RTÉ television reception in Britain
Richard
Wales? Can you get all four channels or is it just the VHF channels?
I'm aware of one enterprising person in Gloucestershire (hello!) who
can get RTÉ One and Network 2 on VHF from Kippure, but is he the only
one?
If regular reception isn't possible, have you ever picked up the Irish
channels via SpE or Tropo?
Richard Logue
(padraic is an anti-spam alias)
Paul Sherwin
>Who here is able to pick the Irish terrestrials off air in England and
>Wales? Can you get all four channels or is it just the VHF channels?
>I'm aware of one enterprising person in Gloucestershire (hello!) who
>can get RTÉ One and Network 2 on VHF from Kippure, but is he the only
>one?
Remember British domestic TVs have never had 625 line VHF, and haven't
had VHF at all for about 30 years, so watching RTE off-air is a pretty
specialist activity.
I think NTL carry RTE1 in some areas.
Best regards, Paul
Paul Sherwin Consulting 22 Monmouth Road, Oxford OX1 4TD, UK
Phone +44 (0)1865 721438 http://www.psherwin.strayduck.com
Mobile +44 (0)7931 578334 mailto:pshe...@strayduck.com
Simon Ough
"Paul Sherwin" <pshe...@strayduck.com> wrote in message
news:3bcabad...@news.onetel.net.uk...
Mark Carver
"Simon Ough" <si...@madhouse2000.greatxscape.net> wrote in message
news:9qego4$ngf18$1...@ID-109603.news.dfncis.de...
> They still use VHF there?????
>
If anyone is 'out of the ordinary', then it's the UK.
I think we are the only country in Europe who have
our TV services exclusively on UHF? Although the Spanish
are now making moves to transfer all of their services
to UHF.
To answer the original question. I used to live in Redruth
Cornwall, and I could regularly receive RTE Radio
from Mt Leinster (sp?) on 94.9. I would reasonably assume
that Band I or III TV reception might therefore be possible.
Philip Striplin
If it's me you're thinking of, and I have reason to think it might be,
I'm in Worcestershire. That makes you at least, oh, 8 miles wrong :)
It doesn't exactly hurt that I'm 800 feet up on the western side of
the Malvern Hills and can see, never mind radio propagation, for about
50 miles or so in the right direction.
I don't think it would work for anyone else this far east. There are a
few people in the west of Wales who get something (and even all the
channels on UHF, particularly on Anglesey), but I'd guess you're
talking about the coastal fringes.
VHF's increasingly nasty though, with more and more local
interference. This is the main reason I prefer Kippure - Mount
Leinster also works (sort of) but it's more theoretical than
practical.
Band 2 is now so crowded I get nothing. Theoretically the Clermont
Carn Lyric FM has a clear channel, but I think it's heavily screened
this way, as I hear nothing (by contrast, the 2-metre amateur beacon
(Drogheda?) comes in fine. In the old days, Kippure would come
through whenever the BBC shut up for the night.
A friend who worked for Rediffusion in Worcester back in the 60's
tells me they used to redistribute RTE, sometimes, unofficially...
They did have a thumping great tower on the tallest hill in the city
(it's still there (1), don't know who owns it now) so I guess it's
possible.
Tara's much less bother...
Phil
(1) To satisfy the pedants, I mean the tower's still there, not the
hill. Which is there also, obviously.
Paul Martin
Richard wrote:
> Who here is able to pick the Irish terrestrials off air in England and
> Wales? Can you get all four channels or is it just the VHF channels?
> I'm aware of one enterprising person in Gloucestershire (hello!) who
> can get RTÉ One and Network 2 on VHF from Kippure, but is he the only
> one?
I've seen many Ireland-facing UHF aerials on the northwest coast of
Wales.
--
Paul Martin <p...@zetnet.net>
Richard
>
> I think NTL carry RTE1 in some areas.
>
Yeah, but as far as I know, all these areas are in Northern Ireland,
nad not Great Britain.
