!

"Tony Gamble" <tonyg...@compuserve.com> wrote in message
news:9eda8b62-073d-4a35...@compuserve.com...

[tony sayer]

In article <HK2dnQdBY-ajZlL_...@brightview.co.uk>, Max
Demian <max_d...@bigfoot.com> scribeth thus

>On 14/07/2022 09:26, tony sayer wrote:
>> In article <tamp1b$2dcpv$1...@dont-email.me>, SH <i.l...@spam.com> scribeth
>> thus
>
>>> A wireless? Oooh that takes me back a long time!
>>>
>>> I remebre Mullard PCL86 valves and having to run an earth wire from the
>>> wireless set to an external earth stake.... oh and that cats whisker
>>> that was used as a tuning aid.....
>
>> A "P" CL used in a mains radio, seems odd?...
>
>Yes, an AC/DC mains radio would chain the heaters but only require
>100mA, not the 300mA ones that TVs used. And probably wouldn't need an
>earth stake. And cats whiskers are used in an AM demodulator [1] not for
>tuning.

Yes "P" series heaters 300 ma

Did have the earth and the old phone pole, wire from the chimney and to
pole the downlead and porcelain lead in! those were the days:)..

>
>[1] Often called the "detector" stage even in valve or transistor
>radios, as it was first used to "detect" the presence of a carrier for
>CW (Morse) transmissions.
>

--

[tony sayer]

In article <otydnVn3BeTQY1L_...@brightview.co.uk>, Max
Demian <max_d...@bigfoot.com> scribeth thus

Used to do that with a mate around 130 yards away, did hum a bit but
worked very well:)

Its just a big resistor the old earth so its like a sort of pi config
filter?...

>
>Wireless communication using Hertzian waves was "radio".

Yes did that too, although the less said about that the better;!..

[tony sayer]

In article <taokvk$2lqo9$1...@dont-email.me>, SH <i.l...@spam.com> scribeth

Valves !! Klystrons were used im Analogue TV transmitters none around
not now mostly IOT tubes.

Total inaccurate bollix what they mean is the Auntie BBC would like to
shut down radio 4 longwave! Valves can be rebuilt in such as Russia and
China and new solid state Long wave transmitters are available if need
be but it seems that LW in Europe is going out of fashion in some places
its useful vast distances needing covering...

https://www.nautel.com/products/am-transmitters/nx-series/

[Ian Jackson]

In message <taol4f$2lrhj$1...@dont-email.me>, Indy Jess John
<bathwa...@OMITTHISgooglemail.com> writes

>"Wireless" describes the receiver. "Radio" describes the transmitter.
>Both are correct, and both must exist for either to be useful.
>

"Wireless" actually describes the transmission medium, ie via
electromagnetic waves, which propagate without the need for intervening
conducting wires.
--
Ian

[NY]

"Brian Gaff" <brian...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:tarm9a$323e7$1...@dont-email.me...

> I had a yought boy with a few shortwave bands medium fm and long. Was very
> good.

Yes the Grundig Yacht Boy was a good radio. My parents had one. It was the
first time I heard FM radio and even on that size of speaker, the clearer
sound compared with AM was noticeable. I made a power supply so it could be
used off the mains instead of eating up batteries.

[Jim Lesurf]

In article <jja704...@mid.individual.net>, Mark Carver

<mark....@invalid.invalid> wrote:
> >
> > Its definately valves, I seem to recall Thyratrons or klystrons
> > mentioned elsewhere and probably due to sloppy journailism :-)

> Klystrons are only of use at UHF, (and the bottom end of SHF) ?

I assume you're taking for granted the above is only in the context of UK
TV. :-) I've used klystrons that could be screw tuned up to 130 GHz! 8-]

FWIW That still wasn't high enough a frequency, so we used to x2 or x3 them
to get what we needed.

[MB]

On 15/07/2022 10:38, Jim Lesurf wrote:
> I assume you're taking for granted the above is only in the context of UK
> TV.:-) I've used klystrons that could be screw tuned up to 130 GHz! 8-]

I doubt that you could get 40 KW out of them. :-)

[alan_m]

On 11/07/2022 15:54, Tony Gamble wrote:

>
> Looks close to what I was hoping for.

With a battery life of UPTO 25 hours?


