Peugeot 106 Ignition wiring
Dave J.
Hi again, can anyone advise me on the interchangeability (or otherwise) of
various parts of the ignition circuitry on this '03 plated Peugeot 106d
'Zen' ?
As mentioned in a previous posting, ignition key was stuck in barrel,
steering lock was on and no way to move (or remove) the key.
I've managed to persuade the key to turn far enough for the steering lock
to drop back. At the moment I'm unwilling to gamble on moving the key
around for fear of locking it up again. so what I'm after doing right now
is 'hotwiring' it to get it running. I don't think the electronic
circuitry around the barrel is damaged, although I suppose it could be.
I'm making this posting as I take a break to look up the colour coding to
try to avoid the hotwire bodge involving any *literally* hot wires..
The information I'm requesting is WRT replacing the barrel without buying
a full lock set (awkward blasted manufacturer). I think I may be able to
replace the mechanics of the lock with a scrap one, use the replacement
key to move the switch, and the electronics from the original to provide
RF authorisation. Both keys on same fob for long enough to earn price of a
full repair.
So, if that is a viable workaround, do I need to use the same receiver
board, or will the one that comes with the scrap barrel do the job? Is the
coding burnt into that chip in any way or is it purely embedded in the
ECU's programming?
Is there anything else I need to worry about? For a start, I've never
dealt with an airbagged car before. All I'm sure of is that battery
disconnection reduces the chance of false triggering and that there's a
backup rechargeable or capacitor, meaning I've then got to be careful not
to ground the wrong wire. I've never even seen behind the steering wheel
facia (will buy a star drive to fit tomorrow) so I've no idea what's there
or how it works.
The gist of it being that I know enough, to know that I don't know enough,
and that I *really* don't fancy learning the 'exciting' way..
Any help or hints would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks if so
Dave Johnson
Douglas Payne
Take the steering column shroud to bits. It usually unscrews from
underneath in Peugeots (going by my experience of various 306s and a
205). It's usually in 2 halves and you probably won't have to take the
steering wheel off to do it. Not having to remove the wheel means you
don't have to fuck about with the airbag, which is good.
The screws'll probably be torx, and quite deeply recessed more than
likely. Normal sockets with torx heads may not cut the mustard as the
head may not be long enough. I used some long ones I found in a set of
"300 for a fiver" drillbits.
Once the upper and lower bits of plastic are away you can see reasonably
clearly how the whole ignition barrel/steering lock gubbins works.
The ignition barrel is probably held in with some kind of rivet or
security headed screw, I'm afraid I never investigated on my 306 when I
recently changed the heater matrix (complete dash and most of the
steering column had to be removed).
The immobiliser 'aerial' is a black shroud that fits over the ignition
barrel.
Look out for, and don't bugger about with, orange wires, they seem to be
SRS/airbag workings (that's the explosive stuff). It's probably good
working practice to disconnect the battery and have a cup of tea/wait 10
minutes) before mucking about in the steering column shroud.
Have you got a Haynes manual for it? If not, it could be worth it.
It'll have all the procedures you need for dismantling and reassembly of
the bits you want.
If you change the barrel from a scrapper, having the original car key on
the same keyring will probably be enough to fool the immobiliser. I'm
not sure but if you get the whole lock and key set along with the
immobiliser aerial from a scrapper and swap them over you could be
laughing. Perhaps more bother than its worth.
As to the interchangability, 106s come in 2 general phases, older ones
are less curvy IIRC. You probably want your donor to be a Diesel, and
roughly of the same age, the electromagics have a better chance of being
the same then, but don't get hung up on it being zackerly the same reg
or spec level, I'd be fairly confident that they all came with
immobilisers by then and there's a good chance that the steering column,
keys, ignition barrels and steering locks came from the same stock over
the entire production run.
I'd not bother trying to hotwire it, you'll probably just bugger the
loom and make trying to fix it properly a bit of a nightmare.
Please note that I could be wrong on any or all of the above.
And I'd like to re-iterate that improperly mucking about with the airbag
can easily get you killed.
Good luck!
--
Douglas
Dave J.
+0000, in uk.rec.cars.maintenance, 'Douglas Payne' wrote:
>> Hi again, can anyone advise me on the interchangeability (or otherwise) of
>> various parts of the ignition circuitry on this '03 plated Peugeot 106d
>> 'Zen' ?
>>
>> As mentioned in a previous posting, ignition key was stuck in barrel,
>> steering lock was on and no way to move (or remove) the key.
>>
>> I've managed to persuade the key to turn far enough for the steering lock
>> to drop back. At the moment I'm unwilling to gamble on moving the key
>> around for fear of locking it up again. so what I'm after doing right now
>> is 'hotwiring' it to get it running.
[...]
>Take the steering column shroud to bits. It usually unscrews from
>underneath in Peugeots (going by my experience of various 306s and a
>205). It's usually in 2 halves and you probably won't have to take the
>steering wheel off to do it. Not having to remove the wheel means you
>don't have to fuck about with the airbag, which is good.
Got the shroud off early on, used an allen key to persuade what looks like
star-drive screws out of their sockets.
>
>The screws'll probably be torx, and quite deeply recessed more than
>likely.
Do they look like star drives?
I haven't managed to get the front facia off the steering wheel, I assume
that's how you remove it but I'm very wary of the airbag that must be
hidden away in there and anyhow, the only way I'll get it off is to get
the proper tool set. Yes, they are deeply recessed, and I'll have to
search around for someone to sell me the right kit for undoing them. As
above, do they look similar to star drive fittings? These are really
really tiny, maybe a millimetre across.
>Normal sockets with torx heads may not cut the mustard as the
>head may not be long enough. I used some long ones I found in a set of
>"300 for a fiver" drillbits.
>
>Once the upper and lower bits of plastic are away you can see reasonably
>clearly how the whole ignition barrel/steering lock gubbins works.
Yes, got to get the indicator/wiper switches out of the way (again, lack
of toolkit)
Anyhow, I tried the straightforward 'hotwire', *think* I got the
connections right, all the lights came on in the right order and it spun,
but certainly no cigar.
>The immobiliser 'aerial' is a black shroud that fits over the ignition
>barrel.
The shroud on this one has been broken in the past and superglued back
into place. I tried tugging at the entire casing in the hope of seeing
more and the superglued bit came away. Can see the coil but it looks
intact.
Maybe I've fried the RF detection electronics somehow, or maybe there's
some interaction between the mechanical switch and the circuit board which
I can't see. Maybe I didn't get the switch bypass *quite* right.
