acea a5/b5 oil
Fred
My OH drives a Vauxhall Astra (1.4L petrol, 56 plate), which she has
owned for a year, so it's time to change the oil for the first time.
I've run into two problems, eurocarparts lists two oil filters; one is
slightly longer than the other; which do I need?
But my main concern is the oil. I saw some big drums at costco and
figured that it would be cheaper in the long run to buy one of these.
But I have since read the service booklet that came with the Astra and
it says to avoid oils ACEA A1/B1 and A5/B5. The drum I bought is
A5/B5.
What does all this A/B stuff mean and why is A5/B5 so bad? Should I be
taking it back for a refund?
I also bought a drum of their "diesel oil" for my car and that appears
to say it is A3/B3/A3/B4. What does all that mean?
TIA
Mrcheerful
"Fred" <fr...@no-email.here.invalid> wrote in message
news:o3q206939t45sie2s...@4ax.com...
genuine vauxhall oil/filter is the way to go (and cheap too)
Cicero
=====================================================================
I had no idea either (about the oil designations) so I did a
quick 'google' and found this:
http://www.driverstechnology.co.uk/oils.htm
Part of the information seems to contradict Astra Manual
information since it appears that A5 oils are one of the
best grades:
"Put simply, A3/B3, A5/B5 and C3 oils are the better
quality, stay in grade performance oils."
Cic.
--
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Using Ubuntu Linux
Windows shown the door
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Chris Whelan
The fact that an oil is "better" does not mean it meets the
manufacturer's specification for that vehicle.
Chris
--
Remove prejudice to reply.
John Henderson
> I had no idea either (about the oil designations) so I did a
> quick 'google' and found this:
>
> http://www.driverstechnology.co.uk/oils.htm
>
> Part of the information seems to contradict Astra Manual
> information since it appears that A5 oils are one of the
> best grades:
>
> "Put simply, A3/B3, A5/B5 and C3 oils are the better
> quality, stay in grade performance oils."
A "better" oil might not be a suitable oil, for a number of
reasons. ACEA A5/B5 oils "may be unsuitable for use in some
engines" - http://www.lubrizol.com/EuropeanEngineOils/A5B508.html
John
Cicero
======================================================================
It seems odd that Vauxhall should advise owners to 'avoid'
oils graded as ACEA A1/B1 and A5/B5 since they obviously
have quite desirable characteristics - fuel economy and in
the case of A5/B5 suitability for high performance combined
with fuel economy. If there is any real danger to engines
from the use of such oils one might expect Vauxhall to
specify exactly which grade(s) they recommend rather than
telling owners which to avoid.
I wonder what would happen if a warranty claim on a blown
engine revealed that the engine contained one of the oils to
be avoided.
Chris Whelan
[...]
> If there is any real danger
> to engines from the use of such oils one might expect Vauxhall to
> specify exactly which grade(s) they recommend rather than telling owners
> which to avoid.
They do, as do all manufacturers.
> I wonder what would happen if a warranty claim on a blown engine
> revealed that the engine contained one of the oils to be avoided.
>
> Cic.
If an oil that was explicitly listed as unsuitable was used, there would
be no doubt that they would refuse the claim, and correctly so IMHO.
Cicero
> On Mon, 31 May 2010 17:26:21 +0100, Cicero wrote:
>
> [...]
>
>
>>If there is any real danger
>>to engines from the use of such oils one might expect Vauxhall to
>>specify exactly which grade(s) they recommend rather than telling owners
>>which to avoid.
>
>
> They do, as do all manufacturers.
They do, of course - I wasn't thinking straight. I was
side-tracked by the idea that Vauxhall would only advise
people to avoid certain grades of oil rather than an
outright prohibition.
>
>
>>I wonder what would happen if a warranty claim on a blown engine
>>revealed that the engine contained one of the oils to be avoided.
>>
>>Cic.
>
>
> If an oil that was explicitly listed as unsuitable was used, there would
> be no doubt that they would refuse the claim, and correctly so IMHO.
Since Vauxhall seem to have introduced a grey area by only
advising people to avoid certain grades they have created a
golden opportunity for the lawyers to have a field day in
muddy waters. Of course I'm picking up on the OP's use of
the word 'avoid' which may not be how Vauxhall have actually
worded it in their manual.
>
> Chris
Fred
wrote:
> Of course I'm picking up on the OP's use of
>the word 'avoid' which may not be how Vauxhall have actually
>worded it in their manual.
It says: "use of engine oil grades ACEA-A1/B, ACEA-A5/B5 is expressly
forbidden as they can cause long-term engine damage under certain
operating conditions" but it doesn't say what these "certain
conditions" are.
Fred
wrote:
>I had no idea either (about the oil designations) so I did a
>quick 'google' and found this:
>
>http://www.driverstechnology.co.uk/oils.htm
>
>Part of the information seems to contradict Astra Manual
>information since it appears that A5 oils are one of the
>best grades:
>
>"Put simply, A3/B3, A5/B5 and C3 oils are the better
>quality, stay in grade performance oils."
Yes, I found similar pages from google and, like you found, they
suggest A5/B5 is the best of the bunch.
I wonder how many people don't know about these grades. I always
though a 5w30 was 5w30. I'm going to look at the bottles in halfords
and see what all those are.
The advice seems to be to take this back and go to the dealer. I am
happy to listen to your advice. I hadn't thought of doing to the
dealer because usually they have the reputation of costing twice
everyone else. What do independent garages do though? Surely they
don't keep a barrel of Vauxhall oil, a barrel of Ford oil, etc.
