Rosetta Stone
Patrick Dekker
whitby??
They sure sounded pissed off.
And greetings to all those that I (we) met over a very successful
weekend .... thanks Jo we all had a brilliant time.
||||||
/ \
| 0 0 |
| '' |
---o0o------------o0o---
Pat not Goth Pat, highly pissed off with roadworks on the A1
du Mathis
> Well! Does anyone know the reason behind RS opening statement at
> whitby??
>
> They sure sounded pissed off.
Well fill us in - what was said - not _all_ of us were at Whitby (sob)
this weekend...
Matthew <\>
Recovering from a particularly heavy halloween party.
Gothic Rock Info
> Well! Does anyone know the reason behind RS opening statement at
> whitby??
>
> They sure sounded pissed off.
Sorry to say It looks like that was the last ever Rosetta Stone Concert.
Matthew
Jam.
>Well! Does anyone know the reason behind RS opening statement at
>whitby??
What did they say?? I was still outside at the bar when they came on,
so I didn't hear it. I assume it was along similar lines to their
closing statement, "This is our last song... forever." They didn't
seem happy bunnies at all. Arse! I knew I should've bought that Tomb
Raver top when I saw it...
>Pat not Goth Pat, highly pissed off with roadworks on the A1
Oh yes. We took a slight detour through Barnsley and Rotherham to get
to the M1 rather than sit in traffic for ages... And there were still
delays on the M1.
Cheers,
Jam.
--
Jam is now available in 17 fruit flavours.
Saiira
>
> Patrick Dekker wrote:
>
> > Well! Does anyone know the reason behind RS opening statement at
> > whitby??
> >
>
> this weekend...
They said they were not doing any more gigs....not that I remember this
but Alien told me later, when I was sober enough to hear stuff. from
what I heard they weren't particulay good either........:o/
Saiira
Gabriel Strange
"This is Probably the last gig we will ever do, as we don't like what is
happening in the scene"
In other words we can make more money by selling out.
But hark this Senario smacks of Eldritch.
From the roumours I have hread and Don't quote me on this, as I have no hard
facts Yet.
{Rumour}
I have heard that They are all fed up with the Pre-tention in the goth
scene, and have been roumoured to be fed up of all the derssing up, and want
to where jeans and T-shirts. (Blue and White ones).
{End}
Humm if we wore just jeans and t-shirt, we would be just like everybody
else, (Mansonittes, Oasis fans and the likes.) I presonally like the
pre-tention. and thnk it makes people dress up more and come up with better
ideas. and look different.
Well argue among yourselves.
Gabby
Patrick Dekker wrote in message <4fvk+OA+mOP2Ew$E...@fireman.demon.co.uk>...
>Well! Does anyone know the reason behind RS opening statement at
>whitby??
>
>They sure sounded pissed off.
>
>And greetings to all those that I (we) met over a very successful
>weekend .... thanks Jo we all had a brilliant time.
> ||||||
> / \
> | 0 0 |
> | '' |
> ---o0o------------o0o---
>
Carpet Boy
Gabriel Strange <ga...@gothland.demon.co.uk> writes
>They said
>
>"This is Probably the last gig we will ever do, as we don't like what is
>happening in the scene"
IIRC they used the word "bullshit".
>In other words we can make more money by selling out.
>But hark this Senario smacks of Eldritch.
Selling out? And how do you define "selling out"? You don't think it
might have anything to do with forces within the scene trying to push
them out?? And the fact that while this was happening the rest of
gothdom was *far* too busy talking about hair extensions and techno??
You can't compare the Eldritch attitude to goth with the Rosetta
attitude in any way. Eldritch has gone far beyond the "well I don't
think 'goth' is an appropriate term for my music" type of attitude that
many 1980s groups had.
Rosetta on the other hand always admitted an alligience to G-Squad.
Instead of pissing off when they didn't like something in the scene,
they instead stuck with it but explained their point of view -- e.g. the
vampire debate. "Selling out" implies that Rosetta Stone owe some kind
of debt to gothdom -- which they do not.
>From the roumours I have hread and Don't quote me on this, as I have no hard
>facts Yet.
>
>{Rumour}
>I have heard that They are all fed up with the Pre-tention in the goth
>scene, and have been roumoured to be fed up of all the derssing up, and want
>to where jeans and T-shirts. (Blue and White ones).
>{End}
I don't think you'll find fashion or taste in clothing has anything to
do with this whatsoever.
>Humm if we wore just jeans and t-shirt, we would be just like everybody
>else, (Mansonittes, Oasis fans and the likes.) I presonally like the
>pre-tention. and thnk it makes people dress up more and come up with better
>ideas. and look different.
I think the dressing up in goth can be fun, but it's not what goth's all
about. If you think it is, you've got to be pretty shallow. And
pretention isn't about whether you wear a big floppy shirt with frills
on or just a t-shirt. It's to do with whether or not you're a c**t.
>Well argue among yourselves.
Zzzzzzz....
Sod this I'm tired & I've got work in the morning....
Dave
--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
"lose hold/just let it go/give in give up abandon yourself to the flow"
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Alexander
>"This is Probably the last gig we will ever do, as we don't like what is
>happening in the scene"
Correct, more or less.
>In other words we can make more money by selling out.
Oh dear.... X
>But hark this Senario smacks of Eldritch.
How's that then?
>From the roumours I have hread and Don't quote me on this, as I have no hard
>facts Yet.
Then why bother posting rubbish? Christ, you're even worse at
shit-stirring than I am.
>{Rumour}
>I have heard that They are all fed up with the Pre-tention in the goth
>scene, and have been roumoured to be fed up of all the derssing up, and want
>to where jeans and T-shirts. (Blue and White ones).
>{End}
It's hardly a rumor; they're fed up with the bitching and back
stabbing on the goth scene. I don't know what you're talking about
with the jeans & t-shirt thing though.
>Humm if we wore just jeans and t-shirt, we would be just like everybody
>else, (Mansonittes, Oasis fans and the likes.) I presonally like the
>pre-tention. and thnk it makes people dress up more and come up with better
>ideas. and look different.
You're obviously very new, probably last weeks' batch, and don't have
much of a clue then.
>Well argue among yourselves.
That's the problem.
--
~Alexander : Now in *new* "Corporate Whore" flavour!
Are you a net.goth?: http://www.alexander.darkwave.org.uk/
Next DJing at Malice Underground: Tuesday 3rd November
Don't be humble, you're not that great.
Count Von Sexbat
ga...@gothland.demon.co.uk "Gabriel Strange" writes:
>
>"This is Probably the last gig we will ever do, as we don't like what is
>happening in the scene"
>
>In other words we can make more money by selling out.
You are full of shit
>From the roumours I have hread and Don't quote me on this, as I have no hard
>facts Yet.
You have none at all (see above)
/\../\
Sexbat
--
Michael Johnson
>{Rumour}
>I have heard that They are all fed up with the Pre-tention in the goth
>scene, and have been roumoured to be fed up of all the derssing up, and want
>to where jeans and T-shirts. (Blue and White ones).
>{End}
Uh, so Rosetta want out because they don't like the way people DRESS??
<sigh> No wonder Rosetta are pissed off at the goff scene.....even the
quality of the rumours is going downhill....
--
Uncle Nemesis > Michael Johnson > un...@globalnet.co.uk
Nemesis Promotions - Contrary to rumours, Not Bankrupt Yet ;-)
http://www.nemesis.to
Morph
>Patrick Dekker wrote:
>
>> Well! Does anyone know the reason behind RS opening statement at
>> whitby??
>>
>> They sure sounded pissed off.
>
>Well fill us in - what was said - not _all_ of us were at Whitby (sob)
>this weekend...
"This may be the last Rosetta gig" (I'm paraphrasing, but that was the gist
of it). I didn't catch the full speech.
The Rosetta set was, well, competent but not exactly stunning. If that
really was their last gig, then they've gone out with a whimper, not a
bang... :-(
Having said that, the (slightly rewritten :-) cover of 'Let me entertain
you' was priceless. They actually sounded as if they were enjoying that
one, and it does maintain the tradition of silly closing songs / guest
vocalists for the Jo/Whitby gigs.
What was the other cover they played before as an encore, btw? I missed all
but a few seconds of it, and none of the people I was with could remember
what it was. Or wouldn't admit to recognising it, maybe.
Saturday night was good for bad news about bands - just before the Rosetta
announcement I found out that Blyth Power have now split up. Bugger. :-(
-Morph
--
"Did you know that if you get a map and join up all the sites of all
the McDonalds restaurants in London, it makes the sigil of the dark
emperor Mammon?" - Tom O'Bedlam, Invisibles
mer...@my-dejanews.com
> announcement I found out that Blyth Power have now split up. Bugger. :-(
> -Morph
To say Blyth Power 'split up' is, unfortunately, not the whole story.
Chris, now ex- BP guitarist and one of my bestsest friends was actually
at Whitby with me & Wombat et al (he was the strange one who wasn't a
goth.......)
The sorry saga happened in August when Joseph Porter (BP singer &
drummer) rang Chris & Protag (now ex BP bassist - who's been with them
for 12 years) out of the blue & announced that they were sacked. Many
gigs were cancelled but they did a farewell thing in Leeds mid
September. V. recently there was a gig billed as "Blyth Power" (by
Attila no doubt, but that's another story....) but whether this was
just Joseph or who else was in the line up no-one seems to know (any
info gratefully received etc etc)
Chris & Protag are now looking at doing something musical together (and
would no doubt be interested in any exciting offers.....). Watch out
for gig in Birmingham & next year's Glasters!
--
Merlina
I have a firm grip of reality - so now I can strangle it....
-----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----------
http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own
Jam.
>Having said that, the (slightly rewritten :-) cover of 'Let me entertain
>you' was priceless. They actually sounded as if they were enjoying that
>one, and it does maintain the tradition of silly closing songs / guest
>vocalists for the Jo/Whitby gigs.
That was fantastic! After last years 'Drop Dead Gorgeous' , I was
hoping they'd do something similar. I didn't figure out what he was
actually singing until about halfway through. Oooh, Matron...
>What was the other cover they played before as an encore, btw? I missed all
>but a few seconds of it, and none of the people I was with could remember
>what it was. Or wouldn't admit to recognising it, maybe.
It was 'Reward' by The Teardrop Explodes, and jolly fine that was too.
You're right though, Rosetta did seem to be actually enjoying
themselves during these songs, and they came across really well.
I can understand that there's only so much shit that people can take,
and if you're not enjoying something anymore then why carry on?
Hopefully it wont come to that, but I'd rather see them play when
they're on top form. If that was indeed their last gig, then I'll
just have to cling to all the happy memories of the storming Rosetta
gigs that I've been to in the past - last year at Whitby, and all the
times at the Camden Underworld.
Ian C.
>
> Well! Does anyone know the reason behind RS opening statement at
> whitby??
>
> They sure sounded pissed off.
Well I don't have any astounding insights but I have a few thoughts of
my own as to what may /may not hve caused the statements from Rosetta at
Whitby.
Its my guess tht Rosetta feel very much as Cath and I did during the
last months of Epitaph (one of the Norths bigger Goth Club/gig events
-for Newbies). We were fed up with certain elements in the scene
bitching about us, trying to "put our event out of business " out of
sheer jealousy and I guess we were sick of the event taking over our
lives. We needed a break to put our careers/private lifes back on track
as Epitaph had dominated our lives for a couple of years. We did after a
break and some changes decide to launch a new venture, -Disolution,
feeling refreshed and excited again about the scene after our break.
