1:76 LNER A4 models
MartinS
Nigel Gresley. Can anyone give me an opinion on the Bachmann 31-952
"Mallard", which is the heritage NRM edition with valances, double
chimney, non-corridor tender and speed record plaque. I see from the net
that it has a split-chassis loco drive. Since I am not contemplating a
conversion to DCC, does this make any difference to its running qualities?
Bachmann's 2009 RPP is �96.85; Hattons is selling it for �68, with other
sellers in a range from �73 to �100.
In Hornby, Hattons has R2339 Mallard, DCC ready, for �102 and R2688 Sir
Nigel (anniversary edition) for �109. R2779 Falcon at �43 is the Railroad
version, I believe with tender drive, similar to what I already have.
Basically, I'm asking is the Bachmann at �68 a good buy, or is the Hornby
at 50% more a better buy in terms of quality and performance? Any other
RTR suggestions?
--
Martin S.
Paul
"MartinS" <m...@my.place> wrote in message
news:xL5Am.255867$0e4....@newsfe19.iad...
The Bachmann is quite old now which is why it still has the split chassis
The Hornby Railroad is Loco drive and represents great value as it is
actually quite high detail, I compared my Railroad A4 to a fine detail one
from only a couple of years ago and it was better.
I wouldn't bother with the Special Edition, unless you are a collector, the
R2339 is worth a look.
Paul
MartinS
> "MartinS" <m...@my.place> wrote...
>> I'm looking for a replacement for my ageing Hornby tender-drive LNER
>> Sir Nigel Gresley. Can anyone give me an opinion on the Bachmann
>> 31-952 "Mallard", which is the heritage NRM edition with valances,
>> double chimney, non-corridor tender and speed record plaque. I see
>> from the net that it has a split-chassis loco drive. Since I am not
>> contemplating a conversion to DCC, does this make any difference to
>> its running qualities?
>>
>> Bachmann's 2009 RPP is �96.85; Hattons is selling it for �68, with
>> other sellers in a range from �73 to �100.
>>
>> In Hornby, Hattons has R2339 Mallard, DCC ready, for �102 and R2688
>> Sir Nigel (anniversary edition) for �109. R2779 Falcon at �43 is the
>> Railroad version, I believe with tender drive, similar to what I
>> already have.
>>
>> Basically, I'm asking is the Bachmann at �68 a good buy, or is the
>> Hornby at 50% more a better buy in terms of quality and performance?
>> Any other RTR suggestions?
>
> chassis
And maybe why it is being discounted by 30%.
> The Hornby Railroad is Loco drive and represents great value as it is
> actually quite high detail, I compared my Railroad A4 to a fine detail
> one from only a couple of years ago and it was better.
>
> I wouldn't bother with the Special Edition, unless you are a
> collector, the R2339 is worth a look.
Thanks, Paul. It might be worth taking another look at "Falcon" at less
than half the price, as most of my other rolling stock is not super-
detailed, apart from a Bachmann 9F and a Hornby Black 5.
--
Martin S.
simon
"MartinS" <m...@my.place> wrote in message
This railroad range is well good ! Got the 9F last week, basic perhaps but
fine for me on the layout as tis outside my era. Will add some weathering
and possibly the odd pipe or rail. Chassis is smooth as anything straight
out of the box.
Cheers,
Simon
John Turner
"MartinS" wrote
> Thanks, Paul. It might be worth taking another look at "Falcon" at less
> than half the price, as most of my other rolling stock is not super-
> detailed, apart from a Bachmann 9F and a Hornby Black 5.
The Railroad range A4 is a loco drive version utilising the old
(super-detailed) tender drive model tooling, which doesn't quite capture the
shape of the A4 in the same was as the more recent standard range model.
In my opinion, the latter is one of the best steam loco models in the Hornby
range and is streets ahead of both the Bachmann A4 and the Railroad range
effort.
John.
MartinS
> "MartinS" wrote
>
>> Thanks, Paul. It might be worth taking another look at "Falcon" at
>> less than half the price, as most of my other rolling stock is not
> The Railroad range A4 is a loco drive version utilising the old
> (super-detailed) tender drive model tooling, which doesn't quite
> capture the shape of the A4 in the same was as the more recent
> standard range model.
>
> In my opinion, the latter is one of the best steam loco models in the
> Hornby range and is streets ahead of both the Bachmann A4 and the
> Railroad range effort.
Thanks, John. Now I have to decide whether it's worth it for my purposes
to spend more than twice as much for the standard as the Railroad model.
Obviously, if money weren't a factor, it would be a no-brainer.
Now I have to look for a new LMS maroon Princess Coronation, of which
there don't seem to be any currently on the market.
--
Martin S.
simon
"MartinS" <m...@my.place> wrote in message
....
> Now I have to look for a new LMS maroon Princess Coronation, of which
> there don't seem to be any currently on the market.
>
> --
> Martin S.
But are you after the best - LMS "Duchess of Buccleuch" (R2230) or BR fake
one ?
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Hornby-Duchess-of-Buccleuch-LMS-4-6-2-R2230-boxed_W0QQitemZ250512978185QQcmdZViewItemQQimsxq20091013?IMSfp=TL091013155001r21648
Cheers,
Simon
MartinS
> "MartinS" <m...@my.place> wrote...
> ....
>> Now I have to look for a new LMS maroon Princess Coronation, of which
>> there don't seem to be any currently on the market.
>>
> fake one ?
Has smoke deflectors. Won't ship outside UK. Tender drive?
--
Martin S.
simon
"MartinS" <m...@my.place> wrote in message
R2230 was the first super detailed loco drive model and the only one so far
released (outside sets) in LMS maroon. Do wonder if latest LMS black was
supposed to be maroon but was a communication error with china !
Am sure all super detailed have smoke deflectors but was told on here
recently that they are easily removed and all is fine behind. I have 2, one
of which is awaiting SD's removal, weathering and poss rename/renumber.
Wont ship outside UK ? oh well, is there someone that could forward it to
you. Otherwise its about time a new one ws released by Hornby or keep an eye
on Modelfair as they have them occasionally.
cheers,
Simon
MartinS
> "MartinS" <m...@my.place> wrote in message
> news:BexBm.47019$Bl2....@newsfe14.iad...
