JA Michell turntable or Oracle Delphi V?
KL Cheung
humble Rega P3/RB300 to my ultimate Turntable.
Any comments on the following are most welcome before I decide:
JA Michell Orbe SE
Oracle Delphi V
Rega P9
Do they need to mate with specific tonearm? say SME V or IV, RB 900/600?
Regards
KL
TGN
beyond the sound, is that Michell Engineering are the best company I've ever
had to deal with for service. It's solidly built and will last for ever.
Graeme
--
"Expansion leaves the ashes of change."
Graeme Nattress: nattress at dircon dot co dot uk
www.nattress.dircon.co.uk/pixels
Stewart Pinkerton
>I have a Gyrodec with an FR64fx, and it's great. The best thing about the Gyro
>beyond the sound, is that Michell Engineering are the best company I've ever
>had to deal with for service. It's solidly built and will last for ever.
Graeme, this just doesn't answer the question. Is there anyone out
there who has actually compared the Orbe with the Oracle, using the
same arm and cart? Inquiring minds want to know!
I have a GyroDec/RB300/OC9, but I still lust after an Oracle!
--
Stewart Pinkerton | Music is art, audio is engineering
David Allcock
In article <3899edf2....@news.dircon.co.uk>,
pat...@popmail.dircon.co.uk (Stewart Pinkerton) wrote:
>TGN <natt...@dircon.co.uk> writes:
>
>>I have a Gyrodec with an FR64fx, and it's great. The best
thing about the Gyro
>>beyond the sound, is that Michell Engineering are the best
company I've ever
>>had to deal with for service. It's solidly built and will last
for ever.
I canc ertainly back up Graeme's view here, I've also had
dealings with Michell Engineering and they really do look
after their customers. I've had a Syncro for 11 years and it was
used when I purchased it, so yes the Michell decks
really do just keep on running.
>
>Graeme, this just doesn't answer the question. Is there anyone
out
>there who has actually compared the Orbe with the Oracle, using
the
>same arm and cart? Inquiring minds want to know!
>
Sorry to dissapoint you Stewart, but I've never had the chance
to carry out this comparison either. I wish I could
though :-)
What I can tell you is this, the Orbe SE is probably one of the
bargains in the high end here in the UK. It's beautifully
finished, built to last a lifetime and the sound is incredible
for the money. Even with the basic RB-300 arm it can still
mix it with the very best T/T's in the world. I can only imagine
what one would sound like with an arm of the calibre
of the Graham 2.0 (one of the very best, if not the best
tangential tracking arm in the world). To answer the original
question you can order suitable arm boards for the Orbe SE to
use it with just about any arm available today. The
Orbe is often used with the Rega arms (the RB-300 is the
standard arm supplied) or the SME arms (which I would not
recommend due to their lack of transparency in my experience).
If your budget can stretch to an Orbe SE and a
SME, I'd try and get a used Graham 1.5 t/c or even a 2.0. The
Graham uses the SME armboard but to my ears has
far more resolution, is much more neutral and is the most
transparent arm I've ever heard. Yes I am biased, as I'm
lucky enough to use a 2.0 myself and it will go with me to my
grave!!! For me the RB-300 will knock you out, and
from there I really believe that you may as well save for a used
Graham, as the Rega arm is so good there is very
little out there that betters it by a big enough margin to
justify the extra expenditure.
The comments on the arms holds equally true for the Oracle V
T/T. Now I've never heard this deck, but I do know a
couple of people who use the III, and are very happy with it. It
has been commented that the deck isn't the most
fluid deck when it comes to music reproduction, but it is very
neutral, so a great recording will sound great, and a
poor recording will sound pure. If you are looking for total
neutrality the Oracle is very much like the Orbe in this
respect. The build quality is excellent and Oracle once again
seems to be on a secure financial footing, so they will
be around to service your deck for years to come.
In short you have the kind of decision many of us wish we faced.
Either deck will give you a great deal of pleasure,
both are fuss free and require very little tweaking once up and
running. I'd be swayed to the Orbe SE, primarily
because Michell Engineering are in the UK and I've perviously
owned their Syncro. But in Hong Kong I would not like
to comment on what the import duty and shipping, not to mention
importer mark up's may have done to the price of
the Michell deck.
Good luck with your decision, I'#d love to know which deck you
eventually go for. If I can be of any further
assistance then please don't hesitate to drop me a line.
