Wannabe born-again biker seeking advice

[Lobster]

I've been using usenet for well over 20 years, but this is my first-ever
foray into the legendary UKRM.

Gulp.

I'm afraid I'm (potentially) a classic BAB. I'm mid-50s, last threw a leg
over a saddle 30 years ago, and due to changing life circumstances I'm
really keen to get back on to two wheels now. I'd really appreciate some
expert advice on my best way forward.

First, I'm well aware of the potential pratfalls; my reaction times not
being what they were, bikes being more powerful, roads being more busy etc.
I'd certainly want to start off with some training. I have a full bike
license, and since cash (and especially insurance costs!) won't be a
particular problem this time round, I'd ultimately like to go large. I'm
definitely not, and never was, a boy racer; I always hankered after a BMW
as a youngster - back then my dream machine was the K100RS, which came out
not long before I reluctantly packed in biking (a decision which may have
involved a woman...) I never rode anything bigger than my Honda CB250RS
though.

So, what suggestions would you guys make for a machine now? I've read some
folk claiming that it's fine to go straight from a small to a large bike,
'just don't twist the throttle too much till you get the hang of it and
you'll be fine'; others say exactly the opposite and say that you'll never
get the hang of a big bike like that. Thoughts?

Whatever bike I (hopefully) end up buying, I really wouldn't want to just
pitch up and ride it away into traffic, after 30 years of car driving! A
test ride would be impractical too, I guess. Might sound a daft question,
but is there a setup these days where I could either get a bit of safe
reacclimatisation experience either/or on a bike before buying, or on my
new purchase off-road?


--
David

[c...@post.netunix.com]

Lobster <davidlobs...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> I've been using usenet for well over 20 years, but this is my first-ever
> foray into the legendary UKRM.
>
> Gulp.
>
> I'm afraid I'm (potentially) a classic BAB. I'm mid-50s, last threw a leg
> over a saddle 30 years ago, and due to changing life circumstances I'm
> really keen to get back on to two wheels now. I'd really appreciate some
> expert advice on my best way forward.

A few lighthearted but appropriate suggestions :-

Are you gay ? - If so you want a Harley with tassels.
Are you dissatisfied with your dick size ? - If so you want a big bike.

Right - that narrows it down to something sensible. What were considered
midrange bikes in the 350-ish cc range are no longer available so there
is a gap in the market.
Where do you intend to ride and why - for a local commute a 125 or 250
is enough and easier to flick through traffic.
For longer rides including motorways the modern entry level is 600cc,
there are loads to chose from so your choice will be a matter of
style and personal preference. Saddle height is important if you are
a shortarse. It is a good idea to pick something with a reasonably
local dealer, you will need spares and service etc.
If you are buying used beware that many bikes in this range have been
restricted to 33 BHP for restricted licence holders and derestricting
them can be expensive.

Have fun......

[petrolcan]

In article <8t450d-...@post.netunix.com>, c...@post.netunix.com
says...

>
> Lobster <davidlobs...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > I've been using usenet for well over 20 years, but this is my first-ever
> > foray into the legendary UKRM.
> >
> > Gulp.
> >
> > I'm afraid I'm (potentially) a classic BAB. I'm mid-50s, last threw a leg
> > over a saddle 30 years ago, and due to changing life circumstances I'm
> > really keen to get back on to two wheels now. I'd really appreciate some
> > expert advice on my best way forward.
>
> A few lighthearted but appropriate suggestions :-
>
> Are you gay ? - If so you want a Harley with tassels.
> Are you dissatisfied with your dick size ? - If so you want a big bike.

WTF?

> Right - that narrows it down to something sensible. What were considered
> midrange bikes in the 350-ish cc range are no longer available so there
> is a gap in the market.
> Where do you intend to ride and why - for a local commute a 125 or 250
> is enough and easier to flick through traffic.
> For longer rides including motorways the modern entry level is 600cc,
> there are loads to chose from so your choice will be a matter of
> style and personal preference. Saddle height is important if you are
> a shortarse. It is a good idea to pick something with a reasonably
> local dealer, you will need spares and service etc.
> If you are buying used beware that many bikes in this range have been
> restricted to 33 BHP for restricted licence holders and derestricting
> them can be expensive.
>
> Have fun......

Lobster, ignore all of that.

Buy the bike you want and DFC.

[Gyp]

On 09/05/2016 00:43, Lobster wrote:
> I've been using usenet for well over 20 years, but this is my first-ever
> foray into the legendary UKRM.

20 years? Newbie.

> I'm afraid I'm (potentially) a classic BAB. I'm mid-50s, last threw a leg
> over a saddle 30 years ago, and due to changing life circumstances I'm
> really keen to get back on to two wheels now. I'd really appreciate some
> expert advice on my best way forward.

And you've asked here?

> First, I'm well aware of the potential pratfalls; my reaction times not
> being what they were, bikes being more powerful, roads being more busy etc.
> I'd certainly want to start off with some training. I have a full bike
> license, and since cash (and especially insurance costs!) won't be a
> particular problem this time round, I'd ultimately like to go large. I'm
> definitely not, and never was, a boy racer; I always hankered after a BMW
> as a youngster - back then my dream machine was the K100RS, which came out
> not long before I reluctantly packed in biking (a decision which may have
> involved a woman...) I never rode anything bigger than my Honda CB250RS
> though.

The good news is that modern BMWs have lots of rider aids to make it
more difficult for ham fisted idiots to hurt themselves twisting the
throttle or brakes.

The bad news is that there are a lot of other ways of cocking it up.
Simply the weight of a bike can be a problem when you're getting used to
low speed manoeuvring and even low speed fall-offs can be eye wateringly
expensive (as the previous owner of my R1200 discovered)

> So, what suggestions would you guys make for a machine now? I've read some
> folk claiming that it's fine to go straight from a small to a large bike,
> 'just don't twist the throttle too much till you get the hang of it and
> you'll be fine'; others say exactly the opposite and say that you'll never
> get the hang of a big bike like that. Thoughts?

If I'm honest, those I know that have gone straight to a big bike have
been OK; I've known a young lad go from a 125cc straight to a Kawasaki
750 turbo, and my neighbour has done direct access straight to a
Goldwing and Pan European.

A lot will depend on your build, strength, level of self restraint etc.

I'd suggest you could probably do a lot worse than have a year on a used
mid-sized twin with an upright seating position and see how you get on.
I'm thinking Suzuki SV650 (or variant thereof), Kawasaki er6 or the
lovely Yamaha MT07. You shouldn't lose much money on one of those - if
any - and you may actually find that they're big enough without the need
for something bigger.

Or just get it over with and buy a Gixxer thou

Good luck!


--
Gyp

[Eiron]

On 09/05/2016 07:09, Gyp wrote:

> Or just get it over with and buy a Gixxer thou

Gixxer Thou? Thou art a scurvy knave to suggest such a thing.
A GSX-S is a much more sensible bike for a BAB.

But training is pointless if you already have a licence.

--
Eiron.

[YTC#1]

I'd disagree, what would be the harm in him having a few lessons with an
instructor. He would benefit from the advice, but also not be restricted
by the usual learner restrictions.