To be honest, people should have the right to receive any station they
want, assuming it is technically possible.
Cheers,
Richard
M.J.Powell
<p...@zetnet.net> writes
And in the opposite direction, when I lived in Dublin in 70/71 it was
common to see 20/30 ft masts on the roofs of houses, guyed to the
corners, supporting 2x 3/4 ele yagis for Band 1, stacked! All pointing
north.
Mike
--
M.J.Powell
Paul Sherwin
wrote:
Cable companies are very restrictive in what they take. I'm sure
there'd be lots of interest in S4C in England, if only for the
rescheduled C4 stuff, and the RTE channels would be useful also. Maybe
it's a copyright issue?
Steve
news:chllstgnmp248s1m1...@4ax.com...
I'm in Worcester - where's the tower, Philip?
Paul Martin
Paul Sherwin wrote:
> Cable companies are very restrictive in what they take. I'm sure
> there'd be lots of interest in S4C in England, if only for the
> rescheduled C4 stuff, and the RTE channels would be useful also. Maybe
> it's a copyright issue?
S4C digital (S4C digidol) does not contain *any* C4 programming. It's
available throughout the UK to DSat (Skybox) viewers. Except for the
education programmes in the mornings, all the programming is in Welsh.
--
Paul Martin <p...@zetnet.net>
Anthony
>
> >Who here is able to pick the Irish terrestrials off air in England and
> >Wales? Can you get all four channels or is it just the VHF channels?
> >I'm aware of one enterprising person in Gloucestershire (hello!) who
> >can get RTÉ One and Network 2 on VHF from Kippure, but is he the only
> >one?
>
> Remember British domestic TVs have never had 625 line VHF, and haven't
> had VHF at all for about 30 years, so watching RTE off-air is a pretty
> specialist activity.
I've come across quite a few TV's with VHF tuners, including my pocket
Citizen and my niece an nephews Ł80 cheapo Proline. I've managed to pick up
Spanish TV on the pocket one with only a amplified aerial designed for such
TVs, this is in Hampshire.
Mark Carver
"Anthony" <a...@sesamestreet.com> wrote in message
news:9qfoll$nmp7m$1...@ID-98017.news.dfncis.de...
> I've come across quite a few TV's with VHF tuners, including my pocket
> Citizen and my niece an nephews £80 cheapo Proline
A friend of mine has just bought a 'Crown' 80 quid telly from Asda.
(Maybe the same chassis ?)
He 'just for fun' connected it up to his defunct NTL cable outlet, and
is able to view on VHF: ITV2, Sky News, Sky 1, CNN, BBC N24,
and a few others. :-)
Richard
>
Yes they do. VHF 625 lines with PAL colour, NICAM stereo and teletext.
AFAIK the UK is the only European country that has its television
services exclusively on UHF. In recent years RTÉ have moved nearly all
their local relays to UHF, and TV3 and TG4 are exclusively on UHF.
RTÉ have 10 main transmitter stations, five of which are VHF/UHF and
five that are exclusively UHF.
Richard
Simon Ough
have any intentions of going UHF only?
(Just out of curiosity)
Simon
"Richard" <padrai...@yahoo.ie> wrote in message
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Paul Sherwin
Well, S4C certainly used to. The Welsh programming generally ended at
about 10:00pm and they took C4 stuff broadcast in England at other
times. I haven't checked the schedules recently - has this changed?
Mark Carver
.
>
> Well, S4C certainly used to. The Welsh programming generally ended at
> about 10:00pm and they took C4 stuff broadcast in England at other
> times. I haven't checked the schedules recently - has this changed?
There are two versions of S4C.
As Paul Martin pointed out there is the *Digital* version as seen
in Wales on Sky EPG 104, rest of UK optionally on 184,
and via DTT in Wales only.
This has no C4 'English' programmes, as C4 is also available
in Wales on Sky 184, and DTT Ch 8.
S4C as seen only in Wales on analogue terrestrial does,
and always has, carried 'timeshifted' and 'live' C4 English output.
