Monsal Head parking?
Nick Pedley
looking for a short circular stroll (10 miles max) to do before arriving at
the hostel in the evening. First thought was to wander along the Monsal Head
tracks but am put off by the possibility of expensive parking. Can anyone
put a price on this?
Any suggestions for a different day stroll?
Thanks,
Nick
pb
"Nick Pedley" <nichola...@npedley.freeserve.co.uk> wrote in message
news:c0nlmn$taq$1...@newsg4.svr.pol.co.uk...
Don't know the price but its per hour, ideal for the toerags to spot when
you have just left so they have plenty of time to break in. You can find
some roadside parking in Millerdale or in Litton and walk from there. You
could park near Foolow / Housely and walk from there to Great Longstone and
back along Monsaldale and Cressbrook dale.
pb
Chris Gilbert
> First thought was to wander along the Monsal Head
> tracks but am put off by the possibility of expensive parking.
Why not just pay the money ? On the grand scale of things it's not
much and I assure that the locals would much rather you put your car
in the place put aside for and paid for through our local taxes than
have it bunging up the roads in the villages, which have already
limited parking.
I must admit I just don't get this attitude. If I am visting another
area then I make sure I pay my way. Tax payers in country areas
already carry a disproportionate cost of thier maintenenace than the
majority of the people who use them. Giving what amounts to a very
small amount of money back through parking charges is not much to ask
is it ?
Chris
--
Cressbrook on the web
http://www.cressbrook.net
Nick Pedley
"Chris Gilbert" <chris_...@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
news:9b6b9d38.04021...@posting.google.com...
It helps to know what sort of parking there is (long stay/short
stay/attended/local crimespot etc) and how much it costs to park for however
long so you can be sure of having enough change to pay for the inevitable
machines. Is that OK with you?
As for the cost, I've been stung too often for expensive parking because of
a lack of planning. Certainly I consider more than £1 per hour extortionate,
especially when it's midweek and out of season. I'm already supporting the
local communities by staying there, shopping there and eating and drinking
out there.
Nick
Chris Gilbert
> I'm already supporting the
> local communities by staying there, shopping there and eating and drinking
> out there.
Then IME you're the exception rather than the rule, Nick, and good
luck to you. There's too many people who drive here, park for free,
eat their sarnies and go home and while they are perfectly within
thier rights to do so they don't actually put anything back into the
local economy.
If you're going midweek then park at Upperdale, just down the road in
the valley. There's space there for about a dozen cars and its free.
Easy access from there onto the Monsal Trail. You can also park at the
mill in Cressbrook.
Chris
Nick Pedley
"Chris Gilbert" <chris_...@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
news:9b6b9d38.04021...@posting.google.com...
Thanks Chris,
I found a nice route in an old copy of Trail which sounds interesting (along
the valley floor) among several others online. I might just go to Stanton
Lees and see what the Nine Ladies looks like before the quarry gets
reopened. Hmm, decisions, decisions!
Nick
Martin Richardson
<nichola...@npedley.freeserve.co.uk> writes
>
>
>I found a nice route in an old copy of Trail which sounds interesting (along
>the valley floor) among several others online.
over a cliff?
--
Martin Richardson
216/284 Munros (34/34 'Furths')
32/89 Donalds 397/1552 Marilyns 439/439 Nuttalls
Nick Pedley
"Martin Richardson" <mar...@thequiff.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
news:3xqh16Bu...@thequiff.demon.co.uk...
> In message <c0qvot$cgt$1...@news8.svr.pol.co.uk>, Nick Pedley
> <nichola...@npedley.freeserve.co.uk> writes
> >
> >
> >I found a nice route in an old copy of Trail which sounds interesting
(along
> >the valley floor) among several others online.
> Are you sure the route will keep you on the valley floor - or lead you
> over a cliff?
>
Nick
Bernie Hughes
news:9b6b9d38.04021...@posting.google.com...
> much and I assure that the locals would much rather you put your car
> in the place put aside for and paid for through our local taxes than
> have it bunging up the roads in the villages, which have already
> limited parking.