--
Bruce Porter
"The internet is a huge and diverse community but mainly friendly"
http://ytc1.blogspot.co.uk/
There *is* an alternative! http://www.openoffice.org/

[Gyp]

Eiron <Evelyn....@live.com> Wrote in message:

> On 09/05/2016 07:09, Gyp wrote:
>
>> Or just get it over with and buy a Gixxer thou
>
> Gixxer Thou? Thou art a scurvy knave to suggest such a thing.
> A GSX-S is a much more sensible bike for a BAB.

Angle grinder.

> But training is pointless if you already have a licence.

Err...

--
--
Gyp

[TMack]

On Sun, 08 May 2016 23:43:33 +0000, Lobster wrote:

> Whatever bike I (hopefully) end up buying, I really wouldn't want to
> just pitch up and ride it away into traffic, after 30 years of car
> driving! A test ride would be impractical too, I guess. Might sound a
> daft question, but is there a setup these days where I could either get
> a bit of safe reacclimatisation experience either/or on a bike before
> buying, or on my new purchase off-road?

There is a lot to be said for just buying the big bike you want to ride and learning to ride it. However, another
approach is to buy something moderately powered and use that until you can approach its limits. The lower-
powered bike first approach will probably make you appreciate a powerful bike even more. The first few times
I rode a 100+ bhp bike were a wonderful revelation after I had spent a while on lower powered bikes. I was
confident in starting to explore my limits on the "bigger" bike due to my experience on the "smaller" bikes.
Without the previous experience, it is possible that I would have been too cautious from the outset on the
bigger bike and it's possible that I might never have really appreciated its real potential. I would also
recommend things such as wheelie school, track days and off-road experience days as ways of boosting your
confidence and your knowledge of how to handle a bike.

As for your age - I returned to motorcycling in my mid 50s after nearly 30 years without a bike. It was
undoubtedly one of the best decisions that I have ever made. Just do it!

--
Tony
'09 FJR1300, '07 Street Triple OMF#24

[Simon Wilson]

On 5/9/2016 7:55 AM, YTC#1 wrote:
> On 09/05/2016 07:49, Eiron wrote:
>> On 09/05/2016 07:09, Gyp wrote:
>>
>>> Or just get it over with and buy a Gixxer thou
>>
>> Gixxer Thou? Thou art a scurvy knave to suggest such a thing.
>> A GSX-S is a much more sensible bike for a BAB.
>>
>> But training is pointless if you already have a licence.
>>
>
> I'd disagree, what would be the harm in him having a few lessons with an
> instructor. He would benefit from the advice, but also not be restricted
> by the usual learner restrictions.
>
>

Me too. I know many on here think the IaM's a waste of time, but I
picked up a few tips. I did lose a point on my test for speeding though.
<Proud>.

--
/Simon

[Champ]

On Sun, 8 May 2016 23:43:33 +0000 (UTC), Lobster
<davidlobs...@hotmail.com> wrote:

>I'm afraid I'm (potentially) a classic BAB. I'm mid-50s, last threw a leg
>over a saddle 30 years ago, and due to changing life circumstances I'm
>really keen to get back on to two wheels now. I'd really appreciate some
>expert advice on my best way forward.

Welcome back.

You're obviously aware of all the downsides, so my advice would
be...don't worry *too* much! It's like riding a bike, after all.
Your first few rides probably will be a bit wobbly, but after that
you'll be fine.

My other bit of advice would be - rather than seek out your pride and
joy, for a first bike to get back in the game, but something cheap and
cheerful which you won't be too precious about. I would have said
something like a Bandit 600, but I don't even know if there's many of
them still around. But, a naked, sit-up, mid-size bike, at least 5
years old, and not too expensive.

[Colin Irvine]

On Mon, 09 May 2016 07:55:08 +0100, YTC#1 wrote:

> On 09/05/2016 07:49, Eiron wrote:
>> On 09/05/2016 07:09, Gyp wrote:
>>
>>> Or just get it over with and buy a Gixxer thou
>>
>> Gixxer Thou? Thou art a scurvy knave to suggest such a thing.
>> A GSX-S is a much more sensible bike for a BAB.
>>
>> But training is pointless if you already have a licence.
>>
>>
> I'd disagree, what would be the harm in him having a few lessons with an
> instructor. He would benefit from the advice, but also not be restricted
> by the usual learner restrictions.

Wot 'e said.

--
Colin Irvine
ZZR1400

[Eddie]

Lobster wrote:
> I've been using usenet for well over 20 years, but this is my first-ever
> foray into the legendary UKRM.

We're legendary? How the hell did that happen?

> So, what suggestions would you guys make for a machine now?

KTM Super Duke

<hat="sensible">
Leave it in 'rain mode' until you've got your confidence back.
</hat>

--
Eddie ed...@deguello.org

[Eiron]

On 09/05/2016 08:27, Colin Irvine wrote:

>>> But training is pointless if you already have a licence.
>>>
>>>
>> I'd disagree, what would be the harm in him having a few lessons with an
>> instructor. He would benefit from the advice, but also not be restricted
>> by the usual learner restrictions.
>
> Wot 'e said.

When I were a lad, as soon as you got your first pay packet you would
pedal to the local bike shop, sign up for 5 bob a week for 3 years,
and ride out on a 650 Triumph. No helmets or training - the dealer would
show you which levers did what, and off you went. The second day you would
try for a ton on the North Circular and show off for the birds at the Ace.
It never did us any harm and anyway, chicks dig scars. :-)

--
Eiron.

[the man with no idea]

On Monday, 9 May 2016 00:43:37 UTC+1, Lobster wrote:

> So, what suggestions would you guys make for a machine now? I've read some
> folk claiming that it's fine to go straight from a small to a large bike,
> 'just don't twist the throttle too much till you get the hang of it and
> you'll be fine'; others say exactly the opposite and say that you'll never
> get the hang of a big bike like that. Thoughts?

I wasn't quite as long out of biking as you - I had a 250 in 1993 and got back into bikes about 2003 - but went for a GS500E first. Cheap, not much to break if you drop it, and good fun in traffic. However, on my mostly motorway 30-mile commute I found it under-powered and swapped it for a ZR-7 a year later. Still not a particularly fast bike, it tops out at about 130, but so easy to ride, very accommodating gear box, still pretty flickable and great for commuting. I've toured Germany on it and it was fine except for the vibes through the bars.

When I took VR in 2010 I then bought a DL1000, which has a few issues but is, overall, a cracking bike. It also tops out at 130 but gets to it a lot quicker than the ZR-7.

I think if I was just getting back into biking now I'd probably go for the smaller V-Strom (650) which is, I'm told, a great all-rounder. However, I am of the opinion that if you like going fast at all then you might outgrow it fairly quickly.

Regarding training, I did a couple of ride-outs with coppers via Bikesafe that were very helpful. I then did a 1-day Bikesafe course, which was excellent, and then went on to IAM training, which I did enjoy as the observer I had was a great bloke who didn't hang about on a bike.

