shiny paint . Again.
Phil Speight
a well painted boat give such offence ? When I started boating , which was
only 30 years ago , it was an adventure open to anyone. I don`t remember
having to qualify either by being super tidy and squeaky clean or rough ,
ready , gruff and manly !
If you have a boat that shows the wear and tear of much use , well , good on
yer. On the other hand if it gives you pleasure to have your boat
expensively painted ( provided ,
of course , that "expensive " means " well " ) and if you like to keep it
immaculate who should find fault in that?
There is , as it happens , a history of smartness on the canal , but I
don`t mean to imply that working boats were painted to the standard many
pleasure boats are now. They weren`t, but then they didn`t need to be .When
the trade was at it`s height they
were repainted ( even the most elaborate ones ) every couple of years or
so.To keep them as smart as a working life allowed . It was good business to
present your boats as nicely as possible.
Come on chaps. Keep your boat the way you want it , and if you stop being
judgemental so may the people you are judging. I don`t know which is worse ,
a snob or an inverted one.None of us use the canal as it was intended to be
used whatever sort of boat we have ( though one or two do their best ) so,
whichever camp we`re in , why can`t we just mind our own business and leave
others to theirs.We may even break a few barriers down along the way.
Phil
Geoff
snip, why can`t we just mind our own business and leave
> others to theirs.We may even break a few barriers down along the way.
> Phil
>
>
and if me Army mates cant come up with the stuff some Navy guys can
supply matt black, luvverly! ;)
g
Tim Leech
<craftm...@btconnect.com> wrote:
>Things I`ve read here recently make me wonder what`s up with us all.Why does
>a well painted boat give such offence ?
Phil, what have you read recently? I can't claim to read every posting
in every thread, life's too short/I'm not that sad, but I don't recall
the subject having been brought up since the last time there was a
thread specifically dealing with it. Have I missed something?
Cheers
Tim
Geoff
> Battleship gray?
>
Nah, matt black, wiv chrome fittings! man! how cool is that!
Phil Rushton
"Tim Leech" <dutto...@onetel.com> wrote in message
news:rmf5u0h1brop5gmbt...@4ax.com...
I was thinking the same as Tim. I cannot recall any recent posts
regarding
paint etc.
I must confess my own attitude to painting the house, boat or any
other
possesion is:
1. Is the structure of the boat / house going to deteriorate if I
don't
apply a coat of something imminently?
2. Does it spoil my enjoyment of the boat or house if the paint or
decorations are not immaculate?
If both answers are no, I tend to leave the decorating till another
day/month/year. I must admit however, that I frequently leave
maintenance till the very last minute - and on occasions till it is
probably costing me more than it would with regular maintenance.
WE all have our different priorities. Some of those might come
down to financial circumstances and some might be due to our
individual personalities and priorities in life.
I hadn't noticed anyone criticising anyone else over their personal
decisions in maintenance etc?
Cheers
Phil
Will Chapman
> which is worse , a snob or an inverted one.None of us use the canal
> as it was intended to be used whatever sort of boat we have ( though
> one or two do their best ) so, whichever camp we`re in , why can`t
> we just mind our own business and leave others to theirs.We may even
> break a few barriers down along the way.
Well said Phil.......
--
Cheers.......
Will Chapman
nb Quidditch
klog
> Nah, matt black [snip]
Ahhhh... a STEALTH boat? Would it absorb GPS sat signals?
Geoff
David Long
<dutto...@onetel.com> writes
thread.
--
David Long
Sankey Canal Restoration Society http://www.scars.org.uk/
St. Mary's http://www.geocities.com/andrew_fishburn/stmary1.html
http://www.scars.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/webcam/
Geoff
> On 10 Jan 2005 11:31:29 -0800, "klog" <g...@klog.freeserve.co.uk>
AIS? bah, humbug, thass only a GPS an a VHF fone in one box, sniff!
innit?
Tim Leech
>In message <rmf5u0h1brop5gmbt...@4ax.com>, Tim Leech
><dutto...@onetel.com> writes
>>On Mon, 10 Jan 2005 17:16:23 +0000 (UTC), "Phil Speight"
>><craftm...@btconnect.com> wrote:
>>
>>>Things I`ve read here recently make me wonder what`s up with us all.Why does
>>>a well painted boat give such offence ?