>> "simon" <nos...@nospam.com> wrote:
>>> "MartinS" <m...@my.place> wrote... ....
>>>> Now I have to look for a new LMS maroon Princess Coronation, of
>>>> which there don't seem to be any currently on the market.
>>>>
>>> But are you after the best - LMS "Duchess of Buccleuch" (R2230) or
>>> BR fake one ?
>>> http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Hornby-Duchess-of-Buccleuch-LMS-4-6-2-R2230-boxedW0QQitemZ250512978185QQcmdZViewItemQQimsxq20091013?IMSfp=TL091013155001r21648
>>
>> Has smoke deflectors. Won't ship outside UK. Tender drive?
>
> so far released (outside sets) in LMS maroon. Do wonder if latest LMS
> black was supposed to be maroon but was a communication error with
> china ! Am sure all super detailed have smoke deflectors but was told
> on here recently that they are easily removed and all is fine behind.
> I have 2, one of which is awaiting SD's removal, weathering and poss
> rename/renumber. Wont ship outside UK ? oh well, is there someone that
> could forward it to you. Otherwise its about time a new one ws
> released by Hornby or keep an eye on Modelfair as they have them
> occasionally.
I'll keep an eye out. Actually, my tender drive Princess Elizabeth is
still running fairly well, so there's no rush.
--
Martin S.
simon
"MartinS" <m...@my.place> wrote in message
Not sure what running fairly well means but the loco drive Duchess (and
Princess) is a mean machine, so smooth and has a slight growl as it goes
that gives a hint of true power. Nothing but nothing comes close (LMS that
is, maybe those lessor lookers but similar types A4 etc do as well).
erm... do you want a Princess or a Duchess (Princess Coronation). In loco
drive LMS theres Princess Aurthur R2225 which was released at same time as
"Duchess of Buccleuch" and Princess Louise R2313 that has slightly later LMS
maroon. Theres also at least 1 train pack - Royal ... - with Princess
Elizabeth but for some curious reason that has overhead warning flashes.
Cheers,
Simon
MartinS
> "MartinS" <m...@my.place> wrote...
>> "simon" <nos...@nospam.com> wrote:
>>> "MartinS" <m...@my.place> wrote...
>>>> "simon" <nos...@nospam.com> wrote:
>>>>> "MartinS" <m...@my.place> wrote... ....
>>>>>> Now I have to look for a new LMS maroon Princess Coronation, of
>>>>>> which there don't seem to be any currently on the market.
>>>>>>
>>>>> But are you after the best - LMS "Duchess of Buccleuch" (R2230) or
>>>>> BR fake one ?
>>>>> http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Hornby-Duchess-of-Buccleuch-LMS-4-6-2-R2230-boxedW0QQitemZ250512978185QQcmdZViewItemQQimsxq20091013?IMSfp=TL091013155001r21648
>>>>
>>>> Has smoke deflectors. Won't ship outside UK. Tender drive?
>>>
>>> R2230 was the first super detailed loco drive model and the only one
>>> so far released (outside sets) in LMS maroon. Do wonder if latest
>>> LMS black was supposed to be maroon but was a communication error
>>> with china ! Am sure all super detailed have smoke deflectors but
>>> was told on here recently that they are easily removed and all is
>>> fine behind. I have 2, one of which is awaiting SD's removal,
>>> weathering and poss rename/renumber. Wont ship outside UK ? oh well,
>>> is there someone that could forward it to you. Otherwise its about
>>> time a new one ws released by Hornby or keep an eye on Modelfair as
>>> they have them occasionally.
>>
>> I'll keep an eye out. Actually, my tender drive Princess Elizabeth is
>> still running fairly well, so there's no rush.
>
> (and Princess) is a mean machine, so smooth and has a slight growl as
> it goes that gives a hint of true power. Nothing but nothing comes
> close (LMS that is, maybe those lessor lookers but similar types A4
> etc do as well). erm... do you want a Princess or a Duchess (Princess
> Coronation). In loco drive LMS theres Princess Aurthur R2225 which was
> released at same time as "Duchess of Buccleuch" and Princess Louise
> R2313 that has slightly later LMS maroon. Theres also at least 1 train
> pack - Royal ... - with Princess Elizabeth but for some curious reason
> that has overhead warning flashes.
Curiouser and curiouser.
Actually I'd be happy with a Duchess or a Princess, as long as it's not
one of the formerly streamlined ones with a sloping firebox.
And I thought steam locos were supposed to chuff, not growl.
--
Martin S.
simon
"MartinS" <m...@my.place> wrote in message
Your on safe ground there, when streamlining removed Duchesses were painted
black and Princesses never suffered the indignity of streamlining.
Not sure if it growls or if romancing :-)
cheers,
Simon
MartinS
> Not sure what running fairly well means but the loco drive Duchess
> (and Princess) is a mean machine, so smooth and has a slight growl as
> it goes that gives a hint of true power. Nothing but nothing comes
> close (LMS that is, maybe those lessor lookers but similar types A4
> etc do as well). erm... do you want a Princess or a Duchess (Princess
> Coronation). In loco drive LMS theres Princess Aurthur R2225 which was
> released at same time as "Duchess of Buccleuch" and Princess Louise
> R2313 that has slightly later LMS maroon. Theres also at least 1 train
> pack - Royal ... - with Princess Elizabeth but for some curious reason
> that has overhead warning flashes.
Any comments on this one? ebay.uk item no. 290360730939
It's 6201 Princess Elizabeth with warning flashes, presumably from the
R1057 Royal Train set, but identifed as R2225. It's described as GWO, with
"loose front wheels"; I've emailed the vendor for clarification on that.
The starting price is very low (�19.99), but there could be a flurry of
bidding before it ends tomorrow at 15:10 (10:10 for me). The vendor has a
99.7% rating and will post overseas for �8.
The Duchess of Buccleigh went on eBay for �67.09, not bad for as-new and
boxed. Modelfair sold an R2225 that had been renumbered and renamed to
Princess Elizabeth, without warning flashes, for �79.50.
--
Martin S.
simon
"MartinS" <m...@my.place> wrote in message
Yep thats from train pack R1057. I have one split from set. Its as per 70's
when pulling royal train, but livery near as can tell from as built with
numbers/letters straw with black edge and lining gold/yellow also black
edge. Theres some confusion as to whether lining was gold or yellow in 1935.
