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Disproportionate PCN?
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AnthonyL
Feb 2, 2024, 8:46:48 AMFeb 2
to
Local council car park providing 2hrs free, ticket to be displayed in
windscreen.
I was going the chemist opposite the car park to pick up my
prescription. Although it is a car park I've regulary (couple of
times a month) I had a senior moment (I am nearer 80 than 75) and
forgot about the ticket. In fact I remembered I'd forgotten it and
mentioned it to the teller at the chemist as I was being served.
Needless to say I'd got a £50* PCN on the return to the car ~10mins
after I had arrived.
The attendant must have been lurking behind the bushes and rubbing
hands with glee seeing I'd not gone towards the ticket machines.
Is there any point whatsoever in attempting an appeal?
* "Parked in a car park without clearly displaying a valid pay and
display ticket or voucher of parking clock"
50% discount if paid in 14 days.
--
AnthonyL
Why ever wait to finish a job before starting the next?
windscreen.
I was going the chemist opposite the car park to pick up my
prescription. Although it is a car park I've regulary (couple of
times a month) I had a senior moment (I am nearer 80 than 75) and
forgot about the ticket. In fact I remembered I'd forgotten it and
mentioned it to the teller at the chemist as I was being served.
Needless to say I'd got a £50* PCN on the return to the car ~10mins
after I had arrived.
The attendant must have been lurking behind the bushes and rubbing
hands with glee seeing I'd not gone towards the ticket machines.
Is there any point whatsoever in attempting an appeal?
* "Parked in a car park without clearly displaying a valid pay and
display ticket or voucher of parking clock"
50% discount if paid in 14 days.
--
AnthonyL
Why ever wait to finish a job before starting the next?
billy bookcase
Feb 2, 2024, 10:52:58 AMFeb 2
to
"AnthonyL" <nos...@please.invalid> wrote in message
news:65bceebd....@news.eternal-september.org...
> Local council car park providing 2hrs free, ticket to be displayed in
> windscreen.
>
> I was going the chemist opposite the car park to pick up my
> prescription. Although it is a car park I've regulary (couple of
> times a month) I had a senior moment (I am nearer 80 than 75) and
> forgot about the ticket. In fact I remembered I'd forgotten it and
> mentioned it to the teller at the chemist as I was being served.
>
> Needless to say I'd got a £50* PCN on the return to the car ~10mins
> after I had arrived.
>
> The attendant must have been lurking behind the bushes and rubbing
> hands with glee seeing I'd not gone towards the ticket machines.
>
> Is there any point whatsoever in attempting an appeal?
On what grounds ?
> windscreen.
>
> I was going the chemist opposite the car park to pick up my
> prescription. Although it is a car park I've regulary (couple of
> times a month) I had a senior moment (I am nearer 80 than 75) and
> forgot about the ticket. In fact I remembered I'd forgotten it and
> mentioned it to the teller at the chemist as I was being served.
>
> Needless to say I'd got a £50* PCN on the return to the car ~10mins
> after I had arrived.
>
> The attendant must have been lurking behind the bushes and rubbing
> hands with glee seeing I'd not gone towards the ticket machines.
>
> Is there any point whatsoever in attempting an appeal?
( Being in a similar demographic, I at first thought you were
referring to an urgent call of nature )
Otherwise it might be considered unwise to confess to experiencing
"senior moments" under any circumstances, anywhere near to a motor
vehicle. Except among friends, at least.
Supposing for instance they asked you to produce medical evidence
of some kind, in mitigation ?
>
> * "Parked in a car park without clearly displaying a valid pay and
> display ticket or voucher of parking clock"
>
> 50% discount if paid in 14 days.
no stone unturned in pursuit of what they will claim is rightfully theirs.
bb
>
?
>
Peter Johnson
Feb 2, 2024, 11:15:16 AMFeb 2
to
On Fri, 02 Feb 2024 13:46:42 GMT, nos...@please.invalid (AnthonyL)
wrote:
>Local council car park providing 2hrs free, ticket to be displayed in
>windscreen.
