the rise and fall of david murray smith
graham h
could do no wrong he was winning flat handicaps left right and centre and
trained the likes of rhyme and reason as a novice then he seemed to just
fade away the same goes for stan mellor and others beside it fascinates me
how these good trainers seem to go out of fashion so quickly .
obviously you have owners like wildenstein ,that guy who owned captain john
and that wingfield digby bloke(kendal cavalier)who change trainers more
often than they change their underware and lets face it a lot of the owners
that you see interviewed on telly look like right little shits (thats how
they become succesful enough to earn money for race horses){i am of couse
incredibally jealous of their wealth}but how do trainers become
unfashionable so quickly please tell if you know.....gh
Firebeast
I can only presume the first two have retired, not seeing them in papers for
a while, and if so, they must have gone out really quietly, but Chappy is
still doing the all weather rounds.
At one time he was the dogs doodahs, with some of the best handicappers
around. ( Soba-better than Hcp I know, Chaplins Club, Sullys Choice,
Glencroft, and loads I'm sure I've missed)
Chappy was the sort of bloke all punters wanted on his side, whenever on TV
he always gave an honest opinion of his horses chances, on one praticular
day I remember him saying that Chaplins Club, Sully, and Glencroft would all
win, they did. ( Even with Tubby Nichols on their backs) Never one to mince
his words, I just think it's a slightly sad indictment of what is happening
to racing today, when a guy like this (and the others) never really got the
break they deserved, and set on a course towards even better things.
Of course it may be that they were happy with their lot, but I bet they
would've liked that extra yard.
Am I alone in missing the likes of these trainers, and their great horses?
-
Steve.Beastie.
-
graham h <gra...@pygoplites.freeserve.co.uk> wrote in message
news:858agf$oee$1...@newsg4.svr.pol.co.uk...
Stephen Powell
too badly for a 66 year old, with a small yard, most of them owned by him!!
I will admit however that most of his winners were on the AW. Some trainers
have there ups and downs for no apparant reason - look at David Elsworth and
Mick Easterby in recent seasons.
I think a lot of the problem comes down to that wonder phrase - 'fashion'
and also geography has a lot to do with it - 2 of the trainers you mentioned
are Yorkshire based - and there just aren't enough people living up here
with the money to spend on fancy yearlings - not that dissimilar to the
housing boom really!
--
Stephen Powell
Harrogate, N.Yorks
http://www.tla-net.demon.co.uk/racing
Firebeast wrote in message <85a2fc$1dtv9$1...@fu-berlin.de>...
Roger Standing
enough on their own. It's vital to have personality, charm, politeness, to
know how much to say etc, when meeting owners.
Roger
--
see Istabraq on http://www.findit.co.uk/uk/pictures.htm
Firebeast <st...@firebeast.screaming.net> wrote in message
news:85a2fc$1dtv9$1...@fu-berlin.de...
Firebeast
these trainers were as good as anyone around in their hay days.
The thing is 95K is ok I suppose and if Chappy's still getting a kick out of
it that's fine by me, but that sort of money is what Soba could pick up in
'one' race at todays inflated prices.
I agree more with theory that 'fashion' has a lot to do with it, rather than
Geography, after all the 'Malton lot' don't seem to be doing too bad do
they? In this day and age of personal helicopters etc, geography shouldn't
be a problem to the more affluent owner.
However, I can agree with what Roger says to an extent, the likes of Charlie
Brookes, and Nicky Henderson, are/were real charmers, same can be said of
'some' of the 'newer' flat trainers. I suppose Chappy could be a bit brussem
with people, just his Yorkshire charm I guess.
John Suttcliffe however, was one of the nicest blokes you could have wished
to meet.
I don't pretend to know the answer to any of this, and I'm not saying I'm
right over anyone elses opinions, I just think it's slightly sad that the
talents of some of our 'lesser' lights will never be given a better chance
on a bigger stage.
-
Steve.Beastie.
-
Roger Standing <rog...@bluewin.ch> wrote in message
news:85a956$3h9$1...@bw107zhb.bluewin.ch...
Stephen Powell
more). Soba was a one off, a horse in a million. Chapman has never trained
any other horse with black-type pretensions. Chaplins Club and Glencroft
were solid sprint handicappers but I don't think they were 'that' much
better than Soaked (9 wins in 98) or Takhlid (10 wins in 99). I think he's
still a good trainer, the fact that he's never had another Soba is
irrelevant, like saying Bill Watts never had another Teleprompter.
As for the Malton lot - only the Easterby clan (Mick, Tim and Richard Fahey)
doing really well - Tim Etherington has a smaller string and has had to rent
out half his yard, Jimmy Fitzgerald doing OK at NH but his flat horses are
struggling, Elsey gone, Julie Camacho not doing as well as Maurice did,
Nigel Tinkler had a good season, which makes up for several bad ones, Colin
Tinkler given up. I believe these are all good trainers - they just don't
have the ammunition.
