Is there any legal difference between DVLC and DVLA ?
Nick
until you know the answer.
I have received a fixed penalty offer from Thames Valley Police for speeding
(35 in a 30, as I believe many are these days). Basically I can pay £60 to
take up this conditional offer or take it to court.
I have no problem with this, and given the odds, it's a fair cop.
The form that I must return with payment and my driving licence has two
boxes. I must tick one or other of these boxes, there are no other options.
First box: "I hold a valid GB licence issued by the DVLA in Swansea"
Second box: I hold a non GB driving licence.......
My driving licence was issued by DVLC (not DVLA) and is valid from May 1986
until June 202*.
I do not have a licence issued by the DVLA and I do not have a non GB
licence.
Thus I cannot honestly tick either box.
What's the answer please?
I'm not looking for an easy way out. I put my hands up to the alleged
offence.
Thanks,
Nick.
David McNeish
> What's the answer please?
No legal difference really, they're just different names for the
relevant part of the Department for Transport, depending on which era
you're talking about.
TTman
"Nick" <nick...@boom.co.uk> wrote in message
news:9bnhvn...@mid.individual.net...
presumably).
FYI DVLC became DVLA....
Ben Harris
>The form that I must return with payment and my driving licence has two
>boxes. I must tick one or other of these boxes, there are no other options.
>First box: "I hold a valid GB licence issued by the DVLA in Swansea"
>Second box: I hold a non GB driving licence.......
>
>My driving licence was issued by DVLC (not DVLA) and is valid from May 1986
>until June 202*.
>
>I do not have a licence issued by the DVLA and I do not have a non GB
>licence.
>Thus I cannot honestly tick either box.
>What's the answer please?
I think that DVLC was renamed to DVLA at some point, so they're the same
body. Being a government department, they're effectively just part of
the Crown anyway, and in law driving licences are granted by the
Secretary of State (which is defined to mean any of the principal
Secretaries of State). Usually, references to the current name of
something are taken to include references to it when it had other names,
so I think it would be correct to tick the DVLA box. If you're feeling
slightly awkward, you could amend "DVLA" to "DVLC" before doing so.
--
Ben Harris
Owain
> I think that DVLC was renamed to DVLA at some point, so they're the same
> body.
The DVLC became the DVLA in 1990
Owain
sid
or DVA if your licence was issued in NI.
BartC
news:9bnhvn...@mid.individual.net...
> I have received a fixed penalty offer from Thames Valley Police for
> speeding
> (35 in a 30, as I believe many are these days). Basically I can pay £60 to
> take up this conditional offer or take it to court.
> I have no problem with this, and given the odds, it's a fair cop.
(Many would disagree: because of the decimal system, using miles for
distances, and the decision for most speed limits to be multiples of ten,
the choice of speed limit can be quite arbitrary.
For example if an actual safe limit was deemed to be around 38mph, then the
choice would be between 30 or 40mph. To be safe, 30mph would have to be used
instead of a more appropriate 35mph (rounding to 5mph instead of 10).
You've possibly gotten a ticket for driving 3mph below the true safe limit!
In Europe the true limit would 61kph and the posted limit would be 60kph.
With 10kph (6mph) steps, their limits can, on the whole, more accurately
reflect actual conditions than ours.)
In reality, your offence is for not obeying the *posted* limits rather than
speeding dangerously (although it is possible the 30mph was just in this
case; we don't know).)
--
Bartc
Ben Harris
sid <bl...@blank.com> wrote:
>On 25/08/11 22:55, Ben Harris wrote:
>> In article<9bnhvn...@mid.individual.net>, Nick<nick...@boom.co.uk> wrote:
>>> The form that I must return with payment and my driving licence has two
>>> boxes. I must tick one or other of these boxes, there are no other options.
>>> First box: "I hold a valid GB licence issued by the DVLA in Swansea"
>>> Second box: I hold a non GB driving licence.......
>>>
>>> My driving licence was issued by DVLC (not DVLA) and is valid from May 1986
>>> until June 202*.
>>>
>>> I do not have a licence issued by the DVLA and I do not have a non GB
>>> licence.
>>> Thus I cannot honestly tick either box.
>>> What's the answer please?
>> so I think it would be correct to tick the DVLA box. If you're feeling
>> slightly awkward, you could amend "DVLA" to "DVLC" before doing so.
