Rescue on Pyg Track
Paul Upham
came across 3 girls, one of whom had slipped on the path. Although she was
essentially lying right across the path, she had been there for a few
minutes before we stopped and offered help.
Firstly, thanks a bunch to all those who just walked by before we got to
her. Also, thanks to everyone else who walked by as we tried in vain to get
her down, with either a badly sprained or broken ankle. However, my genuine
thanks do go to the odd one or two individuals who did offer assistance.
Eventually, a Sea King from RAF Valley which happened to be exercising in
the area, winched her on board and took her to Bangor Hospital.
The 2 girls came from Bexhill-on-Sea and I would really like to know how she
got on and how she is now. So please, is anyone out there who knows these
girls?
Regards
Paul
Pedt Scragg
<paul....@btinternet.com> writes
[coming across PYG track mishap]
>
>Firstly, thanks a bunch to all those who just walked by before we got to
>her. Also, thanks to everyone else who walked by as we tried in vain to get
>her down, with either a badly sprained or broken ankle.
Happens a lot, unfortunately :-( I saw quite a bit of it being on the
hills 5 days a week as a professional guide for 15 years or so. Always
remember being on Tryan N. ridge and meeting a guy who'd frozen on the
Tower. The four I had with me just buggered off and continued on their
own leaving me to help the Dutch Gentleman who was in serious distress
and had been for around 30 mins or so with numerous people passing him
ignoring his request for help. His girlfriend [soon to be very ex] was
just waiting on the summit for him.
I still meet this bloke once a year for a week in various parts of the
UK for a session of walking/scrambling and my real pleasure was getting
him and his new wife over Aonach Eagach [ sp? ] in September this year
without problems.
--
Pedt
http://signpost-design.co.uk/
Signpost Web Design, Wrexham, North Wales
Jhimmy
I'm no medical prcationer, but even a sprained ankle can cause huge problems
with others trying to carry a victim down a wet slippery mountain path. I
remember a program on telly years ago (999) when an injured walker kept
walking and the helicopter had to follow her, while signalling for her to
stop! She didn't! on and on she went. Can't remember how she stopped,
though.
Finally, not to help is callous to say the extreme.
Jhimmy.
Alan White
wrote:
>Raises the question of when and when not to call the rescue teams out.
>
It's quite instructive reading the reports of MRTs. People seem to
initiate a call-out for quite trivial reasons. A sprained wrist is one
that I remember which, although no doubt very painful, doesn't really
hamper walking. However, without knowing the full details it's
probably rash to pontificate.
We've thought about our own reaction to injury and came to the
conclusion that we would only need an MRT if we weren't sufficiently
mobile to get out safely by ourselves from wherever we were. I can
think of at least two instances in which if we'd followed criteria
used by some others, quoted in the reports, we would have called out
the MRT and one instance where there wasn't one and we were a long way
from civilisation anyway.
--
Alan White
in England's Lake District.
http://www.alan.lesley.ukgateway.net
Pete Jones
...but let's do it anyway....
-----------------------------------
Don't believe the hype
www.trackster-man.co.uk
Alan White <alan....@ukgateway.net> wrote in message
news:JZAcOM6if+5y8W...@4ax.com...
Paul Upham
> >
>
call for help - I know that some MRTs frown on mobile phones and indeed I
do.
However, I never gave it any thought beforehand, but if you dial 999 on a
mobile, you could be connected to an emergency operator anywhere in the
country and probably not in the area you need help for!
In this case, we were transferred through 4 different operators, 1 of which
was in Aldershot!
In all cases, the operator said "why don't we contact the local MRT
ourselves, it is nothing to do with us" or words to that effect.
Eventually my colleague who was making the call demanded to know the name of
the operator and instructed them to make a note of the grid reference and
our phone number. He also left the operator the instruction that they were
to phone us with a reply.
Less than 2 minutes later, the phone rang, informing us that a helicopter
was airborne in the area and would be with us shortly. As I put the phone
back in my pocket, the Sea King flew into the valley!
Don't rely on mobiles!!
Regards
Paul
Pedt Scragg
<paul....@btinternet.com> writes
>> >Raises the question of when and when not to call the rescue teams out.
>> >
>>
>As the originator of this string, I omitted the problems we had trying to
>call for help - I know that some MRTs frown on mobile phones and indeed I
>do.
>
>However, I never gave it any thought beforehand, but if you dial 999 on a
>mobile, you could be connected to an emergency operator anywhere in the
>country and probably not in the area you need help for!
