WEED - HELP NEEDED - HORSETAIL!!!!!
Philip Goldspink
one particular weed which seems to form an underground network of roots. I
am told by other allotment holders that its common name is horsetail.Does
anyone know how I can get rid of it please????
Phil Goldspink
Lowestoft, Suffolk
Paul
>I have recently acquired an allotment but I'm having problems in eradicating
>one particular weed which seems to form an underground network of roots. I
>am told by other allotment holders that its common name is horsetail.Does
>anyone know how I can get rid of it please????
>
miniture Christmas trees with 'branches' radiating from a cenral stem. It
is extremly difficult to keep under control. I don't like to be a wet
blanket but acquiring a different allotment is one very good solution.
Others in this n.g. recomend glycophosphate IIRC Spray the plant, cover it
with an upside down plastic food bag then scrunch up the leaves and leave
the bag in place till it dies.
HTH
Paul
North Wales
Phil Cooper
down for over 6 ft is still alive. The only answer is keep repeating the
treatment you mentioned over and over again until the horsetail gets tired
of it (you may reach that point first, then apply Paul's first suggestion
and move - preferaby a good distance away!)
Phil
Aonghas P MacKenzie
from "Philip Goldspink" <Philip.G...@tesco.net> contains these words:
> I have recently acquired an allotment but I'm having problems in eradicating
> one particular weed which seems to form an underground network of roots. I
> am told by other allotment holders that its common name is horsetail.Does
> anyone know how I can get rid of it please????
> Phil Goldspink
> Lowestoft, Suffolk
Pity you're in Lowestoft and not in a region where there is gold -
horsetails take up gold in their root system and it is sometimes
viable to extract this from the ash of the burnt plants.
One way you would get rid of them (eventually) is to dig out as much
of the root as you can from each sprout as it appears. It will become
exhausted and die, but you have to be on the ball and remove every
bit before it has a chance to replenish the energy expended in
pushing up the new sprouts.
Don't expect to eradicate them within a year!
--
Aonghas Mackenzie
Kieth Naylor
Philip Goldspink <Philip.G...@tesco.net> wrote in article
<6ug0mn$7k7$1...@barcode.tesco.net>...
> I have recently acquired an allotment but I'm having problems in
eradicating
> one particular weed which seems to form an underground network of roots.
I
> am told by other allotment holders that its common name is horsetail.Does
> anyone know how I can get rid of it please????
>
> Phil Goldspink
> Lowestoft, Suffolk
Sorry to hear of your situation - I sympathise!
I have the same problem and have found that the only effective way of
combating horsetail is to dig, dig and then dig some more.
In my case, the weed is invading from next door and I have managed to keep
it under control by using a glyphosphate spray and then breaking the soil
around the weed and following its roots and digging it up without breaking
it (because they will root and shoot).
You will learn a lot about how it spreads in this exercise and once you
understand what it's trying to do (it usually spreads in a straight line
away from the parent plant) it's easier to track and control.
In terms of the root depth, I have found that it rarely goes deeper than 2
spades depth (but this will depend on the type of soil you have). You can
also leave the root exposed and spray that with a glyphosphate based weed
killer.
I have been undertaking this task for the past two summers so you can see
it can be quite a task. And I have also informed my neighbours of the
wonders of weed control, which also helps.
Alan Beech
I would give up now. I found out about Horse (Mares) tail the hard way.
I bought a nice house with huge garden only to find that the previous owners
had had a gardener in to remove the sight and presence of this thing. Two
weeks after moving in we were swamped with the stuff. I would now kill the
previous owners or take them to court for fraud.
I have tried Glycophosphate over about three years with some success. I
have had better results with something called Casoron G4 which although
expensive seems to work and is specific for marestail. But hard to find.
If anyone knows the active ingredient in G4 please let me know so I can buy
more cheaply.
Best practice I have found is to:-
1) Strim it down to about 4 inches so that you can still see where it is
2) Double dig over the borders to remove as much root as possible ( my
aching back...oy veh!)
