Cricketers who were born and died during WG's career

[Andy Walker]

Some time ago, I said that I would trawl for cricketers whose entire
life was within WG's f-c career. This turned out to be harder than
I had expected. Wisden's "Births and Deaths" ought to have been all
that was needed, but it isn't, for a number of reasons which I could
explain to anyone interested. CricInfo has all the information, but
includes thousands of club cricketers unknown to Wisden, Wiki and
even Google. OTOH, Wisden has a fair number of cricketers unknown
to CricInfo. Anyway, my final decision was to use the CricInfo
information, supplemented by Wiki and Google whenever possible, and
to include them only if they were mentioned by Wisden.

There are 39 such cricketers, E&OE, including some big names,
inc royalty[1] and seven Test players[2]. Several died or were killed
in the Boer War[3]. Most played only a handful of f-c matches, if any,
but fourteen[4] played at least 20. The biggest name of all, of course,
was W. G. Grace, but this one was not the "real" WG but his son.

Typical of the difficulties was the mysterious Rev T Duodecimo
Platt [Harrow], about whom Wisden says almost nothing except for his
death in 1902. So he could have died at any age. Google shows only
an article by John Arlott complaining about Wisden's decision to drop
such interesting names from its lists. But further research shows that
his wife was born in 1833, and his son, EB Comyn-Platt, resigned a
commission in 1880, so although I still know little about TDP [though
presumably he had at least 11 siblings], it is certain that he was born
well before the 1860s.

[1] HRH Prince Victor Albert Ludwig Ernest Anton Christian of Schleswig-
Holstein, grandson of Queen Victoria, and only royal to play f-c.
[2] VA Barton, MP Bowden, JJ Ferris, GA Lohmann, RW McLeod, FW Milligan,
VM Tancred.
[3] Prince Christian, Ferris, DH Forbes, Milligan, AM Porter, HT Stanley,
GTL Tryon.
[4] GR Bardswell, Barton, Bowden, Ferris, Grace, R Joyce, Lohmann, McLeod,
Milligan, EA Nepean, RM Preston, JS Robinson, Stanley, JN Tonge.

========================================================================

Ainley, Joe [Worcs], 1878-1907
Bardswell, Gerald R [Lancs, OxfU], 1873-1906
Barton, Victor A [England, Hants, Kent], 1867-1906
Blackwell, Henry [Derbys], 1876-1900
Bowden, "Monty" P [England, Surrey, Transvaal], 1865-92 [5]
Christian, Prince VALEACoS-H [I Zingari], 1867-1900
Day, Albert G [Yorks], 1865-1908
Ferris, John J [Aus, Eng, Gloucs, NSW, SA], 1867-1900
Foley, Mr H St G [Eton], 1866-1904
Forbes, Dudley [OxfU], 1873-1901
Goodman, Samuel [Philadelphians], 1877-1905
Grace, William G (jnr) [CamU, Gloucs, London], 1875-1904
Gwynn, Lucius H [Ireland, Gents], 1873-1902 [6]
Hardy, Silas [Notts], 1867-1905
Inns, John H [Essex], 1876-1905
Joyce, Ralph [Leics], 1878-1908
Lohmann, George A [Eng, Surrey, Western Prov], 1865-1901 [7]
Lord, William A [Warks], 1873-1906
Martineau, Lionel [CamU], 1867-1906
McCorquodale, Edmund G [CamU], 1881-1904
McLeod, Daniel H [Vic], 1872-1901
McLeod, Robert W "Bob" [Aus, Vic], 1868-1907
Milligan, Frank W [Eng, Yorks], 1870-1900 [8]
Nepean, Evan A [Middx, OxfU], 1865-1906
Newton, Edward [Hants], 1871-1906
Peters, Arthur E [SAust], 1872-1903
Pillans, Albert A [Hants], 1869-1901
Porter, A Marshall [DublinU], 1874-1900 [9]
Preston, J Merritt [Yorks] [7,10], 1864-90
Reynolds, Harold [Europeans (India)], 1865-1905 [7]
Robinson, J Sandford [CamU, Notts], 1868-98 [11]
Smith, Fred [Yorks], 1879-1905
Spurway, Robert P [Natal, Som], 1866-98
Stanbrough, Morris H [Charterhouse, Caius], 1870-1904 [12]
Stanley, Henry T [Somerset], 1873-1900
Tancred, Vincent M [SAf, T'vaal], 1975-1904 [13]
Tonge, John N [Kent], 1854-1903
Townsend, Frank N [Gloucs, T'vaal], 1875-1901 [14]
Tryon, Guy TL [Northants], 1878-1901