Jonathan G Campbell
>
> On 15 Oct 2001 06:54:29 -0700, richa...@my-deja.com (Richard)
> wrote:
>
> >pshe...@strayduck.com (Paul Sherwin) wrote in message news:<3bcabad...@news.onetel.net.uk>...
> >
> >>
> >> I think NTL carry RTE1 in some areas.
> >>
> >
> >Yeah, but as far as I know, all these areas are in Northern Ireland,
> >nad not Great Britain.
> >
> >To be honest, people should have the right to receive any station they
> >want, assuming it is technically possible.
>
> Cable companies are very restrictive in what they take. I'm sure
> there'd be lots of interest in S4C in England, if only for the
> rescheduled C4 stuff, and the RTE channels would be useful also. Maybe
> it's a copyright issue?
>
I'd assume so. In Belfast, (NTL digital) they introduced RTE1 & 2, but
not TV3 or TG4.
I often wondered what did the local emitter of (e.g.) Coronation St.
think about the capture of some of his viewers (along with, presumably,
some advertising revenue).
Also, another example, I _think_ TV3 will show the MUFC game tonight,
not something Sky, or whoever 'owns' it, would like.
Best regards,
Jon C.
--
Jonathan G Campbell BT48 7PG jg.ca...@ntlworld.com 028 7126 6125
http://homepage.ntlworld.com/jg.campbell/
Philip Striplin
Tunnel Hill - just to the east of the railway line, at the top of a
recreation ground. Rather an elaborate structure considering it was
built to cope with a few stacked yagis.
Anthony
news:9qgouq$ntn95$1...@ID-75131.news.dfncis.de...
>
> "Anthony" <a...@sesamestreet.com> wrote in message
> news:9qfoll$nmp7m$1...@ID-98017.news.dfncis.de...
>
> > I've come across quite a few TV's with VHF tuners, including my pocket
>
> A friend of mine has just bought a 'Crown' 80 quid telly from Asda.
> (Maybe the same chassis ?)
>
> He 'just for fun' connected it up to his defunct NTL cable outlet, and
> is able to view on VHF: ITV2, Sky News, Sky 1, CNN, BBC N24,
> and a few others. :-)
Likewise, a friend of mine who had an old Sony VCR was amazed at what he
could watch through it when he moved into his last flat. They didn't
subscribe to cable, but was able to get Sky One, Cartoon Network and VH-1
and a few others (pretty much all the channels they would've be interested
in). This lasted for about a year, clearly NTL weren't in a hurry or simply
didn't realise how many people had access to their channels for free and
quite legally.
Richard
> If TV3 and TG4 are UHF only, then why are RTE1 and 2 still on VHF? Do they
> have any intentions of going UHF only?
>
> (Just out of curiosity)
>
> Simon
>
Well, RTÉ have more or less moved their relay stations to UHF only and
as I have said, half of their main transmitters already broadcast the
four Irish networks on UHF only as well. These are Three Rock
(Dublin), Cairn Hill (Midlands), Spur Hill (Cork), Holywell Hill
(Donegal, but really Derry) and Clermont Carn (North Louth, but really
Northern Ireland).
Looking at the DTT channel allocations to Ireland, none are on Band
III, all are UHF. So it's likely the five remaining high power Band
III TXs will keep RTE 1 and Network 2 on Band III until whenever
Ireland stops analogue broadcasting, sometime in the next 10 years or
so.
The remaining Band III transmitters are Kippure (East), Truskmore
(North West), Maghera (West), Mount Leinster (South East) and
Mullaghanish (South). Note that these sites also broadcast TV3 and TG4
on UHF.
Of all the Irish transmitters, the most likely to be recieved in
Britain are Kippure with RTE 1 on channel E and Network 2 on channel
H, Clermont Carn with RTE 1 on 52 and Network 2 on 56 and possibly
Mount Leinster with RTE 1 on channel F and Network 2 on channel i.