3) If it's a new border I have covered with a plastic sheet after digging
and planted through this....then after three years removed the plastic
4) Keep applying your chosen chemical...do not let up at all and don't go on
holiday because it keeps growing
5) Lots of spot application of systemic chemicals
6) Be very rigorous about not letting even the smallest bit get into your
compost or you will inadvertently be spreading the thing about
7) Only give plants as gifts to those you dislike as the root ball soil is
probably infected with bits of root.
8) Become rich by inventing a way to kill this thing.
After all this ( and I have now 10 years experience of this thing in a big
garden) I would say MOVE now or be prepared for a lifetime battle.
Marion, my wife, finds great fun in this of course and last birthday bought
me a baseball cap embroidered with WW3 -MT for Mares Tail. The fight goes
on....I'm off to go do battle.
Lots of Sympathy
Alan
Kieth Naylor
> I would give up now.
Awh! Don't be such a pessimist. Think of it more as a challenge ;-)
> Best practice I have found is to:-
>
> 1) Strim it down to about 4 inches so that you can still see where it is
NO! Never strim it! Each part of the horsetail is capable of rooting and
spreading. If you're strimming, you're spreading it all over the place!
> 2) Double dig over the borders to remove as much root as possible ( my
> aching back...oy veh!)
> 3) If it's a new border I have covered with a plastic sheet after digging
> and planted through this....then after three years removed the plastic
Yes, this works well. It doesn't kill it but it does keep it under control
until you find something that really will kill it.
> 4) Keep applying your chosen chemical...do not let up at all and don't go
on
> holiday because it keeps growing
> 5) Lots of spot application of systemic chemicals
Yes and when you dig it up it will appear as if it is a small damp twig.
Do not think it is dead. If you peel back the dark outer layer, you will
see that the inside is ready to root. Don't forget that this plant has
been with us since the dinosaurs so a little bit of digging and modern
chemicals will not phase it!
> 6) Be very rigorous about not letting even the smallest bit get into your
> compost or you will inadvertently be spreading the thing about
Refer your point 1 above!
> 7) Only give plants as gifts to those you dislike as the root ball soil
is
> probably infected with bits of root.
> 8) Become rich by inventing a way to kill this thing.
>
> After all this ( and I have now 10 years experience of this thing in a
big
> garden) I would say MOVE now or be prepared for a lifetime battle.
Yes, that's true!
Aonghas P MacKenzie
from "Kieth Naylor" <Kieth....@btinternet.com> contains these words:
/snip/
> In terms of the root depth, I have found that it rarely goes deeper than 2
> spades depth (but this will depend on the type of soil you have). You can
> also leave the root exposed and spray that with a glyphosphate based weed
> killer.
/snip/
Sorry to be a wet blanket, but the roots can go down eight feet at least.
--
Aonghas Mackenzie
Aonghas P MacKenzie
from "Alan Beech" <a...@talktech.telinco.com> contains these words:
/snip/
> After all this ( and I have now 10 years experience of this thing in a big
> garden) I would say MOVE now or be prepared for a lifetime battle.
> Marion, my wife, finds great fun in this of course and last birthday bought
> me a baseball cap embroidered with WW3 -MT for Mares Tail. The fight goes
> on....I'm off to go do battle.
> Lots of Sympathy
> Alan
Have you tried spraying with detergent to allow the shoots to be
wetted then spraying with Roundup? I got rid of (admittedly) a small
patch that way with two applications.
--
Aonghas Mackenzie
Kieth Naylor
Aonghas P MacKenzie <an.b...@zetnet.co.uk> wrote in article
<199809261...@zetnet.co.uk>...
I don't deny it, but I don't think it can always be the case and it doesn't
stop me trying to control the weed problem.
As you can see, I did say that it depends on the kind of soil you have -
heavy, clay like soils *do* tend to prevent such weeds spreading because
they are programmed to take the path of least resistance to ensure their
survival - through the much softer and richer soil at the surface which
contains the most recent sources of nutrients.