Whatever/whichever, immobilised, good style. Heater comes on and goes off
after correct delay, spins sweet as you like, but won't fire.
Absolutely gutted. Straws and camels, family tragedy, kind of hard to ride
in and help out on a crippled camel..
I don't suppose there's any sort of 'reset' process that's supposed to be
carried out after total disconnection? Or have I just broken it? :-(
>Look out for, and don't bugger about with, orange wires, they seem to be
>SRS/airbag workings (that's the explosive stuff). It's probably good
>working practice to disconnect the battery and have a cup of tea/wait 10
>minutes) before mucking about in the steering column shroud.
I assume the airbag's behind the facia I haven't yet removed? I was told
there's a small battery/large capacitor to act as backup in the event of a
crash and that if I ground the wrong wire, even with the main battery
disconnected I risk dangerous results.
>I'd not bother trying to hotwire it, you'll probably just bugger the
>loom and make trying to fix it properly a bit of a nightmare.
Nah, that's not the problem. Not knowing for sure how the switching works,
maybe that's the problem. I just unplugged wires from the ignition barrel
where they join the main loom and wedged wires in behind the plugs. This
could perhaps be why I can't get it going.
Do you happen to know the symptoms when it's immobilised? Is it normal for
all the dashboard lights, the heater timer, everything to apparently work
correctly but without anything firing? If not then I must be -> <- that
close to getting it running.
[snip comments about interchangability not being too much of a problem]
>
>Have you got a Haynes manual for it? If not, it could be worth it.
>It'll have all the procedures you need for dismantling and reassembly of
>the bits you want.
>Please note that I could be wrong on any or all of the above.
>
>And I'd like to re-iterate that improperly mucking about with the airbag
>can easily get you killed.
Thanks very much for the advice and the warning. Advice part's quite
reassuring (in as far as it's possible to reassure someone who thinks they
may have knackered an expensive car)
Dave J.
Dave J.
in uk.rec.cars.maintenance, 'Dave J.' wrote:
>Nah, that's not the problem. Not knowing for sure how the switching works,
>maybe that's the problem. I just unplugged wires from the ignition barrel
>where they join the main loom and wedged wires in behind the plugs.
>This could perhaps be why I can't get it going.
As in not knowing for sure which wires do what. Though it seems to work
exactly as it should..
Dave
Duncan Wood
Have you got the ignition key stuck next to the sensor coil, spinning but
not firing is normal behaviour if it's still immobilised.
Dave J.
uk.rec.cars.maintenance, 'Duncan Wood' wrote:
Key's still in the lock, daren't move it. The one thing that's gone right
today is that the steering's no longer locked up, meaning it should be
quite straightforward to change the barrel. Just for luck I put the other
key nearby too. Still no life. Looks to be damage to the chip or the RF
coil.
Also, they've used solid core wires to connect to the electronics. Seems a
daft idea, solid core in a motor vehicle.
Can't think of any further diagnostics until I've got proper tools. Unless
anyone'd like to chip in with corrections to my method of bypassing the
mechanical switching. I'm not convinced I've got it quite right, though
probably mostly thanks to a hope that the problem's something simple.
For the sake of any future Peugeot 106 googlers, the bolts that hold the
steering shroud and wiper/headlight assemblies in place are indeed 'Torx'
fittings (12 point start drive). Did an image search to confirm. No idea
of size beyond 'couple of mill-ish'.
Thanks
Dave
Douglas Payne
> In MsgID<5vcgh3F...@mid.individual.net> on Fri, 18 Jan 2008 20:29:22
> +0000, in uk.rec.cars.maintenance, 'Douglas Payne' wrote:
> Got the shroud off early on, used an allen key to persuade what looks like
> star-drive screws out of their sockets.
Sorry, mis-interpreted how far you'd got.
>>The screws'll probably be torx, and quite deeply recessed more than
>>likely.
>
>
> Do they look like star drives?
The very fellows.
> I haven't managed to get the front facia off the steering wheel, I assume
> that's how you remove it but I'm very wary of the airbag that must be
> hidden away in there and anyhow, the only way I'll get it off is to get
> the proper tool set. Yes, they are deeply recessed, and I'll have to
> search around for someone to sell me the right kit for undoing them. As
> above, do they look similar to star drive fittings? These are really
> really tiny, maybe a millimetre across.
The airbag is probably held on with 2 torx headed bolts on the back of
the steering wheel. It'll just lift out of the steering wheel after
that, if it's like the 306, there'll be 2 wires connected to a little
plug that pushes into the back of the airbag unit.
Make sure there's no latent electrickery in the system (have cup of tea
after disconnecting battery as mentioned before) when you're plugging or
unplugging it and be careful with it, store it somewhere dry and where,
if it does go off, it won't hurt anybody. Put it down on its back, as I
read that it'll happily fire itself a long way into the air if you put
it down on its front and it goes off. There are probably videos on
youtube. (c:
> Yes, got to get the indicator/wiper switches out of the way (again, lack
> of toolkit)
Yeah, you need a nice set of Torx bits.
> Anyhow, I tried the straightforward 'hotwire', *think* I got the
> connections right, all the lights came on in the right order and it spun,
> but certainly no cigar.
Sounds rightly immobilised to me. My 306 also flashes a light on the
instrument cluster when it's being turned over whilst immobilised. A
sort of flash flash... flash flash... flash flash while it turns over.
>>The immobiliser 'aerial' is a black shroud that fits over the ignition
>>barrel.
>
>
> The shroud on this one has been broken in the past and superglued back
> into place. I tried tugging at the entire casing in the hope of seeing
> more and the superglued bit came away. Can see the coil but it looks
> intact.
Superglue? Alarm bells are ringing. This is the steering column shroud?
> Maybe I've fried the RF detection electronics somehow, or maybe there's
> some interaction between the mechanical switch and the circuit board which
> I can't see. Maybe I didn't get the switch bypass *quite* right.
>
> Whatever/whichever, immobilised, good style. Heater comes on and goes off
> after correct delay, spins sweet as you like, but won't fire.
>
> Absolutely gutted. Straws and camels, family tragedy, kind of hard to ride
> in and help out on a crippled camel..
Heh. I'd be inclined to hire a Camel if there was any potential peril.
> I don't suppose there's any sort of 'reset' process that's supposed to be
> carried out after total disconnection? Or have I just broken it? :-(
I dunno if the coil is matched to the key, I never had the chance to
experiment, but there's no reset process as far as I know. I just
plugged mine back in after a couple of days and it fired up.
