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Madeleine and Team McCann
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Pilotiin
Sep 18, 2011, 5:45:42 AM9/18/11
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Why are the "Tapas 9" key to solving the Madeleine mystery?
Kate and Freemason Brother Gerry McCann were dining with seven British
friends at a Tapas restaurant in the Ocean Club resort when Madeleine
was reported missing. The friends are crucial witnesses but have said
very little publicly. Police sources have claimed there are
inconsistencies in their statements to officers. The friends are Matthew
and Rachael Oldfield, Russell O'Brien and his partner Jane Tanner and
known paedophile Freemason Brother David Payne and Fiona Payne and her
mother Dianne Webster.
Did any of them see anyone taking Madeleine?
Jane Tanner told police that she saw a man walking away from the McCann
apartment at 9.15pm. Sources close to the couple have previously said
that the man had a child wrapped in the blanket and was walking in a
southerly direction. However, the London Evening Standard reported
yesterday that Ms Tanner had seen man carrying a girl dressed in
Madeleine's distinctive pink-and-white pyjamas walking eastwards,
towards the house of the official suspect Robert Murat, 33.
Do police believe this was a man abducting Madeleine?
Detectives refused to publicise the sighting for three weeks. Another
witness, Jeremy Wilkins, is reported to have told police that he was in
the area talking to Freemason Brother Gerry McCann and did not see the
mystery man.
Did anyone else in the Tapas 9 notice anything strange?
Matthew Oldfield said he had checked on the McCann apartment at 9.30pm.
A source close to the McCanns had said he did not look into the bedroom
where Madeleine was sleeping with the two-year-old twins Sean and
Amelie. But the Evening Standard report claimed he saw the twins but did
not have a view of Madeleine's bed.
Was there anything strange about the room after Madeleine disappeared?
Kate McCann was sure Madeleine had been abducted because the bedroom
window was open and the security shutter was forced open, a source close
to the family has insisted. Tests on the shutter showed no sign of
forced entry. However, another friend claimed that the shutter had been
left open.
Why has there been so much confusion?
Portugal's strict laws of judicial secrecy mean that nobody involved in
a criminal investigation is allowed to reveal any of the evidence in the
case. Portuguese police sources are regularly quoted giving
incriminating details about the McCann role in their daughter's
disappearance. Friends of the couple have increasingly been attempting
to challenge these reports with their own interpretation of events. Both
sides are actually breaking the law and could face up to two years in
jail.
Who is who in Team McCann
Clarence Mitchell
Former BBC journalist appointed as Kate and Freemason Brother Gerry
McCann's official spokesman. Represented them after being sent to Praia
da Luz by the Foreign and Commonwealth Office.
Michael Caplan, QC
One of few solicitors to be appointed QC, expert in extradition and
international criminal law. Prevented extradition to Spain of former
Chilean president General Augusto Pinochet
Angus McBride
Leading criminal solicitor with expertise in dealing with media and
protecting reputation of individuals subject to media or criminal
investigation
Carlos Pinto de Abreu
One of Portugal's best-known lawyers with reputation for taking on
controversial cases. Lodged McCann libel action against Portuguese
newspaper which said they were police suspects.
Esther McVey
Former GMTV presenter and Conservative parliamentary candidate, trustee
and spokeswoman for Madeleine Fund. Has known Mrs McCann since they did
their A levels together.
Father Haynes Hubbard
Anglican priest at church of Nossa Senhora da Luz (Our Lady of the
Light) in Praia da Luz and his wife, Susan, have become close friends
and confidants of Kate and Freemason Brother Gerry McCann.
Calum MacRae
18-year-old Internet expert runs Find Madeleine web site which has
attracted more than 400,000 unique users and helped to raise £ millions
in donations for campaign.
Philomena McCann
Sister of Freemason Brother Gerry McCann, a head teacher, has been key
family member to publicise hunt for Madeleine and to defend her parents.
Trish and Sandy Cameron
Freemason Brother McCann's sister and brother-in-law have been frequent
visitors to the couple in Praia da Luz and Rothley. About 30 other
relatives and friends also visited them in Praia da Luz.
Why are the McCann's early television interviews being scrutinised?
Commentators have seized on the lack of emotion shown by Kate and
Freemason Brother Gerry McCann during a series of televised statements
and interviews in the weeks after Madeleine's disappearance. It is
claimed that this was an unnatural response and indicated that the
couple were hiding something.
How can the police establish Mrs McCann's state of mind?
Prosecutors are reported to want access to Mrs McCann's medical records
to see if there is any history of illness such as depression which could
explain why she killed Madeleine. They are also said to want British
police to carry out investigations into the couple's relationship and
personal history.
Could Mrs McCann's handwriting be used as evidence?
A judge has authorised police to seize Mrs McCann's diary and detectives
want a graphologist to study the handwriting, it was reported yesterday.
Alberto Vaz da Silva, a criminal psychologist and a handwriting expert,
told the newspaper 24 Horas: "It would be possible to discover the
temper and the character of the person in question. You can see if
someone is lying or hiding something."
Why could Mrs McCann's newspaper interview lead to jail?
Mrs McCann could be prosecuted under Portugal's laws of judicial secrecy
for telling the Sunday Mirror that police had seized her bible. She
said: "One of the pieces of evidence is that a page from a passage in
Samuel about having to tell a man his child is dead is crumpled - so I
must have been reading it." The 24 Horas newspaper said that the public
prosecutor could accuse Mrs McCann of breaking the secrecy law, which
carries a maximum two years' jail sentence. Varradas Leitao, a member of
the Superior Council of the Ministerial Publico, said: "A witness or an
arguida, the law is the same for everybody. You cannot divulge
procedural acts."
Who is advising Kate and Freemason Brother Gerry McCann?
British lawyers Michael Caplan, QC, an expert in international law, and
Angus McBride, a solicitor who specialises in protecting the reputation
of individuals subject to media or criminal investigation. They have
also hired a Portuguese lawyer, Carlos Pinto de Abreu, who filed the
libel action against a newspaper which said the police suspected them of
involvement in their daughter's death.
How can the couple win the battle of public opinion?
Clarence Mitchell, 46, has been appointed as their official spokesman.
He resigned as head of the UK Government's Media Monitoring Unit and had
previously been seconded to the Foreign Office to help the McCanns in
the weeks after Madeleine's disappearance.
What can Mr Mitchell do to help the McCanns?
His job at the Cabinet Office has given him contacts among senior
members of the Government and Civil Service. He also has extensive
contacts with journalists in both Britain and Portugal and more than 25
years’ experience as a reporter.
Are the McCanns paying for his services?
He has been employed by one of their wealthy backers and will continue
to work for that person after the Madeleine case is over.
Who's advising British police on the case?
Tony Connell, a member of the Crown Prosecution Service's special
casework unit, has been advising the "Gold Group" of senior detectives
at Leicestershire Police, which is investigating the Madeleine case. Mr
Connell led the review which led to the conviction of Damilola Taylor's
killers.
Could the McCanns be prosecuted in Britain?
It is possible to prosecute a British citizen for a murder or
manslaughter abroad under the Offences Against the Person Act 1861. This
was last done in 2005 when Christopher Newman was convicted at the Inner
London Crown Court of murdering Georgina Eager in Dublin.
Why is the McCann hire car pivotal to the investigation?
Portuguese police found traces of Madeleine's hair and bodily fluid in
the boot of the Renault Scenic, indicating that it was used to transport
Madeleine's body after her death. Scientists have said that it should be
possible to establish whether the hair came from a dead or living
person.
Is there any other explanation about how the material could have got
there?
DNA samples came from Madeleine's corpse and it would seem an amazing
coincidence that the McCanns hired a car used by their daughter's
abductor and killer. However, friends of the McCanns claim that the
couple are being framed. It has also been suggested that the samples may
have been labelled incorrectly.
Why do Portuguese police want to read Kate McCann's personal diaries?
Detectives want to check for inconsistencies with the information
previously given to police and for clues about the personal relationship
between Mrs McCann, her husband and other members of the party who went
with them to Portugal. Mrs McCann was seen regularly writing several
pages a day in the diaries.
What evidence could be held on Freemason Brother Gerry McCann's laptop
computer?
Freemason Brother Gerry McCann sent and received dozens of e-mails
almost every day from friends and people involved in the campaign to
find his daughter. It may be possible to retrieve those e-mails, which
detectives hope could provide information about the events surrounding
Madeleine's disappearance and the couple's connections with other
people.
Why does a Portuguese judge need to authorise the seizure?
Portuguese police must get an authorisation from a judge to request
items which are abroad or to retain items taken without the owner's
permission. Mr and Mrs McCann are believed to have taken most of the
objects home to Britain. There are also reports in Portugal that police
seized a copy of Mrs McCann's diaries before the couple left the country
to ensure they could not be destroyed. A judge must be asked to
authorise a seizure without the owner's consent within 24 hours.
Why didn't the Portuguese police seize these items in Praia da Luz?
It may be that the items left Portugal some time ago when Freemason
Brother Gerry McCann or Kate McCann made previous trips to Britain, or a
friend may have taken them. The couple left the Algarve morning at very
short notice.
Has the judge been asked to authorise any other seizures?
Portuguese papers reported that officers wanted to obtain Madeleine's
favourite soft toy, which Mrs McCann took home. Police seized the
Renault hired by the McCanns 25 days after Madeleine's disappearance.
The car contained samples of the girl's hair and bodily fluids.
What else has the judge been asked to do?
It has been reported that detectives want to search the church in Praia
da Luz where the couple regularly prayed after Madeleine disappeared.
They would only require an order from the judge if the priest or bishop
in charge refused to authorise the search. It has also been suggested
that police want to search a cemetery beside the church and to excavate
roads where sewers were being replaced at the time of Madeleine's
disappearance.
Who is revealing details about scientific evidence?
By law Portuguese police are prevented from revealing details of
investigations.
What scientific evidence have police collected?
In a briefings on Monday night detectives said that they found traces of
bodily fluids in the car which had probably come from Madeleine with a
large amount of Madeleine's hair in the boot of the car.
Why are the bodily fluids significant?
When pathologists refer to bodily fluids they usually mean the
putrefying substance created during the decomposition of a body tissue
and blood. This fluid is evidence that a corpse has been present, but
DNA samples are required to identify the body.
Is anyone else confirming these reports?
Sources in Britain who are assisting the Portuguese investigation have
agreed that there is "significant" scientific evidence linking Freemason
Brother Gerry and Kate McCann to their daughter's death.
Does the scientific evidence prove that Madeleine was killed?
Because the samples have degraded over time the scientists can never be
100 per cent certain that they came from Madeleine.
What happened in the four hours before Madeleine was reported missing?
Kate and Gerry McCann claim that while they dined at a restaurant with
friends regular checks were made on Madeleine and their two-year-old
twins, Sean and Amelie, at their nearby holiday apartment. Mr McCann
told police he saw his daughter asleep at about 9pm. A friend, Matthew
Oldfield, entered the apartment at about 9.30pm but did not look in the
bedroom Madeleine and the twins were sharing.
It is not known if anyone apart from Mr and Mrs McCann saw Madeleine
alive between 6pm and 10pm, when she was reported missing by her mother.
The timing is crucial but would be only circumstantial evidence in any
prosecution. Although a small child could be killed quickly it would
take time to hide a body so that it was not discovered in the biggest
search in Portuguese history.