[YTC#1]

On 09/05/2016 10:19, Eiron wrote:
> On 09/05/2016 08:27, Colin Irvine wrote:
>
>>>> But training is pointless if you already have a licence.
>>>>
>>>>
>>> I'd disagree, what would be the harm in him having a few lessons with an
>>> instructor. He would benefit from the advice, but also not be restricted
>>> by the usual learner restrictions.
>>
>> Wot 'e said.
>
> When I were a lad, as soon as you got your first pay packet you would
> pedal to the local bike shop, sign up for 5 bob a week for 3 years,
> and ride out on a 650 Triumph. No helmets or training - the dealer would

And in comparison to current bikes, they are/were a POS.

> show you which levers did what, and off you went. The second day you would
> try for a ton on the North Circular and show off for the birds at the Ace.
> It never did us any harm and anyway, chicks dig scars. :-)
>

But not missing limbs, or digging graves.

Oh fuck, I sound like a bloody safety nazi !

[Thomas]

On Sun, 08 May 2016 16:43:33 -0700, Lobster
<davidlobs...@hotmail.com> wrote:

> I've been using usenet for well over 20 years, but this is my first-ever
> foray into the legendary UKRM.
>
> Gulp.
>

<snort>

> First, I'm well aware of the potential pratfalls; my reaction times not
> being what they were, bikes being more powerful, roads being more busy
> etc.
> I'd certainly want to start off with some training.

> Whatever bike I (hopefully) end up buying, I really wouldn't want to just
> pitch up and ride it away into traffic, after 30 years of car driving! A
> test ride would be impractical too, I guess. Might sound a daft
> question,
> but is there a setup these days where I could either get a bit of safe
> reacclimatisation experience either/or on a bike before buying, or on my
> new purchase off-road?

I went from a Honda 50 to a BSA 650, but that was before training existed.
14 years later, I did my first training, and it was worth it.

As for which bike, few dealers will let you test ride a variety of bikes,
but you can at least sit on them in the shop to see which are at least
comfortable. Try as many as you can.

[ogden]

Gyp <a@b.c> wrote:
> I'd suggest you could probably do a lot worse than have a year on a
used
> mid-sized twin with an upright seating position and see how you get
on.
> I'm thinking Suzuki SV650

...is almost always the right answer to this kind of question. Cheap,
reliable, practical and fun enough if you're not used to more.

--
ogden

[Hog]

Eddie wrote:
> Lobster wrote:
>> I've been using usenet for well over 20 years, but this is my
>> first-ever foray into the legendary UKRM.
>
> We're legendary? How the hell did that happen?
>
>> So, what suggestions would you guys make for a machine now?
>
> KTM Super Duke

Did you buy one yet?

>
> <hat="sensible">
> Leave it in 'rain mode' until you've got your confidence back.
> </hat>

Throttle response in town is glitchy in anything but Sport

[Hog]

Lobster wrote:
> I've been using usenet for well over 20 years, but this is my
> first-ever foray into the legendary UKRM.
>
> Gulp.

You cannot go wrong with a Kawasaki ER-6F ABS and you can find the older
shape with the (better) conventional twin headlights under £2,500

I bought one as a spare, rode it around Ireland, France and UK. Other than
fitting a high screen I couldn't fault it and it's very enjoyable and
engaging to ride. There are no engine weaknesses and handling is
reassuringly solid. The ABS is excellent and will be reassuring for a
returning rider.
Just sold it on after 2 years and I'm sorry to see it go.

It pairs particularly well with the R&G crash bungs, I'm since told.....

[Eddie]

Hog wrote:

> Eddie wrote:
>>
>> KTM Super Duke
>
> Did you buy one yet?

Paid a deposit for a GT. Originally expected this month, now has a build
date of end-June, delivery mid-July. Production delays due to component
supply issues, apparently.

>> <hat="sensible">
>> Leave it in 'rain mode' until you've got your confidence back.
>> </hat>
>
> Throttle response in town is glitchy in anything but Sport

Oh, joy.

--
Eddie ed...@deguello.org

[Mike Fleming]

In article <XnsA60376636B74d...@46.165.242.75>, Lobster

<davidlobs...@hotmail.com> writes:

> I'm afraid I'm (potentially) a classic BAB. I'm mid-50s, last threw a leg
> over a saddle 30 years ago, and due to changing life circumstances I'm
> really keen to get back on to two wheels now. I'd really appreciate some
> expert advice on my best way forward.

I don't think there's any one-size-fits-all advice. The AIX sysadmin
at my old company, who also happens to be the former drummer in my
band, used to ride a bike about 30 years ago - a Honda Superdream. He
decided to get back onto two wheels a year ago (a couple of years
after I got him back into drumming, 22 years after he used to play
regularly). He finished up buying, as his first bike back on the road,
a Triumph Trophy 1200 (the recent shaft drive one), then going off on
a tour of France which he did unscathed. It worked for him, though I
don't know that it would work for everyone.

For that matter, I had a nine year layoff, though I went from riding a
Triumph Tiger 900 to a Triumph Tiger 1050, so it wasn't a monstrous
step, plus I had a couple of hundred thousand miles of experience to
help me.

I wouldn't worry too much about the capacity. The first thing you need
to consider is comfort. There's a huge assortment of riding positions,
youy need to find out what you'd be most comfortable with - go round a
few dealers and unashamedly sit on their bikes, foot up on a footpeg
and hands on the bars so you get the riding position (and make sure
you can actually get onto it - that's why I didn't get a Tiger
885i/955i). That will at least point you to an appropriate category of
bike. Then see what takes your fancy, read the reviews on the MCN
website, google for problems associated with the models you fancy, and
then go looking for them and see if you can get any test rides.

--
Mike Fleming
Coitum volantum non dono

[Champ]

On Mon, 9 May 2016 08:41:27 -0000 (UTC), "Krusty"
<dontw...@nowhere.invalid> wrote:

>Do one of the off-road experience days. You'll have a laugh, get used
>to the clutch & gears again, & fall off safely.

Ooh, good call

[Hog]

Eddie wrote:
> Hog wrote:
>> Eddie wrote:
>>>
>>> KTM Super Duke
>>
>> Did you buy one yet?
>
> Paid a deposit for a GT. Originally expected this month, now has a

Good man.
I decided it isn't for me because it's a Superduke pretending to be a two up
capable tourer, but it really isn't.
I see that SW Motec or H&B will sell a luggage plate to carry a top case,
which might help

> build date of end-June, delivery mid-July. Production delays due to
> component supply issues, apparently.

No sign of a 1290 R Ltd either <glum>

>
>>> <hat="sensible">
>>> Leave it in 'rain mode' until you've got your confidence back.
>>> </hat>
>>
>> Throttle response in town is glitchy in anything but Sport
>
> Oh, joy.

The GT is quite different and this year they are all tuned for Euro4. Down
7bhp and up on torque.
I'm sure the active suspenders will be good though.

[Champ]

On Mon, 9 May 2016 09:29:48 +0100, Eddie <ed...@deguello.org> wrote:

>Lobster wrote:
>> I've been using usenet for well over 20 years, but this is my first-ever
>> foray into the legendary UKRM.

>We're legendary? How the hell did that happen?

If you stick around long enough, everything/everyone becomes legendary

[Hog]

+1

go for the Trials day experience

[Stephen Packer]

Trials day is certainly good fun and challenging, but I'm not sure you
learn an awful lot that's as directly relevant as riding an enduro
styled bike.