>
> I must admit I just don't get this attitude. If I am visting another
> area then I make sure I pay my way. Tax payers in country areas
> already carry a disproportionate cost of thier maintenenace than the
> majority of the people who use them. Giving what amounts to a very
> small amount of money back through parking charges is not much to ask
> is it ?
In principle yes, it's a worthwhile exercise to spend money in rural places,
even if just a paper & some snacks out the local shop. But parking charges
actively discourage this, so I doubt the local community benefits much.
--
Bernie
Get back on the wagon to reply..
Gordon
>
>I found a nice route in an old copy of Trail which sounds interesting (along
>the valley floor) among several others online. I might just go to Stanton
>Lees and see what the Nine Ladies looks like before the quarry gets
>reopened. Hmm, decisions, decisions!
>
>Nick
>
presumably to prevent them starting it. We walked down to Nine ladies
from Rowsley - free car parking at Caudwell's Mill.
--
Gordon
Chris Gilbert
> In principle yes, it's a worthwhile exercise to spend money in rural places,
> even if just a paper & some snacks out the local shop. But parking charges
> actively discourage this, so I doubt the local community benefits much.
I honestly don't see that parking charges amount to a heap of beans.
Even if it costs £5 to park my car all day its only a couple of pints.
I've been trying to get my head 'round why such a small amount of
money causes some people such a problem. I wonder if a part of it is
the fact that we are the walking generation that has seen our hobby
pass from one that is essentially free (beyond one or two essesntial
bits of kit) to one that is progressively being asked to contribute to
the grander scheme of things. So, is this just a transitional thing ?
Chris
pb
"Chris Gilbert" <chris_...@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
news:9b6b9d38.04021...@posting.google.com...
>
> Even if it costs £5 to park my car all day its only a couple of pints.
> I've been trying to get my head 'round why such a small amount of
> money causes some people such a problem. I wonder if a part of it is
> the fact that we are the walking generation that has seen our hobby
> pass from one that is essentially free (beyond one or two essesntial
> bits of kit) to one that is progressively being asked to contribute to
> the grander scheme of things. So, is this just a transitional thing ?
No one minds paying to park in a purpose built car park complete with a
minder in a hut, I very much object to paying through the nose just because
your council has painted yellow lines all over and stuck up a parking meter
on a patch of waste ground. I also wonder why you think everyone else
should subsidise your council tax? Your council's expenses are no
different to elsewhere.
pb
Chris Gilbert
> No one minds paying to park in a purpose built car park complete with a
> minder in a hut, I very much object to paying through the nose just
because
> your council has painted yellow lines all over and stuck up a parking
meter
> on a patch of waste ground.
The land probably cost money, as did the construction of the car park.
Who pays ?
> I also wonder why you think everyone else
> should subsidise your council tax? Your council's expenses are no
> different to elsewhere.
I was trying to broaden the discussion but since you put it that way,
the Peak Park is the second most visited park in the world behind
Yosemite and it inevitably suffers from a bit of wear and tear. Some
money to make good the wear and tear does come through the National
parks scheme but some of it inevitably comes out of my pocket. You
could argue that that is an occupational hazard and that I choose to
live where I do. My argument is that asking people to make a small
contribution, in recognition of the enjoyment that they derive from
having the area protected for everyone's benefit, is reasonable. If the
easiest way to implement that levy is by applying a small parking charge
then, to me, that is also reasonable. When faced with parking charges in
other UK beauty spots I willingly pay what I'm asked.
As I said, its a small amount and I don't see the problem and I was
trying to understand it. One person's reasonable charge is clearly
another's paying through the nose. Everything's subjective, I suppose.
pb
>
> The land probably cost money, as did the construction of the car park.
> Who pays ?
>
>
The particular piece of land in question has had no work done on it other
than the yellow lines and the parking meter. There is a long stretch of
meters on the road out of Castleton towards Mam Tor, the road has been
there for some time. Just two of many that are not car parks but just
money makers. Sorry its OT, end of rant for me.
pb
RJ Webb
>I honestly don't see that parking charges amount to a heap of beans.
>Even if it costs £5 to park my car all day its only a couple of pints.
