Victoria Plum and Rhizomes.
Steen Jensen
A colleague at work today told me that his Victoria plum tree had set
rhizomes all over his garden.
This happy tree was origanally bought as a dwarf plum but has since
grown to giant proportions. As a result my friend has pruned some of the
main branches so he could walk around his garden without getting
concussed.
How does he get rid of the unwanted root system propagating new plum
trees in his garden?
Can they be cut at the trunk and then left to die or does he have to dig
them up? I suspect this may entail excavating the lawn and the garden
path!
Are there any chemical remedies? this man is wholly unscrupolous.
I was'nt aware that plum trees propagated like this, what would trigger
such a response? could it be pruning main stems?
All these questions, TIA :)
--
Steen Jensen - * They don't make games for my PC anymore *
Watford,
Herts, U.K.
Nick Maclaren
In article <MmfqnAA5...@piper.demon.co.uk>, Steen Jensen <st...@piper.demon.co.uk> writes:
|> A colleague at work today told me that his Victoria plum tree had set
|> rhizomes all over his garden.
If this were true, he could get a paper to Nature out of it! I am
afraid that he should invest in a gardening reference or two. Plums
don't produce rhizomes. He probably means suckers.
|> This happy tree was origanally bought as a dwarf plum but has since
|> grown to giant proportions. As a result my friend has pruned some of the
|> main branches so he could walk around his garden without getting
|> concussed.
That sounds as if he was swindled.
|> How does he get rid of the unwanted root system propagating new plum
|> trees in his garden?
With difficulty, unless he is prepared to kill the plum.
|> Can they be cut at the trunk and then left to die or does he have to dig
|> them up? I suspect this may entail excavating the lawn and the garden
|> path!
Yes, provided that they haven't established themselves as separate
plants, but remember that they may start from deep roots.
|> Are there any chemical remedies? this man is wholly unscrupolous.
Some herbicides (brushwood killers etc.) are described as being useful
for this, but I suspect that it is tricky to gauge the amount precisely
enough to kill the suckers without killing the tree.
|> I was'nt aware that plum trees propagated like this, what would trigger
|> such a response? could it be pruning main stems?
Yes. But it sounds as if the plum had been grafted onto an
inappropriate rootstock in the first place.
Nick Maclaren,
University of Cambridge Computer Laboratory,
New Museums Site, Pembroke Street, Cambridge CB2 3QG, England.
Email: nm...@cam.ac.uk
Tel.: +44 1223 334761 Fax: +44 1223 334679
Alan J Holmes
In article <MmfqnAA5...@piper.demon.co.uk>,
Steen Jensen <st...@piper.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>A colleague at work today told me that his Victoria plum tree had set
>rhizomes all over his garden.
>This happy tree was origanally bought as a dwarf plum but has since
>grown to giant proportions. As a result my friend has pruned some of the
>main branches so he could walk around his garden without getting
>concussed.
If he had properly pruned the thing each year it would be still
at a managable height.
>How does he get rid of the unwanted root system propagating new plum
>trees in his garden?
SBK.
>Can they be cut at the trunk and then left to die or does he have to dig
>them up? I suspect this may entail excavating the lawn and the garden
>path!
Just spray with SBK.
>Are there any chemical remedies? this man is wholly unscrupolous.
SBK!
>I was'nt aware that plum trees propagated like this, what would trigger
>such a response? could it be pruning main stems?
Usually it's the result of damage to the root system.
Whilst we are on the subject of pruning! Well weren't we?
I have an espalier apple, which is some years old, and has
suffered from not being well cared for whilst in it's early
stages of growth, (no it wasn't me!). I would like to
completely reshape it by cutting the trunk and allowing new
shoots to sprout.
The BIG question is, at what time of the year should I give it a
very short back-and-sides?
Alan
Nick Vincent
On 28 Jan 1997 13:05:46 -0000, Alan....@brunel.ac.uk (Alan J
Holmes) wrote:
>In article <MmfqnAA5...@piper.demon.co.uk>,
>Steen Jensen <st...@piper.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>>A colleague at work today told me that his Victoria plum tree had set
>>rhizomes all over his garden.
<varied text on plum suckers snipped - or should that be pruned? >
>
>>Are there any chemical remedies? this man is wholly unscrupolous.