As its from 70's explains why has warning flashes and speedo cable. I'm
happy with it as is but do intend to give it light weathering and remove
flashes when confident know how to do that. Will remove speedo as well.
Mine, typical of Hornby Princesses is good runner but when got it, wheels
were dirty either from some running or original black paint/muck that some
new Hornby locos arrive with.
I paid GBP65 for mine from local shop that I know to be reliable.
Cheers,
Simon
MartinS
>>
>>> Not sure what running fairly well means but the loco drive Duchess
>>> (and Princess) is a mean machine, so smooth and has a slight growl
>>> as it goes that gives a hint of true power. Nothing but nothing
>>> comes close (LMS that is, maybe those lessor lookers but similar
>>> types A4 etc do as well). erm... do you want a Princess or a Duchess
>>> (Princess Coronation). In loco drive LMS theres Princess Aurthur
>>> R2225 which was released at same time as "Duchess of Buccleuch" and
>>> Princess Louise R2313 that has slightly later LMS maroon. Theres
>>> also at least 1 train pack - Royal ... - with Princess Elizabeth but
>>> for some curious reason that has overhead warning flashes.
>>
>> Any comments on this one? ebay.uk item no. 290360730939
>>
>> It's 6201 Princess Elizabeth with warning flashes, presumably from
>> the R1057 Royal Train set, but identifed as R2225. It's described as
>> GWO, with "loose front wheels"; I've emailed the vendor for
>> clarification on that. The starting price is very low (�19.99), but
>> there could be a flurry of bidding before it ends tomorrow at 15:10
>> (10:10 for me). The vendor has a 99.7% rating and will post overseas
>> for �8.
>>
>> The Duchess of Buccleigh went on eBay for �67.09, not bad for as-new
>> and boxed. Modelfair sold an R2225 that had been renumbered and
>> renamed to Princess Elizabeth, without warning flashes, for �79.50.
>>
> 70's when pulling royal train, but livery near as can tell from as
> built with numbers/letters straw with black edge and lining
> gold/yellow also black edge. Theres some confusion as to whether
> lining was gold or yellow in 1935. As its from 70's explains why has
> warning flashes and speedo cable. I'm happy with it as is but do
> intend to give it light weathering and remove flashes when confident
> know how to do that. Will remove speedo as well. Mine, typical of
> Hornby Princesses is good runner but when got it, wheels were dirty
> either from some running or original black paint/muck that some new
> Hornby locos arrive with. I paid GBP65 for mine from local shop that I
> know to be reliable. Cheers,
> Simon
Thanks - I'm watching it. I think "loose front wheels" may just be
normal slop in the front bogie mounting.
--
Martin S.
MartinS
> "simon" <nos...@nospam.com> wrote:
>> "MartinS" <m...@my.place> wrote...
>>>
>>> Any comments on this one? ebay.uk item no. 290360730939
>>>
>>> It's 6201 Princess Elizabeth with warning flashes, presumably from
>>> the R1057 Royal Train set, but identifed as R2225. It's described as
>>> GWO, with "loose front wheels"; I've emailed the vendor for
>>> there could be a flurry of bidding before it ends tomorrow at 15:10
>>> (10:10 for me). The vendor has a 99.7% rating and will post overseas
>>>
>>> The Duchess of Buccleigh went on eBay for �ｿｽ67.09, not bad for as-new
>>> and boxed. Modelfair sold an R2225 that had been renumbered and
>>>
>> Yep thats from train pack R1057. I have one split from set. Its as
>> per 70's when pulling royal train, but livery near as can tell from
>> as built with numbers/letters straw with black edge and lining
>> gold/yellow also black edge. Theres some confusion as to whether
>> lining was gold or yellow in 1935. As its from 70's explains why has
>> warning flashes and speedo cable. I'm happy with it as is but do
>> intend to give it light weathering and remove flashes when confident
>> know how to do that. Will remove speedo as well. Mine, typical of
>> Hornby Princesses is good runner but when got it, wheels were dirty
>> either from some running or original black paint/muck that some new
>> Hornby locos arrive with. I paid GBP65 for mine from local shop that
>> I know to be reliable. Cheers,
>> Simon
>
> Thanks - I'm watching it. I think "loose front wheels" may just be
> normal slop in the front bogie mounting.
I just won it for �ｿｽ70.99. Someone else had an automatic bid of up to
�ｿｽ68.99. I guess that's a fair price in comparison to others. I just hope
it's in as good condition as described - no box, of course.
--
Martin S.
Paul Boyd
> I just won it for �70.99. Someone else had an automatic bid of up to
> �68.99.
Hmmm.... many people set their bids to just *above* the round pound
because they know that most people bid in round pounds. Setting a bid
to just *below* means that you're very likely to lose out by maybe just
a penny, but it does mean that the price has been pushed up.
I'm also very wary about bidding on private auctions, especially where
there is no reason whatsoever for the auction to be private as in this
case. You have even less idea than usual as to who you're bidding
against or how much activity with that seller your competing bidders have.
Not that I'm a cynical bugger or anything, but my suspicions have been
aroused by that seller's listings. Anyway, you've presumably paid no
more than you're happy to have paid ;-)
--
Paul Boyd
http://www.paul-boyd.me.uk/
MartinS
I'm keeping my fingers crossed that it will be worth the price when I
receive it, and hope there was no shill biddng. The seller has a 99.7%
feedback rating, for what that's worth, going back to 2003.
Re my original post, I have also ordered Hornby Railroad R2779 A4
"Falcon", R2675 A1 "Flying Scotsman" and R2674 3F Jinty from Model
Railways Direct to replace 2 tender-drive locos and a defunct Bachmann
J72. I had taken the J72 apart for a second time to see why it was
emitting smoke from the cab. I found the cause was arcing between the
split frame and commutator, and as I powered it, the whole business
melted and fused. It was a good little runner when I bought it but, as
others have discovered, it was crap.
My only remaining previous-generation motive power are a 4-6-2T (with
traction tyres removed) and a Lima Class 101 DMU. I would like to
replace the noisy pancake motor in the latter with a new Hornby or
equivalent motor. Can anyone recommend a reasonable cost solution?