>I've been trying to get my head 'round why such a small amount of
>money causes some people such a problem. I wonder if a part of it is
>the fact that we are the walking generation that has seen our hobby
>pass from one that is essentially free (beyond one or two essesntial
>bits of kit) to one that is progressively being asked to contribute to
>the grander scheme of things. So, is this just a transitional thing ?
>
>Chris
Was there in December.. as I was on a circuit, I just found some
laybys elsewhere on my route. The pub and caff got the money.
There are plenty of places on the B road to the north. BTW the caff
in the YH is pretty good in the cake dept.
Richard Webb
Gordon
>Bernie Hughes wrote
>
>> In principle yes, it's a worthwhile exercise to spend money in rural places,
>> even if just a paper & some snacks out the local shop. But parking charges
>> actively discourage this, so I doubt the local community benefits much.
>
>I honestly don't see that parking charges amount to a heap of beans.
>Even if it costs £5 to park my car all day its only a couple of pints.
>
50p tip!
>I've been trying to get my head 'round why such a small amount of
>money causes some people such a problem. I wonder if a part of it is
>the fact that we are the walking generation that has seen our hobby
>pass from one that is essentially free (beyond one or two essesntial
>bits of kit) to one that is progressively being asked to contribute to
>the grander scheme of things. So, is this just a transitional thing ?
>
If I had to pay £5 every week when I went walking it would cost me more
in a year than I just paid for a top of the range coat. That should
last me about 9 or 10 years, and keep me warm and dry.
I think £2.50 or so is reasonable, more than that and it explains why
many people park at the roadside instead.
--
Gordon
Charles Frederick Wildgoose
Nick Pedley <nichola...@npedley.freeserve.co.uk> wrote
> I might just go to Stanton Lees and see what the Nine Ladies looks like
> before the quarry gets reopened. Hmm, decisions, decisions!
The Nine Ladies won't be quarried away - it will still be there for a few
more years yet. It's not the most impressive stone circle either to be
honest - though we like it. The stones are probably only a foot or two above
ground.
Charlie.
Gordon
roped off, and it looked as though netting paths were being laid to
protect the grass.
--
Gordon
Nick Pedley
"RJ Webb" <highcr...@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote in message
news:4031f246...@news-text.blueyonder.co.uk...
>
> Was there in December.. as I was on a circuit, I just found some
> laybys elsewhere on my route. The pub and caff got the money.
>
> There are plenty of places on the B road to the north. BTW the caff
> in the YH is pretty good in the cake dept.
>
> Richard Webb
Which YH do you mean, Ravenstor? Might pop in if it's open, am staying at
Hartington Hall and Ilam.
As for parking near Monsal I might follow Trail's suggestion* and park in a
lay-by... now here's a point for you all to discuss!
'Should Trail magazine suggest the use of proper car parks or lay-bys?'
And what does parking cost at Monsal Head anyway? (50p for one hour max last
time I was there some years ago).
Nick
*Their route diagram had arrows going the opposite way to the actual route
guide, should I be worried?! ;-)
Bernie Hughes
> I honestly don't see that parking charges amount to a heap of beans.
> Even if it costs £5 to park my car all day its only a couple of pints.
> I've been trying to get my head 'round why such a small amount of
> money causes some people such a problem.
It's not the money that matters, it's the principle. Paying extra for petrol
in a rural station isn't a problem, nor is the extra pound on a dusty bottle
of plonk from the tiny spar a big deal either. But I fail to see how the
local community benefits from parking charges.
>I wonder if a part of it is the fact that we are the walking generation
that has seen our hobby
> pass from one that is essentially free (beyond one or two essesntial
> bits of kit) to one that is progressively being asked to contribute to
> the grander scheme of things.
You might be, I was born in the 70's :-)
Roger
from "Chris Gilbert" <chris_...@ntlworld.com> contains these words:
> As I said, its a small amount and I don't see the problem and I was
> trying to understand it. One person's reasonable charge is clearly
> another's paying through the nose. Everything's subjective, I suppose.