Now thats minor compared to what Rosetta have put into the scene and
have to put up with. Rosetta have given 10 years to this scene, and
haven't made the vast fortune bands like The mission did, instead they
have been screwed by record labels, bitched at by rival fans stc, and
despite this stolen the hearts of many of the Goths that have been
around in the last 10 years with some sings that stand out miles from
those written by many other bands past and present.
A a guess Rosetta Stone feel they need to duck out of things ,
consolodate things and see whether they want to carry on as musicians
/producers whatever . Looking at th bands influences of late they may
cease to be a traditional Goth sounding band, and might feel that its
best to do things differently rather than risk all of the selling out
critisism etc. I recall Tyranny coming out and it causeing alot of
people to claim sell out, NIN rip off , whatever, whan new materil and
slight direction changes cause rections like that perhaps they are right
to say rosetta Stone ends here, and our new project starts here (if
thats the case).
All I can say is Thanks for everything Rosetta, 3 storming gigs at
Hallam, 10 years of entertainent and gigs (for Cath anyway), and some
classic songs.
I wish them luck with whatever happens in the future hopefully it will
be a much needed break, maybe with the launch of some newer material
later in whatever style they choose. Certainly the Goth scenes alot more
open to new styles than 4 years ago When tyranny appeared.
Ian C.
Captain M
>
>
> What was the other cover they played before as an encore, btw? I missed all
> but a few seconds of it, and none of the people I was with could remember
> what it was. Or wouldn't admit to recognising it, maybe.
>
It was 'Reward' by Teardrop Explodes, the band that featured Julian Cope on
vocals. The reason people wouldn't admit to recognizing it was probably
because it came out around 17-18 years ago. I do remember it on TOTP –
although I was very young at the time! They had a great video where they were
driving along a quayside in a jeep.
Another question regarding Rosetta's set: who was the girl dancer who jumped
onto the stage and then got escorted off by security?
Captain M
Gabriel Strange
'cos I would like to know why and what has happened. As would a lot of other
people, As i was expecting them in 1999, it came as a shock to me.
If there is any official explanation could someone post it so we can all
find out. and some one mention a fight they had B 4 they went on stage is
there any truth in that?
Gabby
Count Von Sexbat wrote in message <910036...@batt.demon.co.uk>...
Carpet Boy
Strange <ga...@gothland.demon.co.uk> writes
>Don't scream at me I just saying what I have heard if it is wrong correct me
>'cos I would like to know why and what has happened. As would a lot of other
>people, As i was expecting them in 1999, it came as a shock to me.
Oh I don't know... "you're full of shit" was pretty succinct and to-
the-point.
>If there is any official explanation could someone post it so we can all
>find out. and some one mention a fight they had B 4 they went on stage is
>there any truth in that?
I don't believe any official explanation has been given. I don't know
if any statement will be made. I can't tell you if there was or wasn't
some kind of "fight" before Rosetta Stone went on stage.
I *can* tell you that the events leading up to this have been going on
for years... and that if you've missed them, perhaps you've been
burying your head in the sand.
Maybe it'd help if you looked at some of what's already been said... for
example:
http://x2.dejanews.com/getdoc.xp?AN=380740952 or
http://x2.dejanews.com/getdoc.xp?AN=383183363
Gabriel Strange
maybe even split it down the middle, if they succeed then we will be back to
square one. with no events, and nothing happening. I personally am not a
big fan of RS but I Think it is has been taken to far, Yes everybody is
allowed there differences, and there own opinions, but it seams to me that
if you disagree with the masses you are a shit stirring moron, I disagree
with many ppl on many things. Thats what makes us Goth the fact that we can
think for ourselves, and speak our own opinions. And if ppl are put down for
saying what they want. The we will all loss the essence of what we are, and
disappear in to Obscurity 'cos we cannot agree to disagree. As my comment
earlier got such a response as "you are full of shit", well that was my
opinion. and you just took it upon yourselves to pick sides and put me down.
When in the end we are all on one side. Everybody is allowed there own
opinion, and should not be slammed for it. even if it is wrong. As I was,
but I got slammed again for admitting I was wrong.
Now if anybody chooses to slam me now for what I have said then you are no
better than the rest of them. At last if you disagree say why, and if
someone is incorrect correct them. Don't just jump of the deep end.
And If you want to know My pet Hate about Rossetta stone, well hear it is. "
I believe that They should Do some new Material, Write some songs, and not
Just do Re-Mixes, Yes they are good, but it dose get boring, after a while,
and The T-shirts are another annoyance, Yes one year of rip offs was fun,
but this October, I was expecting some good RS T-shirts, and not just
Rip-offs".
I don't Pick and Chooses side, I have no Favourite band I just Like bits of
them all.
and Hate bits of them all. Too.
Now if anybody slams me for what I have said then So be it but you are what
is going to destroy the Goth scene.As I am just Voiceing my Opinions, and
Not slaming anybody.
Gabby
"Yes I admit I was wrong but so should more ppl"
Carpet Boy wrote in message ...
Carpet Boy
I have no problem with you or whoever saying "I don't like Rosetta
Stone" -- that's your opinion and you're entitled to it -- but now you
insist you're merely voicing your opinions and "not slaming anybody"...
when only yesterday you made the unsubstantiated claim that Rosetta
Stone were "selling out" in order to "make more money".
Spare me the hypocrisy. It's *my* *opinion* that you are full of shit.
Have a nice life,
antony johnston
> Another question regarding Rosetta's set: who was the girl dancer who jumped
> onto the stage and then got escorted off by security?
the same girl dancer who stood next to us down the front for the rest of
the set and sang very loudly and very badly. yes, she seemed slightly
inebriated.
--
antony johnston : www.mostlyblack.demon.co.uk
:: f a i l u r e i s n o t a n o p t i o n ::
Michael Johnson
rosetta stone
Strange" <ga...@gothland.demon.co.uk> wrote shite:
> and The T-shirts are another annoyance, Yes one year of rip offs was fun,
> but this October, I was expecting some good RS T-shirts, and not just
> Rip-offs".
I'm flattered my wordsmithing/artwork is so staggeringly profound that you
assume I must've ripped it off...
...and you wonder why I've had enough?
smoke machine . drum machine . amphetamine - anyone?
porl
--
_______________________-wHATEver pRODUCTIONS-_______________________
_____________________-www.blakmail.demon.co.uk-_____________________
the Gruamach
<Ian.c...@virgin.net> scribbled
>Its my guess tht Rosetta feel very much as Cath and I did during the
>last months of Epitaph (one of the Norths bigger Goth Club/gig events
>-for Newbies). We were fed up with certain elements in the scene
>bitching about us, trying to "put our event out of business " out of
>sheer jealousy and I guess we were sick of the event taking over our
Well, for the record, there's a WHOLE lot of us (even us silly
Americans) who loved Epitaph, and understand what an effort it is to
run good shows like that.
I'm just happy to have gotten to the last few gigs before I missed
them all.
Charles/the Gruamach, http://home.stlnet.com/~gothcop
The St. Louis Perkygoff, dammit!
Alt.Gothic's own Garibaldi and expecting DaddyGoth
Patrick Dekker
>
>>{Rumour}
>>I have heard that They are all fed up with the Pre-tention in the goth
>>scene, and have been roumoured to be fed up of all the derssing up, and want
>>to where jeans and T-shirts. (Blue and White ones).
>>{End}
I only ever saw them in Jeans and T-Shirts anyway
Matthew North
>
> It was 'Reward' by Teardrop Explodes, the band that featured Julian Cope
on
> vocals.
talking of julian cope hes on tour talking about his new book, hes at the
cavern in exeter on the 3rd of dec i think.
matt
Matthew North
> Another question regarding Rosetta's set: who was the girl dancer who
jumped
> onto the stage and then got escorted off by security?
>
its not the same one that always got on stage during adreanaline at london
gigs was it>>?
Ill check the video
mat
Matthew North
fun,
> > but this October, I was expecting some good RS T-shirts, and not just
> > Rip-offs".
the only rip off was they all sold out before I was able to get one, ie
there wernt enough!!!!
Still I got my Gothic as fuck hooded top, and its fab
mn
Matthew North
> Well, for the record, there's a WHOLE lot of us (even us silly
> Americans) who loved Epitaph, and understand what an effort it is to
> run good shows like that.
I know stacks of people that went and had a good time always, from
experience of gigging in the
city sheffield has something special all of its own, as well as trams.
Its just a shame there will always be an element that put you down whatever
your doing.
mat
WnderBunny
In article <rosettastone-0...@blakmail.demon.co.uk>,
rosett...@pains.to.keep.you.in.the.dark (rosetta stone) writes:
>I'm flattered my wordsmithing/artwork is so staggeringly profound that you
>assume I must've ripped it off...
>
>
>...and you wonder why I've had enough?
>
Yes, we do wonder why you've had enough?
Is a statement from you too much to ask rather than having to endure all these
rumours and half-truths?
Or is it just a cynical ploy to get yourself some more publicity? Personally I
think thay's more worthy of nightbreed but I suppose if you can't beat em join
em.
So come on, what's going on Porl?
Mixy
TackyGoth
>Well! Does anyone know the reason behind RS opening statement at
>whitby??
Money. Apparently. That's what I heard anyhow. Allegedly.
>They sure sounded pissed off.
Apparently they'll still be recording. Ahem. Allegedly.
Louise x (TackyGoth)
ICQ: 15326003
"A writer doesn't write to help humanity, but to help himself".
Graham Greene
Remove the zebras to reply!
the Gruamach
discovered the cure for cancer, but forgot it all when:
Ian put the best: Some people just can't stand being jealous, so they
attack whatever it is that they're jealous of.
"Oh, I can do better" (but they never do)
"Oh such and such is bad/wrong/crap" (but never offer intelligent
alternate ideas)
Not just with Epitaph or RS, but with life in general.
It's all part of the "People suck" thing.
the Gruamach
cancer, but forgot it all when:
>
Other than general curiousity, why does he have to explain shit to
you, or anyone else?
It's his/their life, who are you to go around demanding explainations
for things?
WnderBunny
In article <364a378c....@news.stlnet.com>, got...@stlnet.com (the
Gruamach) writes:
>Other than general curiousity, why does he have to explain shit to
>you, or anyone else?
Because he chose to put himself in the public eye and has a moral duty to the
people that have supported him and bought his records over the years. Not
everyone has screwed him over and he still has a lot of fans out there who are
left in limbo not knowing what's going on.
>
>It's his/their life, who are you to go around demanding explainations
>for things?
One of the above (who wasn't at Whitby to hear what was said).
Mixy
Fox
rosett...@pains.to.keep.you.in.the.dark (rosetta stone) wrote:
>smoke machine . drum machine . amphetamine - anyone?
I'll take the drum machine. How much do you want for it?
Fox
--
/\_/\ F "Death is hard an' cold an' ugly.
\O O/ O Not some cute chick!"
\o/ X Sarah - The Maxx - Issue #4
WnderBunny
>Fox wrote:
>
>>
>>>smoke machine . drum machine . amphetamine - anyone?