>>I'd not bother trying to hotwire it, you'll probably just bugger the
>>loom and make trying to fix it properly a bit of a nightmare.
>
>
> Nah, that's not the problem. Not knowing for sure how the switching works,
> maybe that's the problem. I just unplugged wires from the ignition barrel
> where they join the main loom and wedged wires in behind the plugs. This
> could perhaps be why I can't get it going.
Switching - the engine needs fuel and air. To get the fuel it needs
electricity to energise the stop solenoid on the fuel pump. The
immobiliser interrupts this if it can't see an RF chip in a key at the
coil on the ignition barrel. Your engine sounds immobilised to me as
you've got all the idiot lights and the starter turning by jumping the
connections, all thats missing is fuel presumably.
The coil's connector definately hasn't been dislodged, and it's wires
are all definately intact? It's not unknown for the coils to fail.
Heh, perhaps, there's some vital pair of wires you haven't connected.
Hope you get it going but I'd be getting me some tools, and going after
a barrel/key/coil set off some scrap vehicle and trying me some
experiments tomorrow. Dunno if the RF chips are coded to the pump or
the coil.
> Thanks very much for the advice and the warning. Advice part's quite
> reassuring (in as far as it's possible to reassure someone who thinks they
> may have knackered an expensive car)
I don't think you'll have knackered it completely. Might cost a few
quid in bits to fix though.
--
Douglas
Duncan Wood
wrote:
Normally the pumps ecu. The coils fairly dumb (totally dumb on many cars)
Dave J.
+0000, in uk.rec.cars.maintenance, 'Douglas Payne' wrote:
>> The shroud on this one has been broken in the past and superglued back
>> into place. I tried tugging at the entire casing in the hope of seeing
>> more and the superglued bit came away. Can see the coil but it looks
>> intact.
>
>Superglue? Alarm bells are ringing. This is the steering column shroud?
The shroud I mean is the plastic ring around the lock.
So much for the idea of early to bed and early to rise, tried it, failed,
and even usenet isn't enough to put me to sleep :)
Why do you say alarm bells are ringing? Looks to me as if some clumsy
technician has bashed it while fixing something else. Car was definitely
gone over with a fine toothed comb before it was sold. To the extent that
I'm halfway inclined to question the mileage.
Thanks again, I'll let you know how I get on if you're a regular reader
here.
Dave J.
Douglas Payne
> In MsgID<5vcsq2F...@mid.individual.net> on Fri, 18 Jan 2008 23:58:57
> +0000, in uk.rec.cars.maintenance, 'Douglas Payne' wrote:
>
>
>>>The shroud on this one has been broken in the past and superglued back
>>>into place. I tried tugging at the entire casing in the hope of seeing
>>>more and the superglued bit came away. Can see the coil but it looks
>>>intact.
>>
>>Superglue? Alarm bells are ringing. This is the steering column shroud?
>
>
> The shroud I mean is the plastic ring around the lock.
The round black thing with the little multiplug at the back? If the
housing's cracked or broken, that's where I'd put my money at the moment
as far as the non starting thing goes.
> So much for the idea of early to bed and early to rise, tried it, failed,
> and even usenet isn't enough to put me to sleep :)
>
> Why do you say alarm bells are ringing? Looks to me as if some clumsy
> technician has bashed it while fixing something else. Car was definitely
> gone over with a fine toothed comb before it was sold. To the extent that
> I'm halfway inclined to question the mileage.
Looks at the moment from what you say like some clumsy chap has broken
it, bodged it with superglue as a temporary fix and now its failed
completely, possibly because of the struggling with the gubbed steering
lock.
--
Douglas
Dave J.
+0000, in uk.rec.cars.maintenance, 'Douglas Payne' wrote:
>
>Sounds rightly immobilised to me. My 306 also flashes a light on the
>instrument cluster when it's being turned over whilst immobilised. A
>sort of flash flash... flash flash... flash flash while it turns over.
Can anyone tell me about the immobilisation methodology, I've seen mention
of 'resetting' WRT other cars and I wonder if there's a parallel on the
Peug 106 '03.
Also, is there anything I'm supposed to do after the system's been powered
down by battery disconnection?
As a last resort, I've seen mention that there at least *was* a way to
bypass the immobiliser, which is something I would have thought
impossible. Unfortunately, that may only apply to older versions.
Does anyone know any more detail?
Thanks
Dave
Dave J.
+0000, in uk.rec.cars.maintenance, 'Douglas Payne' wrote:
>> The shroud I mean is the plastic ring around the lock.
>
>The round black thing with the little multiplug at the back? If the
>housing's cracked or broken, that's where I'd put my money at the moment
>as far as the non starting thing goes.
Not that it really makes a difference, but no, the housing/facia in front
of the pickup coil, the plastic 'rim' you see around the lock. I've looked
inside as much as I can, without removing the rest of the facia for fear
of causing any (further) damage, the coil appears intact.
Please see my other posting if you've any ideas over the immobilisation.
It's the sort of fault that would normally cause me to double check I've
plugged everything in correctly, but AFAICT I have and everything's where
it should be.
The other possibility is that I've misuderstood the switch wiring and
there's something wrong with my 'hotwire' technique. I didn't receive the
car-theft apprenticship that seems to be provided for youngsters in this
area. Could do with being fifteen again and hanging around with the 'back
of shed' smoking crew for a while ;(
Anyhow, I'm off outside to continue tinkering. At least the weather's
improved :)
Thanks
Dave.
Dave J.
>Dave J. wrote:
>> In MsgID<5vcsq2F...@mid.individual.net> on Fri, 18 Jan 2008 23:58:57
>> +0000, in uk.rec.cars.maintenance, 'Douglas Payne' wrote:
>>
>>
>>>>The shroud on this one has been broken in the past and superglued back
>>>>into place. I tried tugging at the entire casing in the hope of seeing
>>>>more and the superglued bit came away. Can see the coil but it looks
>>>>intact.
>>>
>>>Superglue? Alarm bells are ringing. This is the steering column shroud?
>>
>>
>> The shroud I mean is the plastic ring around the lock.
>
>The round black thing with the little multiplug at the back? If the
>housing's cracked or broken, that's where I'd put my money at the moment
>as far as the non starting thing goes.
OK, well I've managed to almost dismantle the steering column. The thing
that was holding me as the light faded tonight was a plug at the back of
the assembly behind the wheel. It takes the airbag feed from the rotating
cuff to the wiring loom. There's a plug/socket fitting that I think is
secured some sort of pry apart/squeeze together trick to stop it falling
off. Only snag is I can't see how because of where it is.
