Pollarding Young Oak Trees
Angdnews
I read the fairly recent postings about pollarding ash/oak trees, but didn't
see oaks mentioned specifically. How successful are they?
I inherited a small plantation of oaks which are probably about 15 years old
now. I managed to move some before they grew too big, but the remaining ones
are now too tall and too close together (and too near the house for a
woodland), so I'd like to take the tops out and reduce the side branches, but
not destroy them completely!
Any advice will be greatly appreciated.
TIA ... Angela
Please trim the hedge for email
mts
you thin
them out leaving a few scattered ones to grow to adult. It would look better -
the grassland beneath could be a haven for wildflowers, you would have beautiful
trees
and some free wood!!
MartinS
Angdnews skrev:
Jeremy
mts skrev <36C6F89D...@algonet.se>...
pollarding - one of the great evils man imposes on trees -
What's so greatly evil about pollarding?
Not all pollards look like amputees' stumps. Where I live, there are several
hundred yards of 17th century pollarded ash trees that are so lovely that
they are the graphic symbol for the area/county. They're more remarkable
than the allée of chestnuts round the corner, and are surrounded by
wildflowers, huge, covered with moss & lichen & have lots of birdsnests.
Jeremy Hawker
(Norway 2, England 0)
mts
pollarded
trees (even if the King of Sweden ordered it!) - trees with there upper parts
swollen by the extra growths and then sprouted
-Yuk -
Compare that with an alley of full chestnuts in full flower - it aint the same
ball-game!
I'm a great believer in the cultural landscape - but there is culture and
butchery
Further someone kindly pollarded one of the beech trees in my garden - badly
-before my time - so that
I am about end up with a completely dead centre of the tree as it rots away
quietly
- poor thing!
MartinS
Jeremy skrev:
John Neale Baraclough
from angd...@aol.comhedge (Angdnews) contains these words:
> Hi everyone
> I read the fairly recent postings about pollarding ash/oak trees, but didn't
> see oaks mentioned specifically. How successful are they?
> I inherited a small plantation of oaks which are probably about 15 years old
> now. I managed to move some before they grew too big, but the remaining ones
> are now too tall and too close together (and too near the house for a
> woodland), so I'd like to take the tops out and reduce the side branches, but
> not destroy them completely!
Not far from here a farmer has made effective use of young oaks cut
back to make a thick medium height screen between a 4ft hawthorn
hedge and a mature tree plantation some yards behind it.They quickly
throw up long leafy shoots.Contrary to expectations,youthful oaks are
fastgrowing and will not be killed by quite brutal decapitation .You
could perhaps cut them to various heights so that the overall group
becomes a graduated mound of greenery (and insects and birds).
Oaks were traditionally pollarded on Lochlomondside to provide a bark
harvest for tanning.
Janet, West Scotland
Plant Man
this technique, or not do it at all. The problem appears to be from wanton,
sloppy, or large amputations. There are plenty of horrid examples here in
Maine, and, from what I read about this, it goes for Britain, too.
Perhaps the problem comes from starting this when the trees are rather
large, and the needed removals really are amputations, which can never heal,
allowing the deep penetration of rot. Perhaps with the young oaks in
question, it will work. But I have to confess a strong bias against the
practice.
(I have kept an "Abominations" photo collection since 1990, whereby I
brazenly pull off anywhere I see bad examples of tree and shrub treatment,
and, if necessary, "pull in" the shots with a long lense.) Sometimes it is
poorly executed pollarding, often just arbitrary lopping. Kind of a sick
sense of humor, I dare to admit, but--- It does give much material for use
when giving talks about pruning!
Scott Hadley
wyste...@my-dejanews.com
> pollarding - one of the great evils > MartinS
>
> Angdnews skrev:
> > a small plantation of oaks ...now too tall and too close together (and too
near the house for a woodland)...
Well, I agree with Janet's suggestion.
I think they would look fantastic pollarded, like a strange orchard.