>
>SBK!
>
I'd be very careful of using SBK to kill suckers, it's strong stuff -
I've used it in the past to kill a tree stump!
>>I was'nt aware that plum trees propagated like this, what would trigger
>>such a response? could it be pruning main stems?
>
>Usually it's the result of damage to the root system.
>
I agree - if the tree is in a lawn you can easily damage the surface
roots by mowing the grass too short - leading to sucker formation.
Dig down to where the sucker joins the root - pull the sucker off,
then to discourage regrowth carefully brush on some ammonium
sulphamate.
>Whilst we are on the subject of pruning! Well weren't we?
>
>I have an espalier apple, which is some years old, and has
>suffered from not being well cared for whilst in it's early
>stages of growth, (no it wasn't me!). I would like to
>completely reshape it by cutting the trunk and allowing new
>shoots to sprout.
>
>The BIG question is, at what time of the year should I give it a
>very short back-and-sides?
>
>Alan
>
NOW! this will encourage the new shoot growth you need in the spring
- but if you're going to be that drastic why not start again from
scratch with a new tree? You'll lose several seasons of fruit bearing
whilst training in a new espalier structure, whereas a young partly
trained tree from a nursery will give you fruit in a couple of years.
Why do I say this? I had the same situation with a similar badly
pruned apple tree (imagine a pollarded apple with a trunk 8 feet tall)
that I tried for three years to prune back into shape, until I decided
to go for a new tree.
Nick
Steen Jensen
In article <5cktja$s...@loki.brunel.ac.uk>, Alan J Holmes
<Alan....@brunel.ac.uk> writes
>As a result my friend has pruned some of the
>>main branches so he could walk around his garden without getting
>>concussed.
>
>If he had properly pruned the thing each year it would be still
>at a managable height.
I'm not experienced at pruning plums because I don't grow them :(
I've heard several versions about what you should do i.e.
Prune them in November,
Prune them in spring but only lightly and never cut the main branches,
or you don't really need to prune them.
Is there a definitive method and time to apply the shears?
My friends tree was bought as a Dwarf but as Nick mentioned it may have
been grown on an inappropriate rootstock
>SBK.
>Just spray with SBK.
>SBK!
>
Whats SBK, how is it obtained and do you have shares in it? ;)
>I have an espalier apple,
Can't help I'm afraid but good luck with it anyway.
Best Regards,
Steen Jensen
In article <5ckp3t$i...@lyra.csx.cam.ac.uk>, Nick Maclaren
<nm...@cus.cam.ac.uk> writes
>|> A colleague at work today told me that his Victoria plum tree had set
>|> rhizomes all over his garden.
>
>afraid that he should invest in a gardening reference or two. Plums
>don't produce rhizomes. He probably means suckers.
>
Yup, this is my interpretation, Nick, Rhizome as in 'subterranean
rootlike stem emitting both roots and shoots'. (OED).
Suckers read as 'shoot springing from subterranean part of stem, from
part of root remote from main stem, from axil, or abnormally from bole
or branch'(OED)
Having looked it up I'm sure you're right and I'll refer to them as
suckers from now on.
One thing that puzzles me tho' is that the definition that I have
obtained for suckers, implies that the sucker is dependent on the tree,
it does not produce roots. Therefore can it be assumed that if the root
or stem is cut at the tree then the sucker will die?
What is the difference between a Rhizome and a Sucker?
Kelvin Yue
In article <5cktja$s...@loki.brunel.ac.uk>, Alan....@brunel.ac.uk (Alan
J Holmes) wrote:
> In article <MmfqnAA5...@piper.demon.co.uk>,
> Steen Jensen <st...@piper.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> >A colleague at work today told me that his Victoria plum tree had set
> >rhizomes all over his garden.
>
Snip
> Whilst we are on the subject of pruning! Well weren't we?
>
> I have an espalier apple, which is some years old, and has
> suffered from not being well cared for whilst in it's early
> stages of growth, (no it wasn't me!). I would like to
> completely reshape it by cutting the trunk and allowing new
> shoots to sprout.
>
> The BIG question is, at what time of the year should I give it a
> very short back-and-sides?
>
> Alan
>
Now, but if it is very neglected do it over 3 years.
