EEC 80 Watt Charging set.
Campingstoveman
Today I went with my good wife and our Dormobile to Bolnhurst Vintage Rally
a local do to us.
I spent a pleasant day pottering about and came home with what I thought was
a well kept, and still smelling of preservative, 80 Watt Gen Set by EEC but
on inspection it has S.T. Ltd on the spec plate? does that mean Stuart
Turner as they did design them but I thought others i.e. EEC made them.
Anybody know the voltage please.
Pictures can be seen at usual site shown at bottom of post.
Martin P
--
http://community.webshots.com/user/campingstoveman
When replying use martin...@btopenworld.com
Campingstoveman
> Gentlemen,
>
> Today I went with my good wife and our Dormobile to Bolnhurst Vintage
> Rally a local do to us.
> I spent a pleasant day pottering about and came home with what I
> thought was a well kept, and still smelling of preservative, 80 Watt
> Gen Set by EEC but on inspection it has S.T. Ltd on the spec plate?
> does that mean Stuart Turner as they did design them but I thought
> others i.e. EEC made them. Anybody know the voltage please.
> Pictures can be seen at usual site shown at bottom of post.
>
> Martin P
Forgot to mention, does anybody have a canvas cover for it they would like
to sell me, and also forgot to mention that Peter Forbes and his good lady
spent some time with me as well.
Martin P
Peter A Forbes
<martin...@btopenworld.com> wrote:
>Gentlemen,
>
>Today I went with my good wife and our Dormobile to Bolnhurst Vintage Rally
>a local do to us.
>I spent a pleasant day pottering about and came home with what I thought was
>a well kept, and still smelling of preservative, 80 Watt Gen Set by EEC but
>on inspection it has S.T. Ltd on the spec plate? does that mean Stuart
>Turner as they did design them but I thought others i.e. EEC made them.
>Anybody know the voltage please.
>Pictures can be seen at usual site shown at bottom of post.
>
>Martin P
Not a bad little show at all, we toodled over and had a cuppa with Martin during
the afternoon, thanks Martin!
Hugh Stannard had his Tangye out at the show, and there was a Hamworthy
compressor set there with a Lister A engine IIRC, looked to be mostly complete.
Apart from that there was the usual run of D's and such stuff, plus a 6hp AP
Ruston & Hornsby which was running.
Bought a few new rubber spider couplings, about 2-1/2 of them, look to be good
for a genny coupling or similar.
Why do people leave bare steel parts out in the rain? The guy had a box of bits
that were swimming in water after a heavy shower, he could just as easily
covered the stuff up and saved the eventual surface rust that will occur and
make it even more difficult to sell at the next show...
Peter
--
Peter & Rita Forbes
die...@easynet.co.uk
Engine pages for preservation info:
http://www.oldengine.org/members/diesel
Nick H
(Stuart Turner), DK (Douglas of Kingswood) amoung them. I have two ST's and
an ECC in various states of disrepair. Magnetos seem prone to OC secondary.
--
NHH
http://community.webshots.com/user/n_highfield
"Campingstoveman" <martin...@btopenworld.com> wrote in message
news:2jlvk3F...@uni-berlin.de...
Nick H
--
NHH
http://community.webshots.com/user/n_highfield
"Nick H" <n_hig...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:2jm84qF...@uni-berlin.de...
John Manders
of bits
> that were swimming in water after a heavy shower, he could just as easily
> covered the stuff up and saved the eventual surface rust that will occur
and
> make it even more difficult to sell at the next show...
>
Patina?
Bob Holmes
> Made by quite a number of companies in parallel ECC (Enfield Cycle Co), ST
> (Stuart Turner), DK (Douglas of Kingswood) amoung them. I have two ST's and
> an ECC in various states of disrepair. Magnetos seem prone to OC secondary.
>
> --
> NHH
>
I have had one of these charging sets for about 36years, made by ECC. I
always thought it was "Electrical Construction Company " of Wolverhampton.