I've never pollarded an oak, only an ash, but it's not THAT difficult to do
it well. I seem to remember there are 2 ways: cut all the branches EITHER
about 2 metres OR about 4 cm from where they join the main stem. Where you
have cut shoots will sprout, and subsequently it will swell up. Although the
first method may suit you better, I tried both because the first looked like
a tree in one of those photos of trench warfare. The latter version didn't
look much better until...it got leaves. Then it looked like a palm tree for a
few months, really very interesting. Then all the leaves fell off, and now it
looks...ok, a bit odd, but come the spring, it's going to look GREAT again.
You have to go round every few days in the summer & pinch off all the shoots
which begin to grow lower on the trunk, so that all the energy is
concentrated in the sprouts at the top.
Don't be put off by all this talk of butchery & evil. The only bloodshed will
be caused by drivers staring out of their car windows at the beauty of your
garden.
Jeremy Hawker
(Norway 4, Sweden 0)
-----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----------
http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own
Jeremy
mts wrote in message <36C745B...@algonet.se>...
>I've yet to find the attraction of driving down a road lined with newly
>pollarded
>trees (even if the King of Sweden ordered it!) - trees with there upper
parts
>swollen by the extra growths and then sprouted
>-Yuk -
>Compare that with an alley of full chestnuts in full flower - it aint the
same
>ball-game!
Funnily enough, the chestnuts I mentioned are at Skaugum, where the King of
Norway lives. OK, they are beautiful, but so are the pollarded ash trees.
>I'm a great believer in the cultural landscape - but there is culture and
>butchery.
The cultural landscape (now there's a great potential topic, by the way).
Well, chestnuts & allées are certainly part of the cultural landscape - I
think chestnuts were only introduced into England in the 16th c.
Hilsen,
Jeremy
Alan Gould
<janet.a...@zetnet.co.uk> writes
snip....
>Oaks were traditionally pollarded on Lochlomondside to provide a bark
>harvest for tanning.
I thought that describing pollarding as a great evil was a rather
sweeping statement by mts. Much inconsiderate pollarding has been done,
but if the choice is between that and losing the tree, then pollarding
has to be the lesser evil.
Many of the problems arising from pollarding are as a result of having
left the tree to grow too large in the first place, or the tree becoming
overcrowded. It is so easy to underestimate the amount of space a tree
is going to need when a young sapling is being planted.
Oaks as with most trees can be trained from a young age to grow into the
size and style of tree the gardener wants. If trees have been left to
grow too big, they should be reduced by stages rather than having
drastic surgery all at once. In the end, pollarding is an extension of
pruning, done for much the same reasons on a larger scale.
--
Alan and Joan Gould, North Lincs.
<al...@agolincs.demon.co.uk>
Janet Tweedy
writes
>Rather than pollarding - one of the great evils man imposes on trees - couldn't
>you thin
>them out leaving a few scattered ones to grow to adult. It would look better -
>the grassland beneath could be a haven for wildflowers, you would have beautiful
>trees
>and some free wood!!
>MartinS
All this sounds like experienced advice so perhaps you could suggest
something for a friend who lives in Lichfield. They have six oak trees,
very close together, mature and with a tree p. order on them. Fine, they
love them, but they are between the house and the fence to the lane.
Underneath nothing really grows except the meadow grass and they would
dearly love to 'do something' with the ground around them and to make a
sort of informal screen from the lane. The trees are about 20 foot from
the low wooden railing/fence and about 15 - 20 foot apart so have grown
up fairly straight. They are about 150 foot from the house which itself
is 150 years old so there doesn't seem to be any danger from tree roots
etc.
They wondered if they would be allowed to take off some of the lower
branches to raise the crown and to perhaps give a bit of light in the
summer.
All suggestions welcome.
--
Janet Tweedy
Dalmatian Telegraph
http://www.lancedal.demon.co.uk
mts
- however I would suggest
that oaks can form a rather nice oak parkland given half a chance - someone
once described an area of oaks and grassland as an oak savanna!!
Seems to me if you have the trees - oaks are wonderful individual trees - then with
careful opening up and clearing and even native shrub and herb planting it could be
really great to wander through...
MartinS
Janet Tweedy skrev:
mts
mts
Colin Brook
<j...@lancedal.demon.co.uk> writes
>perhaps you could suggest
>something for a friend who lives in Lichfield. They have six oak trees,
>They wondered if they would be allowed to take off some of the lower
>branches to raise the crown and to perhaps give a bit of light in the
>summer.