Mrcheerful
I do, and a friend with a larger garage does the same. if you put the right
stuff in there will be less likelihood of faults developing that can be
blamed on you. Vauxhall oil bought through the trade club is very cheap in
any case.
Cicero
=====================================================================
Well that puts things in a very different light. It would be
tempting fate to use the wrong oil(s) when they're so
plainly forbidden.
I think I'll be having a closer look at the oil I'm using in
my 306 as I've been trusting my local dealer to supply the
correct oil since I started using diesels about 10 years ago.
Fred
wrote:
>I do, and a friend with a larger garage does the same. if you put the right
>stuff in there will be less likelihood of faults developing that can be
>blamed on you. Vauxhall oil bought through the trade club is very cheap in
>any case.
Crickey, you must have a room full of different oils. I phoned my
Vauxhall stealer and my experience was much different to yours: they
want Ł40-odd pounds ex vat for 4 Litres. The next size up is 20L and
that costs over two hundred pounds; more than buying five four litre
bottles. How much discount do they offer the trade? At those prices
per litre, petrol begins to look cheap! ;)
Out of curiosity, I looked on the shelves at Halfords. Up to now I
have always looked at the "diesel oils" aisle rather than the "petrol
oils", so I was surprised to see that Halfords offer half a dozen
colour-coded 5w30 oils: one for Fords, another for Audis, another for
BMWs, another for Vauxhalls, etc.
I did buy some 5w30 oil once before but didn't notice it was one of
many. I don't know if the others weren't sold then or if I just didn't
see them! It was for a Ford and I do have a tiny bit left. It's a bit
of a waste really each make having its own oil; there must be many
part cans in people's garages that they cannot use when they change
cars.
Interestingly, the own-brand 5w30s that are A3 rated are synthetic and
the A1 oils are part synthetic, I think Castrol Magnatec did not
follow this rule though. To give credit to Castrol, they do print the
rating on the bottle "5w30 A1".
I think that with Castrol I needed "Edge" which is also Ł40-odd, so it
looks like I have no choice; it's going to cost some money.
I have never noticed a problem when shopping for "diesel oil". Have I
just been lucky with my experience that my cars have all wanted a
similar oil, or is it that for some reason diesel engines are less
fussy about their oil?
TIA
Mrcheerful
the trade club does have some good discounts, the oil you need is about 3
quid a litre trade.
I think they all started specifying super oils to get the customers back in
buying parts in dealers!!
The other problem is the makers have pressure to make longer service
intervals and that really does need larger oil capacity and super quality
oil.
Chris Whelan
> On Wed, 2 Jun 2010 19:31:09 +0100, "Mrcheerful" <nbk...@hotmail.co.uk>
> wrote:
>
>>I do, and a friend with a larger garage does the same. if you put the
>>right stuff in there will be less likelihood of faults developing that
>>can be blamed on you. Vauxhall oil bought through the trade club is
>>very cheap in any case.
>
> Crickey, you must have a room full of different oils. I phoned my
> Vauxhall stealer and my experience was much different to yours: they
> want £40-odd pounds ex vat for 4 Litres. The next size up is 20L and
> that costs over two hundred pounds; more than buying five four litre
> bottles. How much discount do they offer the trade? At those prices per
> litre, petrol begins to look cheap! ;)
>
> Out of curiosity, I looked on the shelves at Halfords. Up to now I have
> always looked at the "diesel oils" aisle rather than the "petrol oils",
> so I was surprised to see that Halfords offer half a dozen colour-coded
> 5w30 oils: one for Fords, another for Audis, another for BMWs, another
> for Vauxhalls, etc.
>
> I did buy some 5w30 oil once before but didn't notice it was one of
> many. I don't know if the others weren't sold then or if I just didn't
> see them! It was for a Ford and I do have a tiny bit left. It's a bit of
> a waste really each make having its own oil; there must be many part
> cans in people's garages that they cannot use when they change cars.
>
> Interestingly, the own-brand 5w30s that are A3 rated are synthetic and
> the A1 oils are part synthetic, I think Castrol Magnatec did not follow
> this rule though. To give credit to Castrol, they do print the rating on
> the bottle "5w30 A1".
>
> I think that with Castrol I needed "Edge" which is also £40-odd, so it
> looks like I have no choice; it's going to cost some money.
>
> I have never noticed a problem when shopping for "diesel oil". Have I
> just been lucky with my experience that my cars have all wanted a
> similar oil, or is it that for some reason diesel engines are less fussy
> about their oil?
>
> TIA
Most drivers would change oil once a year at best. The difference between
20UKP and 40UKP over a year is pretty small in terms of car running
costs; it's possible that the better oil might even improve fuel
consumption to the point that it works out cheaper to use it!
If you think "Vauxhall" oil is expensive, I would suggest you don't
consider running a VW on the extended service schedule...
Fred
wrote:
>the oil you need is about 3 quid a litre trade.
And £10+ per litre to the public, ouch!
>The other problem is the makers have pressure to make longer service
>intervals and that really does need larger oil capacity and super quality
>oil.
I don't mind the quantity, 4L is not much really, and I wouldn't mind
using super oil, it's just a shame that each make has a different
super oil, why can't they all use the same type of 5w30?!
Fred
they said it is because of the additives in it but they didn't go into
any further detail. HTH