No DNS at Gradwell?

Jim Crowther

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Feb 6, 2017, 1:19:25 PM2/6/17

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I'm suddenly not getting any email nor able to view any of my <g> hosted
websites. I can FTP to the websites, but that's all. A DIG on the
sites suggest the DNS servers are now ns1.gradwellcloud.com,
ns2.gradwellcloud.com.

Have I been 'moved' to the cloud without any notice I wonder? The
sparse-on-detail communications I've had so far in the last few months
implied I would have to move my sites under my own steam. However, I'm
still in the process of working out how to move all my business away
from Gradwell.

Has anyone received a detailed explanation of the 'move' process from
<g>?

--
Jim Crowther

Molly Mockford

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Feb 6, 2017, 1:32:13 PM2/6/17

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At 10:19:08 on Mon, 6 Feb 2017, Jim Crowther
<Don't_bo...@blackhole.do-not-spam.me.uk> wrote in
<tS0JI9lc...@nospam.at.my.choice.of.UID.invalid>:

>I'm suddenly not getting any email nor able to view any of my <g>
>hosted websites. I can FTP to the websites, but that's all. A DIG on
>the sites suggest the DNS servers are now ns1.gradwellcloud.com,
>ns2.gradwellcloud.com.

Yes, Gradwell somehow managed to change the nameservers on all my
domains (which were with 123Reg) unilaterally some time ago. I was
livid, but never got an explanation.

However, my web sites (those that remain with Gradwell, which is only
those I haven't been able to move yet) are available. The web sites are
on the cloud, but the mailboxes remain on legacy; and those are still
working too. (More or less; mail to one of them bounced, but now works
again - no explanation.)

>Have I been 'moved' to the cloud without any notice I wonder? The
>sparse-on-detail communications I've had so far in the last few months
>implied I would have to move my sites under my own steam. However, I'm
>still in the process of working out how to move all my business away
>from Gradwell.
>
>Has anyone received a detailed explanation of the 'move' process from
><g>?

No. Nor a detailed explanation of the invoices they raise!
--
Molly Mockford
Nature loves variety. Unfortunately, society hates it. (Milton Diamond Ph.D.)
(My Reply-To address *is* valid, though may not remain so for ever.)

Jim Crowther

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Feb 6, 2017, 5:13:24 PM2/6/17

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In uk.net.providers.gradwell, on Mon, 6 Feb 2017 18:29:39, Molly

Mockford wrote:

>At 10:19:08 on Mon, 6 Feb 2017, Jim Crowther
><Don't_bo...@blackhole.do-not-spam.me.uk> wrote in
><tS0JI9lc...@nospam.at.my.choice.of.UID.invalid>:
>
>>I'm suddenly not getting any email nor able to view any of my <g>
>>hosted websites. I can FTP to the websites, but that's all. A DIG on
>>the sites suggest the DNS servers are now ns1.gradwellcloud.com,
>>ns2.gradwellcloud.com.
>
>Yes, Gradwell somehow managed to change the nameservers on all my
>domains (which were with 123Reg) unilaterally some time ago. I was
>livid, but never got an explanation.
>
>However, my web sites (those that remain with Gradwell, which is only
>those I haven't been able to move yet) are available. The web sites
>are on the cloud, but the mailboxes remain on legacy; and those are
>still working too. (More or less; mail to one of them bounced, but
>now works again - no explanation.)
>
>>Have I been 'moved' to the cloud without any notice I wonder? The
>>sparse-on-detail communications I've had so far in the last few months
>>implied I would have to move my sites under my own steam. However,
>>I'm still in the process of working out how to move all my business
>>away from Gradwell.
>>
>>Has anyone received a detailed explanation of the 'move' process from
>><g>?
>
>No. Nor a detailed explanation of the invoices they raise!

After an 11 minute hold, I got through to the last person left at
Gradwell for the evening. A very pleasant chap - it appeared that
despite my having put a DD in place, and according to my bank statements
all payments had been made, the wonderful system at Gradwell thought I
had paid fuck nothing and someone (or the system all by itself?) had
disabled all my domains. No email, no websites, nada.

