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Richard Dixon
May 19, 2013, 8:11:42 AM5/19/13
to
I really wish he'd make his mind up about about being world class. He's beginning to get quite irritating.
What a morning. Aside from Broad's obvious five fer the comedy hooping inswinger followed by the outswinger followed by the outswinger was a wonderful masterclass by Jimmy. Wow.
What a morning. Aside from Broad's obvious five fer the comedy hooping inswinger followed by the outswinger followed by the outswinger was a wonderful masterclass by Jimmy. Wow.
Mike Holmans
May 19, 2013, 9:47:58 AM5/19/13
to
On Sun, 19 May 2013 05:11:42 -0700 (PDT), Richard Dixon
<richsdi...@gmail.com> tapped the keyboard and brought forth:
>I really wish he'd make his mind up about about being world class. He's beginning to get quite irritating.
Beginning?
Before play started this morning, I was musing on the wisdom of
bringing in Bresnan instead of him....
Cheers,
Mike
--
<richsdi...@gmail.com> tapped the keyboard and brought forth:
>I really wish he'd make his mind up about about being world class. He's beginning to get quite irritating.
Before play started this morning, I was musing on the wisdom of
bringing in Bresnan instead of him....
Cheers,
Mike
--
Steve Hague
May 19, 2013, 10:34:04 AM5/19/13
to
like this, why don't they do it all the time? Or at least on a fairly
regular basis.
Steve Hague
John Hall
May 19, 2013, 1:38:06 PM5/19/13
to
In article <knanko$9g4$1...@dont-email.me>,
years haven't helped. And he's still only 26 (admittedly soon to be 27),
though one might think he was older given how long he seems to have been
around. Pace bowlers other than out-and-out speed merchants typically
don't reach their peak till their late twenties, so with luck the best
could be yet to come.
--
John Hall
"Sir, I have found you an argument;
but I am not obliged to find you an understanding."
Dr Samuel Johnson (1709-1784)
Steve Hague <steve....@virgin.net> writes:
>It raises the question yet again. If someone is capable of
>something like this, why don't they do it all the time? Or at least on
>a fairly
>regular basis.
I suspect that his frequent injury lay-offs over the last couple of
>It raises the question yet again. If someone is capable of
>something like this, why don't they do it all the time? Or at least on
>a fairly
>regular basis.
years haven't helped. And he's still only 26 (admittedly soon to be 27),
though one might think he was older given how long he seems to have been
around. Pace bowlers other than out-and-out speed merchants typically
don't reach their peak till their late twenties, so with luck the best
could be yet to come.
--
John Hall
"Sir, I have found you an argument;
but I am not obliged to find you an understanding."
Dr Samuel Johnson (1709-1784)
Unknown
May 19, 2013, 2:27:07 PM5/19/13
to
Mike Holmans
May 19, 2013, 3:58:53 PM5/19/13
to
On Sun, 19 May 2013 15:34:04 +0100, "Steve Hague"
<steve....@virgin.net> tapped the keyboard and brought forth:
How fair is that as a question?
Having caught some statistical nugget being tossed around during the
commentary, I had a little look at his recent record.
In his last 11 Tests (ie since the beginning of the last English
season), he has been taking wickets at 4 per match, which is the
benchmark for a very good Test bowler. He's had four five-fers in that
period. And that includes the two Tests in India where he was mostly
engaged on lacerating his fatpad (a new one on me, I must admit).
The bowler's five-fer is regularly equated with the batsman's century.
Broad comes out with these magical spells about as often as Pietersen
plays one of his spectaculars. Only Cook has been scoring centuries as
consistently as Broad has been taking five-fers.
Why do sensible people like thee and me keep thinking about dropping
him? In what sense can that possibly be rational?
Cheers,
Mike
--
<steve....@virgin.net> tapped the keyboard and brought forth:
Having caught some statistical nugget being tossed around during the
commentary, I had a little look at his recent record.
In his last 11 Tests (ie since the beginning of the last English
season), he has been taking wickets at 4 per match, which is the
benchmark for a very good Test bowler. He's had four five-fers in that
period. And that includes the two Tests in India where he was mostly
engaged on lacerating his fatpad (a new one on me, I must admit).
The bowler's five-fer is regularly equated with the batsman's century.
Broad comes out with these magical spells about as often as Pietersen
plays one of his spectaculars. Only Cook has been scoring centuries as
consistently as Broad has been taking five-fers.
Why do sensible people like thee and me keep thinking about dropping
him? In what sense can that possibly be rational?
Cheers,
Mike
--
Mal
May 19, 2013, 4:34:52 PM5/19/13
to
"John Hall" wrote in message
news:nrPJy4G+...@jhall.demon.co.uk.invalid...