>>
>>Phil, what have you read recently? I can't claim to read every posting
>>in every thread, life's too short/I'm not that sad, but I don't recall
>>the subject having been brought up since the last time there was a
>>thread specifically dealing with it. Have I missed something?
>>
>Yes. Marin mentioned it in his contribution to the Saul happening
>thread.
Curious.
I haven't seen anything from Marin in that thread.
Cheers
Tim
David Long
>On Mon, 10 Jan 2005 20:29:45 +0000, David Long <Da...@n0ne.c0m> wrote:
>
>>In message <rmf5u0h1brop5gmbt...@4ax.com>, Tim Leech
>><dutto...@onetel.com> writes
>>>On Mon, 10 Jan 2005 17:16:23 +0000 (UTC), "Phil Speight"
>>><craftm...@btconnect.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>Things I`ve read here recently make me wonder what`s up with us all.Why does
>>>>a well painted boat give such offence ?
>>>
>>>Phil, what have you read recently? I can't claim to read every posting
>>>in every thread, life's too short/I'm not that sad, but I don't recall
>>>the subject having been brought up since the last time there was a
>>>thread specifically dealing with it. Have I missed something?
>>>
>>Yes. Marin mentioned it in his contribution to the Saul happening
>>thread.
>
>Curious.
> I haven't seen anything from Marin in that thread.
>
came through to me under the Saul SH.
Drifter
It'll be hot inside in the summer.
Geoff
> You can play with it by registering here http://www.aislive.com
>
> Nah, it has a field STATUS , where you can enter things like "I am in
> the Pig and Whistle until closing time" It seems the ideal application
> for a narrowboat.
>
Mmmmm, I was under the impression AIS was, say, a box on my vessel, a
box on your vessel and ditto for anybody in the area and these boxes
chatted to one another as to position, course etc, and they tried to
prevent the humans doing anything stupid. The site under your link above
indicates that outfits on-shore can (@ 2500 yurros a pop) use all this
data squirting about the ether to give themselves a sort of PPI.
Or, have I got this completely wrong, (usual state of affairs)
There is a similar system for aircraft I believe.
g
ps. need to get this back to paint soon
Geoff
>
> It'll be hot inside in the summer.
>
Nah, matt black radiates heat dunnit? ;)
Geoff
sho-nuff
Tim Leech
>In message <gsp5u0d0ip6nelisf...@4ax.com>, Tim Leech
><dutto...@onetel.com> writes
>>On Mon, 10 Jan 2005 20:29:45 +0000, David Long <Da...@n0ne.c0m> wrote:
>>
>>>In message <rmf5u0h1brop5gmbt...@4ax.com>, Tim Leech
>>><dutto...@onetel.com> writes
>>>>On Mon, 10 Jan 2005 17:16:23 +0000 (UTC), "Phil Speight"
>>>><craftm...@btconnect.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>Things I`ve read here recently make me wonder what`s up with us all.Why does
>>>>>a well painted boat give such offence ?
>>>>
>>>>Phil, what have you read recently? I can't claim to read every posting
>>>>in every thread, life's too short/I'm not that sad, but I don't recall
>>>>the subject having been brought up since the last time there was a
>>>>thread specifically dealing with it. Have I missed something?
>>>>
>>>Yes. Marin mentioned it in his contribution to the Saul happening
>>>thread.
>>
>>Curious.
>> I haven't seen anything from Marin in that thread.
>>
>He changed his Subject Heading to "Continuous Cruisers", but it still
>came through to me under the Saul SH.
OK, I've read through both threads, I can't see anywhere that it's
suggested that a well painted boat can give offence. Maybe I'm still
missing something?
It does concerm me that *some* boatowners have spent so much money on
their paint jobs that they become too precious about their boating,
but I've aired that view quite a while ago & haven't seen it raised
again here. In any case, it's not really so much a comment on
expensive/shiny paint jobs as on a minority of those who possess them.
Cheers
Tim
Rick Ansell
Invincible may eventually end up Grey (as in RN Grey) with some nice bits
of simple black lining and black patches included into the
'design' anywhere where significant staining is to be expected (e.g.
around the exhaust and chimney).
As well as fitting with the name the current dark paint job makes the boat
very hot in summer.