To fit your (Douglas) 306 experience, it's the 'orange wire' output from
the back of the steering assembly. The wire travels from the airbag, to a
rotating cuff inside the steering wheel.
The rotating cuff then feeds out to a static socket around the back of the
indicator/wiper assembly. I can't get the plug out of that static socket.
Without removing that I can't move the cuff, and without removing the cuff
I don't think I can get the switch assembly out of the way. Without moving
that assembly I'm never going to figure out how to replace the ignition
barrel.
So far I've successfully pulled the plug to pieces (and put it back
together) but I can't persuade it to disengage and, as the car's not
wholly mine I'm not willing to be quite as brutish as I would on the well
maintained museum piece I'd prefer.
Is it just Peugeots or have all modern cars become plasticised nightmares
to work on?
Oh, and a definite 'thanks' to whomsoever said they'd got a necessary tool
from a pound-shop. The smallest star drive is missing from my kit (hadn't
realised it's a 'torx' kit) and the local pound-shop obligingly provided a
strange square tool which mysteriously fitted. My kit fits the rest.
Anyone dealt with that airbag feed plug/socket before? What's the trick?
I won't get away with cutting the wire and stripblocking it together as
there isn't the clearance for the plug to travel through the hole. :-(
Thanks for any help
Dave
Douglas Payne
Heh, the 205 I had was a nightmare, bits of the dash would frequently
break off and the plastic screw holes would snap or strip at any
available opportunity. The 306's insides are made of plastics that lend
themselves better to being the insides of a car.
> Oh, and a definite 'thanks' to whomsoever said they'd got a necessary tool
> from a pound-shop. The smallest star drive is missing from my kit (hadn't
> realised it's a 'torx' kit) and the local pound-shop obligingly provided a
> strange square tool which mysteriously fitted. My kit fits the rest.
>
> Anyone dealt with that airbag feed plug/socket before? What's the trick?
>
> I won't get away with cutting the wire and stripblocking it together as
> there isn't the clearance for the plug to travel through the hole. :-(
I feel your pain, but the plug on the column probably only attaches the
dash loom to the steering column, you might not have to undo the
connector you're having bother with at all. I levered the 306's driver
airbag connector on the column apart with a BFO screwdriver, can't
remember if it had a squeezey unlock arangement or not. It was black.
This is how the 306 was arranged:
The airbag unit itself has a plug on the back, the wires from this plug
go to the rotating cuff. Undo the 2 torx screws on the back of the
steering wheel holding the airbag on. Lift the airbag out a small way
and simply unplug it. Once the airbag's off you can stop shitting
yourself every time you prod its wiring. (c: That's what I did anyway.
The cuff will be attached to the column under the steering wheel after
you've removed the bolt holding the wheel on. 3 torx screws on the 306,
but unless you actually want to remove the whole steering column you
probably won't need to move the cuff.
This may seem a bit condescending, but this stuff is all in the Haynes
manual. With pictures probably. You're going a bit mad for hotwiring
it, are you sure it needs to be this complicated? I'd have had the
barrel out and the RF coil thing changed ages ago, just to make sure.
--
Douglas - Probably giving more 2ps than are welcome by now.
Dave J.
+0000, in uk.rec.cars.maintenance, 'Douglas Payne' wrote:
>I feel your pain, but the plug on the column probably only attaches the
>dash loom to the steering column, you might not have to undo the
>connector you're having bother with at all. I levered the 306's driver
>airbag connector on the column apart with a BFO screwdriver, can't
>remember if it had a squeezey unlock arangement or not. It was black.
>
Just curiousity, but 'BFO' (screwdriver)?
"Budge the Flamin Object" ? ;)
>This is how the 306 was arranged:
[...]
>The cuff will be attached to the column under the steering wheel after
>you've removed the bolt holding the wheel on. 3 torx screws on the 306,
>but unless you actually want to remove the whole steering column you
>probably won't need to move the cuff.
As I mention below, I will need to remove the wiper/indicatory assembly in
order to get at the ignition mountings. The airbag on this is wired to the
rotatating cuff, I've disconnected at the airbag and put the explosive
part safely away ;-)
The rotating cuff then has a static plug/socket which pokes through a hole
in the wiper/indicator assembly. It's that plug and socket which need to
part company.
>This may seem a bit condescending, but this stuff is all in the Haynes
>manual. With pictures probably. You're going a bit mad for hotwiring
>it, are you sure it needs to be this complicated? I'd have had the
>barrel out and the RF coil thing changed ages ago, just to make sure.
You don't seem condescending, a Haynes is something I may buy today,
though I don't know that I definitely need it. I've got the relevant parts
almost totally to pieces and once the tool problem was solved it's been
fairly simple so far. Don't forget I'm on a strict budget. Were I not then
in this weather I'd have paid to have had it towed to a real mechanic days
ago.
I've thoroughly given up on hotwiring because (as you say) the sensible
way forward is to eliminate the ignition barrel and associated electronics
by straightforward replacement.
In order to remove the switch assembly and get to the barrel I do need to
disconnect the feed to the airbag, the lead from the loom plugs into the
cuff through a hole in the assembly and a) there won't be enough slack on
the cable to work and b) since it won't move despite my removing every
other bolt I can see I think the only way to discover more about what's
holding it in place is to shift that cuff - it slides off the stalk and I
think there may be more bolts behind it. This means disconnecting that
wire anyhow.
There is no way around it, Haynes or no Haynes, that plug has to come out.
Daylight may help but it's currently seriously peeing down.
I think I'll head into town and investigate scrap parts, by the time I
return the weather may have cleared up and there may even be a hint here
about that perishin plug.
Thanks again, your responses help me stick at it. My not sticking at it
will *certainly* cost hundreds of pounds that I just do not have, and that
family tragedy I mentioned earlier is no joke at all :(
On top of all this I'm supposed to be seeking employment in some field
with more demand than my current computer vendor/repair-technician
occupation. Not sure how I'll combine that with visiting me Mum hundreds
of miles away..
Dave
Duncan Wood
If you can find a real scrapyard then you can break their plug :-) (& if
the airbags already gone off then thay won't care.