Regards and best wishes,
Do you still listen to vinyl records?
If so come and see us fellow record lovers at:-
http://www.analogue-domain.org.uk
>I have a GyroDec/RB300/OC9, but I still lust after an Oracle!
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Nick Hadlow
<david.allc...@ukonline.co.uk.invalid> writes
<v.large snip>
> I'd be swayed to the Orbe SE, primarily
>because Michell Engineering are in the UK and I've perviously
>owned their Syncro.
deal of pleasure from my record player without trying anything
pervious...
(sorry everyone)
--
Nick Hadlow, UK
KL Cheung
I lean more towards the Orbe SE, but staying with RB300 does not upgrade to
my ultimate turntable.
I must admit that I love classical music more than changing gears.
My choice left are :
RB600, ?simply RB300 with better cable and neutrix plugs. I heard good
review on the P25/RB600.
SME V, very expensive at same price as the Orbe SE, classic bench mark
tonearm
Graham 2.0, basic or deluxe. Jeee, what a different do they mean? any help?
They need extra interface box
> Orbe is often used with the Rega arms (the RB-300 is the
> standard arm supplied) or the SME arms (which I would not
> recommend due to their lack of transparency in my experience).
> If your budget can stretch to an Orbe SE and a
> SME, I'd try and get a used Graham 1.5 t/c or even a 2.0.
What gears did you use? Why are you not happy with the SME V?
> Graham uses the SME armboard but to my ears has
> far more resolution, is much more neutral and is the most
> transparent arm I've ever heard. Yes I am biased, as I'm
> lucky enough to use a 2.0 myself and it will go with me to my
> grave!!! The build quality is excellent and Oracle once again
> seems to be on a secure financial footing, so they will
> be around to service your deck for years to come.
yes, Oracle looks beautiful, but the dealer is slobby here in HK.
Definitely over-priced. No chance of auditioning or even viewing.!! Sign....
KL
Hong Kong
David Allcock
In article <87qs97$mv4$1...@justice.csc.cuhk.edu.hk>, "KL Cheung"
<kl-c...@cuhk.edu.hk> wrote:
>Thank you David for your advise.
>
>I lean more towards the Orbe SE, but staying with RB300 does
not upgrade to
>my ultimate turntable.
> I must admit that I love classical music more than changing
gears.
>My choice left are :
>
>RB600, ?simply RB300 with better cable and neutrix plugs. I
heard good
>review on the P25/RB600.
>SME V, very expensive at same price as the Orbe SE, classic
bench mark
>tonearm
>Graham 2.0, basic or deluxe. Jeee, what a different do they
mean? any help?
The RB-600 has better bearings & better internal cabling (always
held to be a major failing of the original RB-300) but
the design is essentially the same. The SME V is a classic arm,
but as I'll explain later to my ears it has been riding on
it's laurels a little bit too long. The Graham 2.0 is held by
many to be the finest tangential tracking arm available
today. Whilst I do not feel comfortable with absolutes in audio
(so much depends on the interaction with partnering
equipment) it is definitely up there as one of the best. The
difference between the basic and the deluxe is a matter
of wether the alignment jigs and tools are included or not. I'd
say definitely get the deluxe. It is more expensive, but
the jigs and tools will mean you can easily move the arm to
another deck in the future and carry out alignment at
your leisure, not when the dealer happens to be able to fit you
in. For me I try and be as self sufficient as possible
where matters analogue are concerned as there are practically no
decent dealers near where I live and no one who
has any familiarity with the Graham class of analogue audio
equipment. In case you haven't guessed, I have a 2.0
deluxe myself.
>They need extra interface box
>
Not true! The interface box is only needed if you want to use
general (RCA - RCA) interconnect to connect up the
arm to the phono stage. I didn't buy the interface box, instead
I purchased a dedicated phono cable with a 90
degree SME 5 pin DIN connector to go into the arm and RCA's at
the other end. This means fewer joins in the cable
and less opportunity to mess up the delicate phono signal from
the cart.
>> Orbe is often used with the Rega arms (the RB-300 is the
>> standard arm supplied) or the SME arms (which I would not
>> recommend due to their lack of transparency in my experience).
>> If your budget can stretch to an Orbe SE and a
>> SME, I'd try and get a used Graham 1.5 t/c or even a 2.0.