I don't have a problem with shiny boats in general, although I do raise my
eyebrows at two things:
a) Paint in places which need special care to avoid
scratches.
b) Polished paint in places where it may be dangerous. I know how slippery
the (inherited) paint on the roof of Invincible is in anything other than
perfectly dry conditions. I worry about polished cants etc.
Incidentally, on the 'slippery paint' issue one of the houseboaters down
here is a painter and decorator and has discussed things with his
supplier. They believe that they can source non-slip paint in any tint.
I'll have a more serious look at things (including _cost_) when I come to
repaint.
Rick
Geoff
>
>
> Did you get as far as seeing the plots in real time?
>
Nay, I bottled out of the registration when they asked wot shipping line
I owned!! :)
Martin Phillips
<m...@privacy.net> writes
>On Mon, 10 Jan 2005 20:24:15 +0000, Rick Ansell
><ri...@nb-invincible.org.uk> wrote:
>
>
>>Incidentally, on the 'slippery paint' issue one of the houseboaters down
>>here is a painter and decorator and has discussed things with his
>>supplier. They believe that they can source non-slip paint in any tint.
>>I'll have a more serious look at things (including _cost_) when I come to
>>repaint.
>
>lasts about 10 years.
It lasted about ten months on my boat. Still got half of a tin in
tasteful grey left if anyone wants it.
Wassail!
--
Martin E Phillips nb Boden, Splatt Bridge
http://www.g4cio.demon.co.uk martin/at/g4cio/dot/demon/dot/co/dot/uk
Homebrewing, black pudding, boats, morris dancing, ham radio and more!
The Gloucester-Sharpness canal page http://www.glos-sharpness.org.uk
NB Tafelberg
I am learning to do boat painting. I'm also attending Phils course in
April doing roses and castles. Why? Because I decided as a liveaboard
that I wanted to learn the skills I needed to paint the boat myself. 70
footers are expensive to paint if done by some one else.
I'm using Phil's craftmaster paints, they are superb, even for a
beginner like me, I started with two hatches and two side panels. (Only
because the boat used to say someone elses name and I got irritated by
being called it!).
I think we do have a tradition to upkeep, I often travel the River Wey
Navigation and some boats (mainly plastic!) are in a terrible state
and ruin what is otherwise a beautiful navigation.
I know that some people like to have a rough old wreck but I think in
the long term if you don't keep your boat up to scratch you can find it
rusting. I think it's more of a maintenance thing. I am priviledged to
have a boat that has been cared for, and though she's 20 years old, she
still turns heads. But thats because I polish the brass (no laquer
thanks) and try and keep her painted up.
You can't force people to do anything and I wouldn't want that. It's
not right, I prefer to encourage people by having a nice looking boat
myself. That takes ME work not other people.
I know I make mistakes and sometimes need some help, but in the end I
will be able to have my boat any jolly colour scheme I like.
I'm not sure painting boats is the rocket science that it sometimes
looks like. It's more down to technique and paint that you use.
What do you think?
Paul
NB Tafelberg
http://www.tafelberg.co.uk
Andrew Denny
all.Why does
> >a well painted boat give such offence ?
>
> Phil, what have you read recently? I can't claim to read every
posting
> in every thread, life's too short/I'm not that sad, but I don't
recall
> the subject having been brought up since the last time there was a
> thread specifically dealing with it. Have I missed something?
Perhaps 'recently' wasn't quite the right word for Phil to use. But
he's right, smartly painted and shiny boats have often been spoken of
with scorn here and in many other waterways circles. If you want a
gorgeously painted boat, why not have one?
There does seem to be a layer of inverted snobbery about it, mainly by
people who couldn't afford to pay to have it done anyway. Then they
rationalise their opinion by saying "Why bother? Boating's a contact
sport, innit?"
In some parts of the world, especially the Middle East and Himalayas,
it's considered a badge of honour by many a truck driver to have his
entire vehicle painted in exotic designs, and the interior of the cab
is often swathed with lace and expensive embroidery by his wife.
Coincidentally, there, too, truck driving tends to be a contact sport!
