GB News

[Jeff Gaines]

Watching on Sky 515, it's the only channel I've seen for years with lip
sync problems, anybody else seeing this?

--
Jeff Gaines Wiltshire UK
There is absolutely no substitute for a genuine lack of preparation

[NY]

"Jeff Gaines" <jgaines...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
news:xn0mz3ki2...@news.individual.net...

>
> Watching on Sky 515, it's the only channel I've seen for years with lip
> sync problems, anybody else seeing this?

Yes, terrible sync problems. I'm glad it's not just me. I'm watching a
recording of the HD feed on satellite. I don't know what the effect is on SD
on terrestrial. It was bad with Andrew Neil's introduction and for the time
when the reporters (north east, Northern Ireland, south east) introduced
themselves - though the Birmingham reporter was bang in sync. I presume
those introductions were recorded rather than live.

[NY]

"NY" <m...@privacy.invalid> wrote in message
news:sa5r0v$7sv$1...@dont-email.me...

I've just watched the recording of start of Tonight Live with Dan Wootton,
which includes the tail-end of the previous programme "Welcome to GB News".
By the end of the Welcome programme, lip sync seemed to be a lot better,
though not perfect. But then as I watched, it slipped back to terrible at
the start of the Dan Wootton programme after the transition between Andrew
Neil's handover "take it away Dan", the Dan Wootton title sequence and Dan
starting to talk. Skipping forwards about 20 minutes, it had got better
again.

There are obviously gremlins that have crept in, which *hopefully* the
techies will root out and fix. Embarrassing for them that the gremlins
didn't manifest themselves on any of the testing in the preceding days. From
what I remember, the looped trailers over the past few days were bang on, so
it;s only the live stuff that is in and out of sync.

[TonyGamble]

What a mess visually. Just turned off the bit with Alan Sugar who was about half the size (screenwise) of the studio presenter. Can't they afford trained vision mixers?

And rubbish definition. What bit rate are they using? Have the beancounters taken over already and said how much money you can save with fuzzy pictures.

What I have seen so far is so amateur.

Sad.

Tony

[NY]

"TonyGamble" <tonyg...@compuserve.com> wrote in message
news:bb0c7fa9-a4c2-4baa...@googlegroups.com...

At a quick dip-in, the picture quality on HD satellite looks fairly good.
Andrew Neil's camera looks very ropy (lack of sharpness, noise, low bit
rate) but the other cameras where there are dual-screen shots looked
sharper. There was a cockup at 20:09 when Andrew Neil was talking to Neil
Oliver and Neil was badly off-mike and at one point there was a whispered
female voice "Yes, well I don't know" - looks like someone faded up the
wrong mike. Ah! His mike had fallen off his shirt ;-)

It will be interesting to see how the technical standards improve over the
coming days. There's definitely something badly wrong with Andrew Neil's
camera: it needs a good bit of fettling! I almost wonder whether it's an SD
camera whose picture has been upscaled to HD.

I'm not sure I like Dan Wootton.: there's something about his manner which
makes me feel uncomfortable.

[Brian Gregory]

On 13/06/2021 20:44, Jeff Gaines wrote:
>
> Watching on Sky 515, it's the only channel I've seen for years with lip
> sync problems, anybody else seeing this?
>

Forget that.

Why was Andrew Neil in semi darkness, so much so that he looked really
grainy.

Then at the start of "Tonight Live", the first real program, a whole
load of the presenters questionable personal opinion about COVID and
lockdown presented in a way that, at least to me, didn't seem at all
balanced.

I gave up at that point.

--
Brian Gregory (in England).

[TonyGamble]

Watched 6.00 to 6.10 this morning out of curiosity.

Sound balance problems as they cut from studio to ob or vtr.

Image sharper without the Andrew Neil image dominating.

All rather 'jolly'. A bit like that wierd thing on BBC1 that follows the Breakfast prog with all those trainers and sweat shirts to prove they are part of 'the people' and all the potted palms.

It can't be easy to start a news channel but I wonder where they poached their staff from - or did they use the pool of ones without jobs?

[Brian Gaff (Sofa)]

Are you sure they are not just refurbished Gerry Andersons Supermarionation,
puppets?
Brian

--

This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
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Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
"Bob Latham" <b...@sick-of-spam.invalid> wrote in message
news:593c1a...@sick-of-spam.invalid...
> In article <xn0mz3ki2...@news.individual.net>,

> Jeff Gaines <jgaines...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>
>> Watching on Sky 515, it's the only channel I've seen for years with
>> lip sync problems, anybody else seeing this?
>

> Same on Freeview and variable sound levels.
>
> Bob.
>

[Brian Gaff (Sofa)]

Seriously though, it should be simple with modern kit to have a time
signature that could effectively make sure they were delayed so they agreed.
The old problems tended to be when the audio and video got separated or had
different delays for som reason.

Brian

--

This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
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Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!

"NY" <m...@privacy.invalid> wrote in message
news:sa5r0v$7sv$1...@dont-email.me...

[Brian Gaff (Sofa)]

Andrew Neil is far too full of himself of late, presenting his views as the
one true way a lot more than he used to.

Brian

--

This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
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Blind user, so no pictures please
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"TonyGamble" <tonyg...@compuserve.com> wrote in message

news:4285402b-0801-4905...@googlegroups.com...

[Jeff Gaines]

On 13/06/2021 in message <iinfn3...@mid.individual.net> Brian Gregory

wrote:

>>Watching on Sky 515, it's the only channel I've seen for years with lip
>>sync problems, anybody else seeing this?
>>
>
>Forget that.
>
>Why was Andrew Neil in semi darkness, so much so that he looked really
>grainy.

Thank heavens for small mercies, he looks better in the dark :-)

--
Jeff Gaines Wiltshire UK

This is as bad as it can get, but don't bet on it

[Woody]

Could it be that AN is at his home in France and coming in by Interweb?

When has has been on GMB or Sky from there the picture and sound has
been good so, along with the other picture and sound sync problems could
it be that they have a poor Interweb connection at their studios?

[Woody]

We turned it on this morning and saw two presenters. Wasn't until the
woman of colour in the middle in a red dress moved that we realised
there was three of them - but it was so dingy you still couldn't see
her, just the moving red dress.

[TonyGamble]

"Brian Gaff (Sofa)’s profile photo
Brian Gaff (Sofa)
unread,
08:12 (1 hour ago)
to

Are you sure they are not just refurbished Gerry Andersons Supermarionation,
puppets?

Brian +"

The folk that come on after BBC Breakfast are like characters from the Muppets with their arms on little sticks that are pushed up by animators underneath. Nobody gesticulates like that in real life.

[TonyGamble]

On Monday, 14 June 2021 at 09:00:49 UTC+1, Woody wrote:

> On Mon 14/06/2021 08:58, Woody wrote:

> > Could it be that AN is at his home in France and coming in by Interweb?
> >

If he is then he is a brave man. I would not launch a new channel from a thousand miles away. I'd be in the studio making sure any glitches were sorted asap.

