Car damaged by garage during service
naffer
replacing glow-plugs.
Garage says,
"One of the glow-plugs sheered off when we were removing it. You can
probably manage on the other three or would you like us to take the
head off the engine to effect a repair. The engine job will cost
about £600".
Is it likely that I can insist that the garage does to repair at its
expense? What would my rights be?
Naffer.
Adrian
were saying:
Only if you can prove that they sheared the plug through negligence,
which is extremely unlikely.
What age is the car, what mileage, and have the glow plugs ever been
replaced before?
They can and do corrode and seize in place, possibly exacerbated by poor
workmanship on replacement last time. It can be effectively impossible to
remove them in situ if particularly bad.
Mrcheerful
Glow plugs can just shear off when being removed, it is just one of those
things, they are done up tightly and rust into place over several years.
To make a successful claim you would have to show that the garage were
negligent in some way, which would be quite difficult or impossible.
Depending on the vehicle it may be possible to get the plug out without
taking the head off, so it may be worth getting a second opinion. Some
modern diesels only use the glow plugs at temps below -5 degrees in any
case. If it starts ok then just use it as is.
Niel J Humphreys
news:tRi3n.25457$Ym4....@text.news.virginmedia.com...
> naffer wrote:
>> The car was put in for regular service. The service included
>> replacing glow-plugs.
>> Garage says,
>> "One of the glow-plugs sheered off when we were removing it. You can
>> probably manage on the other three or would you like us to take the
>> head off the engine to effect a repair. The engine job will cost
>> about �600".
>>
>> Is it likely that I can insist that the garage does to repair at its
>> expense? What would my rights be?
>>
>> Naffer.
>
> Glow plugs can just shear off when being removed, it is just one of those
> things, they are done up tightly and rust into place over several years.
> To make a successful claim you would have to show that the garage were
> negligent in some way, which would be quite difficult or impossible.
> Depending on the vehicle it may be possible to get the plug out without
> taking the head off, so it may be worth getting a second opinion.
Definitely. It should definitely be possible to remove the plug without
removing the head. I'd suggest going to another garage who do not necesarily
only go by the book and have a mechanic who is willing to apply a little
common sense.
--
Richard
No it shouldnt..............how many badly seized glow plugs have to
removed successfully, and how did you do the work?
martin
Out of interest (I don't know the answer) could you carefully drill out
the plug not going all the through and use a stud extractor? I know it
would be a horrible cleanup job if you cocked up and actually did go
through the plug.
Alasdair
>Only if you can prove that they sheared the plug through negligence,
>which is extremely unlikely.
>
>What age is the car, what mileage, and have the glow plugs ever been
>replaced before?
>
>They can and do corrode and seize in place, possibly exacerbated by poor
>workmanship on replacement last time. It can be effectively impossible to
>remove them in situ if particularly bad.
I should have thought the garage owed a duty to the customer to warn
him of the possibility of the glow plugs seizing up during removal. My
garage normally warns me of the possibility of the cam belt breaking
under stress when undergoing its MOT test.
I've often wondered if one can insure against such risks.
--
Alasdair.
Jethro
>
> - Show quoted text -
The risk of swarf getting into the cylinder and scoring the wall, or
damaging a valve seat are too great. If I were doing the job, I would
*quote* for the full-on "proper" way (i.e. head removal), but then
have a go drilling out ...
you *might* get some joy with a stud extracter *if* you can heat the
surrounding metal. But you'd need an oxy-acetylene torch.
The biggest problem will be physical access. you might only have a
couple of cm clear ....
steve robinson
Depends where its sheared and what other bits of engine and
ancilleries are in the way
Mrcheerful
here is the absolute business in removing a broken glow plug which is worse
than the average car as it is down a deep hole, well worth watching if you
have a real interest:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=koghDoROFko
Mrcheerful
Dave Baker
"martin" <use...@etiqa.co.uk> wrote in message
news:4b4dbd57$0$2524$da0f...@news.zen.co.uk...