It depends how 'comfortably off' you are. Would you pay £50 for the
privilege of parking your car? £5 out of an income of £5000 pa hurts a
damn sight more than £50 out of an income of £50000 pa.
--
Roger
Charles Frederick Wildgoose
Gordon <Gor...@g3snx.demon.co.uk> wrote >
> Last summer there was a cluster of tents and tree houses there,
> presumably to prevent them starting it. We walked down to Nine ladies
> from Rowsley - free car parking at Caudwell's Mill.
During the last few years the parking of cars [other than by visitors to the
Mill] has been discouraged. I don't believe there's been any wheel clamping
yet but who knows ? If motorists carry on for just a few more yards beyond
Caudwells Mill from the A6 they cross a roadbridge. The road then bends
right immediately and there is some roadside parking which is probably a
better bet.
Incidentally, the Country Parlour at Caudwell's Mill serve an excellent
Homity Pie amongst other things and the mill is worth looking round too.
Charlie.
Gordon
>
>> We walked down to Nine ladies
>> from Rowsley - free car parking at Caudwell's Mill.
>
>During the last few years the parking of cars [other than by visitors to the
>Mill] has been discouraged. I don't believe there's been any wheel clamping
>yet but who knows ? If motorists carry on for just a few more yards beyond
>Caudwells Mill from the A6 they cross a roadbridge. The road then bends
>right immediately and there is some roadside parking which is probably a
>better bet.
>
>Incidentally, the Country Parlour at Caudwell's Mill serve an excellent
>Homity Pie amongst other things and the mill is worth looking round too.
>
>Charlie.
>
black cat ornament for my wife on that trip, and we had a Tour de la
Mill. We were the only punters on that tour! :-)
I did the Nine Ladies walk with my current lady friend last summer and
we went in the Country Parlour for tea and cakes etc.
I always try to make a contribution to the local economy, but prefer it
to be other than extortionate parking fees.
~~~~~~~~~~~~
So there! :-p
PS My spell-chucker wanted me to change that to "Extortion ate". :-)
--
Gordon
RJ Webb
<nichola...@npedley.freeserve.co.uk> wrote:
>
>"RJ Webb" <highcr...@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote in message
>news:4031f246...@news-text.blueyonder.co.uk...
>>
>
>> Was there in December.. as I was on a circuit, I just found some
>> laybys elsewhere on my route. The pub and caff got the money.
>>
>> There are plenty of places on the B road to the north. BTW the caff
>> in the YH is pretty good in the cake dept.
>>
>> Richard Webb
>
>Which YH do you mean, Ravenstor? Might pop in if it's open, am staying at
>Hartington Hall and Ilam.
Mistake... It was not the YH but some building by the pool at
Cresbrook.
Richard Webb
Charles Frederick Wildgoose
> There was some work going n when we were last there, the stones were
> roped off, and it looked as though netting paths were being laid to
> protect the grass.
The Peak Park have a management agreement with the Stanton Estate, so it may
have been them who were working on it.
We [the Derbyshire Dales Group of the Ramblers' Association] were recently
working on the moor with Peak Park Ranger Neil Hanshaw cutting down some of
the isolated silver birches. If these were allowed to spread there would
eventually be no heather on the moor. I didn't realise that heather doesn't
survive in the shade of birch trees.
There was a mixed bag of comments from walkers [local dog walkers included]
who were passing by : some of them feel it is a pity that the birches were
being cut down. They would presumably be the first to complain if in twenty
years time the moor is covered by birch trees. We also had a visit from an
eco-warrior who wanted to know what we were doing. When he learnt it was the
Peak Park and local members of the RA he said 'No problem' and seemed quite
thrilled as he said we were on the same side. He even gave me their mobile
telephone number telling me to ask for Wooky if I phoned and if we were
passing any time then we should call in for a cup of tea.
Charlie.
pb
> >> in the YH is pretty good in the cake dept.
> >>
> >
at
> >Hartington Hall and Ilam.
>
> Mistake... It was not the YH but some building by the pool at
> Cresbrook.
D's brew stop IIRC. Ginormous cups of tea too!!
pb
Chris Gilbert
> Mistake... It was not the YH but some building by the pool at
> Cresbrook.