Having said all that some Yorkshire trainers ARE doing well - Easterby's,
Johnston, Eyre, Nicholls etc. Are they really better horseman - or just
better businessmen? It's no longer a hobby farmers and toffs can do in their
spare time - it's a major international business.
--
Stephen Powell
Harrogate, N.Yorks
http://www.tla-net.demon.co.uk/racing
Firebeast wrote in message <85ajtn$1fgv0$1...@fu-berlin.de>...
Derek Fitzpatrick
lot of abuse on this NG about a year ago before disappearing from view.
I have always been a great admirer of David Chapman's training methods.( 34
Winners from 365 runners last year and £154K in win/place prize money ). His
horses
are well turned out. His Granddaughter Ruth Clarke who travels with the
horses is also a very good rider over Hurdles and is especially worth
watching when riding Baher.
I was amused one day to see Miss Clarke come into Tatts just before the off.
She was holding an outstretched mobile phone. She went up to the Hills
representative on the rails and handed the phone to him saying "Granddad
wants to speak to you" I quickly looked at my racecard to see what their
runner was. It was a 50/1 shot and ran a good race but was unplaced.
Regards
Derek.
John B
Stephen Powell wrote in message
<947447418.4579.0...@news.demon.co.uk>...
>
>As for the Malton lot - only the Easterby clan (Mick, Tim and Richard
Fahey)
>doing really well - Tim Etherington has a smaller string and has had to
rent
>out half his yard, Jimmy Fitzgerald doing OK at NH but his flat horses are
>struggling, Elsey gone, Julie Camacho not doing as well as Maurice did,
>Nigel Tinkler had a good season, which makes up for several bad ones, Colin
>Tinkler given up. I believe these are all good trainers - they just don't
>have the ammunition.
>
Malcolm Jefferson? He's not done badly with what he gets has he? Dato,
Tullymurry, Kings Measure etc.
John B
Firebeast
' It's no longer a hobby farmers and toffs can do in their spare time - it's
a major international business.'
In my naive and soft hearted way, I find that a little sad, don't you?
Whilst I agree with fetching the whole 'game forward into the new
millennium, and making as many advances as possible, am I alone in yearning
for those great days of the past, and the apparent closeness of it all.
(maybe misguided)
Along with the feeling that, the trainers were 'REAL' people, I just don't
get that anymore.
I just can't imagine Cecil mixing with the Hoy paloy (mrs Cecil yes), but I
could always have that thought about most of those other trainers you
mentioned, Easterby, Chapman, etc.
I'll just sit content in my little bubble, reminiscing about what were good
times, and good trainers, IMHO, and not really caring one way or the other
about the likes of Cecil or Stoute, or even Pipe for that matter.
-
Just my humble thoughts.....
-
Steve.Beastie.
-
Arthur Bracken
who also left the training ranks during the early 1990's(Willie Muir was his
headlad), was a relative of David Murray Smith(nephew I believe) and when he
left racing, a horse called Amigo Menor moved to Murray Smith's yard.
Amigo Menor had won many races while with Brassey and always or nearly
always wore blinkers but when he moved to Murray Smith he ran a couple of
races without blinkers and finished unplaced.Then Murray Smith applied the
headgear and Amigo Menor duly won, after the race Murray Smith told
reporters he had to ring up Kim Brassey and ask him, what was needed to
bring about a change in the form of Amigo Menor, Brassey told him to reapply
the blinkers to Amigo Menor and all would be well.
My only thoughts on hearing this was,
How does he think of them(excuses)?
Economics are never far from the cause of the "fall" of many of these
smaller trainers.
Other trainers with ability and not reaching the place one would assume they
belong(top notch) is "Ginger" McCain and Jimmy FitzGearld, his(FitzGearld's)
training of Evichstar(half-brother to Amigo Menor) to win the 1990 Lincon at
33/1 makes him a genius, in my eyes anyway.
Art
Stephen Powell
"with what he gets" !!! Also prize-money wise he's only doing as well as
David Chapman, which some people seem to feel isn't that good really!
John B wrote in message <85b1e5$rdi$1...@news7.svr.pol.co.uk>...
Peter Courtenay
pulling a bus at Hexham some months prior to winning the Triumph at
Cheltenham.and I won't forget King's Curate' tremendous battle and eventual
win in the stayers under Mark Perratt beating Pipe's Run For Free.Why he
does'nt have a decent string of horses I do not know.
Conrad Allen
Norman
Arthur Bracken wrote in message <85b4td$mje$1...@news6.svr.pol.co.uk>...