You learn something everyday!
Some years ago a local surplus dealer was selling small "tool kits" for £5 .
It turned out that these were maintenance kits for the 80w charging sets-
including spare plugs, valves ,springs, gaskets, fuel pipe etc, all in a
neat steel box. Folded neatly in the bottom , was an instruction book. The
kit enabled me to re-furbish the set . It was always a pig to start,
especially after some kind soul threw it in the canal sometime around 1970.
Those spark plugs and valves are beautifully made.
Robert.
Nick H
Anyone out there got a definative answer?
--
NHH
"Bob Holmes" <bho...@cs.man.ac.uk> wrote
John Stevenson
wrote:
I still have some of the boxes, empty now of course.
--
Regards,
John Stevenson
Nottingham, England.
Prepair Ltd
wrote:
>Nick H wrote:
Both are probably correct, Electric Construction Co was a
dynamo/alternator manufacturer who put together complete systems using
other people's engines, Enfield Cycle Co was a sub-contractor who made
bits under contract to the Air Ministry amongst other.
One of our Cub generators is made by the Enfield Cycle Co, the
alternator is BKB though. I assume that they were just an assembler in
this instance, buying the Cub engine in from Oil Engines (Coventry)
Ltd or one of the others who manufactured the engine over the years.
I have not heard of an Enfield Cycle Co set using an Electric
Construction Co generator end.
--
Peter A Forbes
Prepair Ltd, Luton, UK
pre...@easynet.co.uk
http://www.prepair.co.uk
Campingstoveman
Found Needle was loose and about two turns so set back a bit and now runs in
short bursts, any idea how many turns from stop needle should be.
Petrol is also stale some fresh on Wednesday as flying to Edinburgh tomorrow
for day.
Martin P
"John Manders" <j.ma...@rl.ac.uk> wrote in message
news:cb6nbc$13...@newton.cc.rl.ac.uk...
Nick H
From: J.Edwards (jo...@generator.freeserve.co.uk)
Subject: Re: ex-WD Charging Set
View: Complete Thread (11 articles)
Original Format
Newsgroups: uk.rec.engines.stationary
Date: 2001-02-09 13:43:50 PST
Hi again Derek
If you close the needle valve completely(clockwise)
then open it approx 1.5 turns this should put you in a running position,you
can then adjust slightly either way when the engine is running.I only have
the same manual as you on the set so can,t help there.There is a small ball
bearing acting as a non return valve in the brass union at the tank make
sure that it,s there or it will never run.I have some spares for this set if
you need anything try me.
"Campingstoveman" <martin...@btopenworld.com> wrote in message
news:2jota5F...@uni-berlin.de...
Roland and Celia Craven
put back away for another 5 years :-)
ttfn
Roland
Campingstoveman
Was getting worried as you went very quiet, have a good weekend with Peter F
he likes his tea sweet and strong. :-))
Martin P
Prepair Ltd
We only had ONE sugar!! :-))
J K Siddorn
a spark despite my best efforts. The other is (like Martin's) pretty new
looking. It starts and runs OK, but like all little engines with direct lift
carbs is really fussy and the slightest movement of the throttle screw will
make it run badly or just expire. Narrowing the plug gap helps.
Oddly enough, I had it running on Friday just to see if it did and it
started without a lot of bother after several months of sitting about. The
starting procedure is rather arcane and requires three priming pulls with
the choke on and then three more on cold start. If it doesn't go then, try
putting it on hot start. I've marked the throttle screw with Typex and
knowing where it was is a definite advance!
You'll have to be as attentive as to a new high maintenance mistress until
it has warmed up, following the four stroke setting on the carb screw as it
roars away to itself. Load it after adjustment and then be prepared to see
it through its first tantrum as the mixture weakens under load. That done,
it will run cheerfully for about two hours on a full tank.