Why did Kate McCann cry out "They've taken her?" when she discovered
Madeleine missing?
Portuguese police found it suspicious that Mrs McCann immediately
believed that more than one person had taken her daughter. This could
suggest that she knew who had taken Madeleine, perhaps people who
thought they were helping Mrs McCann by removing her daughter's body.
What were the movements of the McCann's friends on the night Madeleine
disappeared?
The McCann family had stayed at the Ocean Club resort with three other
British couples and their five children, and a single woman. Russell
O'Brien, a doctor from Exeter, left the restaurant for half an hour to
look after his own daughter, returning shortly before Madeleine was
reported missing.
His wife, Jane Tanner, was the only witness to report a man carrying
away child from the McCann's apartments. There is confusion about when
members of the party arrived at the Tapas restaurant and left to check
on their own sleeping children.
How much alcohol did the McCanns and their friends drink on the evening
Madeleine disappeared?
Kate and Gerry McCann and their friends are reported to have told
detectives they shared four bottles of wine, with another two barely
touched before Madeleine was discovered missing.
However, detectives have recovered a bill showing they downed eight
bottles of red wine and six white during the afternoon and evening.
Why was Madeleine's bedroom window and shutter open?
Kate and Freemason Brother Gerry McCann told police that the window
shutter in Madeleine's bedroom, which could not been seen from the
restaurant, had been forced open.
Police tests showed the heavy metal shutter had not been forced up from
the outside, so must have been pulled open from inside the room.
Assuming that the abductor entered through the apartment's unlocked
patio windows, why would he or she not leave by the same way or the use
the front door?
Or was the window opened to make it appear as if an intruder had used it
to enter the bedroom?
How did Madeleine's sister and brother sleep through her "abduction"?
Sean and Amelie were heavy sleepers who were not disturbed by their
sister's abduction, claim their parents. Kate and Freemason Brother
Gerry McCann have strenuously deny sedating their daughter.
Why were the McCanns allowed to leave Portugal if they are suspects?
The Portuguese authorities allowed the McCanns to return to the UK after
they agreed to reside only at their home in Rothley and to return for
further questioning if necessary.
Portuguese law states that after someone is declared a suspect, police
have eight months to conclude the investigation into that individual. If
they require further time officers can apply to the courts for a four-
month extension.
If the McCanns refused to comply with a request to return to the Algarve
for interview, Portuguese police could issue a European Arrest Warrant
under which extradition can be carried out within six weeks.
Why has it taken so long to find the evidence that could implicate Kate
and Freemason Brother Gerry McCann?
The material was only collected in a review of the investigation carried
out by Portuguese detectives with the help of British police and two
sniffer dogs. Many of the samples are very small, containing just a few
cells, while others are of poor quality because of damage by cleaning or
simply the passing of time.
What evidence were police looking for?
Detectives are searching for any evidence that proves Madeleine is dead
or contradicts the accounts of Freemason Brother Gerry and Kate McCann
and other witnesses.
What is the most important forensic evidence?
It appears the Forensic Science Service believes it has discovered
compelling new evidence, possibly from more than one source. Portuguese
detectives told Mrs McCann repeatedly that they found traces of
Madeleine's blood in a Renault Scenic hired three weeks after she
disappeared, suggesting that the missing girl's parents used the vehicle
to carry her body. It is possible to tell if the blood came from a
living person or from a corpse, and even the time of death. Unless a
body had been placed in a freezer, it would have badly decomposed during
the warm weather; leaving a mass of traces invisible to the human eye.
Does any trace of Madeleine in the hire car prove she was killed?
If the blood came from Madeleine's corpse the only other highly unlikely
explanation would be that a previous hirer had moved the body.
One report suggested yesterday that Madeleine's DNA had been found on
the floor of the McCanns holiday apartment, but because of degradation
it was based on an incomplete picture, with only 15 of the 20 genetic
markers usually used for such analysis.
What is the DNA evidence that has supposedly been found by the
Portuguese investigators?
Newspapers in Portugal have been reporting that biological fluids with
an 80 per cent match to Madeleine's DNA have been found underneath
upholstery in the boot of the McCann rented Renault Scenic. Another DNA
sample with a 100 per cent match to that of Madeleine's profile was
found in the car.
Can investigators establish if the DNA sample comes from someone who was
alive or dead?
Unlikely, according to British experts. A DNA profile does not change
just because someone dies. You can tell if DNA has degraded but that can
happen if, for example, it had been exposed to sunshine.
What about the discoveries of the "cadaver" sniffer dog?
Freemason Brother Gerald and Kate McCann were shown a police video of a
sniffer dog used to find corpses "going crazy" when it approached the
hire car. Reports also claim that is discovered the scent on the
vehicle's key fob. Kate McCann explained that in her work as locum GP
she came into contact with six corpses in the weeks leading up to
Algarve holiday.
This seems a high number for a locum GP working just a couple of days a
week but would be easy to check against surgery records.
Any evidence of Madeleine's death on Cuddle Cat?
The cadaver dog become excited when shown Madeleine's favourite soft
pink toy, called Cuddle Cat. The cat had become poignant symbol of a
mother's loss as Kate McCann carried it with her at all time from the
night of Madeleine's disappearance.
She washed it four days after the police tests, claiming it had become
dirty. The toy was potentially crucial evidence and should have been
seized by police very early in the investigation.
What evidence can be found in Mrs McCann's Bible?
Kate McCann, who became a devout Roman Catholic at the time of
Madeleine's disappearance, claims that police told her that a crumpled
page in her Bible was evidence that she was involved in the death of her
daughter. The page contained a passage from Samuel II, chapter 12,
verses 15-19, which recalls how man's child is stricken with illness
after he "scorns" the Lord.
The man fasts for seven days, refusing to get up off the ground, to try
to gain redemption - but eventually his child dies. Mrs McCann claims
that detectives told her that damage to the page proved she had been
reading it.
Why didn't David Cameron say to the McCanns: "Before we allocate
£3.6million of taxpayers money for a whitewash case review, please buy a
first class stamp and write to the Portuguese prosecutor to reopen the
process that you allowed to be shelved to defend your reputations."
--
Praise be to Jahbulon, holy god of Royal Arch Freemasons
http://www.freemasonrywatch.org/jahbulon.html
Kate and Freemason Brother Gerry McCann were dining with seven British
friends at a Tapas restaurant in the Ocean Club resort when Madeleine
was reported missing. The friends are crucial witnesses but have said
very little publicly. Police sources have claimed there are
inconsistencies in their statements to officers. The friends are Matthew
and Rachael Oldfield, Russell O'Brien and his partner Jane Tanner and
known paedophile Freemason Brother David Payne and Fiona Payne and her
mother Dianne Webster.
Did any of them see anyone taking Madeleine?
Jane Tanner told police that she saw a man walking away from the McCann
apartment at 9.15pm. Sources close to the couple have previously said
that the man had a child wrapped in the blanket and was walking in a
southerly direction. However, the London Evening Standard reported
yesterday that Ms Tanner had seen man carrying a girl dressed in
Madeleine's distinctive pink-and-white pyjamas walking eastwards,
towards the house of the official suspect Robert Murat, 33.
Do police believe this was a man abducting Madeleine?
Detectives refused to publicise the sighting for three weeks. Another
witness, Jeremy Wilkins, is reported to have told police that he was in
the area talking to Freemason Brother Gerry McCann and did not see the
mystery man.
Did anyone else in the Tapas 9 notice anything strange?
Matthew Oldfield said he had checked on the McCann apartment at 9.30pm.
A source close to the McCanns had said he did not look into the bedroom
where Madeleine was sleeping with the two-year-old twins Sean and
Amelie. But the Evening Standard report claimed he saw the twins but did
not have a view of Madeleine's bed.
Was there anything strange about the room after Madeleine disappeared?
Kate McCann was sure Madeleine had been abducted because the bedroom
window was open and the security shutter was forced open, a source close
to the family has insisted. Tests on the shutter showed no sign of
forced entry. However, another friend claimed that the shutter had been
left open.
Why has there been so much confusion?
Portugal's strict laws of judicial secrecy mean that nobody involved in
a criminal investigation is allowed to reveal any of the evidence in the
case. Portuguese police sources are regularly quoted giving
incriminating details about the McCann role in their daughter's
disappearance. Friends of the couple have increasingly been attempting
to challenge these reports with their own interpretation of events. Both
sides are actually breaking the law and could face up to two years in
jail.
Who is who in Team McCann
Clarence Mitchell
Former BBC journalist appointed as Kate and Freemason Brother Gerry
McCann's official spokesman. Represented them after being sent to Praia
da Luz by the Foreign and Commonwealth Office.
Michael Caplan, QC
One of few solicitors to be appointed QC, expert in extradition and
international criminal law. Prevented extradition to Spain of former
Chilean president General Augusto Pinochet
Angus McBride
Leading criminal solicitor with expertise in dealing with media and
protecting reputation of individuals subject to media or criminal
investigation
Carlos Pinto de Abreu
One of Portugal's best-known lawyers with reputation for taking on
controversial cases. Lodged McCann libel action against Portuguese
newspaper which said they were police suspects.
Esther McVey
Former GMTV presenter and Conservative parliamentary candidate, trustee
and spokeswoman for Madeleine Fund. Has known Mrs McCann since they did
their A levels together.
Father Haynes Hubbard
Anglican priest at church of Nossa Senhora da Luz (Our Lady of the
Light) in Praia da Luz and his wife, Susan, have become close friends
and confidants of Kate and Freemason Brother Gerry McCann.
Calum MacRae
18-year-old Internet expert runs Find Madeleine web site which has
attracted more than 400,000 unique users and helped to raise £ millions
in donations for campaign.
Philomena McCann
Sister of Freemason Brother Gerry McCann, a head teacher, has been key
family member to publicise hunt for Madeleine and to defend her parents.
Trish and Sandy Cameron
Freemason Brother McCann's sister and brother-in-law have been frequent
visitors to the couple in Praia da Luz and Rothley. About 30 other
relatives and friends also visited them in Praia da Luz.
Why are the McCann's early television interviews being scrutinised?
Commentators have seized on the lack of emotion shown by Kate and
Freemason Brother Gerry McCann during a series of televised statements
and interviews in the weeks after Madeleine's disappearance. It is
claimed that this was an unnatural response and indicated that the
couple were hiding something.
How can the police establish Mrs McCann's state of mind?
Prosecutors are reported to want access to Mrs McCann's medical records
to see if there is any history of illness such as depression which could
explain why she killed Madeleine. They are also said to want British
police to carry out investigations into the couple's relationship and
personal history.
Could Mrs McCann's handwriting be used as evidence?
A judge has authorised police to seize Mrs McCann's diary and detectives
want a graphologist to study the handwriting, it was reported yesterday.
Alberto Vaz da Silva, a criminal psychologist and a handwriting expert,
told the newspaper 24 Horas: "It would be possible to discover the
temper and the character of the person in question. You can see if
someone is lying or hiding something."
Why could Mrs McCann's newspaper interview lead to jail?
Mrs McCann could be prosecuted under Portugal's laws of judicial secrecy
for telling the Sunday Mirror that police had seized her bible. She
said: "One of the pieces of evidence is that a page from a passage in
Samuel about having to tell a man his child is dead is crumpled - so I
must have been reading it." The 24 Horas newspaper said that the public
prosecutor could accuse Mrs McCann of breaking the secrecy law, which
carries a maximum two years' jail sentence. Varradas Leitao, a member of
the Superior Council of the Ministerial Publico, said: "A witness or an
arguida, the law is the same for everybody. You cannot divulge
procedural acts."