--
Martin S.
simon
"MartinS" <m...@my.place> wrote in message
> Paul Boyd <pa...@invalid.net> wrote:
>> MartinS wrote:
>>
>>> I just won it for �70.99. Someone else had an automatic bid of up to
>>> �68.99.
>>
>> Hmmm.... many people set their bids to just *above* the round pound
>> because they know that most people bid in round pounds. Setting a bid
>> to just *below* means that you're very likely to lose out by maybe
>> just a penny, but it does mean that the price has been pushed up.
>>
>> I'm also very wary about bidding on private auctions, especially where
>> there is no reason whatsoever for the auction to be private as in this
>> case. You have even less idea than usual as to who you're bidding
>> against or how much activity with that seller your competing bidders
>> have.
>>
>> Not that I'm a cynical bugger or anything, but my suspicions have been
>> aroused by that seller's listings. Anyway, you've presumably paid no
>> more than you're happy to have paid ;-)
>
> I'm keeping my fingers crossed that it will be worth the price when I
> receive it, and hope there was no shill biddng. The seller has a 99.7%
> feedback rating, for what that's worth, going back to 2003.
>
condition then I think its a fair price - Paul only charges that type.
>
> My only remaining previous-generation motive power are a 4-6-2T (with
> traction tyres removed) and a Lima Class 101 DMU. I would like to
> replace the noisy pancake motor in the latter with a new Hornby or
> equivalent motor. Can anyone recommend a reasonable cost solution?
>
> --
> Martin S.
Erm its diesel - sell it on ebay and use the money to get a rebuilt
scot/patriot for GBP60 or a railroad 9F.
:-)
Cheers,
Simon
MartinS
> scot/patriot for GBP60 or a railroad 9F.
>:-)
It's my one concession to the diesel age - DMUs were introduced when
steam was still around, if not in Big 4 livery. I'm not picky about my
periods - it's my railway and I'll run what I want.
I already have a Bachmann 9F with early BR crest. It's nice but it
doesn't like some of my 2nd radius points.
--
Martin S.
Graham Thurlwell
<snip>
> I had taken the J72 apart for a second time to see why it was
> emitting smoke from the cab. I found the cause was arcing between the
> split frame and commutator, and as I powered it, the whole business
> melted and fused.
Makes a change from the axles exploding, which is what usually happens
to the ones we use.
> It was a good little runner when I bought it but, as
> others have discovered, it was crap.
If you haven't binned it, and the body hasn't melted, Mainly Trains do
a very nice chassis and detailing kit for the J72. Ref. number is
MT248. They also do a kit to convert the J72 into a J71 if you fancy a
challenge. Ref. for that one is MT249. Etched nickel silver. How's
your soldering? ;-)
Obviously, it's going to cost quite a bit more than just buying a
replacement or ordering the spares from Bachmann but my Dad and I have
bought several Bachmann J72s and only the most recent one works
perfectly and only one other can be termed a runner (and is a little
rough).
--
Jades' First Encounters Site - http://www.jades.org/ffe.htm
The best Frontier: First Encounters site on the Web.
nos...@jades.org is currently broken, please reply on group!
MartinS
> MartinS <m...@my.place> wrote:
>
> <snip>
>
>> I had taken the J72 apart for a second time to see why it was
>> emitting smoke from the cab. I found the cause was arcing between the
>> split frame and commutator, and as I powered it, the whole business
>> melted and fused.
>
> Makes a change from the axles exploding, which is what usually happens
> to the ones we use.
>
>> It was a good little runner when I bought it but, as others have
>> discovered, it was crap.
>
> If you haven't binned it, and the body hasn't melted, Mainly Trains do
> a very nice chassis and detailing kit for the J72. Ref. number is
> MT248. They also do a kit to convert the J72 into a J71 if you fancy a
> challenge. Ref. for that one is MT249. Etched nickel silver. How's
> your soldering? ;-)
>
> Obviously, it's going to cost quite a bit more than just buying a
> replacement or ordering the spares from Bachmann but my Dad and I have
> bought several Bachmann J72s and only the most recent one works
> perfectly and only one other can be termed a runner (and is a little
> rough).
I replaced it with a new Hornby Railroad LMS Jinty for �21.99.
It didn't have to be an LNER shunter.
--
Martin S.
simon
"MartinS" <m...@my.place> wrote in message
> Paul Boyd <pa...@invalid.net> wrote:
>> MartinS wrote:
>>
>>> I just won it for �70.99. Someone else had an automatic bid of up to
>>> �68.99.
>>
> receive it, and hope there was no shill biddng. The seller has a 99.7%
> feedback rating, for what that's worth, going back to 2003.
> Martin S.
IMHO Assuming condition ok then youve got one of the best models of one of
the best loco's at a fair price. So who cares about anything else - esp if
you could have got it cheaper .....
Let us know how it goes.
cheers,
Simon
MartinS
>>> MartinS wrote:
>>>
>>>> I just won it for �70.99. Someone else had an automatic bid of up
>>>> to �68.99.
>>>
>> I'm keeping my fingers crossed that it will be worth the price when
>> I receive it, and hope there was no shill biddng. The seller has a
>> 99.7% feedback rating, for what that's worth, going back to 2003.
>
> one of the best loco's at a fair price. So who cares about anything
> else - esp if you could have got it cheaper .....
>
> Let us know how it goes.
It could be a while. It was posted yesterday, so unless it got out of the
UK by last night, it may end up in a black hole for weeks.
--
Martin S.
MartinS
OK, I got my loco on Monday, only 5 days - it beat the strike.
It was, as expected, unboxed, and wrapped in copious amounts of bubble
wrap. It may have been wrapped a little too tightly, as the tender
connector was bent, which I was able to fix, but it ran unevenly due to
some binding in the valve gear. I have tried to straighten things out
but still haven't got it quite perfect. These components are very
delicate! Otherwise, the model is in excellent condition.
One question that someone may be able to answer: there is some moulded
pipework below the cab on the right side, but none on the left side,
although it looks as though something might have been broken off. Should
there be pipework on the left side of 6201 below the cab? I've tried to
find clear pictures on the net, but I'm still not sure. Some of Horby's
more recent BR models with the fixed trailing wheels appear to have
pipework, but this one has the swinging bogie.
The Railroad range A1, A4 and 3F I ordered new have been held back until
the strike is settled, so I haven't received them yet.