>
>All suggestions welcome.
If a TPO is involved then, in my view, one of the best people to have an
early discussion with is the planning officer concerned. S/he will
undoubtedly have some suggestions about how to 'resolve' any problem and
they may be immediately acceptable. OTOH, if they don't seem so then a
local 'real' = not just a person with a chain saw and a pair of Kevlar
trousers - tree surgeon might me a good idea.
Regards, Colin
--
Colin Brook - Winchester (UK)
mailto:co...@cbassoc.demon.co.uk
Tel:+44(0)1962-714030 Fax:+44(0)8701641293 Mobile:0976258703
mts
cultural landscapes are terribly interesting. Nature raw in tooth and claw is
fine
as far as it goes ........
- but its often the interaction with man that makes for really interesting
landscapes. Some pollarding I think can be rather interesting - likewise the
results of traditional haymaking
etc - can lead to great diversity in meadows - likewise the British Hedgerow
can lead to wonderful habitats (phew just stayed on topic!!)
So yes cultural landscapes rule OK!
halsningar
MartinS
Jeremy skrev:
Janet Tweedy
writes
>Well I'm not experienced in tree preservation or p. orders!!
>- however I would suggest
>that oaks can form a rather nice oak parkland given half a chance - someone
>once described an area of oaks and grassland as an oak savanna!!
>
>Seems to me if you have the trees - oaks are wonderful individual trees - then
>with
>careful opening up and clearing and even native shrub and herb planting it could
>be
>really great to wander through...
>MartinS
Um, yes, only you can't really wander through a line of oaks and they
have grown very straight but though bare for about 10 foot up the trunk
they cast and awful lot of shade in the summer which rules out ANY
planting around the bases!
I agree about them being lovely to wander through but you'd have to do a
fair bit of zig zagging with this lot!
Janet
Bob Harvey
Janet Tweedy <j...@lancedal.demon.co.uk> wrote:
...
> All this sounds like experienced advice so perhaps you could suggest
> something for a friend who lives in Lichfield. They have six oak trees,
> They wondered if they would be allowed to take off some of the lower
> branches to raise the crown and to perhaps give a bit of light in the
> summer.
We have an Oak tree that was quite young when the neighbour's goat got at the
lower branches. It looked odd until Rose took a saw to it and removed the
lower branches. It looked even odder for a couple of yers, but now it has a
fine crown developing - the proper shape just higher up. The wounds healled
up nicely too.
But that was a young tree. Branches about 35mm thick. I imagine an older one
would keep the scars of amputation, but 150 is young for an oak, so it will
generate a nice shape afterwards.
Be careful to remove a similar weight off each side all the way round, if you
see what I mean. Cut coarsely some distance from the trunk then tidily again
where you want the cut to be seen - this to avoid tearing.
If in any doubt get a proffessional in- but take up recommendations first, as
there are a lot of cackhanded gypsies making a living ruining good trees.
-------------
Bob Harvey
OETKB
Bob Harvey
Alan Gould <al...@agolincs.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> snip....
> >Oaks were traditionally pollarded on Lochlomondside to provide a bark
> >harvest for tanning.
>
> I thought that describing pollarding as a great evil was a rather
> sweeping statement by mts. Much inconsiderate pollarding has been done,
> but if the choice is between that and losing the tree, then pollarding
> has to be the lesser evil.
Hmm, yes. I have been thinking about this, and am in several minds. There is
something very evocative about pollarded willows out on the Fens - but it is
evocative of a man-made environment, withies harvested for basket making. Poor
men eking a living at the edge of subsitence. There was an economic
justification for the oaks mentioned above too.
But that's industrial archaeology rather than gardening. Isn't formal
pollarding rather like bonsai or topiary? an art form with living things
rather than gardening? Needing to be part of a great design, of a piece with
the trees - like topiary needs avenues and bonsai those pots?
And, whilst it's all down to personal choice, I can't find it in me to like
pollarded trees as things of beauty - for me they just aren't. I'd like to
think that the plants in my garden - remedial pruning apart - have the chance
to be themselves.
On balance then, against. But no need to be rabid about it.