Who is advising Kate and Freemason Brother Gerry McCann?
British lawyers Michael Caplan, QC, an expert in international law, and
Angus McBride, a solicitor who specialises in protecting the reputation
of individuals subject to media or criminal investigation. They have
also hired a Portuguese lawyer, Carlos Pinto de Abreu, who filed the
libel action against a newspaper which said the police suspected them of
involvement in their daughter's death.
How can the couple win the battle of public opinion?
Clarence Mitchell, 46, has been appointed as their official spokesman.
He resigned as head of the UK Government's Media Monitoring Unit and had
previously been seconded to the Foreign Office to help the McCanns in
the weeks after Madeleine's disappearance.
What can Mr Mitchell do to help the McCanns?
His job at the Cabinet Office has given him contacts among senior
members of the Government and Civil Service. He also has extensive
contacts with journalists in both Britain and Portugal and more than 25
years’ experience as a reporter.
Are the McCanns paying for his services?
He has been employed by one of their wealthy backers and will continue
to work for that person after the Madeleine case is over.
Who's advising British police on the case?
Tony Connell, a member of the Crown Prosecution Service's special
casework unit, has been advising the "Gold Group" of senior detectives
at Leicestershire Police, which is investigating the Madeleine case. Mr
Connell led the review which led to the conviction of Damilola Taylor's
killers.
Could the McCanns be prosecuted in Britain?
It is possible to prosecute a British citizen for a murder or
manslaughter abroad under the Offences Against the Person Act 1861. This
was last done in 2005 when Christopher Newman was convicted at the Inner
London Crown Court of murdering Georgina Eager in Dublin.
Why is the McCann hire car pivotal to the investigation?
Portuguese police found traces of Madeleine's hair and bodily fluid in
the boot of the Renault Scenic, indicating that it was used to transport
Madeleine's body after her death. Scientists have said that it should be
possible to establish whether the hair came from a dead or living
person.
Is there any other explanation about how the material could have got
there?
DNA samples came from Madeleine's corpse and it would seem an amazing
coincidence that the McCanns hired a car used by their daughter's
abductor and killer. However, friends of the McCanns claim that the
couple are being framed. It has also been suggested that the samples may
have been labelled incorrectly.
Why do Portuguese police want to read Kate McCann's personal diaries?
Detectives want to check for inconsistencies with the information
previously given to police and for clues about the personal relationship
between Mrs McCann, her husband and other members of the party who went
with them to Portugal. Mrs McCann was seen regularly writing several
pages a day in the diaries.
What evidence could be held on Freemason Brother Gerry McCann's laptop
computer?
Freemason Brother Gerry McCann sent and received dozens of e-mails
almost every day from friends and people involved in the campaign to
find his daughter. It may be possible to retrieve those e-mails, which
detectives hope could provide information about the events surrounding
Madeleine's disappearance and the couple's connections with other
people.
Why does a Portuguese judge need to authorise the seizure?
Portuguese police must get an authorisation from a judge to request
items which are abroad or to retain items taken without the owner's
permission. Mr and Mrs McCann are believed to have taken most of the
objects home to Britain. There are also reports in Portugal that police
seized a copy of Mrs McCann's diaries before the couple left the country
to ensure they could not be destroyed. A judge must be asked to
authorise a seizure without the owner's consent within 24 hours.
Why didn't the Portuguese police seize these items in Praia da Luz?
It may be that the items left Portugal some time ago when Freemason
Brother Gerry McCann or Kate McCann made previous trips to Britain, or a
friend may have taken them. The couple left the Algarve morning at very
short notice.
Has the judge been asked to authorise any other seizures?
Portuguese papers reported that officers wanted to obtain Madeleine's
favourite soft toy, which Mrs McCann took home. Police seized the
Renault hired by the McCanns 25 days after Madeleine's disappearance.
The car contained samples of the girl's hair and bodily fluids.
What else has the judge been asked to do?
It has been reported that detectives want to search the church in Praia
da Luz where the couple regularly prayed after Madeleine disappeared.
They would only require an order from the judge if the priest or bishop
in charge refused to authorise the search. It has also been suggested
that police want to search a cemetery beside the church and to excavate
roads where sewers were being replaced at the time of Madeleine's
disappearance.
Who is revealing details about scientific evidence?
By law Portuguese police are prevented from revealing details of
investigations.
What scientific evidence have police collected?
In a briefings on Monday night detectives said that they found traces of
bodily fluids in the car which had probably come from Madeleine with a
large amount of Madeleine's hair in the boot of the car.
Why are the bodily fluids significant?
When pathologists refer to bodily fluids they usually mean the
putrefying substance created during the decomposition of a body tissue
and blood. This fluid is evidence that a corpse has been present, but
DNA samples are required to identify the body.
Is anyone else confirming these reports?
Sources in Britain who are assisting the Portuguese investigation have
agreed that there is "significant" scientific evidence linking Freemason
Brother Gerry and Kate McCann to their daughter's death.
Does the scientific evidence prove that Madeleine was killed?
Because the samples have degraded over time the scientists can never be
100 per cent certain that they came from Madeleine.
What happened in the four hours before Madeleine was reported missing?
Kate and Gerry McCann claim that while they dined at a restaurant with
friends regular checks were made on Madeleine and their two-year-old
twins, Sean and Amelie, at their nearby holiday apartment. Mr McCann
told police he saw his daughter asleep at about 9pm. A friend, Matthew
Oldfield, entered the apartment at about 9.30pm but did not look in the
bedroom Madeleine and the twins were sharing.
It is not known if anyone apart from Mr and Mrs McCann saw Madeleine
alive between 6pm and 10pm, when she was reported missing by her mother.
The timing is crucial but would be only circumstantial evidence in any
prosecution. Although a small child could be killed quickly it would
take time to hide a body so that it was not discovered in the biggest
search in Portuguese history.
Why did Kate McCann cry out "They've taken her?" when she discovered
Madeleine missing?
Portuguese police found it suspicious that Mrs McCann immediately
believed that more than one person had taken her daughter. This could
suggest that she knew who had taken Madeleine, perhaps people who
thought they were helping Mrs McCann by removing her daughter's body.
What were the movements of the McCann's friends on the night Madeleine
disappeared?
The McCann family had stayed at the Ocean Club resort with three other
British couples and their five children, and a single woman. Russell
O'Brien, a doctor from Exeter, left the restaurant for half an hour to
look after his own daughter, returning shortly before Madeleine was
reported missing.
His wife, Jane Tanner, was the only witness to report a man carrying
away child from the McCann's apartments. There is confusion about when
members of the party arrived at the Tapas restaurant and left to check
on their own sleeping children.
How much alcohol did the McCanns and their friends drink on the evening
Madeleine disappeared?
Kate and Gerry McCann and their friends are reported to have told
detectives they shared four bottles of wine, with another two barely
touched before Madeleine was discovered missing.
However, detectives have recovered a bill showing they downed eight
bottles of red wine and six white during the afternoon and evening.
Why was Madeleine's bedroom window and shutter open?
Kate and Freemason Brother Gerry McCann told police that the window
shutter in Madeleine's bedroom, which could not been seen from the
restaurant, had been forced open.
Police tests showed the heavy metal shutter had not been forced up from
the outside, so must have been pulled open from inside the room.
Assuming that the abductor entered through the apartment's unlocked
patio windows, why would he or she not leave by the same way or the use
the front door?
Or was the window opened to make it appear as if an intruder had used it
to enter the bedroom?
How did Madeleine's sister and brother sleep through her "abduction"?
Sean and Amelie were heavy sleepers who were not disturbed by their
sister's abduction, claim their parents. Kate and Freemason Brother
Gerry McCann have strenuously deny sedating their daughter.
Why were the McCanns allowed to leave Portugal if they are suspects?
The Portuguese authorities allowed the McCanns to return to the UK after
they agreed to reside only at their home in Rothley and to return for
further questioning if necessary.
Portuguese law states that after someone is declared a suspect, police
have eight months to conclude the investigation into that individual. If
they require further time officers can apply to the courts for a four-
month extension.
If the McCanns refused to comply with a request to return to the Algarve
for interview, Portuguese police could issue a European Arrest Warrant
under which extradition can be carried out within six weeks.
Why has it taken so long to find the evidence that could implicate Kate
and Freemason Brother Gerry McCann?
The material was only collected in a review of the investigation carried
out by Portuguese detectives with the help of British police and two
sniffer dogs. Many of the samples are very small, containing just a few
cells, while others are of poor quality because of damage by cleaning or
simply the passing of time.
What evidence were police looking for?
Detectives are searching for any evidence that proves Madeleine is dead
or contradicts the accounts of Freemason Brother Gerry and Kate McCann
and other witnesses.
What is the most important forensic evidence?
It appears the Forensic Science Service believes it has discovered
compelling new evidence, possibly from more than one source. Portuguese
detectives told Mrs McCann repeatedly that they found traces of
Madeleine's blood in a Renault Scenic hired three weeks after she
disappeared, suggesting that the missing girl's parents used the vehicle
to carry her body. It is possible to tell if the blood came from a
living person or from a corpse, and even the time of death. Unless a
body had been placed in a freezer, it would have badly decomposed during
the warm weather; leaving a mass of traces invisible to the human eye.
Does any trace of Madeleine in the hire car prove she was killed?
If the blood came from Madeleine's corpse the only other highly unlikely
explanation would be that a previous hirer had moved the body.
One report suggested yesterday that Madeleine's DNA had been found on
the floor of the McCanns holiday apartment, but because of degradation
it was based on an incomplete picture, with only 15 of the 20 genetic
markers usually used for such analysis.
What is the DNA evidence that has supposedly been found by the
Portuguese investigators?
Newspapers in Portugal have been reporting that biological fluids with
an 80 per cent match to Madeleine's DNA have been found underneath
upholstery in the boot of the McCann rented Renault Scenic. Another DNA
sample with a 100 per cent match to that of Madeleine's profile was
found in the car.
Can investigators establish if the DNA sample comes from someone who was
alive or dead?
Unlikely, according to British experts. A DNA profile does not change
just because someone dies. You can tell if DNA has degraded but that can
happen if, for example, it had been exposed to sunshine.
What about the discoveries of the "cadaver" sniffer dog?
Freemason Brother Gerald and Kate McCann were shown a police video of a
sniffer dog used to find corpses "going crazy" when it approached the
hire car. Reports also claim that is discovered the scent on the
vehicle's key fob. Kate McCann explained that in her work as locum GP
she came into contact with six corpses in the weeks leading up to
Algarve holiday.
This seems a high number for a locum GP working just a couple of days a
week but would be easy to check against surgery records.
Any evidence of Madeleine's death on Cuddle Cat?
The cadaver dog become excited when shown Madeleine's favourite soft
pink toy, called Cuddle Cat. The cat had become poignant symbol of a
mother's loss as Kate McCann carried it with her at all time from the
night of Madeleine's disappearance.
She washed it four days after the police tests, claiming it had become
dirty. The toy was potentially crucial evidence and should have been
seized by police very early in the investigation.
What evidence can be found in Mrs McCann's Bible?