--
Martin S.
simon
"MartinS" <m...@my.place> wrote in message
> One question that someone may be able to answer: there is some moulded
> pipework below the cab on the right side, but none on the left side,
> although it looks as though something might have been broken off. Should
> there be pipework on the left side of 6201 below the cab? I've tried to
> find clear pictures on the net, but I'm still not sure. Some of Horby's
> more recent BR models with the fixed trailing wheels appear to have
> pipework, but this one has the swinging bogie.
> --
> Martin S.
Yep there is, tis to do with injector. looks different to that on RHS -
simpler. Vaguely shaped as below.
With 2 pipes on left joining the 3rd on right. Dimension of 1cm by 1 cm.
| | |
| L---O
L-------|-
HTH
Simon
MartinS
>> moulded pipework below the cab on the right side, but none on the
>> left side, although it looks as though something might have been
>> broken off. Should there be pipework on the left side of 6201 below
>> the cab? I've tried to find clear pictures on the net, but I'm still
>> not sure. Some of Horby's more recent BR models with the fixed
>> trailing wheels appear to have pipework, but this one has the
>> swinging bogie.
>
> - simpler. Vaguely shaped as below.
> With 2 pipes on left joining the 3rd on right. Dimension of 1cm by 1
> cm.
>
>
> | | |
> | L---O
> L-------|-
Hmmm... Guess I'll have to make do without that.
--
Martin S.
simon
"MartinS" <m...@my.place> wrote in message
Must admit I hadnt noticed it before so wouldnt worry about it. however you
could make something up with bit of wire if you really wanted to.
Cheers,
Simon
MartinS
> "MartinS" <m...@my.place> wrote...
>> "simon" <nos...@nospam.com> wrote:
>>> "MartinS" <m...@my.place> wrote...
>>>> One question that someone may be able to answer: there is some
>>>> moulded pipework below the cab on the right side, but none on the
>>>> left side, although it looks as though something might have been
>>>> broken off. Should there be pipework on the left side of 6201 below
>>>> the cab? I've tried to find clear pictures on the net, but I'm
>>>> still not sure. Some of Horby's more recent BR models with the
>>>> fixed trailing wheels appear to have pipework, but this one has the
>>>> swinging bogie.
>>>
>>> Yep there is, tis to do with injector. looks different to that on
>>> RHS - simpler. Vaguely shaped as below.
>>> With 2 pipes on left joining the 3rd on right. Dimension of 1cm by 1
>>> cm.
>>>
>>> | | | L---O L-------|-
>>
>> Hmmm... Guess I'll have to make do without that.
>
> however you could make something up with bit of wire if you really
> wanted to.
I dodn't think I want to badly enough. After all, the loco has no steps,
and there's that annoying speedo cable that prevents you totally
removing the body from the chassis. It's not that easy to get rid of,
either, as it has a special fitting on the rear axle crankpin.
--
Martin S.
simon
"MartinS" <m...@my.place> wrote in message
> I dodn't think I want to badly enough. After all, the loco has no steps,
> and there's that annoying speedo cable that prevents you totally
> removing the body from the chassis. It's not that easy to get rid of,
> either, as it has a special fitting on the rear axle crankpin.
>
> --
> Martin S.
Dont say that, I want to remove speedo cable - or at least make it less
obvious !
Cheers,
Simon
MartinS
>> steps, and there's that annoying speedo cable that prevents you
>> totally removing the body from the chassis. It's not that easy to get
>> rid of, either, as it has a special fitting on the rear axle
>> crankpin.
>
> less obvious !
Well, I managed to break it (flexible plastic) so I cut it off. The upper
fitting is glued into the running board, I believe, and can be removed.
It's harder to get rid of the axle fitting, but it's not too noticeable.
--
Martin S.
MartinS
> The Railroad range A1, A4 and 3F I ordered new have been held back
> until the strike is settled, so I haven't received them yet.
I have now received the above 3 models. The A1 Flying Scotsman and A4
Falcon are excellent value for under �50, having the new chassis with
fixed trailing pony truck and wide flangeless wheels. These are not
noticeable, and also make it easier to rerail the loco.
However, the 8-wheel tenders appear to be on basically the same chassis
as the old tender-drive version. They even have a dummy ringfield motor
to add weight! In fact, I was able to swap over the (non-prototypical)
trailing pony trucks for the old ones that already had Kadees attached
to them - they still carry the same part number.
Both locos run very nicely, as does Princess Elizabeth now I have sorted
out the valve gear problem. However, after only a couple of days the A1
lost a front axle crankpin at speed, causing it to jump the track.
Luckily there was no apparent damage, and I found the pin beside the
track. I had some difficulty getting it back in; it has ridges rather
than threads, and pushes into a metal boss. If it comes loose again,
I'll e-mail the vendor about an replacement.
The 3F Jinty is a bit of a disappointment, even though it cost only �22
(Hamley's wants �35!). It's an old body lacking a lot of detail, but the
"upgraded" 0-6-0 chassis allows too little vertical and horizontal
play in the axles to negotiate track irregularities. Some of my older
Hornby turnouts have the insulated frog slightly higher than the running
rails; as the centre driver passes over the frog, it lifts the other 2
wheels on that side, breaking electrical contact and often causing a
derailment. Hornby's older 6-coupled tank loco design was much more
accommodating, with the weight on the front two axles, traction tyres on
the centre axle (which also had reduced flanges), and a floating rear
axle held in contact with the track by springs. My 1990s 2-6-4T with
this arrangement (and a 3-pole motor) runs well without hesitation or
derailment on turnouts; I have removed the traction tyres and it hauls 3
suburban coaches with no slippage.
This is a case where a "new and improved" design creates problems
that the previous design managed to avoid. My 3 Pacifics and Black 5,
with full flanges on all loco and tender wheels, negotiate turnouts and
sharp curves better than the 3F. My Bachmann J74, with its now burned
out motor, was problem-free when new. I can't quite say the same for my
Bachmann 9F with its 10-coupled wheelbase, but it does negotiate both
tracks of my main oval.