Mary Waller
> > sweeping statement by mts. Much inconsiderate pollarding has been done,
> > but if the choice is between that and losing the tree, then pollarding
> > has to be the lesser evil.
> pollarding rather like bonsai or topiary? an art form with living things
> rather than gardening? Needing to be part of a great design, of a piece with
> the trees - like topiary needs avenues and bonsai those pots?
I need to pollard (or coppice, but I'm not sure of the difference!)
quite a few elms at the bottom of my garden, as when they get to 15 / 20
foot the dutch elm disease kills them. Has anyone got any advice on how
hard I should cut them back, i.e. to how high?
--
the (dot) sanctuary (at) iname (dot) com
http://millennium.fortunecity.com/treearbor/136/index.htm
Alan Gould
<robert...@my-dejanews.com> writes
>In article <LSCLgOBr1$x2E...@agolincs.demon.co.uk>,
> Alan Gould <al...@agolincs.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>> snip....
>> >Oaks were traditionally pollarded on Lochlomondside to provide a bark
>> >harvest for tanning.
>>
>> sweeping statement by mts. Much inconsiderate pollarding has been done,
>> but if the choice is between that and losing the tree, then pollarding
>> has to be the lesser evil.
>
>something very evocative about pollarded willows out on the Fens - but it is
>evocative of a man-made environment, withies harvested for basket making. Poor
>men eking a living at the edge of subsitence. There was an economic
>justification for the oaks mentioned above too.
>
>pollarding rather like bonsai or topiary? an art form with living things
>rather than gardening? Needing to be part of a great design, of a piece with
>the trees - like topiary needs avenues and bonsai those pots?
>
>pollarded trees as things of beauty - for me they just aren't. I'd like to
>think that the plants in my garden - remedial pruning apart - have the chance
>to be themselves.
>
>On balance then, against. But no need to be rabid about it.
Yes, you are pointing to pollarding done for wrong reasons, commerce,
fashion etc. I was more thinking about the kind of pollarding necessary
for hedges. Often I read in this group of trees being ripped out when
they could have been pollarded and kept. I regularly cut back poplars
and myrobalan plums in our hedges for that reason.
Alan Gould
<the.sa...@iname.com> writes
snip....
>I need to pollard (or coppice, but I'm not sure of the difference!)
>quite a few elms at the bottom of my garden, as when they get to 15 / 20
>foot the dutch elm disease kills them. Has anyone got any advice on how
>hard I should cut them back, i.e. to how high?
Some people use the term coppice when they actually mean pollard.
A coppice (or copse) (n) is a line or group of trees grown for cutting,
or it is the sproutings from a cut stump. To coppice (v) is to make a
coppice or cover an area with trees for coppicing.
A pollard (n) is a tree which has had the whole crown cut off - also a
horned animal. To pollard (v.t.) is to carry out the act of pollarding.
If your elm trees have Dutch Elm Disease, you should take proper advice
from your local authority. I believe it is still a notifiable disease.
--
Alan Gould: <al...@agolincs.demon.co.uk>
Harold Sargeant
<al...@agolincs.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>Some people use the term coppice when they actually mean pollard.
>
>A coppice (or copse) (n) is a line or group of trees grown for cutting,
>or it is the sproutings from a cut stump. To coppice (v) is to make a
>coppice or cover an area with trees for coppicing.
>
>A pollard (n) is a tree which has had the whole crown cut off - also a
>horned animal. To pollard (v.t.) is to carry out the act of pollarding.
Pollarding was coppicing at a greater height so that grazing
animals such as deer could not eat the shoots and so destroy the
future crop. Only in timber production were trees allowed to grow
fully.
--
Harold Sargeant
Angdnews
Thanks for all your suggestions.
I've decided to try Janet's idea of cutting them to various heights to keep the
informal theme to that part of the 'garden' (a term I use loosely!). I would
love to let them grow to their full height, but when you see that the nearest
is about 6 metres from the house, and the closest ones are still about 1.5
metres apart, despite my thinning efforts, you'll get a better idea of the
problem. Interesting ideas some people have (previous owner).
I'll let you know how they get on!
Angela
PS We have no shortage of insects and birds here - it's an organic gardener's
heaven.