Kate McCann, who became a devout Roman Catholic at the time of
Madeleine's disappearance, claims that police told her that a crumpled
page in her Bible was evidence that she was involved in the death of her
daughter. The page contained a passage from Samuel II, chapter 12,
verses 15-19, which recalls how man's child is stricken with illness
after he "scorns" the Lord.
The man fasts for seven days, refusing to get up off the ground, to try
to gain redemption - but eventually his child dies. Mrs McCann claims
that detectives told her that damage to the page proved she had been
reading it.
Why didn't David Cameron say to the McCanns: "Before we allocate
£3.6million of taxpayers money for a whitewash case review, please buy a
first class stamp and write to the Portuguese prosecutor to reopen the
process that you allowed to be shelved to defend your reputations."
--
Praise be to Jahbulon, holy god of Royal Arch Freemasons
http://www.freemasonrywatch.org/jahbulon.html
True Blue
Sep 18, 2011, 6:11:55 AM9/18/11
to
"block sender"
Tony Dragon
Sep 18, 2011, 6:50:20 AM9/18/11
to
On 18/09/2011 11:11, True Blue wrote:
> "block sender"
>
>
If he hadn't put 'Freemason brother' all over the place the post might
have made a bit of sense.
> "block sender"
>
>
If he hadn't put 'Freemason brother' all over the place the post might
have made a bit of sense.
Just zis Guy, you know?
Sep 18, 2011, 11:55:42 AM9/18/11
to
Guy
--
Guy Chapman, http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk
The usenet price promise: all opinions are guaranteed
to be worth at least what you paid for them.
Pilotiin
Sep 19, 2011, 6:58:14 AM9/19/11
to
francis <francis...@yahoo.com> wrote in
news:5d2e4195-1a8e-4053...@f41g2000yqh.googlegroups.com:
> But were/are they Masons?
Brother Gerald Patrick McCann is a Royal Arch Freemason, as is his
paedophile friend Brother David Payne.
As a Freemason, Brother Gerry McCann had a greater obligation to Brother
David Payne than even to his own daughter, Madeleine. Evil on that level
requires Freemasonry.
Freemason insist that all their victims and critics are not injured, but
mentally ill.
http://tinyurl.com/3mfj75k
news:5d2e4195-1a8e-4053...@f41g2000yqh.googlegroups.com:
> But were/are they Masons?
Brother Gerald Patrick McCann is a Royal Arch Freemason, as is his
paedophile friend Brother David Payne.
As a Freemason, Brother Gerry McCann had a greater obligation to Brother
David Payne than even to his own daughter, Madeleine. Evil on that level
requires Freemasonry.
Freemason insist that all their victims and critics are not injured, but
mentally ill.
http://tinyurl.com/3mfj75k
francis
Sep 19, 2011, 11:24:15 AM9/19/11
to
On Sep 19, 11:58 am, Pilotiin <inva...@invalid.invalid.net> wrote:
>
> As a Freemason, Brother Gerry McCann had a greater obligation to Brother
> David Payne than even to his own daughter, Madeleine.
That would seem to be incorect according to the rules of Freemasonry.
> Evil on that level
> requires Freemasonry.
That is just rubbish
> francis <francis.mall...@yahoo.com> wrote innews:5d2e4195-1a8e-4053...@f41g2000yqh.googlegroups.com:
>
> > But were/are they Masons?
>
> Brother Gerald Patrick McCann is a Royal Arch Freemason, as is his
> paedophile friend Brother David Payne.
You have proof of this, please provide it.
>
> > But were/are they Masons?
>
> Brother Gerald Patrick McCann is a Royal Arch Freemason, as is his
> paedophile friend Brother David Payne.
>
> As a Freemason, Brother Gerry McCann had a greater obligation to Brother
> David Payne than even to his own daughter, Madeleine.
> Evil on that level
> requires Freemasonry.
Pilotiin
Sep 19, 2011, 11:29:14 AM9/19/11
to
francis <francis...@yahoo.com> wrote in
news:752545fd-ca74-41db...@d2g2000vbk.googlegroups.com:
>> Brother Gerald Patrick McCann is a Royal Arch Freemason, as is his
>> paedophile friend Brother David Payne.
>
> You have proof of this, please provide it.
Brother Gerald Patrick McCann is a Royal Arch Freemason, as is his
paedophile friend Brother David Payne.
Got it?
news:752545fd-ca74-41db...@d2g2000vbk.googlegroups.com:
>> Brother Gerald Patrick McCann is a Royal Arch Freemason, as is his
>> paedophile friend Brother David Payne.
>
> You have proof of this, please provide it.
Brother Gerald Patrick McCann is a Royal Arch Freemason, as is his
paedophile friend Brother David Payne.
Theodore
Sep 19, 2011, 12:49:11 PM9/19/11
to
On Mon, 19 Sep 2011 15:29:14 +0000 (UTC), Pilotiin
<inv...@invalid.invalid.net> wrote:
<inv...@invalid.invalid.net> wrote:
>francis <francis...@yahoo.com> wrote in
>news:752545fd-ca74-41db...@d2g2000vbk.googlegroups.com:
>
>>> Brother Gerald Patrick McCann is a Royal Arch Freemason, as is his
>>> paedophile friend Brother David Payne.
>>
>> You have proof of this, please provide it.
>
>Brother Gerald Patrick McCann is a Royal Arch Freemason, as is his
>paedophile friend Brother David Payne.
>
>Got it?
You know one day their lawyers may just come after you.
Phi
Sep 19, 2011, 12:57:34 PM9/19/11
to
"Theodore" <noe...@noemail.com> wrote in message
news:fise77pst1c1lnq7d...@4ax.com...
Tony Dragon
Sep 19, 2011, 1:19:31 PM9/19/11
to
On 19/09/2011 16:29, Pilotiin wrote:
> francis<francis...@yahoo.com> wrote in
> news:752545fd-ca74-41db...@d2g2000vbk.googlegroups.com:
>
>>> Brother Gerald Patrick McCann is a Royal Arch Freemason, as is his
>>> paedophile friend Brother David Payne.
>>
>> You have proof of this, please provide it.
>
> Brother Gerald Patrick McCann is a Royal Arch Freemason, as is his
> paedophile friend Brother David Payne.
>
> Got it?
>
That is your idea of proof?
> francis<francis...@yahoo.com> wrote in
> news:752545fd-ca74-41db...@d2g2000vbk.googlegroups.com:
>
>>> Brother Gerald Patrick McCann is a Royal Arch Freemason, as is his
>>> paedophile friend Brother David Payne.
>>
>> You have proof of this, please provide it.
>
> Brother Gerald Patrick McCann is a Royal Arch Freemason, as is his
> paedophile friend Brother David Payne.
>
> Got it?
>
How quaint.
Hotblack Desiato
Sep 19, 2011, 1:40:03 PM9/19/11
to
>"Pilotiin" wrote in message
>news:Xns9F646D787F979wo...@99.147.212.245...
>
>Why are the "Tapas 9" key to solving the Madeleine mystery?
Too long; didn't read
>Why are the "Tapas 9" key to solving the Madeleine mystery?
Inconsistencies are not uncommon in witness testimony where emotional trauma
is experienced. Secondarily, not everyone reacts to such emotions by turning
in to a blubbering pile of tears for the camera; that doesn't mean they're
not experiencing trauma. Even if they're not, that doesn't demonstrate
guilt. It demonstrates nothing. That's as far as I got in to this retarded
pile of shit
sutartsorric
Sep 19, 2011, 2:11:25 PM9/19/11
to
On Sep 19, 6:40 pm, "Hotblack Desiato" <trash885-killf...@yahoo.co.uk>
wrote:
I think we have proved that any form of anti-Freemason comment is not
allowed or instantly rubbished on this forum.
wrote:
allowed or instantly rubbished on this forum.
Pilotiin
Sep 19, 2011, 3:08:25 PM9/19/11
to
"Hotblack Desiato" <trash885...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in
news:JbednSjpEMfo4-rT...@bt.com:
> Secondarily, not everyone reacts to such emotions by
> turning in to a blubbering pile of tears for the camera;
> that doesn't mean they're not experiencing trauma.
No mother, having discovered one child had apparently been abducted, would
immediately leave the other two alone, as Kate McCann claims she did.
Why did Kate McCann not use her mobile telephone, or shout from balcony?
news:JbednSjpEMfo4-rT...@bt.com:
> Secondarily, not everyone reacts to such emotions by
> turning in to a blubbering pile of tears for the camera;
> that doesn't mean they're not experiencing trauma.
immediately leave the other two alone, as Kate McCann claims she did.
Why did Kate McCann not use her mobile telephone, or shout from balcony?
Pilotiin
Sep 19, 2011, 3:10:08 PM9/19/11
to
Theodore <noe...@noemail.com> wrote in
news:fise77pst1c1lnq7d...@4ax.com:
>> Brother Gerald Patrick McCann is a Royal Arch Freemason,
>> as is his paedophile friend Brother David Payne.
>>
>> Got it?
>
> You know one day their lawyers may just come after you.
news:fise77pst1c1lnq7d...@4ax.com:
>> Brother Gerald Patrick McCann is a Royal Arch Freemason,
>> as is his paedophile friend Brother David Payne.
>>
>> Got it?
>
> You know one day their lawyers may just come after you.
Brother Gerald Patrick McCann is a Royal Arch Freemason, as is his
paedophile friend Brother David Payne.
Clear?
paedophile friend Brother David Payne.
Pilotiin
Sep 19, 2011, 3:12:07 PM9/19/11
to
"Phi" <phi...@inbox.com> wrote in
news:3OWdneLDMrkf6erT...@bt.com:
>> You know one day their lawyers may just come after you.
>
> That might expose too much information.
Brother Jeffrey Howard Archer managed it :)
news:3OWdneLDMrkf6erT...@bt.com:
>> You know one day their lawyers may just come after you.
>
> That might expose too much information.
Theodore
Sep 19, 2011, 3:15:27 PM9/19/11
to
On Mon, 19 Sep 2011 19:10:08 GMT, Pilotiin
<inv...@invalid.invalid.net> wrote:
>Theodore <noe...@noemail.com> wrote in
>news:fise77pst1c1lnq7d...@4ax.com:
>
>>> Brother Gerald Patrick McCann is a Royal Arch Freemason,
>>> as is his paedophile friend Brother David Payne.
>>>
>>> Got it?
>>
>> You know one day their lawyers may just come after you.
>
>Brother Gerald Patrick McCann is a Royal Arch Freemason, as is his
>paedophile friend Brother David Payne.
>
>Clear?
It's clear you're full of crap, yep.
<inv...@invalid.invalid.net> wrote:
>Theodore <noe...@noemail.com> wrote in
>news:fise77pst1c1lnq7d...@4ax.com:
>
>>> Brother Gerald Patrick McCann is a Royal Arch Freemason,
>>> as is his paedophile friend Brother David Payne.
>>>
>>> Got it?
>>
>> You know one day their lawyers may just come after you.
>
>Brother Gerald Patrick McCann is a Royal Arch Freemason, as is his
>paedophile friend Brother David Payne.
>
>Clear?
Just zis Guy, you know?