--
Martin S.
simon
"MartinS" <m...@my.place> wrote in message
> MartinS <m...@my.place> wrote:
>
> The 3F Jinty is a bit of a disappointment, even though it cost only �22
> (Hamley's wants �35!). It's an old body lacking a lot of detail, but the
> "upgraded" 0-6-0 chassis allows too little vertical and horizontal
> play in the axles to negotiate track irregularities. Some of my older
> Hornby turnouts have the insulated frog slightly higher than the running
> rails; as the centre driver passes over the frog, it lifts the other 2
> wheels on that side, breaking electrical contact and often causing a
> derailment. Hornby's older 6-coupled tank loco design was much more
> accommodating, with the weight on the front two axles, traction tyres on
> the centre axle (which also had reduced flanges), and a floating rear
> axle held in contact with the track by springs.
So the rear wheel is no longer sprung on railroad Jinty ?
cheers,
Simon
MartinS
No. The axles are all in brass bearings with very little free play.
That's progress for you!
--
Martin S.
simon
"MartinS" <m...@my.place> wrote in message
Pity about that, railroad stuff supposed to be good runners - 9F certainly
is.
Sotto voce - of course youve checked B2B.....
Cheers,
Simon
MartinS
> "MartinS" <m...@my.place> wrote...
>> "simon" <nos...@nospam.com> wrote:
>>> "MartinS" <m...@my.place> wrote...
>>>> MartinS <m...@my.place> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> The 3F Jinty is a bit of a disappointment, even though it cost only
>>>> �22 (Hamley's wants �35!). It's an old body lacking a lot of
>>>> detail, but the "upgraded" 0-6-0 chassis allows too little vertical
>>>> and horizontal play in the axles to negotiate track irregularities.
>>>> Some of my older Hornby turnouts have the insulated frog slightly
>>>> higher than the running rails; as the centre driver passes over the
>>>> frog, it lifts the other 2 wheels on that side, breaking electrical
>>>> contact and often causing a derailment. Hornby's older 6-coupled
>>>> tank loco design was much more accommodating, with the weight on
>>>> the front two axles, traction tyres on the centre axle (which also
>>>> had reduced flanges), and a floating rear axle held in contact with
>>>> the track by springs.
>>>
>>> So the rear wheel is no longer sprung on railroad Jinty ?
>>
>> No. The axles are all in brass bearings with very little free play.
>> That's progress for you!
>
> certainly is.
> Sotto voce - of course youve checked B2B.....
14.2mm
--
Martin S.
simon
"MartinS" <m...@my.place> wrote in message news:7woIm.5$W7...@newsfe11.iad...
FM Guage ?
Could it do with some weight ?
Cheers,
Simon
MartinS
> Could it do with some weight ?
FM?
I don't think that would help. What might help would be perfectly flat
turnouts, but some side-to-side axle play would also help.
--
Martin S.
simon
"MartinS" <m...@my.place> wrote in message
14mm :-)
Cheers,
Simon
Greg.Procter
> "simon" <nos...@nospam.com> wrote:
>> "MartinS" <m...@my.place> wrote...
>>> "simon" <nos...@nospam.com> wrote:
>>>> "MartinS" <m...@my.place> wrote...
>>>>> "simon" <nos...@nospam.com> wrote:
>>>>>> "MartinS" <m...@my.place> wrote...
>>>>>>> MartinS <m...@my.place> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The 3F Jinty is a bit of a disappointment, even though it cost
>>>>>>> only ￜ22 (Hamley's wants ￜ35!). It's an old body lacking a lot of
>>>>>>> detail, but the "upgraded" 0-6-0 chassis allows too little
>>>>>>> vertical and horizontal play in the axles to negotiate track
>>>>>>> irregularities. Some of my older Hornby turnouts have the
>>>>>>> insulated frog slightly higher than the running rails; as the
>>>>>>> centre driver passes over the frog, it lifts the other 2 wheels
>>>>>>> on that side, breaking electrical contact and often causing a
>>>>>>> derailment. Hornby's older 6-coupled tank loco design was much
>>>>>>> more accommodating, with the weight on the front two axles,
>>>>>>> traction tyres on the centre axle (which also had reduced
>>>>>>> flanges), and a floating rear axle held in contact with the track
>>>>>>> by springs.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> So the rear wheel is no longer sprung on railroad Jinty ?
>>>>>
>>>>> No. The axles are all in brass bearings with very little free play.
>>>>> That's progress for you!
>>>>
>>>> Pity about that, railroad stuff supposed to be good runners - 9F
>>>> certainly is.
>>>> Sotto voce - of course youve checked B2B.....
>>>
>>> 14.2mm
>>
>> FM Guage ?
>> Could it do with some weight ?
>
> FM?
> I don't think that would help. What might help would be perfectly flat
> turnouts, but some side-to-side axle play would also help.
>
Once I lay my turnouts I run a circa 8" x 3" fine sharpening stone over
them in a figure 8 pattern. 30 seconds of gentle movement is usually
enough and the high spots show up very quickly. Frogs are the usual high
point, especially plastic frogs. Comparing smoothness of running before
and after is impressive.
Greg.P.
NZ
simon
"Greg.Procter" <pro...@ihug.co.nz> wrote in message
news:op.u2xrwlsxt7a1n0@promodel-5a9821...
Once again I didnt read what was written correctly. Older Hornby points -
dump ASAP - alternately as Greg says file with something till level.
Cheers,
Simon
MartinS
> MartinS <m...@my.place> wrote:
>
>> I don't think that would help. What might help would be perfectly
>> flat turnouts, but some side-to-side axle play would also help.
>
> Once I lay my turnouts I run a circa 8" x 3" fine sharpening stone
> over them in a figure 8 pattern. 30 seconds of gentle movement is
> usually enough and the high spots show up very quickly. Frogs are the
> usual high point, especially plastic frogs. Comparing smoothness of
> running before and after is impressive.
I might try that, if I can't get them to lie flat any other way. I thought
of using a hair dryer or heat gun while gently bending the plastic
sleepers.
--
Martin S.
simon
"MartinS" <m...@my.place> wrote in message
Not glued down ? If not then do so and leave heavy weight on top. If base
not flat then glue to shim glued to base.
Cheers,
Simon
MartinS
>>>
>>> Once I lay my turnouts I run a circa 8" x 3" fine sharpening stone
>>> over them in a figure 8 pattern. 30 seconds of gentle movement is
>>> usually enough and the high spots show up very quickly. Frogs are
>>> the usual high point, especially plastic frogs. Comparing smoothness
>>> of running before and after is impressive.
