You Child's Art is Worth £1.25
Carol T
<<<< is spent on children's art, per pupil, per year, in infants and primary
schools!
Art and creativity are closely linked. Rote learning, as is used in the
academic subjects, does not teach a child to 'think' and become greater
people.
Carol T
Tat
"Carol T" <cteas...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:aciekg$gha$2...@knossos.btinternet.com...
so....... ?
Art materials, if bought in bulk, can be very cheap, and how much, per
child, can paint/glue/paper etc cost? They generally don't use that much of
it. (unlike my 2 year old, where a painting isn't considered a painting
unless every centimetre of paper is 2 cm thick in paint!)
My 6 year old daughter can draw for England, and has certainly never been
short of art materials at school. Admittedly they do spend alot of time
drawing on the backs of fax header sheets or used computer paper - but does
that matter?
I certainly don't have any complaints.
Katie
Mummy to Rhian and Kira
Paul Griffiths
news:aciekg$gha$2...@knossos.btinternet.com...
> Did you know that according to the Wright Stuff (TV show) a whole
>>>>£1.25
> <<<< is spent on children's art, per pupil, per year, in infants and
primary
> schools!
It varies too widely from school to school for me to take a figure like that
seriously. Anyway, a lot of useful creative art can be done with rubbish
for virtually no money at all. That's why schools are always asking for
yoghurt cartons, old cereal boxes and cardboard roll middles.
> Art and creativity are closely linked.
Of course but creativity can be, and often is, expressed in other ways too.
> Rote learning, as is used in the academic subjects, does not teach a
> child to 'think' and become greater people.
Not much rote learning going on in primary schools these days, and hasn't
been for some years either.
--
Paul Griffiths
Carol T
> It varies too widely from school to school for me to take a figure like
that
> seriously.
Yes, they said in some schools it was as low as 60p! When I supervised at
our local playschool our biggest expenditure was art materials, running into
the hundreds of pounds, and that was to go alongside the creations made with
junk parents brought in.
Carol T
Steve Roberts
So are maths and creativity, physics and creativity, engineering and
creativity, language and creativity, almost-anything-you-bloody-well-like
and creativity....
Richard Borcherds*, Roger Penrose*, Alec Issigonis* and Ted Hughes*, for
example, are/were all pretty creative in their own ways, but I've no idea
how ace they are or were with a pot of paints.
Harry Kroto* said he thought the best thing you could give a child to
kick-start creativity was a meccano set, not that they make them any more
(?). That'd be more than a quid or two though, I guess.
> Rote learning, as is used in the
> academic subjects, does not teach a child to 'think' and become greater
> people.
Well, I've been teaching an academic subject for about 15 years now, and
rote learning plays a pretty minimal part... except when I try to remember
all the new students' names! We do seriously concern oursevves with trying
to engender creativity in our students. (Not sure you can "teach" it). It's
not easy...
I agree with Carol that a quid or so a head doesn't sound like much and a
bit more would no doubt be useful;
I agree with others that you can do a whole heap of creative stuff with free
or recycled stuff;
I have my doubts about the depth of research producing that number!
Steve "meccano number 9 set" Roberts
*your mission (should you choose..): identify the names. 10 points each
except, on grounds of relative obscurity, 20 for Borcherds, 5 for Hughes.
(yes, Carol, I've "unblocked" you - I usually disagree with you, but the
debates often get interesting. Anyway, it did seem a bit mean.)
Steve Roberts
art in schools: one a general glossary entry, one relating to age 14 tests,
one about visiting museums, and one about homework generally.
Pretty poor, really, compared to the shed loads of stuff about science,
numeracy, literacy, etc, important though they are. It doesn't mean art
teaching / appreciation doesn't happen in schools, of course - as we all
know - but it does give an gloomy indication of the DfES mindset.
My problem is how to dispose of the great heaps of stuff Katie and Alex
bring home - I love to keep a good fraction of it, but getting the rest into
the bin / recycler without them noticing and having fits is difficult.
Hiding it in newspapers seems to work.....
Steve
"Carol T" <cteas...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:aciekg$gha$2...@knossos.btinternet.com...
Paul Griffiths
news:acjrts$rv1$1...@news.ox.ac.uk...
> Harry Kroto* said he thought the best thing you could give a child to
> kick-start creativity was a meccano set, not that they make them any more
> (?). That'd be more than a quid or two though, I guess.