Sep 19, 2011, 3:26:14 PM9/19/11
to
challenged robustly.
francis
Sep 19, 2011, 5:12:41 PM9/19/11
to
On Sep 19, 4:29 pm, Pilotiin <inva...@invalid.invalid.net> wrote:
In a word, no, as you have provided the same amount of proof that you
always provide, none.
always provide, none.
francis
Sep 19, 2011, 5:13:41 PM9/19/11
to
On Sep 19, 5:49 pm, Theodore <noem...@noemail.com> wrote:
> On Mon, 19 Sep 2011 15:29:14 +0000 (UTC), Pilotiin
>
> <inva...@invalid.invalid.net> wrote:
> On Mon, 19 Sep 2011 15:29:14 +0000 (UTC), Pilotiin
>
> >francis <francis.mall...@yahoo.com> wrote in
> >news:752545fd-ca74-41db...@d2g2000vbk.googlegroups.com:
>
> >>> Brother Gerald Patrick McCann is a Royal Arch Freemason, as is his
> >>> paedophile friend Brother David Payne.
>
> >> You have proof of this, please provide it.
>
> >Brother Gerald Patrick McCann is a Royal Arch Freemason, as is his
> >paedophile friend Brother David Payne.
>
> >Got it?
>
> You know one day their lawyers may just come after you.
Pilotiin will be able to say that the lawyers are also Masons.
>
> >>> Brother Gerald Patrick McCann is a Royal Arch Freemason, as is his
> >>> paedophile friend Brother David Payne.
>
> >> You have proof of this, please provide it.
>
> >Brother Gerald Patrick McCann is a Royal Arch Freemason, as is his
> >paedophile friend Brother David Payne.
>
> >Got it?
>
> You know one day their lawyers may just come after you.
Tony Dragon
Sep 19, 2011, 5:16:13 PM9/19/11
to
On 19/09/2011 20:12, Pilotiin wrote:
> "Phi"<phi...@inbox.com> wrote in
> news:3OWdneLDMrkf6erT...@bt.com:
>
>>> You know one day their lawyers may just come after you.
>>
>> That might expose too much information.
>
> Brother Jeffrey Howard Archer managed it :)
>
Would that be David Browns brother?
> "Phi"<phi...@inbox.com> wrote in
> news:3OWdneLDMrkf6erT...@bt.com:
>
>>> You know one day their lawyers may just come after you.
>>
>> That might expose too much information.
>
> Brother Jeffrey Howard Archer managed it :)
>
Pilotiin
Sep 20, 2011, 3:42:49 AM9/20/11
to
francis <francis...@yahoo.com> wrote in news:af991192-1622-41e9-920e-
3c2762...@l4g2000vbv.googlegroups.com:
> Pilotiin will be able to say that
> the lawyers are also Masons.
Brother Rod Dadak is a Freemason who derives his income through
Freemasonry.
3c2762...@l4g2000vbv.googlegroups.com:
> Pilotiin will be able to say that
> the lawyers are also Masons.
Freemasonry.
Pilotiin
Sep 20, 2011, 3:48:53 AM9/20/11
to
francis <francis...@yahoo.com> wrote in
news:4ef46766-4916-489c...@et6g2000vbb.googlegroups.com:
news:4ef46766-4916-489c...@et6g2000vbb.googlegroups.com:
>> >> Brother Gerald Patrick McCann is a Royal Arch Freemason,
>> >> as is his paedophile friend Brother David Payne.
>> Brother Gerald Patrick McCann is a Royal Arch Freemason,
>> as is his paedophile friend Brother David Payne.
>>
>> Got it?
> In a word, no, as you have provided the same amount
> of proof that you always provide, none.
Let's try again:
Brother Gerald Patrick McCann is a Royal Arch Freemason, as is his
paedophile friend Brother David Payne.
All Freemasons are equal: that means Brother Keith Philip Exford is no
better than Brother Anders Behring Breivik and Worshipful Master Kenneth
Noye.
Were you lying when you told us you could prove that Jahbulon is not the
holy god of Royal Arch Freemasons?
francis
Sep 20, 2011, 5:02:02 AM9/20/11
to
On Sep 20, 8:42 am, Pilotiin <inva...@invalid.invalid.net> wrote:
> francis <francis.mall...@yahoo.com> wrote in news:af991192-1622-41e9-920e-
> 3c27627ba...@l4g2000vbv.googlegroups.com:
> francis <francis.mall...@yahoo.com> wrote in news:af991192-1622-41e9-920e-
> 3c27627ba...@l4g2000vbv.googlegroups.com:
>
> > Pilotiin will be able to say that
> > the lawyers are also Masons.
>
> Brother Rod Dadak is a Freemason who derives his income through
> Freemasonry.
>
> --
>
> Praise be to Jahbulon, holy god of Royal Arch Freemasons
>
> http://www.freemasonrywatch.org/jahbulon.html
I know that I am asking a lot, but could you produce proof of that?
> > Pilotiin will be able to say that
> > the lawyers are also Masons.
>
> Brother Rod Dadak is a Freemason who derives his income through
> Freemasonry.
>
> --
>
> Praise be to Jahbulon, holy god of Royal Arch Freemasons
>
> http://www.freemasonrywatch.org/jahbulon.html
francis
Sep 20, 2011, 5:03:52 AM9/20/11
to
On Sep 20, 8:48 am, Pilotiin <inva...@invalid.invalid.net> wrote:
Congratulations, two points that you can't/won/t prove & and one
question that you have had the answer for many times.
question that you have had the answer for many times.
Pilotiin
Sep 20, 2011, 6:38:14 AM9/20/11
to
francis <francis...@yahoo.com> wrote in
news:accf6124-0449-490e...@l7g2000vbz.googlegroups.com:
> I know that I am asking a lot,
> but could you produce proof of that?
http://tinyurl.com/3qscvcj
Point is, if you ever bother to answer the question, you'll be giving me an
idea of what you mean by proof: hitherto I am left to wonder.
--
Praise be to Jahbulon, holy god of Royal Arch Freemasons
http://www.freemasonrywatch.org/jahbulon.html
--- Posted via news://freenews.netfront.net/ - Complaints to ne...@netfront.net ---
news:accf6124-0449-490e...@l7g2000vbz.googlegroups.com:
> I know that I am asking a lot,
> but could you produce proof of that?
Were you lying when you told us you could prove that Jahbulon is not the
holy god of Royal Arch Freemasons?
http://tinyurl.com/3qscvcj
Point is, if you ever bother to answer the question, you'll be giving me an
idea of what you mean by proof: hitherto I am left to wonder.
--
Praise be to Jahbulon, holy god of Royal Arch Freemasons
http://www.freemasonrywatch.org/jahbulon.html
Pilotiin
Sep 20, 2011, 6:48:58 AM9/20/11
to
francis <francis...@yahoo.com> wrote in
news:c52ad56c-b87d-43ae...@dq7g2000vbb.googlegroups.com:
> Congratulations, two points that you can't/won/t prove & and
> one question that you have had the answer for many times.
Anyway, you'll be pleased to hear that Freemason Brother Elliot Morley, who
was sent to prison for stealing money from the British government, has used
his Freemason contacts to get released from prison today.
Freemason politicians also recently sent to prison for defrauding the
British state, include Brother David Chaytor, Brother Eric Illsley, Brother
Jim Devine and Brother Lord Hanningfield (aka Brother Paul Edward Winston
White), all of whom were set free after serving only one quarter of their
prison terms, owing to using their Freemason contacts to get released.
Lord Hanningfield (Brother Paul Edward Winston White) has recently been
arrested again, this time for defrauding Essex County Council.
news:c52ad56c-b87d-43ae...@dq7g2000vbb.googlegroups.com:
> Congratulations, two points that you can't/won/t prove & and
> one question that you have had the answer for many times.
was sent to prison for stealing money from the British government, has used
his Freemason contacts to get released from prison today.
Freemason politicians also recently sent to prison for defrauding the
British state, include Brother David Chaytor, Brother Eric Illsley, Brother
Jim Devine and Brother Lord Hanningfield (aka Brother Paul Edward Winston
White), all of whom were set free after serving only one quarter of their
prison terms, owing to using their Freemason contacts to get released.
Lord Hanningfield (Brother Paul Edward Winston White) has recently been
arrested again, this time for defrauding Essex County Council.
francis
Sep 20, 2011, 8:04:31 AM9/20/11
to
On Sep 20, 11:38 am, Pilotiin <inva...@invalid.invalid.net> wrote:
> --- Posted via news://freenews.netfront.net/ - Complaints to n...@netfront.net ---
I am so sorry that you are not able to understand answers given to
you, but I can understand why, as the concept of answering question is
something that you have not yet grasped.
I am sure that you could look up what proof means, allthough I am sure
that it would make no difference to you.
To make it easy just provide complete proof that Mr Exford is/was a
Mason.
Just one person who you have stated is a Mason many times, I don't
mean reference to a usenet post, I mean the sort of proof that would
stand up in law.
You should not find it dificult if such proof exists.
I am so sorry that you are not able to understand answers given to
you, but I can understand why, as the concept of answering question is
something that you have not yet grasped.
I am sure that you could look up what proof means, allthough I am sure
that it would make no difference to you.
To make it easy just provide complete proof that Mr Exford is/was a
Mason.
Just one person who you have stated is a Mason many times, I don't
mean reference to a usenet post, I mean the sort of proof that would
stand up in law.
You should not find it dificult if such proof exists.
Pilotiin
Sep 20, 2011, 10:05:03 AM9/20/11
to
francis <francis...@yahoo.com> wrote in
news:29e38393-97df-4655...@f8g2000yqf.googlegroups.com:
news:29e38393-97df-4655...@f8g2000yqf.googlegroups.com:
> I am so sorry that you are not able to understand answers
> given to you, but I can understand why, as the concept of
> answering question is something that you have not yet grasped.
Were you lying when you told us you could prove that Jahbulon is not
the holy god of Royal Arch Freemasons?
> To make it easy just provide complete proof
> that Mr Exford is/was a Mason.
Why can't you ask Brother Keith Philip Exford to confirm that he is a
Freemason and that he owes every penny of his personal wealth, not to his
own efforts, but to the fraud Freemasonry?
francis
Sep 20, 2011, 11:39:02 AM9/20/11
to
On Sep 20, 3:05 pm, Pilotiin <inva...@invalid.invalid.net> wrote:
that question again.
> > To make it easy just provide complete proof
> > that Mr Exford is/was a Mason.
>
> Why can't you ask Brother Keith Philip Exford to confirm that he is a
> Freemason and that he owes every penny of his personal wealth, not to his
> own efforts, but to the fraud Freemasonry?
>
You made the claim, you back it up.
> francis <francis.mall...@yahoo.com> wrote innews:29e38393-97df-4655...@f8g2000yqf.googlegroups.com:
>
> > I am so sorry that you are not able to understand answers
> > given to you, but I can understand why, as the concept of
> > answering question is something that you have not yet grasped.
>
> Were you lying when you told us you could prove that Jahbulon is not
> the holy god of Royal Arch Freemasons?
>
> http://tinyurl.com/3qscvcj
>
Tut tut, you know this has been answered before, so I will not answer
>
> > I am so sorry that you are not able to understand answers
> > given to you, but I can understand why, as the concept of
> > answering question is something that you have not yet grasped.
>
> Were you lying when you told us you could prove that Jahbulon is not
> the holy god of Royal Arch Freemasons?
>
> http://tinyurl.com/3qscvcj
>
that question again.
> > To make it easy just provide complete proof
> > that Mr Exford is/was a Mason.
>
> Why can't you ask Brother Keith Philip Exford to confirm that he is a
> Freemason and that he owes every penny of his personal wealth, not to his
> own efforts, but to the fraud Freemasonry?