>>
>>I'll take the drum machine. How much do you want for it?
>
>I was planning to snog the drum machine!
>
>But I didnt want to pass on my throat infection so I resisted.
>It's cute tho :)
I thought it was an ADAT?
Well if you get turned on by an overblown video recorder then more power to
you. Been hanging out with Kryten lately?
Mixy
<The views expressed herein are strictly my own or those of the voices in my
head>
ICQ 15290022
Remember to remove antispam "postheap" before replying
Fox
wrote:
>
>In article <364a378c....@news.stlnet.com>, got...@stlnet.com (the
>Gruamach) writes:
>
>>Other than general curiousity, why does he have to explain shit to
>>you, or anyone else?
>
>Because he chose to put himself in the public eye and has a moral duty to the
>people that have supported him and bought his records over the years. Not
>everyone has screwed him over and he still has a lot of fans out there who are
>left in limbo not knowing what's going on.
(Reuters 04/11/98 13:30) BROWN FLOOD ALERT REPORTED ON UK NEWSGROUP
The Ministry Of Bullshit today issued a bullshit alert for all users
of the uk.people.gothic newsgroup. The Ministry has been monitoring
the accretion of bullshit in the Rosetta Stone thread since the
beginning of the week but was completely unprepared for the sudden
deluge which occurred at 11:26. A spokesman said "It appears to be
the fault of some idiot called Mixy. He's just released several
thousand gallons of bullshit into the group, apparently with the
intention of duressing one Porl King. For some reason he believes
that people who pursue a life in entertainment must forgo all their
rights to privacy and release personal information on all their
decisions as and when he sees fit." Mixy was not approached for
comment.
>>It's his/their life, who are you to go around demanding explainations
>>for things?
>
>One of the above (who wasn't at Whitby to hear what was said).
Why don't you take your moral duty and shove it? Don't you feel
ashamed at trying to use such a transparent and feeble excuse in a bid
to morally blackmail another person into doing something you want to
see happen? Go and crawl back under your rock.
And you still owe me that pint.
die_la...@my-dejanews.com
rosetta stone have done more for the 90's goth scene than any other goth band
that l can think of. they are one of the reasons that we, and many other 90's
goth bands ever started. they have been an inspiration for new bands, and a
real kick up the arse for older bands who have become lazy and despondent with
the scene (ahem. . .)
so, what happens if they go this time for good ? many ppl may feel that
nothing will change, as the end of one band will not result in the end of the
uk scene. really ? the reality is that it may signal the end of this era of
goth music - because older bands such as ourselves ( 6 years and counting )
and rosetta etc have had just about all they can stomach of the bitchiness
and infighting of the uk goth scene.
you may not care, or feel that it will not effect you personally, but how
many more bands can we afford to lose ? there are some great new uk bands,
but how many can you honestly say will make it to where rosetta are now ?(
before they give up before they even get anywhere or lose their individuality
on the way ). do you want to go to gigs and see no headline bands, only small
and inexperienced ( musically with their sound and performance )support bands
? again you may not care. . . but l do.
the uk scene is on the edge of imploding. don't get me wrong, we're not quite
finished yet - and i'm used to fighting to get what we want as a band; l don't
want to see any more bands ( and the dedicated people who work so hard to
support the scene e.g. promoters, brv etc )destroyed by the back stabbing. (
and we all know who started this in the first place. . . i hope you're happy
now ****)
it's way past time for this to stop - and i'm not so arrogant to believe that
anything l say will have any impact, just that l wanted to add my voice to
the others who have suffered and survived the hate campaigns launched on uk
scene ( and the net - i've been on-line for ages but couldn't face the
resulting war of words until now ) over the last few years.
maybe this will be the end . . . or is it just the beginning of the end ? i
hope that rosetta don't go for good - they will be greatly missed and mourned
for sometime to come.
rachel (die laughing)
In article <363fa06d...@read.news.globalnet.co.uk>,
un...@globalnet.co.uk (Michael Johnson) wrote:
> "Gabriel Strange" <ga...@gothland.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>
> >{Rumour}
> >I have heard that They are all fed up with the Pre-tention in the goth
> >scene, and have been roumoured to be fed up of all the derssing up, and want
> >to where jeans and T-shirts. (Blue and White ones).
> >{End}
>
> Uh, so Rosetta want out because they don't like the way people DRESS??
>
> <sigh> No wonder Rosetta are pissed off at the goff scene.....even the
> quality of the rumours is going downhill....
>
> --
> Uncle Nemesis > Michael Johnson > un...@globalnet.co.uk
> Nemesis Promotions - Contrary to rumours, Not Bankrupt Yet ;-)
> http://www.nemesis.to
>
evil...@cimmerii.demon.co.uk
rosett...@pains.to.keep.you.in.the.dark (rosetta stone) wrote:
(something, anything at all)
Well, the rumours about being pissed off with the *entire* scene must be
false, since Porl is still reading UPG! :-)
More seriously, I've been pissed off with goth for years. Rosetta [we|a]re the
only band keeping the goth tag going and any fecker who believes the pile of
crap demo tapes and short-run home-pressed CDs which every other goth band
issues can support a subculture is sadly mistaken.
This is the end of the line. Goth today is shite. The music sucks, the
fashion is laughable and the politics stink. We've all had enough. We all
prefer techno anyway (didn't we always? were we just fooling ourselves in
order to hang around with cool looking people?). And most of us lot here are
pushing 30... does the word "sad" ring any bells?
Face it, the only cool goth bands are the ones which don't sound goth at all.
The problem is that we've all invested such an enourmous part of our lives in
being goth that it has become really difficult for any of us to just divorce
ourselves from goth overnight. We've become a subculture of hangers-on. All
our friends are goths. We have an enourmous wardrobe full of black clothes
that would cost a fortune to replace, and we don't even know where to go to
find decent normal clothes anymore. We'd have to go out and actually *talk*
to people to find new friends, rather than just hang about with people based
on their dress sense. Goth is such an easy subculture to join, but so very
difficult to leave...
How many times have you been to a goth gig and wished they'd turn the bloody
PA down so you could talk to your friends over the awful drivel on stage?
How many gigs have you liked the look of, but then boycotted because you don't
want to get involved in the politics?
How many of us actually listen to tapes of goth music when we're on our own in
the car? Not industrial or techno or darkwave, proper goth music. And I'm not
counting you at the back with the rubber bat. Approximately? None.
Sure, it'll be sad if Porl and Karl stop doing music/media altogether,
they're some of the most creative people around today. But a six month break,
followed by a change of name and direction could be all that is required. And
so long as we don't follow Porl and Karl's future careers whilst wearing
velvet cloaks and fangs then they'll be a huge success.
Anyone wishing to take over the UPG FAQ please apply via email. Thank-you and
goodnight.
-------------------------------------------------------------------
Andrew Oakley <evil...@cimmerii.demon.co.uk> PGP Key ID 2E2C7969
www.cimmerii.demon.co.uk - UPG FAQ, home page, photos, links & more
"what is the use of music," thought Alice, "without drum machines?"
die_la...@my-dejanews.com
rosetta stone have done more for the 90's goth scene than any other goth band
that l can think of. they are one of the reasons that we, and many other 90's
goth bands ever started. they have been an inspiration for new bands, and a
real kick up the arse for older bands who have become lazy and despondent with
the scene (ahem. . .)
so, what happens if they go this time for good ? many ppl may feel that
nothing will change, as the end of one band will not result in the end of the
uk scene. really ? the reality is that it may signal the end of this era of
goth music - because older bands such as ourselves ( 6 years and counting )
and rosetta etc have had just about all they can stomach of the bitchiness
and infighting of the uk goth scene.
you may not care, or feel that it will not effect
-----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----------
Brigid Smith
> Patrick Dekker wrote:
> >
> > Well! Does anyone know the reason behind RS opening statement at
> > whitby??
> >
>
I was in the other room, and missed it.
Someone enlighten me please.
Brigid.
WnderBunny
In article <3646571e....@news.sequent.com>,
f...@scio.SPAMBLOCK.demon.co.uk (Fox) writes:
>Why don't you take your moral duty and shove it? Don't you feel
>ashamed at trying to use such a transparent and feeble excuse in a bid
>to morally blackmail another person into doing something you want to
>see happen? Go and crawl back under your rock.
No, why can't Porl let us know what's going on? Surely it's better to set the
record straight than to let the rumour-mongers take over ond continue exactly
what he was apparently speaking out against? He felt the need to make a totally
ambiguious statement then shuts up leaving all the Rosetta fans in the dark.
Surely he must owe them something for all the support they've given him over
the years? These are the people that have put a roof over his head and food on
his plate.
>And you still owe me that pint.
See me at Whitby in April and I'll buy it for you.
Mixy
Andi Gordon
> I have heard that They are all fed up with the Pre-tention in the goth
> scene, and have been roumoured to be fed up of all the derssing up, and want
> to where jeans and T-shirts. (Blue and White ones).
Who gives a shit what rosetta or anyone else wears ????
Have you ever noticed how all of todays best goth bands never actually look
"Goth" on stage...
Porl (rosetta), at whitby, in his sporty top, Eddie (horatii) in his footbal
shirt, All of the Stun in whatever they happened to crawl out of bed in,
funhouse look like rock stars, not goths...
and it goes on and on...
The truly dreadful bands seem to all wear "goth" clothes, usually with really
BAAADD make-up, and end up looking as contrived and shite as thier music.....
Straight out of the Black Rose (or similar) and onto the stage.....
It's all part of whether the band are trying to be "goth" or just trying to
write music...
I doubt any of the better bands ATM, actually sit down and think let's write a
goth track. And this is their strength....
<revelation>
Maybe if they spent more time writing the music naturally, and not trying so
hard to write "goth" stuff, they might stop being crap....
</revelation>
--
yours:~andi/gordon $
begin 666 signature<pre>
</wrists>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>d>vilution
#>--{ kitsch (the girl) }-------<#>|\\\\\\\\\\\www.dvilution.demon.co.uk
#>-{=====================}------<#>|//////////an...@dvilution.demon.co.uk
#>----{1st d>vilution single}---<#>0===================================0
#>--{ltd. edition ironic pink}--<#>|*******[album due b4 the]**********|
#>---{case with pvc sleeve}-----<#>|***********[millenium dome...]*****|
#>{available late 1998}---------<#>|***[(ie 2002)]*********************|
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<dis.con.one
Cristina
The Girl who wanted to be God wrote in message
>Hold on, how did Funhouse get mixed up in the "best goth bands"
>category? *snicker*
Best drunken-in-between-songs-banter maybe?
Cristina
WnderBunny
<snip pessimistic crap>
>Anyone wishing to take over the UPG FAQ please apply via email. Thank-you and
>goodnight.
OK, godbye and don't let the door hit you up the arse on the way out.
Just because one band decides to call it a day you give up? Surely you would be
better off supporting the scene even more and boycotting the individual
responsible for its supposed demise.
Given what is happening in the US and Germany goth is becoming ever more
popular. Just look at Whitby for an example on your own doorstep. OK, it's not
the same as the old goth but something that stands still simply stagnates. With
no evidence to the contrary I think Rosetta are just doing the sympathy thing
and hoping the backlash against **** will be enough to get him out of everyones
hair.
