Alternatives to Rival 34
JHP
boat which puts seaworthiness before accommodation, can be sailed short
handed and my wife has taken a shine to the Rival 34. Although there are a
number about it seems wise to me to look at other similar designs.
Any advice, please?
John Powell
rjh...@ucs.ed.ac.uk
Contessa 32?
RH
JHP
<rjh...@ucs.ed.ac.uk> wrote in message
news:8rcg8b$fj2$1...@scotsman.ed.ac.uk...
Thanks - slightly smaller internally though, perhaps?
John
Sarah & Tony Boas
got back from another few days on her in the Med. Good seaworthy boats,
although a bit short of space.
I prefer my Sadler 34 - also a good record of seaworthiness and
passagemaking as has the Rival. The Sadler is a bit faster, I reckon
also a bit more comfortable, excellent chart table / nav area, and also
has better accommodation - although not as good as some more modern
designs (e.g Halberg Rassey 34 - but ŁŁŁs more). Basically the Sadler
is 10 years newer than the Rival in design and benefits from some of the
lessons learnt over the period. I also consider that the double skin,
'unsinkable' construction is a big plus.
In terms of short handed sailing, I do sail her solo but more usually
with my wife, and we have no problems with one only on watch plus self
steering.
Tony Boas
Sadler 34 - Bold Warrior
"JHP" <john.powell1@(nospam)virgin.net> wrote in message
news:V1jC5.10360$uq5.1...@news6-win.server.ntlworld.com...
> I would be grateful for any advice on alternatives to a Rival 34. We
want a
> boat which puts seaworthiness before accommodation, can be sailed
short
> handed and my wife has taken a shine to the Rival 34. Although there
are a
> number about it seems wise to me to look at other similar designs.
> Any advice, please?
> John Powell
>
>
>
Rainer Thonnes
"JHP" <john.powell1@(nospam)virgin.net> writes:
><rjh...@ucs.ed.ac.uk> wrote
>> "JHP" <john.powell1@(nospam)virgin.net> writes:
>> > I would be grateful for any advice on alternatives to a Rival 34. We
>> > want a boat which puts seaworthiness before accommodation, can be
>> > sailed short handed and my wife has taken a shine to the Rival 34.
>>
>
>Thanks - slightly smaller internally though, perhaps?
Quite. But you did say seaworthiness before accommodation. And
the larger boat might be a little harder to handle short handed.
When I was in the market for a boat in this size range, a bit over
two years ago, the Contessa was one of the ones I looked at and
found it really rather cramped. I much preferred the Rival 32 (the
34 being out of my price range) and nearly bought one, but a rival
buyer (pun intended) snapped her up before I could get a trial sail.
I eventually settled on an Elizabethan 33 which is reasonably
comfortable internally, and is seaworthy by design, having a
traditional long keel. In fact, her smaller sister, the Liz 31,
from which the 33 differs virtually only by having a stern
locker stuck on the end of the cockpit (as a counter stern
entirely above the waterline), is essentially a scaled-up Folkboat,
apart from not being fractionally-rigged. I usually sail her single
handed. Though a purist at heart, I've made concessions and let the
Autohelm strut its stuff.
You could do worse than investing in a copy of the Good Yacht Guide
to help you focus your search.
http://www.goodyachtguide.fsnet.co.uk
Unfortunately it looks like you might need to buy two volumes
as they're sorted by boat length and there's one volume for
27-34ft and one for 34-50ft.
You can then get review article reprints for specific models.
rjh...@ucs.ed.ac.uk
>
> Thanks - slightly smaller internally though, perhaps?
There's the rub. I can't remember which is smaller internally as it's so
long since I sailed either (1992, Contessa, before that for a Rival 34).
My memory is of the Contessa being slightly roomier, but this may have
been because the Rival had the `owners cabin and shower aft' sort of
layout - meaning less room for the foc'sle hands (I was a foc'sle hand
in those days).
Also from memory, I remember the Rival as being slightly finer at the
bow (wetter in a blow going to windward?).