>> No it shouldnt..............how many badly seized glow plugs have to
>> removed successfully, and how did you do the work?
>
> Out of interest (I don't know the answer) could you carefully drill out
> the plug not going all the through and use a stud extractor? I know it
> would be a horrible cleanup job if you cocked up and actually did go
> through the plug.
It never ceases to amaze me why people think that when a fitting is rusted
into place so tightly that a socket applied to the hex nut on it sheared the
whole thing in half before it budged that maybe a flimsy little brittle stud
extractor screwed into the remains might miraculously get it out. However I
suspect that's why engineers also see so many broken stud extractors stuck
in things that now need grinding out or spark eroding. There's nowt quite so
effective as amateur mechanics at keeping professional ones in business.
--
Dave Baker
steve robinson
Its always possible but generally not advisable , its often the case
that its quicker to take the head off
Adrian
were saying:
> I should have thought the garage owed a duty to the customer to warn him
> of the possibility of the glow plugs seizing up during removal.
There is _always_ a risk of corroded or seized fasteners, or of more work
being required than is initially apparent. Clearly, that risk increases
for older cars or ones that have previously been inadequately maintained.
> My garage normally warns me of the possibility of the cam belt breaking
> under stress when undergoing its MOT test.
As VOSA's regs require them to do for diesels.
> I've often wondered if one can insure against such risks.
I strongly suspect the premiums would be hilarious, especially on a car
that was anything other than almost new.
Richard
Yes its astonishing................in general the broken off stud
extractor is likely to make the job of removal doubly difficult, and
certainly add a great deal to the costs!
Mrcheerful
there is always the possibility that parts may break during removal, it is
inherent in the job. There can also be previous damage which cannot be
foreseen. eg: someone has stripped a sump bolt thread and managed to get it
to seal with some silicone, when undone by the garage they won't put it back
without a proper repair, which the garage are not liable for.
Warning you about the cambelt before MoT is a requirement of VOSA, in the
early days of testing diesel emissions there were several engines wrecked,
mainly because the belt was overdue and because some governors had been
modified or were broken or there was little oil in. So they introduced some
checks: oil level for instance, and a warning (which should be on the wall)
to the customer about the need for servicing and cambelt changes .
Years ago someone I was not familiar with rang up and asked for an
oilchange, he was very specific about how much it would be beforehand and
supplied the oil and filter. I had quoted 10 pounds IIRC for labour, when
the vehicle came in I dropped the oil and filter and did up the drain plug
all ok, but when I came to put the oil in I discovered why the car had come
in and why he wanted an exact price in advance: the oil filler tube was
completely stuffed with old hard mayonaise and no oil would go down the tube
at all (this was an old renault or peugeot) as cleaning out the system was
a pain and a long job I filled the oil through an alternate route. When the
customer came for the car he asked how I had got the oil in !! So he knew
the problem in advance and was hoping to get me to do the clean out for
nothing!! So I am always a bit suspicious when someone starts on about
garages' liability to fix things like stripped bolts etc. as I know that
some are just a set up to get someone else to fix something that the owner
has damaged.
ZZ
news:6c437630-4b99-402b...@m3g2000yqf.googlegroups.com...
>The car was put in for regular service. The service included
>replacing glow-plugs.
>Garage says,
> "One of the glow-plugs sheered off when we were removing it. You can
>probably manage on the other three or would you like us to take the
>head off the engine to effect a repair. The engine job will cost
>about �600".
If you can afford to I'd let them bodge it and leave it on the 3 then either
part exchange the car or bung it in the next car auction.
Richard
That piece of kit is likely to have cost more than a new engine, and
simply wont work on any engines with restricted access anyway, and as
most modern engines have restricted access the only people who might
have that equipment are possibly specialists dealing with only a few
specific engines..............
martin
> Adrian wrote:
>> They can and do corrode and seize in place, possibly exacerbated by
>> poor workmanship on replacement last time. It can be effectively
>> impossible to remove them in situ if particularly bad.