>
>or DVA if your licence was issued in NI.
Then you'd tick the "I hold a non GB driving licence", since Northern
Ireland is outside Great Britain. That's why the form says "GB" and not
"UK".
--
Ben Harris
Scion
That's what the OP said - he was done for speeding, i.e. exceeding the
speed limit, not dangerous driving.
Anyone who thinks that the speed limit designates the speed at which it is
safe to drive, needs to take driving lessons pronto.
BartC
news:Xns9F4D7F7943D...@88.198.244.100...
> BartC wrote:
>> In reality, your offence is for not obeying the *posted* limits rather
>> than speeding dangerously (although it is possible the 30mph was just
>> in this case; we don't know).)
>
>
> That's what the OP said - he was done for speeding, i.e. exceeding the
> speed limit, not dangerous driving.
>
> Anyone who thinks that the speed limit designates the speed at which it is
> safe to drive, needs to take driving lessons pronto.
The OP also said it was a 'fair cop' which I took issue with.
--
Bartc
Alex Heney
>"Nick" <nick...@boom.co.uk> wrote in message
>news:9bnhvn...@mid.individual.net...
>
>> I have received a fixed penalty offer from Thames Valley Police for
>> speeding
>> (35 in a 30, as I believe many are these days). Basically I can pay £60 to
>> take up this conditional offer or take it to court.
>> I have no problem with this, and given the odds, it's a fair cop.
>
>(Many would disagree:
Nope.
no rational person would disagree.
Many think the law is wrong in this area, but that does not mean they
would disagree about whether he broke it or not.
>ecause of the decimal system, using miles for
>distances, and the decision for most speed limits to be multiples of ten,
>the choice of speed limit can be quite arbitrary.
>
>For example if an actual safe limit was deemed to be around 38mph, then the
>choice would be between 30 or 40mph. To be safe, 30mph would have to be used
>instead of a more appropriate 35mph (rounding to 5mph instead of 10).
>
>You've possibly gotten a ticket for driving 3mph below the true safe limit!
>In Europe the true limit would 61kph and the posted limit would be 60kph.
>With 10kph (6mph) steps, their limits can, on the whole, more accurately
>reflect actual conditions than ours.)
They *can*, but IME, they don't.
Main urban limits are pretty universally the same across most European
countries, at 50kph (which is 31 mph).
Most countries now also have some lower limits for residential areas,
corresponding to our 20mph.
Upper limits are more variable, but usually within each country they
only use a fairly restricted set of limits.
>
>In reality, your offence is for not obeying the *posted* limits rather than
>speeding dangerously (although it is possible the 30mph was just in this
>case; we don't know).)
Of course it is.
The offence doesn't mention anything about danger, it is *purely*
regarding exceeding the posted limit.
--
Alex Heney, Global Villager
Who is "General Failure" and why is he reading my disk?
To reply by email, my address is alexATheneyDOTplusDOTcom
Alex Heney
But it is.
"fair law" and "fair cop" don't mean the same thing.
BartC
news:1o4g571kso9q2tsun...@4ax.com...
> On Fri, 26 Aug 2011 10:25:02 +0100, "BartC" <b...@freeuk.com> wrote:
>>You've possibly gotten a ticket for driving 3mph below the true safe
>>limit!
>>In Europe the true limit would 61kph and the posted limit would be 60kph.
>>With 10kph (6mph) steps, their limits can, on the whole, more accurately
>>reflect actual conditions than ours.)
>
> They *can*, but IME, they don't.
>
> Main urban limits are pretty universally the same across most European
> countries, at 50kph (which is 31 mph).
>
> Most countries now also have some lower limits for residential areas,
> corresponding to our 20mph.
Yes there are 50kph and 30mph limits, roughly the same as our 30mph and
20mph ones. But there is also the choice of using 40kph, about 25mph. We
would have to use the lower 20mph limit (since, for a reason no-one seems to
know, we can't use limits ending in '5').
And, in my experience (mainly Italy), no-one really takes the 30kph limit
(normally seen on road-works) very seriously. Probably because there are
very few speed cameras; motorists are trusted to slow down *enough*.
--
Bartc
Alex Heney
Southern Italy is the worst area I have driven in for obeying traffic
laws in general, and is also the area where the largest proportion of
vehicles were showing damage.