--
mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk

[MB]

On 17/07/2022 11:51, alan_m wrote:
> With a battery life of UPTO 25 hours?

The majority of people have no need for that much battery capacity so
manufacturers do not make them because of the extra cost and extra weight.

I have no figures but I suspect that most portable radios spend the
majority of their time running off the mains and many will be only used
off the mains.

I do find it handy that I can take my main portable (Roberts) through
into another room whilst there though it has the peculiarity that it
will sometimes restart when unplugged from the mains even though it is
only float charging the battery as far as I can see.

Another annoyance with the Roberts is the Bluetooth, I saw one review
praising it for its Bluetooth but the Blutooth is only an input, you
cannot feed a remote speaker through it.

[Jim Lesurf]

True. :-) The Klystrons only output c100mW. frequency-trebled with the
varactors of the time that gave more like 100 microW. Fortunately, the
mixer only needed about 1 to 10 microwatts of LO. Much morr would have
stopped it working!

Also used BWOs that output a lot at a few hundred GHz. But that's another
story.

All 'fun' when combined with sites that were dry and had dodgy earthing...

[Rink]

Op 13-7-2022 om 15:54 schreef SH:

> On 13/07/2022 13:57, Max Demian wrote:
>> On 13/07/2022 09:59, Brian Gaff wrote:
>>
>>> No neither am I but I'd dispute the battery life on dry cells if
>>> you use dab. It is however very sensitive on fm and dab and
>>> having the stereo for phones can be handy, but if you don't need
>>> that some of the lesser known fm only radios with knobs are
>>> fine.
>>
>> This one even has long wave:
>> https://www.argos.co.uk/product/8883205
>>
>
> Wow.... is ther *anything* left on LW?
>
> Last I heard was that Droitwich LW will close when the last Klystron
> dies as they are very ikd technology and getting harder to repair or
> replace....

UK
Ireland
Iceland
Luxemburg
Denmark
Poland
France (no sound)
Rumania
Algeria

I can receive it all, except Denmark

Rink

[Rink]

Op 14-7-2022 om 10:43 schreef SH:

> On 14/07/2022 09:29, tony sayer wrote:
>> In article <tamiqv$2cnaa$1...@dont-email.me>, SH <i.l...@spam.com>
>> scribeth thus

>>> On 13/07/2022 13:57, Max Demian wrote:
>>>> On 13/07/2022 09:59, Brian Gaff wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> No neither am I but I'd dispute the battery life on dry
>>>>> cells if you use dab. It is however very sensitive on fm and
>>>>> dab and having the stereo for phones can be handy, but if
>>>>> you don't need that some of the lesser known fm only radios
>>>>> with knobs are fine.
>>>>
>>>> This one even has long wave:
>>>> https://www.argos.co.uk/product/8883205
>>>>
>>>
>>> Wow.... is ther *anything* left on LW?
>>>
>>> Last I heard was that Droitwich LW will close when the last
>>> Klystron dies as they are very ikd technology and getting harder
>>> to repair or replace....
>>

>> Klystron eh? At Droitwich, do tell us more;?...
>
>
> https://www.theguardian.com/media/2011/oct/09/bbc-radio4-long-wave-goodbye
>

> Its definately valves, I seem to recall Thyratrons or klystrons
> mentioned elsewhere and probably due to sloppy journailism :-)

"Part of the problem is that pumping the signal so that it can cover
England, Wales and lowland Scotland requires 500 kilowatts of power, far
more - according to the BBC - than other long wave transmitters,"

far more than other long wave transmitters ???

500 kW ERP is (was) a normal power for longwave transmitters.
Europe had many higher power transmitters
for example:

Radio France 2000 kW (162 kHz)
RTL 2000 kW (234 kHz)
Europe 1 2000 kW (183 kHz)
etc.

not to speak about Northern Africa and the Middle East
where 2000kW is normal.

Rink

[MB]

On 25/08/2022 15:13, Rink wrote:
> far more than other long wave transmitters ???

Don't forget because of the shape and geology of the UK, there are three
transmitters and even then there is not good complete coverage and not
very few people listen to Long Wave.

[MB]

On 25/08/2022 16:03, MB wrote:
> Don't forget because of the shape and geology of the UK, there are three
> transmitters and even then there is not good complete coverage and not
> very few people listen to Long Wave.