In article <knanko$9g4$1...@dont-email.me>,
Steve Hague <steve....@virgin.net> writes:
>It raises the question yet again. If someone is capable of
>something like this, why don't they do it all the time? Or at least on
>a fairly
>regular basis.
I suspect that his frequent injury lay-offs over the last couple of
years haven't helped. And he's still only 26 (admittedly soon to be 27),
though one might think he was older given how long he seems to have been
around. Pace bowlers other than out-and-out speed merchants typically
don't reach their peak till their late twenties, so with luck the best
could be yet to come.
--
John Hall
had to be told the length to bowl after the first innings (otherwise they'd
have adjusted for themselves). They are not bright and not that good, at
least on any consistent basis. Remember we got on top of the Aussies in Oz
after they both dropped out. Selectors are often stubborn (as opposed to
consistent or loyal) but it probably reflects that we are not as well off
for quicks as we like to think. Could be Aussies have more depth.
With the support, practice and training they get it is a mystery why front
line bowlers find it so hard to bowl with decent accuracy. (Accepting that
gales, wet ground etc can cause inconsistency).
Hopefully Broad will go well in the Ashes but one 5 fer won't do it. No
doubt he will do enough to justify his favoured position although I hope
Bresnan, Tremlett, etc can provide alternatives to him and Finn.
Steve Hague
May 19, 2013, 5:50:02 PM5/19/13
to
Steve Hague
Message has been deleted
Message has been deleted
David North
May 20, 2013, 8:34:58 AM5/20/13
to
"John Hall" <nospam...@jhall.co.uk> wrote in message
news:nrPJy4G+...@jhall.demon.co.uk.invalid...
averaged about 3 runs more than Broad does.
--
David North
news:nrPJy4G+...@jhall.demon.co.uk.invalid...
> In article <knanko$9g4$1...@dont-email.me>,
> Steve Hague <steve....@virgin.net> writes:
>>It raises the question yet again. If someone is capable of
>>something like this, why don't they do it all the time? Or at least on
>>a fairly
>>regular basis.
>
> I suspect that his frequent injury lay-offs over the last couple of
> years haven't helped. And he's still only 26 (admittedly soon to be 27),
> though one might think he was older given how long he seems to have been
> around. Pace bowlers other than out-and-out speed merchants typically
> don't reach their peak till their late twenties, so with luck the best
> could be yet to come.
Anderson wasn't exactly Mr Consistent at the same age (4 years ago), and
> Steve Hague <steve....@virgin.net> writes:
>>It raises the question yet again. If someone is capable of
>>something like this, why don't they do it all the time? Or at least on
>>a fairly
>>regular basis.
>
> I suspect that his frequent injury lay-offs over the last couple of
> years haven't helped. And he's still only 26 (admittedly soon to be 27),
> though one might think he was older given how long he seems to have been
> around. Pace bowlers other than out-and-out speed merchants typically
> don't reach their peak till their late twenties, so with luck the best
> could be yet to come.
averaged about 3 runs more than Broad does.
--
David North
John Hall
May 20, 2013, 1:19:33 PM5/20/13
to
In article <5h3kp8t819hckq7q6...@4ax.com>,
Mike Holmans <mi...@jackalope.demon.co.uk> writes:
>We know that Broad sometimes does come up with these
>steamroller match-turning spells, and that he does so a bit more
>frequently than the others do. Obviously we'd prefer him to be
>brilliant every day, but is the criticism of him for not being as
>brilliant as possible every time he bowls overblown? Why are his
>innocuous and bad days so much more heinous than Bresnan's or
>Finn's? Why do the knives come out for him more quickly?
It's a good question. I suspect that it may have something to do with
people not liking him because they see him as being petulant (with some
justification, it must be admitted).
Mike Holmans <mi...@jackalope.demon.co.uk> writes:
>We know that Broad sometimes does come up with these
>steamroller match-turning spells, and that he does so a bit more
>frequently than the others do. Obviously we'd prefer him to be
>brilliant every day, but is the criticism of him for not being as
>brilliant as possible every time he bowls overblown? Why are his
>innocuous and bad days so much more heinous than Bresnan's or
>Finn's? Why do the knives come out for him more quickly?
It's a good question. I suspect that it may have something to do with
people not liking him because they see him as being petulant (with some
justification, it must be admitted).