>
>I was going the chemist opposite the car park to pick up my
>prescription. Although it is a car park I've regulary (couple of
>times a month) I had a senior moment (I am nearer 80 than 75) and
>forgot about the ticket. In fact I remembered I'd forgotten it and
>mentioned it to the teller at the chemist as I was being served.
>
>Needless to say I'd got a £50* PCN on the return to the car ~10mins
>after I had arrived.
>
>The attendant must have been lurking behind the bushes and rubbing
>hands with glee seeing I'd not gone towards the ticket machines.
>
>Is there any point whatsoever in attempting an appeal?
>
Depends on the operator but you won't know until you try.
wrote:
>Local council car park providing 2hrs free, ticket to be displayed in
>windscreen.
>
>I was going the chemist opposite the car park to pick up my
>prescription. Although it is a car park I've regulary (couple of
>times a month) I had a senior moment (I am nearer 80 than 75) and
>forgot about the ticket. In fact I remembered I'd forgotten it and
>mentioned it to the teller at the chemist as I was being served.
>
>Needless to say I'd got a £50* PCN on the return to the car ~10mins
>after I had arrived.
>
>The attendant must have been lurking behind the bushes and rubbing
>hands with glee seeing I'd not gone towards the ticket machines.
>
>Is there any point whatsoever in attempting an appeal?
>
JNugent
Feb 2, 2024, 2:15:58 PMFeb 2
to
displayed printed ticket) but had to get my case papers out of the boot
(in a hatchback).
When I got back to the car five or six hours later, there was a ticket
on the windscreen, alleging that I had parked without displaying the
ticket. And to an extent, that was true. It was a very windy day, with
reported tree damage across southern counties and the wind must have
flipped over my ticket when I opened the hatch lid. I certainly didn't
display it upside down!
I photocopied the ticket and the penalty ticket and also obtained the
relevant weather report, sending all three with a covering letter to B&H
council. Strictly speaking, I was bang to rights, but they cancelled the
penalty with a warning not to do it again (as though I have power over
the elements).
So if on that day, your medical needs were urgent, painful and
distracting... you could appeal on medical grounds, I dare say. You'd
only be staking the price of a second class stamp.
Mark Goodge
Feb 2, 2024, 2:31:18 PMFeb 2
to
On Fri, 02 Feb 2024 13:46:42 GMT, nos...@please.invalid (AnthonyL) wrote:
>Local council car park providing 2hrs free, ticket to be displayed in
>windscreen.
>
>I was going the chemist opposite the car park to pick up my
>prescription. Although it is a car park I've regulary (couple of
>times a month) I had a senior moment (I am nearer 80 than 75) and
>forgot about the ticket. In fact I remembered I'd forgotten it and
>mentioned it to the teller at the chemist as I was being served.
>
>Needless to say I'd got a £50* PCN on the return to the car ~10mins
>after I had arrived.
>
>The attendant must have been lurking behind the bushes and rubbing
>hands with glee seeing I'd not gone towards the ticket machines.
>
>Is there any point whatsoever in attempting an appeal?
Legally, you've got no grounds for an appeal. But given that it's a council
>windscreen.
>
>I was going the chemist opposite the car park to pick up my
>prescription. Although it is a car park I've regulary (couple of
>times a month) I had a senior moment (I am nearer 80 than 75) and
>forgot about the ticket. In fact I remembered I'd forgotten it and
>mentioned it to the teller at the chemist as I was being served.
>
>Needless to say I'd got a £50* PCN on the return to the car ~10mins
>after I had arrived.
>
>The attendant must have been lurking behind the bushes and rubbing
>hands with glee seeing I'd not gone towards the ticket machines.
>
>Is there any point whatsoever in attempting an appeal?
car park, not a private car park, you may find that explaining the situation
will result in the ticket being cancelled, especially if you can demonstrate
that you were only there for about ten minutes.
A lot depends on the council, and how rigidly they enforce their policies.
Some are more willing to forgive than others.
Mark
Fredxx
Feb 2, 2024, 2:31:22 PMFeb 2
to
On 02/02/2024 13:46, AnthonyL wrote:
> Local council car park providing 2hrs free, ticket to be displayed in
> windscreen.