Douglas Payne
> In MsgID<5vi78sF...@mid.individual.net> on Mon, 21 Jan 2008 00:28:11
> +0000, in uk.rec.cars.maintenance, 'Douglas Payne' wrote:
>
>> I feel your pain, but the plug on the column probably only attaches the
>> dash loom to the steering column, you might not have to undo the
>> connector you're having bother with at all. I levered the 306's driver
>> airbag connector on the column apart with a BFO screwdriver, can't
>> remember if it had a squeezey unlock arangement or not. It was black.
>>
>
> Just curiousity, but 'BFO' (screwdriver)?
> "Budge the Flamin Object" ? ;)
"Big, Fuck-Off" (Screwdriver) (c:
>> This is how the 306 was arranged:
> [...]
>
> The rotating cuff then has a static plug/socket which pokes through a hole
> in the wiper/indicator assembly. It's that plug and socket which need to
> part company.
Thats how it was on the 306 too. The assembly was cable-tied onto the
column. Can you take a digital picture of it, perhaps I, or someone
here present could suggest how to undo it. My email address is valid.
>> This may seem a bit condescending, but this stuff is all in the Haynes
>> manual. With pictures probably. You're going a bit mad for hotwiring
>> it, are you sure it needs to be this complicated? I'd have had the
>> barrel out and the RF coil thing changed ages ago, just to make sure.
>
> You don't seem condescending, a Haynes is something I may buy today,
> though I don't know that I definitely need it. I've got the relevant parts
> almost totally to pieces and once the tool problem was solved it's been
> fairly simple so far. Don't forget I'm on a strict budget. Were I not then
> in this weather I'd have paid to have had it towed to a real mechanic days
> ago.
Saving money is the reason I embarked upon changing the heater matrix in
the 306 - £40 for the matrix but it's a lot of work (probably a few
hundred pounds) on a car that's only worth a few hundred pounds in my case.
> I've thoroughly given up on hotwiring because (as you say) the sensible
> way forward is to eliminate the ignition barrel and associated electronics
> by straightforward replacement.
Good lad.
> Thanks again, your responses help me stick at it. My not sticking at it
> will *certainly* cost hundreds of pounds that I just do not have, and that
> family tragedy I mentioned earlier is no joke at all :(
Sorry to hear about family tragedy.
It's taking a long time though. By the end you'll be a bloody expert!
--
Douglas
Dave J.
+0000, in uk.rec.cars.maintenance, 'Douglas Payne' wrote:
[...]
>> Just curiousity, but 'BFO' (screwdriver)?
>> "Budge the Flamin Object" ? ;)
>
>"Big, Fuck-Off" (Screwdriver) (c:
<G> Should have thought of that, but your usenet persona seemed to imply
it was a genuine tool type (:
>
>>> This is how the 306 was arranged:
>> [...]
>>
>
>> The rotating cuff then has a static plug/socket which pokes through a hole
>> in the wiper/indicator assembly. It's that plug and socket which need to
>> part company.
>
>Thats how it was on the 306 too. The assembly was cable-tied onto the
>column. Can you take a digital picture of it, perhaps I, or someone
>here present could suggest how to undo it. My email address is valid.
I've got myself a scrap barrel and electronics (against the predictions of
every garage I've spoken to as it's such a new variation) so I'll be
trying in earnest to spark the thing back to life tomorrow. Well, umm,
diesels don't (shouldn't!) have sparks, but you get the idea ;)
If I remain stuck I may try the digital photo idea, though the mirror
arrangement required to get the picture will probably be enough for me to
see how to do it.
On thinking about it, the digital camera might make an ideal 'periscope'
for seeing around corners.
[...]
>> Don't forget I'm on a strict budget. Were I not then
>> in this weather I'd have paid to have had it towed to a real mechanic days
>> ago.
>
>Saving money is the reason I embarked upon changing the heater matrix in
>the 306 - £40 for the matrix but it's a lot of work (probably a few
>hundred pounds) on a car that's only worth a few hundred pounds in my case.
Picking up a replacement lock and circuitry for 25 UKP when doing it the
Peugeot way would've been knocking on 200 quid before you've even added
much labour makes for quite a good start. I just hope I've damaged nothing
else in my pratting about. Mental note: Check fuses.. Anothe mad thing
about this beast, how many bleedin fuse boxes does a car *need* ? ! I've
found three so far and that's without really looking.
[...]
>Sorry to hear about family tragedy.
Some aspects of life are unavoidable and are guaranteed to happen sooner
than you'd wish. This one has a slightly cruel twist to it but is
otherwise nothing that others don't deal with.
>It's taking a long time though. By the end you'll be a bloody expert!
Lack of toolkit, unwillingness to delve any deeper than necessary, foul
weather, inability to sleep, consequent reduction in daylight, lack of
funds and generally being as slow, methodical and gentle as possible.
Fingers crossed for tomorrow.
Thanks for the hints and encouragement.
Dave J.
Douglas Payne
> I've got myself a scrap barrel and electronics (against the predictions of
> every garage I've spoken to as it's such a new variation) so I'll be
> trying in earnest to spark the thing back to life tomorrow. Well, umm,
> diesels don't (shouldn't!) have sparks, but you get the idea ;)
I know there was a changeover at about 1998 where they revamped the 106
and made it a wee bit curvier. Some of the electrics may have changed
at that time, as they probably started putting airbags and immobilisers
in them as standard but I've never really paid much attention to 106
history.
It can be worth strolling around scrapyards and used car dealerships
just to see what the outward differences are, but I suspect if they
could save a stack of money buying millions of 1 type of RF coil for
ignitions across the range, they would.
> Picking up a replacement lock and circuitry for 25 UKP when doing it the
> Peugeot way would've been knocking on 200 quid before you've even added
> much labour makes for quite a good start. I just hope I've damaged nothing
> else in my pratting about. Mental note: Check fuses.. Anothe mad thing
> about this beast, how many bleedin fuse boxes does a car *need* ? ! I've
> found three so far and that's without really looking.
My experience of car electrics is that they're generally quite
resilient, cars are pretty harsh environments for electronics as there's
lots of interference and varying voltages and the equipment has to be
designed to withstand common electrical problems like failing batteries
and alternators, so I'd remain hopeful.
If all the correct lights come on on the dash and the headlights and
indicators and interior lights and and windscreen wipers and horn and
things work OK with the ignition on, most of the major fuses will be intact.
The interior fuses and the fuses for rear lights will be under the dash
somewhere. The major engine bay equipment will be fused under the
bonnet somewhere, the box usually has BFO fuses in and there may be
another fusebox for stuff like the headlights under the bonnet if its
arranged anything like the 306 (and my 205 if I recall correctly).
Keep us appraised.
