Western Realism: Proof That God Exists
Bob
Here are the questions from the earlier thread:
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>Only if you accept the tenets of Western Realism.
What are these tenets - are they generally agreed - is 'Western
Realism' a a widely accepted description?
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So give us something to show that they are not circular, padding in
between to separate them will not acheive that BTW. I for one would be
very interested to hear how you resolve the 'apparent' tautology.
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>A version, I remind you, is accepted by the vast majority of
>practicing Western scientists.
Can you give a reference for this? a representitive poll would do.
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I must admit that I am having problems finding the expression 'Western
Realism' on any philosophy websites I searched yesterday. Is there
more common name for this theory (or is it some sort of belief?).
Any useful links to sites with a relatively brief description of the
principle points (apart from 'I subscribe to this idea, therefore it
is the only acceptable and correct idea and cannot be compared to any
other ideas')?
Also, is it not self defeating in a discussion to presume that
discussion is only possible if all those taking part already agree on
everything, i.e. accept Western Realism as fact? Are the discussion
of various theories and ideas and the Supreme Being mutually
exclusive?
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As you can see, the essence of all those questions is: What is Western
Realism? So I will attempt to answer those questions here.
I do not understand why one poster could not find references to
"Western Realism" on the web. I used Google and found about 170
references. Here is a typcial entry from the Enclyclopedia Brittanica:
http://www.britannica.com/bcom/eb/article/5/0,5716,115425+5,00.html
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Realism
Distinctions among the Realisms
As previously noted, the term Realism has been applied retroactively
to the transcendence of the Platonic Forms or Ideas, to the extent
that for Plato the natures of things have, in the ideas of them, an
existence more real than that of sensible, individual things. Yet,
from its emphasis on ideal as opposed to concrete existence, this
Platonic doctrine would be classed as an Idealism instead of a
Realism. In the parallel issue in Aristotelianism, the stand that the
universals, or specific and generic natures, exist only in the mind
but are nonetheless grounded in the real forms of things has been
called a moderate Realism. Aristotle himself, however, vigorously
denied that the universals have any substantiality (Metaphysics, Z:
13-14; 1038b8-1039b19), which clearly suggests that, for him, the
universals have no existence independently of cognition; this tends,
in this first context, to invalidate the designation Realism for the
Aristotelian doctrine.
Correspondingly, Realism is used to describe medieval views that
allowed species and genera some kind of distinct existence outside of
their conception by the mind. There it meant not only that individual
men and individual animals and so on exist outside cognition but also
that the specific nature of man and the generic nature of animal and
the like have an existence of their own in the outside world. For
Realism, objects "fall into" such categories as humanness,
mountainness, and so on naturally. For its opponents, however, this is
not always the case: thus, in terms of a modern illustration,
graniteness--that which all the granite rocks share in common--does
not exist except as an artificial category set up by the mind
(conceptualism) because it merges by imperceptible gradations into
diorite or felsite as its mineral composition and texture gradually
change.
Yet in actual fact the various medieval doctrines do not fit neatly
under these divisions. In the philosophies of several medieval
Scholastics, for instance, both the particular thing and the universal
are distinguished in one way or another from a third entity, the
specific or generic nature taken absolutely in itself. This so-called
absolute nature was given a "being of its own" by Avicenna, the early
11th-century Persian philosopher and physician, and--in the 13th
century--by Henry of Ghent, an eclectic Christian Scholastic, and by
the voluntarist John Duns Scotus, an important medieval Franciscan
Scholastic, who gave the absolute nature a reality that was distinct
in form from the individual thing, but unitively contained in it.
Thomas Aquinas gave it no being at all. Though these views reflect
radically different metaphysical settings, they all variously bar the
natures from real existence when separated in any way from the
individual.
In its conventional applications to Greek and medieval thought,
accordingly, Realism turns out to be an elusive and even confusing
notion. It seems to be an inept way of emphasizing difficulties that
are significantly present in the philosophies of these epochs, which
require understanding and solution. But the granting of extramental
existence to the generic and specific natures has raised more
difficulties than it has solved.
All of these ancient and medieval doctrines--whether Realistic,
conceptualistic, or nominalistic--accept the external existence of
individual sensible things. From this viewpoint, they would all be
Realisms in the second main sense of the term, that of the Realism of
ordinary things, which is the sense in which Realism is predominantly
employed in the modern era. Here it means the epistemological (or
theory-of-knowledge) view that things taken as individual wholes have
an existence that is outside of human cognition.
History of Western Realism
In these and other related ways, modern writers have seen the
philosophic attitude called Realism continually surfacing in the
stream of Western thought, suggesting that it is a perennial feature.
Ancient Realism
In pre-Socratic thought, even in Parmenides (late 6th century), known
for reducing reality to the One, the relevant reality of the objects
of cognition was everywhere assumed. In Plato (5th and 4th centuries
BC), the separate and more excellent existence of the natures, or
Forms, was strongly asserted at times, though quite often the
immanence of the form in individuals was just as surely implied
without any satisfactory reconciliation of the contradiction. With
Philo of Alexandria, a Hellenistic Jewish philosopher in the 1st
century AD, the existence of the Platonic Forms was located within the
mind of God, a view also found in the early 5th century in Augustine
of Hippo (De diversis quaestionibus, "On Diverse Questions"). In the
medieval Augustinian tradition, for instance in the writings of Anselm
of Canterbury, the influence of this interpretation persisted. In the
early 6th century, on the other hand, Boethius, perhaps the
intellectual founder of the Middle Ages, in transmitting Aristotelian
logic to the West, presented the universal notions with a strong cast
of Platonic Realism, while acknowledging that the Aristotelian view
was different. Among medieval thinkers in the early 12th century, such
as William of Champeaux, the Parisian logician and theologian, the
Platonizing tradition of Boethius was dominant, though it was brought
under fire by such men as Roscelin, founder of nominalism, who saw
universals as mere words. With the stormy controversialist Peter
Abelard, who was the foremost dialectician of his time, the Boethian
Realism was attacked. But according to Abelard, more than mere words
were required to justify universality; in his view, universals were
concepts signifying real things and had their ultimate basis in the
divine ideas, as in the Augustinian tradition.
Contents of this article:
Introduction
Nature and scope of Realism
Realism and the problem of knowledge
Philosophical senses of Realism
Basic kinds of Realism
Distinctions among the Realisms
History of Western Realism
Ancient Realism
Medieval Realism
Modern Realism
20th-century Realism
Major issues and evaluation of Realism
Bibliography
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There you have it. Any questions?
Bob Knauer
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"Friends don't let friends use WinME."
Bob
abelard
On Thu, 15 Feb 2001 1:53:19 GMT, r...@houston.rr.com (Bob)
typed:
>There you have it. Any questions?
what do *you* mean by western realism?
regards.
--
web site at www.abelard.org - new, doc....mechanics of inflation.
also logic and much more...over 1/4 million doc. requests yearly
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Bob
>what do *you* mean by western realism?
Actually, you summarized it earlier.
Here is the start of that discussion:
http://www.britannica.com/bcom/eb/article/5/0,5716,115425+5,00.html
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Realism
Distinctions among the Realisms
History of Western Realism
Ancient Realism
Contents of this article:
Bob Knauer