From what I have seen this morning the breakfast programme needs a damned good editor. Too much waffle.

Tony G - who was there on the first day of LWT and when the union pulled the plugs on us.

[John Armstrong]

I read through this thread, and switched on at 9.15 am "out of
curiosity" too. I'm watching on Virgin 626, allegedly HD.

Lip sync problems still apparent in the studio, though not from the
"guests" around the country. The shot from Durham started off with a
dreadful echo on sound, which they cleared after a few seconds.

One of the commercials a few minutes ago was advertising "How to buy
gold bullion". Not something I'm ever likely to do. I wonder what
their target audience is.

Switched off about 9.28. Seems a fair trial! :-)

[NY]

"Woody" <harro...@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
news:sa727v$gtd$1...@dont-email.me...

> Could it be that AN is at his home in France and coming in by Interweb?

He was certainly in the studio last night because there was a chat between
him and Neil Oliver (Neil's mike dropped off and he went badly off-mike),
and there were shots of both of them facing each other.

Otherwise, I could well have believed that AN was via a webcam...

[MrSpo...@_qwuw0pyreyfo5t010jupz.biz]

On Mon, 14 Jun 2021 09:31:08 +0100
John Armstrong <j...@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:
>On Sun, 13 Jun 2021 22:24:57 -0700 (PDT), TonyGamble
><tonyg...@compuserve.com> wrote:
>
>>Watched 6.00 to 6.10 this morning out of curiosity.
>>
>>Sound balance problems as they cut from studio to ob or vtr.
>>
>>Image sharper without the Andrew Neil image dominating.
>>
>>All rather 'jolly'. A bit like that wierd thing on BBC1 that follows the
>Breakfast prog with all those trainers and sweat shirts to prove they are part
>of 'the people' and all the potted palms.
>>
>>It can't be easy to start a news channel but I wonder where they poached
>their staff from - or did they use the pool of ones without jobs?

A lot of the presenters and back office staff were poached from Wireless Group.
Dan Wooten came from talkRadio, ditto Neil Oliver who did a section on Mike
Grahams show for a year, De Perio came from Times Radio.

[TonyGamble]

"A lot of the presenters and back office staff were poached from Wireless Group"

According to their web site they supply radio material.

That explains the problem of working on television then.

[MrSpoo...@nzgpnkenablv4qhlyqmt48v.org]

Radio and TV presenters are pretty interchangable these days and have been
for quite a while.

[JNugent]

Although Andrew Neil was eventually shown (by a reflection in a glass
panel) to be in the studio with several other presenters, at first, due
to the fuzzy nature of his image on-screen, I thought he was at home,
phoning it in on Facetime.

[JNugent]

On 14/06/2021 08:58 am, Woody wrote:
> On Mon 14/06/2021 06:24, TonyGamble wrote:
>> Watched 6.00 to 6.10 this morning out of curiosity.
>>
>> Sound balance problems as they cut from studio to ob or vtr.
>>
>> Image sharper without the Andrew Neil image dominating.
>>
>> All rather 'jolly'. A bit like that wierd thing on BBC1 that follows
>> the Breakfast prog with all those trainers and sweat shirts to prove
>> they are part of 'the people' and all the potted palms.
>>
>> It can't be easy to start a news channel but I wonder where they
>> poached their staff from - or did they use the pool of ones without jobs?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
> Could it be that AN is at his home in France and coming in by Interweb?

I thought that at first. But later, his reflection cold be seen on a
glass panel when one of the other presenters was shown from a certain angle.

[TonyGamble]

"Radio and TV presenters are pretty interchangable these days and have been
for quite a while. "

Interchangable maybe but not necessarily possessing the same skills.

Likewise the engineers, as proven when they cut to one outside reporter this morning at about 6.10. Desparately over exposed video and ineffective sound - corrected with the second try.

Followed with a recording of a sea front interview with Mrs Patel where the volume was far too low.

There is an anecdote that ITN say their finest news bulleting ever was their very first - having had a year to practice it. This morning's was more akin to a bunch of students wheeled in to have a tinker with some kit they had hardly ever seen before.

[Andy Burns]

John Armstrong wrote:

> switched on at 9.15 am

14:05 someone off-camera trying to snort a microphone?

[MrSpook_...@5tf2vh.biz]

Given how many TV channels there are these days with only a certain pool of
professionals to go around, you might not be far from the truth.

[NY]

"JNugent" <jennings&c...@fastmail.fm> wrote in message
news:iioql1...@mid.individual.net...

Looking again critically at the pictures of my HD satellite recordings of
Welcome to GB News and Tonight Live with Dan Wootton, I'm wondering whether
the studio cameras were either SD upscaled to HD or lower bitrate, or both.
There were a few reflections off chromium objects which looked to have
jagged edges that were too coarse to be HD. And the pictures of adverts,
graphics and some of the recorded or remote insert reports looked sharper
than the studio shots.

Look at https://i.postimg.cc/50SGbJpx/vlcsnap-2021-06-14-16h10m41s205.png.
Look in particular at the reflections from the curved stand that is holding
the globe in the top left of the screen - very coarse jagged edge. And is it
my imagination or is the background (eg the plant to the right of the woman)
a bit sharper than the woman herself (I chose a frame where she wasn't
moving) - did the camera focus somewhere in between the two instead of on
the woman?

[NY]

"JNugent" <jennings&c...@fastmail.fm> wrote in message
news:iioql1...@mid.individual.net...

https://i.postimg.cc/3x2zn2p4/vlcsnap-2021-06-14-16h17m36s334.png shows he
was in the same studio as Neil Oliver - unless it is a very clever composite
shot ;-)

Look at those *horrible* jagged edges on the chromium arms of Neil Oliver's
chair.

And look at this picture of Andrew Neil
https://i.postimg.cc/Dy9trxW3/vlcsnap-2021-06-14-16h18m13s855.png - no way
is that a high quality HD picture ;-) Pin-sharp graphics, web-cam quality
camera ;-)

[Andy Burns]

NY wrote:

> JNugent wrote:
>
>> Although Andrew Neil was eventually shown (by a reflection in a glass
>> panel) to be in the studio with several other presenters, at first,
>> due to the fuzzy nature of his image on-screen, I thought he was at
>> home, phoning it in on Facetime.
>
> Looking again critically at the pictures of my HD satellite recordings
> of Welcome to GB News and Tonight Live with Dan Wootton, I'm wondering
> whether the studio cameras were either SD upscaled to HD or lower
> bitrate, or both. There were a few reflections off chromium objects
> which looked to have jagged edges

Are the reflections real, or could it be a virtual studio with
reflections added to virtual surfaces?

[Brian Gregory]

On 14/06/2021 08:51, Jeff Gaines wrote:
> On 13/06/2021 in message <iinfn3...@mid.individual.net> Brian
> Gregory wrote:
>
>>> Watching on Sky 515, it's the only channel I've seen for years with
>>> lip sync problems, anybody else seeing this?
>>>
>>
>> Forget that.
>>
>> Why was Andrew Neil in semi darkness, so much so that he looked really
>> grainy.
>
> Thank heavens for small mercies, he looks better in the dark :-)
>

I was watching in HD on satellite.
It was fascinating watching the snow dance on his face.
It didn't quite look like normal low light graininess though, it kind of
formed a few weird swirly patterns that persisted for a moment, like
maybe there was heavy digital processing of some kind going on.

At about 20:09 when AN started his first attempt to interview Neil
Oliver there was a good bit, they had the wrong microphone faded up and
while you couldn't hear NO being interviewed you could clearly hear a
woman whisper something like "yes, well I don't know, no".

[NY]

On 14/06/2021 17:28, Brian Gregory wrote:
> On 14/06/2021 08:51, Jeff Gaines wrote:
>> On 13/06/2021 in message <iinfn3...@mid.individual.net> Brian
>> Gregory wrote:
>>
>>>> Watching on Sky 515, it's the only channel I've seen for years with
>>>> lip sync problems, anybody else seeing this?
>>>>
>>>
>>> Forget that.
>>>
>>> Why was Andrew Neil in semi darkness, so much so that he looked
>>> really grainy.
>>
>> Thank heavens for small mercies, he looks better in the dark :-)
>>
>
> I was watching in HD on satellite.
> It was fascinating watching the snow dance on his face.
> It didn't quite look like normal low light graininess though, it kind of
> formed a few weird swirly patterns that persisted for a moment, like
> maybe there was heavy digital processing of some kind going on.

I think Andrew Neil's camera was an even cheaper brand of webcam than
the rest of the studio cameras ;-)

Someone on the Digital Spy forum said his camera made it look as if he'd
had his face sandpapered ;-)

> At about 20:09 when AN started his first attempt to interview Neil
> Oliver there was a good bit, they had the wrong microphone faded up and
> while you couldn't hear NO being interviewed you could clearly hear a
> woman whisper something like "yes, well I don't know, no".

Yes I heard that cock-up. I couldn't decide whether they'd faded up the
wrong mike or whether it was something else, though whatever mike was
live caught the woman's whisper. But a few minutes later Neil Oliver
discovered that his personal mike had fallen off and was buried in his
shirt. As soon as he put it back, the sound returned to normal quality -
but still out of sync with the pictures.



I've seen worse, more car-crashy TV, but only from a local TV station
"SixTV" based in Oxford and broadcast from Oxford transmitter around
2002. That had everything: newsreaders who looked like rabbits caught in
the headlights, cameras that clipped highlights giving people glaring
orange patches on their faces, people's voices going off-mike (like Neil
Oliver's did). But it also had the delectable Sasha Norris presenting a
very interesting wildlife programme called "Wild" so it wasn't all bad.

[NY]

On HD it did look as if there was a fuzzy 1980s Chromakey halo around
people in some shots, so I wonder if the bookcase and the dining table
and the newsroom in the background are virtual backgrounds, and only the
chairs that the presenters are sitting on are real. But there was so
much noise and bit-starved compression artefacts (and this is on HD via
satellite) that it's difficult to tell whether it really was Chromakey
halo or just crappy over-compression of contrasty edges.

Something in the cameras or compression chain really does *not* like
bright reflections from the arms of the chrome seats: there are horrible
jagged edges like upscaled 640x480 video.

[Andy Burns]

Brian Gregory wrote:

> they had the wrong microphone faded up and while you couldn't hear NO
> being interviewed you could clearly hear a woman whisper something like
> "yes, well I don't know, no"

I've heard faint talkback speech in the background several times. They
seem to know there's horrid echo on the outside contributions, because
when the interviewee is speaking they fade over to a different audi
which sounds clean, then they switch back to the echoey version when the
interviewer/interviewee are speaking to each other.

[TonyGamble]

On Freesat I watched Boris on the BBC and then the feed taken by GB and (a) the video deteriorated and (b) the sound was out of sync.

Surely someone can get the sat feed into sync?

I stayed with them to watch the studio chat and the poor chap in the middle might not have bothered to clip his mike to his jacket the number of times it was not turned up.

We folk here on this forum are picky - but why isn't Mr Neil or someone at the station picky as well? It does matter. It'll matter a lot more when they run out of money and potential investors realise they simply don't care.

That OB from St Albans. How can you get echo from a lapel mike used out of doors? And then they lost her pre-taped clip. Poor girl. I bet she wonders why she gave up the day job.

[Andy Burns]

TonyGamble wrote:

> but why isn't Mr Neil or someone at the station picky as well? It does matter.

The presenters seem to be taking the piss out of the technical quality.

[TonyGamble]

Once the presenters adopt that attitude the channel is doomed.

The number of times that Dubery woman looked at the wrong camera between 6.30 and 7.00 is pathetic. Is there no floor manager?. Are they saving red bulbs on the top of the cameras?

How many times do you hear a BBC Today presenter apologising for an incorrect time check? The rule is that you crack on with what you are needed to do next. The world does not stop if you have been told the wrong time.

[NY]

"TonyGamble" <tonyg...@compuserve.com> wrote in message
news:c7807054-a21e-472a...@googlegroups.com...

> The number of times that Dubery woman looked at the wrong camera between
> 6.30 and 7.00 is pathetic. Is there no floor manager?. Are they saving red
> bulbs on the top of the cameras?

Does a floor manager usually indicate to the presenter which is *going to
be* the next camera (ie a few seconds in advance), so the presenter can be
prepared for the change, rather than the helpless looking around "the red
light on the camera I was using has gone out - which camera has a light
now?".

If so, how does a floor manager indicate this? Do they walk from one camera
to the next and give a hand signal to say "this will be the next one - but
wait for the light".

[NY]

"Andy Burns" <use...@andyburns.uk> wrote in message
news:iipl1m...@mid.individual.net...

I predict one of two things will happen.

Either GB News will take off and become a respected and lasting news
broadcaster - and they'll have a retrospective in 20 years' time looking
back on all the technical cock-ups of the first few days before it had found
its feet.

Or GB News will vanish without trace within a month or so.

[Roderick Stewart]

Unless they've changed it since I used to work in studios (admittedly
not recently) it's the Production Assistant who calls the shots from
the gallery, so anyone with talkback will hear it.

Rod.

[NY]

"Jeff Gaines" <jgaines...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
news:xn0mz3ki2...@news.individual.net...
>

> Watching on Sky 515, it's the only channel I've seen for years with lip
> sync problems, anybody else seeing this?

It's still going on. The symptom is very weird. I wonder what could cause
sound to lead video at the start of any new segment on the channel, but to
gradually right itself over the course of a few minutes - until the next
interview or other live presentation after a video insert.

Are microphones in a modern studio analogue back to the mixing desk, and
then digital from the mixed output onwards? Or does each mike have an A/D
converter so the sound arrives at the mixing desk as a bitstream? I wonder
if they need to resync the sound (using a clapperboard and a digital delay)
just before each segment goes live, until they find and kill the gremlin.

[NY]

"NY" <m...@privacy.invalid> wrote in message
news:sa8b7l$pdk$1...@dont-email.me...

Watching the current item (Andrew Neil talking to an anti-lockdown
campaigner) it looks as if they have only got the sound and pictures in sync
for the interviewee's camera. On the wide two-shot camera it *looks* as if
there's a delay, and there certainly is for the camera used for the close-up
of Neil. So the cameras are not even in sync with each other: it's as if
it's between camera and vision mixing desk.

I'd love to hear the talkback from the gallery. I bet they are tearing their
hair out trying to get it right.

[NY]

"Roderick Stewart" <rj...@escapetime.myzen.co.uk> wrote in message
news:0ebfcgl61uu2gd3g9...@4ax.com...

Yes but does the presenter hear that, or is it filtered out so as to present
them with only the most crucial comments from the director?

[Woody]

Could it be that OBs are being done on 4G or 5G by mobile phone of which
they are using more than one and not of the same make/model/firmware/OS?

The bit that is getting me is not the poor {enter your own choice here}
but more the abysmally low sound. We normally have our TV sound at about
35 on BBC News Channel or Sky but we need to go to 50 or more (out of
60!!) to even hear GBN!

[NY]

On 14/06/2021 22:21, Woody wrote:
> The bit that is getting me is not the poor {enter your own choice here}
> but more the abysmally low sound. We normally have our TV sound at about
> 35 on BBC News Channel or Sky but we need to go to 50 or more (out of
> 60!!) to even hear GBN!

I've just compared GBN against Sky News, BBC News Channel and BBC One,
all in SD on satellite. And the sound levels seem pretty similar to me.

I also compared the HD versions of GBN and BBC News, and they are also
fairly similar.

The problem isn't the sound level but the poor sound-vision sync and the
occasions of off-mike voices (as if they've faded up a mike on the other
side of the studio and are picking up room acoustics).

[williamwright]

On 14/06/2021 22:21, Woody wrote:

> The bit that is getting me is not the poor {enter your own choice here}
> but more the abysmally low sound. We normally have our TV sound at about
> 35 on BBC News Channel or Sky but we need to go to 50 or more (out of
> 60!!) to even hear GBN!

I had it on in the workshop and on the ordinary telly I couldn't get it
loud enough to hear properly. In the end I tuned it in on a Freeview box
that is connected to an audio amp and listen to it that way.

On satellite, a couple of hours ago the sound was still low, but it's OK
now, level-wise at least. But at 0042 everything except the ticker
thingy went dead for a minute or so.

Bill

[williamwright]

On 15/06/2021 00:34, NY wrote:
> On 14/06/2021 22:21, Woody wrote:
>> The bit that is getting me is not the poor {enter your own choice
>> here} but more the abysmally low sound. We normally have our TV sound
>> at about 35 on BBC News Channel or Sky but we need to go to 50 or more
>> (out of 60!!) to even hear GBN!
>
> I've just compared GBN against Sky News, BBC News Channel and BBC One,
> all in SD on satellite. And the sound levels seem pretty similar to me.

Yes, they brought the level up at midnight approx. Until then sat and
DTT were both very low.

Bill

[Roderick Stewart]

Presenters of live shows usually have discreet earphones fed with
gallery talkback, which will be a cacophony of everything that is
going on in the gallery, typically dominated by the director screaming
and swearing at everyone and the PA calmly calling out shot numbers
and camera numbers, while the Technical Manager may also be on the
phone to somebody in the background. To present a live show properly
in these circumstances it's necessary to be a professional who can
cope with all this audible panic while appearing outwardly calm,
confident, knowledgeable and in charge, and to be able to ad-lib and
improvise with a smile at a moment's notice if there is a sudden
change of plan or something fails to work. This requires a special set
of qualities and skills possessed by very few. It looks like magic
when it works, and can quickly descend into chaos when it doesn't.

Rod.

[Mark Carver]

From what I can gather from various sources, the technical set up is
woefully inadequate for what they are trying to do. In fact it would be
inadequate for a simple shopping channel.
For instance it seems they may only be using an 8 input audio mixer !

It's just been thrown together by a bunch of well meaning I'm genuinely
sure, but inexperienced technical staff. I don't think the channel has
an Engineering Director ?

They need a properly engineered, designed, and debugged broadcast studio
system. That doesn't come cheap, or quickly

[MrSpoo...@w4851tef.gov]

On Mon, 14 Jun 2021 16:15:06 +0100
"NY" <m...@privacy.invalid> wrote:
>Looking again critically at the pictures of my HD satellite recordings of
>Welcome to GB News and Tonight Live with Dan Wootton, I'm wondering whether

I do wonder how the target audience of GBNews will take to a slightly camp
kiwi.

[MrSpoo...@ik4n3jafg.ac.uk]

On Tue, 15 Jun 2021 00:34:20 +0100
NY <m...@privacy.net> wrote:
>On 14/06/2021 22:21, Woody wrote:
>> The bit that is getting me is not the poor {enter your own choice here}
>> but more the abysmally low sound. We normally have our TV sound at about
>> 35 on BBC News Channel or Sky but we need to go to 50 or more (out of
>> 60!!) to even hear GBN!
>
>I've just compared GBN against Sky News, BBC News Channel and BBC One,
>all in SD on satellite. And the sound levels seem pretty similar to me.

Is there some kind of one upmanship going on here with sources? Why TF would
anyone watch it on satellite when its available on Freeview?

[MrSpo...@mntf7zr6kw4e_8v1.ac.uk]

London Live is still going after god knows how many years with apparently
an audience of 3 people and a bored dog so there's hope for GBNews yet.

[Jeff Gaines]

On 15/06/2021 in message <u4jgcg9a03vdgaldl...@4ax.com>

Roderick Stewart wrote:

>Presenters of live shows usually have discreet earphones fed with
>gallery talkback, which will be a cacophony of everything that is
>going on in the gallery,

I have never experienced that live but I enjoyed the TV series "The
Newsroom" which managed to get a lot of the excitement across, as well as
having some very attractive females in it!

--
Jeff Gaines Wiltshire UK
There is absolutely no substitute for a genuine lack of preparation

[JNugent]

If you have Sky, you tend to watch everything on that, mainly because it
only requires the use of one remote control.

[Andy Burns]

MrSpoo...@ik4n3jafg.ac.uk wrote:

> Why TF would
> anyone watch it on satellite when its available on Freeview?

On terrestrial it's SD, on satellite it's HD.

[MB]

On 14/06/2021 19:31, TonyGamble wrote:
>> The presenters seem to be taking the piss out of the technical quality.
> Once the presenters adopt that attitude the channel is doomed.

I wonder if there will be any early resignations?

[MB]

On 14/06/2021 08:16, Brian Gaff (Sofa) wrote:
> Andrew Neil is far too full of himself of late, presenting his views as the
> one true way a lot more than he used to.
> Brian


I have thought that for some time, he is very overrated.

I gave up watching the late night This Week programme because it was the
same unfunny people with very corny gags every week. Too cosy.

[NY]

<MrSpoo...@ik4n3jafg.ac.uk> wrote in message
news:sa9lg0$1uf0$1...@gioia.aioe.org...

Because a) my satellite reception is better than my Freeview reception, and
b) GB News is HD on satellite but sub-SD (only 544x576) on terrestrial.

[NY]

<MrSpoo...@w4851tef.gov> wrote in message
news:sa9lar$1s2j$1...@gioia.aioe.org...

"Slightly"?

[MB]

On 14/06/2021 14:17, MrSpook_...@5tf2vh.biz wrote:
> Given how many TV channels there are these days with only a certain pool of
> professionals to go around, you might not be far from the truth.


Perhaps they have been throwing around so much money to get big names
and not enough left for the rest?

[MB]

On 14/06/2021 08:14, Brian Gaff (Sofa) wrote:
> Seriously though, it should be simple with modern kit to have a time
> signature that could effectively make sure they were delayed so they agreed.
> The old problems tended to be when the audio and video got separated or had
> different delays for som reason.
> Brian

Not so sure, I believe there are things that can happen with digital
signals to affect lip sync.

Years ago our Freeview here was out of lip sync, it took ages to get
someone to investigate. NTL switched transmitters whilst speaking to me
on the phone.

They locked it onto the good side until someone could go and change the
unit.

Usual case that if there are no alarms then everything must be OK!

[MB]

On 14/06/2021 16:42, Andy Burns wrote:
> Are the reflections real, or could it be a virtual studio with
> reflections added to virtual surfaces?



Is anything real in modern studios! Certainly much of the "talent"
don't seem to be.

[Davey]

I was watching on Freeview at about 9:20 this morning, and had the
sound at a comfortable level, low enough to not wake 'er asleep in the
room above. Then they switched to adverts, and I was blasted back in my
chair, and just managed to lower the volume to a reasonable level
before she woke up. Then when the programme came back on, I could hardly
hear a thing.

--
Davey.

[tim...]

"Bob Latham" <b...@sick-of-spam.invalid> wrote in message
news:593c1a...@sick-of-spam.invalid...
> In article <xn0mz3ki2...@news.individual.net>,

> Jeff Gaines <jgaines...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>
>> Watching on Sky 515, it's the only channel I've seen for years with
>> lip sync problems, anybody else seeing this?
>

> Same on Freeview and variable sound levels.

I don't have variable sound

I have barely audible sound

so much so that it's impossible to watch

(Not that I was impressed with the 5 minutes that I did wade through)

[TonyGamble]

"From what I can gather from various sources, the technical set up is
woefully inadequate for what they are trying to do. In fact it would be

inadequate for a simple shopping channel............."

I feel sorry for the presenters, many of whom, unlike Andrew Neil, are still trying to build their careers.

It is so unfair for them to be let down so often by amateurish technology.

I wonder when they will get complaints from the advertisers for running the commercials in a smaller (framed) screen.

[charles]

In article <13818778-7cc4-445b...@googlegroups.com>,

TonyGamble <tonyg...@compuserve.com> wrote:
> "From what I can gather from various sources, the technical set up is
> woefully inadequate for what they are trying to do. In fact it would be
> inadequate for a simple shopping channel............."

> I feel sorry for the presenters, many of whom, unlike Andrew Neil, are
> still trying to build their careers.

> It is so unfair for them to be let down so often by amateurish technology.

Does the problem lie with the purseholders? If you can buy a webcam from
Morgans for £25, why do you need to spend any more?

> I wonder when they will get complaints from the advertisers for running
> the commercials in a smaller (framed) screen.

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle

[Roderick Stewart]

Lip sync was never a problem on television until we invented it. Then
we had to invent solutions for it. Before everything went digital it
would have required extra effort to get the sound and picture out of
sync unless you were using film. Now it's so commonplace that we just
get used to it unless it's really bad.

Luckily gadgets to correct it are now a standard item of hi-fi
equipment. Search for "lip sync corrector" or "audio delay".

https://www.amazon.co.uk/LINDY-70449-Lip-Sync-Corrector/dp/B005ZRWWJ0/ref=sr_1_3?dchild=1&keywords=lip+sync+corrector&qid=1623753710&sr=8-3

I have one of these connected in the "tape monitor" circuit of a hi-fi
amplifier so I can switch it in and out of circuit with a single
button as required. There is absolutely no audible change in volume or
quality. The delay time can be adjusted, but I find that a permanent
delay of 100ms seems to suit most sources closely enough and I only
occasionally need to switch it out.

Rod.

[TonyGamble]

> Does the problem lie with the purseholders? If you can buy a webcam from
> Morgans for £25, why do you need to spend any more?

Probably.

I say that as a beancounter who left the profession to learn how to be a manager by working in commercial television.

[Roderick Stewart]

On Tue, 15 Jun 2021 08:13:14 +0100, Mark Carver
<mark....@invalid.invalid> wrote:

> From what I can gather from various sources, the technical set up is
>woefully inadequate for what they are trying to do. In fact it would be
>inadequate for a simple shopping channel.
>For instance it seems they may only be using an 8 input audio mixer !
>
>It's just been thrown together by a bunch of well meaning I'm genuinely
>sure, but inexperienced technical staff. I don't think the channel has
>an Engineering Director ?

Every professional sound engineer I've met has a story about somebody
who decided to shoot something on the cheap, with the sound being done
as an afterthought by a friend who "knows about sound" or "knows about
electronics" but with no broadcast experience, because they think
recording sound is easy. In the worst case they can end up with days
or weeks worth of material which has no useable sound or none at all.
It's an expensive lesson, usually even more expensive than it would
have been to pay a professional to do it properly.

Rod.

[Roderick Stewart]

You can also stream it online from their website. It's hard to tell if
it's HD or SD, but in any case this would only apply to the studio
content. Most of the actual news material has the usual "mobile phone
on location" look that nearly everything beyond a studio has now.

Rod.

[charles]

In article <bn1hcgpo63its7rrb...@4ax.com>,

Some years ago, I was involved in play where a piano had to be played. The
actor couldn't play, so the piano had to be set so that the audience
couldn't see the keyboard. The diector handed me a cassette! and said "a
friend recorded this" I listened (automatic level control & it sounded as
though it was done in a bathroom) and said I needed the music score which
I eventually got. Then visited a friend with a Steinway, taking my trusty
Revox. We only did one take and most of the audience thought the actor was
playing live.

[Chris Youlden]

On 14/06/2021 17:28, Brian Gregory wrote:
> On 14/06/2021 08:51, Jeff Gaines wrote:
>>>
>>> Why was Andrew Neil in semi darkness, so much so that he looked
>>> really grainy.
>>
>> Thank heavens for small mercies, he looks better in the dark :-)
>>
>
> I was watching in HD on satellite.
> It was fascinating watching the snow dance on his face.
> It didn't quite look like normal low light graininess though, it kind of
> formed a few weird swirly patterns that persisted for a moment, like
> maybe there was heavy digital processing of some kind going on.
>

Bad decision to have such dark backgrounds IMO, especially in news. And
I don't rate their graphics; the logos, news strap font look like they
were designed by a Sixth Form media class. That's the sort of thing
which creates an impression right away.


--

Chris

[Chris Youlden]

If there is an FM, which isn't necessarily so, he/she will indicate the
next camera and stand beside it if possible. If the presenter is looking
to the wrong camera, the FM will signal to the presenter that they
should be on another camera.

News presenters usually listen to production talkback in my experience
as there is a considerable amount of information flowing between
presenter and gallery during a live, fast moving programme.

--

Chris

[williamwright]

So you equate a preference for news that isn't slanted to the left with
homophobia and xenophobia?

Bill

[MrSpo...@hrul8v5kq.co.uk]

You don't have to be homophobic to be turned off by some guy mincing about
and with an accent that could break glass. Plus he's crap - I listened to him
occasionally on talkRadio and he couldn't argue his way out of a wet paper
bag. He should have stuck to showbiz reporting.

[Java Jive]

On 15/06/2021 10:01, Davey wrote:
>
> I was watching on Freeview at about 9:20 this morning, and had the
> sound at a comfortable level, low enough to not wake 'er asleep in the
> room above. Then they switched to adverts, and I was blasted back in my
> chair, and just managed to lower the volume to a reasonable level
> before she woke up. Then when the programme came back on, I could hardly
> hear a thing.

The Naked Scientists on BBC Radio Cambridgeshire has started doing that
with their f*king loud jingles, so I've decided to stop listening to it.
Most of it is repeated, with less extreme abuse of its audience, on 5
Live Science anyway.

WTF can't these people manage such a simple thing as to have a
consistent audio level throughout a single broadcast?

--

Fake news kills!

I may be contacted via the contact address given on my website:
www.macfh.co.uk

[Chris J Dixon]

Roderick Stewart wrote:

>Presenters of live shows usually have discreet earphones fed with
>gallery talkback, which will be a cacophony of everything that is

>going on in the gallery, typically dominated by the director screaming
>and swearing at everyone and the PA calmly calling out shot numbers
>and camera numbers, while the Technical Manager may also be on the
>phone to somebody in the background. To present a live show properly
>in these circumstances it's necessary to be a professional who can
>cope with all this audible panic while appearing outwardly calm,
>confident, knowledgeable and in charge, and to be able to ad-lib and
>improvise with a smile at a moment's notice if there is a sudden
>change of plan or something fails to work. This requires a special set
>of qualities and skills possessed by very few. It looks like magic
>when it works, and can quickly descend into chaos when it doesn't.

I had an interesting visit to BBC Nottingham studios some years
ago, during which they had things set up so that we could
appreciate, from a nearby conference room, how things would be in
the gallery as the local evening news was transmitted.

A couple of digital projectors were arranged with split screens
so that we could see the feeds from studio cameras, satellite
van, autocue, VT, and hear the talkback. It was certainly
interesting. You only realise how tricky it is when you see it
done badly.

Somewhere on line I have seen a broadcast with talkback included,
where the gallery are going absolutely frantic, but I have sadly
no idea where I found it.

Chris
--
Chris J Dixon Nottingham UK
ch...@cdixon.me.uk @ChrisJDixon1

Plant amazing Acers.

[williamwright]

You are avoiding my question.

Bill

[MrSpook_1...@2m_ow.com]

On Tue, 15 Jun 2021 15:39:52 +0100

The answer is no.

[NY]

"Chris J Dixon" <ch...@cdixon.me.uk> wrote in message
news:9kbhcg5r4pf7fnvqc...@4ax.com...

> I had an interesting visit to BBC Nottingham studios some years
> ago, during which they had things set up so that we could
> appreciate, from a nearby conference room, how things would be in
> the gallery as the local evening news was transmitted.
>
> A couple of digital projectors were arranged with split screens
> so that we could see the feeds from studio cameras, satellite
> van, autocue, VT, and hear the talkback. It was certainly
> interesting. You only realise how tricky it is when you see it
> done badly.
>
> Somewhere on line I have seen a broadcast with talkback included,
> where the gallery are going absolutely frantic, but I have sadly
> no idea where I found it.

The National Museum of Photography, Film and Television in Bradford used to
have an excellent exhibit until about 10 years ago: a mockup of the ITV
Calendar news studio, with the various studio cameras feeds, the OB, VT and
film feeds and the gallery talkback channel. They used all the material they
had of the famous Summit Tunnel fire of 20 December 1984 when a train
carrying tankers of petrol, travelling on the line under the Pennines
between Manchester and Todmorden, caught fire: I remember it happening and
the news footage was horrendous: huge fireballs coming out of all the tunnel
air shafts.

It was very instructive to hear how programme was managed. I think there was
late-breaking footage arriving during the programme so the running order was
constantly changing.

Sadly it was all taken away and replaced by a static exhibit that was much
less interesting - but probably had more buttons for the kiddies to press.

[Woody]

For the record, now the National Science and Media Museum, part of the
Science Museum group.

[MB]

On 15/06/2021 14:50, Chris J Dixon wrote:
> Somewhere on line I have seen a broadcast with talkback included,
> where the gallery are going absolutely frantic, but I have sadly
> no idea where I found it.

Many years ago, one of the old BBC sports programmes (Grandstand?) ran a
recording of one of the experienced presenters with what he was hearing
in his earpiece at the time.

[NY]

"Woody" <harro...@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
news:saar2c$6a4$1...@dont-email.me...

> On Tue 15/06/2021 18:29, NY wrote:
>> The National Museum of Photography, Film and Television in Bradford

> For the record, now the National Science and Media Museum, part of the
> Science Museum group.

Thanks. I knew the name had changed to a slightly less unwieldy one, but I
couldn't be arsed to look it up.

The NSMM is a classic example of a museum which started out great (the
Calendar studio and the Tim Hunkin "Secret Life of Machines"-type
explanations of how TV works stood out for me) but then went downhill as it
tried to cater too much for children and not additionally for adults. By all
means explain concepts in a way that will interest and inform children, but
also have some "meat" (technical detail) for the adults. They could have
demos of how VTRs worked (quad and helical scan) because that is pretty
mind-boggling and comparisons of TV cameras (eg image orthicon with its
black halos around bright objects and vice versa; vidicon smear;
plumbicon/saticon lag/comet tailing - gradually getting better with later
technology; CCD/CMOS - fairly bullet-proof but less tolerant of
overexposure, especially of one colour channel only). Maybe even comparison
of 16 film camera and developing tank versus 1980s ENG camera (with backpack
VTR) versus modern camcorder with built-in solid-state data storage to show
how size has reduced.

But more and more space seems to be taken up with art-gallery pop-up
exhibitions. What exhibits are left get spoiled by unsupervised/unruly
children barging everyone else out of the way. I waited patiently to get my
hands on a studio TV camera (almost certainly a mock-up and not the genuine
tube or solid-state sensor) to try my hand at panning/tilting/zooming at the
same time, so an object appears to grow out of the corner of a frame -
impressive when it's done by someone competent (ie not me!). And I'd been
doing it for about a minute when a kid tried to shoulder-barge me out of the
way, saying "it's my turn now". Fortunately an adult (his mum?) gave him a
good stern 10-on-the-Richter-Scale bollocking ;-) When I'd had my "play", I
caught the woman's eye and mouthed "thanks" and beckoned the lad over. I
noticed that he spent about 30 seconds wrenching the camera to the full
extent of its mountings side/side and up/down, zoomed in and out and then
said "This is BORING". Now if there hadn't be the adult present, I'd have
been in danger of being bullied by a dog-in-the-manger, and if he'd thrown a
tantrum, I could have been made to take the blame.

Maybe more "interpreter" staff are needed to explain to children (and maybe
some adults) the significance of the exhibits.

It was about 2012 when I last went, I think, so things may well have changed
since then. For the better?

[Brian Gaff (Sofa)]

No listen to the output from the Brighton radio Sussex studio at certain
times, you can hear somebody doing the levels in the middle of interviews
and songs. It sounds almost as if there is no pre show set up of master
levels from the channels and they are using each individual fader as the
only means to balance the output, that is ridiculous when even el cheapo
home mixers have controls to pre set the channels level so right up is
right up and all that. Most these days even have nice sounding limiters as
well, unlike the old level devil by Alice we use at our tn, which distorts
terrible for a split second when a loud noise comes along.
The adverts on most tv stations seem to be mega compressed so even though
the peaks are exactly the same, the perceived levels are higher.
Brian

--

This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...
bri...@blueyonder.co.uk
Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
"Java Jive" <ja...@evij.com.invalid> wrote in message
news:saab50$9g7$1...@gioia.aioe.org...

[Andy Burns]

Jeff Gaines wrote:

> lip sync problems

audio gremlins gone today?

[NY]

"Andy Burns" <use...@andyburns.uk> wrote in message
news:iiu77o...@mid.individual.net...

> Jeff Gaines wrote:
>
>> lip sync problems
>
> audio gremlins gone today?

What do you think? Of course they haven't :-(

Just watched the programme that's going out now and one of the reporters
seems to be connected by low bandwidth mobile internet, so the picture is
breaking up into macro blocks and has horrendous sync problems. Now some of
that may be the poor way the reporter is communicating with the studio, but
even the presenters have some sync problem.

This one will run and run: until they get their equipment supplier and
commissioner back in to sort it out properly.

I'm amazed that this problem wasn't sorted out in the pre-launch acceptance
testing, unless it only became apparent when they started broadcasting. The
fact that the amount of lag seems to vary from camera to camera within the
studio suggests that it is internal and is *not* a broadcasting artefact.

I wonder if us techies will ever get to hear what the problem is caused by.

[Pamela]

On 11:01 15 Jun 2021, TonyGamble said:

> "From what I can gather from various sources, the technical set up
> is woefully inadequate for what they are trying to do. In fact it
> would be inadequate for a simple shopping channel............."

It's is worse than that: GB News's technical quality is inadequate for a
teenager's video blog.

Audio sync, less than SD picture quality, studio background the same
colour as presenter's clothing, etc. Several presenters were poorly
prepared.

Quite amazing considering the time they had to get it right.

[Pamela]

On 09:31 14 Jun 2021, John Armstrong said:
> On Sun, 13 Jun 2021 22:24:57 -0700 (PDT), TonyGamble
> <tonyg...@compuserve.com> wrote:
>
>>Watched 6.00 to 6.10 this morning out of curiosity.
>>
>>Sound balance problems as they cut from studio to ob or vtr.
>>
>>Image sharper without the Andrew Neil image dominating.
>>
>>All rather 'jolly'. A bit like that wierd thing on BBC1 that follows
>>the Breakfast prog with all those trainers and sweat shirts to prove
>>they are part of 'the people' and all the potted palms.
>>
>>It can't be easy to start a news channel but I wonder where they
>>poached their staff from - or did they use the pool of ones without
>>jobs?
>>
>
> I read through this thread, and switched on at 9.15 am "out of
> curiosity" too. I'm watching on Virgin 626, allegedly HD.
>
> Lip sync problems still apparent in the studio, though not from the
> "guests" around the country. The shot from Durham started off with a
> dreadful echo on sound, which they cleared after a few seconds.
>
> One of the commercials a few minutes ago was advertising "How to buy
> gold bullion". Not something I'm ever likely to do. I wonder what
> their target audience is.
>
> Switched off about 9.28. Seems a fair trial! :-)

GB News spoilt its launch, at the time curious viewers tuned in. What a
cock up.

[Pamela]

On 11:23 14 Jun 2021, said:

> On Mon, 14 Jun 2021 02:56:40 -0700 (PDT)
> TonyGamble <tonyg...@compuserve.com> wrote:
>>"A lot of the presenters and back office staff were poached from
>>Wireless Group"
>>
>>According to their web site they supply radio material.
>>
>>That explains the problem of working on television then.
>
> Radio and TV presenters are pretty interchangable these days and
> have been for quite a while.
>

They don't always fare equally well. Victoria Derbyshire was excellent on
radio but never seems comfortable on tv even after many years.

[Pamela]

On 18:29 14 Jun 2021, Andy Burns said:

> Brian Gregory wrote:
>
>> they had the wrong microphone faded up and while you couldn't hear
>> NO being interviewed you could clearly hear a woman whisper
>> something like "yes, well I don't know, no"
>
> I've heard faint talkback speech in the background several times.
> They seem to know there's horrid echo on the outside contributions,
> because when the interviewee is speaking they fade over to a
> different audi which sounds clean, then they switch back to the
> echoey version when the interviewer/interviewee are speaking to each
> other.

Surely they had endless rehearsals where most of this could have been
ironed out.

[Pamela]

On 16:15 14 Jun 2021, NY said:

> "JNugent" <jennings&c...@fastmail.fm> wrote in message
> news:iioql1...@mid.individual.net...
>> On 13/06/2021 09:49 pm, NY wrote:
>>> "Jeff Gaines" <jgaines...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
>>> news:xn0mz3ki2...@news.individual.net...
>>>>
>>>> Watching on Sky 515, it's the only channel I've seen for years
>>>> with lip sync problems, anybody else seeing this?
>>>
>>> Yes, terrible sync problems. I'm glad it's not just me. I'm
>>> watching a recording of the HD feed on satellite. I don't know
>>> what the effect is on SD on terrestrial. It was bad with Andrew
>>> Neil's introduction and for the time when the reporters (north
>>> east, Northern Ireland, south east) introduced themselves - though
>>> the Birmingham reporter was bang in sync. I presume those
>>> introductions were recorded rather than live.
>>
>> Although Andrew Neil was eventually shown (by a reflection in a
>> glass panel) to be in the studio with several other presenters, at
>> first, due to the fuzzy nature of his image on-screen, I thought he
>> was at home, phoning it in on Facetime.