>>
>> I might try that, if I can't get them to lie flat any other way. I
>> thought of using a hair dryer or heat gun while gently bending the
>> plastic sleepers.
>>
> base not flat then glue to shim glued to base.
They are on flexible cork underlay, at the moment just pinned down.
--
Martin S.
simon
"MartinS" <m...@my.place> wrote in message
Be suprised if anyone suggested not gluing down, although if you want to
replace Hornby points with Peco ones first they are much better.
Cheers,
Simon
MartinS
> "MartinS" <m...@my.place> wrote...
>> "simon" <nos...@nospam.com> wrote:
>>> "MartinS" <m...@my.place> wrote...
>>>> "Greg.Procter" <pro...@ihug.co.nz> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Once I lay my turnouts I run a circa 8" x 3" fine sharpening stone
>>>>> over them in a figure 8 pattern. 30 seconds of gentle movement is
>>>>> usually enough and the high spots show up very quickly. Frogs are
>>>>> the usual high point, especially plastic frogs. Comparing
>>>>> smoothness of running before and after is impressive.
>>>>
>>>> I might try that, if I can't get them to lie flat any other way. I
>>>> thought of using a hair dryer or heat gun while gently bending the
>>>> plastic sleepers.
>>>>
>>> Not glued down ? If not then do so and leave heavy weight on top. If
>>> base not flat then glue to shim glued to base.
>>
>> They are on flexible cork underlay, at the moment just pinned down.
>
> to replace Hornby points with Peco ones first they are much better.
I have old first-radius curved points in the fiddle yard.
--
Martin S.
John Turner
Subject: Re: 1:76 LNER A4 models
> Some of my older Hornby turnouts have the insulated frog slightly higher
> than the running rails; as the centre driver passes over the frog, it
> lifts the other 2 wheels on that side, breaking electrical contact and
> often causing a derailment.
1) Don't use Hornby points
2) Why not just file the frog slightly & reduce it's height.
John.
MartinS
1} Peco don't make the same ones; neither does Hornby anymore.
2) I could try that, but then I'd have filed frogs.
--
Martin S.
simon
"MartinS" <m...@my.place> wrote in message
In my admitedly limited experience pinned track wont stay in same place
forever. So you file it now and then it moves and requires further
modification or replacement. So recon first glue it as flat as possible then
see if filing required.
The best action however, is as said, for you to get rid of Hornby points, at
the same time move up a radius so more engines can use the fiddle yard. Pin
new track, play with it, glue new track, remove pins (if you want to).
Cheers,
Simon
MartinS
>>> From: "MartinS"
>>> Subject: Re: 1:76 LNER A4 models
>>>
>>>> Some of my older Hornby turnouts have the insulated frog slightly
>>>> higher than the running rails; as the centre driver passes over the
>>>> frog, it lifts the other 2 wheels on that side, breaking electrical
>>>> contact and often causing a derailment.
>>>
>>> 1) Don't use Hornby points
>>>
>>> 2) Why not just file the frog slightly & reduce it's height.
>>
>> 1} Peco don't make the same ones; neither does Hornby anymore.
>>
>> 2) I could try that, but then I'd have filed frogs.
>
> place forever. So you file it now and then it moves and requires
> further modification or replacement. So recon first glue it as flat as
> possible then see if filing required.
>
> The best action however, is as said, for you to get rid of Hornby
> points, at the same time move up a radius so more engines can use the
> fiddle yard. Pin new track, play with it, glue new track, remove pins
> (if you want to).
Problem is, space is very tight, which is why I used 1st radius points.
If I changed them, I'd have to completely relay the fiddle yard, maybe
lose one siding, and they'd be shorter.
--
Martin S.
Graham Thurlwell
<snip>
> My Bachmann J74, with its now burned out motor, was problem-free when new.
Assuming you mean the J72, that's actually the most frustrating thing
about them. They're beautiful runners and then they just suddenly
start to fail.
--
Jades' First Encounters Site - http://www.jades.org/ffe.htm
The best Frontier: First Encounters site on the Web.
nos...@jades.org is currently broken, please reply on group!
MartinS
> MartinS <m...@my.place> wrote:
>
> <snip>
>
>> My Bachmann J74, with its now burned out motor, was problem-free when
>> new.
>
> Assuming you mean the J72, that's actually the most frustrating thing
> about them. They're beautiful runners and then they just suddenly
> start to fail.
I guess I do. Mine started to emit smoke from the cab. Found there was
arcing from the frame to the commutator. Finally got so hot it melted.
--
Martin S.
simon
"MartinS" <m...@my.place> wrote in message
Understand, its a balence that only you can decide. Could a 3-way point help
?
Cheers,
Simon
MartinS
> point help ?
Only if the 3 are all curved the same way!
--
Martin S.
Graham Thurlwell
Funny thing is, none of ours burnt out. Every single casualty appears
to have been the axles failing. They start to click while running,
then the click becomes a clunk and finally a ludicrously loud bang
before the bloody things stop running at all.
It's such a shame as the bodies are bloody good and compare well to
photographs - I compared the Mainline J72 body [1] I have with the
photos of the real engine in Vol. 43A of Yeadon's Register and I'm
hard-pressed to find much difference.
I heard a rumour recently that Bachmann are planning on developing new
chassis for all of their older LNER models. Not before time.
Notes:-
1. The one I'm planning to convert to a J71 using the Mainly Trains
conversion kit I mentioned on this group a while back.
John Turner
"Graham Thurlwell" wrote
> Assuming you mean the J72, that's actually the most frustrating thing
> about them. They're beautiful runners and then they just suddenly
> start to fail.
Everything mechanical fails at some time; in fact I becoming increasingly
convinced that many items (outside the model railway field) are designed to
fail much more quickly than in the past.
My pet (non-mechanical) hate is toothbrushes that seem to last a week or
less before becoming unusable, but it does guarantee I buy lots of them.
John.
simon
"John Turner" <nos...@nospam.invalid> wrote in message
news:8ZCdnUxPfpOCw2TX...@supernews.com...
>
> My pet (non-mechanical) hate is toothbrushes that seem to last a week or
> less before becoming unusable, but it does guarantee I buy lots of them.
>
> John.
Mine equiv hate is items that are unusable cos one part has failed and it
cannot be replaced. Typical is taps that leak.