We decided that it was necessary to make the system *know* I'd paid -
and I agreed to pay the 'debt' by CC on the understanding that when all
was ironed out I'd get a credit. I was advised that paying by a UK card
while I was physically in California would likely get prevented by their
wonderful Worldpay system - so I tried paying with a US card. Nope, no
joy. So I was told to download and run Teamviewer so I could input my
UK CC details via his computer in Bath - with him looking the other way,
natch. Haha - another gotcha - as this was unrecognised as one of my
machines the Visa check insisted it had to phone me on my UK mobile with
a passphrase. Luckily my UK phone has an A&A sip2sim card in it - so I
switched it on, got the call, got the passphrase.

Great, the payment went through! However, three hours later the domains
are still unavailable. No email, no websites...

So I tried a number I had found for their 'OMG' out of hours support.
Got straight through - the chap is looking into it and will phone me
back on my US number. Hopefully...

What a bloody palaver - still ongoing!

Grrr...

--
Jim Crowther

Jim Crowther

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Feb 6, 2017, 6:07:44 PM2/6/17

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In uk.net.providers.gradwell, on Mon, 6 Feb 2017 14:13:08, Jim Crowther
wrote:

>What a bloody palaver - still ongoing!

And I've just heard back that all is up and running again for my
domains. Apparently this has shown up considerable underlying problems
with their billing system - something to do with 'obsolete' log-ins from
<g> start-up time way back when. I suppose they didn't know they still
had such customers...

--
Jim Crowther

Chris S

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Feb 6, 2017, 6:40:32 PM2/6/17

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The writing is not only on the wall; the wall has all the indications
of being just about to collapse.

My Gradwell account was closed on the 7th December, I quote:

> xxxxxxxx (Gradwell Customer Services)
>
> 7 Dec, 14:59 GMT
>
> Hi Chris,
>
> My sincerest apologies in relation to the way that your account has been managed.
>
> As per your email below I have looked over your account and can see that all subscriptions are cancelled on your account and there is nothing pointing to our system. Following looking over this I have completely closed down your Gradwell Cloud account for you.

Nevertheless, yesterday I received a 2.64 GBP Gradwell invoice for "22
GB-Days in excess of disk quota for 4/1/2017 to 3/2/2017".

It's one of three similar disputed invoices, the others for November
and December 2016. I queried the November invoice and a credit note
was raised but botched in some way that I didn't understand. They know
this but I still recieved a payment request reminder for that invoice
yesterday. I paid the December one under protest in the forlorn hope
that it would help end the matter.

I replied by email to both and their system raised tickets for both
emails. Out of curiosity I tried one of the ticket links and the
response was:

System Error

Sorry, the system has encountered an error: Cannot access 'voip'
database MySQL server has gone away.

Full details have been sent to our development team.

End quote.

!

Chris S

cla...@gmail.com

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Feb 6, 2017, 8:20:06 PM2/6/17

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On Monday, 6 February 2017 22:13:24 UTC, Jim Crowther wrote:

> joy. So I was told to download and run Teamviewer so I could input my
> UK CC details via his computer in Bath - with him looking the other way,

Be careful, as I think that puts you at risk of being told to sod off by your card provider and take a hit in the event of any subsequent fraud. And, while the chap at Gradwell was trying to help, that's not the right way to do it and I expect breaches some regulations in respect of card-handling merchants.

You know what this looks like? I've seen this many times and it fits. A legacy home-grown system which was never designed to scale, which has been forced to scale and become increasingly unmanageable, but just about manageable as long as you know all the tricks to keeping it running, then replaced in parts by off the shelf solutions, with various technical and operational processes in place to glue everything together and get to a point where it works as long as you know what you're doing and how to maintain the glue.

The result is a reactive company which is a slave to its operations, as opposed to a company which is in charge of its operations. Gradwell couldn't fix your account because the financial bit, which glues into the service availability bit, was saying no. Rather than override it and simply enable service, you were forced to play the game and make the payment part authorise your service. You shouldn't have to do that; it's not your concern.