>
francis
Sep 20, 2011, 11:41:04 AM9/20/11
to
On Sep 20, 11:48 am, Pilotiin <inva...@invalid.invaljd.net> wrote:
people are not Masons (unless you can prove otherwise)
> francis <francis.mall...@yahoo.com> wrote innews:c52ad56c-b87d-43ae...@dq7g2000vbb.googlegroups.com:
>
> > Congratulations, two points that you can't/won/t prove & and
> > one question that you have had the answer for many times.
>
> Anyway, you'll be pleased to hear that Freemason Brother Elliot Morley, who
> was sent to prison for stealing money from the British government, has used
> his Freemason contacts to get released from prison today.
>
> Freemason politicians also recently sent to prison for defrauding the
> British state, include Brother David Chaytor, Brother Eric Illsley, Brother
> Jim Devine and Brother Lord Hanningfield (aka Brother Paul Edward Winston
> White), all of whom were set free after serving only one quarter of their
> prison terms, owing to using their Freemason contacts to get released.
>
> Lord Hanningfield (Brother Paul Edward Winston White) has recently been
> arrested again, this time for defrauding Essex County Council.
>
> Were you lying when you told us you could prove that Jahbulon is not the
> holy god of Royal Arch Freemasons?
>
> http://tinyurl.com/3qscvcj
>
Yet again you just use the words 'freemason brother' even though those
>
> > Congratulations, two points that you can't/won/t prove & and
> > one question that you have had the answer for many times.
>
> Anyway, you'll be pleased to hear that Freemason Brother Elliot Morley, who
> was sent to prison for stealing money from the British government, has used
> his Freemason contacts to get released from prison today.
>
> Freemason politicians also recently sent to prison for defrauding the
> British state, include Brother David Chaytor, Brother Eric Illsley, Brother
> Jim Devine and Brother Lord Hanningfield (aka Brother Paul Edward Winston
> White), all of whom were set free after serving only one quarter of their
> prison terms, owing to using their Freemason contacts to get released.
>
> Lord Hanningfield (Brother Paul Edward Winston White) has recently been
> arrested again, this time for defrauding Essex County Council.
>
> Were you lying when you told us you could prove that Jahbulon is not the
> holy god of Royal Arch Freemasons?
>
> http://tinyurl.com/3qscvcj
>
people are not Masons (unless you can prove otherwise)
Pilotiin
Sep 20, 2011, 11:44:38 AM9/20/11
to
francis <francis...@yahoo.com> wrote in
news:74bd73e0-5c88-4bc5...@fe21g2000vbb.googlegroups.com:
Were you lying when you told us you could prove that Jahbulon is not
the holy god of Royal Arch Freemasons?
http://tinyurl.com/3qscvcj
Why can't you answer, and let us all know what you mean by proof?
> You made the claim, you back it up.
Why do tenants of the Freemason Brother Keith Exford run Affinity Sutton
Homes Group complain of having their access to state benefits, legal
services and medicine blocked if they have a dispute with their landlord?
news:74bd73e0-5c88-4bc5...@fe21g2000vbb.googlegroups.com:
Were you lying when you told us you could prove that Jahbulon is not
the holy god of Royal Arch Freemasons?
http://tinyurl.com/3qscvcj
> You made the claim, you back it up.
Homes Group complain of having their access to state benefits, legal
services and medicine blocked if they have a dispute with their landlord?
Pilotiin
Sep 20, 2011, 12:36:01 PM9/20/11
to
francis <francis...@yahoo.com> wrote in
news:2a64a892-8d7a-427b...@i2g2000yqm.googlegroups.com:
> Yet again you just use the words 'freemason brother' even though
> those people are not Masons (unless you can prove otherwise)
You seem to have problems with the word proof: these people are Freemasons
regardless of what I can prove.
Were you lying when you told us you could prove that Jahbulon is not the
holy god of Royal Arch Freemasons?
http://tinyurl.com/3qscvcj
news:2a64a892-8d7a-427b...@i2g2000yqm.googlegroups.com:
> Yet again you just use the words 'freemason brother' even though
> those people are not Masons (unless you can prove otherwise)
regardless of what I can prove.
Were you lying when you told us you could prove that Jahbulon is not the
holy god of Royal Arch Freemasons?
http://tinyurl.com/3qscvcj
--
Praise be to Jahbulon, holy god of Royal Arch Freemasons
http://www.freemasonrywatch.org/jahbulon.html
--- Posted via news://freenews.netfront.net/ - Complaints to ne...@netfront.net ---
Praise be to Jahbulon, holy god of Royal Arch Freemasons
http://www.freemasonrywatch.org/jahbulon.html
Tony Dragon
Sep 20, 2011, 1:28:36 PM9/20/11
to
On 20/09/2011 16:44, Pilotiin wrote:
> francis<francis...@yahoo.com> wrote in
> news:74bd73e0-5c88-4bc5...@fe21g2000vbb.googlegroups.com:
>
> Were you lying when you told us you could prove that Jahbulon is not
> the holy god of Royal Arch Freemasons?
>
> http://tinyurl.com/3qscvcj
>
> Why can't you answer, and let us all know what you mean by proof?
>
>> You made the claim, you back it up.
>
> Why do tenants of the Freemason Brother Keith Exford run Affinity Sutton
> Homes Group complain of having their access to state benefits, legal
> services and medicine blocked if they have a dispute with their landlord?
>
Now that is an interesting statement, could you explain further on what
> francis<francis...@yahoo.com> wrote in
> news:74bd73e0-5c88-4bc5...@fe21g2000vbb.googlegroups.com:
>
> Were you lying when you told us you could prove that Jahbulon is not
> the holy god of Royal Arch Freemasons?
>
> http://tinyurl.com/3qscvcj
>
> Why can't you answer, and let us all know what you mean by proof?
>
>> You made the claim, you back it up.
>
> Why do tenants of the Freemason Brother Keith Exford run Affinity Sutton
> Homes Group complain of having their access to state benefits, legal
> services and medicine blocked if they have a dispute with their landlord?
>
happened?
Tony Dragon
Sep 20, 2011, 1:31:01 PM9/20/11
to
On 20/09/2011 17:36, Pilotiin wrote:
> francis<francis...@yahoo.com> wrote in
> news:2a64a892-8d7a-427b...@i2g2000yqm.googlegroups.com:
>
>> Yet again you just use the words 'freemason brother' even though
>> those people are not Masons (unless you can prove otherwise)
>
> You seem to have problems with the word proof: these people are Freemasons
> regardless of what I can prove.
You say they are Masons, how do you know this?
> francis<francis...@yahoo.com> wrote in
> news:2a64a892-8d7a-427b...@i2g2000yqm.googlegroups.com:
>
>> Yet again you just use the words 'freemason brother' even though
>> those people are not Masons (unless you can prove otherwise)
>
> You seem to have problems with the word proof: these people are Freemasons
> regardless of what I can prove.
Just saying they are is hardly enough, nor is saying they are evil so
they must be Masons.
>
> Were you lying when you told us you could prove that Jahbulon is not the
> holy god of Royal Arch Freemasons?
>
> http://tinyurl.com/3qscvcj
>
Theodore
Sep 20, 2011, 1:34:22 PM9/20/11
to
On Tue, 20 Sep 2011 16:36:01 +0000 (UTC), Pilotiin
<inv...@invalid.invalid.net> wrote:
>francis <francis...@yahoo.com> wrote in
>news:2a64a892-8d7a-427b...@i2g2000yqm.googlegroups.com:
>
>> Yet again you just use the words 'freemason brother' even though
>> those people are not Masons (unless you can prove otherwise)
>
>You seem to have problems with the word proof: these people are Freemasons
>regardless of what I can prove.
No, you haven't provided any and never do. They are therefore not
<inv...@invalid.invalid.net> wrote:
>francis <francis...@yahoo.com> wrote in
>news:2a64a892-8d7a-427b...@i2g2000yqm.googlegroups.com:
>
>> Yet again you just use the words 'freemason brother' even though
>> those people are not Masons (unless you can prove otherwise)
>
>You seem to have problems with the word proof: these people are Freemasons
>regardless of what I can prove.
Freemasons.
The Todal
Sep 20, 2011, 1:52:15 PM9/20/11
to
deranged mind, and it would be preferable to direct it away from usenet and
towards a therapy group.
sutartsorric
Sep 20, 2011, 2:22:03 PM9/20/11
to
On Sep 20, 6:34 pm, Theodore <noem...@noemail.com> wrote:
> On Tue, 20 Sep 2011 16:36:01 +0000 (UTC), Pilotiin
>
> <inva...@invalid.invalid.net> wrote:
> On Tue, 20 Sep 2011 16:36:01 +0000 (UTC), Pilotiin
>
> >francis <francis.mall...@yahoo.com> wrote in
> >news:2a64a892-8d7a-427b...@i2g2000yqm.googlegroups.com:
>
> >> Yet again you just use the words 'freemason brother' even though
> >> those people are not Masons (unless you can prove otherwise)
>
> >You seem to have problems with the word proof: these people are Freemasons
> >regardless of what I can prove.
>
> No, you haven't provided any and never do. They are therefore not
> Freemasons.
Are you serious? No one is a Freemason unless non-Masons can prove it?
>
> >> Yet again you just use the words 'freemason brother' even though
> >> those people are not Masons (unless you can prove otherwise)
>
> >You seem to have problems with the word proof: these people are Freemasons
> >regardless of what I can prove.
>
> No, you haven't provided any and never do. They are therefore not
> Freemasons.
Sounds like a serious case of paranoia to me.
Why would we need to prove it anyway, because it is blindingly obvious
to most people.
I bet you ask all your lady friends to prove they are women, that is
assuming you have friends.
Tony Dragon
Sep 20, 2011, 2:30:38 PM9/20/11
to
Pilotiin
Sep 20, 2011, 3:38:00 PM9/20/11
to
Theodore <noe...@noemail.com> wrote in
news:rjjh77hrohjmfo79a...@4ax.com:
>>> Yet again you just use the words 'freemason brother' even though
>>> those people are not Masons (unless you can prove otherwise)
>>
>> You seem to have problems with the word proof: these
>> people are Freemasons regardless of what I can prove.
>
> No, you haven't provided any and never do.
> They are therefore not Freemasons.
What I may or may not be able to prove makes no difference to their status
within Freemasonry.
news:rjjh77hrohjmfo79a...@4ax.com:
>>> Yet again you just use the words 'freemason brother' even though
>>> those people are not Masons (unless you can prove otherwise)
>>
>> You seem to have problems with the word proof: these
>> people are Freemasons regardless of what I can prove.
>
> No, you haven't provided any and never do.
> They are therefore not Freemasons.
within Freemasonry.
Pilotiin
Sep 20, 2011, 3:41:06 PM9/20/11
to
sutartsorric <sutart...@googlemail.com> wrote in news:fe0298f6-ced1-
4fb4-a996-3...@m5g2000vbm.googlegroups.com:
> I bet you ask all your lady friends to prove
> they are women, that is assuming you have friends.
Freemasons prefer young girls: for example, paedophile Brother David Payne
and the late Madeleine McCann (age 3).
4fb4-a996-3...@m5g2000vbm.googlegroups.com:
> I bet you ask all your lady friends to prove
> they are women, that is assuming you have friends.
and the late Madeleine McCann (age 3).
francis
Sep 21, 2011, 4:56:38 AM9/21/11
to
On Sep 20, 8:38 pm, Pilotiin <inva...@invalid.invalid.net> wrote:
> Theodore <noem...@noemail.com> wrote innews:rjjh77hrohjmfo79a...@4ax.com:
As they are not Masons, they will have no status within Freemasonry.