Regards,
Kim Siddorn,
philip.starling
It runs a treat and generates about 40 volts DC when not under a load
What voltage battery should it charge?
Phil
Prepair Ltd <pre...@easynet.co.uk> wrote in message
news:lusfd0tk1d74nghie...@4ax.com...
Nick H
40 volts off-load sounds a bit high, but try hanging a car battery on it and
see what happens.
--
NHH
http://community.webshots.com/user/n_highfield
"philip.starling" <philip....@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
news:590Cc.844$Ui5.602@newsfe1-win...
Roland and Celia Craven
batteries.
ttfn
Roland
Nick H
by the cooling fins I would suspect that the metal rectumfryer has a fairly
high internal resistance so output voltage will drop sharply when load is
applied.
--
NHH
"Roland and Celia Craven" <rol...@petternut.co.uk> wrote in message
news:2jvkj4F...@uni-berlin.de...
Bob Holmes
> This is what I found too, 38 odd volts off load but it's rated at 12 volts.
> Connected to a 12 volt battery makes it work pretty hard and the revs drop
> by at least 50% I'd judge.
>
> These electrickery things have always puzzled me - can anyone explain why my
> battery doesn't warm through and turn into a Dali sculpture?
>
> --
>
> Regards,
>
> Kim Siddorn,
There are 3 factors involved with this generator-
Firstly, the engine has no governor, so , off load it revs to a much higher
value than when it is loaded., also it is much noisier at these high revs.
Secondly, there is no voltage regulation within the generator - it is in fact
a rotating permanent magnet alternator, and , very approximately , the
output voltage is proportional to the revs.
Thirdly, the old metal rectifier fitted to these sets is rather inefficient
( its the finned thing over the generator )
This rectifier , as well as producing a vaguely Direct Current is also by
virtue of its inefficiency, a series resistance between the generator and the
battery and has the effect of limiting the charging current to about 5amps.
The internal impedance of the generator winding also limits the current to
a safe value. The rectifier can usefully be replaced by a modern silicon
bridge rectifier rated at 10amp and 100v because these old rectifiers fail
regularly due to age , you finish up with ac on your battery.
It would still be possible to boil your battery , but you would have to run
the genny for a long time and the enemy would have homed in on your position
by the din from the engine and the condition of the battery is then
irrelevent.
I would not recommend connecting other equipment to the generator unless there
was a 12v battery in circuit to hold the voltage down
Robert.
Nick H
--
NHH
"philip.starling" <philip....@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
news:590Cc.844$Ui5.602@newsfe1-win...
Roland and Celia Craven
ttfn
Roland
"Nick H" <n_hig...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:2jvnjhF...@uni-berlin.de...
> Suggestions please for 'EP&Co'
Nick H
--
NHH
"Roland and Celia Craven" <rol...@petternut.co.uk> wrote in message
news:2jvp5iF...@uni-berlin.de...
Prepair Ltd
wrote:
>Destruction book definitely states for 12v wireless accumulators - Judging
>by the cooling fins I would suspect that the metal rectumfryer has a fairly
>high internal resistance so output voltage will drop sharply when load is
>applied.
Selenium type.
Look nice but horribly inefficient. worth keeping on the generator for
appearance but fit a modern sillicoon equivalent (Kim has a couple we
gave him IIRC) out of sight.
STC in the days of Standard Telephones & Cables, plus Brimar made most
of these in the UK.
Nick H
If replacing metal rectifier with silicon type would it be prudent to
include a series resistor to avoid boiling battery or, more likely,
overheating alternator windings?
BTW. I remember those STC SenTerCel types - smelt like old cabbage when dead
or dying! Westinghouse were another big manufacturer ranging from large
power types to the tiny Westector.
--
NHH
"Prepair Ltd" <pre...@easynet.co.uk> wrote
Phil Starling
All very interesting, I don't have any intention of doing anything
useful with it but the information is useful.
Cheers,
Phil.