[wessie]

<c...@post.netunix.com> wrote in news:8t450d-...@post.netunix.com:

he's talking bollocks and has not looked at a maker's website to see
there are a number of 200-300cc options e.g. Yamaha MT03, BMW G310R.
It's a growing sector of the market.

[Hog]

Learn such high level bike control. Then get onto an Enduro bike. Then
onto the road. Would be my perspective of it all.

[Hog]

wessie wrote:

> he's talking bollocks and has not looked at a maker's website to see
> there are a number of 200-300cc options e.g. Yamaha MT03, BMW G310R.
> It's a growing sector of the market.

But why would you?
650cc and 75bhp is the sweet spot, I think.

Only a ham fisted cunt could drop one.

[wessie]

Eddie <ed...@deguello.org> wrote in news:dpbp45...@mid.individual.net:

> Hog wrote:
>> Eddie wrote:
>>>
>>> KTM Super Duke
>>
>> Did you buy one yet?
>
> Paid a deposit for a GT. Originally expected this month, now has a build
> date of end-June, delivery mid-July. Production delays due to component
> supply issues, apparently.
>
>

all gone to dealers for warranty work :)

[wessie]

Lobster <davidlobs...@hotmail.com> wrote in
news:XnsA60376636B74d...@46.165.242.75:

> I've been using usenet for well over 20 years, but this is my
> first-ever foray into the legendary UKRM.
>
> Gulp.
>

<snip>

> Whatever bike I (hopefully) end up buying, I really wouldn't want to
> just pitch up and ride it away into traffic, after 30 years of car
> driving! A test ride would be impractical too, I guess. Might sound
> a daft question, but is there a setup these days where I could either
> get a bit of safe reacclimatisation experience either/or on a bike
> before buying, or on my new purchase off-road?
>
>

I'll endorse Thomas' advice - go to a showroom and sit on some bikes. I
can't sit comfortably on many bikes as my knees refuse to bend. That
will give you an idea of the ergonomics that might suit you.

Training: booking a day with a training firm won't harm you and will
give you the chance to ride one or two bikes. They often have different
bikes as one size won't fit all.

As others say, 600cc bikes, mostly twins, can be great fun but benign
enough to be BAB friendly. The Suzuki DL650 Vstrom suits me due to it's
upright riding position - it's a variation of the SV650 mentioned by
ogden. Very knee friendly.

Get some insurance quotes as it will vary by model and may influence
your decision. 0% NCB on a bike may be painful, even at your age.

Look out for manufacturer or dealer demo days - Fowlers in Bristol book
Castle Combe Circuit a couple of times a year. Harley have open days and
Yamaha have an MT tour at some circuits this year. You may have the
opportunity to ride a range of bikes if you book early enough.

[wessie]

"Hog" <sm91...@CHIPShotmail.co.uk> wrote in news:ngqikm$lcn$1@dont-
email.me:

A2 licence
cheaper insurance
make a decent urban commuter for those not willing to use a midi-scoot

[AndyB]

Well my H2 produces less than 75bhp and you don't have to be particularly ham fisted to drop one of those if you forget what you're riding.

[Stephen Packer]

Weight and height I would guess.

Balancing bikes isn't *that* easy and I'd rather drop something small
and cheap while I remember how.

[zymur...@googlemail.com]

On Monday, May 9, 2016 at 8:09:09 AM UTC+1, TMack wrote:

> On Sun, 08 May 2016 23:43:33 +0000, Lobster wrote:
>
> > Whatever bike I (hopefully) end up buying, I really wouldn't want to
> > just pitch up and ride it away into traffic, after 30 years of car
> > driving! A test ride would be impractical too, I guess. Might sound a
> > daft question, but is there a setup these days where I could either get
> > a bit of safe reacclimatisation experience either/or on a bike before
> > buying, or on my new purchase off-road?
>

> buy something moderately powered and use that until you can approach its
> limits. The lower-powered bike first approach will probably make you
> appreciate a powerful bike even more.

I recommend this. I did a DAS on a CG125 and went for a low power 600 for two years. Crashed it, dropped it, learned a lot.

Then got a succession of litrebikes. Yay !

Paul.

[Ian Field]

"Eiron" <Evelyn....@live.com> wrote in message
news:dpaq8j...@mid.individual.net...

> On 09/05/2016 07:09, Gyp wrote:
>
>> Or just get it over with and buy a Gixxer thou
>
> Gixxer Thou? Thou art a scurvy knave to suggest such a thing.
> A GSX-S is a much more sensible bike for a BAB.
>

> But training is pointless if you already have a licence.

If you already have the license and some experience; there's various
publications on roadcraft and the official HMSO Ride Manual that work out a
lot cheaper than a training course.

[YTC#1]

Does the MT03 have an identity issue ?

MCN and others say it is the 660cc Minarelli motor, but wikipedia has it
as a 301cc motor ?

> It's a growing sector of the market.
>

[Rick]

On 09/05/2016 00:43, Lobster wrote:
> So, what suggestions would you guys make for a machine now? I've read some
> folk claiming that it's fine to go straight from a small to a large bike,
> 'just don't twist the throttle too much till you get the hang of it and
> you'll be fine'; others say exactly the opposite and say that you'll never
> get the hang of a big bike like that. Thoughts?
>

My two pennyworth ...

I wouldn't give it a second thought, I'd go straight for the big bike.
You'll probably feel nervous the first time you take it out but you'll
be amazed how quickly that disappears. I'm assuming you still have the
brains you were born with so you won't be riding in a Rossi stylee
immediately. Just go out on a nice day when there's no traffic around
and take it easy. If you're anything like some of those I know you'll
end up doing a much longer journey than you anticipated. One in
particular bought a Blackbird as his first big bike after passing his
test, felt like a complete knob walking out to it in full view of the
neighbours in his cul de sac, gingerly wobbled off and ended up riding
the thing all day. When he got home and dismounted his legs went from
under him, he was so knackered, but you couldn't have got the grin off
his face with a blowlamp.

Just do it!


--
Rick Brown

SprintRS R100RT

[Champ]

On Mon, 9 May 2016 12:43:39 -0700 (PDT), Stephen Packer
<stephen...@gmail.com> wrote:

>> > he's talking bollocks and has not looked at a maker's website to see
>> > there are a number of 200-300cc options e.g. Yamaha MT03, BMW G310R.
>> > It's a growing sector of the market.

>> But why would you?
>> 650cc and 75bhp is the sweet spot, I think.

>> Only a ham fisted cunt could drop one.

>Weight and height I would guess.

>Balancing bikes isn't *that* easy ...

Isn't it?

The only time I "balance a bike" is when I'm stationery, with my feet
on the ground. That is particularly easy. Otherwise, when I'm riding
along <waves hands> magic happens. As explained by Mat Oxley here:
http://www.twitlonger.com/show/n_1sok75n

[Thomas]

On Mon, 09 May 2016 14:46:09 -0700, Champ <ne...@champ.org.uk> wrote:

> On Mon, 9 May 2016 12:43:39 -0700 (PDT), Stephen Packer
> <stephen...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>> > he's talking bollocks and has not looked at a maker's website to see
>>> > there are a number of 200-300cc options e.g. Yamaha MT03, BMW G310R.
>>> > It's a growing sector of the market.
>
>>> But why would you?
>>> 650cc and 75bhp is the sweet spot, I think.
>
>>> Only a ham fisted cunt could drop one.

where hamfistedcunt=newbie

>> Weight and height I would guess.
>
>> Balancing bikes isn't *that* easy ...
>
> Isn't it?
>
> The only time I "balance a bike" is when I'm stationery, with my feet
> on the ground. That is particularly easy.