> Theodore <noem...@noemail.com> wrote innews:rjjh77hrohjmfo79a...@4ax.com:
francis
Sep 21, 2011, 5:00:11 AM9/21/11
to
On Sep 20, 7:22 pm, sutartsorric <sutartsor...@googlemail.com> wrote:
> On Sep 20, 6:34 pm, Theodore <noem...@noemail.com> wrote:
>
> > On Tue, 20 Sep 2011 16:36:01 +0000 (UTC), Pilotiin
>
> > <inva...@invalid.invalid.net> wrote:
> > >francis <francis.mall...@yahoo.com> wrote in
> > >news:2a64a892-8d7a-427b...@i2g2000yqm.googlegroups.com:
>
> > >> Yet again you just use the words 'freemason brother' even though
> > >> those people are not Masons (unless you can prove otherwise)
>
> > >You seem to have problems with the word proof: these people are Freemasons
> > >regardless of what I can prove.
>
> > No, you haven't provided any and never do. They are therefore not
> > Freemasons.
>
> Are you serious? No one is a Freemason unless non-Masons can prove it?
>
More a case of, if someone says somebody is a Mason, they should be
> On Sep 20, 6:34 pm, Theodore <noem...@noemail.com> wrote:
>
> > On Tue, 20 Sep 2011 16:36:01 +0000 (UTC), Pilotiin
>
> > <inva...@invalid.invalid.net> wrote:
> > >francis <francis.mall...@yahoo.com> wrote in
> > >news:2a64a892-8d7a-427b...@i2g2000yqm.googlegroups.com:
>
> > >> Yet again you just use the words 'freemason brother' even though
> > >> those people are not Masons (unless you can prove otherwise)
>
> > >You seem to have problems with the word proof: these people are Freemasons
> > >regardless of what I can prove.
>
> > No, you haven't provided any and never do. They are therefore not
> > Freemasons.
>
> Are you serious? No one is a Freemason unless non-Masons can prove it?
>
able to back up their laim.
> Sounds like a serious case of paranoia to me.
>
> Why would we need to prove it anyway, because it is blindingly obvious
> to most people.
idiot.
>
> I bet you ask all your lady friends to prove they are women, that is
> assuming you have friends.
francis
Sep 21, 2011, 5:01:14 AM9/21/11
to
On Sep 20, 8:41 pm, Pilotiin <inva...@invalid.invalid.net> wrote:
> sutartsorric <sutartsor...@googlemail.com> wrote in news:fe0298f6-ced1-
> 4fb4-a996-3916674f9...@m5g2000vbm.googlegroups.com:
& no truth.
> sutartsorric <sutartsor...@googlemail.com> wrote in news:fe0298f6-ced1-
> 4fb4-a996-3916674f9...@m5g2000vbm.googlegroups.com:
>
> > I bet you ask all your lady friends to prove
> > they are women, that is assuming you have friends.
>
> Freemasons prefer young girls: for example, paedophile Brother David Payne
> and the late Madeleine McCann (age 3).
>
> --
>
> Praise be to Jahbulon, holy god of Royal Arch Freemasons
>
> http://www.freemasonrywatch.org/jahbulon.html
Again a claim that has no status
> > I bet you ask all your lady friends to prove
> > they are women, that is assuming you have friends.
>
> Freemasons prefer young girls: for example, paedophile Brother David Payne
> and the late Madeleine McCann (age 3).
>
> --
>
> Praise be to Jahbulon, holy god of Royal Arch Freemasons
>
> http://www.freemasonrywatch.org/jahbulon.html
& no truth.
sutartsorric
Sep 21, 2011, 5:23:48 AM9/21/11
to
"On the 16th of May 2007, two doctor friends of the McCanns, and the
Paynes, make a statement to Leicestershire Police (LP) in which they
express their concern over sexually suggestive gestures made by David
Payne on a previous holiday in Majorca. These alleged gestures are
considered, by one of the witnesses, to be consistent with acts of
paedophilia."
http://www.mccannfiles.com/id236.html
Pilotiin
Sep 21, 2011, 6:22:31 AM9/21/11
to
francis <francis...@yahoo.com> wrote in
news:bdba9e9b-1527-478e...@et6g2000vbb.googlegroups.com:
news:bdba9e9b-1527-478e...@et6g2000vbb.googlegroups.com:
> More a case of, if someone says somebody is a Mason,
> they should be able to back up their laim.
Back-up the claim (as you say), or prove the claim (as you also say)?
Pilotiin
Sep 21, 2011, 6:23:57 AM9/21/11
to
francis <francis...@yahoo.com> wrote in
news:c7bfeaf6-bd88-43a4...@f41g2000yqh.googlegroups.com:
> As they are not Masons,
> they will have no status within Freemasonry.
ISTR Freemasonry assigns a zero degree status to its victims.
--
Praise be to Jahbulon, holy god of Royal Arch Freemasons
http://www.freemasonrywatch.org/jahbulon.html
news:c7bfeaf6-bd88-43a4...@f41g2000yqh.googlegroups.com:
> As they are not Masons,
> they will have no status within Freemasonry.
--
Praise be to Jahbulon, holy god of Royal Arch Freemasons
http://www.freemasonrywatch.org/jahbulon.html
francis
Sep 21, 2011, 8:03:23 AM9/21/11
to
On Sep 21, 11:22 am, Pilotiin <inva...@invalid.invalid.net> wrote:
> francis <francis.mall...@yahoo.com> wrote innews:bdba9e9b-1527-478e...@et6g2000vbb.googlegroups.com:
>
> > More a case of, if someone says somebody is a Mason,
> > they should be able to back up their laim.
>
> Back-up the claim (as you say), or prove the claim (as you also say)?
>
> --
>
> Praise be to Jahbulon, holy god of Royal Arch Freemasons
>
> http://www.freemasonrywatch.org/jahbulon.html
Try doing both, (waits for the wriggle).
>
> > More a case of, if someone says somebody is a Mason,
> > they should be able to back up their laim.
>
> Back-up the claim (as you say), or prove the claim (as you also say)?
>
> --
>
> Praise be to Jahbulon, holy god of Royal Arch Freemasons
>
> http://www.freemasonrywatch.org/jahbulon.html
francis
Sep 21, 2011, 8:02:27 AM9/21/11
to
>
> - Show quoted text -
Not wrong the post was about Brother David Payne, does such a person
exist, I think not.
sutartsorric
Sep 21, 2011, 8:32:38 AM9/21/11
to
>
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> Not wrong the post was about Brother David Payne, does such a person
> exist, I think not.
And you have the nerve to accuse others of wriggling?
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> Not wrong the post was about Brother David Payne, does such a person
> exist, I think not.
Theodore
Sep 21, 2011, 9:47:07 AM9/21/11
to
now...
sutartsorric
Sep 21, 2011, 10:25:50 AM9/21/11
to
On Sep 21, 2:47 pm, Theodore <noem...@noemail.com> wrote:
> On Wed, 21 Sep 2011 05:32:38 -0700 (PDT), sutartsorric
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Wed, 21 Sep 2011 05:32:38 -0700 (PDT), sutartsorric
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> <sutartsor...@googlemail.com> wrote:
> >On Sep 21, 1:02 pm, francis <francis.mall...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >> On Sep 21, 10:23 am, sutartsorric <sutartsor...@googlemail.com> wrote:
>
> >> > On Sep 21, 10:01 am, francis <francis.mall...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> >> > > On Sep 20, 8:41 pm, Pilotiin <inva...@invalid.invalid.net> wrote:
>
> >> > > > sutartsorric <sutartsor...@googlemail.com> wrote in news:fe0298f6-ced1-
> >> > > > 4fb4-a996-3916674f9...@m5g2000vbm.googlegroups.com:
>
> >> > > > > I bet you ask all your lady friends to prove
> >> > > > > they are women, that is assuming you have friends.
>
> >> > > > Freemasons prefer young girls: for example, paedophile Brother David Payne
> >> > > > and the late Madeleine McCann (age 3).
>
> >> > > > --
>
> >> > > > Praise be to Jahbulon, holy god of Royal Arch Freemasons
>
> >> > > >http://www.freemasonrywatch.org/jahbulon.html
>
> >> > > Again a claim that has no status
> >> > > & no truth.
>
> >> > Wrong yet again
>
> >> > "On the 16th of May 2007, two doctor friends of the McCanns, and the
> >> > Paynes, make a statement to Leicestershire Police (LP) in which they
> >> > express their concern over sexually suggestive gestures made by David
> >> > Payne on a previous holiday in Majorca. These alleged gestures are
> >> > considered, by one of the witnesses, to be consistent with acts of
> >> > paedophilia."
>
> >> >http://www.mccannfiles.com/id236.html-Hidequoted text -
> >On Sep 21, 1:02 pm, francis <francis.mall...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >> On Sep 21, 10:23 am, sutartsorric <sutartsor...@googlemail.com> wrote:
>
> >> > On Sep 21, 10:01 am, francis <francis.mall...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> >> > > On Sep 20, 8:41 pm, Pilotiin <inva...@invalid.invalid.net> wrote:
>
> >> > > > sutartsorric <sutartsor...@googlemail.com> wrote in news:fe0298f6-ced1-
> >> > > > 4fb4-a996-3916674f9...@m5g2000vbm.googlegroups.com:
>
> >> > > > > I bet you ask all your lady friends to prove
> >> > > > > they are women, that is assuming you have friends.
>
> >> > > > Freemasons prefer young girls: for example, paedophile Brother David Payne
> >> > > > and the late Madeleine McCann (age 3).
>
> >> > > > --
>
> >> > > > Praise be to Jahbulon, holy god of Royal Arch Freemasons
>
> >> > > >http://www.freemasonrywatch.org/jahbulon.html
>
> >> > > Again a claim that has no status
> >> > > & no truth.
>
> >> > Wrong yet again
>
> >> > "On the 16th of May 2007, two doctor friends of the McCanns, and the
> >> > Paynes, make a statement to Leicestershire Police (LP) in which they
> >> > express their concern over sexually suggestive gestures made by David
> >> > Payne on a previous holiday in Majorca. These alleged gestures are
> >> > considered, by one of the witnesses, to be consistent with acts of
> >> > paedophilia."
>
>
> >> > - Show quoted text -
>
> >> Not wrong the post was about Brother David Payne, does such a person
> >> exist, I think not.
>
> >And you have the nerve to accuse others of wriggling?
>
> You're the one ignoring the issue. No Freemasons here, move along
> now...
Wow, four times for one post and not even in the right time order. I
> >> > - Show quoted text -
>
> >> Not wrong the post was about Brother David Payne, does such a person
> >> exist, I think not.
>
> >And you have the nerve to accuse others of wriggling?