Mike Holmans
May 20, 2013, 1:46:09 PM5/20/13
to
On Mon, 20 May 2013 18:19:33 +0100, John Hall
<nospam...@jhall.co.uk> tapped the keyboard and brought forth:
>In article <5h3kp8t819hckq7q6...@4ax.com>,
> Mike Holmans <mi...@jackalope.demon.co.uk> writes:
>>We know that Broad sometimes does come up with these
>>steamroller match-turning spells, and that he does so a bit more
>>frequently than the others do. Obviously we'd prefer him to be
>>brilliant every day, but is the criticism of him for not being as
>>brilliant as possible every time he bowls overblown? Why are his
>>innocuous and bad days so much more heinous than Bresnan's or
>>Finn's? Why do the knives come out for him more quickly?
>
>It's a good question. I suspect that it may have something to do with
>people not liking him because they see him as being petulant (with some
>justification, it must be admitted).
If so, it's a pretty silly reason. If I catch myself thinking that, I
shall have to give myself a good talking-to. I was hoping there might
be something else so I didn't have to feel a twit.
Cheers,
Mike
--
<nospam...@jhall.co.uk> tapped the keyboard and brought forth:
>In article <5h3kp8t819hckq7q6...@4ax.com>,
> Mike Holmans <mi...@jackalope.demon.co.uk> writes:
>>We know that Broad sometimes does come up with these
>>steamroller match-turning spells, and that he does so a bit more
>>frequently than the others do. Obviously we'd prefer him to be
>>brilliant every day, but is the criticism of him for not being as
>>brilliant as possible every time he bowls overblown? Why are his
>>innocuous and bad days so much more heinous than Bresnan's or
>>Finn's? Why do the knives come out for him more quickly?
>
>It's a good question. I suspect that it may have something to do with
>people not liking him because they see him as being petulant (with some
>justification, it must be admitted).
shall have to give myself a good talking-to. I was hoping there might
be something else so I didn't have to feel a twit.
Cheers,
Mike
--
John Hall
May 20, 2013, 2:28:49 PM5/20/13
to
In article <e6okp8lhav0a8i5fq...@4ax.com>,
rate cricketers.
> If I catch myself thinking that, I
>shall have to give myself a good talking-to. I was hoping there might
>be something else so I didn't have to feel a twit.
:)
Mike Holmans <mi...@jackalope.demon.co.uk> writes:
>On Mon, 20 May 2013 18:19:33 +0100, John Hall
><nospam...@jhall.co.uk> tapped the keyboard and brought forth:
>
>>In article <5h3kp8t819hckq7q6...@4ax.com>,
>> Mike Holmans <mi...@jackalope.demon.co.uk> writes:
>>>We know that Broad sometimes does come up with these
>>>steamroller match-turning spells, and that he does so a bit more
>>>frequently than the others do. Obviously we'd prefer him to be
>>>brilliant every day, but is the criticism of him for not being as
>>>brilliant as possible every time he bowls overblown? Why are his
>>>innocuous and bad days so much more heinous than Bresnan's or
>>>Finn's? Why do the knives come out for him more quickly?
>>
>>It's a good question. I suspect that it may have something to do with
>>people not liking him because they see him as being petulant (with some
>>justification, it must be admitted).
>
>If so, it's a pretty silly reason.
Agreed, but I'm sure that prejudice plays a big part in how many people
>On Mon, 20 May 2013 18:19:33 +0100, John Hall
><nospam...@jhall.co.uk> tapped the keyboard and brought forth:
>
>>In article <5h3kp8t819hckq7q6...@4ax.com>,
>> Mike Holmans <mi...@jackalope.demon.co.uk> writes:
>>>We know that Broad sometimes does come up with these
>>>steamroller match-turning spells, and that he does so a bit more
>>>frequently than the others do. Obviously we'd prefer him to be
>>>brilliant every day, but is the criticism of him for not being as
>>>brilliant as possible every time he bowls overblown? Why are his
>>>innocuous and bad days so much more heinous than Bresnan's or
>>>Finn's? Why do the knives come out for him more quickly?
>>
>>It's a good question. I suspect that it may have something to do with
>>people not liking him because they see him as being petulant (with some
>>justification, it must be admitted).
>
>If so, it's a pretty silly reason.
rate cricketers.
> If I catch myself thinking that, I
>shall have to give myself a good talking-to. I was hoping there might
>be something else so I didn't have to feel a twit.
Andrew B
May 20, 2013, 3:24:12 PM5/20/13
to
On 20/05/2013 13:11, Mike Holmans wrote:
> We know that Broad sometimes does come up with these steamroller
> match-turning spells, and that he does so a bit more frequently than
> the others do. Obviously we'd prefer him to be brilliant every day,
> but is the criticism of him for not being as brilliant as possible
> every time he bowls overblown? Why are his innocuous and bad days so
> much more heinous than Bresnan's or Finn's? Why do the knives come out
> for him more quickly?