--
Douglas
Dave J.
in uk.rec.cars.maintenance, 'Dave J.' wrote:
>>It's taking a long time though. By the end you'll be a bloody expert!
>
>Lack of toolkit, unwillingness to delve any deeper than necessary, foul
>weather, inability to sleep, consequent reduction in daylight, lack of
>funds and generally being as slow, methodical and gentle as possible
Latest blasted problem, the old ignition barrel won't disengage.
I've got the old key turning in the lock, it'll go to any position
including the one that's supposed to release the two protusions securing
the barrel, but although they slacken slightly so you can push them
partway in, they won't move anything like far enough to slide the lock out
of the tube.
Bloody Nightmare! Anyone here with a genius method to 'persude' them
inward?
Maybe I can drill them out? Be well awkward to get the drill bit to line
up. If I had a grinder with a tiny wheel there might be a chance, though
the odds on SWMBO letting me near her much beloved peugeot with one of
those are nonexistent tending toward negative..
Arrgggh!
Why can't we stick to older vehicles. 20 odd year I was driving those and
I never once had anything I couldn't fix. Not that this element of the
problem has much to do with modernity; although wait until I get back to
the immobiliser. Just discovered the electronics is *slightly* different
so the most I can hope for is to borrow the coil if the original turns out
to be open circuit. With luck that won't come into it and the original
will be OK once (if!) I can get the lock changed.
Dave
Dave J.
+0000, in uk.rec.cars.maintenance, 'Douglas Payne' wrote:
>The interior fuses and the fuses for rear lights will be under the dash
>somewhere. The major engine bay equipment will be fused under the
>bonnet somewhere, the box usually has BFO fuses in and there may be
>another fusebox for stuff like the headlights under the bonnet if its
>arranged anything like the 306 (and my 205 if I recall correctly).
>
>Keep us appraised.
Daylight expired before I remembered to check the fuses, but I imagine
you're right that any failures would have shown symptoms of some sort.
Although.. Actually, it's *possible* the receiver circuit could have a
feed of its own to keep it seperate from voltage transients courtesy of
other knicknacks. And, if that were the problem the symptom would indeed
be immobilisation..
Don't know, guesswork at the end of the day, but you did suggest that I
keep you informed :)
Got the mechanism changed over, had to rejig the plugs. Peugeot obviously
decided to make it awkward to substitute one year's switch for another's.
Switch itself is mechanically identical, with identical pattern of
conntections at the back of the switch-blade assembly and identical colour
coding. Also three identical plugs to connect to the loom. Only thing is,
they swapped one plug for another. *WHY* ? !
After snipping the wires and resoldering/insulating them to the correct
plugs all the ignition seems perfect, as it did when I hotwired it.
Safisfactorily neat and tidy when all plugged in.
Still no broom-broom :-((
At this rate it's gonna be a long walk..
Ideas, mad, bad or dangerous, as welcome as ever. (-;
Dave J.
Dave J.
in uk.rec.cars.maintenance, 'Dave J.' wrote:
>After snipping the wires and resoldering/insulating them to the correct
>plugs all the ignition seems perfect, as it did when I hotwired it.
>Safisfactorily neat and tidy when all plugged in.
>
>Still no broom-broom :-((
Anyone, any ideas at all?
Everything looks perfect, right key electronic key fob for the car bolted
to mechanical key section that fits replacement mechanical lock, all
ignition stages look absolutely right. Just won't start.
If I could bypass the immobiliser it'd be a beautiful miracle. AFAICT it's
*got* to be that which is preventing it from starting. The original
electronics are around the mechanical lock, all plugged in to the wiring
loom exactly as they were before. No other symptoms of any problem
*except* a failure to start up.
No way forward that I can see except giving in, having it towed to a
garage, paying their exorbitant towing charges followed by their well
earned hourly rate, followed by the mental prices Peugeot charge for a
replacement lock system.
Temporary immobiliser bypass? Seriously, anything to make it go again,
things are magnificently disastrous, right here & right now.
Anyone, anywhere, any ideas at all ? ?
Please?
Dave
Duncan Wood
Have you tried a new key?
PCPaul
> Temporary immobiliser bypass? Seriously, anything to make it go again,
> things are magnificently disastrous, right here & right now.
>
> Anyone, anywhere, any ideas at all ? ?
>
I had a mobile auto electrician come out and remove a factory immobiliser
from an Astra, no problem. Was about £50, but that was a few years ago...
Douglas Payne
> In MsgID<fn6n5c$fl6$1...@news.datemas.de> on Wed, 23 Jan 2008 06:34:28 +0000,
> in uk.rec.cars.maintenance, 'Dave J.' wrote:
>
>
>>After snipping the wires and resoldering/insulating them to the correct
>>plugs all the ignition seems perfect, as it did when I hotwired it.
>>Safisfactorily neat and tidy when all plugged in.
>>
>>Still no broom-broom :-((
>
>
> Anyone, any ideas at all?
>
> Everything looks perfect, right key electronic key fob for the car bolted
> to mechanical key section that fits replacement mechanical lock, all
> ignition stages look absolutely right. Just won't start.
>
> If I could bypass the immobiliser it'd be a beautiful miracle. AFAICT it's
> *got* to be that which is preventing it from starting. The original
> electronics are around the mechanical lock, all plugged in to the wiring
> loom exactly as they were before. No other symptoms of any problem
> *except* a failure to start up.
)c: I've pretty much run out of ideas. I suspect that even if someone
here present did have info on how to bypass the immobiliser, they'd not
be inclined to publish how to do it online anyway.
> No way forward that I can see except giving in, having it towed to a
> garage, paying their exorbitant towing charges followed by their well
> earned hourly rate, followed by the mental prices Peugeot charge for a
> replacement lock system.
Try an auto electrician? You might find a mobile one in your area in
the Yellow Pages or somesuch.
> Temporary immobiliser bypass? Seriously, anything to make it go again,
> things are magnificently disastrous, right here & right now.
>
> Anyone, anywhere, any ideas at all ? ?
Clutching at straws:
Did it start with the key stuck in the ignition?
Has it got fuel in it?
--
Douglas
Dave J.
uk.rec.cars.maintenance, 'Duncan Wood' wrote:
>>
>> Temporary immobiliser bypass? Seriously, anything to make it go again,
>> things are magnificently disastrous, right here & right now.
>>
>> Anyone, anywhere, any ideas at all ? ?
>>
>> Please?
>Have you tried a new key?