>
> I was going the chemist opposite the car park to pick up my
> prescription. Although it is a car park I've regulary (couple of
> times a month) I had a senior moment (I am nearer 80 than 75) and
> forgot about the ticket. In fact I remembered I'd forgotten it and
> mentioned it to the teller at the chemist as I was being served.
>
> Needless to say I'd got a Ł50* PCN on the return to the car ~10mins
> Local council car park providing 2hrs free, ticket to be displayed in
> windscreen.
>
> I was going the chemist opposite the car park to pick up my
> prescription. Although it is a car park I've regulary (couple of
> times a month) I had a senior moment (I am nearer 80 than 75) and
> forgot about the ticket. In fact I remembered I'd forgotten it and
> mentioned it to the teller at the chemist as I was being served.
>
> after I had arrived.
Did you then get a ticket?
I thought there were rules about entry time and the time at which the
ticket is purchased?
Otherwise the less stressful and only option is to pay.
AnthonyL
Feb 2, 2024, 3:29:26 PMFeb 2
to
On Fri, 2 Feb 2024 15:52:49 -0000, "billy bookcase" <bi...@anon.com>
wrote:
>
>"AnthonyL" <nos...@please.invalid> wrote in message
>news:65bceebd....@news.eternal-september.org...
>> Local council car park providing 2hrs free, ticket to be displayed in
>> windscreen.
>>
>> I was going the chemist opposite the car park to pick up my
>> prescription. Although it is a car park I've regulary (couple of
>> times a month) I had a senior moment (I am nearer 80 than 75) and
>> forgot about the ticket. In fact I remembered I'd forgotten it and
>> mentioned it to the teller at the chemist as I was being served.
>>
>> Needless to say I'd got a £50* PCN on the return to the car ~10mins
>> after I had arrived.
>>
>> The attendant must have been lurking behind the bushes and rubbing
>> hands with glee seeing I'd not gone towards the ticket machines.
>>
>> Is there any point whatsoever in attempting an appeal?
>
>On what grounds ?
>
I'm here asking for suggestions. Do you have one?
>( Being in a similar demographic, I at first thought you were
>referring to an urgent call of nature )
>
>Otherwise it might be considered unwise to confess to experiencing
>"senior moments" under any circumstances, anywhere near to a motor
>vehicle. Except among friends, at least.
>
>Supposing for instance they asked you to produce medical evidence
>of some kind, in mitigation ?
>
My prescription gets sent by the surgery to the chemist who notified
me on Wednesday that it was ready for collection.
>>
>> * "Parked in a car park without clearly displaying a valid pay and
>> display ticket or voucher of parking clock"
>>
>> 50% discount if paid in 14 days.
>
>So its pay £25 or cross swords with a ruthless parking co who may leave
>no stone unturned in pursuit of what they will claim is rightfully theirs.
>
There is a procedure for an informal appeal, which I can do on-line.
https://www.nottinghamshire.gov.uk/transport/parking/challenge-parking-fine
What is not clear from that though other searches suggest that the 14
day clock is reset from the time of getting a response regarding the
informal appeal. In which case an appeal is not going to harm
anything.
I'm not familiar with The Traffic Management Act 2004, s 78, Civil
Enforcement of Road Traffic Contraventions (Approved devices etc) 2022
and the Civil Enforcement of Road Traffic and Contraventions
(Representations and Appeals) (England), Regulations 2022.
I rang the number on the website at 14.10. The office is open 09.00
to 14.00 (those bloody 10 minutes). I won't have time on Mon or Tue
to do that, and when I do I'd like a third pary view of the situation
if possible.
wrote:
>
>"AnthonyL" <nos...@please.invalid> wrote in message
>news:65bceebd....@news.eternal-september.org...
>> Local council car park providing 2hrs free, ticket to be displayed in
>> windscreen.
>>
>> I was going the chemist opposite the car park to pick up my
>> prescription. Although it is a car park I've regulary (couple of
>> times a month) I had a senior moment (I am nearer 80 than 75) and
>> forgot about the ticket. In fact I remembered I'd forgotten it and
>> mentioned it to the teller at the chemist as I was being served.