If you (or anyone - Rosetta included) keep spouting such pessimistic crap I can
only assume you don't want to see the scene grow and develop so we are better
off without you.
Stormbringer
<wnder...@aol.compostheap> squeaked....
>Andrew Oakley wrote.....
>
><snip pessimistic crap>
>
>
>If you (or anyone - Rosetta included) keep spouting such pessimistic crap I can
>only assume you don't want to see the scene grow and develop so we are better
>off without you.
>
Oh, come on!
You can't help but admit that goth is stagnating.
Something needs to happen, and it needs to happen fast.
For too many years now, a lot of people have held the belief that "if we
just hang on a bit longer, things'll get better..."
It hasn't come true.
Look around you at the goth scene. "Goths" nowadays are so diverse that
they practically belong to other sub-cultures, or even <sharp intake of
breath> popular culture.
And the politics are fucking ridiculous. Look at your local goth scene.
Look at this newsgroup. Arguments, bitching, etc. etc. and contrary to
the spin-doctors' popular belief, It has NOT always been like this.
The number of people I know that don't go to gigs or goth nights just
because of the political factors involved is stupid.
If we can't get our shit together soon, the only thing we'll be doing at
Whitby in years to come is laying flowers at the headstone of goth.
-fin-
>>-8>
** Storm **
HiRez
[A bunch of good stuff. Look it up on Dejanews.]
<AOL>
Me too.
</AOL>
This is my own Sheffield/Rosetta story:
Years ago, 1990 to be precise (I think), I went along to view Ver Neff
because they were a Big Goth Band and I was still nominally a goth, even
though I was avidly listening to the techno music that KISS-FM would
play on a Wednesday evening.
They were utterly fucking awful. I hated every minute, and I still have
absolutely no time for that crew of arses to this day. I remember thinking
'If this is what goth has turned into, that's the last I'll have to do
with this bag of crap' (or thoughts to that effect anyway)
And that was the last time I had anything to do with contemporary goth
music until...
(Oh, I was still happily playing old JD & sisters amongst the Big Black
and mad 'faceless techno bollocks' - all of that meant a shitload to me)
.. I was dragged along to an Epitaph in the middle (May?) of 1996...
.. And there was this band on stage who were making exactly the kind of
guitar-fired techno/industrial/goth racket that I'd been trying to make
myself.
So, you can blame Rosetta for me being here, and bouncing drunkenly
around many fine goth events in the last couple of years.
And the merchandise... Shit, chaps. No other band on the *planet* comes
close to the media hacking/cultural subversion that this lot manage.
I am in no position to comment knowlegably about the deconstruction of
pop-cultural memes, but I think that's what I'm seeing on every R-S shirt.
Damn. Wish I had the complete set.
--
J "I don't believe I've written that. Pseud's Corner, here I come" H-R
Trizia
poorly...@marge-central.noodles.demon.co.uk (The Girl who wanted
to be God) wrote:
<snip>
>More fitting would be Nervosa in various colour clashing outfits and
>um... that dodgy boi in Emma conquest who decided not to wear much...
>;P
>
>Marge xxx
OI! Don't you go saying things about our Tim!
T'n'T
To speak of teaching morals is a contradiction in terms.
One can only teach morality.
Captain M
>snip>
> Given what is happening in the US and Germany goth is becoming ever >more popular.
An interesting point. Why is the scene apparently healthier in these two
countries than in our own island? The types of society, economy, attitude to
alternative culture perhaps? Is there as much backstabbing and bitching going
on over there? The US being a much bigger place and therefore having a larger
goth/alternative population?
What do people who have been abroad recently and experienced the goth cultures
over there think?
Captain M (who holds a US passport and is now thinking of disappearing to San
Francisco or some place to get away from the depressing developments in the UK)
COUPSNESTI
Mixy spouts...
>record straight than to let the rumour-mongers take over
It's a bit 'kin late for that don't you think...
<<fox says.....
Why don't you take your moral duty and shove it? >>
And if he needs any help shoving it up i'll go get a big fuck off sledge
hammer and see what happens..
Coup's
( who thinks that maybe,just maybe a month without a mention of Rosetta Stone
connected to a load of bullshit rumours might jusy get the most fun band on the
planet to play again (here's hoping anyway))..
Gabriel Strange
WnderBunny wrote in message
<19981104053518...@ngol01.aol.com>...
>
>In article <rosettastone-0...@blakmail.demon.co.uk>,
>rosett...@pains.to.keep.you.in.the.dark (rosetta stone) writes:
>
>>I'm flattered my wordsmithing/artwork is so staggeringly profound that you
>>assume I must've ripped it off...
>>
>>
>>...and you wonder why I've had enough?
>>
>
>Yes, we do wonder why you've had enough?
>
>Is a statement from you too much to ask rather than having to endure all
these
>rumours and half-truths?
>
>Or is it just a cynical ploy to get yourself some more publicity?
Personally I
>think thay's more worthy of nightbreed but I suppose if you can't beat em
join
>em.
>
>So come on, what's going on Porl?
>
>Mixy
Karl Robinson
Stone
>connected to a load of bullshit rumours might jusy get the most fun band on
the
>planet to play again (here's hoping anyway))..
although judging by blakmail that's unlikely :(
Karl - :(
Gabriel Strange
evil...@cimmerii.demon.co.uk wrote in message
<71ptd1$1fg$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>...
>In article <rosettastone-0...@blakmail.demon.co.uk>,
> rosett...@pains.to.keep.you.in.the.dark (rosetta stone) wrote:
>(something, anything at all)
>
>Well, the rumours about being pissed off with the *entire* scene must be
>false, since Porl is still reading UPG! :-)
Fair Comment
>
>More seriously, I've been pissed off with goth for years. Rosetta [we|a]re
the
>only band keeping the goth tag going and any fecker who believes the pile
of
>crap demo tapes and short-run home-pressed CDs which every other goth band
>issues can support a subculture is sadly mistaken.
My definition og goth ins not just the music
>
>This is the end of the line. Goth today is shite. The music sucks, the
>fashion is laughable and the politics stink. We've all had enough. We all
>prefer techno anyway (didn't we always? were we just fooling ourselves in
>order to hang around with cool looking people?). And most of us lot here
are
>pushing 30... does the word "sad" ring any bells?
Techno has it's place but not in my music collection and never have liked
it, I used to be in to Rock music, not the american crap but the 70's-80's
Rock from England. I hang aroung with who I please, and not always Goths, 30
well yeah I'm getting there. SAD I like being SAD.
>
>Face it, the only cool goth bands are the ones which don't sound goth at
all.
What dose goth sound like then please define.
>
>The problem is that we've all invested such an enourmous part of our lives
in
>being goth that it has become really difficult for any of us to just
divorce
>ourselves from goth overnight. We've become a subculture of hangers-on. All
>our friends are goths. We have an enourmous wardrobe full of black clothes
>that would cost a fortune to replace, and we don't even know where to go to
>find decent normal clothes anymore. We'd have to go out and actually *talk*
>to people to find new friends, rather than just hang about with people
based
>on their dress sense. Goth is such an easy subculture to join, but so very
>difficult to leave...
I came to goth as a natural Progretion from Rock, and did not just jump
straight in, and yes I still go to Rock gigs, A) cos the music is good, and
B) there is no infighting, and C) It dose not stagnate.
I shop at secon hand shop's, my wardrobe would cost very little to replace,
but why should I I like what I wear. I Talk to all of my Goth friends and
Normal Friends. Since when dose your dress sence difine what and who you
are. I wear a Suit all day, and jeans and T-shirt at a weekend. Goth easy to
join CRAP, you ask any normal person what they think is goth and you might
be supprised, and to teach them what I have learnt to over the years being a
goth takes time.
I could leave if I wished, but I Like what I like and Hate what I hate, No
one person tells me what is good or bad.
>
>How many times have you been to a goth gig and wished they'd turn the
bloody
>PA down so you could talk to your friends over the awful drivel on stage?
>
Ohh every Fathful Dawn gig. I have seen them to many times.
>How many gigs have you liked the look of, but then boycotted because you
don't
>want to get involved in the politics?
NONE
>
>How many of us actually listen to tapes of goth music when we're on our own
in
>the car? Not industrial or techno or darkwave, proper goth music. And I'm
not
>counting you at the back with the rubber bat. Approximately? None.
>
Well I can name quite a few ppl one was a Raver, who listened to goth,
rather than rave. and we perfer Vinyl.
>Sure, it'll be sad if Porl and Karl stop doing music/media altogether,
>they're some of the most creative people around today. But a six month
break,
>followed by a change of name and direction could be all that is required.
And
>so long as we don't follow Porl and Karl's future careers whilst wearing
>velvet cloaks and fangs then they'll be a huge success.
So your telling us to just follow them blindly and not like there music, I
like there old music, and some of there new music, but if they did some
thing different I may follow but if I don't like it I won't.
Yes they are creative musically, but Being a trained and experienced Graphic
Designer/Illistrator, The artwork leave a little to be desired, as I said
earier, but it cannot be all bad as ppl buy it.
>
>Anyone wishing to take over the UPG FAQ please apply via email. Thank-you
and
>goodnight.
Not me I have enough on my plate
>
>-------------------------------------------------------------------
>Andrew Oakley <evil...@cimmerii.demon.co.uk> PGP Key ID 2E2C7969
>www.cimmerii.demon.co.uk - UPG FAQ, home page, photos, links & more
>"what is the use of music," thought Alice, "without drum machines?"
>
Gabriel Strange
Carpet Boy wrote in message ...
>
>I have no problem with you or whoever saying "I don't like Rosetta
>Stone" -- that's your opinion and you're entitled to it -- but now you
>insist you're merely voicing your opinions and "not slaming anybody"...
>when only yesterday you made the unsubstantiated claim that Rosetta
>Stone were "selling out" in order to "make more money".
>
>Spare me the hypocrisy. It's *my* *opinion* that you are full of shit.
Why? thats all I want Why do you have these opinions, why am I full of shit
just saying it is not going to change anything, it might if you explain why.
otherwise there is no debate or discustion just name calling and arguments.
( This is probably why they left the scene, and don't fucking quote me on
it, as I do not know why they did it just seams to me thorough my
experiences thay this would be a good reason. )
>
>Have a nice life,
>
>Dave
>
>--
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------
>"lose hold/just let it go/give in give up abandon yourself to the flow"
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Gabriel Strange
rosetta stone wrote in message ...
>In article <910135177.11509.0...@news.demon.co.uk>, "Gabriel
>Strange" <ga...@gothland.demon.co.uk> wrote shite:
>
>
>> and The T-shirts are another annoyance, Yes one year of rip offs was fun,
>> but this October, I was expecting some good RS T-shirts, and not just
>> Rip-offs".
>
>
>I'm flattered my wordsmithing/artwork is so staggeringly profound that you
>assume I must've ripped it off...
Well you see I am a trained Graphic designer/ Illistrator, and Personally
there has been nothing original in the art work for 20 years, T-shirts are
the worst offender. Album covers are the least in my opinion.
I asume othere wise why are you not sueing the Crap out of Sony. and Eidos.
For breach or Copyright.
>
>
>...and you wonder why I've had enough?
Yes we do, As I have said I have my Opinions and am willing to explain and
adapt unlike may ppl who just have a go and don't give a reason. I fyou have
a grip with me just ask me directly and I will thell you why, My opinions
are such.