>
> watch the video here of a proper job in situ:
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=koghDoROFko
Oh wow! How would that take in real time Mr C?
>
>
Mrcheerful
That video is of the mercedes cdi engine which is well known for stuck glow
plugs, hence the purpose made kit. If access is good then about half an
hour per plug should be enough. But on some engines you need to remove the
injection pump before you can get access, so every vehicle is different.
The main point is that with the right equipment and skill, glow plugs can
often be sorted out without removing the head and taking it to an
engineering firm.
Djornsk
It would be tempting to try that , with the piston as close to TDC on
compression as clearance allowed, and then blowing out with an airline
and mopping up the piston surface with blue-tack on a stick or similar.
You'd probably end up having to drill and thread o/s and use an insert.
Ideally it would be good to have the reassurance of seeing inside the
cylinder with an endoscope afterwards.
Some might say that's risky, but so can be having major work done by a
garage to correct minor faults if the mechanic is having a bad day.
j
Dave Baker
Even as a perfeshunal enjinear it took a while to work out exactly what was
going on in that video. However having Googled to see what a complete glow
plug for one of those ought to look like I assume that the one in the engine
broke below the top thread leaving just the bottom part in situ and the
thread in the head still ok. The sequence then seemed to be drill, tap,
screw in impact puller, pull out broken remains, ream hole for new glowplug.
However if the old plug broke above the thread because it was rusted into
place it would be an entirely different problem. So do they normally break
below the thread or above it?
--
Dave Baker
steve robinson
It also means that on many vehicles its actually far more cost
effective to remove the head than strip away all the other ancillary
bits to gain access .
By removing the head you also know that your drilling operation isnt
going to bugger up anything else
Dave Baker
"steve robinson" <st...@colevalleyinteriors.co.uk> wrote in message
news:xn0gp3h3...@news.virginmedia.com...
>> That video is of the mercedes cdi engine which is well known for
>> stuck glow plugs, hence the purpose made kit. If access is good
>> then about half an hour per plug should be enough. But on some
>> engines you need to remove the injection pump before you can get
>> access, so every vehicle is different. The main point is that with
>> the right equipment and skill, glow plugs can often be sorted out
>> without removing the head and taking it to an engineering firm.
>
> It also means that on many vehicles its actually far more cost
> effective to remove the head than strip away all the other ancillary
> bits to gain access .
>
> By removing the head you also know that your drilling operation isnt
> going to bugger up anything else
Clearly not someone who knows anything about engines. Any ancilliary that
had to be removed to get access for an in situ repair would obviously also
need to be removed to get the head off, plus inlet manifolds, exhaust
manifolds, cam belt and much other stuff, then you've got many many hours of
head removal and refitting labour, new gaskets and head bolts, the chances
that a bad mechanic won't clean everything up properly or screw the cam
timing up when refitting and bend the valves. Compared to a 1/2 hour in situ
repair it's a no brainer. No one in their right mind would remove the head
on a modern FI or diesel engine if they didn't need to.
Different matter on an old A series Mini or a CVH or Pinto. Couple of hours
tops to get the head off those if you need to helicoil a spark plug or
summat.
--
Dave Baker
Mrcheerful
glow plugs can seize on their threads, or on the taper seat or just where
the hot bit pokes through
Mostly the hex is snapped off before the thread, often by amateurs using
manky spanners rather than a nice single hex socket and a T bar (which is
what I use and so far have not had one break, touches wood)
the design of the plug is such that the size reduces after the thread, so
accurate drilling can effectively release the thread on its own, the thread
is easily removed as a thin tube (as for standard broken bolt removal), then
removal of the rest of the plug is a pull out job after threading the inside
where the heating element goes.
I have taken out a few broken ones by welding a nut on the remainder and
turning that
steve robinson
Not so Dave in some cars and light commercials to get a drill in to
bore out the offending plug you will possibly need to remove
radiators , grills , air con , fans coolant pipes alternators , wiper
motors fuse units et al , some you wont even get a drill into to do
the job or you wont be in a position to judge the angle or depth .