>
> I'm not saying I don't have such thoughts. I do. What I don't
> We know that Broad sometimes does come up with these steamroller
> match-turning spells, and that he does so a bit more frequently than
> the others do. Obviously we'd prefer him to be brilliant every day,
> but is the criticism of him for not being as brilliant as possible
> every time he bowls overblown? Why are his innocuous and bad days so
> much more heinous than Bresnan's or Finn's? Why do the knives come out
> for him more quickly?
>
> understand is why, because all the rational analysis I can come up
> with seems to say otherwise.
There seems to be a tendency for England fans to be much more critical
of bowlers regarded as "erratic" (e.g. Cork, Caddick, Harmison, Broad)
than those regarded as "reliable" (e.g. Hoggard, Fraser, Gough)... any
failures by the first set tend to be greeted with a chorus of
"show-pony", or "luxury", while their good days get rather grudging
praise ("about time too after the last few games").
Richard Dixon
May 20, 2013, 5:35:00 PM5/20/13
to
On Monday, 20 May 2013 18:46:09 UTC+1, Mike Holmans wrote:
> If so, it's a pretty silly reason. If I catch myself thinking that, I
> shall have to give myself a good talking-to. I was hoping there might
> be something else so I didn't have to feel a twit.
Just get your Dulux colour chart out...RD
> If so, it's a pretty silly reason. If I catch myself thinking that, I
> shall have to give myself a good talking-to. I was hoping there might
> be something else so I didn't have to feel a twit.
Mal
May 20, 2013, 5:49:30 PM5/20/13
to
"Andrew B" wrote in message news:kndt1b$61r$1...@dont-email.me...
day. I've lost count of the times I've felt that Broad's and Finn's bowling
has been rubbish and totally released pressure that Anderson (in recent
times) and Swann have built. I don't particularly rate Bresnan or Tremlett
except that when they were fit and grooved in Oz last time they maintained
the pressure and regularly took big wickets.
Apart from Broad's perceived petulance I suspect that it's because he's seen
as having had a preferred & protected position compared to others.
Richard Dixon
May 20, 2013, 6:26:09 PM5/20/13
to
On Monday, 20 May 2013 22:49:30 UTC+1, Mal wrote:
> Apart from Broad's perceived petulance I suspect that it's because he's seen
> as having had a preferred & protected position compared to others.
...and gets asked on Jonathan Ross when he's barely an established international cricketer. Helps being a pretty-boy, I guess...
> Apart from Broad's perceived petulance I suspect that it's because he's seen
> as having had a preferred & protected position compared to others.
Richard
D Ramapriya
May 20, 2013, 9:32:16 PM5/20/13
to
On May 20, 4:11 pm, Mike Holmans <m...@jackalope.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> On Mon, 20 May 2013 12:38:29 +0100, Hils <h...@saynotospam.net> tapped
> >wayward spells and another bowler breaks down in a match, England will
> >be stuffed. England would struggle to get out of jail even against the
> >Aussies with only two front-line bowlers. But since neither Tremlett nor
> >Bresnan have proved they're fit and England don't have any bowlers of
> >the calibre of Steyn, Philander, or Morkel in the wings, they're stuck
> >with Broad.
>
> So if one bowler is injured and another has an off day, England will
> be in trouble. Who could ever possibly have guessed that?
>
> Anderson has just about eradicated the badly-off day and Swann is
> rarely completely innocuous, so you can mostly bank on them not to be
> too much of a problem. All the other bowlers are capable of delivering
> spells of deep mediocrity, so why single out Broad?
>
> And by the way, you'd have some fun trying to persuade Yorkshire that
> Bresnan hasn't proved his fitness this year, and still more trying to
> persuade some of the batsmen he's dismissed.
this tendency of your media* to both hype up a promising entrant to
unwarranted levels and later put him down, again to an unwarranted
degree, when there's a trough in his performances. I've noticed this
especially with Bell and Broad over their careers, and to a somewhat
lower degree with Cook and Strauss. Three consecutive performances
either way and they're either heroes or have-beens.
Ramapriya
* only those who aren't ex-international cricketers
> On Mon, 20 May 2013 12:38:29 +0100, Hils <h...@saynotospam.net> tapped
> the keyboard and brought forth:
>
>
> >On 19/05/13 20:58, Mike Holmans wrote:
> >> Why do sensible people like thee and me keep thinking about dropping
> >> him? In what sense can that possibly be rational?
>
> >His behaviour may have improved recently, but if he has one of his
> >> Why do sensible people like thee and me keep thinking about dropping
> >> him? In what sense can that possibly be rational?