>
report a lorry shedding bits of its load on the A1(M) near Scotch Corner
and got an operator in the SW of England. AIUI, you should dial 112 from
a mobile to get the nearest operator to the mast you connect to as 999
can go, as you found out, anywhere if supported.
AAPOI, 112 also works from landlines.
David Springthorpe
wrote:
>I remember a program on telly years ago (999) when an injured walker kept.....
I didn't know they had television 1,000 years ago.....!!!!!
David Springthorpe.
Michael Farthing
paul....@btinternet.com "Paul Upham" writes:
> In this case, we were transferred through 4 different operators, 1 of which
> was in Aldershot!
> In all cases, the operator said "why don't we contact the local MRT
> ourselves, it is nothing to do with us" or words to that effect.
I have always understood that the preferred procedure is to dial 999,
ask for the police, and that they are then geared up to call the MRT.
Any MRT members care to comment?
--
Michael Farthing
cyclades
software house
Stephen Shepherd
> AIUI, you should dial 112 from
> a mobile to get the nearest operator to the mast you connect to as 999
> can go, as you found out, anywhere if supported.
>
> AAPOI, 112 also works from landlines.
> --
> Pedt
Isn't 112 Euro wide? That is any phone, as well as a 'disconnected' mobile,
in Europe will connect you through to the Emergency Operator with 112. I've
noticed recently in phone boxes 112 is alongside 999.
--
Stephen Shepherd
US National Parks, RN pictures, F1 info, Ford Puma
http://homepages.which.net/~stephen.shepherd
The Strictly Unofficial Jaguar Racing Website http://jaguarracing.home.dhs.org
Phil Brady
Paul Upham <paul....@btinternet.com> wrote in article
<7vi9p1$ih1$1...@uranium.btinternet.com>...
> > >Raises the question of when and when not to call the rescue teams out.
> > >
> >
> As the originator of this string, I omitted the problems we had trying to
> call for help - I know that some MRTs frown on mobile phones and indeed I
> do.
>
> However, I never gave it any thought beforehand, but if you dial 999 on a
> mobile, you could be connected to an emergency operator anywhere in the
> country and probably not in the area you need help for!
>
> In this case, we were transferred through 4 different operators, 1 of
which
> was in Aldershot!
[ .. snip .. ]
That can happen with land lines too. My previous university, in order to
save costs, subscribed to a phone company whose local exchange was 40
miles away. The result was that some emergency calls were rejected because
we were routed to the wrong centre. We never could get them to acknowledge
that we were legitimate but solved it by changing tables in the exchange to
route 999 calls over local BT lines.
Phil Brady
Tony Gillon
Yes Dial 999 ask for the Police force for the county that you are in then
when connected to the Police then request Mountain Rescue and that trips the
system in to operation to mobilise the appropriate team.
Tony Gillon
Team Secretary
Oldham Mountain Rescue Team
Michael Farthing <m...@cyclades.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
news:941454...@cyclades.demon.co.uk...
> In article <7vi9p1$ih1$1...@uranium.btinternet.com>
> paul....@btinternet.com "Paul Upham" writes:
>
> > In this case, we were transferred through 4 different operators, 1 of
which
> > was in Aldershot!
Mike Lees
<m...@cyclades.demon.co.uk> writes
>In article <7vi9p1$ih1$1...@uranium.btinternet.com>
> paul....@btinternet.com "Paul Upham" writes:
>
>> In this case, we were transferred through 4 different operators, 1 of which
>> was in Aldershot!
>> In all cases, the operator said "why don't we contact the local MRT
>> ourselves, it is nothing to do with us" or words to that effect.
>
>I have always understood that the preferred procedure is to dial 999,
>ask for the police, and that they are then geared up to call the MRT.
>Any MRT members care to comment?
>
The preferred procedure is, as Michael states, to call the Police and
explain that it is a mountain incident.
It is only the Police, and the Mountain Rescue Team's who have the
authority to call on the services of the RAF, or it was in my day, and I
dont think that it has changed.
It is a pity that outside of the mountain areas of the UK the 999
operators are not all conversant with MR procedures. I have found that
in almost all cases however, the Police, wherever they are, are usually
"on the ball" and contact the relevant MRT and set the operation/rescue
in motion.
--
Mike Lees
Founder member - Peak District Mountain Rescue Organisation
Ex member - Glossop Mountain Rescue Team
Paul Horder
999 on his mobile phone, asked for mountain rescue and was put through to
Liverpool Coastguard! Almost 10 minutes later and after speaking to 5
operators did he get to the appropriate person. En route he was even put
through to Keswick Tourist Information Centre!