>>
>> Needless to say I'd got a £50* PCN on the return to the car ~10mins
>> after I had arrived.
>>
>> The attendant must have been lurking behind the bushes and rubbing
>> hands with glee seeing I'd not gone towards the ticket machines.
>>
>> Is there any point whatsoever in attempting an appeal?
>
>On what grounds ?
>
>( Being in a similar demographic, I at first thought you were
>referring to an urgent call of nature )
>
>Otherwise it might be considered unwise to confess to experiencing
>"senior moments" under any circumstances, anywhere near to a motor
>vehicle. Except among friends, at least.
>
>Supposing for instance they asked you to produce medical evidence
>of some kind, in mitigation ?
>
me on Wednesday that it was ready for collection.
>>
>> * "Parked in a car park without clearly displaying a valid pay and
>> display ticket or voucher of parking clock"
>>
>> 50% discount if paid in 14 days.
>
>So its pay £25 or cross swords with a ruthless parking co who may leave
>no stone unturned in pursuit of what they will claim is rightfully theirs.
>
https://www.nottinghamshire.gov.uk/transport/parking/challenge-parking-fine
What is not clear from that though other searches suggest that the 14
day clock is reset from the time of getting a response regarding the
informal appeal. In which case an appeal is not going to harm
anything.
I'm not familiar with The Traffic Management Act 2004, s 78, Civil
Enforcement of Road Traffic Contraventions (Approved devices etc) 2022
and the Civil Enforcement of Road Traffic and Contraventions
(Representations and Appeals) (England), Regulations 2022.
I rang the number on the website at 14.10. The office is open 09.00
to 14.00 (those bloody 10 minutes). I won't have time on Mon or Tue
to do that, and when I do I'd like a third pary view of the situation
if possible.
AnthonyL
Feb 2, 2024, 3:32:40 PMFeb 2
to
On Fri, 2 Feb 2024 18:14:28 +0000, Fredxx <fre...@spam.invalid> wrote:
>On 02/02/2024 13:46, AnthonyL wrote:
>> Local council car park providing 2hrs free, ticket to be displayed in
>> windscreen.
>>
>> I was going the chemist opposite the car park to pick up my
>> prescription. Although it is a car park I've regulary (couple of
>> times a month) I had a senior moment (I am nearer 80 than 75) and
>> forgot about the ticket. In fact I remembered I'd forgotten it and
>> mentioned it to the teller at the chemist as I was being served.
>>
>> Needless to say I'd got a Ł50* PCN on the return to the car ~10mins
>> after I had arrived.
>
>Did you then get a ticket?
>
Why would I? I've got at least the remainder of the 2hrs before I
>On 02/02/2024 13:46, AnthonyL wrote:
>> Local council car park providing 2hrs free, ticket to be displayed in
>> windscreen.
>>
>> I was going the chemist opposite the car park to pick up my
>> prescription. Although it is a car park I've regulary (couple of
>> times a month) I had a senior moment (I am nearer 80 than 75) and
>> forgot about the ticket. In fact I remembered I'd forgotten it and
>> mentioned it to the teller at the chemist as I was being served.
>>
>> Needless to say I'd got a Ł50* PCN on the return to the car ~10mins
>> after I had arrived.
>
>Did you then get a ticket?
>
contravene another limit.
But in any event, I'd finished my business, got my prescription and
drove off to the next item on my list.
>I thought there were rules about entry time and the time at which the
>ticket is purchased?
>
nick
Feb 2, 2024, 4:45:36 PMFeb 2
to
As others have already said, it's worth asking nicely if they wouldn't mind letting you off this time,just this once, but as one in the same demographic to another,I think they've got you banged to rights, guv. Twenty five quid is a small price to pay for a reminder to keep your mind sharp and attentive at all times. If I don't stay sharp and attentive, I fall over (no, I do NOT 'have a fall' - I'm not quite that old!) but not having quite been shocked out of letting my mind wander, I still fall down once in a while.