In the case of an allotment, I would have to assume that the soil would
have been well tended for a period of years and that the roots would be
spreading in this way. The worst case scenarios that everyone seems to
present of this weed *might* therefore not be applicable. My garden has
been tended as a vegetable and flower border over a number of years and I
have found that the roots of the horsetail spread horizontally precisely
because of the conditions I mentioned and I would hope that this is how I
have managed to contain it within a defined area (although not kill it
off).
But at the end of the day, a question was asked. I was trying to provide
an answer to the original posting based on *my* experience (which I will
admit does not match your experience).
I also thought that it would be helpful to provide a more positive response
other than "just give up" which I wouldn't expect to receive off other
keen(?) gardeners.
Alan Beech
>>> 1) Strim it down to about 4 inches so that you can still see where it is
NO! Never strim it! Each part of the horsetail is capable of rooting and
spreading. If you're strimming, you're spreading it all over the place!<<<
I'm not sure why I wrote that. I used to do this for only one season about
5 years ago and as you say strimming definitely broadcasts the stuff.
What I now do is cut it cleanly off in small areas of say 2 sq. yards,
gather it up in specially allocated black sacks and burn it later.
>>>Digging::::Yes, this works well. It doesn't kill it but it does keep it
under control
until you find something that really will kill it.<<<
Right but the problem for me is to do with the size of the plot and time
available. I have almost eradicated it from the front of the house.
Continuous digging plus spot treatment as soon as the first new "twigglets"
become visible seems to weaken it over a period of about 5 years. But at
the rear there are a few areas which I have yet to really do more than
weaken it.
Thinking about your point above, the success started to come when I realised
that taking the view that I needed to maintain a very clean working approach
to each area so as to minimise the potential for cross infection.
>>>>Do not think it is dead. If you peel back the dark outer layer, you
will
see that the inside is ready to root. <<<
Yup its easy to underestimate the blighters capacity to survive the most
alien and hard environment.
>>>> 6) Be very rigorous about not letting even the smallest bit get into
your
compost or you will inadvertently be spreading the thing about. Refer your
point 1 above!. <<<
What I now do is spend dedicated periods of time just dealing with
Marestail. That way I can keep all of the bits separate, bag it up and
spend time collecting the remains.....cleanliness in all things here. I
bought a second hand B&D leaf blower/sucker and use this ONLY for Marestail
which has been extracted.
alan
Alan Gould
<Kieth....@btinternet.com> writes
snip....
>I also thought that it would be helpful to provide a more positive response
>other than "just give up" which I wouldn't expect to receive off other
>keen(?) gardeners.
I thought that the suggestion of 'giving up' was in respect of not
taking on an alottment which had a serious problem with horsetail.
That seems to make sense, but if the problem appeared in someone's own
garden it would need to be tackled in some way. We have never had to
deal with horsetail as such, but there are various persistent plants
which can make life very tedious for the gardener. The long term answer
is often patience and soil management.
In our case, we have permanently resident cow parsley growing in areas
where it doesn't cause much problem to us. We also have twitch grass
which if left unattended will take over vegetable or flower beds. We
have plenty of nettles and comfrey which we see as a valuable resource
for compost, but other gardeners would prefer to be without.
Quite a few of these seemingly indefatigable plants will not survive
repeated cultivation and hoeing if they are in growing areas. Others
will not survive repeated mowing if they are in a lawn. In the case of
twitch grass which had taken over and area where I wanted to grow
vegetables, I had to spend a lot of time going over it picking out the
roots from the soil. Now the patch is in production and I keep an eye
out for odd growths of twitch which escaped my attention. I have another
patch covered with black plastic which I am hoping will shade out the
unwanted plants in 12-18 months.
--
Alan and Joan Gould
paulw...@my-dejanews.com
> I bought a nice house with huge garden only to find that the previous owners
> had had a gardener in to remove the sight and presence of this thing. Two
> weeks after moving in we were swamped with the stuff. I would now kill the
> previous owners or take them to court for fraud.
I think it depends on your access to the plant, and what you can do.
To expand - I cannot concieve of a weed that would survive (say) 3
years thorough fallowing (or the more-or-less equivalent old carpet,
black polythene). But you can't always do that.