That'll be D's Brew Stop. Run by a guy called Dave Teare. Nice chap.
At the Brew Stop he lets you eat your own food. Good position to and
now that the rennovations at the mill are drawing to a close the
ambience will also get even better over the next couple of years as
all of the work grows over.
Chris
Michael Farthing
Frederick Wildgoose <wild...@zetnet.co.uk> writes
>There was a mixed bag of comments from walkers [local dog walkers included]
>who were passing by : some of them feel it is a pity that the birches were
>being cut down. They would presumably be the first to complain if in twenty
>years time the moor is covered by birch trees.
I just can't understand this. Why would they complain? Why is heather
superior to birch? OK, some people may think it is, but there's nothing
obvious about it. There are lots of people who would much prefer
natural forest to be allowed to develop in place of the distorted
landscape created by past human intervention. I've never understood
this conservationist desire to interfere with the natural course of
nature. What is the conservationists' problem that makes them so
hostile to nature?
--
Michael Farthing
cyclades
Software House
Paul Rooney
The desire for biodiversity. Left to itself, our upland would not
contain heather moors. But heather moors are interesting places for
some species, and vital for others.
--
Paul
My Lake District walking site (updated 29th September 2003):
RJ Webb
>We [the Derbyshire Dales Group of the Ramblers' Association] were recently
>working on the moor with Peak Park Ranger Neil Hanshaw cutting down some of
>the isolated silver birches. If these were allowed to spread there would
>eventually be no heather on the moor. I didn't realise that heather doesn't
>survive in the shade of birch trees.
A useful orienteering technique. At Stanton - head for the white bits
on the map - faster going. Heather thrives around the edges of
woodland though - thats where you find it in Norway where there is no
grouse management- its also where you find the grouse.
Ironically the best orienteering at Stanton are the old quarries
around the TV mast and in the camp. Fiendishly difficult. The old
overgrown quarries are great wild places, quarrying is a pain when it
happens but often with time leaves great wildlife places.
Richard Webb
Michael Farthing
<paulr...@aol.com> writes
Not left to itself it does not contain birch woods.
Nature does a very good job of providing biodiversity. That's where it
came from in the first place. It is man that threatens it. Left to
themselves our upland would contain not only biodiversity, but
sustainable and appropriate biodiversity. It is also silly to say that
we would not have heather moorlands. We would not have heather
moorlands in SOME of the places we now have them. We would have other
things instead. (ie biodiversity).
We've got rid of planned economies in Eastern Europe now everyone has
realised that Bureaucracy is not too hot on getting everything right by
planning. Well will the same lesson be applied to the Natural World?
Paul Rooney
<m...@cyclades.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>Nature does a very good job of providing biodiversity. That's where it
>came from in the first place.
Not so. The richness of British plants and wildlife is due in large
part to the rich diversity of man-made habitats. Ask in
uk.rec.natural-history about the flora of the Downs, for example.
Michael Farthing
<paulr...@aol.com> writes
>On Thu, 19 Feb 2004 11:04:27 +0000, Michael Farthing
><m...@cyclades.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>
>
>>Nature does a very good job of providing biodiversity. That's where it
>>came from in the first place.
>
>Not so. The richness of British plants and wildlife is due in large
>part to the rich diversity of man-made habitats.
It is still nature that has done the work (_pace_ escaped cultivates: a
relatively minor aspect). And had the variety of man-made habitats not
existed there would still be the variety of natural ones: indeed the
variety is often due to man's inability to impose a uniformity on a
scene that will not comply.
In the sense that man frequently disturbs the land and so facilitates
the appearance of a wide range of generalist life at the expense of the
climax community, which is quite likely to be more specialist and with
fewer species, then one can make a case. But of course taking all
climax communities in the country then the number of species is greatly
increased, whereas the generalists, by their nature, differ less from
place to place.
But man's tendency is to interrupt the autogenic processes at particular
points, so that we are left with monocultures rather than a regularly
changing succession. And where that culture is a product (such as
sheep) - well all the more so.