Gradwell evidently can't manage its own operations, and customers are picking up 100% of the risk on a platform they have absolutely no stake in. That alone, even without the demoralising service problems, would make me urge anyone to run as fast as you can to another provider.

Chris

Jim Crowther

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Feb 6, 2017, 9:38:54 PM2/6/17

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In uk.net.providers.gradwell, on Mon, 6 Feb 2017 17:20:06, Chris wrote:

>Gradwell evidently can't manage its own operations, and customers are
>picking up 100% of the risk on a platform they have absolutely no stake
>in. That alone, even without the demoralising service problems, would
>make me urge anyone to run as fast as you can to another provider.

I'll be making the move as soon as I can, no worries there!

--
Jim Crowther

Jim Crowther

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Feb 6, 2017, 10:43:38 PM2/6/17

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In uk.net.providers.gradwell, on Mon, 6 Feb 2017 23:40:29, Chris S
wrote:

>The writing is not only on the wall; the wall has all the indications
>of being just about to collapse.

In response to an email from 'zendesk' saying 'service has been
restored' I wrote:

-------------
Firstly, thank-you for sorting this out. I do not understand what an
'expired subscription' might mean though, and why that has prevented
your system from recognising all the (micro!)payments that have been
made via DD over the last months.

I would appreciate it if I could have someone your end go through the
myriad of invoices and payments (I can provide bank statements to prove
I've paid everything requested in the past) and refund me the extra I
have now paid by CC.

I would also very much appreciate it if I could get just ONE monthly
invoice and ONE monthly direct debit - the invoice to have an included
pdf of the payments requested.

50-60-odd emails per month is VERY IRRITATING. As are the multiple
GRADWELL payments on my bank statements - they make up by far the
majority of entries. :(

I would also request that my ability to set the IPSTAG on the domains I
have hosted with you is restored. I'm sure you can understand why.

------------

--
Jim Crowther

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Feb 13, 2017, 1:25:35 PM2/13/17

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In message <qMDNRgAH...@davidlawson.co.uk>, news
<ne...@davidlawson.co.uk> writes

I understand that it works, but I went the Stunnel route myself. If you
need any detailed advice, then I suggest asking on the
demon.ip.support.turnpike newsgroup.

cla...@gmail.com

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Feb 18, 2017, 4:24:28 AM2/18/17

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On Monday, 13 February 2017 07:30:55 UTC, Molly Mockford wrote:

> I've just moved to TsoHost. I've opted for the cPanel hosting, having
> become somewhat Cloud-averse after my Gradwell experience! Either one,

It's good you've moved but a shame you're not on their what they call their cloud platform, as it's much cleaner and more logical than the old nested domain cPanel setup. Don't let gradwell's piss-poor implentation of a cloud model tarnish your view of the same model offered by other companies.

Chris

Molly Mockford

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Feb 18, 2017, 7:06:14 AM2/18/17

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At 01:24:28 on Sat, 18 Feb 2017, cla...@gmail.com wrote in
<24fbb225-b70e-47d8...@googlegroups.com>:

Unfortunately, it seems to be a default of Cloud platforms that they
don't offer catch-all e-mail on a per-domain basis, only on a
per-account basis. Since I host web sites for several other people, I
certainly don't want their mis-addressed mail all forwarded to me - it
would be a horrendous infringement of confidentiality. When I explained
to TsoHost that it was Gradwell's inability to provide this on their
Cloud which had impelled me to leave, they recommended their CPanel
hosting rather than their Cloud. The price is the same, and either
would be a learning curve for me, so I went with their recommendation.