I would be better for this Thread if you just gave an explination, then at
leaset I would stop people from bitching and sideing with you or whoever.
Yo have you reasons, but if they are anything to do with the bitching then
any atempt to stop it would be better than inaction.
Gabby
Gabriel Strange
I am willing to change my opinions, if some one corrects my on my mistakes.
Yet it seams a lot of pple are not.
die_la...@my-dejanews.com wrote in message
<71psbf$78$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>...
>so have they finished or not ?
>
>rosetta stone have done more for the 90's goth scene than any other goth
band
>that l can think of. they are one of the reasons that we, and many other
90's
>goth bands ever started. they have been an inspiration for new bands, and a
>real kick up the arse for older bands who have become lazy and despondent
with
>the scene (ahem. . .)
>
>so, what happens if they go this time for good ? many ppl may feel that
>nothing will change, as the end of one band will not result in the end of
the
>uk scene. really ? the reality is that it may signal the end of this era of
>goth music - because older bands such as ourselves ( 6 years and counting )
>and rosetta etc have had just about all they can stomach of the bitchiness
>and infighting of the uk goth scene.
>
>you may not care, or feel that it will not effect you personally, but how
>many more bands can we afford to lose ? there are some great new uk bands,
>but how many can you honestly say will make it to where rosetta are now ?(
>before they give up before they even get anywhere or lose their
individuality
>on the way ). do you want to go to gigs and see no headline bands, only
small
>and inexperienced ( musically with their sound and performance )support
bands
>? again you may not care. . . but l do.
>
>the uk scene is on the edge of imploding. don't get me wrong, we're not
quite
>finished yet - and i'm used to fighting to get what we want as a band; l
don't
>want to see any more bands ( and the dedicated people who work so hard to
>support the scene e.g. promoters, brv etc )destroyed by the back stabbing.
(
>and we all know who started this in the first place. . . i hope you're
happy
>now ****)
>
>it's way past time for this to stop - and i'm not so arrogant to believe
that
>anything l say will have any impact, just that l wanted to add my voice to
>the others who have suffered and survived the hate campaigns launched on uk
>scene ( and the net - i've been on-line for ages but couldn't face the
>resulting war of words until now ) over the last few years.
>
>maybe this will be the end . . . or is it just the beginning of the end ? i
>hope that rosetta don't go for good - they will be greatly missed and
mourned
>for sometime to come.
>
>rachel (die laughing)
>
>In article <363fa06d...@read.news.globalnet.co.uk>,
> un...@globalnet.co.uk (Michael Johnson) wrote:
>> "Gabriel Strange" <ga...@gothland.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>> >{Rumour}
>> >I have heard that They are all fed up with the Pre-tention in the goth
>> >scene, and have been roumoured to be fed up of all the derssing up, and
want
>> >to where jeans and T-shirts. (Blue and White ones).
>> >{End}
>>
>> Uh, so Rosetta want out because they don't like the way people DRESS??
>>
>> <sigh> No wonder Rosetta are pissed off at the goff scene.....even the
>> quality of the rumours is going downhill....
>>
>> --
>> Uncle Nemesis > Michael Johnson > un...@globalnet.co.uk
>> Nemesis Promotions - Contrary to rumours, Not Bankrupt Yet ;-)
>> http://www.nemesis.to
>>
>
>
Paul Kinsler
> Oh, come on!
> You can't help but admit that goth is stagnating.
> Something needs to happen, and it needs to happen fast.
I wonder if the rock'n'roll crowd suffer from this "we must move
forward, or die" obsession. Moving forward is nice, but not
necessary for "goth" to survive.
--
#Paul.
------------------------------+soluble fish+------------------------------
Inst Microwaves & Photonics, University of Leeds, UK. (ph) +44 113 2332089
"You people, you do not see the grandeur in the wind and stone and stars,
in the blood and fire and iron - but paint only the flowers."
Loki
evil...@cimmerii.demon.co.uk wrote in message
<71ptd1$1fg$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>...
>In article <rosettastone-0...@blakmail.demon.co.uk>,
> rosett...@pains.to.keep.you.in.the.dark (rosetta stone) wrote:
>(something, anything at all)
>
>This is the end of the line. Goth today is shite. The music sucks, the
>fashion is laughable and the politics stink. We've all had enough. We all
>prefer techno anyway
What's with the "we all prefer techno", speak for yourself, we do not prefer
techno if we did we would be honest and say we're casuals!
>Andrew Oakley <evil...@cimmerii.demon.co.uk
Ben Wilson
Gabriel Strange <ga...@gothland.demon.co.uk> writes
>
>Now if anybody chooses to slam me now for what I have said then you are no
>better than the rest of them. At last if you disagree say why, and if
>someone is incorrect correct them. Don't just jump of the deep end.
(not wishing to get my head bitten off)
IMHO the reason you got your head bitten off, is that it *appeared* that
the original posting was designed to stir shit *rather* than a genuine
appeal for information. Given that tensions were already high regarding
the whole matter, you probably just asked the wrong question at the
wrong time, and had it wrongly interpreted. No-one's fault, it just
happens.
--
Ben Wilson
Ben Wilson
evil...@cimmerii.demon.co.uk writes
>More seriously, I've been pissed off with goth for years. Rosetta [we|a]re the
>only band keeping the goth tag going
^^^^
There's plenty keeping the 'tag' going - Even MM has had a go.
>and any fecker who believes the pile of
>crap demo tapes and short-run home-pressed CDs which every other goth band
>issues can support a subculture is sadly mistaken.
Very true
>
>This is the end of the line. Goth today is shite.
Bollox [1]
>The music sucks,
Double bollox
> the
>fashion is laughable
Admittedly it's not got the originality it used to, and you don't often
see wide brimmed hats covered in flour...
> and the politics stink.
Yeah, true, but you tend to find those involved in the in-fighting are
*usually* either:
1: Those with a vested interest in destroying others in the scene
2: Those immature (physically & emotionally) kindergoths who use the
currency of gossip and rumour to try and climb the unattainable 'ladder
of Gothicdom'
> We've all had enough.
I've just thought 'Fuck 'em' to those out to cause trouble. Admittedly
I've had *nowhere* near the amount the Rosetta have, but there are
plenty of ppl out there who'll be sad to see them go - whose feelings
are important.
> We all
>prefer techno anyway (didn't we always? were we just fooling ourselves in
>order to hang around with cool looking people?).
Now you're just being stupid!!! (or sarcastic???)
> And most of us lot here are
>pushing 30... does the word "sad" ring any bells?
Well, if you're pushing 30 and have been a pseudogoth for years, in the
hope of hanging out with cool ppl........
>
>Face it, the only cool goth bands are the ones which don't sound goth at all.
^^^^^^^^^^^
I'd put 'don't TRY to sound goth'
Besides, who wants to be 'cool'???
>
>
>How many times have you been to a goth gig and wished they'd turn the bloody
>PA down so you could talk to your friends over the awful drivel on stage?
Erm...none - If I want to chat I go to the pub and avoid the ticket
prices and extortionate gig booze costs
>
>How many gigs have you liked the look of, but then boycotted because you don't
>want to get involved in the politics?
None!
>
>How many of us actually listen to tapes of goth music when we're on our own in
>the car?
(raises hand)
ME!!! (though they're sometimes CDs - does that count???)
>Not industrial or techno or darkwave, proper goth music.
define proper goth m..[slaps hand over mouth]
On second thoughts I don't want to start a 5m post thread
[1] It were better in the olde days, y'know
--
Ben 'Morgoth' Wilson
E-mail: dj...@armoury1.demon.co.uk
Ben Wilson
Gabriel Strange <ga...@gothland.demon.co.uk> writes
>>Face it, the only cool goth bands are the ones which don't sound goth at
>all.
>
AAAGGGGGGHHHHH!!!!
NOOOOO!!! - Someone asked THE question.
Here come 1000s of posts 'defining' goth.....
--
Ben Wilson
Trizia
>>More seriously, I've been pissed off with goth for years. Rosetta [we|a]re
>>the only band keeping the goth tag going and any fecker who believes the pile
>>of crap demo tapes and short-run home-pressed CDs which every other goth band
>>issues can support a subculture is sadly mistaken.
>
Doesn't that just sound a teensy bit arrogant? And very derogatory
towards bands that do the best they can with limited resources.
Northern Ireland's biggest independent record label of the early/ mid
- eighties only released on tape because that was all that was
affordable at the time. They didn't confine themselves to goth stuff,
that's true, but you should hear what their sound engineer could do
with two fourtracks.
The medium doesn't matter half so much as the music.
IMO, it's the demo tapes and the home pressed CD's that make it a
subculture. It wouldn't be one if the music was put out by big labels
and on tv and radio ... though it would certainly be nice.
>>This is the end of the line. Goth today is shite. The music sucks,
Some of it does, some of it doesn't. But even the shite stuff is
better than chart music.
>the fashion is laughable
Well, it is getting a bit too cyber/fetish for some peoples liking.
>and the politics stink.
Politics? What politics? I haven't seen any politics in any music
for years.
>> We all prefer techno anyway
No we don't. I agree with Loki on that one. (btw, Loki I saw you in
the Spa, but you looked toooooo scary to say hi to)
>>were we just fooling ourselves in
>>order to hang around with cool looking people?).
But you just said that the fashion was laughable.
>>And most of us lot here are pushing 30... does the word "sad" ring any bells?
>
What's so sad about it?? Some of us don't want to get boring as we
get older. I do as many daft things now as I did when I was 15 - I
just think about them before doing them these days.
Not everyone believes that eventually one has to give into the
mortgage/9 to 5/2.5 children crap.
>>Face it, the only cool goth bands are the ones which don't sound goth at
>>all.
>
If they don't sound goth, how can they be a goth band???
>>The problem is that we've all invested such an enourmous part of our lives
>>in being goth that it has become really difficult for any of us to just
>>divorce ourselves from goth overnight.
No.
>>All our friends are goths.
No.
>>We have an enourmous wardrobe full of black clothes
Yes, but only because I've always preferred black.
>>that would cost a fortune to replace,
Not really, most of it is second hand stuff.
>> and we don't even know where to go to find decent normal clothes anymore.
Not true. It's easier to find 'normal' clothes than goth clothes.
>>rather than just hang about with people based on their dress sense.
You'd have to be a really sad arse to do that.
>>How many times have you been to a goth gig and wished they'd turn the
>>bloody PA down so you could talk to your friends over the awful drivel on stage?
If you knew it was going to be drivel why did you go??
>>How many of us actually listen to tapes of goth music when we're on our own
>>in the car?
Well, there are two of us in this room right now : )
Trizia
... Celt, Pagan, Poet, Lunatic; what more can one ask?
Carpet Boy
Gabriel Strange <ga...@gothland.demon.co.uk> writes
>
>Well you see I am a trained Graphic designer/ Illistrator, and Personally
>there has been nothing original in the art work for 20 years, T-shirts are
>the worst offender. Album covers are the least in my opinion.
>
>I asume othere wise why are you not sueing the Crap out of Sony. and Eidos.
>For breach or Copyright.
I think that'll be the "media hacking" & "cultural subversion" or
whatever it was HiRez put. Maybe it was all a cunning and humourous
parody that you failed to get.