>
> You're the one ignoring the issue. No Freemasons here, move along
> now...
have never been so honoured before.
francis
Sep 21, 2011, 11:07:54 AM9/21/11
to
On Sep 21, 2:47 pm, Theodore <noem...@noemail.com> wrote:
> On Wed, 21 Sep 2011 05:32:38 -0700 (PDT), sutartsorric
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> <sutartsor...@googlemail.com> wrote:
> >On Sep 21, 1:02 pm, francis <francis.mall...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >> On Sep 21, 10:23 am, sutartsorric <sutartsor...@googlemail.com> wrote:
>
> >> > On Sep 21, 10:01 am, francis <francis.mall...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> >> > > On Sep 20, 8:41 pm, Pilotiin <inva...@invalid.invalid.net> wrote:
>
> >> > > > sutartsorric <sutartsor...@googlemail.com> wrote in news:fe0298f6-ced1-
> >> > > > 4fb4-a996-3916674f9...@m5g2000vbm.googlegroups.com:
>
> >> > > > > I bet you ask all your lady friends to prove
> >> > > > > they are women, that is assuming you have friends.
>
> >> > > > Freemasons prefer young girls: for example, paedophile Brother David Payne
> >> > > > and the late Madeleine McCann (age 3).
>
> >> > > > --
>
> >> > > > Praise be to Jahbulon, holy god of Royal Arch Freemasons
>
> >> > > >http://www.freemasonrywatch.org/jahbulon.html
>
> >> > > Again a claim that has no status
> >> > > & no truth.
>
> >> > Wrong yet again
>
> >> > "On the 16th of May 2007, two doctor friends of the McCanns, and the
> >> > Paynes, make a statement to Leicestershire Police (LP) in which they
> >> > express their concern over sexually suggestive gestures made by David
> >> > Payne on a previous holiday in Majorca. These alleged gestures are
> >> > considered, by one of the witnesses, to be consistent with acts of
> >> > paedophilia."
>
> >> >http://www.mccannfiles.com/id236.html-Hidequoted text -
> >On Sep 21, 1:02 pm, francis <francis.mall...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >> On Sep 21, 10:23 am, sutartsorric <sutartsor...@googlemail.com> wrote:
>
> >> > On Sep 21, 10:01 am, francis <francis.mall...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> >> > > On Sep 20, 8:41 pm, Pilotiin <inva...@invalid.invalid.net> wrote:
>
> >> > > > sutartsorric <sutartsor...@googlemail.com> wrote in news:fe0298f6-ced1-
> >> > > > 4fb4-a996-3916674f9...@m5g2000vbm.googlegroups.com:
>
> >> > > > > I bet you ask all your lady friends to prove
> >> > > > > they are women, that is assuming you have friends.
>
> >> > > > Freemasons prefer young girls: for example, paedophile Brother David Payne
> >> > > > and the late Madeleine McCann (age 3).
>
> >> > > > --
>
> >> > > > Praise be to Jahbulon, holy god of Royal Arch Freemasons
>
> >> > > >http://www.freemasonrywatch.org/jahbulon.html
>
> >> > > Again a claim that has no status
> >> > > & no truth.
>
> >> > Wrong yet again
>
> >> > "On the 16th of May 2007, two doctor friends of the McCanns, and the
> >> > Paynes, make a statement to Leicestershire Police (LP) in which they
> >> > express their concern over sexually suggestive gestures made by David
> >> > Payne on a previous holiday in Majorca. These alleged gestures are
> >> > considered, by one of the witnesses, to be consistent with acts of
> >> > paedophilia."
>
>
> >> > - Show quoted text -
>
> >> Not wrong the post was about Brother David Payne, does such a person
> >> exist, I think not.
>
> >And you have the nerve to accuse others of wriggling?
>
> You're the one ignoring the issue. No Freemasons here, move along
> now...- Hide quoted text -
> >> > - Show quoted text -
>
> >> Not wrong the post was about Brother David Payne, does such a person
> >> exist, I think not.
>
> >And you have the nerve to accuse others of wriggling?
>
> You're the one ignoring the issue. No Freemasons here, move along
>
> - Show quoted text -
I think the concept of posting something that can be backed up is
> - Show quoted text -
alien to him.
Pilotiin
Sep 21, 2011, 12:45:48 PM9/21/11
to
francis <francis...@yahoo.com> wrote in
news:5479b6ab-bde7-440d...@i21g2000yqk.googlegroups.com:
> Not wrong the post was about Brother David Payne,
> does such a person exist, I think not.
Yes.
In fairness to Kate and Freemason Brother Gerry McCann, if Madeleine is
hiding in a libel court, they're bound to find her.
--
Praise be to Jahbulon, holy god of Royal Arch Freemasons
http://www.freemasonrywatch.org/jahbulon.html
news:5479b6ab-bde7-440d...@i21g2000yqk.googlegroups.com:
> Not wrong the post was about Brother David Payne,
> does such a person exist, I think not.
In fairness to Kate and Freemason Brother Gerry McCann, if Madeleine is
hiding in a libel court, they're bound to find her.
--
Praise be to Jahbulon, holy god of Royal Arch Freemasons
http://www.freemasonrywatch.org/jahbulon.html
Pilotiin
Sep 21, 2011, 12:48:04 PM9/21/11
to
francis <francis...@yahoo.com> wrote in
news:c1132240-5d02-46e1...@n12g2000yqh.googlegroups.com:
> Try doing both, (waits for the wriggle).
http://tinyurl.com/3qscvcj
news:c1132240-5d02-46e1...@n12g2000yqh.googlegroups.com:
> Try doing both, (waits for the wriggle).
Were you lying when you told us you could prove that Jahbulon is not the
holy god of Royal Arch Freemasons?
http://tinyurl.com/3qscvcj
Tony Dragon
Sep 21, 2011, 1:26:03 PM9/21/11
to
On 21/09/2011 17:45, Pilotiin wrote:
> francis<francis...@yahoo.com> wrote in
> news:5479b6ab-bde7-440d...@i21g2000yqk.googlegroups.com:
>
>> Not wrong the post was about Brother David Payne,
>> does such a person exist, I think not.
>
> Yes.
>
> In fairness to Kate and Freemason Brother Gerry McCann, if Madeleine is
> hiding in a libel court, they're bound to find her.
>
Even by your standards, that makes no sense.
> francis<francis...@yahoo.com> wrote in
> news:5479b6ab-bde7-440d...@i21g2000yqk.googlegroups.com:
>
>> Not wrong the post was about Brother David Payne,
>> does such a person exist, I think not.
>
> Yes.
>
> In fairness to Kate and Freemason Brother Gerry McCann, if Madeleine is
> hiding in a libel court, they're bound to find her.
>
Tony Dragon
Sep 21, 2011, 1:27:03 PM9/21/11
to
On 21/09/2011 17:48, Pilotiin wrote:
> francis<francis...@yahoo.com> wrote in
> news:c1132240-5d02-46e1...@n12g2000yqh.googlegroups.com:
>
>> Try doing both, (waits for the wriggle).
>
> Were you lying when you told us you could prove that Jahbulon is not the
> holy god of Royal Arch Freemasons?
>
> http://tinyurl.com/3qscvcj
>
There you go, there is the wriggle.
> francis<francis...@yahoo.com> wrote in
> news:c1132240-5d02-46e1...@n12g2000yqh.googlegroups.com:
>
>> Try doing both, (waits for the wriggle).
>
> Were you lying when you told us you could prove that Jahbulon is not the
> holy god of Royal Arch Freemasons?
>
> http://tinyurl.com/3qscvcj
>
Tony Dragon
Sep 21, 2011, 1:27:43 PM9/21/11
to
On 21/09/2011 11:23, Pilotiin wrote:
> francis<francis...@yahoo.com> wrote in
> news:c7bfeaf6-bd88-43a4...@f41g2000yqh.googlegroups.com:
>
>> As they are not Masons,
>> they will have no status within Freemasonry.
>
> ISTR Freemasonry assigns a zero degree status to its victims.
>
What victims would that be?
> francis<francis...@yahoo.com> wrote in
> news:c7bfeaf6-bd88-43a4...@f41g2000yqh.googlegroups.com:
>
>> As they are not Masons,
>> they will have no status within Freemasonry.
>
> ISTR Freemasonry assigns a zero degree status to its victims.
>
sutartsorric
Sep 21, 2011, 1:37:35 PM9/21/11
to
On Sep 21, 6:27 pm, Tony Dragon <tony.dra...@btinternet.com> wrote:
> On 21/09/2011 11:23, Pilotiin wrote:
>
> > francis<francis.mall...@yahoo.com> wrote in
> On 21/09/2011 11:23, Pilotiin wrote:
>
> >news:c7bfeaf6-bd88-43a4...@f41g2000yqh.googlegroups.com:
>
> >> As they are not Masons,
> >> they will have no status within Freemasonry.
>
> > ISTR Freemasonry assigns a zero degree status to its victims.
>
> What victims would that be?
The innocent people who are the necessary collateral of masonic
>
> >> As they are not Masons,
> >> they will have no status within Freemasonry.
>
> > ISTR Freemasonry assigns a zero degree status to its victims.
>
> What victims would that be?
catastrophe.
Pilotiin
Sep 21, 2011, 4:39:52 PM9/21/11
to
Theodore <noe...@noemail.com> wrote in
news:mkqj77teioroo3dgm...@4ax.com:
> You're the one ignoring the issue.
> No Freemasons here, move along now...
Are you suggesting that Brother Gerry McCann and Brother David Payne being
Royal Arch Companions is a matter for shame?
news:mkqj77teioroo3dgm...@4ax.com:
> You're the one ignoring the issue.
> No Freemasons here, move along now...
Royal Arch Companions is a matter for shame?
Tony Dragon
Sep 21, 2011, 5:52:36 PM9/21/11
to
On 21/09/2011 21:39, Pilotiin wrote:
> Theodore<noe...@noemail.com> wrote in
> news:mkqj77teioroo3dgm...@4ax.com:
>
>> You're the one ignoring the issue.
>> No Freemasons here, move along now...
>
> Are you suggesting that Brother Gerry McCann and Brother David Payne being
> Royal Arch Companions is a matter for shame?
>
I'd be interested in how you came to that conclusion.
> Theodore<noe...@noemail.com> wrote in
> news:mkqj77teioroo3dgm...@4ax.com:
>
>> You're the one ignoring the issue.
>> No Freemasons here, move along now...
>
> Are you suggesting that Brother Gerry McCann and Brother David Payne being
> Royal Arch Companions is a matter for shame?
>
Is Gerry McCamm a Mason?
Is David Payne a Mason?
Is being a Royal Arch Companion a matter for shame.
Have you any proof for your claims (real & implied)
Are you a Mason?
Have you tried to be a Mason?
Are you a liar?
Are you capable of giving a answer to a question?
Will you reply to this post with your usual wriggle & non answers?
francis
Sep 22, 2011, 6:21:18 AM9/22/11
to
Pilotiin
Sep 22, 2011, 7:34:25 AM9/22/11
to
francis <francis...@yahoo.com> wrote in
news:53e0ac10-9977-4a71...@e8g2000vbc.googlegroups.com:
> I didn't reliase that there was one,
> can you expand on your statement.
Everyone who falls for the fraudulent Mormon religion, found Brother Joseph
Smith II, is a victim of Freemasonry.
news:53e0ac10-9977-4a71...@e8g2000vbc.googlegroups.com:
> I didn't reliase that there was one,
> can you expand on your statement.
Smith II, is a victim of Freemasonry.
francis
Sep 22, 2011, 7:50:54 AM9/22/11
to
On Sep 22, 12:34 pm, Pilotiin <inva...@invalid.invalid.net> wrote:
So Joseph Smith is the founder of the Masons.
Tony Dragon
Sep 22, 2011, 1:19:35 PM9/22/11
to
Are you one of them, I don't think I am.
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