Welsh Folk Songs
Ted Arrowsmith
contains a Welsh folk song called, "Hela'r Dryw", which apparently means
"Hunting the Wren". Can anybody give me the lyrics, and if possible, a
translation? Also, does anybody know any albums/artists with more Welsh folk
music. Thanks.
Eddie <arr...@mersinet.co.uk>
Andy Jackson
Ted Arrowsmith wrote in message <90926772...@muffin.mersinet.co.uk>...
Johnny Adams
And here's tellin'.
Try looking at the Sain catalogue, which includes Siwsann George and the group
Mabsant, amongst several others worthy of attention.
Sain Records
Canolfan Sain
Llandwroc
Gwynedd
LL54 5TG
01286 831111 (tel)
01286 831497 (fax)
Johnny Adams - j.a...@media-perf.salford.ac.uk
Academic Home Page on http://www.salford.ac.uk/media/staff/jma.htm
Folk Pages on http://www.salford.ac.uk/media/staff/jmahome/r3step.htm
Research on http://www.salford.ac.uk/media/research/vmpaims.htm
Sailing pages on http://www.salford.ac.uk/media/staff/jmahome/dca_home.htm
Mr. M.J. Tems
Pembrokeshire. The idea is very similar to the Cutty Wren, which was used in
the mid-winter wren customs of English-speaking South Pembrokeshire. If you
visit the Museum of Welsh Life at St Fagans, Cardiff, you can see a
Pembrokeshire wren-house.
I remember the song being recorded on a vinyl album by Cromlech on the Sain
label in the early 1980s. Somewhere in my mountain of files and notes (which
are slowly being put together as an archive of South Wales traditional arts
material by our organisation Celfyddydau Mari Arts at our HQ in the Model
House Craft and Design Centre, The Bullring, Llantrisant CF72 8EB, tel 01443
237758) I have the words and the tune and, as soon as I can, I'll dig them
out and provide a translation. If you don't hear soon, give me a reminder.
Mick Tems, Calennig.
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John Firth
from Mr. M.J. Tems <mari...@argonet.co.uk> contains these words:
> The song Hela'r Dryw (Hunting The Wren) comes from Welsh-speaking North
> Pembrokeshire. The idea is very similar to the Cutty Wren, which was used in
> the mid-winter wren customs of English-speaking South Pembrokeshire. If you
> visit the Museum of Welsh Life at St Fagans, Cardiff, you can see a
> Pembrokeshire wren-house.
I believe that it was a Christmas tradition in Pembrokeshire that
children took a wren from door to door on twelth night with the
question 'Please to see the King' and were given a few coins.
Steeleye Span's second album was called 'Please to see the King'
which gives details of this.
John Firth
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Jack Bramah
>Lumee there's askin'. Watch this space !!!!!!
>Ted Arrowsmith wrote in message <90926772...@muffin.mersinet.co.uk>...
>>Can anyone help me? I have recently been given a copy of an album which
>>contains a Welsh folk song called, "Hela'r Dryw", which apparently means
>>"Hunting the Wren". Can anybody give me the lyrics, and if possible, a
>>translation? Also, does anybody know any albums/artists with more Welsh
>folk
>>music. Thanks.
>>
>>Eddie <arr...@mersinet.co.uk>
>>
Gorau Gwerin - The Best of Welsh Folk Music (Various Artists)
22 Tracks - Label: Sain (the main Welsh folk label) SCD 2006
Harp Music of Wales - Robin Huw Bowen
14 tracks - Label: Saydisc CD-SDL 412
Traditional Songs of Wales - Siwsann George
22 Tracks - Label: Saydisc CD-SDL 406
Stryd America - 4 yn y Bar
16 Tracks - Label: Fflach CD111H
On vinyl I also have stuff by Aberjaber, yr Hwntws, Mynediad Am Ddim, Ar
Log, Calennig
--
Jack Bramah <ja...@catland.demon.co.uk>
Ser galego é máis ca nacer en Galicia
George Hawes
>The message <na.dd8b01489a....@argonet.co.uk>
> from Mr. M.J. Tems <mari...@argonet.co.uk> contains these words:
>> The song Hela'r Dryw (Hunting The Wren) comes from Welsh-speaking North
>> Pembrokeshire.