Tony Gillon <to...@gillon27.freeserve.co.uk> wrote in message
news:7vn95b$nli$1...@news5.svr.pol.co.uk...
> Michael and All
>
> Yes Dial 999 ask for the Police force for the county that you are in then
> when connected to the Police then request Mountain Rescue and that trips
the
> system in to operation to mobilise the appropriate team.
>
> Tony Gillon
> Team Secretary
> Oldham Mountain Rescue Team
>
>
> Michael Farthing <m...@cyclades.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
> news:941454...@cyclades.demon.co.uk...
> > In article <7vi9p1$ih1$1...@uranium.btinternet.com>
> > paul....@btinternet.com "Paul Upham" writes:
> >
> > > In this case, we were transferred through 4 different operators, 1 of
> which
> > > was in Aldershot!
> > > In all cases, the operator said "why don't we contact the local MRT
> > > ourselves, it is nothing to do with us" or words to that effect.
> >
> > I have always understood that the preferred procedure is to dial 999,
> > ask for the police, and that they are then geared up to call the MRT.
> > Any MRT members care to comment?
> >
Alan White
So far none of the posts in this thread, apart from my original, have
addressed the subject and we've got into an interesting discussion on
_how_ to summon the MRT.
Under what circumstances would you want to summon the MRT?
Chris Gilbert
Alan White wrote in message ...
>Under what circumstances would you want to summon the MRT?
When one of my party, or someone we encounter, is incapacitated
and we can't get them off the hill ourselves without risking exacerbating
whatever their incapacitation is. (ie. we need a stretcher or a helicopter
or both )
or
Someone has left route information for a walk involving risk with me
and they have failed to show up a few hours after the time they said
they would.
Chris
Bernard
Alan White wrote in message ...
>
>So far none of the posts in this thread, apart from my original, have
>addressed the subject and we've got into an interesting discussion on
>_how_ to summon the MRT.
>
>
This does not quite answer your question, but it was a story told to me.
A colleague in a previous job used to lead parties of teenagers up Snowdon,
on one descent, towards Pen-y-Pas (is that spelt correctly?) I think, a
member of the party who was becoming very tired and fatigued had an accident
and hurt or sprained an ankle. Another member of the party who was
considered fit, competent and able was explained the route and asked to go
ahead and wait in the cafe. If they had not arrived back by a certain time
he was to call the MRT. During the descent, the person going ahead, for
some inexplicable reason felt a need to go back to the party to check some
details, but he got lost! He eventually found the railways lines and had
the good sense to follow them down. In the meantime, the main party got
back to the cafe before the appointed time and ended up called out the MRT
for their missing member.
Regards
Bernard
Pedt Scragg
<alan....@ukgateway.net> writes
>Sigh.
>
>So far none of the posts in this thread, apart from my original, have
>addressed the subject and we've got into an interesting discussion on
>_how_ to summon the MRT.
>
>Under what circumstances would you want to summon the MRT?
>
a) One of your group suffers an accident that you cannot deal with
within the group;
b) You come across an accident as above.
Walking Company I used to work for also had a policy that if a group was
well overdue on ETA (1-2 hours depending on the walk, group, time of
year and weather) or darkness had fallen one hour after ETA then police
phoned on their general number, not 999 one, about possible problem. If
still did not turn up [or phone] after another hour then another call to
general number. The two times that procedure was used in 14 years both
Police and MRT were grateful for an early 'heads-up' - one was a party
trying to find a lost walking club member in appalling weather and
second was a group trying to get a lady with a broken arm down who was
incapable, due to shock, of walking for more than a minute at a time. In
both cases Police contacted MRT who contacted the property and then
decided that the circumstances [weather, time of year, walk] were such
that they'd move immediately rather than wait. Incidentally, that policy
was approved in discussions with Police and MRT in all of the areas that
we operated in. General MRT position was 'we'd rather know early about
what might be a problem so we can take a decision as to whether or not
to move now'.
As an aside, I was with a group on Blea Rigg a good few years ago and we
heard someone shouting for help 'Help! My Wife's ill!' in the direction
somewhere between Sgt. Man and Tarn Crag. Hurtled down to NDG Hotel and
called Police then MRT who'd just had a couple of other calls about the
cries for help as well. Swift response with teams going from both from
NDG and Easedale Road. It turned out the lady had an upset stomach. They
walked out and met MRT on their way up to Easedale Tarn. Thanks though
from MRT to myself and the others who'd reported the cries for help
though it turned out that the lady did not really need MRT assistance.