Paul E. Bennett
> The status field seems to be entered manually. It;s not unusual to see
> a boat doing 20 knots with status: Tied Up
Running the engine in gear, to charge batteries, while moored no doubt ;>
--
********************************************************************
Paul E. Bennett ....................<email://peb@a...>
Forth based HIDECS Consultancy .....<http://www.amleth.demon.co.uk/>
Mob: +44 (0)7811-639972 .........NOW AVAILABLE:- HIDECS COURSE......
Tel: +44 (0)1235-811095 .... see http://www.feabhas.com for details.
Going Forth Safely ..... EBA. www.electric-boat-association.org.uk..
********************************************************************
Chris Newport
> Incidentally, on the 'slippery paint' issue one of the houseboaters down
> here is a painter and decorator and has discussed things with his
> supplier. They believe that they can source non-slip paint in any tint.
> I'll have a more serious look at things (including cost) when I come to
> repaint.
Just stir about a handfull of clean sand into each litre
of paint.
--
My real address is crn (at) netunix (dot) com
WARNING all messages containing attachments or html will be silently
deleted. Send only plain text.
Rick Ansell
> On Monday 10 January 2005 8:24 pm in uk.rec.waterways Rick Ansell wrote:
>
>> Incidentally, on the 'slippery paint' issue one of the houseboaters
>> down here is a painter and decorator and has discussed things with his
>> supplier. They believe that they can source non-slip paint in any tint.
>> I'll have a more serious look at things (including cost) when I come to
>> repaint.
>
> Just stir about a handfull of clean sand into each litre of paint.
Thats one way to do it. But it has its disadvantages in terms of, unless
you use exactly the right thing, the sand grains being pressed through the
various coats and causing the paintjob to fail early. There are ways
around that and it's one option I will compare with the specialised item
at the time.
The stuff I'm talking about is intended for workshop floors. It should
give a nice easily mopable surface without lots of little upstands that
you can't ever get quite clear of the gunk you get mooring under trees and
a major air route. It may not be suitable, but thats something to look
into closer to the time.
Rick
Rick Ansell
> I have to agree with Phil...
<snip>
> I think we do have a tradition to upkeep, I often travel the River Wey
> Navigation and some boats (mainly plastic!) are in a terrible state and
> ruin what is otherwise a beautiful navigation.
Bzzzzt! And this is the attitude that I, for one, object to. A few 'tatty'
boats do not, and cannot, 'ruin' a navigation. At worst they 'add
character'. And it doesn't matter if they are 'plastic' or steel.
I'm sorry but some of us have other priorities than looks.
In fact the 'tatty' GRP boat that is _used_ is often the sign of a
dedicated boater who can't justify or afford anything 'better' but has
stretched themselves so they can own a boat. Not all are in this class by
any means but many are. The 'abandoned' boat, on the other hand isn't
going to get tidied up by anyone.
I don't claim to be a dedicated boater but I'm in much the same situation.
I had to go to the edge of what I could afford to get a boat and mooring I
fell in love with. Invincible isn't pretty but looks will have to wait
until the loans I took out to get her begin to expire (1 year 3 months
until the first! :) ) and I've cleared the backlog of higher priority
stuff.
I remember the early morning dog walkers who passed Invincible one morning
at the Milton Keynes National as I was dressing before heading down to
site. Not realising I was awake inside the boat they commented 'I don't
think we should allow scruffy boats like that at the National'.
Now there were a number of scruffy boats there that year. And a lot of
them were owned by people who spend the time and money saved on
prettifying the boat on other things. Like assisting with running the
national, restoring canals, leading the local IWA branch etc. Should they
be drummed off the waterways for this?
This isn't 'inverted snobbery'. This is simple anger that some people seem
to think that there should be some sort of 'means test' before one can be
admitted to the august company of boat owners. Put bluntly, if that ever
happened the waterways would, for me, be dead and I would give up
restoring them (having previously been barred from living and boating on
them) and find something else to do. And I suspect that a lot of people
involved in the waterways would agree with me.
> I know that some people like to have a rough old wreck but I think in
> the long term if you don't keep your boat up to scratch you can find it
> rusting. I think it's more of a maintenance thing. I am privileged to
> have a boat that has been cared for, and though she's 20 years old, she
> still turns heads. But that's because I polish the brass (no lacquer
> thanks) and try and keep her painted up.