But consider the original issue: the destruction of the birch is an
attempt to freeze an autogenic succession at a particular point. It
should be allowed to go its way - and in some places the birch will
triumph and in others the heather will remain. We shall have a mixture
and the sites that follow each course will have been far better selected
for fitness for purpose than a park ranger can ever hope to achieve.
>Ask in
>uk.rec.natural-history about the flora of the Downs, for example.
If you expect me to research your arguments for you rather than actually
presenting them yourself, then at least refer me to a proper piece of
research.
However, even man has increased biodiversity on the Downs (which I doubt
- the biodiversity is fundamentally due to the nature of the ground,
though the exact mix is undoubtedly different as a result of human
actions), this can hardly be seen as a conclusion that transfers to the
rest of the landscape and it also sits ill-at-ease with the
Conservationist assertion that modern farming methods are a cause of
decline. You can't have your cake and eat it.
I will concede, however, that the man's unintentional facilitating of
introductions has increased the total number of species. The trouble is
that the conservationists don't like that!
Paul Rooney
<m...@cyclades.demon.co.uk> wrote:
Someone else explain - I have to quench a thirst.
(X-posts added).
Nick Pedley
"Charles Frederick Wildgoose" <wild...@zetnet.co.uk> wrote in message
news:40348072$0$17208$4c56...@master.news.zetnet.net...
Glad to hear that the area is in good hands and am still considering a
stroll round there, time and weather permitting.
What amazes me is the owner of the quarry. Apparently he lives in Haddon
Hall under which is a tunnel for the Matlock-Buxton railway line which was
closed in the 1960's and is due for reopening. He is part of the group who
oppose the line because, among other reasons, it will detract from the
natural beauty of the area....
Nick
Gordon
>have been them who were working on it.
>
>We [the Derbyshire Dales Group of the Ramblers' Association] were recently
>working on the moor with Peak Park Ranger Neil Hanshaw cutting down some of
>the isolated silver birches. If these were allowed to spread there would
>eventually be no heather on the moor. I didn't realise that heather doesn't
>survive in the shade of birch trees.
>
>There was a mixed bag of comments from walkers [local dog walkers included]
>who were passing by : some of them feel it is a pity that the birches were
>being cut down. They would presumably be the first to complain if in twenty
>years time the moor is covered by birch trees. We also had a visit from an
>eco-warrior who wanted to know what we were doing. When he learnt it was the
>Peak Park and local members of the RA he said 'No problem' and seemed quite
>thrilled as he said we were on the same side. He even gave me their mobile
>telephone number telling me to ask for Wooky if I phoned and if we were
>passing any time then we should call in for a cup of tea.
>
>Charlie.
>
I did think of hailing them as we passed their encampment, but all
seemed to be quiet.
Regarding birch trees, did you know that you can often find Fly Agaric
under birches? Or so my daughter told me when we saw some on the
ground under a birch.
--
Gordon
Gordon
>
>
>Glad to hear that the area is in good hands and am still considering a
>stroll round there, time and weather permitting.
>What amazes me is the owner of the quarry. Apparently he lives in Haddon
>Hall under which is a tunnel for the Matlock-Buxton railway line which was
>closed in the 1960's and is due for reopening. He is part of the group who
>oppose the line because, among other reasons, it will detract from the
>natural beauty of the area....
>
>Nick
>
--
Gordon
Gordon
:-(
--
Gordon
AndyP
> It's not the money that matters, it's the principle. Paying extra for
petrol
> in a rural station isn't a problem, nor is the extra pound on a dusty
bottle
> of plonk from the tiny spar a big deal either. But I fail to see how the
> local community benefits from parking charges.
It's a self perpetuating kind of scenario. Car park charges bring in a bit
of money encouraging the touristifying of the area to bring in more people,
more people need more car parking etc etc. Whether this is of benefit or
not to the locals depends on whether they're in the tourism industry.
The way it seems to work at the moment where I used to live is that the
paying carparks get signed and promoted in leaflets listing local
attractions thus keeping all the tourists in one area, leaving the locals
with a bit of peace and quiet to enjoy all the best bits.