OOOooops

Don't forget because of the shape and geology of the UK, there are three
transmitters and even then there is not good complete coverage and

[tony sayer]

In article <te801i$3lnml$1...@dont-email.me>, Rink <rink.hof.haalditmaarweg
@planet.nl> scribeth thus

Its BBC polities Rink. More modern and efficient solid state
transmitters exist but its down to does the BBC want to carry on with
the Long wave outlet seems they don't, and any old excuse like "cant get
the valves" will make it politically easier to close it down!...

New ones here//

https://www.nautel.com/products/am-transmitters/nx-series/

Shouldn't be surprised if the Russians and Chinese make them as well!.

Do remember they have large land masses to cover that are very difficult
with FM and DAB..

[Max Demian]

On 26/08/2022 11:14, tony sayer wrote:
> In article <te801i$3lnml$1...@dont-email.me>, Rink <rink.hof.haalditmaarweg
> @planet.nl> scribeth thus
>> Op 14-7-2022 om 10:43 schreef SH:
>>> On 14/07/2022 09:29, tony sayer wrote:
>>>> In article <tamiqv$2cnaa$1...@dont-email.me>, SH <i.l...@spam.com>
>>>> scribeth thus

>>>>> Last I heard was that Droitwich LW will close when the last
>>>>> Klystron dies as they are very ikd technology and getting harder
>>>>> to repair or replace....
>>>>
>>>> Klystron eh? At Droitwich, do tell us more;?...

>>> https://www.theguardian.com/media/2011/oct/09/bbc-radio4-long-wave-goodbye
>>>
>>> Its definately valves, I seem to recall Thyratrons or klystrons
>>> mentioned elsewhere and probably due to sloppy journailism :-)

>> "Part of the problem is that pumping the signal so that it can cover
>> England, Wales and lowland Scotland requires 500 kilowatts of power, far
>> more - according to the BBC - than other long wave transmitters,"
>>
>> far more than other long wave transmitters ???
>>
>> 500 kW ERP is (was) a normal power for longwave transmitters.
>> Europe had many higher power transmitters
>> for example:
>>
>> Radio France 2000 kW (162 kHz)
>> RTL 2000 kW (234 kHz)
>> Europe 1 2000 kW (183 kHz)
>> etc.
>>
>> not to speak about Northern Africa and the Middle East
>> where 2000kW is normal.

> Its BBC polities Rink. More modern and efficient solid state
> transmitters exist but its down to does the BBC want to carry on with
> the Long wave outlet seems they don't, and any old excuse like "cant get
> the valves" will make it politically easier to close it down!...

...and the Luftwaffe might use the signal to bomb London.

--
Max Demian

[MB]

On 26/08/2022 11:14, tony sayer wrote:

> Do remember they have large land masses to cover that are very difficult
> with FM and DAB..

I wonder if the savings from closing down VHF FM and Long Wave would be
enough to complete DAB coverage? I suspect it could cover hilly areas
much better than VHF FM, even now it is often better than VHF FM.

They could replace the three Long Wave transmitters with solid state but
how much would that cost and why when the services are available on DAB.

I doubt that any mariners depend on the Shipping Forecast now, anyone
who can afford a yacht that leaves inshore wates can afford NAVTEX or
satellite.

[Rink]

Op 26-8-2022 om 12:14 schreef tony sayer:

I do not know about China, but Russia closed all Longwave
transmitters many years ago.
I was able to receive 171 kHz Kaliningrad.

And the same frequency 171 kHz was assigned to The Netherlands,
but never used.
Not clever to ask for a longwave frequency, because in those days
there were no Dutch language stations on longwave and most radio's
sold in The Netherlands did not have longwave.

Rink

[R. Mark Clayton]

On Monday, 12 September 2022 at 18:37:14 UTC+1, Rink wrote:
> Op 26-8-2022 om 12:14 schreef tony sayer:
> > In article <te801i$3lnml$1...@dont-email.me>, Rink <rink.hof.haalditmaarweg
> > @planet.nl> scribeth thus

SNIP

> >
> I do not know about China, but Russia closed all Longwave
> transmitters many years ago.
> I was able to receive 171 kHz Kaliningrad.
>
> And the same frequency 171 kHz was assigned to The Netherlands,
> but never used.
> Not clever to ask for a longwave frequency, because in those days
> there were no Dutch language stations on longwave and most radio's
> sold in The Netherlands did not have longwave.
>
> Rink

Hilversum used to appear on long wave radio dials, but went online ~2008.