>
> >wayward spells and another bowler breaks down in a match, England will
> >be stuffed. England would struggle to get out of jail even against the
> >Aussies with only two front-line bowlers. But since neither Tremlett nor
> >Bresnan have proved they're fit and England don't have any bowlers of
> >the calibre of Steyn, Philander, or Morkel in the wings, they're stuck
> >with Broad.
>
> So if one bowler is injured and another has an off day, England will
> be in trouble. Who could ever possibly have guessed that?
>
> Anderson has just about eradicated the badly-off day and Swann is
> rarely completely innocuous, so you can mostly bank on them not to be
> too much of a problem. All the other bowlers are capable of delivering
> spells of deep mediocrity, so why single out Broad?
>
> And by the way, you'd have some fun trying to persuade Yorkshire that
> Bresnan hasn't proved his fitness this year, and still more trying to
> persuade some of the batsmen he's dismissed.
>
> We know that Broad sometimes does come up with these steamroller
> match-turning spells, and that he does so a bit more frequently than
> the others do. Obviously we'd prefer him to be brilliant every day,
> but is the criticism of him for not being as brilliant as possible
> every time he bowls overblown? Why are his innocuous and bad days so
> much more heinous than Bresnan's or Finn's? Why do the knives come out
> for him more quickly?
>
> I'm not saying I don't have such thoughts. I do. What I don't
> understand is why, because all the rational analysis I can come up
> with seems to say otherwise.
As an outsider, and a hopefully objective one, I can't help but notice
> We know that Broad sometimes does come up with these steamroller
> match-turning spells, and that he does so a bit more frequently than
> the others do. Obviously we'd prefer him to be brilliant every day,
> but is the criticism of him for not being as brilliant as possible
> every time he bowls overblown? Why are his innocuous and bad days so
> much more heinous than Bresnan's or Finn's? Why do the knives come out
> for him more quickly?
>
> I'm not saying I don't have such thoughts. I do. What I don't
> understand is why, because all the rational analysis I can come up
> with seems to say otherwise.
this tendency of your media* to both hype up a promising entrant to
unwarranted levels and later put him down, again to an unwarranted
degree, when there's a trough in his performances. I've noticed this
especially with Bell and Broad over their careers, and to a somewhat
lower degree with Cook and Strauss. Three consecutive performances
either way and they're either heroes or have-beens.
Ramapriya
* only those who aren't ex-international cricketers
Graham P Davis
May 21, 2013, 4:00:36 AM5/21/13
to
On Mon, 20 May 2013 18:32:16 -0700 (PDT)
D Ramapriya <d.ram...@gmail.com> wrote:
> As an outsider, and a hopefully objective one, I can't help but notice
> this tendency of your media* to both hype up a promising entrant to
> unwarranted levels and later put him down, again to an unwarranted
> degree, when there's a trough in his performances. I've noticed this
> especially with Bell and Broad over their careers, and to a somewhat
> lower degree with Cook and Strauss. Three consecutive performances
> either way and they're either heroes or have-beens.
That sort of behaviour by the media isn't limited to cricket or sport
D Ramapriya <d.ram...@gmail.com> wrote:
> As an outsider, and a hopefully objective one, I can't help but notice
> this tendency of your media* to both hype up a promising entrant to
> unwarranted levels and later put him down, again to an unwarranted
> degree, when there's a trough in his performances. I've noticed this
> especially with Bell and Broad over their careers, and to a somewhat
> lower degree with Cook and Strauss. Three consecutive performances
> either way and they're either heroes or have-beens.
in general. For example, the magician, Paul Daniels, got just the same
treatment. When he first appeared on the scene, they all said what a
breath of fresh air he was then, all trying to make out they were the
first to discover him then, once he became popular, they all rubbished
him, continuing to poke fun at his 'rug' years after he'd stopped
wearing one.
Those who can, do.
Those who can't, teach.
Those who can't teach become journalists.
--
Graham P Davis, Bracknell, Berks.
Free office software: http://www.libreoffice.org/
Carlos Seixas, Sonata nº 1 - best version of this I've found:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YXox7vonfEg
Offramp
May 21, 2013, 6:00:47 AM5/21/13
to
You are Paul Daniels...
Graham P Davis
May 21, 2013, 7:39:02 AM5/21/13
to
On Tue, 21 May 2013 03:00:47 -0700 (PDT)
Offramp <alane...@gmail.com> wrote:
> You are Paul Daniels...
Afraid not - more hair but lots less dosh. ;-)
Offramp <alane...@gmail.com> wrote:
> You are Paul Daniels...
Afraid not - more hair but lots less dosh. ;-)
David North
May 21, 2013, 8:30:15 AM5/21/13
to
"Mike Holmans" <mi...@jackalope.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
news:5h3kp8t819hckq7q6...@4ax.com...