Cheers,
Simon
Wolf K
> "Graham Thurlwell" wrote
>
>> Assuming you mean the J72, that's actually the most frustrating thing
>> about them. They're beautiful runners and then they just suddenly
>> start to fail.
>
> Everything mechanical fails at some time; in fact I becoming increasingly
> convinced that many items (outside the model railway field) are designed to
> fail much more quickly than in the past.
They're designed a) for replacement, not repair, and b) to fail all at
once, since it makes no sense to include parts of different design
lifetimes when the item will not be repaired.
And there _is_ a difference in electronic parts. They are produced by
the tens of thousands by machine. Random sample testing (using Bayesian
probability, if you want to know) grades the batches, and the batches
that are more likely to contain more than a specified percentage of bad
parts are sold for less. Manufacturers (such as Bachmann) that must meet
a price point will buy the cheaper parts. That's why so much consumer
product fails. It's cheaper for them to replace or repair items than to
buy more expensive parts. And of course they set the warranty period to
ensure that most failures will occur well after it.
cheers
wolf k.
beamends
> "Graham Thurlwell" wrote
>
>> Assuming you mean the J72, that's actually the most frustrating thing
>> about them. They're beautiful runners and then they just suddenly start
>> to fail.
>
> Everything mechanical fails at some time; in fact I becoming
> increasingly convinced that many items (outside the model railway field)
> are designed to fail much more quickly than in the past.
>
You are quite right to think that - products, both electronic and
mechanical, are designed to have a specific life-span, invariably based
on the warranty period. It might sound like manufacturers are pulling a
fast one (which is true to some extent - the milk float manufacturers all
went bust because milk floats simply never needed replacing, so when
everyone had one there was no market for new ones) but it's also down to
us. A resistor costing 0.1p may have a Mean Time Between Failures of,
say, 1000 hours, meaning some will fail immediately (around 5%), the
majority (90%) will survive the whole 1000 hours (or long enough for
warranty anyway), and some (the remaining 5%) will work "forever". A 1p
resistor may "never" fail, and a 2p resistor will be guaranteed to work
and last (and be a much more accurate value), having been tested after
manufacture. The trouble is, if we see a radio going for 10 quid (cheap
and cheerful) or 15 quid (with 2p resistors in it) we always go for the
cheap one and are then surprised when it fails. The same goes for washing
machines - I know a bod who used to work for Creda at Blythe Bridge (now
made overseas), and he was adamant that for 50 quid extra they could make
a machine that would last "a lifetime", but there was no point when £5
means the difference between a machine selling or not.
It's one of the things that we should really be looking at to protect the
environment, and conspicuously don't. How much better it would be if,
rather than worrying about re-cycling so much, we insisted products were
better made thereby reducing the need to re-cycle in the first place. Ok,
the young couple setting up home night struggle to buy themselves a nice
new shiny washing machine (just like in the good old days!!), but how
much better that would be than having to worry that, as the machine is 3
years old, it's going to fail any time now?
> My pet (non-mechanical) hate is toothbrushes that seem to last a week or
> less before becoming unusable, but it does guarantee I buy lots of them.
>
It's not just you there either - I've got quite a collection of duff ones
too. I now use the good old Mk. 1 hand driven model ;-) I've also got a
ruck of B&Q and Silverline (same thing, different label) soldering irons
that were about as much use as an ashtray on a motorbike....
> John.
Cheers
Richard
--
I have become...............comfortably numb
Greg.Procter
Ahh, now that's a different problem! At least MY Peco points have
always been flat to start with.
I pin them so that they sit where they should be while I ballast and glue
them.
The pins are then superfluous and get pulled out. If you're quick enough
the
pin holes in the plastic close up again.
The remaining problem is that the frogs are usually not level with the
running
rails, so far they have always been high, so the sharpening stone treatment
has always worked. Ditto for GF and several other brands.
Greg.P.
Greg.Procter
Under those circumstances you _really_ need flat turnouts.
Try not to sit on them in the car on the way home!
;-)
Greg.P.
Greg.Procter
It's quite practical to trim turnouts considerably so that tracks can be
closer.
I have tracks at about 45mm spacing in my straight fiddle yard.
Don't trim closer than two rigid sleepers to the points end (one past the
spring pivot on Peco turnouts) I use a Dremel to cut fishplates to half
length
so that the sleeper rail fixings can remain in place.
The shorter curve allows marginal locos to get through ie like a large
radius turnout.
Greg.P.
simon
Now thats a good idea !
Cheers,
Simon
MartinS
Well, if you will buy them in bulk at Poundstretchers, what do you expect?
--
Martin S.
MartinS
> "John Turner" <nos...@nospam.invalid> wrote...
>>
>> My pet (non-mechanical) hate is toothbrushes that seem to last a week
>> or less before becoming unusable, but it does guarantee I buy lots of
>> them.
>>
> Mine equiv hate is items that are unusable cos one part has failed and
> it cannot be replaced. Typical is taps that leak.
I have one of those - an outside hose tap. The screw holding the washer is
seized, and the new type is a different design so I have to buy a whole
new tap instead of just a washer, then find the propane torch and solder.
--
Martin S.
MartinS
>> points. If I changed them, I'd have to completely relay the fiddle
>> yard, maybe lose one siding, and they'd be shorter.
>
> It's quite practical to trim turnouts considerably so that tracks can
> be closer.
> I have tracks at about 45mm spacing in my straight fiddle yard.
> Don't trim closer than two rigid sleepers to the points end (one past
> the spring pivot on Peco turnouts) I use a Dremel to cut fishplates to
> half length so that the sleeper rail fixings can remain in place.
> The shorter curve allows marginal locos to get through ie like a large
> radius turnout.
I have six fiddle tracks at 48mm spacing (the width of a cork ballast
strip) achieved through a combination of first and second radius curved
points, to maximise the length of the straight storage tracks within the
main oval on my 6' x 8' baseboard.
--
Martin S.
John Turner
"MartinS" wrote
> Well, if you will buy them in bulk at Poundstretchers, what do you expect?
Funny that, becuae it doesn't seem to matter how much I spend, they rarely
last more than a week. The best ones I've had recently (Wisdom) were from
Poundland in Scunthorpe - two for a quid - and the first of them is still
going strong after three weeks!!!
John.