>I believe that it was a Christmas tradition in Pembrokeshire that
>children took a wren from door to door on twelth night
Of course (and to debase this thread) Les Barker has his own
"Hunting the Wren" 'tradition' enshrined in one of his ditties .
.
G.
Sian Thomas
George Hawes wrote in message <71k3k2$smp$5...@shiny.i-cubed.co.uk>...
The Hunting of the King Wren was really interesting ... and not confined to
Pembrokeshire. There are Wren Hunting songs from various parts of Wales -
the Carmarthenshire area around Kidwelly is one, I think. And there are
wren biers from various places in the Museum of Welsh Folk Life.
Interestingly, some of the motifs are also carried through to wassail bowls.
BTW, it wasn't children who went door to door, but grown men. As in the
Mari Llwyd tradition. Children collected *calennig* (hel c'lennig) and had
standard verses to recite (and I think there are some songs as well...)
--
Sian Thomas
http://www.telecottages.org/iws
Y gerdd orau, cerdd at dy waith
ICQ #11650729
remove twp to reply - dileu twp i ateb
Julian Flood
> The Hunting of the King Wren
The wren, the wren, the king of the birds... It's in the Clancy Brothers'
Song Book - I'd give you more but I've lent it to someone and forgotten who.
Please To See The King?
--
Julian Flood
jul...@argonet.co.uk
Life: much too important to be taken seriously.
Mick Tems
<jul...@argonet.co.uk> wrote:
>
> "Sian Thomas" wrote:
> > The Hunting of the King Wren
>
> The wren, the wren, the king of the birds... It's in the Clancy Brothers'
> Song Book - I'd give you more but I've lent it to someone and forgotten
> who.
> Please To See The King?
>
posted a day or two ago. What's your e-mail?
You were quite correct in saying that the Wren custom was carried out by
adults. In fact, the strongest men of the community would be given the task
of carrying the wren house, struggling as though the tiny bird was
enormously heavy.
I have the following songs: Hela'r Dryw; The Cutty Wren (Tenby version); and
The King (19th century version from Pembrokeshire which is very close in
text to the one collected in Marloes this century, which Martin Carthy gave
to Steeleye Span for their Please To See The King album.
You may also be interested in my posting about the Mumbles horse's head
custom. Please spread the word to anyone who may be interested.
--
Mick Tems and Pat Smith (Calennig, Clwb Gwerin Llantrisant Folk Club,
Celfyddydau Mari Arts) e-mail: mari...@argonet.co.uk
website: http://www.argonet.co.uk/users/mari.arts
1 Ty Clwyta Cottages, Cross Inn, Llantrisant CF72 8EB Tel/fax 01443 226892
Kevin Sheils
>
> "Sian Thomas" wrote:
> > The Hunting of the King Wren
>
> The wren, the wren, the king of the birds... It's in the Clancy Brothers'
> Song Book - I'd give you more but I've lent it to someone and forgotten who.
> Please To See The King?
>
I guess the Clancy's Song Book would have been an Irish version. I don't
know their words but my mother (Irish) sang (or rather recited)
The wren, the wren, the king of all birds (wren pronounced ran)
St Stephens's Day he was caught in the furze
Although he is little his honour is great
So rise up master and give us a treat (pronounced trate)
A penny or tuppence, whatever you can
Please give us something to bury the wren.
--
Kevin Sheils
http://www.mrscasey.co.uk/ For Sidmouth/Towersey Festivals etc
http://www.btinternet.com/~haleend For Waltham Forest Folk Events
George Hawes
<re: "Hunting the Wren" and Sian Thomas's comments thereon">
>>
>You were quite correct in saying that the Wren custom was carried out by
>adults. In fact, the strongest men of the community would be given the task
>of carrying the wren house, struggling as though the tiny bird was
>enormously heavy.
ISTR seeing some old film footage of a similar custom in
Ireland, in a fairly recent TV broadcast . . . or am I dreaming
again?
G
yrhyddg...@gmail.com
> Can anyone help me? I have recently been given a copy of an album which
> contains a Welsh folk song called, "Hela'r Dryw", which apparently means
> "Hunting the Wren". Can anybody give me the lyrics, and if possible, a
> translation? Also, does anybody know any albums/artists with more Welsh folk
> music. Thanks.
>
> Eddie <arr...@mersinet.co.uk>
Ble rwy't ti'n mynd? medde Dibyn wrth Dobyn
Ble rwy't ti'n mynd? medde Rhisiart wrth Robin
Ble rwy't ti'n mynd? medde John
Ble rwy't ti'n mynd? medde everyone
Mynd tua'r coed medde Dibyn wrth Dobyn
Be' wnei di yno? medde Dibyn wrth Dobyn
Hela'r dryw bach medde Dibyn wrth Dobyn
translation:
Where are you going? said Dibyn to Dobyn
Where are you going? said Rhisiart to Robin
Where are you going? said John
Where are you going? said everyone
Going to the woods said Dibyn to Dobyn
What will you do there? said Dibyn to Dobyn
Hunt the little wren said Dibyn to Dobyn
Colin Irvine
wrote:
Actually, this reminds me of a song that used to be popular in English
folk clubs, but I can't bring it to mind.
Colin Irvine
--
Molly Mockford
wrote in <kvirrah33sp1s7eb4...@4ax.com>:
>Actually, this reminds me of a song that used to be popular in English
>folk clubs, but I can't bring it to mind.
>Colin Irvine
"That valley is fatal when furnaces burn,
Yonder's the midden whose odors will madden,
That gap is the grave where the tall return."
"O do you imagine," said fearer to farer,
"That dusk will delay on your path to the pass,
Your diligent looking discover the lacking
Your footsteps feel from granite to grass?"
"O what was that bird," said horror to hearer,
"Did you see that shape in the twisted trees?
Behind you swiftly the figure comes softly,
The spot on your skin is a shocking disease?"
"Out of this house"‚ said rider to reader,
"Yours never will"‚ said farer to fearer,
"They're looking for you" ‚ said hearer to horror,
As he left them there, as he left them there.
WH Auden
--
Molly Mockford
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Regards
Nigel Stapley
www.thejudge.me.uk
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Richard Robinson
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"The whole plan hinged upon the natural curiosity of potatoes" - S. Lem
My email address is at http://www.qualmograph.org.uk/contact.html
Colin Irvine
<nospam...@mollymockford.me.uk> wrote:
>At 08:52:20 on Sun, 2 Aug 2015, Colin Irvine <lo...@colinandpat.co.uk>
>wrote in <kvirrah33sp1s7eb4...@4ax.com>:
>
>>Actually, this reminds me of a song that used to be popular in English
>>folk clubs, but I can't bring it to mind.
>>Colin Irvine
>
>"O where are you going?" said reader to rider,
>"That valley is fatal when furnaces burn,
>Yonder's the midden whose odors will madden,
>That gap is the grave where the tall return."
>
>"O do you imagine," said fearer to farer,
>"That dusk will delay on your path to the pass,
>Your diligent looking discover the lacking
>Your footsteps feel from granite to grass?"
>
>"O what was that bird," said horror to hearer,
>"Did you see that shape in the twisted trees?
>Behind you swiftly the figure comes softly,
>The spot on your skin is a shocking disease?"
>
>"Out of this house"‚ said rider to reader,
>"Yours never will"‚ said farer to fearer,
>"They're looking for you" ‚ said hearer to horror,
>As he left them there, as he left them there.
>
>WH Auden
--
Colin Irvine
Colin Irvine
the end of each verse.
--
Colin Irvine
Colin Irvine
From Nigel Parsons on mudcat -
One more version, from "North Country Songs" by "Gwen & Mary
Polwarth", and listed as "collected from Jack Elliott of Birtley"
1. O where are we gannin says Billy to Bob?
O where are we gannin says Billy to Bob?
O where are we gannln says Jack me lad?
O where are we gannin says everyone?
2. We'll gan a shootin' says Billy to Bob, etc.
3. O what'll we shoot says Billy to Bob? etc.
4. We'll shoot a cock sparrer says Billy to Bob, etc.
5. O what'll we dee with it says Billy to Bob? etc.
6. We'll sell it for a tanner says Billy to Bob, etc.
7. O what'll we buy says Billy to Bob? etc.
8. We'll buy a pot of whisky says Billy to Bob, etc.
9. Now what if we get drunk says Billy to Bob? etc.
10. Why how will we get hyem says Billy to Bob? etc.
11. We'll ride in a train says Billy to Bob, etc.
12, Why how will we pay him says Billy to Bob? etc.
13, We'll pay him with a poker, says Billy to Bob,
--
Colin Irvine
Java Jive
> <rich...@privacy.net> wrote:
>
> >Nigel Stapley said:
> >
> >> On 02/08/2015 08:52, Colin Irvine wrote:
> >>
That's the most likely one. Robin Dransfield did a good version of
that on "Tidewave", with Christian Gourhan playing hurdy-gurdy making
it sound suitably freakish. I've appended the lyrics below.
> >I've heard "Said Milder to Molder".
> Close, but the one I think I can remember has "xxxx says everyone" at
> the end of each verse.
Most of the versions that a simple search found online seem to be
rather pared down compared with most of the versions I've actually
heard sung - everyone copying Steeleye Span's lyrics instead of
doing proper and diligent research, perhaps?
But Mudcat, though a pain to use and search, is usually good on things
like this:
site:mudcat.org lyrics:"The Cutty Wren"
... finds amongst other things this extended discussion with several
versions, including, ahem, Les Barker's ...
http://mudcat.org/thread.cfm?threadid=47959
There's also ...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cutty_Wren
However none of these are quite like the versions I've heard, as
epitomised by Robin Dransfield's, so, as my music books are all in
boxes, here, as best as I can transcribe them hearing them through
monitor speakers, are the lyrics he sings ...
"Oh where are going?" says Milder to Molder (mother?)
"I cannot tell you!" says Jack In The Can (?)
"We're going to the woods!" says John The Red Nose
"We're going to the woods!" says John (???)
"And what will you do there?" says Milder to Molder
"I cannot tell you!" says Jack In The Can
"We'll hunt for the wren!" says John The Red Nose
"We'll hunt for the cutty wren!" says John ...
"And how will you shoot her?" says Milder to Molder
"With bows and with arrows!" says Jack In The Can
"With shot and with powder!" says John The Red Nose
"With big guns and big arrows(?)!" cries everyone.
"And how will you carry her?" says Milder to Molder
"On four strong men's shoulders!" says Jack In The Can
"In carts and in wagons!" says John The Red Nose
"And we'll all heave together!" cries everyone.
"And what will you cut her up with?" says Milder to Molder
"Oh I do not know that!" says Jack In The Can
"With forks and with knives!" says John The Red Nose
"With big hatchets and cleavers!" cries everyone.
"And how will you cook her?" says Milder to Molder
"Oh I cannot tell you!" says Jack In The Can
"In pans and in kettles!" says John The Red Nose
"In cups(?) and brass cauldrons!" cries everyone.
"And who then shall eat her?" says Milder to Molder
"We'll invite all the village!" says Jack In The Can
"And who'll eat the spirits(?)!" says John The Red Nose
"Ah we'll give 'em to the poor!" cries everyone.
--
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