Northern Italy, on the other hand (in particular the dolomites) has
driving standards which are very much better - more like those of
Austria.
--
Alex Heney, Global Villager
Resistance Is Useless! (If < 1 ohm)
Roland Perry
2011, BartC <b...@freeuk.com> remarked:
>For example if an actual safe limit was deemed to be around 38mph, then the
>choice would be between 30 or 40mph. To be safe, 30mph would have to be used
>instead of a more appropriate 35mph (rounding to 5mph instead of 10).
In the USA they have speed limits at 5mph increments, including very low
limits like 15mph where the circumstances warrant them. They also make
much more use of *minimum* speed limits on highways.
I've also seen "impossible" limits, for example a highway with a 50mph
Minimum but also a 45mph Maximum past some road works. Presumably it's
understood that minimum limits are suspended in such situations, but
there's no actual signage to say so.
--
Roland Perry
BartC
"Roland Perry" <rol...@perry.co.uk> wrote in message
news:9ZB8TV52...@perry.co.uk...
> In message <j37omg$q67$1...@dont-email.me>, at 10:25:02 on Fri, 26 Aug 2011,
> BartC <b...@freeuk.com> remarked:
>>For example if an actual safe limit was deemed to be around 38mph, then
>>the
>>choice would be between 30 or 40mph. To be safe, 30mph would have to be
>>used
>>instead of a more appropriate 35mph (rounding to 5mph instead of 10).
>
> In the USA they have speed limits at 5mph increments, including very low
> limits like 15mph where the circumstances warrant them. They also make
> much more use of *minimum* speed limits on highways.
Well they have speed limits that *end* in 5, such as 25, 35, 45mph, but
still with 10mph steps!
But they have a bit more variety than ours with some ending in 0 too. From
the bit of driving I've done over there, they seem to use more common sense
also, so that outside a school there might be a 25mph limit, but with the
qualifier "When Children are Present".
Over here that would likely take the form of a speed camera, a 20mph limit,
and the restriction applying 24 hours a day, even at 3am in the middle of
August!
--
Bartc
Roland Perry
2011, BartC <b...@freeuk.com> remarked:
>> In the USA they have speed limits at 5mph increments, including very low
>> limits like 15mph where the circumstances warrant them. They also make
>> much more use of *minimum* speed limits on highways.
>
>Well they have speed limits that *end* in 5, such as 25, 35, 45mph, but
>still with 10mph steps!
Last small town I was in, they had limits as follows:
All streets 25mph unless otherwise posted.
Main street into town 55, reducing to 45, 35 as you got closer.
A few streets also signed as 30, 40 or 50.
So, while most changes were steps of 10mph, all intermediate speeds were
signed somewhere or other.
>But they have a bit more variety than ours with some ending in 0 too. From
>the bit of driving I've done over there, they seem to use more common sense
>also, so that outside a school there might be a 25mph limit, but with
>the qualifier "When Children are Present".
I've seen 15mph outside some schools. The speed limits are indeed
lowered during school hours (which are posted, it's not a case of
eyeballing children). But that's also the case in some parts of the UK,
where it's often accompanied by vertical yellow wig-wag lights.
>Over here that would likely take the form of a speed camera, a 20mph limit,
>and the restriction applying 24 hours a day, even at 3am in the middle of
>August!
--
Roland Perry
Alex Heney
Why do you believe that?
There are plenty of places which have limits outside schools that only
apply at certain times (often "when lights flash" with the lights
being turned on around schools start and end times).
--
Alex Heney, Global Villager
Democracy: the demand of the stupid that they rule over the intelligent because there are more of them
RobertL
> "Nick" <nicks...@boom.co.uk> wrote in message
>
> news:9bnhvn...@mid.individual.net...
>
> > I have received a fixed penalty offer from Thames Valley Police for
> > speeding
> > (35 in a 30, as I believe many are these days). Basically I can pay £60 to
> > take up this conditional offer or take it to court.
> > I have no problem with this, and given the odds, it's a fair cop.
>
> (Many would disagree: because of the decimal system, using miles for
> distances, and the decision for most speed limits to be multiples of ten,
> the choice of speed limit can be quite arbitrary.
But his ticket was for breaking the speed limit, not for driving at an
unsafe speed.
Robert