Chris S

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Feb 18, 2017, 1:04:53 PM2/18/17

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On Sat, 18 Feb 2017 12:00:51 +0000, Molly Mockford
<nospam...@mollymockford.me.uk> wrote:

>At 01:24:28 on Sat, 18 Feb 2017, cla...@gmail.com wrote in
><24fbb225-b70e-47d8...@googlegroups.com>:
>
>>On Monday, 13 February 2017 07:30:55 UTC, Molly Mockford wrote:
>>
>>> I've just moved to TsoHost. I've opted for the cPanel hosting, having
>>> become somewhat Cloud-averse after my Gradwell experience! Either one,
>>
>>It's good you've moved but a shame you're not on their what they call
>>their cloud platform, as it's much cleaner and more logical than the
>>old nested domain cPanel setup. Don't let gradwell's piss-poor
>>implentation of a cloud model tarnish your view of the same model
>>offered by other companies.
>
>Unfortunately, it seems to be a default of Cloud platforms that they
>don't offer catch-all e-mail on a per-domain basis, only on a
>per-account basis.

Err... I don't think so unless I am having a senior moment that has
lasted several years! ;-). I have half a dozen or so domains within a
Tsohost cloud account and each has it's own 'catch-all' variant. No
mail for domain "A" ends up in a domain "B" mailbox unless
specifically routed to do so.

>Since I host web sites for several other people, I
>certainly don't want their mis-addressed mail all forwarded to me - it
>would be a horrendous infringement of confidentiality. When I explained
>to TsoHost that it was Gradwell's inability to provide this on their
>Cloud which had impelled me to leave, they recommended their CPanel
>hosting rather than their Cloud. The price is the same, and either
>would be a learning curve for me, so I went with their recommendation.

It's plausible that Tsohost interpreted "host web sites for several
other people" to mean giving those people control over their sites and
that may , and I write *may* as it is just a guess, need to be cpanel
based.

There is at least one other limitation with the Cloud hosting option
because, or so I was given to understand, the mail system is shared
across the cloud, and that is outgoing mail is spam filtered. I forget
what the SpamAssassin threshold is but it is not configurable. As far
as I recall, I have only once come across this limitation in practice
when forwarding a 'false positive' mail item. I don't think it's a
technical limitation, rather just trying to reduce the risk of the
shared mailservers being blacklisted.

Chris S

Molly Mockford

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Feb 18, 2017, 1:23:53 PM2/18/17

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At 18:04:50 on Sat, 18 Feb 2017, Chris S <ugje...@sneakemail.com>
wrote in <s11hac10vr3m19hmf...@4ax.com>:

>On Sat, 18 Feb 2017 12:00:51 +0000, Molly Mockford
><nospam...@mollymockford.me.uk> wrote:
>
>>Unfortunately, it seems to be a default of Cloud platforms that they
>>don't offer catch-all e-mail on a per-domain basis, only on a
>>per-account basis.
>
>Err... I don't think so unless I am having a senior moment that has
>lasted several years! ;-). I have half a dozen or so domains within a
>Tsohost cloud account and each has it's own 'catch-all' variant. No
>mail for domain "A" ends up in a domain "B" mailbox unless
>specifically routed to do so.

Ah well, I guess the sales person I spoke to got it wrong. Or maybe I
misunderstood them. Never mind - it's all set up on cPanel now, and
working just as I want it.

>There is at least one other limitation with the Cloud hosting option
>because, or so I was given to understand, the mail system is shared
>across the cloud, and that is outgoing mail is spam filtered. I forget
>what the SpamAssassin threshold is but it is not configurable. As far
>as I recall, I have only once come across this limitation in practice
>when forwarding a 'false positive' mail item. I don't think it's a
>technical limitation, rather just trying to reduce the risk of the
>shared mailservers being blacklisted.

Ah, I didn't know that. I've now very glad I didn't go for Cloud! That
would be an absolute game-killer for me. I don't like anything,
anywhere, interfering with my e-mail, inwards or outwards. I recently
realised that 123Reg had implemented spam filtering on all forwarded
mail (not just their POP3 mailboxes, but mail forwarded elsewhere) for
all domains held there, turned on by default, without any notification,
and I was livid. Every single e-mail I received which had had
****SPAM**** added to its Subject line was a false positive, and it was
not easy to find out where to turn the blasted thing off (and that's
after figuring out where it was happening, and identifying 123Reg as the
culprit). Me, I deal with my own spam and virus filtering when mail
arrives, and I deeply resent anybody else trying to mess around with it
en route, especially without my knowledge and permission.