Its advantages are relatively long range, with some refraction around the surface of the earth and very simple equipment needed to receive it (e.g. a crystal radio - I made one aged 11 and used to to listen to Radio Luxembourg on MW), so good for broadcasting into places where the internet is slugged (e.g. Russia). Nearby jamming stations can be avoided by careful aerial orientation.

[Rink]

Op 13-9-2022 om 12:30 schreef R. Mark Clayton:

> On Monday, 12 September 2022 at 18:37:14 UTC+1, Rink wrote:
>> Op 26-8-2022 om 12:14 schreef tony sayer:
>>> In article <te801i$3lnml$1...@dont-email.me>, Rink <rink.hof.haalditmaarweg
>>> @planet.nl> scribeth thus
> SNIP
>>>
>> I do not know about China, but Russia closed all Longwave
>> transmitters many years ago.
>> I was able to receive 171 kHz Kaliningrad.
>>
>> And the same frequency 171 kHz was assigned to The Netherlands,
>> but never used.
>> Not clever to ask for a longwave frequency, because in those days
>> there were no Dutch language stations on longwave and most radio's
>> sold in The Netherlands did not have longwave.
>>
>> Rink
>
> Hilversum used to appear on long wave radio dials, but went online ~2008.
>

The last long wave broadcast in The Netherlands was about 1950.

In "1975 Geneve" a transmitter was planned on 171 kHz,
but this frequency was never used in The Netherlands.

On mediumwave many transmitters/frequencies were used by public and
commercial broadcasters.
More then 10 kW were on:
675, 747, 828, 891, 1008, 1224, 1251 and 1395 kHz
Now all MW-frequencies are in use by small transmitters, max. 100 Watt.
See:
https://radio-tv-nederland.nl/am/am.html


A very good book is "70 jaar Radio-Omroepzenders in Nederland" from ing.
P. Vijzelaar.
You can download this book here:
<https://nvhrbiblio.nl/biblio/boek/Vijzelaar%20-%2070%20jaar%20radio-omroepzenders.pdf>


It describes all long wave and mediumwave transmissions until 1989.
It is in Dutch, but I'm sure you can understand a lot of it.


Rink

[Mark Carver]

On 16/10/2022 17:49, Rink wrote:
>
> The last long wave broadcast in The Netherlands was about 1950.
>
> In "1975 Geneve" a transmitter was planned on 171 kHz,
> but this frequency was never used in The Netherlands.

There was a minor bit of excitement about 20 years ago, when I think
there was a short lived plan for an English language station aimed at
the UK from the Netherlands on 171 kHz ?

Delta 171  ?

About the same time that an outfit were going to launch a LW service
from the Isle of Man on 279 kHz

https://paulrusling.com/Musicman_279.html

[charles]

In article <tihcms$368q7$1...@dont-email.me>,

Rink <rink.hof.ha...@planet.nl> wrote:
> Op 13-9-2022 om 12:30 schreef R. Mark Clayton:
> > On Monday, 12 September 2022 at 18:37:14 UTC+1, Rink wrote:
> >> Op 26-8-2022 om 12:14 schreef tony sayer:
> >>> In article <te801i$3lnml$1...@dont-email.me>, Rink <rink.hof.haalditmaarweg
> >>> @planet.nl> scribeth thus
> > SNIP
> >>>
> >> I do not know about China, but Russia closed all Longwave
> >> transmitters many years ago.
> >> I was able to receive 171 kHz Kaliningrad.
> >>
> >> And the same frequency 171 kHz was assigned to The Netherlands,
> >> but never used.
> >> Not clever to ask for a longwave frequency, because in those days
> >> there were no Dutch language stations on longwave and most radio's
> >> sold in The Netherlands did not have longwave.
> >>
> >> Rink
> >
> > Hilversum used to appear on long wave radio dials, but went online ~2008.
> >

> The last long wave broadcast in The Netherlands was about 1950.

> In "1975 Geneve" a transmitter was planned on 171 kHz,
> but this frequency was never used in The Netherlands.

It wouldn't have been allocated unless The Netherlands had asked for it.

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England - sent from my RISC OS 4té
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle