ITV3 Running Late
galaxyguy
do not run to time. They over run by 2 minutes at the top of the hour.
It is not correct for a TV channel not to start and end broadcasts at
the advertised time. Just last Sunday I was watching 'Super Sleuths'
on ITV3 devoted to Colin Dexter and to 'Morse'. Allegedly the
programme ran from 20.00hrs to 21.00hrs and on BBC 1 at 21.00 I wanted
to see the adaption of Henning Mankell's 'Wallander'. Fortunately the
correct time is displayed on my satellite receiver and on my VHS
recorder. These two digital clocks reminded me that I had to abandon
the end of the ITV3 programme in order to catch the opening scenes of
Wallander. Had I continued watching ITV3 to the end of the programme I
would have missed the start of the BBC 1 schedule; indeed all
broadcaster's schedules. It was not isolated event. I am noticing that
habitually ITV3 is currently starting programmes 2 minutes late. Can
someone advise them to adjust their transmissions so that they start
and finish at the correct time? It does seem to be the most basic task
for any programme controller to check!
Graham C
<nort...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>Many viewers like me will have noticed that ITV3 programme schedules
>do not run to time.
Do any channels run to time? On the last 'Points of View' the BBC
were criticised (what again !) on their timing. One viewer mentioned
the infamous 'One Show', which usually begins three minutes early. (I
had to change the default 2 min start padding to 4 minutes on my Toppy
to catch this one).
Unsurprisingly the BBC reply was that 'although every effort is made
to ensure that programmes run to time, there may be the odd occasion
where a programme will slip BY A FEW SECONDS.'
Can't ever remember watching a' Last Night of the Proms' which didn't
seriously over-run. They must be aware of this one by now.
Surely programmes could be made to run correctly - the broadcasting
authorities have enough programme adverts which can be used as padding
to ensure this. On the other hand these adverts seen more important
than the programmes themselves.
GrahamC
davidr...@postmaster.co.uk
> On Tue, 12 Jan 2010 03:23:20 -0800 (PST), galaxyguy
>
> >Many viewers like me will have noticed that ITV3 programme schedules
> >do not run to time.
>
> Do any channels run to time? On the last 'Points of View' the BBC
> were criticised (what again !) on their timing. One viewer mentioned
> the infamous 'One Show', which usually begins three minutes early. (I
> had to change the default 2 min start padding to 4 minutes on my Toppy
> to catch this one).
>
> Unsurprisingly the BBC reply was that 'although every effort is made
> to ensure that programmes run to time, there may be the odd occasion
> where a programme will slip BY A FEW SECONDS.'
That's quite funny - nice to see them blatantly lying. Things like The
One Show are competitively scheduled to the second - there's a running
order accessible inside the BBC which lists the real start times. It's
pre-planned and intentional - not the result of some unforeseen
"slip". This has been discussed in this group several times.
FWIW, if you have a compatible PVR, the BBC does send out a signal
just before the start of each programme telling it to start recording.
The timing of this signal is accurate to within a second or so - our
recordings always start at the same moment of the BBC station ident
immediately before the programme itself, no matter how early or late
the programme is.
Watching live TV, looking at the time on the clock of a VHS machine
etc - sounds like the 20th century. We're in 2010 now. ;-)
Still, broadcasters should run to published time, and most importantly
should keep their programmes _within_ the specified time slot. It
would allow owners of PVRs to know how many programmes they can
schedule simultaneously, back-to-back, without having to worry about
one channel finishing after the hour, while another starts before the
hour, so requiring an extra tuner which may not be available.
Cheers,
David.
Stephen Wolstenholme
"davidr...@postmaster.co.uk" <davidr...@postmaster.co.uk>
wrote:
>FWIW, if you have a compatible PVR, the BBC does send out a signal
>just before the start of each programme telling it to start recording.
>The timing of this signal is accurate to within a second or so - our
>recordings always start at the same moment of the BBC station ident
>immediately before the programme itself, no matter how early or late
>the programme is.
In my experience the BBC always send the start recording signals at
the correct time. Some other channels are not so reliable.
Steve
--
Neural Planner Software Ltd www.NPSL1.com
Neural network applications, help and support.
Peter Duncanson
"davidr...@postmaster.co.uk" <davidr...@postmaster.co.uk> wrote:
Sometime last year, I think it was, ITV were sending the start signal
for each programme at the beginning of the adverts preceding the
programme which was typically two minutes or so before the advertised
start time of the programmme. If a show was advertised to start at 21:00
the start signal would be transmitted at about 20:58. The show would
then start at, say, 21:03. This sometimes resulted in incomplete
recordings of programmes on non-ITV channels. I think ITV have stopped
doing this.
>
>Watching live TV, looking at the time on the clock of a VHS machine
>etc - sounds like the 20th century. We're in 2010 now. ;-)
>
>Still, broadcasters should run to published time, and most importantly
>should keep their programmes _within_ the specified time slot. It
>would allow owners of PVRs to know how many programmes they can
>schedule simultaneously, back-to-back, without having to worry about
>one channel finishing after the hour, while another starts before the
>hour, so requiring an extra tuner which may not be available.
>
>Cheers,
>David.
--
Peter Duncanson
(in uk.tech.digital-tv)
Java Jive
serious about it. How about complaining to Ofcom, copying your local
MP, and also forwarding the complaint to the Advertising Standards
Authority, explaining that in your view a published schedule is a form
of advertisement, and therefore for it to be decent, honest, legal,
truthful, etc, the programmes in it should start on time.
On Tue, 12 Jan 2010 03:23:20 -0800 (PST), galaxyguy
<nort...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
> Many viewers like me will have noticed that ITV3 programme schedules
> do not run to time.
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Bob Goddard
> On Tue, 12 Jan 2010 03:23:20 -0800 (PST), galaxyguy
> <nort...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>
>>Many viewers like me will have noticed that ITV3 programme schedules
>>do not run to time.
>
> Do any channels run to time? On the last 'Points of View' the BBC
> were criticised (what again !) on their timing. One viewer mentioned
> the infamous 'One Show', which usually begins three minutes early. (I
> had to change the default 2 min start padding to 4 minutes on my Toppy
> to catch this one).
>
> Unsurprisingly the BBC reply was that 'although every effort is made
> to ensure that programmes run to time, there may be the odd occasion
> where a programme will slip BY A FEW SECONDS.'
[...]
At least with the BBC, or you not able to request the actual times under the
FoI act.
davidr...@postmaster.co.uk
wrote:
> On Tue, 12 Jan 2010 04:22:45 -0800 (PST),
> wrote:
>
> >FWIW, if you have a compatible PVR, the BBC does send out a signal
> >just before the start of each programme telling it to start recording.
> >The timing of this signal is accurate to within a second or so - our
> >recordings always start at the same moment of the BBC station ident
> >immediately before the programme itself, no matter how early or late
> >the programme is.
>
> In my experience the BBC always send the start recording signals at
> the correct time. Some other channels are not so reliable.
Yes - channel five is a disaster.
Cheers,
David.
Stephen Wolstenholme
"davidr...@postmaster.co.uk" <davidr...@postmaster.co.uk>
wrote:
>On 12 Jan, 12:41, Stephen Wolstenholme <st...@tropheus.demon.co.uk>
I recorded a series on Five USA but I shouldn't have bothered. The
first of the series is the only one I have attempted to watch and it
started about 10 minutes into the program.
bolta...@boltar.world
Stephen Wolstenholme <st...@tropheus.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>I recorded a series on Five USA but I shouldn't have bothered. The
>first of the series is the only one I have attempted to watch and it
>started about 10 minutes into the program.
I don't know why they don't sort themselves out. A huge number of people
time shift TV programs and if Five can't fix the mismatch between their
EPG and the actual programs then they'll just lose viewers and eventually
advertising revenue.
B2003
IanT
"galaxyguy" <nort...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
news:0d83068e-6d21-414d...@o28g2000yqh.googlegroups.com...
You must lead a really boring life to post such a thing. Does it really
matter
if something overruns by a second or a minute? I am sure ITV would
be really upset to hear that they didn't stick to what your TWO digital
clocks
showed.
Why complain in a newsgroup? What do you think will happen as a result
of complaining in a newsgroup? Have you complained directly to the
television company - if not, why not?
The last question must be - do you think anyone is that bothered?
The easiest thing to do is set your timer for a few minutes before the start
of what you want to record and also allow a few minutes at the end. That
will mean you get a full recording.
Don't forget, this is NOT a complaint department for ITV, no one from
ITV will respond to you here. To complain TO ITV you must contact
ITV directly.
IanT
"Graham C" <graha...@btopenworld.com> wrote in message
news:0look5ptthf7evj5o...@4ax.com...
Even national radio stations never run on time. They put adverts on the
hour and delay the news by a few minutes depending on the time of day.
It's to force people to hear adverts when they tune in for the news!