> On Mon, 20 May 2013 12:38:29 +0100, Hils <hi...@saynotospam.net> tapped
(those like last Sunday excepted) with just the injury.
--
David North
news:5h3kp8t819hckq7q6...@4ax.com...
> On Mon, 20 May 2013 12:38:29 +0100, Hils <hi...@saynotospam.net> tapped
> the keyboard and brought forth:
>
>
>>On 19/05/13 20:58, Mike Holmans wrote:
>
>
>>> Why do sensible people like thee and me keep thinking about dropping
>>> him? In what sense can that possibly be rational?
>>
>>> him? In what sense can that possibly be rational?
>>
>>His behaviour may have improved recently, but if he has one of his
>>wayward spells and another bowler breaks down in a match, England will
>>be stuffed. England would struggle to get out of jail even against the
>>Aussies with only two front-line bowlers. But since neither Tremlett nor
>>Bresnan have proved they're fit and England don't have any bowlers of
>>the calibre of Steyn, Philander, or Morkel in the wings, they're stuck
>>with Broad.
>
> So if one bowler is injured and another has an off day, England will
> be in trouble. Who could ever possibly have guessed that?
If the fifth bowler is Trott, they'll probably be struggling on most days
>>wayward spells and another bowler breaks down in a match, England will
>>be stuffed. England would struggle to get out of jail even against the
>>Aussies with only two front-line bowlers. But since neither Tremlett nor
>>Bresnan have proved they're fit and England don't have any bowlers of
>>the calibre of Steyn, Philander, or Morkel in the wings, they're stuck
>>with Broad.
>
> So if one bowler is injured and another has an off day, England will
> be in trouble. Who could ever possibly have guessed that?
(those like last Sunday excepted) with just the injury.
--
David North
David North
May 21, 2013, 8:47:17 AM5/21/13
to
"D Ramapriya" <d.ram...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:9d861a2e-caab-4d73...@li6g2000pbb.googlegroups.com...
"As an outsider, and a hopefully objective one, I can't help but notice
this tendency of your media* to both hype up a promising entrant to
unwarranted levels and later put him down, again to an unwarranted
degree, when there's a trough in his performances. I've noticed this
especially with Bell and Broad over their careers, and to a somewhat
lower degree with Cook and Strauss. Three consecutive performances
either way and they're either heroes or have-beens."
Journalists are paid to sell newspapers, not to make honest and balanced
judgements. "Broad has moderately disappointing day" doesn't make a good
headline.
--
David North
news:9d861a2e-caab-4d73...@li6g2000pbb.googlegroups.com...
"As an outsider, and a hopefully objective one, I can't help but notice
this tendency of your media* to both hype up a promising entrant to
unwarranted levels and later put him down, again to an unwarranted
degree, when there's a trough in his performances. I've noticed this
especially with Bell and Broad over their careers, and to a somewhat
lower degree with Cook and Strauss. Three consecutive performances
either way and they're either heroes or have-beens."
judgements. "Broad has moderately disappointing day" doesn't make a good
headline.
--
David North
Steve Hague
May 21, 2013, 11:35:00 AM5/21/13
to
'crash out'.
Steve Hague
g.ca...@uea.ac.uk
May 21, 2013, 11:44:29 AM5/21/13
to
*I don't bother with a newspaper for exactly this reason.
Steve Hague
May 21, 2013, 12:02:32 PM5/21/13
to
Steve Hague
RH
May 21, 2013, 12:37:59 PM5/21/13
to
On May 21, 4:44 pm, g.caw...@uea.ac.uk wrote:
> On Tuesday, 21 May 2013 13:47:17 UTC+1, David North wrote:
> > "D Ramapriya" <d.ramapr...@gmail.com> wrote in message
> On Tuesday, 21 May 2013 13:47:17 UTC+1, David North wrote:
>
> >news:9d861a2e-caab-4d73...@li6g2000pbb.googlegroups.com...
>
> > "As an outsider, and a hopefully objective one, I can't help but notice
>
> > this tendency of your media* to both hype up a promising entrant to
>
> > unwarranted levels and later put him down, again to an unwarranted
>
> > degree, when there's a trough in his performances. I've noticed this
>
> > especially with Bell and Broad over their careers, and to a somewhat
>
> > lower degree with Cook and Strauss. Three consecutive performances
>
> > either way and they're either heroes or have-beens."
>
> > Journalists are paid to sell newspapers, not to make honest and balanced
>
> > judgements. "Broad has moderately disappointing day" doesn't make a good
>
> > headline.
>
> However that is then an implicit criticism of the readership, if they* wanted honest and balanced judgements, that would be what sells newspapers.
How could you tell when the newspapers never, according to you, try
> >news:9d861a2e-caab-4d73...@li6g2000pbb.googlegroups.com...