If you want more details, then my site at http://welcome.to/irishtv
will give you more info, click on the TX-DX page.
Regards,
Richard
Richard
> Looking at the DTT channel allocations to Ireland, none are on Band
> III, all are UHF. So it's likely the five remaining high power Band
> III TXs will keep RTE 1 and Network 2 on Band III until whenever
> Ireland stops analogue broadcasting, sometime in the next 10 years or
> so.
Ahh, but UK DAB uses Band III, meaning that NI listeners are deprived
of 5 out of the 7 DAB MUxs because the frequencies clash with ROI. I
wonder do ROI plan to use Band II for DAB. I hope that VHF TV does
stop in ROI, though I wonder whether it will mean more DAB for NI.
Richard (Bell)
Will Downing
"Jonathan G Campbell" <jg.ca...@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
news:3BCCAD99...@ntlworld.com...
Stephen
"Richard" <richa...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
news:e4974946.01101...@posting.google.com...
If we had any sense we would have integrated DAB and DTT in one set top box,
then ITV Digital could have a selection of Radio channels as good as Sky
Digital. The audio encoding for DAB and DTT are similar enough that they
could have been made to work with the same hardware, just as is the case
with Radio from a Sky Digital box. Having a set top box with both UHF and
Band 3 tuners would allow further integration as it would be possible to use
Band 3 for DTT to relieve the shortage of channels, or duplicate DAB at UHF
to provide all the DAB channels to NI. As far as I know, the U.S. are
already using Band 3 for DTT, and Germany intend to do so. In the UK, we
seem to be limiting our options by using Band 3 only for DTT without a
picture (DAB), and requiring a different receiver box for it.
Richardr
ste...@junkmailblocker.sptv.demon.co.uk says...
> If we had any sense we would have integrated DAB and DTT in one set top box,
> then ITV Digital could have a selection of Radio channels as good as Sky
> Digital.
>
But the cost of the box would go up substantially.
Also don't forget that aerials required and transmission black spots
(which are substantial in both cases) are different.
Mark Carver
"Will Downing" <willd...@eircom.net> wrote in message
news:6qqz7.296$8s4....@news.indigo.ie...
> Tv3 are part owned by CanWest inCanada and... Ulster Televiosn (UTV)
They are now AFAIK primarily owned by Granada. Another reason they
show "Coronation St"
Richard
>
UTV sold its stake in TV3. But CanWest also owns a stake in UTV.
>
> "Jonathan G Campbell" <jg.ca...@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
> news:3BCCAD99...@ntlworld.com...
> > > >
> >
> > I'd assume so. In Belfast, (NTL digital) they introduced RTE1 & 2, but
> > not TV3 or TG4.
> >
> > I often wondered what did the local emitter of (e.g.) Coronation St.
> > think about the capture of some of his viewers (along with, presumably,
> > some advertising revenue).
They have been complaining at the propect for years, but are now
putting up with it because:
1. They want people in ROI to watch Corrie on UTV, not TV3.
2. ntl said they would not broadcat UTV via cable in the Republic if
UTV objected to RTE in NI! This wasn't a problem before ntl: bought
cablelink (in ROI) of course.
Richard
Lloydee
Anyone suggest a cheap DIY aerial to pick stuff up under lift conditions?
Incidentaly, I can pick up Today FM quite often on 101.4 here in south Dorset.
Paul Sherwin
Is this normal for analogue cable? Does it just arrive as VHF, and get
frequency shifted in the settop box? If so, I'll keep an eye open for
a cheap VCR next time I'm in Ireland or Europe (I also have a defunct
NTL cable outlet).
Richardr
says...
> Is this normal for analogue cable? Does it just arrive as VHF, and get
> frequency shifted in the settop box? If so, I'll keep an eye open for
> a cheap VCR next time I'm in Ireland or Europe (I also have a defunct
> NTL cable outlet).
>
A lot of UK TV's and videos also have the relevant tuners. Certainly
Philips TVs and videos, and also my current JVC video have the relevant
bands.