My mother's shock was embarrassment, not a penalty charge notice. She had had the habit of metaphorically wandering off into a dreamlike state and asking questions over and over and not listening to the answers though there was nothing really wrong with her mind. It was when she dreamily asked me, how was my wife and I replied, casually, "Oh, she's still dead" that shocked her into paying proper attention which I think probably benefited her and kept her alert for many years more.
Nick
My mother's shock was embarrassment, not a penalty charge notice. She had had the habit of metaphorically wandering off into a dreamlike state and asking questions over and over and not listening to the answers though there was nothing really wrong with her mind. It was when she dreamily asked me, how was my wife and I replied, casually, "Oh, she's still dead" that shocked her into paying proper attention which I think probably benefited her and kept her alert for many years more.
Nick
Fredxx
Feb 3, 2024, 3:41:00 AMFeb 3
to
On 02/02/2024 20:32, AnthonyL wrote:
> On Fri, 2 Feb 2024 18:14:28 +0000, Fredxx <fre...@spam.invalid> wrote:
>
>> On 02/02/2024 13:46, AnthonyL wrote:
>>> Local council car park providing 2hrs free, ticket to be displayed in
>>> windscreen.
>>>
>>> I was going the chemist opposite the car park to pick up my
>>> prescription. Although it is a car park I've regulary (couple of
>>> times a month) I had a senior moment (I am nearer 80 than 75) and
>>> forgot about the ticket. In fact I remembered I'd forgotten it and
>>> mentioned it to the teller at the chemist as I was being served.
>>>
>>> Needless to say I'd got a Ł50* PCN on the return to the car ~10mins
>>> after I had arrived.
>>
>> Did you then get a ticket?
>>
>
> Why would I? I've got at least the remainder of the 2hrs before I
> contravene another limit.
I thought you had to put a free ticket on your car for your free 2
> On Fri, 2 Feb 2024 18:14:28 +0000, Fredxx <fre...@spam.invalid> wrote:
>
>> On 02/02/2024 13:46, AnthonyL wrote:
>>> Local council car park providing 2hrs free, ticket to be displayed in
>>> windscreen.
>>>
>>> I was going the chemist opposite the car park to pick up my
>>> prescription. Although it is a car park I've regulary (couple of
>>> times a month) I had a senior moment (I am nearer 80 than 75) and
>>> forgot about the ticket. In fact I remembered I'd forgotten it and
>>> mentioned it to the teller at the chemist as I was being served.
>>>
>>> Needless to say I'd got a Ł50* PCN on the return to the car ~10mins
>>> after I had arrived.
>>
>> Did you then get a ticket?
>>
>
> Why would I? I've got at least the remainder of the 2hrs before I
> contravene another limit.
hours? I assumed you were only i the chemist for 10 minutes, I now
presume you were longer than this and misread your OP.
> But in any event, I'd finished my business, got my prescription and
> drove off to the next item on my list.
>
>> I thought there were rules about entry time and the time at which the
>> ticket is purchased?
>>
>
> Rules such as what?
expected to display a ticket.
AnthonyL
Feb 4, 2024, 6:08:49 AMFeb 4
to
On Sat, 3 Feb 2024 00:38:02 +0000, Fredxx <fre...@spam.invalid> wrote:
>On 02/02/2024 20:32, AnthonyL wrote:
>> On Fri, 2 Feb 2024 18:14:28 +0000, Fredxx <fre...@spam.invalid> wrote:
>>
>>> On 02/02/2024 13:46, AnthonyL wrote:
>>>> Local council car park providing 2hrs free, ticket to be displayed in
>>>> windscreen.
>>>>
>>>> I was going the chemist opposite the car park to pick up my
>>>> prescription. Although it is a car park I've regulary (couple of
>>>> times a month) I had a senior moment (I am nearer 80 than 75) and
>>>> forgot about the ticket. In fact I remembered I'd forgotten it and
>>>> mentioned it to the teller at the chemist as I was being served.
>>>>
>>>> Needless to say I'd got a Ł50* PCN on the return to the car ~10mins
>>>> after I had arrived.
>>>
>>> Did you then get a ticket?