>
> > "As an outsider, and a hopefully objective one, I can't help but notice
>
> > this tendency of your media* to both hype up a promising entrant to
>
> > unwarranted levels and later put him down, again to an unwarranted
>
> > degree, when there's a trough in his performances. I've noticed this
>
> > especially with Bell and Broad over their careers, and to a somewhat
>
> > lower degree with Cook and Strauss. Three consecutive performances
>
> > either way and they're either heroes or have-beens."
>
> > Journalists are paid to sell newspapers, not to make honest and balanced
>
> > judgements. "Broad has moderately disappointing day" doesn't make a good
>
> > headline.
>
> However that is then an implicit criticism of the readership, if they* wanted honest and balanced judgements, that would be what sells newspapers.
the reasonable approach./.. RH
Message has been deleted
Andrew B
May 21, 2013, 6:51:36 PM5/21/13
to
On 21/05/2013 22:27, Hils wrote:
> fairly sure he's never had three.
His bowling figures against India in 2011 were: 4-37, 3-57, 6-46, 2-30,
4-53, 2-28, 2-51, 2-44. (Followed by 3-84, 0-8, 4-47 against Pakistan).
> On 21/05/13 02:32, D Ramapriya wrote:
>> As an outsider, and a hopefully objective one, I can't help but notice
>> this tendency of your media* to both hype up a promising entrant to
>> unwarranted levels and later put him down, again to an unwarranted
>> degree, when there's a trough in his performances. I've noticed this
>> especially with Bell and Broad over their careers, and to a somewhat
>> lower degree with Cook and Strauss. Three consecutive performances
>> either way and they're either heroes or have-beens.
>
> Has Broad ever had two consecutive good-to-average performances? I'm
>> As an outsider, and a hopefully objective one, I can't help but notice
>> this tendency of your media* to both hype up a promising entrant to
>> unwarranted levels and later put him down, again to an unwarranted
>> degree, when there's a trough in his performances. I've noticed this
>> especially with Bell and Broad over their careers, and to a somewhat
>> lower degree with Cook and Strauss. Three consecutive performances
>> either way and they're either heroes or have-beens.
>
> fairly sure he's never had three.
His bowling figures against India in 2011 were: 4-37, 3-57, 6-46, 2-30,
4-53, 2-28, 2-51, 2-44. (Followed by 3-84, 0-8, 4-47 against Pakistan).
Richard Dixon
May 21, 2013, 7:40:32 PM5/21/13
to
On Tuesday, 21 May 2013 22:27:04 UTC+1, Hils wrote:
> That's not a good sign in a number 2 or 3 bowler in
> a four-man attack, and it highlights England's lack of depth in fast
> bowling.
I think we've found Dave Turner MkII
Richard
> That's not a good sign in a number 2 or 3 bowler in
> a four-man attack, and it highlights England's lack of depth in fast
> bowling.
I think we've found Dave Turner MkII
Richard
g.ca...@uea.ac.uk
May 22, 2013, 7:33:22 AM5/22/13
to
You would make an excellent journalist for a newspaper, you are demonstrating the required lack of balance by suggesting that I claimed that newspaper *NEVER* try the reasonable approach, which grossly overstates what I actually wrote.
David North
May 22, 2013, 8:50:15 AM5/22/13
to
"Steve Hague" <steve....@virgin.net> wrote in message
news:kng3te$lm9$1...@dont-email.me...
Indeed. It's certainly never a case of the other player winning.
--
David North
news:kng3te$lm9$1...@dont-email.me...
--
David North
Richard Dixon
May 22, 2013, 2:21:16 PM5/22/13
to
On Tuesday, 21 May 2013 23:51:36 UTC+1, Andrew B. wrote:
> His bowling figures against India in 2011 were: 4-37, 3-57, 6-46, 2-30,
> 4-53, 2-28, 2-51, 2-44. (Followed by 3-84, 0-8, 4-47 against Pakistan).
Whilst we're here...
> His bowling figures against India in 2011 were: 4-37, 3-57, 6-46, 2-30,
> 4-53, 2-28, 2-51, 2-44. (Followed by 3-84, 0-8, 4-47 against Pakistan).
http://www.espncricinfo.com/thestands/content/story/637093.html
Richard
Offramp
May 23, 2013, 7:53:34 AM5/23/13
to
I don't really like Broad.
But I bet there's a LOT of kids aged 14/15/16/17 who really like him.
If so, he's a good thing.
But I bet there's a LOT of kids aged 14/15/16/17 who really like him.
If so, he's a good thing.