>
>
> Looking again critically at the pictures of my HD satellite
> recordings of Welcome to GB News and Tonight Live with Dan Wootton,

> I'm wondering whether the studio cameras were either SD upscaled to
> HD or lower bitrate, or both. There were a few reflections off
> chromium objects which looked to have jagged edges that were too
> coarse to be HD. And the pictures of adverts, graphics and some of
> the recorded or remote insert reports looked sharper than the studio
> shots.
>
> Look at
> https://i.postimg.cc/50SGbJpx/vlcsnap-2021-06-14-16h10m41s205.png.
> Look in particular at the reflections from the curved stand that is
> holding the globe in the top left of the screen - very coarse jagged
> edge. And is it my imagination or is the background (eg the plant to
> the right of the woman) a bit sharper than the woman herself (I
> chose a frame where she wasn't moving) - did the camera focus
> somewhere in between the two instead of on the woman?

Live quality is so poor on Freeview, it's almost as if they're not
using full SD.

This smacks of excessive cost-cutting but Widipedia says GB News got
all the pre-launch funding (£60 million) it was looking for.

[MB]

On 16/06/2021 12:06, Brian Gaff (Sofa) wrote:
> No listen to the output from the Brighton radio Sussex studio at certain
> times, you can hear somebody doing the levels in the middle of interviews
> and songs.

It used to be funny running the automatic "squeak" during programme. We
would have permission to do so but had to tell them when we were going
to do it,

Some of the presenters were quite funny warning listeners to expect
strange noises (obviously no idea themselves what it was!).

[Pamela]

On 16:22 14 Jun 2021, NY said:

> "JNugent" <jennings&c...@fastmail.fm> wrote in message
> news:iioql1...@mid.individual.net...
>> On 13/06/2021 09:49 pm, NY wrote:
>>> "Jeff Gaines" <jgaines...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
>>> news:xn0mz3ki2...@news.individual.net...
>>>>
>>>> Watching on Sky 515, it's the only channel I've seen for years
>>>> with lip sync problems, anybody else seeing this?
>>>
>>> Yes, terrible sync problems. I'm glad it's not just me. I'm
>>> watching a recording of the HD feed on satellite. I don't know
>>> what the effect is on SD on terrestrial. It was bad with Andrew
>>> Neil's introduction and for the time when the reporters (north
>>> east, Northern Ireland, south east) introduced themselves - though
>>> the Birmingham reporter was bang in sync. I presume those
>>> introductions were recorded rather than live.
>>
>> Although Andrew Neil was eventually shown (by a reflection in a
>> glass panel) to be in the studio with several other presenters, at
>> first, due to the fuzzy nature of his image on-screen, I thought he
>> was at home, phoning it in on Facetime.
>

> https://i.postimg.cc/3x2zn2p4/vlcsnap-2021-06-14-16h17m36s334.png
> shows he was in the same studio as Neil Oliver - unless it is a very
> clever composite shot ;-)
>
> Look at those *horrible* jagged edges on the chromium arms of Neil
> Oliver's chair.
>
> And look at this picture of Andrew Neil
> https://i.postimg.cc/Dy9trxW3/vlcsnap-2021-06-14-16h18m13s855.png -
> no way is that a high quality HD picture ;-) Pin-sharp graphics,
> web-cam quality camera ;-)

The studio looks so bad that it could be someone's garage.

[Andy Burns]

NY wrote:

> Andy Burns wrote:
>
>> audio gremlins gone today?
>
> What do you think? Of course they haven't :-(

haven't noticed any echo on external contributions, lip-sync within the
studio seems ok, the presenter in brum seems to be bandwidth starved -
cars moving behind her creep for a bit, then zoom for a bit, rinse and
repeat, and the top scanline on her camera is "twittering"

[NY]

"Pamela" <pamela.priv...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:XnsAD4B9B0...@144.76.35.252...

> Live quality is so poor on Freeview, it's almost as if they're not
> using full SD.

They're not. I'd been watching on satellite (where their channel is
1920x1080 HD *) and when I happened to look at terrestrial I noticed that
they are sub-SD: 544x576 rather than 720x576. So they are like Drama,
Yesterday, Talking Pictures - lower res than normal SD.



(*) Though only the captions and the adverts are really HD. The studio
cameras look a lot softer than HD, so I wonder whether they are SD upscaled
to HD. The jagged edges on highlights (eg reflections of the chrome arms of
their naff studio furniture) look even more coarse than you'd expect of the
576 lines in SD.

[Robin]

As a non-techie I'm interested in why the sync can be different on
Freeview (where awful) from online(where OK)? And whether the reason is
necessarily within GB News kit rather than within Red Bee's services?

--
Robin
reply-to address is (intended to be) valid

[NY]

"Robin" <r...@outlook.com> wrote in message
news:30cd4099-6b01-d120...@outlook.com...

Over the past few days I've seen good and bad sync with satellite,
terrestrial and online, sometimes between one camera and another within the
same interview. There seems to be a trend that each new programme (or even
segment within the same programme) starts bad and gradually gets better.
That sounds as if it's originating within the studio, rather than after it's
left the studio and gone to the satellite, terrestrial or online broadcast
equipment.


Changing the subject completely, why is the channel called "GB News" when
most of their output is opinion and comment, and they have very little
news-bulletin coverage? Or aren't I supposed to ask that question?

[Tweed]

News, comment? Prompted by this group I tried to watch it this afternoon
from around 1630 to 1715. It was utterly cringeworthy. It was more akin to
a Victoria Wood parody. At one point it went to a whole segment that was a
webcam interview with an owner of a motor home rental company who was
having a bumper summer (surprise surprise). It was introduced as being
pulled forwards from the “good news” segment because it was so important. I
was hoping that the 1630 to 1700 segment was filler and it would turn into
something sensible at 1700, but it didn’t. There wasn’t enough content to
even judge if it was the alleged right wing antidote to the BBC. Made my
BBC local news TV programme look the pinnacle of intellectual output, and
I’d always considered that to be lightweight.

[MB]

On 16/06/2021 18:37, NY wrote:
> Changing the subject completely, why is the channel called "GB News" when
> most of their output is opinion and comment, and they have very little
> news-bulletin coverage? Or aren't I supposed to ask that question?

The big test will be when a major news story breaks in the UK. Will
they be able to cover it or will it be talking heads in the studio?

[charles]

In article <sadeoa$os0$1...@dont-email.me>,

Shades of my visiting the Oracle "newsroom" in the early days. There was a
set showing Ceefax and the editor dictated to his secretary a different
version of the same story.

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle

[MB]

On 16/06/2021 20:13, charles wrote:
> Shades of my visiting the Oracle "newsroom" in the early days. There was a
> set showing Ceefax and the editor dictated to his secretary a different
> version of the same story.

A bit like Twitter with lots of people running one-man news services
with very grandiose names but repeating the same stuff as everyone else.

[Mark Carver]

On 15/06/2021 14:50, Chris J Dixon wrote:
>

> Somewhere on line I have seen a broadcast with talkback included,
> where the gallery are going absolutely frantic, but I have sadly
> no idea where I found it.
>

Here's a classic clip of BBC director Stewart Morris doing the 1977
Eurovision Song Contest

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XTgCLfYdRo4