I'd sure like to see your Rosetta discography if it stretches back
twenty years... and you Sure hAve oDD uSe of Case and Spellling for a
trained Graphic designer/ Illistrator... (AFAIK Rosetta didn't have
much artwork control with albums until the Tyranny of Inaction... it
was all Rosetta-designed from gEN cON onwards...)
>>...and you wonder why I've had enough?
>
>Yes we do, As I have said I have my Opinions and am willing to explain and
>adapt unlike may ppl who just have a go and don't give a reason. I fyou have
>a grip with me just ask me directly and I will thell you why, My opinions
>are such.
*We* do...? Who are you speaking for here? (I thought I made my own
opinions patently obvious.)
>I would be better for this Thread if you just gave an explination, then at
>leaset I would stop people from bitching and sideing with you or whoever.
>Yo have you reasons, but if they are anything to do with the bitching then
>any atempt to stop it would be better than inaction.
Rosetta have been explaining themselves for a long time... for anyone
who's willing to pay attention and listen. If the situation was more to
do with "bitching" as you put it, and less to do with "sabotage", then
maybe Rosetta would still be here. Maybe they'd still be here if goths
still gave a fuck about... well... goth.
And Karl Robinson pointed out the present line they're taking appeared
today... http://www.blakmail.demon.co.uk/
Aconite
> What's with the "we all prefer techno", speak for yourself, we do not prefer
> techno if we did we would be honest and say we're casuals!
No we wouldn't. I prefer techno. I defy anyone to label me a casual in
any kind of serious manner. I'm not a goth, but I'm definitely not a
casual.
The world isn't all that black and white you know.
Aconite
--
Narcissistic homepage at http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/5666
Tim Baker
gratuitous snipping...
However, since I agreed with pretty much all of it, i'm glad someone
could be arsed to write a decent reply; I was tempted, but it was just
too daunting a task without being excessivley nasty to someone.
TBH, I think that this is the most depressingly pessimistic thread
I've seen thus far(ok, so I've only been reading for about a year, but
it was still pretty bad). I just hope that it was the result of
temporary pissed-off-ness, rather than genuine feeling.
IMO the scene is healthier now than at any other time this
decade(can't comment on the 80's- I was too busy listening to Betty Boo
and the KLF). The new musical influences are not taking over, but being
assimilated into the scene, which is making it richer, without killing
it.
Maybe it's all just a matter of perspective; the scene is inevitably
going to change. Some people might think that this is a move towards the
death of the goth scene, because it is no longer what it was, but surely
that is assuming that it was ever a finished project. The world changes,
so the scene will change with it, but that is just the cosmetic stuff. I
could go on, but probably no-one's that interested in social philosophy
anyway.
>>How many of us actually listen to tapes of goth music when we're on our own in
>>the car?
>ME!!! (though they're sometimes CDs - does that count???)
>[1] It were better in the olde days, y'know
--
Tim Baker
PS: so how many killfiles am I in now?
antony johnston
> No, why can't Porl let us know what's going on? Surely it's better to set the
> record straight than to let the rumour-mongers take over
...oddly enough, I seem to remember a rather long thread a few months
ago in which porl attempted to do just that. and got slagged mightily
for it.
hey, kids! it's a fun, fun world. but people still feel like shit.
--
antony johnston : www.mostlyblack.demon.co.uk
:: f a i l u r e i s n o t a n o p t i o n ::
antony johnston
> Yes they are creative musically, but Being a trained and experienced Graphic
> Designer/Illistrator, The artwork leave a little to be desired
bollocks. just because porl does it himself, does that make it bad? I've
seen "professionally" produced inlays that look like ten shades of dirt
next to something like gender confusion. a small point, but valid.
[go on, I *dare* you]
antony johnston
> there has been nothing original in the art work for 20 years, T-shirts are
> the worst offender. Album covers are the least in my opinion.
"everything has been done...there are no new ideas...nothing is
original...except ME!"
-- hugo tate, c.1990
*yawn*
antony johnston
some very impassioned stuff. a lot of which I know is not true for andi
himself. so just to add some devil's advocate stylee banter...
> This is the end of the line. Goth today is shite. The music sucks, the
> fashion is laughable and the politics stink.
now this all depends on your definition of Goth[tm], and we don't go
there and we don't do that. the music...well, I tend to agree with andi
that the best goth bands are the ones which don't "sound goth", and by
this *I* mean those who don't fall into the "easy.goth" category. they
know who they are.
as for the fashion...hell, I'm never going to win any goff fashion
awards. but I happen to like modern goth fashion myself. I just can't
wear most of it due to certain, ah, physical shortcomings. and it's
certainly a testament to how much it's changed that I can wander about
at whitby wearing what I do and still be considered a goth. [1]
the politics...well, no argument there. I try to stay well clear of it.
hmmm, maybe this is why I was never part of the in crowd. ho hum.
> We all prefer techno anyway (didn't we always?
er...no. at least, no more than motorhead/abba/bowie/skynyrd...though I
realise I'm somewhat of an exception here. [2]
> All our friends are goths. We have an enourmous wardrobe full of black
> clothes that would cost a fortune to replace, and we don't even know where
> to go to find decent normal clothes anymore.
now I *know* andi's being ironic here -- because that description
certainly applies to neither him, me, or the great majority of my
friends whom I would also call goths. apart from the black clothes, but
if you can find one "gothic" item of clothing in my wardrobe I'll, er,
be very surprised.
> How many times have you been to a goth gig and wished they'd turn the bloody
> PA down so you could talk to your friends over the awful drivel on stage?
many. true, I have seen an *awful* lot of shite bands. but I've also
seem a lot of good ones, even at goth gigs would you believe...
> How many gigs have you liked the look of, but then boycotted because you don't
> want to get involved in the politics?
none, but see above.
> How many of us actually listen to tapes of goth music when we're on our own in
> the car? Not industrial or techno or darkwave, proper goth music.
again, kinda depends on your definition. I'd say quite a bit, but then I
count MDB & TON as goth...
> so long as we don't follow Porl and Karl's future careers whilst wearing
> velvet cloaks and fangs then they'll be a huge success.
hey, let's hope so.
--
antony johnston : www.mostlyblack.demon.co.uk
:: f a i l u r e i s n o t a n o p t i o n ::
[1] except by some jumped-up pony in the toilets, but we won't go there.
[2] NP: volume 8: the threat is real, anthrax [*darn*. but I was playing
covenant before, honest...]
Kevin O' Gorman
>Because he chose to put himself in the public eye and has a moral duty to the
>people that have supported him and bought his records over the years. Not
>everyone has screwed him over and he still has a lot of fans out there who are
>left in limbo not knowing what's going on.
What's going on is that they've broken up - what more do they need to know?
It's pretty obvious to anyone who's visited their web site/ read their mailing
list that they weren't happy bunnies re: their music career.
I don't see that putting yourself in the public eye equates with letting
everybody into your toilet to examine the contents of your stool.
K.
-
--
"Can you feel the sadness in our love?-It's the only kind we're worthy of-
Can you feel the madness in our hearts?-As the key turns and the engine starts"
antony johnston
> What's with the "we all prefer techno", speak for yourself, we do not prefer
> techno if we did we would be honest and say we're casuals!
you narrow-minded little bigot. have a nice life.
hatty
Stormbringer wrote in message ...
>And the politics are fucking ridiculous. Look at your local goth
scene.
>Look at this newsgroup. Arguments, bitching, etc. etc. and contrary
to
>the spin-doctors' popular belief, It has NOT always been like this.
No, it was worse - it was insular and it was narrow minded. You only had
to have one record incorrect or one crimp out of place and you were
ostracised. I like the diversity of todays goths. I stand around like a
proud parent sometimes. Since returning to goth world (after a long
absense due mainly to a band covered in flour), it is less pretentious
and more welcoming than it was some (many) years ago. It has a sense of
humour now and when I were a lass - we took it soooooo seriously, the
bitching and the arguments I doubt has anything to do with the *scene*
more to do with individuals.
Maybe I just like 98 gothworld because it is not ageist - but then
techno is not ageist either.
Anyway, some clever DJ type, is going to take goth, buy a 303, a sampler
and do some proper mixing and keep us all happy,
hatty
who may do a whitby review if she ever retrieves the brain cells
containing the data.......
hatty
Tim Baker wrote in message ...
> IMO the scene is healthier now than at any other time this
>decade(can't comment on the 80's- I was too busy listening to Betty Boo
>and the KLF).
In the eighties the scene was way too serious and incestuous. Not so
much the music but the people in clubs and stuff, we were way too busy
trying to get our goth membership card. Although I probably prefer to
listen to some of the 80s bands....thats more a reflection of my age
than anything worng with 98s scene. The scene is healthier attitude
wise, than it was ten years ago.
The new musical influences are not taking over, but being
>assimilated into the scene, which is making it richer, without killing
>it.
And so they should, its about progression. And variety. Years ago you
did not have the choices available now. We had indentikit record
collections, clothes, hairstyles, mekk-up - its good to see the
variations on a theme.
> Maybe it's all just a matter of perspective; the scene is inevitably
>going to change. Some people might think that this is a move towards
the
>death of the goth scene, because it is no longer what it was, but
surely
>that is assuming that it was ever a finished project.
Absolutely - and it should not cling to the past, respect your roots
yeah, but theres room for new and innovative stuff that may grab its
influence from techno, old goth or wherever. Though I do flinch a bit at
bands who are so like the Mission/Sisters they are the Mission/Sisters.
The world changes,
>so the scene will change with it, but that is just the cosmetic stuff.
I
>could go on, but probably no-one's that interested in social philosophy
>anyway.
It is good that the scene changes whilst retaining that elusive factor
that makes stuff *goth*.
I think the goth scene will survive if it continues to evolve.
>>[1] It were better in the olde days, y'know
>on second thoughts, i'm not so sure I agree with that bit ;p
same - it was good then - very good - but not *better* than now.
hatty
one tequila, two tequila, three tequila, floor
five tequila, six tequila, seven tequila, mort!
antony johnston
> Anyway, some clever DJ type, is going to take goth, buy a 303, a sampler
> and do some proper mixing and keep us all happy,
hmmm. I really must urge my old bandmate J to get his arse in gear =!>
Michael Johnson
>Have you ever noticed how all of todays best goth bands never actually look
>"Goth" on stage...
This is very true. And, as Pete Scathe will probably confirm, many
(all?) of the early bands simply didn't look 'gothic' in the
stereotyped way which later became pretty much the goff-norm. And I
could add, it's unusual for the people who *run* goth events to appear
in full slap and swathes of velvet. I advance myself and my patent
sack-of-shit-tied-up-with-string image as evidence.....
>It's all part of whether the band are trying to be "goth" or just trying to
>write music...
>I doubt any of the better bands ATM, actually sit down and think let's write a
>goth track. And this is their strength....
Exactly. Ooooh, I get demo tapes from time to time which are hideously
'goth-by-numbers' and it gets me so depressed....
><revelation>
>Maybe if they spent more time writing the music naturally, and not trying so
>hard to write "goth" stuff, they might stop being crap....
></revelation>
Tell that to the bands! Funny, really. Just now upg seems to be in the
throes of a 'goth is crap' phase, (see the Rosetta thread above for
evidence) and in a paradoxical way I feel quite encouraged by this.