=======================================================================

[5] Bowden was England captain at 23; moved to SA for his health
[6] Gwynne had few chances to play f-c [8 matches] but his outstanding
batting earned him a call-up for an Ashes Test, which he declined
due to exams. Rugger international.
[7] Lohmann, Preston and perhaps Reynolds were born between the match
that WG himself regarded as his f-c debut, and the match now usually
so regarded. Left for debate .... Standards were different in
the 19thC. Reynolds's DoB seems to be unknown, but he was said to be
aged 40 at death.
[8] Milligan was born in Hampshire, but nevertheless played for Yorks.
Killed in the relief of Mafeking.
[9] Porter was also a hockey international.
[10] Preston was a fast bowler; one of his balls killed one Albert Ludy,
buried in the same cemetary.
[11] Robinson's father founded Home Brewery.
[12] Stanbrough was described by Wisden as a "brilliant fieldsman".
[13] Tancred shot himself.
[14] Several Townsends were well-known as cricketers, esp this one's
father, also Frank, and brother Charles.

--
Andy Walker,
Nottingham.

[Brian W Lawrence]

On 16/07/2018 13:30, Andy Walker wrote:

>         Typical of the difficulties was the mysterious Rev T Duodecimo
> Platt [Harrow], about whom Wisden says almost nothing except for his
> death in 1902.  So he could have died at any age.  Google shows only
> an article by John Arlott complaining about Wisden's decision to drop
> such interesting names from its lists.  But further research shows that
> his wife was born in 1833, and his son, EB Comyn-Platt, resigned a
> commission in 1880, so although I still know little about TDP [though
> presumably he had at least 11 siblings], it is certain that he was born
> well before the 1860s.

Cricket Archive says TD Platt was born in 1829, died 19 Oct 1902. Played
for Harrow 1844-48, captain in 1847-48. Also played 3 matches in
1849-51, all against Harrow School (for Cambridge U, Cambridge Scratch
XI & Quidnuncs). 34 matches, none were f/c.

[Offramp]

Very good! Typo-cemetery.

[Andy Walker]

On 16/07/18 16:40, Offramp wrote:
> Very good! Typo-cemetery.

Sorry. Auto-spell didn't pick it, and my fingers were obviously
thinking of symmetary.

--
Andy Walker,
Nottingham.

[Andy Walker]

On 16/07/18 15:07, Brian W Lawrence wrote:
> Cricket Archive says TD Platt was born in 1829, died 19 Oct 1902.
> Played for Harrow 1844-48, captain in 1847-48. Also played 3 matches
> in 1849-51, all against Harrow School (for Cambridge U, Cambridge
> Scratch XI & Quidnuncs). 34 matches, none were f/c.

Thanks. CA seem to have tightened up their pay-wall to the extent
that the legitimate back-entries have dried up, and I don't want either to
hack them or pay them. Grr! Apart from the name, my only interest in TDP
was the fact that he could have been, say, mid-30s when he died; but that
possibility soon disappeared when I found his wife and son.

--
Andy Walker,
Nottingham.

[Offramp]

It is a very serious list. It is like the semi-forgotten cricketers. That is probably a stupid thing to say because that was the actual ethos of your research.

It is a pity Wisden wasn't more help.

[Andy Walker]

On 16/07/18 21:03, Offramp wrote:
> It is a very serious list. It is like the semi-forgotten cricketers.
> That is probably a stupid thing to say because that was the actual
> ethos of your research.

Certainly not stupid. We're lucky in that there are a lot of
cricketers, in particular f-c cricketers, and we know a lot about them
with not too much effort. They systematically have Wiki articles, and
reasonably detailed obituaries, and scorecards detailing performances.
A few years back, for obvious reasons, there was a flurry of books
about WW1 and its effects, and in particular about cricket in 1914 and
about cricketers killed in the war. It's sobering to see pictures of,
eg, school teams of 1914, accompanied by the fact that, say, five of
them were killed and another lost a leg. Or similar facts about those
who played in a county or university match in that era.

This particular group, who lived during WG's career, is a very
mixed bag -- some great players, some virtual nonentities, some famous
outside cricket. It's interesting to look through their life stories,
with much available in Wisden or on Wiki. I hadn't realised, eg, how
much the Boer wars affected life. But, of course, they were a prime
reason for fit young men to die prematurely. Typically of warfare of
the period, those killed in action were pretty-much matched by those
who died of enteric fever and similar.

> It is a pity Wisden wasn't more help.