In essence I suppose it boils down to:
a) If you can't handle it yourself then MRT
b) Cries for help you cannot get to then MRT
Mark Tennent
MRT should only be summoned if:
person is injured and cannot get off the hill without making injury or
condition worse.
person is overdue when a "deadline" was set. ("Deadline" should be say c.2
hrs after latest expected time).
person is stuck and to remain out overnight would be life-threatening.
person is incapable of extracting themselves (e.g. cragfast), even in
daylight.
MRT should NOT be summoned if:
person has only minor injury that allows them to walk of the hill either
unaided or with assistance from other members of party or passers-by.
person(s) only wishes to avoid a miserable, but not life-threatening,
bivouac.
person(s) is capable of extracting themselves once daylight comes.
--
Mark Tennent
Glencoe, Scotland
www.glencoe-mountain-sport.co.uk
Alan White <alan....@ukgateway.net> wrote in message
news:Kf4fODynn2oVVn...@4ax.com...
> Sigh.
>
> So far none of the posts in this thread, apart from my original, have
> addressed the subject and we've got into an interesting discussion on
> _how_ to summon the MRT.
>
>
Alan White
<markt...@clara.net> wrote:
>> Under what circumstances would you want to summon the MRT?
>
>MRT should only be summoned if:
>
>person is injured and cannot get off the hill without making injury or
>condition worse.
>person is overdue when a "deadline" was set. ("Deadline" should be say c.2
>hrs after latest expected time).
>person is stuck and to remain out overnight would be life-threatening.
>person is incapable of extracting themselves (e.g. cragfast), even in
>daylight.
>
>MRT should NOT be summoned if:
>
>person has only minor injury that allows them to walk of the hill either
>unaided or with assistance from other members of party or passers-by.
>person(s) only wishes to avoid a miserable, but not life-threatening,
>bivouac.
>person(s) is capable of extracting themselves once daylight comes.
Thanks Mark, that's exactly how we think it ought to be.
--
Alan White and Lesley Williams
Janet Moxley
gone really pear-shaped ; )
--
Cheers
Janet
Remove NOSPAM from return address before replying
Alan White <alan....@ukgateway.net> wrote in message
news:Kf4fODynn2oVVn...@4ax.com...
> Sigh.
>
> So far none of the posts in this thread, apart from my original, have
> addressed the subject and we've got into an interesting discussion on
> _how_ to summon the MRT.
>
> Under what circumstances would you want to summon the MRT?
>
> --
> Alan White
Janet Moxley
Phil Brady <iss...@bangor.ac.uk> wrote in message
news:01bf24a1$14aa4160$2d01...@is20.bangor.ac.uk...
>
>
> That can happen with land lines too. My previous university, in order to
> save costs, subscribed to a phone company whose local exchange was 40
> miles away. The result was that some emergency calls were rejected
because
> we were routed to the wrong centre. We never could get them to
acknowledge
> that we were legitimate but solved it by changing tables in the exchange
to
> route 999 calls over local BT lines.
>
> Phil Brady
--
It sounds like you were making a lot of 999 calls if you needed to save
money on them. Even for a student group this sounds like a lot of call outs.
What were you up to?
Gordon Harris
<ja...@moxley.fsnet.co.uk> writes
>I don't _want_ in summon the MRT at all as this would mean something had
>gone really pear-shaped ; )
>
>Janet
>
Most things do - eventually. 8-(
--
Gordon
Pedt Scragg
Horder <paulh...@derwentwater.demon.co.uk> writes
>Easier said than done! Someone we rescued a couple of months ago dialled
>999 on his mobile phone, asked for mountain rescue and was put through to
>Liverpool Coastguard! Almost 10 minutes later and after speaking to 5
>operators did he get to the appropriate person. En route he was even put
>through to Keswick Tourist Information Centre!
>
a bit of a clue and actually ask *where* (as in County or better ?) that
the caller is phoning from.
W.D.Grey
<Gor...@g3snx.demon.co.uk> writes
>Most things do - eventually. 8-(
Now then Gordon, are you talking about us wrinklies?
--
Bill
http://www.graigroad.demon.co.uk
Gordon Harris
<Bi...@graigroad.demon.co.uk> writes
>In article <PmCpuHAM...@g3snx.demon.co.uk>, Gordon Harris
><Gor...@g3snx.demon.co.uk> writes
>>Most things do - eventually. 8-(
>
>Now then Gordon, are you talking about us wrinklies?
I can only speak about my own wrinkly.
--
Gordon