>>>
>>
>> Why would I? I've got at least the remainder of the 2hrs before I
>> contravene another limit.
>
>I thought you had to put a free ticket on your car for your free 2
>hours?
Correct and the PCN was for failure to do this.
>On 02/02/2024 20:32, AnthonyL wrote:
>> On Fri, 2 Feb 2024 18:14:28 +0000, Fredxx <fre...@spam.invalid> wrote:
>>
>>> On 02/02/2024 13:46, AnthonyL wrote:
>>>> Local council car park providing 2hrs free, ticket to be displayed in
>>>> windscreen.
>>>>
>>>> I was going the chemist opposite the car park to pick up my
>>>> prescription. Although it is a car park I've regulary (couple of
>>>> times a month) I had a senior moment (I am nearer 80 than 75) and
>>>> forgot about the ticket. In fact I remembered I'd forgotten it and
>>>> mentioned it to the teller at the chemist as I was being served.
>>>>
>>>> Needless to say I'd got a Ł50* PCN on the return to the car ~10mins
>>>> after I had arrived.
>>>
>>> Did you then get a ticket?
>>>
>>
>> Why would I? I've got at least the remainder of the 2hrs before I
>> contravene another limit.
>
>I thought you had to put a free ticket on your car for your free 2
>hours?
>I assumed you were only i the chemist for 10 minutes, I now
>presume you were longer than this and misread your OP.
>
chemist. It was as if someone was hiding behind a bush (or in another
car) watching for silly buggers not going to the ticket machine.
>> But in any event, I'd finished my business, got my prescription and
>> drove off to the next item on my list.
>>
>>> I thought there were rules about entry time and the time at which the
>>> ticket is purchased?
>>>
>>
>> Rules such as what?
>
>I thought there was a grace period between entering a car park and
>expected to display a ticket.
>
minutes is the allowance as it states, observed from 09:54 to 09:59
I had gone there from buying petrol about 1 mile away. My petrol
receipt is timed at 09:46. At best I'm going to be arriving at the
car park after 09:50.
I wasn't "stop-watching". It's about 100yards from the car park to
the chemist. 1min there, 1min back, about 5mins waiting to be served.
The Civil Enforcment Officer could have said "Excuse me, haven't you
forgotten something", instead of no doubt rubbing hand with glee at
seeing another victim and meeting his financial targets.
And this is the same council whose roads I have to traverse everytime
I go anywhere and likely the cause of my recent MOT failure with a
broken suspension spring.
AnthonyL
Feb 4, 2024, 6:11:18 AMFeb 4
to
On Fri, 2 Feb 2024 21:09:58 +0000, nicko...@yahoo.ca (nick) wrote:
>As others have already said, it's worth asking nicely if they wouldn't mind letting you off this time,just this once, but as one in the same demographic to another,I think they've got you banged to rights, guv. Twenty five quid is a small price to pay for a reminder to keep your mind sharp and attentive at all times. If I don't stay sharp and attentive, I fall over (no, I do NOT 'have a fall' - I'm not quite that old!) but not having quite been shocked out of letting my mind wander, I still fall down once in a while.
>
Yes I think that will be my approach though the rules, as stated
>As others have already said, it's worth asking nicely if they wouldn't mind letting you off this time,just this once, but as one in the same demographic to another,I think they've got you banged to rights, guv. Twenty five quid is a small price to pay for a reminder to keep your mind sharp and attentive at all times. If I don't stay sharp and attentive, I fall over (no, I do NOT 'have a fall' - I'm not quite that old!) but not having quite been shocked out of letting my mind wander, I still fall down once in a while.
>
earlier (the thread has got broken) I can't find out the impact of an
informal appeal on the 14 days into which to pay the reduced fee.
Clive Arthur
Feb 4, 2024, 7:55:11 AMFeb 4
to
On 02/02/2024 13:46, AnthonyL wrote:
<snip>
> Needless to say I'd got a Ł50* PCN on the return to the car ~10mins
> after I had arrived.
Whatever your chances of a successful appeal, I don't think it's
'disproportionate'. The parking enforcement has to be paid for.
--
Cheers
Clive
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