No-one has trouble with any of the "nightmare three" (bindweed, ground elder,
horsetail) on their lawn, because none of them can survive being cut
off to half-inch or less once a week. (Alan J Holmes, take note).
Most people just cannot face howing a bare-soil bed this thoroughly;
on a lawn it's a side effect.
It only gets tricky if there are other plants. I have ground-elder in a bed
of shrubs (berberis, confier, yews, heathers etc). I expect
to ALWAYS have it. I cannot think of a method other than clear
felling, that would to the job.
In the case of an allotment, the drastic (or at least extreme) approach is
to spend at least a year weed-clearing (fire, chemical, somthering, hoeing
- whatever). Otherwise you are pulling in 2 directions:
trying to be nice to your veggies, whilst trying to be nasty to your weeds.
Simplify matters. I'm sorry this means a dull year, but I believe it's
your only chance.
BugBear.
-----== Posted via Deja News, The Leader in Internet Discussion ==-----
http://www.dejanews.com/rg_mkgrp.xp Create Your Own Free Member Forum
Alan J Holmes
<paulw...@my-dejanews.com> wrote:
>In article <6uiscu$fat$1...@news3.cableinet.co.uk>,
> "Alan Beech" <a...@talktech.telinco.com> wrote:
>> Phillip,
>> I would give up now. I found out about Horse (Mares) tail the hard way.
>> I bought a nice house with huge garden only to find that the previous owners
>> had had a gardener in to remove the sight and presence of this thing. Two
>> weeks after moving in we were swamped with the stuff. I would now kill the
>> previous owners or take them to court for fraud.
>I think it depends on your access to the plant, and what you can do.
>To expand - I cannot concieve of a weed that would survive (say) 3
>years thorough fallowing (or the more-or-less equivalent old carpet,
>black polythene). But you can't always do that.
>No-one has trouble with any of the "nightmare three" (bindweed, ground elder,
>horsetail) on their lawn, because none of them can survive being cut
>off to half-inch or less once a week. (Alan J Holmes, take note).
Doesn't work on either clover or daisies!
--
Alan G4CRW, Ex FAA, RNARS and others!
Here I sit, giving the world the benefit of my words of wit and wisdom!
What an exciting life I lead!(:-)
Aonghas P MacKenzie
from xxx...@brunel.ac.uk (Alan J Holmes) contains these words:
> Doesn't work on either clover or daisies!
> --
> Alan G4CRW, Ex FAA, RNARS and others!
> Here I sit, giving the world the benefit of my words of wit and wisdom!
> What an exciting life I lead!(:-)
Yes it does, but you must turn the turf and mow the roots. ;-p
--
Aonghas Mackenzie
paulw...@my-dejanews.com
xxx...@brunel.ac.uk (Alan J Holmes) wrote:
> In article <6unlco$qsb$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>,
> <paulw...@my-dejanews.com> wrote:
> >In article <6uiscu$fat$1...@news3.cableinet.co.uk>,
> > "Alan Beech" <a...@talktech.telinco.com> wrote:
>
> >No-one has trouble with any of the "nightmare three" (bindweed, ground elder,
> >horsetail) on their lawn, because none of them can survive being cut
> >off to half-inch or less once a week. (Alan J Holmes, take note).
>
> Doesn't work on either clover or daisies!
Doesn't work oak trees either.
I sometimes suspect you Alan, of never conceding a point on anything. I was
referring (of course) to a previous thread on disposing of bindweed
without chemicals, by repeasted hoeing. Your comment on clover and daisies,
(whilst trivially true) is not what I was talking about.
Peter Matthews
<Philip.G...@tesco.net> writes
>I have recently acquired an allotment but I'm having problems in eradicating
>one particular weed which seems to form an underground network of roots. I
>am told by other allotment holders that its common name is horsetail.Does
>anyone know how I can get rid of it please????
>
>Phil Goldspink
>Lowestoft, Suffolk
>
>
month then dig out as much as you can and burn it. The root system of
horsetail forms a network between two and ten feet down and you need a
strong dose to kill it. I would also recommend waiting until May before
planting anything and give the area a second spray with Roundup in
April.