D Ramapriya
May 23, 2013, 9:17:21 PM5/23/13
to
On May 21, 4:47 pm, "David North" <dno...@abbeymanor.fsbusiness.co.uk>
wrote:
> "D Ramapriya" <d.ramapr...@gmail.com> wrote in message
I always enjoy your 'The Times' and our 'The Hindu'; none of the
avoidable hyperbole you generally see. Also, as I said before, ex-
cricketer scribes avoid the silliness and are a lot more balanced in
this respect.
Ramapriya
wrote:
> "D Ramapriya" <d.ramapr...@gmail.com> wrote in message
avoidable hyperbole you generally see. Also, as I said before, ex-
cricketer scribes avoid the silliness and are a lot more balanced in
this respect.
Ramapriya
D Ramapriya
May 23, 2013, 9:21:24 PM5/23/13
to
On May 21, 4:30 pm, "David North" <dno...@abbeymanor.fsbusiness.co.uk>
wrote:
>
someone who can bowl a dozen overs or so during the day with the
singular brief of them not being leaky. Penetration isn't usually a
requirement, pretty much like what IVAR and Gomes used to do in the
WIPQ era.
Ramapriya
wrote:
>
> > So if one bowler is injured and another has an off day, England will
> > be in trouble. Who could ever possibly have guessed that?
>
> If the fifth bowler is Trott, they'll probably be struggling on most days
> (those like last Sunday excepted) with just the injury.
> --
> David North
In a unit with four penetrative bowlers, the fifth bowler is usually
> > be in trouble. Who could ever possibly have guessed that?
>
> If the fifth bowler is Trott, they'll probably be struggling on most days
> (those like last Sunday excepted) with just the injury.
> --
> David North
someone who can bowl a dozen overs or so during the day with the
singular brief of them not being leaky. Penetration isn't usually a
requirement, pretty much like what IVAR and Gomes used to do in the
WIPQ era.
Ramapriya
David North
May 24, 2013, 8:26:58 AM5/24/13
to
"D Ramapriya" <d.ram...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:bfea8314-bb98-44f8...@mq5g2000pbb.googlegroups.com...
On May 21, 4:30 pm, "David North" <dno...@abbeymanor.fsbusiness.co.uk>
wrote:
>
> > So if one bowler is injured and another has an off day, England will
> > be in trouble. Who could ever possibly have guessed that?
>
> If the fifth bowler is Trott, they'll probably be struggling on most days
> (those like last Sunday excepted) with just the injury.
wrote:
>
> > So if one bowler is injured and another has an off day, England will
> > be in trouble. Who could ever possibly have guessed that?
>
> If the fifth bowler is Trott, they'll probably be struggling on most days
> (those like last Sunday excepted) with just the injury.
"In a unit with four penetrative bowlers, the fifth bowler is usually
someone who can bowl a dozen overs or so during the day with the
singular brief of them not being leaky. Penetration isn't usually a
requirement, pretty much like what IVAR and Gomes used to do in the
WIPQ era."
I'm not sure whether that describes Trott. He has yet to bowl more than 8
someone who can bowl a dozen overs or so during the day with the
singular brief of them not being leaky. Penetration isn't usually a
requirement, pretty much like what IVAR and Gomes used to do in the
WIPQ era."
overs in a Test innings, and he concedes 3.36 rpo on average, whereas
Richards and Gomes both conceded around 2.3, although run rates generally
have increased since the 1980s. I don't think England's attack is as
reliable as the WIPQ, either! OTOH, if it's not Swann who gets injured,
England shouldn't need as many overs from the part-timer as West Indies
would have done.
--
David North
Offramp
May 24, 2013, 10:43:25 AM5/24/13
to
Pietersen is a bloody good off-spinner.
But I haven't seen him bowl it for, what, a decade?
But I haven't seen him bowl it for, what, a decade?
D Ramapriya
May 24, 2013, 11:50:53 AM5/24/13
to
On May 24, 4:26 pm, "David North" <dno...@abbeymanor.fsbusiness.co.uk>
wrote:
> "D Ramapriya" <d.ramapr...@gmail.com> wrote in message
Furthermore, similar to what Illingworth had done in the mid-90s in
requesting Worcs and Yorks to bowl Hick and White as much as possible,
the coach could ask Warwicks and Yorks to give Bell and Root more
bowling so that they too can fill in. Bell I see has four 4WIs in FC
cricket, so could be useful.
Ramapriya
wrote:
> "D Ramapriya" <d.ramapr...@gmail.com> wrote in message
requesting Worcs and Yorks to bowl Hick and White as much as possible,
the coach could ask Warwicks and Yorks to give Bell and Root more
bowling so that they too can fill in. Bell I see has four 4WIs in FC
cricket, so could be useful.
Ramapriya
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