When taking a head off whilst some components will need to be removed
others only require one or to fixings to be removed .
Its horses for courses , most garages dont have the machinery to
correctly remove and re seat rusted up plugs .
Most 'mechanics' now are fitters not mechanical engineers and wouldnt
be able to perform small engineering tasks .
How many garages actually rebuild/ re engineer engines now , i dont
know of any , the just parcel them off to a specialist
martin
> Most 'mechanics' now are fitters not mechanical engineers and wouldnt
> be able to perform small engineering tasks .
>
> How many garages actually rebuild/ re engineer engines now , i dont
> know of any , the just parcel them off to a specialist
Yes I agree with you there. I've rebuilt two engines totally (both top
and bottom ends) and had the blocks into a machine shop for rebore prior
to fitting oversized pistons/rings. The first took me a month because I
went very slowly, the second a week because I knew what I was doing.
Similarly for gearboxes, strip down, remove the broken parts, refurbish
and replace what's needed and rebuild.
Talking to modern car mechanics it's something they just don't do
anymore, whereas the old timers of my age it's more bread and butter.
Now it's drop the gearbox out, put in a refurb and ship old back to refurb.
Culex (The Infamous Culex)
> into place so tightly that a socket applied to the hex nut on it sheared the
> whole thing in half before it budged that maybe a flimsy little brittle stud
> extractor screwed into the remains might miraculously get it out. However I
> suspect that's why engineers also see so many broken stud extractors stuck
> in things that now need grinding out or spark eroding. There's nowt quite so
> effective as amateur mechanics at keeping professional ones in business.
Wouldn't you rather encourage them, perhaps even suggesting that they
should try using a hammer and cold chisel?
-- -
Culex -- the Infamous Culex
Culex (The Infamous Culex)
<st...@colevalleyinteriors.co.uk> wrote:
> its quicker to take the head off
And replace the grease-monkey's head with one from a trained mechanic?
Duncan Wood
Those are nearly always the ones that it's dead easy to get the drill in
though.
> Its horses for courses , most garages dont have the machinery to
> correctly remove and re seat rusted up plugs .
>
> Most 'mechanics' now are fitters not mechanical engineers and wouldnt
> be able to perform small engineering tasks .
>
> How many garages actually rebuild/ re engineer engines now , i dont
> know of any , the just parcel them off to a specialist
--
Duncan Wood
Cynic
<timbr...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>The car was put in for regular service. The service included
>replacing glow-plugs.
>Garage says,
> "One of the glow-plugs sheered off when we were removing it. You can
>probably manage on the other three or would you like us to take the
>head off the engine to effect a repair. The engine job will cost
>about �600".
>
>Is it likely that I can insist that the garage does to repair at its
>expense? What would my rights be?
IANAL.
ISTM (and this is only a non-expert opinion) that unless the garage
gave a fixed quotation (*not* merely an estimate) for carrying out the
work, the customer is liable to pay for all parts and labour entailed
in carrying out that work, even if the work involved turns out to be
more than was initially anticipated.
The garage should not however continue to undertake work that grossly
exceeds any estimate without first obtaining approval from the
customer - which they have done in this case.
If the garage caused damage *due to their negligence* whilst
undertaking the work, they would be liable to put right the damage
done at their own expense. If however the damage was caused
inadvertently during the course of doing work that was agreed, despite
the garage following accepted practise, I do not believe the garage is
legally responsible for making good the damage at their own expense.
So the actual position would hinge upon whether the garage should
reasonably have done anything differently in order to prevent the
damage to the glow plug.
There may *possibly* be a case to be made that the garage should have
warned the customer of the possibility of such damage prior to
obtaining permission to carry out the work, and failure to do so
renders the consent void - which in turn would depend upon how
foreseeable such damage might be.
As said, the above is merely an opinion from a non-lawyer, and is
worth what you paid for it!
--
Cynic
Cynic
Purely as an idle question from a rank amateur - when drilling out a
glowplug or spark plug without removing the head, how much risk is
there of getting metal bits into the cylinder that causes damage as
soon as the engine is started after the repair?
I well recall my father dropping a single small washer into the open
throat of a carburetter while the engine was running, and the mess it
made of a cylinder lining, piston and cylinder head.
I would have thought that a small bit of swarf that fell into the
cylinder may well be practically impossible to spot and even less easy
to remove.
--
Cynic
Jethro
Very high ...
even a speck, milligrams, could get stuck on the valve seat and lead
to it burning ... as another poster suggested, when carrying out this
procedure, it's a good idea to put the cylinder in question to TDC to
close the valves and shield the cylinder wall ... but the risk still
remains. Another trick is to smother the area in grease in the hope it
will catch any swarf, but you now what sods law is like ....
Ian Jackson
<7677da5c-121b-4d86...@34g2000yqp.googlegroups.com>,
Jethro <jeth...@hotmail.com> writes
Was that airline (used several times) a blower or a sucker? It didn't
seem like a sucker to me.
It would be wise to use a miniature inspection camera to check inside
the cylinder, to see if any swarf and other crud was lying inside.
Finally, I would flood the top of the cylinder with thin oil, disable
ignition (how, on a diesel?), put a rag over the open glowplug hole, and
crank the engine for a few seconds. That should get rid of any remaining
crud (via the valves or through the hole).
--
Ian
Cynic
<ianREMOVET...@g3ohx.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>>Very high ...
>>even a speck, milligrams, could get stuck on the valve seat and lead
>>to it burning ... as another poster suggested, when carrying out this
>>procedure, it's a good idea to put the cylinder in question to TDC to
>>close the valves and shield the cylinder wall ... but the risk still
>>remains. Another trick is to smother the area in grease in the hope it
>>will catch any swarf, but you now what sods law is like ....
>Was that airline (used several times) a blower or a sucker? It didn't
>seem like a sucker to me.
>It would be wise to use a miniature inspection camera to check inside
>the cylinder, to see if any swarf and other crud was lying inside.
>Finally, I would flood the top of the cylinder with thin oil, disable
>ignition (how, on a diesel?), put a rag over the open glowplug hole, and
>crank the engine for a few seconds. That should get rid of any remaining
>crud (via the valves or through the hole).
How much gap is there between a piston and the cylinder wall? ISTM
that if a small metal filing were to get into that gap and sit on the
top piston ring, it may well escape all the above methods, and become
dislodged only with the detonation of the first power stroke.
The question really I suppose is whether the risk is low enough to be
worth the saving (and risk) of removing the head. Head removal in the
only cars I have ever worked on was a quick and easy job, but a look
under the bonnet of a modern car suggests that it was designed by
someone who was a master at both jigsaw puzzles and tetris ...
--
Cynic
Ste
> On Wed, 13 Jan 2010 20:19:09 +0000, Ian Jackson
>
>
>
>
>
> <ianREMOVETHISjack...@g3ohx.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> >>Very high ...
> >>even a speck, milligrams, could get stuck on the valve seat and lead
> >>to it burning ... as another poster suggested, when carrying out this
> >>procedure, it's a good idea to put the cylinder in question to TDC to
> >>close the valves and shield the cylinder wall ... but the risk still
> >>remains. Another trick is to smother the area in grease in the hope it
> >>will catch any swarf, but you now what sods law is like ....
> >Was that airline (used several times) a blower or a sucker? It didn't
> >seem like a sucker to me.
> >It would be wise to use a miniature inspection camera to check inside
> >the cylinder, to see if any swarf and other crud was lying inside.
> >Finally, I would flood the top of the cylinder with thin oil, disable
> >ignition (how, on a diesel?), put a rag over the open glowplug hole, and
> >crank the engine for a few seconds. That should get rid of any remaining
> >crud (via the valves or through the hole).
>
> How much gap is there between a piston and the cylinder wall?
Depends how old the engine is!
> ISTM
> that if a small metal filing were to get into that gap and sit on the
> top piston ring, it may well escape all the above methods, and become
> dislodged only with the detonation of the first power stroke.
It depends what sort of filing it is. Filings that are basically
"dust" will not, in small doses, lead to any problems - certainly not
in the short term, anyway - and are likely to be blown away in the
normal operation of the engine. Larger filings (i.e. of the order of
millimeter size or bigger) would be far more of a problem, but
realistically there is no excuse for leaving these behind.
> The question really I suppose is whether the risk is low enough to be
> worth the saving (and risk) of removing the head. Head removal in the
> only cars I have ever worked on was a quick and easy job, but a look
> under the bonnet of a modern car suggests that it was designed by
> someone who was a master at both jigsaw puzzles and tetris ...
Lol. BMWs are a prime example.
Ste
> The car was put in for regular service. The service included
> replacing glow-plugs.
> Garage says,
> "One of the glow-plugs sheered off when we were removing it. You can
> probably manage on the other three or would you like us to take the
> head off the engine to effect a repair. The engine job will cost
> about £600".
>
> Is it likely that I can insist that the garage does to repair at its
> expense? What would my rights be?
It depends on all sorts of factors. If the car is near-new, and you're
getting a service done at the dealership, then there is some argument
that it shouldn't have sheered in the first place (or at the very
least you should have been warned).
On the other hand, if it's an older car, and being done at any
backstreet garage, then there's not much argument to be had.
Obviously, things do seize from time to time, and as owner of the car
that is your risk.
Personally, unless the car is high value or you intend to keep it
until the end of life, I'd just forget about it and perhaps flog the
car before the next cold winter. To be honest though, any engine in
reasonably good order should catch on 3 cylinders, and the 4th will
soon fire.
Culex (The Infamous Culex)
<ianREMOVETHISjack...@g3ohx.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> Was that airline (used several times) a blower or a sucker? It didn't
> seem like a sucker to me.
The last operation seemed to use a vacuum hose as it was inserted in
the hole formerly occupied by an injector; the tubing was also rather
thicker than that of the airlines I use..
> It would be wise to use a miniature inspection camera to check inside
> the cylinder, to see if any swarf and other crud was lying inside.
Could ants be trained to remove any swarf that got into the cylinder?
> Finally, I would flood the top of the cylinder with thin oil, disable
> ignition (how, on a diesel?), put a rag over the open glowplug hole, and
> crank the engine for a few seconds. That should get rid of any remaining
> crud (via the valves or through the hole).
As I doubt that thin oil would wash out a bit of swarf stuck between
the cylinder wall and the piston, might it not be a sensible
precaution to add some thin oil via the injector hole before the
process was started?
Of course, this would mean that the ants would also have to be trained
to swim.
Culex (The Infamous Culex)
> Personally, unless the car is high value or you intend to keep it
> until the end of life, I'd just forget about it and perhaps flog the
> car before the next cold winter. To be honest though, any engine in
> reasonably good order should catch on 3 cylinders, and the 4th will
> soon fire.
I suppose the owner might consider gluing the broken part of the glow-
plug back in place before he sells the motor-car.
Mrcheerful
the only time that anything can get into the cylinder is after the removal
of the remains of the glow plug, the only operation done then is to use a
reamer to clean coke from the bore of the hole, some thick oil is put on the
reamer first, even if some coke does get into the cylinder at this stage it
would do no damage, bits of coke are in the cylinder in any case during
normal running and fall off and go out through the exhaust on a regular
basis.
Duncan Wood
> On Wed, 13 Jan 2010 20:19:09 +0000, Ian Jackson
> <ianREMOVET...@g3ohx.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>
>>> Very high ...
>
>>> even a speck, milligrams, could get stuck on the valve seat and lead
>>> to it burning ... as another poster suggested, when carrying out this
>>> procedure, it's a good idea to put the cylinder in question to TDC to
>>> close the valves and shield the cylinder wall ... but the risk still
>>> remains. Another trick is to smother the area in grease in the hope it
>>> will catch any swarf, but you now what sods law is like ....
>
>> Was that airline (used several times) a blower or a sucker? It didn't
>> seem like a sucker to me.
>
>> It would be wise to use a miniature inspection camera to check inside
>> the cylinder, to see if any swarf and other crud was lying inside.
>
>> Finally, I would flood the top of the cylinder with thin oil, disable
>> ignition (how, on a diesel?), put a rag over the open glowplug hole, and
>> crank the engine for a few seconds. That should get rid of any remaining
>> crud (via the valves or through the hole).
>
> How much gap is there between a piston and the cylinder wall? ISTM
> that if a small metal filing were to get into that gap and sit on the
> top piston ring, it may well escape all the above methods, and become
> dislodged only with the detonation of the first power stroke.
>
There's a commonly used technique in manufacture called thermal deburring,
if it's a thin bit of swarf then it'll be an ex bit of swarf.
Steve Walker
> Years ago someone I was not familiar with rang up and asked for an
> oilchange, he was very specific about how much it would be beforehand and
> supplied the oil and filter. I had quoted 10 pounds IIRC for labour,
> when the vehicle came in I dropped the oil and filter and did up the
> drain plug all ok, but when I came to put the oil in I discovered why
> the car had come in and why he wanted an exact price in advance: the
> oil filler tube was completely stuffed with old hard mayonaise and no
> oil would go down the tube at all (this was an old renault or peugeot) as
> cleaning out the system was a pain and a long job I filled the oil
> through an alternate route. When the customer came for the car he asked
> how I had got the oil in !!
dipstick tube?
Mrcheerful
I put in the oil via the breather hose off the cam cover. I can't remember
whether that engine had a separate dipstick or whether it went through the
middle of the filler tube (certainly the later but similar engines had the
dipstick in the filler tube)
Culex (The Infamous Culex)
What I don't understand is why the engine contained mayonnaise in the
first place.
Had he greased any parts with butter?
Ian Jackson
<1df16985-30b4-4822...@c3g2000yqd.googlegroups.com>,
"Culex (The Infamous Culex)" <the....@googlemail.com> writes
less-than-completely effective.
"The Hatter was the first to break the silence. `What day of the month
is it?' he said, turning to Alice: he had taken his watch out of his
pocket, and was looking at it uneasily, shaking it every now and then,
and holding it to his ear.
Alice considered a little, and then said `The fourth.'
`Two days wrong!' sighed the Hatter. `I told you butter wouldn't suit
the works!' he added looking angrily at the March Hare.
`It was the best butter,' the March Hare meekly replied.
`Yes, but some crumbs must have got in as well,' the Hatter grumbled:
`you shouldn't have put it in with the bread-knife.'
The March Hare took the watch and looked at it gloomily: then he dipped
it into his cup of tea, and looked at it again: but he could think of
nothing better to say than his first remark, `It was the best butter,
you know.'"
--
Ian
Cynic
<ianREMOVET...@g3ohx.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>>What I don't understand is why the engine contained mayonnaise in the
>>first place.
>>
>>Had he greased any parts with butter?
>>
>It is a well-established practice, although sometimes
>less-than-completely effective.
I was told years ago that one trick of used car dealers when selling a
car with a worn and noisey gearbox was to push banana skins into the
box.
--
Cynic
Bod
Bod
Ste
> On Thu, 14 Jan 2010 16:05:02 +0000, Ian Jackson
>
> >>What I don't understand is why the engine contained mayonnaise in the
> >>first place.
>
> >>Had he greased any parts with butter?
>
> >It is a well-established practice, although sometimes
> >less-than-completely effective.
>
> I was told years ago that one trick of used car dealers when selling a
> car with a worn and noisey gearbox was to push banana skins into the
> box.
I've also heard that feeding in a rayon shirt does wonders... for a
few miles!