Because, on the quiet, I've been applying exactly those principles in
the Nemesis Promotions Quality Control department for some time. When
I'm trying to assemble a gig, I *never* bother about whether the
resulting show will be 'goth enough'. If that was my main guideline, a
lot of the best Nemesis gigs would simply never have happened. I do,
however, worry quite extensively about whether the gigs will be
*good*.
I think 1998 will go down as the year when the goth landscape changed
quite radically. There's a shake-up going on, and I suspect a certain
amount of preconceptions and assumptions relating to What Goth Is All
About are going to get unceremoniously shovelled into the dumper.....
And not, if I may be so bold, before time.....
Much as I'm upset by Rosetta's decision to remove themselves from the
goth-equation (because, let's face it, they were 'kin good) when all's
said & done I'm up for whatever's going to happen *next*.
It's going to get.....interesting....
And I'm ready....
--
Uncle Nemesis > Michael Johnson > un...@globalnet.co.uk
Nemesis Promotions - Goth-Landscape gardening a speciality
http://www.nemesis.to
the Gruamach
cancer, but forgot it all when:
>
>In article <364a378c....@news.stlnet.com>, got...@stlnet.com (the
>Gruamach) writes:
>
>>Other than general curiousity, why does he have to explain shit to
>>you, or anyone else?
>
>Because he chose to put himself in the public eye and has a moral duty to the
>people that have supported him and bought his records over the years. Not
>everyone has screwed him over and he still has a lot of fans out there who are
>left in limbo not knowing what's going on.
No, I'm sorry, but no one has a "moral duty" for anything.
RS made music, recorded albums and you and I a lot of others bought
them.
They didn't force you to spend your money on their music, or spend
your money to go to their gigs. You did it because you wanted to. You
enjoyed the music, thus got the "service" you paid money for.
But now they "owe" you explainations? Sorry, but I don't think so.
THat's like saying that an actor has a "moral duty" to justify not
making any more movies, or a famous writer having to justify not
making any more books.
They offered a service, and you bought said service. They don't owe
you a thing. Deal with it.
Charles/the Gruamach, http://home.stlnet.com/~gothcop
The St. Louis Perkygoff, dammit!
Alt.Gothic's own Garibaldi and expecting DaddyGoth
the Gruamach
cancer, but forgot it all when:
>No, why can't Porl let us know what's going on? Surely it's better to set the
>record straight than to let the rumour-mongers take over ond continue exactly
>what he was apparently speaking out against? He felt the need to make a totally
>ambiguious statement then shuts up leaving all the Rosetta fans in the dark.
>Surely he must owe them something for all the support they've given him over
>the years? These are the people that have put a roof over his head and food on
>his plate.
I'm as curious as anyone else as to what's going on, particularly
since I couldn't be at Whitbey.
But my point is, why does he HAVE to? He could have just up and
stopped doing anything at all, if he wanted to.
He (or anyone else in this world) has no obligation to you or anyone
else, even me. The only obligation they might owe would be to a
company that they might have a contract with.
But to you? No, he doesn't owe a thing to you.
It'd be nice to know what's up, but is it Porl's "Moral Duty" to do
so? No.
the Gruamach
cancer, but forgot it all when:
>WnderBunny wrote:
>>snip>
>
>> Given what is happening in the US and Germany goth is becoming ever >more popular.
>
>An interesting point. Why is the scene apparently healthier in these two
>countries than in our own island? The types of society, economy, attitude to
Two words: Spice Girls
(three): Oasis
Or Chumbaba-whateverthehell.
I think the problem might be the horrid crap that's taking over "Brit
Pop" lately. It's brining down the quality of everything else with
it.
WnderBunny
In article <19981104150916...@ng15.aol.com>, coups...@aol.com
(COUPSNESTI) writes:
>Mixy spouts...
>>No, why can't Porl let us know what's going on? Surely it's better to set
>the
>>record straight than to let the rumour-mongers take over
>
>It's a bit 'kin late for that don't you think...
Exactly what I was trying to stop. Porl complains about all the bullshit and
politics on the scene then deliberately goes out and starts another batch. IMHO
he's just sunk to the same level as ****
Mixy
Mixy
<The views expressed herein are strictly my own or those of the voices in my
head>
ICQ 15290022
Remember to remove antispam "postheap" before replying
Michael Johnson
>No, it was worse - it was insular and it was narrow minded. You only had
>to have one record incorrect or one crimp out of place and you were
>ostracised.
This is true. <ashamed> I remember, in about 1985, laughing loud and
long at my then-girlfriend when I discovered she owned a Thompson
Twins record, hidden away among the Bauhaus and Siouxsie. What a crap
thing for me to do...especially as my own record collection, then and
now, would hardly pass any goth-test.
She dumped me. Not because of the Thompson Twins incident, but because
she met some hippy bloke. But it was poetic justice, I suppose.
Still think the Thompson Twins are arse, mind....
>I like the diversity of todays goths.
Diversity, perversity, will see you through adversity. I think things
are about to change quite drastically in the world-o-goff. There's
another post from me in the 'Sign of a great band' thread below which
enlarges on this (as if anyone cared). I think Rosetta have left us a
very timely parting gift: a sodding great Quality-Control bomb....
--
Uncle Nemesis > Michael Johnson > un...@globalnet.co.uk
Nemesis Promotions - Now in new Quality Control flavour:
http://www.nemesis.to
Loki
Aconite wrote in message <3640E2...@dial.pipex.com>...
>Loki wrote:
>
>> What's with the "we all prefer techno", speak for yourself, we do not
prefer
>> techno if we did we would be honest and say we're casuals!
>
>any kind of serious manner. I'm not a goth, but I'm definitely not a
>casual.
>
>The world isn't all that black and white you know.
>
>Aconite
>
accepted! it's not all black and white, I just react when I see a posting
that claims to speak for everyone. It's true those who like techno are not
all casuals, hell even I like some of the industrial techno! It just pees me
off when a statement claims to speak for all.
Loki
antony johnston wrote in message
>Loki <lo...@kian.NOSPAMdircon.co.uk> wrote:
>
>> What's with the "we all prefer techno", speak for yourself, we do not
prefer
>> techno if we did we would be honest and say we're casuals!
>
>
>--
>antony johnston : www.mostlyblack.demon.co.uk
>
techno" as if they speak for all of UPG.
You call me names, you don't even know me, so I guess that makes you a total
wanker!!!!!
WnderBunny
In article <36411...@newsread1.dircon.co.uk>, "Loki"
<lo...@kian.NOSPAMdircon.co.uk> writes:
>>you narrow-minded little bigot. have a nice life.
>>
>>--
>>antony johnston : www.mostlyblack.demon.co.uk
This has to be the worse potkettleblack scenario I've ever seen. Andrew calling
Loki narrow-minded ??? Did someone slip something in my coffee. If it wasn't so
ridiculous I'd be laughing my head off.
>You call me names, you don't even know me, so I guess that makes you a total
>wanker!!!!!
You mean it took you that long to notice ? Not only does he have politics that
make Hitler look looney-left but he thinks he's Mr UPG and can talk for
everyone just because he has the FAX on his website.
Matthew North
> >
> >I was planning to snog the drum machine!
> >
> >But I didnt want to pass on my throat infection so I resisted.
> >It's cute tho :)
>
>
> I thought it was an ADAT?
I thought it was samples from the Aki recorded to the adat cause porl got
fed up with the roland drum box
pity its big and black and has big buttons!
mat
Matthew North
> More seriously, I've been pissed off with goth for years. Rosetta
[we|a]re the
> only band keeping the goth tag going and any fecker who believes the pile
of
> crap demo tapes and short-run home-pressed CDs which every other goth
band
> issues can support a subculture is sadly mistaken.
Well Iv'e had quite a few GOOD home pressed CDs and Demos sent to me
lately, to review
in the sound of music (Shameless Plug)
> This is the end of the line. Goth today is shite.
Well there isnt the "Chart Level" bands around as much as they were old
school Balaam, Sisters, Army, Spear etc are all
playing to top form at the moment, and I was highly inpressed with all the
bands that played the main whitby event.
The music sucks,
Matter of opinion
the
> fashion is laughable
The fashon is different it was very interesting to see such a wide
diversity of styles st whitby.
and the politics stink.
So Ignor it
We've all had enough. We all
> prefer techno anyway
I dont, though James Ray and Rosetta have crafted techno into the gith
sphear, though I would prefer to hear old school
eclectonic such as Tangerine dream, Kraft werk and Jarre
> How many times have you been to a goth gig and wished they'd turn the
bloody
> PA down so you could talk to your friends over the awful drivel on stage?
so Why go, most people know what bands they are going to see dont they?
> How many gigs have you liked the look of, but then boycotted because you
don't
> want to get involved in the politics?
Nil, though I wouldnt stsand in the middle of an NMA gig for fear of being
trampled on again!
> How many of us actually listen to tapes of goth music when we're on our
own in
> the car?
yep, rosetta at whitby bootleg currently on the playlist....
> proper goth music.
Floating in my car at the moment:-
Mission - Blood Brother CD
Cult - Live At the Marquee
Sisters - Vision Thing (aint played it for ages)
Nosferatu - The Prophacy (cause its a damn good album and most people slag
it who have never heard it 50/50 goth & Prog)
MN
Stormbringer
<kin...@bloch.leeds.ac.uk> squeaked....
>In article <Oiw5QKA6...@stormy.demon.co.uk> Stormbringer wrote:
>> Oh, come on!
>> You can't help but admit that goth is stagnating.
>> Something needs to happen, and it needs to happen fast.
>
>I wonder if the rock'n'roll crowd suffer from this "we must move
>forward, or die" obsession. Moving forward is nice, but not
>necessary for "goth" to survive.
>
It's been busy moving sideways so far.
The big picture would seem to indicate stagnation. But NOT IN A NICE
WAY!!!
Goth has lost its impact. That's all there is to it.
>>-8>
** Storm **
Stormbringer
<wnder...@aol.compostheap> squeaked....
>
>In article <36411...@newsread1.dircon.co.uk>, "Loki"
><lo...@kian.NOSPAMdircon.co.uk> writes:
>
>>>you narrow-minded little bigot. have a nice life.
>>>
>>>--
>>>antony johnston : www.mostlyblack.demon.co.uk
>
>This has to be the worse potkettleblack scenario I've ever seen. Andrew calling
>Loki narrow-minded ??? Did someone slip something in my coffee. If it wasn't so
>ridiculous I'd be laughing my head off.
>
>>You call me names, you don't even know me, so I guess that makes you a total
>>wanker!!!!!
>
>You mean it took you that long to notice ? Not only does he have politics that
>make Hitler look looney-left but he thinks he's Mr UPG and can talk for
>everyone just because he has the FAX on his website.
>
For fuck's sake.
This is *exactly* what I was talking about.
Nobody around here can go for five minutes without insulting or
bitching. It's bloody pathetic. You'd get better behaviour from a
class of junior school kids.
I don't care *who* started it, just ALL OF YOU try and be civil for once
and stop your juvenile behaviour, just because you're shielded by the
net.