Rainer's comments are probably more pertinent than mine as he seems to
have been looking at boats this size and shape more recently than me
(I've not been on a boat smaller than about 38' for 4-5 seasons now).
Hull shape (length of keel) is definitely important here. If you really
want to frighten yourself in respect of modern fin-keel yachts, read
Marchaj's `Seaworthiness: The Forgotten Factor' - impressive and useful
book.
RH
rjh...@ucs.ed.ac.uk
> I would be grateful for any advice on alternatives to a Rival 34. We want a
> boat which puts seaworthiness before accommodation, can be sailed short
> number about it seems wise to me to look at other similar designs.
> Any advice, please?
A radical alternative! How about a gaffer? A plastic one, but a gaffer
all the same - seaworthy, roomy, etc.
I sail gaffers all the time these days, and though I've never sailed one
of this particular make, the replica Falmouth Quay Punts built by Martin
Heard of Mylor have a very good reputation down in the West Country and
there is a small second-hand market in these boats. Can't remember the
size range of all the models, but there is a web page:
http://homepages.tcp.co.uk/~rihan/gala.html
with some contacts which may be of help.
RH
JHP
>
> Quite. But you did say seaworthiness before accommodation. And
> the larger boat might be a little harder to handle short handed.
>
> When I was in the market for a boat in this size range, a bit over
> two years ago, the Contessa was one of the ones I looked at and
> found it really rather cramped. I much preferred the Rival 32 (the
> 34 being out of my price range) and nearly bought one, but a rival
> buyer (pun intended) snapped her up before I could get a trial sail.
>
> I eventually settled on an Elizabethan 33 which is reasonably
> comfortable internally, and is seaworthy by design, having a
> traditional long keel. In fact, her smaller sister, the Liz 31,
> from which the 33 differs virtually only by having a stern
> locker stuck on the end of the cockpit (as a counter stern
> entirely above the waterline), is essentially a scaled-up Folkboat,
> apart from not being fractionally-rigged. I usually sail her single
> handed. Though a purist at heart, I've made concessions and let the
> Autohelm strut its stuff.
>
> You could do worse than investing in a copy of the Good Yacht Guide
> to help you focus your search.
>
Thanks, most helpful.
John
John Edginton
news:V1jC5.10360$uq5.1...@news6-win.server.ntlworld.com...
a
> boat which puts seaworthiness before accommodation, can be sailed short
> handed and my wife has taken a shine to the Rival 34. Although there are a
> number about it seems wise to me to look at other similar designs.
> Any advice, please?
>
What about a Victoria 34? They go like a small train, have reasonable room
and a great motion. After 3 days in a 70Knt gale that blew to 70Knt 350Nm
out in the Western Approaches I can vouch for their seaworthyness.
John
secats
> "JHP" <john.powell1@(nospam)virgin.net> wrote in message
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> I would be grateful for any advice on alternatives to a Rival 34.
>John,
The deep 34 (5ft 10in) is a vastly better sailer than the shallow (4ft 8in);
different shape keel for one thing. I sailed the protype (built '71) deep 34
in OSTAR 76 and out of
126 starters and about 75 finishers (the weather mostly awful) I finished 23
and had not sailed the boat for more than two weeks before the race.
Wonderful balance, very forgiving, didn't much mind if over canveassed or
under. Great, but as
Tony says a 1965 design, really.
Curiously I was out examining in a shallow 34 last w/e and it brought back
memories.
I also sail C 32 from time to time: very pretty, much wetter than a Rival,
where the high bow keeps you dry but blows around when berthing. R 34 and
C32 and Sad 34 all fin and skeg = awkward in marinas until you learn the
knack. R and C both classics, whatever that is worth and the S could well
become one. Have always enjoyed sailing the S 34 too, but it is a
different generation so they cannot really be compared - which is not meant
as a criticism, it is just that later ideas produced a different boat - with
a lot more room and probably a longer waterline and more speed.