I'm not sure if it's the soles of my feet that have been worn smooth or
the sand that's miraculously appeared on our streets, but I've had
entirely too many instances lately where that is emphatically not true.
So far, so lucky.

[wessie]

YTC#1 <b...@ytc1-spambin.co.uk> wrote in news:ngqtig$2ev$1...@dont-email.me:

> Does the MT03 have an identity issue ?
>
> MCN and others say it is the 660cc Minarelli motor, but wikipedia has
> it as a 301cc motor ?
>
>

why not look at a brochure?

http://www.yamaha-motor.eu/uk/products/motorcycles/hyper-naked/mt-03.aspx?view=featurestechspecs

321cc


although, perhaps they have recycled the name from a model briefly made 10 years ago

[YTC#1]

On 09/05/2016 22:46, Champ wrote:
> On Mon, 9 May 2016 12:43:39 -0700 (PDT), Stephen Packer
> <stephen...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>>> he's talking bollocks and has not looked at a maker's website to see
>>>> there are a number of 200-300cc options e.g. Yamaha MT03, BMW G310R.
>>>> It's a growing sector of the market.
>
>>> But why would you?
>>> 650cc and 75bhp is the sweet spot, I think.
>
>>> Only a ham fisted cunt could drop one.
>
>> Weight and height I would guess.
>
>> Balancing bikes isn't *that* easy ...
>
> Isn't it?
>
> The only time I "balance a bike" is when I'm stationery, with my feet

I took that to include moving the bike around (standing to one side).
Should you, for some reason, let it lean slightly to far then the
balance has gone. Depending on your strength it is often better and
easier to just let it go.

[YTC#1]

On 09/05/2016 23:47, wessie wrote:
> YTC#1 <b...@ytc1-spambin.co.uk> wrote in news:ngqtig$2ev$1...@dont-email.me:
>
>
>> Does the MT03 have an identity issue ?
>>
>> MCN and others say it is the 660cc Minarelli motor, but wikipedia has
>> it as a 301cc motor ?
>>
>
> why not look at a brochure?
>

I intended to do just that, went to the Yam site below, entered MT03 in
the search and got nothing. I am obviously too use to decent search
engines these days and the lack of a "-" confused it

> http://www.yamaha-motor.eu/uk/products/motorcycles/hyper-naked/mt-03.aspx?view=featurestechspecs
>
> 321cc
>
>
> although, perhaps they have recycled the name from a model briefly made 10 years ago
>

It would appear so, I prefer the older one. But "briefly" seems to be
from 2006-2013.

[Gyp]

On 09/05/2016 22:46, Champ wrote:

> The only time I "balance a bike" is when I'm stationery, with my feet
> on the ground. That is particularly easy.

For lanky buggers like you, maybe. Not for those of us with Umpalumpa legs.


--
Gyp

[Eddie]

I heard something about new bikes having been delivered to dealers, then
sat waiting for the screen to be sent out separately ... but if my only
criterion was a smooth purchase experience, I'd probably have bought a
Honda.

--
Eddie ed...@deguello.org

[Eddie]

Hog wrote:
> Eddie wrote:

>> Hog wrote:
>>
>> Paid a deposit for a GT. Originally expected this month, now has a
>
> Good man.
> I decided it isn't for me because it's a Superduke pretending to be a two up
> capable tourer, but it really isn't.
> I see that SW Motec or H&B will sell a luggage plate to carry a top case,
> which might help

Yeah, I decided against buying another set of bike-specific luggage, and
will get something generic hard panniers once the mounting kits become
available.

>> build date of end-June, delivery mid-July. Production delays due to
>> component supply issues, apparently.
>
> No sign of a 1290 R Ltd either <glum>

What would be the difference between that and the Special Edition?

> The GT is quite different and this year they are all tuned for Euro4. Down
> 7bhp and up on torque.
> I'm sure the active suspenders will be good though.

Reports seem promising so far.

--
Eddie ed...@deguello.org

[Champ]

I'm 178cm (5' 10"). Since when has that been lanky?

[AndyB]

The idea of being caught in possession of any kind of 'roadcraft' publication or an official HMSO manual fills me with horror. I threw away my copy of the Highway Code the day I passed my car test (I'd already passed the bike one) and I've never looked at a copy since so I can't help but wonder what kind of boring existence some people lead if they still read that kind of shit and worse still actually quote from it.

As for the original question; go and look in showrooms until you find a bike you like then buy it. Life's much too short to go for sensible options.

[Gyp]

Champ <ne...@champ.org.uk> Wrote in message:

>
>>For lanky buggers like you, maybe. Not for those of us with Umpalumpa legs.
>
> I'm 178cm (5' 10"). Since when has that been lanky?
>

So am I

What's your inside leg measurement?
--
--
Gyp

[CT]

AndyB wrote:

> As for the original question; go and look in showrooms until you find
> a bike you like then buy it. Life's much too short to go for sensible
> options.

This, in spades.

--
Chris

[Champ]

I've no idea. Not even sure why I would know.

I usually buy 32" length jeans, if that's any help

[Champ]

+1

I've really no idea what came over me earlier when suggesting buying
an inexpensive middleweight. I offer my humblest apologies.

[Jérémy]

Champ <ne...@champ.org.uk> wrote in news:k193jb5nhhua26jvavcmcoluup3nocn3du@
4ax.com:

I went from the Swiss equivalent of Direct Access (which I did in an
elapsed time of 13 days from first time on a bike to passing the test)
directly to a R1200RT, which was fine for 2 years. I then had a spell of
dropping it pretty much weekly (and once three times in an hour) for a
month or two, and crashed it once. Having got that out of my system I've
been fine for another six or so years. I'm compelled to consider that karma
might be more important than experience.

--
Jeremy
K1300GT

[Gyp]

On 10/05/2016 10:04, Champ wrote:

> I've no idea. Not even sure why I would know.

Because you occasionally buy trousers

> I usually buy 32" length jeans, if that's any help

Ah there we go 32".

I buy 28" and they're a bit too long.

QED you're a lanky git (relatively).

--
Gyp

[Gyp]

On 10/05/2016 09:53, Krusty wrote:

>> What's your inside leg measurement?
>

> Sheesh, get a room already.

:-)


--
Gyp

[Champ]

On Tue, 10 May 2016 13:07:33 +0100, Gyp <a@b.c> wrote:

>On 10/05/2016 10:04, Champ wrote:
>
>> I've no idea. Not even sure why I would know.
>
>Because you occasionally buy trousers
>
>> I usually buy 32" length jeans, if that's any help
>
>Ah there we go 32".

Ah, that's the *inside* leg measurement, is it? I had no idea.

>I buy 28" and they're a bit too long.
>
>QED you're a lanky git (relatively).

I wish. As I've often recounted, when I was 18 I was a smidge under
6'. I was shocked (and still am) when I had a medical in my
mid-forties and was told I was 5' 10".