>>-8>
** Storm **
the...@mindless.com
> >An interesting point. Why is the scene apparently healthier in these two
> >countries than in our own island? The types of society, economy, attitude to
>
> Two words: Spice Girls
> (three): Oasis
and also the attitude that comes with thes bands (or the last one at
least)... people in england don't seem to want to be 'a freak'.... they want
ralph loren or whatever he's called... it's the attittude that english people
have... whereas in germany things seem to be a little differant, and i would
imagine that there's just a larger amount of diversity in the US because it's
so huge, thus allowing subcultures to develope more... possibly.. ????
the mime from hell
^*^ ^*^ ^*^ ^*^ ^*^
web: http://i.am/a.goth
ICQ: 2871668
-----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----------
http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own
steve_slimelight
>
> Tim Baker wrote in message ...
>
> >on second thoughts, i'm not so sure I agree with that bit ;p
>
> same - it was good then - very good - but not *better* than now.
It was just bigger with more British bands signed to bigger labels, more
gigs at bigger venues, and lots of press in Melody Maker, Sounds etc...
bla bla bla
Steve.
SLIMELIGHT URL: http://www.slimelight.com
steve_slimelight
>
>
> Anyway, some clever DJ type, is going to take goth, buy a 303, a sampler
> and do some proper mixing and keep us all happy,
>
> who may do a whitby review if she ever retrieves the brain cells
> containing the data.......
The 303 is a piece of crap (IMO). I reckon the Ravelution is much more
amusing!
You want a nice drum station, a bass station, Cubase Score VST, an AKAI
S3000 sampler, a nice hard disk recording set up, a Korg Trinity, a
Novation thingy (can't remember the name but it's great), and lots of
cash to get it all with!!!!!!!!
hahaha!
The Rattler
> Why is the scene apparently healthier in these two countries than in our own island?
got...@stlnet.com thinks:
> Two words: Spice Girls
> (three): Oasis
> Or Chumbaba-whateverthehell.
Eh? All of whom have nothing whatsoever to do with the goth scene...
> I think the problem might be the horrid crap that's taking over "Brit
> Pop" lately. It's brining down the quality of everything else with
> it.
Eh? I don't recall anything being released under the banner of "Brit Pop"
in quite awhile. The term itself is a bit defunct these days to the
extent that even the NME don't use it.
And on top of that, plenty of bands who were once deemed "Britpop" are
actually producing some f**king excellent albums this year. Example:
"Six" by Mansun.
Also... Chumbawumba have been around for donkey's years (something like
15 years now!) and have always been a steaming pile of arse, so quite why
you chose to mention them in your argument is beyond me...
--
"Ramalamalama Kenickie Kenickie!
Ramalamalama Kenickie Kenickie!"
**** Rattl...@hotmail.com
Stormbringer
<rattl...@hotmail.com> squeaked....
<snip>
>
>Eh? I don't recall anything being released under the banner of "Brit Pop"
>in quite awhile. The term itself is a bit defunct these days to the
>extent that even the NME don't use it.
>
...and that's going some.
>And on top of that, plenty of bands who were once deemed "Britpop" are
>actually producing some f**king excellent albums this year. Example:
>"Six" by Mansun.
>
Although the highlight is obviously Tom Baker's monologue.
>Also... Chumbawumba have been around for donkey's years (something like
>15 years now!) and have always been a steaming pile of arse, so quite why
>you chose to mention them in your argument is beyond me...
>
Hmmmm... I think Chumbawumba *used* to be a good band.
Their pre-'93 stuff is ok.
>>-8>
** Storm **
"Aaaaiieeeeeee!! The Clowns! The Clowns!"
The Rattler
says...
> >>How many times have you been to a goth gig and wished they'd turn the
> >>bloody PA down so you could talk to your friends over the awful drivel on stage?
Or more to the point, why didn't you leave?
The Rattler
In...@spam.gothic-rock.freeserve.co.uk says...
> Well Iv'e had quite a few GOOD home pressed CDs and Demos sent to me
> lately, to review
One of the *VERY* best albums I've heard this year was a home pressed CD.
"Zinc" by Rob Peters... Not quite "goth" (what is?), but very Nick Drake-
y and dreamy...
[SNIP Something about wishing bands would shut up so you can talk]
> so Why go, most people know what bands they are going to see dont they?
Quite... There's a simple solution... I go to gigs all the time (Goth and
Non-Goth), sometimes I know the bands really well, other times I don't.
If they're shit and I'd rather talk to my friends I will generally leave.
Sometimes I go and see a band, not knowing what to expect and end up
finding they're utterly brilliant (ie: The Breath Of Life)... You win
some, lose some... Such is the case for all types of music, not just
Goth.
Rob Ingram
Tim Baker <T...@barrack-farm.demon.co.uk> writes:
> (can't comment on the 80's- I was too busy listening to Betty Boo
> and the KLF).
What's wrong with that!? I'm _still_ listening to Betty Boo and the
KLF. Certainly prefer it to most modern goth stuff. :-)
Rob.
WnderBunny
The Rattler.........
>>Eh? I don't recall anything being released under the banner of "Brit Pop"
>>in quite awhile. The term itself is a bit defunct these days to the
>>extent that even the NME don't use it.
Strange as all sort of new brit-pop clubs are opening up over here. Seems the
US is lagging behing as usual.
Andi Gordon
> <snip>
> >More fitting would be Nervosa in various colour clashing outfits and
They were better than I thought they might have been, but not great.
But then it's early days yet for them.
If I listen to some of the shit I wrote 2 years ago I'm horrified.... With
this in mind, if Nervosa improve as all bands tend to, they should be able to
go quite a long way in the scene....
> >um... that dodgy boi in Emma conquest who decided not to wear much...
> >;P
> >
> >Marge xxx
>
> OI! Don't you go saying things about our Tim!
>
Actually, Emma Conquest are a good example of what I'm talking about.....
One of them looks like he should be called Vlad or summat, and another looks
like he's just spent all his money in Kensington Market.....
Image wise, they look like they are trying to be a goth band....
Their music was technically lots better that some bands I could mention, and
it did have a lot of bollox behind it, but I found that after the whitby gig I
couldn't remember any part of any of their songs. No real hooks. Nothing to
hold onto.
But really it's just the blandness of their identity that mirrors their
music...
Personal viewpoint.
Make your own minds up.
--
yours:~andi/gordon $
begin 666 signature<pre>
</wrists>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>d>vilution
#>--{ kitsch (the girl) }-------<#>|\\\\\\\\\\\www.dvilution.demon.co.uk
#>-{=====================}------<#>|//////////an...@dvilution.demon.co.uk
#>----{1st d>vilution single}---<#>0===================================0
#>--{ltd. edition ironic pink}--<#>|*******[album due b4 the]**********|
#>---{case with pvc sleeve}-----<#>|***********[millenium dome...]*****|
#>{available late 1998}---------<#>|***[(ie 2002)]*********************|
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<dis.con.one
Michael Johnson
>> IMO the scene is healthier now than at any other time this
>>decade(can't comment on the 80's- I was too busy listening to Betty Boo
>>and the KLF).
Hey, weren't we all! BTW, whatever happened to Betty Boo?
>In the eighties the scene was way too serious and incestuous. Not so
>much the music but the people in clubs and stuff, we were way too busy
>trying to get our goth membership card.
Here's an embaressing tale. In 1980-something I heard a band called
Pylon on John Peel. They were some sort of US college-band from Akron,
Ohio. I thought their music was great. Really punchy, rhythmic,
straight-between-the-eyes stuff. I used to listen religiously to
Peelie's show, just on the off-chance he'd play another Pylon track.
But I never went out & bought their album myself. Why? Because Pylon
were not a goth band. And, at the time, I was a blinkered little twerp
and, in some stupid way, I felt that I wasn't 'allowed' to buy stuff
that wasn't on the unwritten 'approved' list. I was, of course, being
a clueless fuckwit. I don't know when it finally dawned on me that
this attitude was crap, but eventually the penny dropped, and my
record collection has been a much more interesting place since. (I
finally got the Pylon album, 'Gyrate', about TEN YEARS later!)
And now, of course, I'm sometimes quite critical of people who insist
on a 'pure' or 'trad' approach to goth. But that's because I've been
there. And I was wrong!
>> The new musical influences are not taking over, but being
>>assimilated into the scene, which is making it richer, without killing
>>it.
S'right. Bring 'em on, I say! Bring 'em all on!
>> Maybe it's all just a matter of perspective; the scene is inevitably
>>going to change. Some people might think that this is a move towards
>>the death of the goth scene, because it is no longer what it was, but
>>surely that is assuming that it was ever a finished project.
Ha! Nice new analogy alert! Goth is like one of those DIY projects
which never *quite* gets finished. (And it *is* a DIY project...isn't
it?)
Or even.... Anyone know the story of the Winchester house in the USA?
The one where it was said that if it was ever finished, the
inhabitants would die? So, for years on end, the constuction work went
on...and on...and on... until, in the end, the house had become a
lunatic, sprawling, surreal, mutant-mansion....
And some people think the place is a hideous eyesore, overdue for
demolition. Some people think it's a piece of history which *must* be
preseved exactly as it was at this-or-that point in time. And some
people would like to see the process continue, with ever-more bizarre
mutations being added here, there, and everywhere....
That's goth, innit?
OK, I'll go now.... ;-)
--
Uncle Nemesis > Michael Johnson > un...@globalnet.co.uk
Nemesis Promotions - ever-more bizarre mutations added while-u-wait
http://www.nemesis.to
Andi Gordon
>
> so have they finished or not ?
Take a look at their website... it doesn't look good.
> ...it may signal the end of this era of
> goth music - because older bands such as ourselves ( 6 years and counting )
> and rosetta etc have had just about all they can stomach of the bitchiness
> and infighting of the uk goth scene.
I hope that doesn't mean Die Laughing will disappear too....
Reminds me of that 80's track that starts.....
"Where have all the good guys gone ???"
> you may not care, or feel that it will not effect
Of course they don't. That's why all of this shit is happening....
What people don't realise is that bands need something back for everything
they give to a scene.
We should praise our heroes, not destroy them....
Andi Gordon
> >>I'll take the drum machine. How much do you want for it?
>
> I thought it was an ADAT?
Given the fact that the only time I've met you you rammed pictures of mixing
desks down my throat, I'd have thought you'd have known the difference between
a multitrack recording device and a Drum Machine......
Though give your other comments on here, I don't really give a shit what you
think an ADAT is cos you'll soon find out when we all come round and shove it
so far up your arse you'll be shitting rosetta for the next 3 years....
Andi Gordon
I just can't resist (sorry)
> The 303 is a piece of crap (IMO). I reckon the Ravelution is much more
> amusing!
MC-303 = shite
TB-303 = classic
> You want a nice drum station,
Use a sampler instead....
> a bass station,
mmmm....
> Cubase Score VST,
NOT on the PC.
PC's are shite for music....
VST on the MAC, or OctaMED Soundstudio on the Amiga (yipee!)
> an AKAI S3000 sampler,
send all donations to:
D>vilution
dis.con.one
Southampton
> a nice hard disk recording set up,
yeeuucck, ptooie ptooie.
> a Korg Trinity,
V3 with a Z1 board...mmmmmm.
I have a Trinity, and it is very nice, but does not do any stompy noises...
> a Novation thingy (can't remember the name but it's great), and lots of
> cash to get it all with!!!!!!!!
Maybe a new thread is in order....
</music geek>
ahem.... back to the plot.