But _I_ have done a lot of not-polishing to achieve that patina on _my_
brass! :)
Yes maintenance is good but beyond a certain point it becomes
pretification not practicality. Personally I think life is to short to
polish brass!
> You can't force people to do anything and I wouldn't want that. It's not
> right, I prefer to encourage people by having a nice looking boat
> myself. That takes ME work not other people.
But if you do this by making disparaging comments to people who have made
a positive decision not to 'gild the lilly' and accusing them of 'ruining'
a waterway behind their backs all you are going to do is add to the
(usually wrong) opinion that those in well painted boats are snobs who
want the 'lower classes' off the cut.
> I know I make mistakes and sometimes need some help, but in the end I
> will be able to have my boat any jolly colour scheme I like.
As I will. And good luck to you, a well presented boat is nice to see.
(Provided it isn't so 'precious' that it interfears with others boating
enjoyment.)
> I'm not sure painting boats is the rocket science that it sometimes
> looks like. It's more down to technique and paint that you use. What do
> you think?
Its all in what you are looking for. Phils paintjobs last for ages longer
than the sort of thing I'm likely to do. But I can't afford Phil and his
high quality paint - my DIY job with household paints will be good enough
for me. I will just have to repaint more often. And in between paintjobs I
will be less stressed about the chunks the local kids and their stones are
taking out of that paintwork, the staining due to mooring under trees and
the effects of the cabin stove.
Rick
Dave Mayall
wrote:
:-)
Be bolder!
I told them that I was a ship owner, and MD of "Mr Jinks"
--
Dave Mayall
brian
news:u467u0hnu8mrf3354...@4ax.com...
> --
> Martin
Your about early today
--
Brian
From Sunny Suffolk
Neil Arlidge
Nononono...Martin P owns the Wot Shipping Line :-)
I always put down R&D Services* if asked for a company name
R&D Services* - a company whose sole activity is servicing that "hole in the
water", AKA N Bear Nest.
--
Neil Arlidge - NB Earnest
Follow the travels of the TNC at : http://www.tuesdaynightclub.co.uk
Dave Mayall
news:pan.2005.01.11....@nb-invincible.org.uk...
>
>> I have to agree with Phil...
>
> <snip>
>
>> I think we do have a tradition to upkeep, I often travel the River Wey
>> Navigation and some boats (mainly plastic!) are in a terrible state and
>> ruin what is otherwise a beautiful navigation.
>
> Bzzzzt! And this is the attitude that I, for one, object to. A few 'tatty'
> boats do not, and cannot, 'ruin' a navigation. At worst they 'add
> character'. And it doesn't matter if they are 'plastic' or steel.
No, at worst, they degrade the whole atmosphere of the canal.
I think part of the problem is that people tend to use different definitions
of tatty.
To my mind, when we are talking about tatty, we are talking about a complete
lack of attention to keeping the boat clean and tidy.
Tatty is a level down from "well used"
> I'm sorry but some of us have other priorities than looks.
Tatty isn't just about looks. If a boat has gone so far as to be tatty, the
lack of attention is such that there is a grave risk that damage to the
structure is occuring.
I don't have any particular wish for everybody to have gleaming paint jobs.
It doesn't take vast sums of money to keep a boat clean, or to get rid of
assorted crap, clutter, old oil cans etc.
> I don't claim to be a dedicated boater but I'm in much the same situation.
> I had to go to the edge of what I could afford to get a boat and mooring I
> fell in love with. Invincible isn't pretty but looks will have to wait
> until the loans I took out to get her begin to expire (1 year 3 months
> until the first! :) ) and I've cleared the backlog of higher priority
> stuff.
I've never seen her.
Do you keep her clean and tidy?
Do you try to touch up obvious rust spots?
Do you have half a ton of debris on the roof/stern that ought to be taken to
the tip?
> This isn't 'inverted snobbery'. This is simple anger that some people seem
> to think that there should be some sort of 'means test' before one can be
> admitted to the august company of boat owners.
No, not a means test.
It doesn't take money to keep a boat tidy.
> Its all in what you are looking for. Phils paintjobs last for ages longer
> than the sort of thing I'm likely to do. But I can't afford Phil and his
> high quality paint - my DIY job with household paints will be good enough
> for me. I will just have to repaint more often.
Yes, so yours isn't a tatty boat.