On Thu, 24 Jun 2004 11:49:24 +0100, "Nick H" <n_hig...@hotmail.com>
wrote:
>All I could think of was Eldridge Pope :-}
timleech
wrote:
>Or copper oxide.
>
>If replacing metal rectifier with silicon type would it be prudent to
>include a series resistor to avoid boiling battery or, more likely,
>overheating alternator windings?
>
>BTW. I remember those STC SenTerCel types - smelt like old cabbage when dead
>or dying! Westinghouse were another big manufacturer ranging from large
>power types to the tiny Westector.
I used to have one (bridge rectifier) from a loudspeaker electromagnet
supply, Westinghouse Brake & Saxby Signal co., AFAIR
Cheers
Tim
Tim Leech
Dutton Dry-Dock
Traditional & Modern canal craft repairs
Prepair Ltd
wrote:
>Or copper oxide.
>
>If replacing metal rectifier with silicon type would it be prudent to
>include a series resistor to avoid boiling battery or, more likely,
>overheating alternator windings?
>
>BTW. I remember those STC SenTerCel types - smelt like old cabbage when dead
>or dying! Westinghouse were another big manufacturer ranging from large
>power types to the tiny Westector.
I don't think that copper oxide lasted for long before the Selenium
designs came along, but your comment jogged my memory about stick
rectifiers and plate rectifiers, I think selenium was used for the
plate types and copper oxide for the smaller power types.
A variable wirewound resistor would be useful if you were going to use
the unit for regularly charging batteries, in which case you would
need a tubular wirewound type and some experimenting to find a
workable value for a fixed resistor which could be a modern ali clas
type and bolted to the bodywork out of sight.
The old 1kW firebars are useful as a source of cheap resistance wire,
and they are also available in 110V as well as 240V BTW.
Nick H
just about any technology fascinating) I found this:-
http://www.thorneyhill2.freeserve.co.uk/metalrec.html
--
NHH
Peter A Forbes
I had a look at that, and I found a couple of statements a bit strange.
He mentioned 10,000 amps worth of copper-oxide rectifiers in the early part of
the 1900's, but everyone was on DC mostly in those days anyway, and certainly I
would have expected to see DC generating sets for that kind of punch rather than
rectified AC which was in its infancy in the 1920's.
DC generators were widespread up to the 1950's and later, especially for film
studios like Ealing etc.
Maybe I missed something in my quick look ?
Peter
--
Peter & Rita Forbes
die...@easynet.co.uk
Engine pages for preservation info:
http://www.oldengine.org/members/diesel
Campingstoveman
I am really pleased with myself, not long returned from Scottishland to find
my little Genny caused quite a long thread.
:-))
Something OT passing Peterborough this evening on the A1 I had cause to dial
999 from my mobile, Handsfree, as in the outside lane on the Northbound was
an old Gent happily heading south and waving at on coming cars flashing him
:-((
Martin P
Nick H
E Pass & Co. of Denton near Manchester, and that that company was entrusted
with manufacturing the first production batch of these units.
See:-
http://www.tameside.gov.uk/corpgen/millennium/yearbook18.html
(about 1/3 way down page)
Nothing to do with gensets but I guess many engineering companies were
pressed into service during the war building things a world away from their
peacetime work.
--
NHH
"Nick H" <n_hig...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:2jvnjhF...@uni-berlin.de...
Nick H
marked EEC - all the ones I have seen billed as such have turned out to be
ECC? Go on, have another look, it's all to easy to read what you were
expecting to see rather than what is actually there!
--
NHH
"Nick H" <n_hig...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:2ki4lcF...@uni-berlin.de...
Campingstoveman
> And another thing (stop me if I'm boring you). Has anyone actually
> got a set marked EEC - all the ones I have seen billed as such have
> turned out to be ECC? Go on, have another look, it's all to easy to
> read what you were expecting to see rather than what is actually
> there!
>
> news:2ki4lcF...@uni-berlin.de...