Old Wisdens are fascinating. But they relate primarily to the
events of one year, whether it be matches or obituaries. So you would
need a long unbroken run to use them for a period, and I have only a
few odd copies from pre-1960. But the Births and Deaths are a bit
haphazard. They seem to have done minimal editing from one year to
the next, and when they find that they've forgotten Old Joe, they
just shove him in, out of order, where they can. This is a little
frustrating when you're trying to compare with a proper alphabetical
listing. They also have confusions over [eg] Mac.. and Mc... names,
and other variant spellings, and they often, but not always, break
the order of initial by putting titled players [of whom there are a
lot] ahead of mere gentlemen, ahead of professionals.

--
Andy Walker,
Nottingham.

[David North]

On 16/07/2018 15:07, Brian W Lawrence wrote:
> On 16/07/2018 13:30, Andy Walker wrote:
>
>>          Typical of the difficulties was the mysterious Rev T Duodecimo
>> Platt [Harrow], about whom Wisden says almost nothing except for his
>> death in 1902.  So he could have died at any age.  Google shows only
>> an article by John Arlott complaining about Wisden's decision to drop
>> such interesting names from its lists.  But further research shows that
>> his wife was born in 1833, and his son, EB Comyn-Platt, resigned a
>> commission in 1880, so although I still know little about TDP [though
>> presumably he had at least 11 siblings], it is certain that he was born
>> well before the 1860s.
>
> Cricket Archive says TD Platt was born in 1829

8th Feb to be precise - I found his baptism (4/1/1830, St Pancras) on
Ancestry.

Son of Sir Thomas Joshua Platt KC

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Joshua_Platt


--
David North

[Andy Walker]

On 17/07/18 07:57, David North wrote:
> On 16/07/2018 15:07, Brian W Lawrence wrote:
>> On 16/07/2018 13:30, Andy Walker wrote:
>>>          Typical of the difficulties was the mysterious Rev T Duodecimo

>>> Platt [Harrow], [...].

>> Cricket Archive says TD Platt was born in 1829
> 8th Feb to be precise - I found his baptism (4/1/1830, St Pancras) on Ancestry.
> Son of Sir Thomas Joshua Platt KC
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Joshua_Platt

Thanks, David. Re TJP [who presumably was QC rather than KC for most
of his career!], Wiki/DNB says "he had numerous children" -- well, yes, we
guessed that from his son Duodecimo, and his siblings Quintus. Sixta, Septimus,
Octavia .... OK, I made that up.

BTW, I initially thought that WG's career would be uniquely rich in f-c
cricketers born after he started and who died before he finished, but then
realised that anyone who started around 1890 and played until after WW1 would
pick up shedloads of youngsters killed in WW1. A 30-year career was always
unusual, but far from unknown, but whether any fall into that rather precise
slot would need extra work [Quaife was the first I thought of, but he started
in 1894, which is a year or three too late, really]. It's harder for WW2 as
anyone born after WW1 could only have been 20 by 1939; AFAIK, Sutcliffe is
the only "proper" player whose f-c career started before 1920 and finished after
WW2, tho' there may have been someone who had started in 1914, retired around
1935, and was dragged back in emergency in 1945. Someone here will know!

--
Andy Walker,
Nottingham.

[David North]

"Andy Walker" <a...@cuboid.co.uk> wrote in message
news:pikid5$1fn6$1...@gioia.aioe.org...

SF Barnes also started in 1894 and went on to 1930, or there's MacLaren
(1890-1922/3).

--
David North

[Andy Walker]

On 17/07/18 13:49, David North wrote:
>> BTW, I initially thought that WG's career would be uniquely rich in f-c
>> cricketers born after he started and who died before he finished, but then
>> realised that anyone who started around 1890 and played until after WW1 would
>> pick up shedloads of youngsters killed in WW1.  A 30-year career was always
>> unusual, but far from unknown, but whether any fall into that rather precise
>> slot would need extra work [Quaife was the first I thought of, but he started
>> in 1894, which is a year or three too late, really].
> SF Barnes also started in 1894 and went on to 1930, or there's
> MacLaren (1890-1922/3).

Barnes, like Quaife, is too recent for the bulk of f-c war-time deaths.
It gives you only 20 years before the outbreak of WW1, so you pick up only a
handful of Oxbridge players and the very few who played for their counties in
1914 before the age of 21. But MacLaren is a good catch; that allows for
those playing in 1914 up to age 24, which is a decent proportion of f-c
cricketers. He is also important enough for his record to be interesting;
no-one is going to be excited by Snooks of Loamshire who happened to play
a few matches between 1885 and 1919.

On the other hand, it's not going to be worthwhile to do the detailed
research to get an accurate list comparable with that for WG. According to
Renshaw ["Wisden on the Great War"], Wisden carried nearly 1800 war-related
obituaries, and 289 f-c cricketers lost their lives. A decent proportion of
those, both categories, are going to have been born after 1890.

--
Andy Walker,
Nottingham.