Having said that, here nearly all the channels are scrambled (and I
subscribe to virtually all on the digital service).
Mark Carver
> Is this normal for analogue cable? Does it just arrive as VHF, and get
> frequency shifted in the settop box? If so, I'll keep an eye open for
> a cheap VCR next time I'm in Ireland or Europe (I also have a defunct
> NTL cable outlet).
Dunno. I should add that are other channels that are 'scrambled',
but only in a very primitive manner. The syncs look as if they'd been chopped
off or maybe inverted.
The cable system was originally Videotron in Southampton, before it
was 'acquired' by C+W, before they were 'acquired' by NTL, ooh sorry, ntl.
QrizB
get
> > frequency shifted in the settop box? If so, I'll keep an eye open
for
> > a cheap VCR next time I'm in Ireland or Europe (I also have a
defunct
> > NTL cable outlet).
>
> Dunno. I should add that are other channels that are 'scrambled',
> but only in a very primitive manner. The syncs look as if they'd
been chopped
> off or maybe inverted.
>
> The cable system was originally Videotron in Southampton, before it
> was 'acquired' by C+W, before they were 'acquired' by NTL, ooh
sorry, ntl.
I'm sure there's better authorities on this than me, and if any of
them wish to contradict me they're more than welcome to do so.
However, AIUI most NTL analogue cable TV is transmitted as normal PAL
RF signals Yes, they use a wider bit of the frequency spectrum than
the normal UK UHF, not least because they want to keep most of their
channels out of the UHF band to stop interference with video recorders
and the like.
Encrypted channels have their sync pulses suppressed (by 3dB?), which
does a good enough job of confusing TVs.
As I said, I'm just an interested ameteur, and may well be wrong!
--
QrizB
I sound like I know what I'm talking about, but don't be fooled.
Ed Ellers
"AFAIK the UK is the only European country that has its television
services exclusively on UHF."
France did for a while after closing down its 819-line VHF service, but then
started to use VHF for new networks (starting with Canal Plus) in the 1980s.
Ed Ellers
"As far as I know, the U.S. are already using Band 3 for DTT..."
And even Band I, though I don't know of any actual assignments there yet.
Many stations whose analog services are on VHF expect to move back to those
channels once the analog service ends, while some may choose to remain on
the UHF channels that have been assigned to them for their transitional DTV
service. Nothing is set in concrete yet, except that those stations now in
the high end of the UHF band (698-806 MHz) will have to move downward, and
in nearly all cases have already been assigned DTV channels below that range
that can be retained after the switchover. But the best guess that I can
make is that most, if not all, stations now in the "core" spectrum will end
up back on their old channels.
Anthony
> Is this normal for analogue cable? Does it just arrive as VHF, and get
> frequency shifted in the settop box? If so, I'll keep an eye open for
> a cheap VCR next time I'm in Ireland or Europe (I also have a defunct
> NTL cable outlet).
Or just look out for a TV or VCR that has "Hyperband" or "special" channels.
Most shops won't have this displayed as a feature of the TV, though some do.
Argos actually state in their catalogues if a TV has VHF, not so sure about
VCRs. All manuals will state in the specs if the TV or VCR have "Hyperband"
or VHF, and you can download manuals from most manufacturers.
Anthony
>
> "Paul Sherwin" <pshe...@strayduck.com> wrote in message
> news:3bcfffe4...@news.onetel.net.uk...
>
> > Is this normal for analogue cable? Does it just arrive as VHF, and get
> > frequency shifted in the settop box? If so, I'll keep an eye open for
> > a cheap VCR next time I'm in Ireland or Europe (I also have a defunct
> > NTL cable outlet).
>
> Dunno. I should add that are other channels that are 'scrambled',
> but only in a very primitive manner. The syncs look as if they'd been
chopped
> off or maybe inverted.
I believe either those Macrovision removers or an old RTL4 decoder would
sort the picture out.