The root system can survive underground for over five years even when
the surface is covered.
Alternatively you could harvest it and make your own fungicide to
control mildew and rust on crops.
Recipe courtesy of Roy Lacey's Book Organic Gardening.
Collect the foliage stems and rhizomes and for each 28 grams (1oz) pour
on 1.1 litres of hot water and allow to stand for 24 hours, strain off
the liquid into a suitable container and us it undiluted.
Regards
--
Peter Matthews
Alan Beech
thought of it before and detergent is cheap anyway. Thanks
Alan
Aonghas P MacKenzie
from Peter Matthews <pe...@mattsimm.demon.co.uk> contains these words:
\snip\
> Collect the foliage stems and rhizomes and for each 28 grams (1oz) pour
> on 1.1 litres of hot water and allow to stand for 24 hours, strain off
> the liquid into a suitable container and us it undiluted.
> Regards
> --
> Peter Matthews
You realise that under new EC regulations it is illegal to use this
brew unless it has been rigorously and expensively tested? <G>
--
Aonghas Mackenzie
Aonghas P MacKenzie
from spa...@Pemberton.u-net.com (Alan Pemberton) contains these words:
> Aonghas P MacKenzie <an.b...@zetnet.co.uk> wrote:
> > Pity you're in Lowestoft and not in a region where there is gold -
> > horsetails take up gold in their root system and it is sometimes
> > viable to extract this from the ash of the burnt plants.
> Can you tell us more about this? I thought that plants can only take up
> elements in solution, and as far as I know gold is only soluble in a
> mixture of concentrated hydrochloric and nitric acids ("aqua regia").
> In what form is the gold recovered from the ashes?
> --
> Alan Pemberton
Something I read in (IIRC) the New Scientist many years ago. I think
that the roots take up gold fluoride. (HF eats gold, as well as
glass, tantalum, niobium, and is extremely unhelpful to health if it
gets in contact with the skin.)
--
Aonghas Mackenzie
Alan J Holmes
> from xxx...@brunel.ac.uk (Alan J Holmes) contains these words:
>> Doesn't work on either clover or daisies!
> Yes it does, but you must turn the turf and mow the roots. ;-p
Silly me, why didn't I think of that!(:-)
Alan J Holmes
<paulw...@my-dejanews.com> wrote:
>In article <6unrj1$s69$1...@loki.brunel.ac.uk>,
> xxx...@brunel.ac.uk (Alan J Holmes) wrote:
>> In article <6unlco$qsb$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>,
>> <paulw...@my-dejanews.com> wrote:
>> >In article <6uiscu$fat$1...@news3.cableinet.co.uk>,
>> > "Alan Beech" <a...@talktech.telinco.com> wrote:
>> >No-one has trouble with any of the "nightmare three" (bindweed, ground elder,
>> >horsetail) on their lawn, because none of them can survive being cut
>> >off to half-inch or less once a week. (Alan J Holmes, take note).
>> Doesn't work on either clover or daisies!
>Doesn't work oak trees either.
Oh dear, and there was me thinking that if you were to cut down an
oak tree to within a half inch it would die!(:-)
>I sometimes suspect you Alan, of never conceding a point on anything. I was
>referring (of course) to a previous thread on disposing of bindweed
>without chemicals, by repeasted hoeing. Your comment on clover and daisies,
>(whilst trivially true) is not what I was talking about.
Ah, I thought your note for me to take note was based on somethng
I'd said about lawn weeds earlier.
helen....@nri.org
> > >No-one has trouble with any of the "nightmare three" (bindweed, ground
elder,
> > >horsetail) on their lawn, because none of them can survive being cut
> > >off to half-inch or less once a week. (Alan J Holmes, take note).
We're supposed to mow the lawn once a _week_ ???
helen
Victoria Clare
>wetted then spraying with Roundup? I got rid of (admittedly) a small
>patch that way with two applications.