>> It has been suggested to me (with some authority) off-list that
>> EP&Co may be E Pass & Co. of Denton near Manchester, and that that
>> company was entrusted with manufacturing the first production batch
>> of these units.
>>
>> See:-
>>
>> http://www.tameside.gov.uk/corpgen/millennium/yearbook18.html
>>
>> (about 1/3 way down page)
>>
>> Nothing to do with gensets but I guess many engineering companies
>> were pressed into service during the war building things a world
>> away from their peacetime work.
>> --
>> NHH
Mine is deffinitely marked as S.T. Ltd
No work again today :-))
Martin P
Nick H
BTW Do you think length of NG thread could be inversely proportional to
size of engine under discussion?
--
NHH
"Campingstoveman" <martin...@btopenworld.com> wrote
Campingstoveman
I meant you had no work today as busy with NG :-))
I am busy catching up with paperwork while local Vauxhall dealer attempt to
stop my van alarm from going off for no reason other than it is missing me
every five minutes.
I has not gone wrong this week but I am pleased to report that as I cycled
away from the dealership it was screaming for attention. :-))
Lets discuss a large marine diesel and see how many posts we get.
Martin P
"Nick H" <n_hig...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:2ki80aF...@uni-berlin.de...
Nick H
posts - why I think I sold a 6204 only last week!
--
NHH
"Campingstoveman" <martin...@btopenworld.com> wrote (snip)
Campingstoveman
> My misunderstanding. But I can assure you that I am hard at it between
> posts - why I think I sold a 6204 only last week!
>
whats a 6204 then.
Martin P
Prepair Ltd
<martin...@btopenworld.com> wrote:
>Nick,
>I meant you had no work today as busy with NG :-))
>I am busy catching up with paperwork while local Vauxhall dealer attempt to
>stop my van alarm from going off for no reason other than it is missing me
>every five minutes.
>I has not gone wrong this week but I am pleased to report that as I cycled
>away from the dealership it was screaming for attention. :-))
As I mentioned on the 'phone, I hope that is not a generic fault as we
have just ordered the new replacement for the Movano this week, should
be here mid-September.
Renault were £1100 cheaper 'on the road' than Vauxhall, and that
included aircon on the Renault which was not in the Vauxhall price. As
they are made on the same line at Luton, less than a mile from where I
am sitting it makes me wonder how they can generate that differential.
Peter
Nick H
"Campingstoveman" <martin...@btopenworld.com> wrote
>
> whats a 6204 then.
>
Sorry bearing industry 'in joke'. 6204 = 20x47x14mm ball race - worth about
a fiver! (actually did about £15K of aircraft bearing business)
--
NHH
Campingstoveman
Thats handy to know for future ref :-))
Martin P
Bob Holmes
Well, I didn't know that ! Pass' engineering works is still largely intact
near the junction of M60/M67 and adjacent to Denton railway station ,
famous for having but one scheduled passenger train per week .
The works is currently occupied by "Malbern Windows " and "Scapa Tapes" , the
latter in the last stages of moving out.
Not far away is Richmond St , Audenshaw , where the manufacturers of the
"Wilton" engines was situated.
This company were also suppliers of gensets to theWD though I think they
closed down in the 1930s
A couple of miles away are the former premises of the National Gas & Oil
Engine Co, still largely in engineering company occupancy. The front door of
the building that once served as the "Nash's" ambulance room is provided
with a door stop looking very much like part of a piston .
A shame that my 80w set is ECC of Wolverhampton, when I could have got one
just down the road ( had I been around at that time!)
Robert.
Nick H
manufacturer codes may not have done much to confuse the enemy during WWII,
but they are sure doing a good job on us nearly 60 years later!
As an aside, equipment made by EMI often carried the code GCL for
Gramophone Company Limited.
--
NHH
"Bob Holmes" <bho...@cs.man.ac.uk> wrote (snip)