Key came with replacement lock. Fitted mechanical bit to electronic chunk
of original so that (in therory) the immobiliser should be happy.
It's not :(
Dave
Dave J.
Judging by what I've read, there's no way around the immobiliser unless
anyone here knows better.
Dave
Dave J.
+0000, in uk.rec.cars.maintenance, 'Douglas Payne' wrote:
>> If I could bypass the immobiliser it'd be a beautiful miracle. AFAICT it's
>> *got* to be that which is preventing it from starting. The original
>> electronics are around the mechanical lock, all plugged in to the wiring
>> loom exactly as they were before. No other symptoms of any problem
>> *except* a failure to start up.
>
>)c: I've pretty much run out of ideas. I suspect that even if someone
>here present did have info on how to bypass the immobiliser, they'd not
>be inclined to publish how to do it online anyway.
I suspect there just isn't any way around it. If I'm wrong then the
reply-to address on this posting is in perfect working order and is
checked regularly, though current one is only usually for mailing lists.
I'm extremely peeved with the whole thing. I'd much rather make an
insurance claim whenever I'm dumb enough to leave it minus a steering lock
and/or minus my style of DIY immobiliser than to be unable to start my OWN
damn car after all the careful work I've put in.
>
>> No way forward that I can see except giving in, having it towed to a
>> garage, paying their exorbitant towing charges followed by their well
>> earned hourly rate, followed by the mental prices Peugeot charge for a
>> replacement lock system.
>
>Try an auto electrician? You might find a mobile one in your area in
>the Yellow Pages or somesuch.
Hadn't thought of electrician idea, have tried service centres but they
just say that I should tow it in so they can charge me 71 or 81 UKP + VAT
for their time. :-((
>> Temporary immobiliser bypass? Seriously, anything to make it go again,
>> things are magnificently disastrous, right here & right now.
>>
>> Anyone, anywhere, any ideas at all ? ?
>
>Clutching at straws:
Enough straws would make a raft. All straws welcome.
>
>Did it start with the key stuck in the ignition?
Combination of original electronic part and new mechanical part is in
ignition. Everything looks perfect. Key fits, system powers up lovely,
seems quite happy, internal steering lock disengages, ignition goes live,
heater timer works, starter motor spins, but will not run. Just can't
understand what I've done to spoil it. Horrible feeling of disappointment.
>
>Has it got fuel in it?
I'm not quite that stupid unfortunately (AFAICT!). Only wish I was. What
I've done should have fixed the fault unless there's something happening
I'm not aware of (some way of resetting the system after tinkerings? What
could I have broken? Any ideas anyone?)
Really really totally stuck. Very very unhappy. Not your fault. Thanks for
what you've (plural, applies to everyone who's answered) offered.
Batterey's on charge. Final attempt tomorrow. Will trace wires from lock
electronics to car electronics and check the links. Yes, also clutching at
straws. :-((
Thanks for what you've tried.
Tell you what, I'll at least get a good night's sleep now.
Regretfully yours,
Dave J.
Duncan Wood
But that key will have the wrong immobilizer code
Duncan Wood
the new key will have the wrong immobiliser code, try the old key next to
the coil .
Dave J.
uk.rec.cars.maintenance, 'Duncan Wood' wrote:
>On Thu, 24 Jan 2008 02:23:10 -0000, Dave J. <req...@freeuk.com> wrote:
>
>> In MsgID<op.t5d85ek8yuobwl@lucy> on Wed, 23 Jan 2008 17:49:52 -0000, in
>> uk.rec.cars.maintenance, 'Duncan Wood' wrote:
>>
>>>>
>>>> Temporary immobiliser bypass? Seriously, anything to make it go again,
>>>> things are magnificently disastrous, right here & right now.
>>>>
>>>> Anyone, anywhere, any ideas at all ? ?
>>>>
>>>> Please?
>>
>>> Have you tried a new key?
>>
>> Key came with replacement lock. Fitted mechanical bit to electronic chunk
>> of original so that (in therory) the immobiliser should be happy.
>>
>> It's not :(
>But that key will have the wrong immobilizer code
Sorry, you've misunderstood me. All the electronics on the car has been
left as it originally was, the mechanical part of the lock has been
changed.
Then, the mechanical part of the new key has been fitted to the electronic
part of the *old* key, so the key code is as it was when I started, as is
the car's electronics.
If you see what I mean? I've changed the mechanical lock and *only* the
*mechanical* part of the key. The car's electronics has been untouched and
the electronics on the key is also as it was when I started.
I've swapped the mechanical section of the keys, so I have a composite key
made of the new mechanical slider and the old electronic chunk.
The only bits I've changed are the mechanical bit of the lock and the
mechanical bit of the key.
So, the key which fits the mechanical lock now has the replacement slider
but the original electronic keycode. It should therefore (in theory) match
the original *electronics* but the replacement *mechanism*.
All that's been altered is the mechanical section of the key and the
mechanical section of the lock. Everything else (all the electronics, both
on the key and on the car) is exactly as it was when I started.
Hence my puzzlement and my fear that I've damaged the ID reader.
Dave.
Duncan Wood
So back to the original question, have you tried a new key with new
electronics, the keys die more often than the immobiliser.
Dave J.
uk.rec.cars.maintenance, 'Duncan Wood' wrote:
[...]
>>
>> Key came with replacement lock. Fitted mechanical bit to electronic chunk
>> of original so that (in therory) the immobiliser should be happy.
>>
>> It's not :(
>>
>> Dave
>
>
>the new key will have the wrong immobiliser code, try the old key next to
>the coil .
Please see my earlier reply to exactly that point, you've misunderstood.
The key I'm using has the new *slider* but the old *electronics*. The
electronics on the car presumably still expects the old keycode from the
old key-electronics. The key which fits the new mechanical lock now has
the old (original) electronics.
I've swapped the electronic sections of the keys over. Key I'm using is
now a composite; new slider, old electronic ID chunk. It was a matter of
one grub screw to exchange the sliders. Similarly, all the electronics on
the car is as it was when I started.
God do I wish it was a braindead mistake like that. Thanks for replying
anyway. Hope you've understood either this post or my earlier one.
I wish someone could tell me the slight difference between models of the
electronic reader section (on the car). I have a replacemement for that
part of the lock and it's almost identical, but not quite. One extra wire
but otherwise same colour codes. Circuitry likewise almost identical. It
would be so good if I could swap that part over because it's the only
fault I can think of.