TV channels use similar tricks to almost force people to watch their
programme and to miss a rival one on another channel. It's all about
delaying and annoying people to try and get ratings. If you believe what
RAJAR produce then you're mad. TV companies also lower the volume
of programs below what is normal, so people turn the volume up and
then complain about being blasted by adverts. Really the advert is at
the normal level. Many many tricks are used. Nothing ever runs on time.
Mark Carver
> Don't forget, this is NOT a complaint department for ITV, no one from
> ITV will respond to you here.
No they certainly won't, but you'd be surprised who lurks in these
groups sometimes.
--
Mark
Please replace invalid and invalid with gmx and net to reply.
J G Miller
> No they certainly won't, but you'd be surprised who lurks in these
> groups sometimes.
Regardless of who lurks in these newsgroups, people making comments
about programs starting late or early will not alter the tactics of
the BBC or ITV network in their early or late running of programs
in the attempt to capture and hold a larger audience share.
Ian
<mark....@invalid.invalid> writes
>On 12/01/2010 21:50, IanT wrote:
>
>> Don't forget, this is NOT a complaint department for ITV, no one from
>> ITV will respond to you here.
>
>No they certainly won't, but you'd be surprised who lurks in these
>groups sometimes.
>
>
spoiler in the introduction to one of it's soaps.
Tonight before Emmerdale, " go to ITV.com to see the list of suspects
for the murder of Mark ", who's not dead yet.
Brain dead gradiots strike again.
--
Ian
Owain
> Do any channels run to time?
Yes - QVC are always on time with their top of the hour ident. Their
production values are way ahead of the BBC. They do have two really
irritating women who say "you know" a lot, but if you don't want the
collapsible coathangers or tiffnee-style lighting you probably won't
need to watch them.
Owain
galaxyguy
> "galaxyguy" <northe...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
I don't know why you think it so so peculiar to post a question about
digital TV to a digital post TV group. It has not been posted
elsewhere, this site is entirely appropriate. I think that TV viewers
who have a choice of channels have a perfect right to be able to see
to see the end of a programme on one channel and then be able, at the
top of the hour, to catch the start of another on another channel. BBC
1 were correctly broadcasting to time, ITV3 were not. Both channels
were featuring programmes of interest to the same audience, those
interested in crime fiction. I was obliged to forego the conclusions
of 'Super Sleuths' in order to see the start of 'Wallander' and I had
to keep an eye on the correct time in order to do so. I notice that
ITV3 seem to start virtually all programmes 2 minutes late, I wouldn't
have a problem with that if the programme ended at a time that enabled
me to see the conclusion and then see the start of another programme
on another channel.
It seems basic enough to me and as both channels broadcast in a
digital format, I make no apologises. I wondered whether all the trash
that ITV3 keep pumping out about Yorkshire might have caused the
error, but in the daytime as well their programmes start 2 minutes
late.
It's not good enough. I disagree about the radio comments here.
Although Magic and Heart sometimes ignore the top of the hour and the
news, they are only putting out lightweight pop and no-one is put to
inconvenience by their scheduling. BBC Radio starts programmes
promptly and reliably, especially on FM, and they follow their
schedules. ITV3 may be a minor 'digital only' channel but its audience
size must be one of the largest amongst these stations, especially as
it is FTA on any satellite receiver and FTA on Freeview. These threads
are picked up by people across the media and I'm sure that personnel
at this station have sight of all daily internet comment written about
them. All they need do is have one person set it up via Google.
British TV used to have a reputation for broadcasting correctly to
their schedules. Viewers have a right to point out the implications
raised through their inconsistencies and use forums such as this one
devoted to the subject to comment. I was not off subject. My comments
may have been 'an ITV complaint' but as the thread has shown it has
revealed that many channels ignore timekeeping, it's just that ITV3
does it every hour, not just when motor racing or the proms over run,
as it might do on BBC. I think TV stations should take note, or be
encouraged too through public complaint/comment.
killjoy
> On Tue, 12 Jan 2010 04:22:45 -0800 (PST),
> "davidr...@postmaster.co.uk"<davidr...@postmaster.co.uk>
> wrote:
>
>> FWIW, if you have a compatible PVR, the BBC does send out a signal
>> just before the start of each programme telling it to start recording.
>> The timing of this signal is accurate to within a second or so - our
>> recordings always start at the same moment of the BBC station ident
>> immediately before the programme itself, no matter how early or late
>> the programme is.
>
> In my experience the BBC always send the start recording signals at
> the correct time. Some other channels are not so reliable.