There is an excellent video distributed by Phostrogen which makes the
whole task as clear as daylight.
Kelvin in Cheshire
Alan J Holmes
In article <Jy+31EAM...@piper.demon.co.uk>,
Steen Jensen <st...@piper.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>In article <5cktja$s...@loki.brunel.ac.uk>, Alan J Holmes
><Alan....@brunel.ac.uk> writes
>>As a result my friend has pruned some of the
>>>main branches so he could walk around his garden without getting
>>>concussed.
>>If he had properly pruned the thing each year it would be still
>>at a managable height.
>I'm not experienced at pruning plums because I don't grow them :(
>I've heard several versions about what you should do i.e.
>Prune them in November,
>Prune them in spring but only lightly and never cut the main branches,
>or you don't really need to prune them.
>Is there a definitive method and time to apply the shears?
I was always told you shouldn't _ever_ try to prune plums cos the
tree would die, then one year one of my trees had an _enormouse_
crop and the weight bought down a couple of very large branches,
I was quite worried and thought that is the end of that tree,
but, to my surprise it started growing new shoots the
following year. From that I deduced that the time of year to
prune plums was at the same time you picked the fruit.
>My friends tree was bought as a Dwarf but as Nick mentioned it may have
>been grown on an inappropriate rootstock
>>SBK.
>>Just spray with SBK.
>>SBK!
>Whats SBK, how is it obtained and do you have shares in it? ;)
Shrub and Brushwood Killer.
From any garden centre.
Unfortunately no!(:-)
But do be carefull and follow the instruction precisely.
Alan
Alan J Holmes
In article <32ef2655...@news.sequent.com>,
Nick Vincent <ni...@sequent.com> wrote:
>On 28 Jan 1997 13:05:46 -0000, Alan....@brunel.ac.uk (Alan J
>Holmes) wrote:
>>Whilst we are on the subject of pruning! Well weren't we?
>>I have an espalier apple, which is some years old, and has
>>suffered from not being well cared for whilst in it's early
>>stages of growth, (no it wasn't me!). I would like to
>>completely reshape it by cutting the trunk and allowing new
>>shoots to sprout.
>>The BIG question is, at what time of the year should I give it a
>>very short back-and-sides?
>NOW! this will encourage the new shoot growth you need in the spring
>- but if you're going to be that drastic why not start again from
>scratch with a new tree? You'll lose several seasons of fruit bearing
>whilst training in a new espalier structure, whereas a young partly
>trained tree from a nursery will give you fruit in a couple of years.
>Why do I say this? I had the same situation with a similar badly
>pruned apple tree (imagine a pollarded apple with a trunk 8 feet tall)
>that I tried for three years to prune back into shape, until I decided
>to go for a new tree.
I was thinking of 'pollarding' it at about 3 feet from the
ground!(:-)
Alan
Nick Maclaren
In article <XSew9AAO...@piper.demon.co.uk>, Steen Jensen <st...@piper.demon.co.uk> writes:
|>
|> Yup, this is my interpretation, Nick, Rhizome as in 'subterranean
|> rootlike stem emitting both roots and shoots'. (OED).
|>
|> obtained for suckers, implies that the sucker is dependent on the tree,
|> it does not produce roots. Therefore can it be assumed that if the root
|> or stem is cut at the tree then the sucker will die?
No, because it may have advanced far enough to be able to use the
disconnected roots on its own. Many trees and shrubs spread by
suckering (e.g. elms). If it does live after being disconnected,
the solution is to treat it like a separate, unwanted tree and dig
it up, poison it or otherwise kill it.
|> What is the difference between a Rhizome and a Sucker?
Normally, a sucker is just a shoot in a place remote from the main
(usually shrub-like) plant. A rhizome is both a creeping stem and
a food storage mechanism (as in some irises, couch grass etc.); if
a plant produces rhizomes, then you usually propagate it by taking
some rhizomes and planting them elsewhere.
Steen Jensen
In article <MmfqnAA5...@piper.demon.co.uk>, Steen Jensen
<st...@piper.demon.co.uk> writes
Thanks to all who replied to this thread, not only through the newsgroup
but also by E-Mail.
I've passed on all your comments and suggestions and my friend is
considering his options.
I fear there will be sap on the ground before long :( A case of so long
suckers!