Gravity is a bitch.

[Champ]

On Tue, 10 May 2016 11:17:40 GMT, "Jérémy" <a...@b.com> wrote:

>I'm compelled to consider that karma
>might be more important than experience.

As in so many things :-)

[Eddie]

Champ wrote:
> On Tue, 10 May 2016 13:07:33 +0100, Gyp <a@b.c> wrote:
>
>> On 10/05/2016 10:04, Champ wrote:
>>
>>> I usually buy 32" length jeans, if that's any help
>>
>> Ah there we go 32".
>
> Ah, that's the *inside* leg measurement, is it? I had no idea.

Really? That seems an unusual thing not to know. Anybody else want to
admit to not knowing that?

>> I buy 28" and they're a bit too long.
>>
>> QED you're a lanky git (relatively).
>
> I wish. As I've often recounted, when I was 18 I was a smidge under
> 6'. I was shocked (and still am) when I had a medical in my
> mid-forties and was told I was 5' 10".
>
> Gravity is a bitch.

You've had a bang on the head, you know. That would tend to compact
things, I'd have thought.

--
Eddie ed...@deguello.org

[AndyB]

On 19:09 09/05 , wessie wrote:
>"Hog" <sm91...@CHIPShotmail.co.uk> wrote in news:ngqikm$lcn$1@dont-
>email.me:

>
>> wessie wrote:
>>
>>> he's talking bollocks and has not looked at a maker's website to see
>>> there are a number of 200-300cc options e.g. Yamaha MT03, BMW G310R.
>>> It's a growing sector of the market.
>>
>> But why would you?
>> 650cc and 75bhp is the sweet spot, I think.
>>
>> Only a ham fisted cunt could drop one.
>>
>

>A2 licence
>cheaper insurance
>make a decent urban commuter for those not willing to use a midi-scoot
>

I've just done about 35 miles in the pouring rain on an MT03 and the main points are that it's very light, handles well enough, the brakes are good, it's comfortable to ride but.....

The gearing is up to shit. It's geared to do 130mph flat out and even flat on the tank with a tailwind 100mph is about it. I'd drop a tooth off the front sprocket, 3 or 4 off the back sprocket and try to get it so it hits the redline at 105mph and it revs out. If you sit it at 5k rpm in 4th, 5th or 6th and wind it open nothing happens so you need to drop it down as couple of cogs but the one I rode had under 500 miles on it so I didn't thrash it to hell and back.

[Champ]

On Tue, 10 May 2016 13:58:05 +0100, Eddie <ed...@deguello.org> wrote:

>Champ wrote:

>>> QED you're a lanky git (relatively).

>> I wish. As I've often recounted, when I was 18 I was a smidge under
>> 6'. I was shocked (and still am) when I had a medical in my
>> mid-forties and was told I was 5' 10".
>>
>> Gravity is a bitch.

>You've had a bang on the head, you know. That would tend to compact
>things, I'd have thought.

Only in one particular orientation, which, as far as I know, was not
the one I experienced. As evidence, I cite the fact that I broke my
jaw (through my full face crash helmet).

[Gyp]

"Krusty" <dontw...@nowhere.invalid> Wrote in message:

>
> Which is quite a feat, given the size of the crash bung just above it.

Pmsl


--
--
Gyp

[Stephen Packer]

On Monday, 9 May 2016 22:46:11 UTC+1, Champ wrote:
> On Mon, 9 May 2016 12:43:39 -0700 (PDT), Stephen Packer
> <stephen...@gmail.com> wrote:

> >Balancing bikes isn't *that* easy ...
>
> Isn't it?

I don't think so. Something big and unwieldy when you push it around,
get on and off it, put your feet down on a road with an unusual camber
etc. etc. etc.

I don't (generally) have problems with these things, but if I was starting
from scratch (ish) I think I'd want to have a smaller, lighter bike that
I could drop a bit without hurting my wallet.

[YTC#1]

On 10/05/2016 14:57, AndyB wrote:
>
>
> On 19:09 09/05 , wessie wrote:
>> "Hog" <sm91...@CHIPShotmail.co.uk> wrote in
>> news:ngqikm$lcn$1@dont- email.me:
>>
>>> wessie wrote:
>>>
>>>> he's talking bollocks and has not looked at a maker's website
>>>> to see there are a number of 200-300cc options e.g. Yamaha
>>>> MT03, BMW G310R. It's a growing sector of the market.
>>>
>>> But why would you? 650cc and 75bhp is the sweet spot, I think.
>>>
>>> Only a ham fisted cunt could drop one.
>>>
>>
>> A2 licence cheaper insurance make a decent urban commuter for those
>> not willing to use a midi-scoot
>>
>
> I've just done about 35 miles in the pouring rain on an MT03 and the

The 660cc or 300cc ? Need to be specific :-)

> main points are that it's very light, handles well enough, the brakes
> are good, it's comfortable to ride but.....
>
> The gearing is up to shit. It's geared to do 130mph flat out and even

Ah, ok. Must be the older one :-)

> flat on the tank with a tailwind 100mph is about it. I'd drop a tooth
> off the front sprocket, 3 or 4 off the back sprocket and try to get
> it so it hits the redline at 105mph and it revs out. If you sit it at
> 5k rpm in 4th, 5th or 6th and wind it open nothing happens so you
> need to drop it down as couple of cogs but the one I rode had under
> 500 miles on it so I didn't thrash it to hell and back.

You just lost brownie points.

[Ian Field]

"AndyB" <sp...@bonwick.me.uk> wrote in message
news:dpdilr...@mid.individual.net...

>
>
> On 21:47 09/05 , Ian Field wrote:
>>
>>
>>"Eiron" <Evelyn....@live.com> wrote in message
>>news:dpaq8j...@mid.individual.net...
>>> On 09/05/2016 07:09, Gyp wrote:
>>>
>>>> Or just get it over with and buy a Gixxer thou
>>>
>>> Gixxer Thou? Thou art a scurvy knave to suggest such a thing.
>>> A GSX-S is a much more sensible bike for a BAB.
>>>
>>> But training is pointless if you already have a licence.
>>
>>If you already have the license and some experience; there's various
>>publications on roadcraft and the official HMSO Ride Manual that work out
>>a
>>lot cheaper than a training course.
>>
>>
> The idea of being caught in possession of any kind of 'roadcraft'
> publication or an official HMSO manual fills me with horror. I threw away
> my copy of the Highway Code the day I passed my car test (I'd already
> passed the bike one) and I've never looked at a copy since so I can't help
> but wonder what kind of boring existence some people lead if they still
> read that kind of shit and worse still actually quote from it.

You ignored the bit about various roadcraft publications and started
whittering on about the HMSO offering - it may not be all that, but saying
you've read it can impress plod when you get pulled over.

[Horse]

Bless.

[Gyp]

Horse <aboycal...@gmail.com> Wrote in message:

>
> Bless.

Fuck off


--
--
Gyp

[Gyp]

On 10/05/2016 19:27, Stephen Packer wrote:

> I don't think so. Something big and unwieldy when you push it around,
> get on and off it, put your feet down on a road with an unusual camber
> etc. etc. etc.
>
> I don't (generally) have problems with these things, but if I was starting
> from scratch (ish) I think I'd want to have a smaller, lighter bike that
> I could drop a bit without hurting my wallet.

The previous owner of my R1200R dropped it within a week of buying it
and it cost him £350 in parts for a new rocker cover.

The previous owner of my R80RT dropped it within a fortnight of buying
it and his wife insisted that he sell it. 26 years on, it still wears
the scars on the fairing, cylinder head and pannier lid. I think selling
it back to the dealer within the month cost him about £2.5k.

--
Gyp

[ogden]

Gyp wrote:
>
> The previous owner of my R80RT dropped it within a fortnight of buying
> it and his wife insisted that he sell it. 26 years on, it still wears
> the scars on the fairing, cylinder head and pannier lid.

Nothing compared to the scars on his masculinity.

--
ogden

[astrospanner]

In article <qsk3jb9ph5a3miijg...@4ax.com>,
ne...@champ.org.uk says...

>
> On Tue, 10 May 2016 13:07:33 +0100, Gyp <a@b.c> wrote:
>
> >On 10/05/2016 10:04, Champ wrote:
> >
> >> I've no idea. Not even sure why I would know.
> >
> >Because you occasionally buy trousers
> >
> >> I usually buy 32" length jeans, if that's any help
> >
> >Ah there we go 32".
>
> Ah, that's the *inside* leg measurement, is it? I had no idea.

I am constantly amazed by the things that UKRMers know, and don't know.

--
Will
ZRX1200
XJ600

[astrospanner]

In article <ngsinl$pr4$1...@dont-email.me>, a@b.c says...

>
> On 10/05/2016 10:04, Champ wrote:
>
> > I've no idea. Not even sure why I would know.
>
> Because you occasionally buy trousers
>
> > I usually buy 32" length jeans, if that's any help
>
> Ah there we go 32".
>
> I buy 28" and they're a bit too long.

So if you had proper legs you'd be really tall?

--
Will
ZRX1200
XJ600

[Brownz (via Gurgle Gruppez)]

Normally Champ..... Purveyor of some of my finest eybrow raising "really ?" moments.... Bless....

[astrospanner]

In article <XnsA60376636B74d...@46.165.242.75>,
davidlobs...@hotmail.com says...
>
> I've been using usenet for well over 20 years, but this is my first-ever
> foray into the legendary UKRM.
>
> Gulp.
>
> I'm afraid I'm (potentially) a classic BAB. I'm mid-50s, last threw a leg
> over a saddle 30 years ago, and due to changing life circumstances I'm
> really keen to get back on to two wheels now. I'd really appreciate some
> expert advice on my best way forward.

Having looked at the rest of the replies, my only reaction is
"Christ on a bike, there's a lot of conflicting advice"

You've not said what kind of riding you want to do, or what budget
limits are.

So here's my version:

Go to a shop, see a bike you want. (If you can't afford shop prices,
look at ebay/gumtree etc).

Test ride it if possible. If your nervous about doing that, just hire a
bike for a day eg http://www.superbikerental.co.uk/

Buy it, ride it. Live with it for a bit.

If it terrifies you, ride it more carefully and/or get some training/do
some reading/practise.

Enjoy it!

If, after the initial "I've bought a new bike" has worn off, you don't
like the seating position, or the engine characteristics, or something,
you now have more idea of what you do want. Go and buy that. Money no
object? Keep the old one as well.

--
Will
ZRX1200
XJ600

[Gyp]

On 11/05/2016 11:33, astrospanner wrote:

>> I buy 28" and they're a bit too long.
>
> So if you had proper legs you'd be really tall?

Either that, or when I'm stood next to Champ, my legs don't reach all
the way to the floor.

--
Gyp

[Champ]

Is this you?
http://www.theverge.com/2016/5/2/11564304/flyboard-air-video-world-record-hoverboard-flight-franky-zapata

[Gyp]

Champ <ne...@champ.org.uk> Wrote in message:

> Is this you?
> http://www.theverge.com/2016/5/2/11564304/flyboard-air-video-world-record-hoverboard-flight-franky-zapata
>

Might as well be
--
--
Gyp

[wessie]

Horse <aboycal...@gmail.com> wrote in
news:5ed48fd8-beab-4f8c...@googlegroups.com:

have you grown then? Not seen you since Etraupont...

[wessie]

astrospanner <willgr...@gmail.com> wrote in
news:MPG.319d1ae...@news.eternal-september.org:

I'm the reverse - same height as Gyp but with a 32" inside leg, so I can
flat foot both sides on an R-GS or Super Tenere. I'd be 6' tall if I wasn't
Necky McNoneck

[Wicked Uncle Nigel]

Using the patented Mavis Beacon "Hunt&Peck" Technique, Gyp <a@b.c> typed

>"Krusty" <dontw...@nowhere.invalid> Wrote in message:
>
>>
>> Which is quite a feat, given the size of the crash bung just above it.
>
>Pmsl

+1

--
Wicked Uncle Nigel - "He's hopeless, but he's honest"

Contains moderate bullshit and simulated opinions.

[Wicked Uncle Nigel]

Using the patented Mavis Beacon "Hunt&Peck" Technique,

c...@post.netunix.com typed
>
>Are you gay ? - If so you want a Harley with tassels.
>Are you dissatisfied with your dick size ? - If so you want a big bike.

When I read the OP, my first thought was "CRN will be along to spout
utter fucking bollocks any second... Oh, there he is!".

[Wicked Uncle Nigel]

Using the patented Mavis Beacon "Hunt&Peck" Technique, ogden
<og...@pre.org> typed

Yeah, but then he sold the bike.

[c...@post.netunix.com]

Wicked Uncle Nigel <w...@wicked-uncle-nigel.me.uk> wrote:
> Using the patented Mavis Beacon "Hunt&Peck" Technique,
> c...@post.netunix.com typed
>>
>>Are you gay ? - If so you want a Harley with tassels.
>>Are you dissatisfied with your dick size ? - If so you want a big bike.
>
> When I read the OP, my first thought was "CRN will be along to spout
> utter fucking bollocks any second... Oh, there he is!".

Which part of "humourous" did you not understand in the stuff you snipped.
There is, of course, some truth in the stereotypes.

[Wicked Uncle Nigel]

Using the patented Mavis Beacon "Hunt&Peck" Technique,
c...@post.netunix.com typed
>Wicked Uncle Nigel <w...@wicked-uncle-nigel.me.uk> wrote:
>> Using the patented Mavis Beacon "Hunt&Peck" Technique,
>> c...@post.netunix.com typed
>>>
>>>Are you gay ? - If so you want a Harley with tassels.
>>>Are you dissatisfied with your dick size ? - If so you want a big bike.
>>
>> When I read the OP, my first thought was "CRN will be along to spout
>> utter fucking bollocks any second... Oh, there he is!".
>
>Which part of "humourous" did you not understand in the stuff you snipped.

The part where it was funny.

>There is, of course, some truth in the stereotypes.

Really? Really?

[Mark Olson]

About you constantly posting bollocks?

There, you're not wrong.