Much sympathy for your horsetail problem - fear I have no direct
experience of the dreaded weed, but I thought I would just mention a
tip I saw on some gardening program. Apparently if you have a dry
plot and are in an area with regular hosepipe bans, horsetail can be a
positive boon. It acts as a watering device - cut the tails off
regularly at ground level and they wll apparently go on syphoning
water to the surface for some time until they 'realise' that it's
spilling onto the ground.
Not much use this soggy year, but maybe someone with major horsetail
problems might try it if we actually get a summer in 1999?
Victoria
--
vict...@nogrod.u-net.com
http://www.nogrod.u-net.com/
--
Aonghas P MacKenzie
from spa...@Pemberton.u-net.com (Alan Pemberton) contains these words:
> I'd forgotten about HF. When I was doing 'A' level chemistry it was one
> of our fantasy compounds. The applications we devised for it don't bear
> thinking about! I bet it would clear a lawn faster than verdone, and I'd
> like to see what it does to slugs :-)
> --
> Alan Pemberton
Having had a few small drops of HF splash up and run down my visor
onto my chest while I was stirring 500 gallons of the stuff, I can
even empathise with slugs: washed it off AQAP and straight down to
the sick-bay, where a bubble of sodium glutamo glutamate solution was
raised under the skin on the affected spot. Nasty, the waiting to see
if it had worked, if you know what it does!
--
Aonghas Mackenzie
Sarah Kendrew
against this monster will undoubtedly get the Nobel Prize for horticulture
( come on Monsanto - if you can do something as wonderful as Roundup you
should think of marestail as a real challenge!!). I have had some success
with a pruduct marketed under the name of DINET in Belgium. It is a bramble
and nettle killer basically. They were killed and have not come up again so
far - but before we cry eureka let's wait until next year. On a very small
scale you can make a hollow around the point where it goes into the ground
and pour boiling water in - I did this a couple of years ago and I don't
think it came back, but I admit that this was not done very scientifically.
My specialised book on weeds says that if you've got a serious problem with
marestail the best sokution is to move house!!!!!. Bind weed and ground
elder will easily succomb to roundup by the way.
KAREN MOUNTFORD
I called in at Langthorns nursery last week as I was passing and they
were SELLING a variety of marestail. I can't recall the species name
but it looked like BIGGER and FATTER stems! To be fair they had
labelled it with something like "can be somewaht invasive" ! I couldn't
believe my eyes!
Karen
Remove "greenweed" to e-mail.
hul...@googlemail.com
> I have recently acquired an allotment but I'm having problems in eradicating
> one particular weed which seems to form an underground network of roots. I
> am told by other allotment holders that its common name is horsetail.Does
> anyone know how I can get rid of it please????
>
> Phil Goldspink
> Lowestoft, Suffolk
This method entails not digging over the topsoil as normally done in autumn, just top up the manure blanket annually by 50-75mm depth. The horsetail roots are still underground but I was told that after 3 of 4 years denial of light the roots should be exhausted.
Phil, Manchester
Martin Brown
> On Friday, September 25, 1998 8:00:00 AM UTC+1, Philip Goldspink wrote:
>> I have recently acquired an allotment but I'm having problems in eradicating
>> one particular weed which seems to form an underground network of roots. I
>> am told by other allotment holders that its common name is horsetail.Does
>> anyone know how I can get rid of it please????
followed by glyphosate. It is almost impossible to eradicate but you can
reduce its vigour to a manageable level in a couple of seasons.
>
> I'm in my second year on an allotment with a big horsetail problem. On our allotment we get a plentiful supply of horse manure, and I have a laid a blanket of it about 150 - 200mm thick over the horsetail. The horsetail gets smothered and very little of it then comes through. I just dig through the manure where I want to put in plants. The manure also feeds the soil and helps retain moisture.
>
> This method entails not digging over the topsoil as normally done in autumn, just top up the manure blanket annually by 50-75mm depth. The horsetail roots are still underground but I was told that after 3 of 4 years denial of light the roots should be exhausted.
>
> Phil, Manchester
--
Regards,
Martin Brown