Allowing children to drink alcohol in a restaurant - did the age change?

[Tim Watts]

I notice in England, Gov guidance says that a 16-17 year old may be
served (but not buy) beer, wine or cider with a meal in a restaurant.

When I was a kid (70s) I thought this was permissible at a younger age.

Did the law change and when?


Cheers,

Tim
--
Email does not work

[Nightjar]

On 10/12/2018 17:29, Tim Watts wrote:
> I notice in England, Gov guidance says that a 16-17 year old may be
> served (but not buy) beer, wine or cider with a meal in a restaurant.
>
> When I was a kid (70s) I thought this was permissible at a younger age.
>
> Did the law change and when?

It is certainly part of the Licencing Act 2003. My recollection is that
the age used to be 14. That was probably in the Licensing Act 1964, but
I can't find a full text of that Act to check. However, discussions in
Hansard about that Act all seem to refer to age 14.

--
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Colin Bignell

[R. Mark Clayton]

On Monday, 10 December 2018 18:29:09 UTC, Tim Watts wrote:
> I notice in England, Gov guidance says that a 16-17 year old may be
> served (but not buy) beer, wine or cider with a meal in a restaurant.
>
> When I was a kid (70s) I thought this was permissible at a younger age.
>
> Did the law change and when?

Licensing Act 2003 IIRC, however the age did not change only that the 16 or 17 year old could not order the drinks themselves.

[Robin]

that was like one of the Today Programme's puzzles :)

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2003/17/contents


But s.149(5) seems to provide only for 16 and 17 year olds with a meal.


--
Robin
reply-to address is (intended to be) valid

[Robin]

And then of course I fire prematurely before adding

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1964/26

where the original print PDF has

168.-(l) The holder of a justices' licence shall not allow a Children
person under fourteen to be in the bar of the licensed premises
prohibited during the permitted hours

but it's still 16 to consume with a meal

169(4) Subsections (1) and (2) of this section do not prohibit
the sale to or purchase by a person who has attained the age
of sixteen of beer, porter, cider or perry for consumption at
a meal in a part of the premises usually set apart for the
service of meals which is not a bar

[Nightjar]

On 11/12/2018 11:32, Robin wrote:
> On 11/12/2018 10:45, Robin wrote:
....

> And then of course I fire prematurely before adding
>
> https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1964/26
>
> where the original print PDF has
>
> 168.-(l) The holder of a justices' licence shall not allow a Children
> person under fourteen to be in the bar of the licensed premises
> prohibited during the permitted hours

That is probably where I remember the age 14 from. According to the
Hansard discussions I found, prior to that 14 year olds were were
allowed in the bar area as well.

> but it's still 16 to consume with a meal
>
> 169(4) Subsections (1) and (2) of this section do not prohibit
> the sale to or purchase by a person who has attained the age
> of sixteen of beer, porter, cider or perry for consumption at
> a meal in a part of the premises usually set apart for the
> service of meals which is not a bar


--

--

Colin Bignell

[Graham.]

>>
>
>that was like one of the Today Programme's puzzles :)
>

there is also scope fir a pub quiz question,

"What's the minimum age for alcohol drinking in the UK, 12, 18 or 60
and the correct answer is 60.

As question-master you can then express incredulity at those
apparently insisting that an 18 month old baby should be given a
drink!

--
Graham.

%Profound_observation%

[Tim Watts]

That's fascinating - thanks for finding that.

Well, that's cleared that up - weird, I really thought it was younger...

[R. Mark Clayton]

60 months - children over 5 may be given alcohol to drink by their parents. Younger than that requires medical supervision, which bizarrely occured in my case. When I was just two my parents [private] GP visited before Xmas. He was naturally offered a sherry. It seems that I circled around behind the sofa he was sitting on and drank it for him. My mother fretted, but the doctor said it was no problem, thus probably making me the youngest legal drinker in the UK.

[Tim Watts]

On 11/12/2018 10:11, Nightjar wrote:

Thanks - 14 seemed more akin to what I remember (I was allowed some wine
by my parents)

[R. Mark Clayton]

14 is / was the age for being allowed into pubs [on your own]. Pubs used to have a separate room for younger children [with no bar?], but now this is dealt with by licensing conditions.

Many many pubs were made open plan after the Court of Appeal ruled in 1975 that even staff required by their employer to remain behind the bar were strictly liable for under age drinking by people they could not even see. By chance I visited the court [as a tourist] and saw some of this case take place.

[Tim Watts]

I thought the age to buy was always 18? At least from shops. Was this in
the context of "with a meal"?

[R. Mark Clayton]

No 16 or 17 with a meal - long the case.

[newshound]

On 11/12/2018 12:52, R. Mark Clayton wrote:

>
> 60 months - children over 5 may be given alcohol to drink by their parents. Younger than that requires medical supervision, which bizarrely occured in my case. When I was just two my parents [private] GP visited before Xmas. He was naturally offered a sherry. It seems that I circled around behind the sofa he was sitting on and drank it for him. My mother fretted, but the doctor said it was no problem, thus probably making me the youngest legal drinker in the UK.
>

Wonderful story!

[Vir Campestris]

On 11/12/2018 12:06, Graham. wrote:
> As question-master you can then express incredulity at those
> apparently insisting that an 18 month old baby should be given a
> drink!

It's not any more, but gripe water used to have a significant alcohol
content.

Andy

[Fredxx]

When I've looked in the past, many, many years ago I recall the bottle
saying 5%. Hardly significant.

[R. Mark Clayton]

On Tuesday, 11 December 2018 21:49:55 UTC, Vir Campestris wrote:
> On 11/12/2018 12:06, Graham. wrote:
> > As question-master you can then express incredulity at those
> > apparently insisting that an 18 month old baby should be given a
> > drink!

They did not insist - I apparently helped myself without asking.

[Nightjar]

Watneys Red Barrel was 2.1%. A little lower and it could have been sold
without a licence.

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Colin Bignell