>
>What gears did you use? Why are you not happy with the SME V?
Now I know the SME is well respected and the SME V arm was, when
it was released, a landmark design. I heard the
SME V about 2 years after it came out on a Pink Triangle. Whilst
it's imaging was very good, there was a veil thrown
across the top end of the frequency spectrum which extended down
into the midrange. Instead of looking through
crystal clear glass into the recording, I was instead looking
through acrylic which had been lightly sanded. The bass
seemed very slow and over blown to me also. I heard the same
combo about 3 years ago with the Ortofon Rohmann
cart. and this feeling of veiling was still there for me even
though the phono stage, amplification and speakers were
totally different. I just cannot deal with the veiling that the
SME causes when compared with the Graham. To my
ears the sonic problems of the RB-300 are far less intrusive to
my enjoyment of the music than those of the SME V,
hence my recommendation of going for the RB-300 and then moving
straight to the Graham. For me the lack of
absolute precision in the formation of the soundstage, the
slight graininess at the top end, the slight curtailing of the
upper frequencies and the lack of absolute bass depth of the
RB-300 are more tolerable. This might sound like a long
list of problems, but when you factor in that I am comparing the
RB-300 to a Graham 2.0 then you realise that for
the RB-300 to stand comparison with the Graham and only have
these problems speaks volumes about what an
incredible bargain an RB-300 is. I know that the top end and
imaging can be improved with better cabling. I have yet
to hear a tangential tracking arm which can truly match the
Graham in it's across the board abilities. For me it offers
state of the art reproduction in so many areas that once you
have over $1000, then for me a used Graham is the
only sensible choice.
>
>> Graham uses the SME armboard but to my ears has
>> far more resolution, is much more neutral and is the most
>> transparent arm I've ever heard. Yes I am biased, as I'm
>> lucky enough to use a 2.0 myself and it will go with me to my
>> grave!!! The build quality is excellent and Oracle once again
>> seems to be on a secure financial footing, so they will
>> be around to service your deck for years to come.
>
>yes, Oracle looks beautiful, but the dealer is slobby here in
HK.
>Definitely over-priced. No chance of auditioning or even
viewing.!! Sign....
Given the problems with the Oracle (which is truly a shame as
the Oracle is a truly excellent deck) the you'll
probably be better off with the Michell Orbe SE. I can assure
you that you will not be dissapointed.
I hope some of this has helped and has not served to add further
confusion. If I can be of any further assistance
then please do not hesitate to drop me a line.
Regards and best wishes,
David Allcock
Do you still listen to vinyl records?
If so come and see us fellow record lovers at:-
http://www.analogue-domain.org.uk
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KL Cheung
I have placed my order for the JA Michell Orbe SE and the SME V. I read
about good review on the Graham 2.0 deluxe but the price with the silver
cables is double of SME V. I also read somewhere on the net saying that the
Orbe is designed with SME V in mind.Not at all surprise in UK.
I know music appreciation is very personal perception. May I know what gear
do you use? May be the veil is the fault of the cartridge/phono
preamp/cable? I will used it with my Jadis DPL/Defy 7, driving my panel
speakers.
Would you care to advise on the choice of MC cartridges?
Regards
KL Cheung
>
R.Mui
Welcome to the Michell Club!
I am also interested in the SME V arm...but I better wait a bit as my
late incident with my car is gonna dry up my bank reserve! :-(
I am using the following: GyroSE + RB600 (Ortofon 6N Silver internal
wiring) + Benz Micro MO 0.9. Arm lead out cable is DIY silver solid
core (much like the Kimber KCAG braid but I have added my own shielding
for extra protection against RFI) to Lehman Black Cube (set to MC at
47KOhm). From the Lehman to amp is Kimber's KCAG. Amplifier is DIY
WE300B push-pull integrated driving B&W Matrix 801S3.
Regarding cartridge I have only tried Grado's Reference Platinum other
than the current Benz and the Grado lacked the resolution of the
Benz...although the extra warm midrange and slight exaggeration of
mid-bass might help certain systems. For myself and my system the Benz
is a major step up.
If you are interested to listen to my setup at all why don't you email
me privately for an audition before your Orbe arrives?
Regards,
Richard
KL Cheung 撰寫於文章 <88d5f7$40h$1...@justice.csc.cuhk.edu.hk>...