Yes they do. In both metal and plastic versions, so there. :-Ş
> (yes, Carol, I've "unblocked" you - I usually disagree with you, but the
> debates often get interesting. Anyway, it did seem a bit mean.)
I'm glad you had a rethink but I can see why you would have done it in the
first place. ;-).
BTW I agree with pretty much all the other stuff you wrote but snipped it
for reasons of space.
--
Paul Griffiths
Paul Griffiths
>
> > It varies too widely from school to school for me to take a figure like
> > that seriously.
>
> Yes, they said in some schools it was as low as 60p!
Which means that in some schools it must be much higher, so why not focus on
that?
Regardless, what it means to me is that it's even more important to choose a
school well and to make sure that the parental representation on the board
of governors is more active than passive.
> When I supervised at our local playschool our biggest expenditure was
> art materials, running into the hundreds of pounds, and that was to go
> alongside the creations made with junk parents brought in.
I'm sure it was but you're not comparing like with like.
--
Paul Griffiths
Paul Griffiths
> A look at the DfES website (www.dfes.gov.uk) pulled up only 4
> references to art in schools: one a general glossary entry, one
> relating to age 14 tests, one about visiting museums, and one
> about homework generally.
I'm not sure if I'm surprised or not.
> Pretty poor, really, compared to the shed loads of stuff about science,
> numeracy, literacy, etc, important though they are. It doesn't mean art
> teaching / appreciation doesn't happen in schools, of course - as we all
> know - but it does give an gloomy indication of the DfES mindset.
You can probably lay a lot of the blame on SATs. English, Maths and Science
are pretty much the only things tested so it's not surprising that
everything else takes a back seat in most schools.
> My problem is how to dispose of the great heaps of stuff Katie and Alex
> bring home - I love to keep a good fraction of it, but getting the rest
> into the bin / recycler without them noticing and having fits is
difficult.
For drawings and paintings it isn't a problem, not that there are many now
he's in Year 3. We have a number of cork boards and the new stuff goes
straight onto them and the old stuff is binned or kept in a drawer in his
room at his discretion.
> Hiding it in newspapers seems to work.....
Does that work for "sculptures" or "models" too?
--
Paul Griffiths
gennie
<cteas...@hotmail.com> writes
and a play school. Of course the bulk of a play schools budget will go
towards arts and crafts. Most include at least one project per day and
younger children tend to need more specialised resources when in large
groups as it is harder help and supervise them. Also the waste of
resourses is much more than with older children. There is much more
pressure on a play school to send home something impressive to the
parents. When you do this every day without repeating yourself too often
it gets expensive.
A primary school will often use resources ordered for one subject for
another. Equipment and supplies bought for maths, history, RE and
especially technology will also be used for art. Art classes for older
children will use less consumables than for toddlers. They will be
studying art history and the arts in other cultures, learning about the
colour wheel, learning drawing and painting technique and spending many
days or even weeks on one project. A lot of what they do can be
accomplished with little more than paper and pencils.
--
Regina Diacopoulos
Penny Gaines
> "Steve Roberts" <steve....@xmaterials.ox.ac.uk> wrote in message
> news:acjrts$rv1$1...@news.ox.ac.uk...
>
>> Harry Kroto* said he thought the best thing you could give a child to
>> kick-start creativity was a meccano set, not that they make them any more
>> (?). That'd be more than a quid or two though, I guess.
>
> Yes they do. In both metal and plastic versions, so there. :-Ş
And pieces from both types are scattered all over my son's bedroom floor.
Within the last week I read something about meccano having gone bust
a year or so earlier. Checking their website (www.meccano.com) they
now appear to be a French company with links to Brio. If you read between
the lines that is.
My father designed a bridge out of meccano, and got it in the Meccano
Magazine. That was before I was born.
--
Penny Gaines
UK mum to three
Paul Griffiths
news:a2ulca...@gaines.plus.com...
> Paul Griffiths wrote:
> > "Steve Roberts" <steve....@xmaterials.ox.ac.uk> wrote in message
> > news:acjrts$rv1$1...@news.ox.ac.uk...
> >
> >> Harry Kroto* said he thought the best thing you could give a child to
> >> kick-start creativity was a meccano set, not that they make them any
more
> >> (?). That'd be more than a quid or two though, I guess.
> >
>
> And pieces from both types are scattered all over my son's bedroom floor.
That's nice to hear. I like to see toys being played with, even if the
tradeoff is cometimes and untidy room.