[no...@nochance.at.all.it]

On Mon, 9 May 2016 16:33:05 +0100, "Hog"
<sm91...@CHIPShotmail.co.uk> wrote:

>Lobster wrote:
>> I've been using usenet for well over 20 years, but this is my
>> first-ever foray into the legendary UKRM.
>>
>> Gulp.
>

>You cannot go wrong with a Kawasaki ER-6F ABS and you can find the older
>shape with the (better) conventional twin headlights under £2,500
>
>I bought one as a spare, rode it around Ireland, France and UK. Other than
>fitting a high screen I couldn't fault it and it's very enjoyable and
>engaging to ride. There are no engine weaknesses and handling is
>reassuringly solid. The ABS is excellent and will be reassuring for a
>returning rider.
>Just sold it on after 2 years and I'm sorry to see it go.
>
>It pairs particularly well with the R&G crash bungs, I'm since told.....
>

The advice is mostly all sound apart from one, you need training.
Doesn't matter who with but advanced road training from RSPA, IAM or
wherever will both get you back into the swing and help to meet the
DFC advice.
I haven't met anyone who says they haven't learned something from
advanced training.
Plus it doesn't have to be a chore, the more you're out on your bike
the better, clearly.
If it were me and shekels are not a problem, buy the bike you want and
learn to ride it while getting your training. Win win.

[Champ]

On Thu, 12 May 2016 16:07:33 +0100, no...@nochance.at.all.it. wrote:

> I haven't met anyone who says they haven't learned something from
>advanced training.

I don't have actual evidence about this, but I'd be really suprised if
I did (learn anything).

[YTC#1]

Take you pick from the following quotes

http://www.wiseoldsayings.com/learning-quotes

No one ever knows it all.

Granted you are very experienced, but can you imagine if at work someone
walked in to a training session that you were giving and stated that it
was a waste of time, they know it all already.

What would your opinion of that person be ?

[Colin Irvine]

Is anyone suggesting you would?

--
Colin Irvine
ZZR1400

[Rick]

Nobody knows everything. After I finally passed my car test 9 years ago,
I noticed things drummed into me during the twenty odd lessons have
changed my motorcycling habits. Even though I'd been riding bikes for
thirty years, been through countless winters, worked as a courier etc.,
not had any kind of accident for at least twenty years, I found myself
using the mirrors more, using the lifesaver glance and thinking in a
'roadcraftier' way. Obviously the red mist descends periodically and I
lapse but generally I think I'm a more refined rider.

The bar was set pretty fucking low before all this so it's no great
acheivement.

--
Rick Brown

SprintRS R100RT

[Rick]

*achievement* ffs.
I've been out a couple of times with a club that monitors your riding
and provides feedback. I'm ok but I think they encourage a 'too
cautious' approach and I don't think it's the safest way sometimes. It's
ironic that while I was there two of the 'advanced' riders had accidents
they attributed to their own lack of anticipation. Maybe Champ is correct.

[Simon Wilson]

I'd be surprised if you didn't.

--
/Simon

[YTC#1]

I'm still waiting for someone to correct his spelling.

[Colin Irvine]

On Fri, 13 May 2016 11:29:40 +0100, YTC#1 wrote:

> On 13/05/2016 11:23, Simon Wilson wrote:
>> On 5/13/2016 9:40 AM, Champ wrote:
>>> On Thu, 12 May 2016 16:07:33 +0100, no...@nochance.at.all.it. wrote:
>>>
>>>> I haven't met anyone who says they haven't learned something from
>>>> advanced training.
>>>
>>> I don't have actual evidence about this, but I'd be really suprised if
>>> I did (learn anything).
>>>
>>>
>> I'd be surprised if you didn't.
>>
>>
> I'm still waiting for someone to correct his spelling.

I'm suprised you haven't already.

--
Colin Irvine
ZZR1400

[Mark Olson]

You've had a bang on the head, etc.

[AndyB]

I think he means he'd be surprised if he learned anything he wants to know which is pretty much my view on it.

[YTC#1]

Standards have slipped

[YTC#1]

But surely it is what you don't know that you need to learn ?

[Rick]

On 13/05/2016 13:07, YTC#1 wrote:
> On 13/05/2016 12:22, AndyB wrote:
>>
>>
>> On 11:23 13/05 , Simon Wilson wrote:
>>> On 5/13/2016 9:40 AM, Champ wrote:
>>>> On Thu, 12 May 2016 16:07:33 +0100, no...@nochance.at.all.it. wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I haven't met anyone who says they haven't learned something from
>>>>> advanced training.
>>>>
>>>> I don't have actual evidence about this, but I'd be really suprised if
>>>> I did (learn anything).
>>>>
>>>
>>> I'd be surprised if you didn't.
>>>
>>
>> I think he means he'd be surprised if he learned anything he wants to know which is pretty much my view on it.
>>
>
> But surely it is what you don't know that you need to learn ?
>
>

I suspect Champs take is more along the lines, 'Who do you think you
are, telling *me* how to ride a motorbike? What have you ever done?'

Not hit a telegraph pole may not be enough of a qualification.

[AndyB]

On 13:07 13/05 , YTC#1 wrote:
>On 13/05/2016 12:22, AndyB wrote:
>>
>>
>> On 11:23 13/05 , Simon Wilson wrote:
>>> On 5/13/2016 9:40 AM, Champ wrote:
>>>> On Thu, 12 May 2016 16:07:33 +0100, no...@nochance.at.all.it. wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I haven't met anyone who says they haven't learned something from
>>>>> advanced training.
>>>>
>>>> I don't have actual evidence about this, but I'd be really suprised if
>>>> I did (learn anything).
>>>>
>>>
>>> I'd be surprised if you didn't.
>>>
>>
>> I think he means he'd be surprised if he learned anything he wants to know which is pretty much my view on it.
>>
>
>But surely it is what you don't know that you need to learn ?
>
>

I'll be nice and spell it out for you...

There's a major difference between wanting something and needing it. They might well teach me things I need to know but I don't want to be taught them.

[Champ]

On Fri, 13 May 2016 10:03:31 +0100, YTC#1 <b...@ytc1-spambin.co.uk>
wrote:

>Granted you are very experienced, but can you imagine if at work someone
>walked in to a training session that you were giving and stated that it
>was a waste of time, they know it all already.

Well, they might be an arrogant wanker, or they might indeed know it
all already.

Or possibly both.

[Champ]

On Fri, 13 May 2016 10:48:39 +0100, Rick
<richardhenley...@tiscali.co.uk> wrote:

>>>> I haven't met anyone who says they haven't learned something from
>>>> advanced training.

>>> I don't have actual evidence about this, but I'd be really suprised if I
>>> did (learn anything).

Of course, what I meant was "learnt anything that I agreed with, or
thought correct"

>Nobody knows everything. After I finally passed my car test 9 years ago,
>I noticed things drummed into me during the twenty odd lessons have
>changed my motorcycling habits. Even though I'd been riding bikes for
>thirty years, been through countless winters, worked as a courier etc.,
>not had any kind of accident for at least twenty years, I found myself
>using the mirrors more, using the lifesaver glance and thinking in a
>'roadcraftier' way. Obviously the red mist descends periodically and I
>lapse but generally I think I'm a more refined rider.

Y'see, that mention of a lifesaver is a prime example of my disdain
for this sort of thing. I've never heard a single explanation of why
a lifesaver might be useful.