Dave
Dave J.
uk.rec.cars.maintenance, 'Duncan Wood' wrote:
I've tried the composite key in the lock, combined with another original
key close to the receiver coil around the barrel yes. Second thing I tried
:(
Both original keys worked perfectly before the problem.
Now, on top of car problems, the HD on my Smoothwall (router) box is
making very suspicious noises. That really would be all I need, lose my
internet connection mid problem... Never ever ever ever ask yourself 'what
else can go wrong?' - you will usually get an answer ;(
Thanks
Dave
Duncan Wood
Ok, next check is continuity on the sense coil, it'll be quite high, but
about the same for both
Dave J.
uk.rec.cars.maintenance, 'Duncan Wood' wrote:
>On Thu, 24 Jan 2008 13:32:53 -0000, Dave J. <req...@freeuk.com> wrote:
>
>> In MsgID<op.t5flyrjvyuobwl@lucy> on Thu, 24 Jan 2008 11:24:17 -0000, in
>> uk.rec.cars.maintenance, 'Duncan Wood' wrote:
>>
>>>> Hence my puzzlement and my fear that I've damaged the ID reader.
>>>>
>>>> Dave.
>>>
>>> So back to the original question, have you tried a new key with new
>>> electronics, the keys die more often than the immobiliser
>>
>> I've tried the composite key in the lock, combined with another original
>> key close to the receiver coil around the barrel yes. Second thing I
>> tried
>> :(
>>
>> Both original keys worked perfectly before the problem.
>>
>> Now, on top of car problems, the HD on my Smoothwall (router) box is
>> making very suspicious noises. That really would be all I need, lose my
>> internet connection mid problem... Never ever ever ever ask yourself
>> 'what
>> else can go wrong?' - you will usually get an answer ;(
>>
>> Thanks
>>
>> Dave
>
>
>Ok, next check is continuity on the sense coil, it'll be quite high, but
>about the same for both
Thanks for that, though I beat you to it ;)
I hate to admit it but I'd given up on checking usenet..
Rather than do the sensible continuity checking I just went ahead and
swapped the circuitry between the coils.
Broom-Broom! ;-))
Only bastard is, somehow - I know not how - I lost an original key so
someone may now have a way to open the doors and the immobiliser code that
would enable them to hotwire it :-(
SHMBO won't put up with my homebrew alternative immobiliser so we're
*still* gonna be looking at a stupid bill. Perhaps slightly less stupid
now I've used scrap stuff for some of the replacements but still well more
than the job's worth, I'll bet.
Really peeved with myself, god knows how I mislaid that key, it may be
stuck in the engine but I can't see it and if I can't find it then I've
got to assume it's been found by one of the other residents of hot-car
alley (where I live)
Oh well, it runs again and I can stop it running for the wrong person. The
bill will now be the ladyfriend's fault, not that that will stop me owing
half of it of course...
Thanks for all the encouragement.
Dave
Duncan Wood
Glad you got there in the end. Any auto electricians will sell you an
alarm that'll immobilise the car for way less than Peugeot.
Dave J.
>> Oh well, it runs again and I can stop it running for the wrong person.
>> The
>> bill will now be the ladyfriend's fault, not that that will stop me owing
>> half of it of course...
>>
>> Thanks for all the encouragement.
>>
>> Dave
>
>
>Glad you got there in the end. Any auto electricians will sell you an
>alarm that'll immobilise the car for way less than Peugeot.
Is there any way to recode the existing immobiliser? How much is it likely
to cost?
I can't believe what I (think) I did. I went to lock the car (forgetting
about the remote control as the key I usually use doesn't have one) left
the key in the door while I went to reconnect the battery so the central
locking would work, connected the battery, shut the bonnet, and then
noticed it (key) was missing.
Ass umed I'd left it under the bonnet, spent 1/2 hr sussing how to open
the bonnet from outside the car and then discovered the key wasn't there
after all.
All I can think is some toerag nabbed it from the door while my back was
turned.
I'm definitely losing it, just discovered (five hours after begining above
posting) that I've managed to mislay my wondrous toolkit (plastic bag
containing all the necessary bits and pieces for dismantling/reassembling
the relevant bits of the car) things ain't lookin too wonderful right now
but I guess I oughta resist the temptation to crosspost to
alt.depression.drunken ...
fuckit, general feeling of no point strugglin on ain't exactly unusual and
ain't usually insurmountable. WGAF... ;-) Anyhow, I can't be that bad, the
fingers still produce the words I'm thinking onscreen... :-)
Dave J.
Duncan Wood
>>>
>>> Oh well, it runs again and I can stop it running for the wrong person.
>>> The
>>> bill will now be the ladyfriend's fault, not that that will stop me
>>> owing
>>> half of it of course...
>>>
>>> Thanks for all the encouragement.
>>>
>>> Dave
>>
>>
>> Glad you got there in the end. Any auto electricians will sell you an
>> alarm that'll immobilise the car for way less than Peugeot.
>
> Is there any way to recode the existing immobiliser? How much is it
> likely
> to cost?
>
Yes, but not the cheapest ways buy the keys & engine managemeny ECU from
another one, which is a world of pain. Just fit an aftermarket one. If you
can get the door locks from the one you got the ignition barrel from then
that'll probably solve it anyway.
Dave J.
uk.rec.cars.maintenance, 'Duncan Wood' wrote:
>> Is there any way to recode the existing immobiliser? How much is it
>> likely
>> to cost?
>>
>
>Yes, but not the cheapest ways buy the keys & engine managemeny ECU from
>another one, which is a world of pain. Just fit an aftermarket one. If you
>can get the door locks from the one you got the ignition barrel from then
>that'll probably solve it anyway.
Hadn't thought of that, good idea. Ladyfriend may not be too happy at not
having a remote control though. Only final snag is a lack of a spare
electronic ID for the locks. We'd also have to make do with a single key
as I now have only the one ID unit.
Any idea of the price of a duplicate key with a remote (we have the code
for the original) as I could then presumably get a spline to match the new
ignition mechanics and bolt it into the remote control. Obviously that
would have to wait, but at least it's something to say to SWMBO.
This area is a right nightmare to live.
I'll now also have to buy a new tool set..
Can't even remember where I found the Torx kit I was using.
El-cheapo socket set will have to do to be going on with and I envisage
another visit to that pound shop for the other bits and bobs.
Mind you, I have some devious ideas for recovering the (I suspect stolen)
original key which would fix the problem almost completely. Mini crystal
controled transmitter and door-light switches spring to mind. The car's
parked directly outside our flat and there is a back door..
Cheers
Dave.