>
> Steve
>
back to padding rather than use the Freeview automation as I've missed
the end of too many BBC programmes.
KJ
Mizter T
PVR users aren't exactly the greatest consumers of television
commercials...
Mizter T
On Jan 12, 1:45 pm, Peter Duncanson <m...@peterduncanson.net> wrote:
>
> Sometime last year, I think it was, ITV were sending the start signal
> for each programme at the beginning of the adverts preceding the
> programme which was typically two minutes or so before the advertised
> start time of the programmme. If a show was advertised to start at 21:00
> the start signal would be transmitted at about 20:58. The show would
> then start at, say, 21:03. This sometimes resulted in incomplete
> recordings of programmes on non-ITV channels. I think ITV have stopped
> doing this.
Which makes sense from ITV's perspective, as PVR viewers might, just
might, end up watching a few commercials as a result.
Mizter T
Exactly. People should bear in mind that overall TV viewing is on the
decline too. (I don't watch very much of the stuff!)
Stephen Wolstenholme
It's easy to fast forward through any commercials. It's a skill to
stop at exactly the right moment but well worth a bit of practicing. A
flash of the sponsors part way through the break, to encourage
stooping too soon, can be difficult to spot in fast forward :)
tim....
"J G Miller" <mil...@yoyo.ORG> wrote in message news:1263340...@vo.lu...
How does starting early capture extra audience?
tim
J G Miller
> How does starting early capture extra audience?
More people watch the regional news from the BBC than that provided
by ITV Broadcasting Limited.
Thus a viewer who is about to switch to ITV-1 for Emmerdale who gets to
see the start of The One Show at 18:58h may become so enthralled by the
topics which the show is going to cover forgets to change channels.
Johnny B Good
from Stephen Wolstenholme <st...@tropheus.demon.co.uk> contains these words:
The current sponsors of Chanel Four's "The Simpsons" (a directory
services company - 118,118, ISTR ;-) are a godsend.
The sponsor ad leaves a nice big gap of 'black' between itself and the
program parts (both starts and endings) which gives me a nice clean
recording when I've done with MPEG_Streamclip to lift out parts one and
two and Mpg2Cut2 to rejoin them as a single mpg file (followed by
another MPEG_Streamclip session to clean up the timecode errors
introduced by the joining process).
These are recordings done on my PC using a DVB-T adapter to capture the
TV streams. The DTVR program converts them from transport stream to
program stream on-the-fly but it doesn't entirely strip out all the FEC
rubbish. Using MPEG_Streamclip to convert the resulting mpg file _into_
an mpg file finishes the job nicely, leaving the resultant file about
1.4% smaller (and nicely trimmed).
--
Regards, John.
Please remove the "ohggcyht" before replying.
The address has been munged to reject Spam-bots.
Mark Carver
After watching about 20 seconds of The One Show, I remember how to
change channels again.
J G Miller
> After watching about 20 seconds of The One Show, I remember how to
> change channels again.
I am sure you do, but then I think it is unlikely that you were intending
to watch Emmerdale.
tim....
"J G Miller" <mil...@yoyo.ORG> wrote in message news:126340...@vo.lu...
I very much doubt it
tim
J G Miller
> I very much doubt it
But that will be the thinking used for starting early.
Why do you think it is common practice for US TV shows to go from the
end of one show to the start of the next without a commercial break
and then have the commercial break after the opening to the story?
Get the viewer hooked so that they do not change stations.
davidr...@postmaster.co.uk
No, but five have lots of programme sponsors. I don't know about other
people, but if playback starts on (or I jump to) the 10 second sponsor
bit before the programme, I don't bother skipping it, I just let it
play. So that bit at least gets through to this PVR viewer!
My kids like watching the commercials as much as the programmes! - but
most of the stuff I recorded from five (without thinking to change it
to a manual recording) just got deleted because it was incomplete.
Cheers,
David.
tim....
"J G Miller" <mil...@yoyo.ORG> wrote in message news:126343...@vo.lu...
But that's different
Starting late risks you losing the people who were watching another channel
and switched over at the correct starting time who then find that they have
missed some
tim
Mizter T
On Jan 14, 4:06 pm, "tim...." <tims_new_h...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
> "J G Miller" <mil...@yoyo.ORG> wrote in messagenews:126343...@vo.lu...
But it also catches people who switch on a bit late and might
otherwise switch off or over if they think that they've missed a
critical bit of the narrative - i.e. something that happens very early
on, on which the whole of the rest of the storyline revolves.