The point about the Rival 32 being lighter than the bigger R34 is a well
known and reasonable misunderstanding. The sail plan is identical and the
weight only slightly different. The R34 is a much better sailer that the
R32.
If marina handling is important, how about a Fulmar, which is also a delight
to sail and roomy for its length, less expensive perhaps than the others?
Geoff
>
>
>
JHP
secats <sec...@cwcom.net> wrote in message
news:IbpC5.694$aQ3.760@news1-hme0...
Thanks for all that - you 've given me two new ideas if I can't track down a
R34.
Thanks to everybody, in fact - much apprecaited.
John
Sarah & Tony Boas
posting, the Rival 34 which I sailed & compared unfavourably with the
Sadler 34 for sailing performance was the shallow (4'8") version not the
deep keel.
Fulmar is well worth a look - many were used for sail training in all
weathers - but 32 feet LOA, not 34.
I agree with the comments on handling in marinas - I made a near bog of
it coming in astern on Monday with a strong cross wind!
Whilst the Contessa 32 is a wonderful boat and unbeaten in stability /
knockdown terms for anything around that size, the accommodation is very
small and dated.
In the new boat category the Malo 34 and Halberg Rassey 34 are nice, but
then it is big bucks.
Shortlist: Sadler 34, Victoria 34, Rival 34, Fulmar 32, Contessa 32.
From my personal view, in that order!
Tony Boas
Sadler 34 - Bold Warrior
"secats" <sec...@cwcom.net> wrote in message
Martin Kendell
well built tanks that don't get phased by a 10 if you get the sail plan
right...
The repair and running costs compared with our Dehler are significantly less
Martin
Petasus III
Robert Miles
Very happy with it.. ok for family. good accomm. Don't need to reef too
early..
All controls to cockpit... wide side decks ..
benefit from headsail reefing..
Not too many in UK.. have a look in Belgium/Holland..
Great fun sailing them back!!
Bit egg shaped compared to Sadler 34..
HUUUGGGHHE cockpit locker... can get lost in there....
Regards
Bob
Shamaal
Dehler 34
JHP <john.powell1@(nospam)virgin.net> wrote in message
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Pedro Vilajoana
Look at Cabo-Rico boatyard, in Costa Rica.
PyroJames
"JHP" <john.powell1@(nospam)virgin.net> wrote:
> I would be grateful for any advice on alternatives to a Rival 34. We
want a
> boat which puts seaworthiness before accommodation, can be sailed
short
> handed and my wife has taken a shine to the Rival 34. Although there
are a
> number about it seems wise to me to look at other similar designs.
> Any advice, please?
> John Powell
No one seems to have mentioned int so far, but what about an S&S 34, to
my mind they fall in the same grouping as the others. I don't know
about cost over here though.
--
PyroJames
Where I like, when I like, in whatever I like to wear.
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
Pedro Vilajoana
Geoff Hales
less popular but the aft cabin might be welcome.
I confess I think the Vic 34 is a terrible boat to sail though spacious to
live in.
I imagine their overpriced value will fall rapidly now they are no longer
made and there is no spares back up.
Regarding the C32, David Sadler (her designer and a designer of British
battle tanks too...) said that she came out 4 inches deeper in the water
than intended. I rather doubt that, as the rudder would have looked odd,
but it might account for her low freeboard.
I have had a full knockdown (galley kit on the deck head, lost the mast head
light, sort of thing in an R34 without problems ( to the boat, that is..).
Not the boat's fault: 55 knots of breeze and confused seas in the open
ocean, though perhaps the storm jib and 3 reefed main was a bit much.
Geoff
Pedro Vilajoana <pvila...@nexo.es> wrote in message
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Don Ramsay
with a shorter cockpit) through some of the worst that the channel and North
Sea can throw up and felt immensely secure in her. The design might well be
dated but her displacement and easy lines are all.
Don
"Geoff Hales" <m02b...@cwcom.net> wrote in message
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JHP
on a R34, but I appreciate all your help.
John Powell