> Within the last week I read something about meccano having gone bust
> a year or so earlier. Checking their website (www.meccano.com) they
> now appear to be a French company with links to Brio. If you read between
> the lines that is.
They've gone bust a couple of times and changed hands more than once, I
believe.
That prolly explains why the stuff wasn't available for a good while. Nice
to see it back though.
> My father designed a bridge out of meccano, and got it in the Meccano
> Magazine.
I'd forgotten about the magazine, thanks for the reminder.
> That was before I was born.
Did he manage anything afterwards? :-)
--
Paul Griffiths
Steve Roberts
> > Magazine.
>
> I'd forgotten about the magazine, thanks for the reminder.
>
> > That was before I was born.
>
1967-70 ish, to be exact- re the sub, that is). All good uplifting "scouting
for boys" stuff.
Steve
Steve Roberts
>
> Does that work for "sculptures" or "models" too?
>
nursery rather than "proper" school. Oh, the delights to come!
Possibly I should get one of those tree-branch shredder things. Maybe,
though, this would lead to an arms race with them eventually coming home
with marble sculptures, vast pieces of installation art, or complete and
very very solid tableware sets. "I made it just for 'oo, daddy!"
Steve
Paul Griffiths
> > > Hiding it in newspapers seems to work.....
> > Does that work for "sculptures" or "models" too?
> Fortunately (?) we don't have too much of that yet... Both are still at
> nursery rather than "proper" school. Oh, the delights to come!
Indeed, indeed, many delights await I'm sure.
> Possibly I should get one of those tree-branch shredder things. Maybe,
> though, this would lead to an arms race with them eventually coming home
> with marble sculptures, vast pieces of installation art, or complete and
> very very solid tableware sets. "I made it just for 'oo, daddy!"
I think this is one of those cases where the trick is not to expect to win.
--
Paul Griffiths
Mary Ann Tuli
> for virtually no money at all. That's why schools are always asking for
> yoghurt cartons, old cereal boxes and cardboard roll middles.
Yep.
I dutifully wash all my plastic cartons out and cart bags of it to Josh's
nursery, only to have it all come home again covered with glitter and paint
:-)
Mary Ann
Paul Griffiths
news:ad22ve$stu$1...@niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk...
Which then gather dust until they're forgotten and you pluck up courage to
throw them out, yes?
--
Paul Griffiths
Mary Ann Tuli
> > > for virtually no money at all. That's why schools are always asking
for
> > > yoghurt cartons, old cereal boxes and cardboard roll middles.
> >
> > Yep.
> > I dutifully wash all my plastic cartons out and cart bags of it to
Josh's
> > nursery, only to have it all come home again covered with glitter and
> paint
> > :-)
>
> Which then gather dust until they're forgotten and you pluck up courage to
> throw them out, yes?
Something like that! We give lots away to adoring relatives who probably
keep hold of it a little longer than we might, but yes, the toilet roll
windmill and the Petit filous clock are no more.
Mary Ann
StJohn
Carol T wrote in message ...
Junk! JUNK!!
Do you mean the recycled and free resources provided by well-meaning
parents?
StJohn
Paul Griffiths
> Something like that! We give lots away to adoring relatives who probably
> keep hold of it a little longer than we might, but yes, the toilet roll
> windmill and the Petit filous clock are no more.
Some stuff they work on as a group and only one of the kids is "lucky"
enough to take it home. It's a good system, I think, spreads the stuff
around a bit. ;-)
--
Paul Griffiths
Paul Griffiths
news:Fq9J8.6860$g63.1...@news11-gui.server.ntli.net...
>
> Carol T wrote in message ...
> >
at
> > our local playschool our biggest expenditure was art materials, running
> > into the hundreds of pounds, and that was to go alongside the creations
> > made with junk parents brought in.
>
> Junk! JUNK!!
>
> Do you mean the recycled and free resources provided by well-meaning
> parents?
Yep, junk! :-))
--
Paul Griffiths
Penny Gaines
[snip]
> Something like that! We give lots away to adoring relatives who probably
> keep hold of it a little longer than we might, but yes, the toilet roll
> windmill and the Petit filous clock are no more.
The worst we got was a Father's Day present: it was some lovely
child-made marbled paper used to make a pencil pot. It would have
been lovely, if only the pot was not so very obviously a toilet roll.
FWIW, we put the best things on the side of the fridge. The rest seem
to float around the floor for a while, before being put on top of the
fridge. Unless it is mentioned again (it never is), it gets sneakily
chucked out.