Pah, leaky solvent waste joint

[chris French]

Installed the waste pipe for the new bath today - solvent weld. Testing
it all out I find I've got a little leak (a drip every 10 seconds type
thing) on one elbow joint.

Not had a leaky solvent weld before. Any tricks to seal it - dab a bit
more adhesive around the joint? or just whack on a dab of LSX?

Thanks
--
Chris French

[newshound]

Can you get one or two "wraps" of white PVC tape around the area,
preferably with a bit of tension on the tape? Can make a near invisible
repair which should last forever.

[DerbyBorn]

newshound <news...@stevejqr.plus.com> wrote in
news:ZoSdnZteOeQD5jLP...@brightview.co.uk:

For what they cost - wouldn't it be better to remake the joint. Any
external solution is likely to fail. The stuff you apply is not an adhesive
- it is a solvent that causes the plastics to weld together. Applying it to
the leak is not a good idea.

--

DerbyBorn

[Artic]

chris French scribbled...

As it's under a bath and will be hidden from view, best remake the joint
for the sake of a new elbow and 2 straight connectors.

When you made the joints, did you give them a twist? Doing that ensures
the solvent is spread all around the joins.

[chris French]

In message <ZoSdnZteOeQD5jLP...@brightview.co.uk>,
newshound <news...@stevejqr.plus.com> writes

PVC tape as in insulation tape? I wouldn't expect that to stay
watertight.

Access is fine at the moment, and not to bothered about appearance as
it's under the end of the bath (double ended - waste is in the middle of
the bath) where the pipe from drops down under the floorboards. Though
will soon be behind some boxing in at end of the bath.
--
Chris French

[Tim Watts]

I also clean the pipe and the inside of the joint with some alcohol first to
remove any wax or grease.
--
Tim Watts Personal Blog: http://squiddy.blog.dionic.net/

http://www.sensorly.com/ Crowd mapping of 2G/3G/4G mobile signal coverage

[j...@mdfs.net]

On a similar theme, is there a way I can glue down a small bit of
loose silicone sealant? Obviously, needs to be a water-proof flexible
glue, so a superglue-alike (sets brittle) or PVC (washes out) won't
work.

In the past I've tried slipping a bit more sealant into under a
loose bit, but that doesn't glue it down, as you press down the
loose bit it squeezes out, and when you release pressure the
gap opens up again.

jgh

[The Medway Handyman]

Also, did you apply solvent to outside of pipe & inside of elbow?


--
Dave - The Medway Handyman www.medwayhandyman.co.uk

[DerbyBorn]

j...@mdfs.net wrote in news:c7104f97-0813-4d6b-bb2a-bb2136662885
@googlegroups.com:

I think you need to review your approaches. Putting stuff on the outside is
not a good idea. Cleaning and preparation are the key. Bodge this and the
process fails. Clean thoroughly.

--

DerbyBorn

[Artic]

j...@mdfs.net scribbled...

Once something like that comes apart, it also get dirty and/or damp. It
will never glue together as you can't clean it.

[Artic]

Tim Watts scribbled...

>
> On Monday 16 December 2013 22:51 Artic wrote in uk.d-i-y:
>
> > chris French scribbled...
> >
> >>
> >> Installed the waste pipe for the new bath today - solvent weld. Testing
> >> it all out I find I've got a little leak (a drip every 10 seconds type
> >> thing) on one elbow joint.
> >>
> >> Not had a leaky solvent weld before. Any tricks to seal it - dab a bit
> >> more adhesive around the joint? or just whack on a dab of LSX?
> >
> >
> > As it's under a bath and will be hidden from view, best remake the joint
> > for the sake of a new elbow and 2 straight connectors.
> >
> > When you made the joints, did you give them a twist? Doing that ensures
> > the solvent is spread all around the joins.
>
> I also clean the pipe and the inside of the joint with some alcohol first to
> remove any wax or grease.

That should be automatic.

[F Murtz]

Tim Watts wrote:
> On Monday 16 December 2013 22:51 Artic wrote in uk.d-i-y:
>
>> chris French scribbled...
>>
>>>
>>> Installed the waste pipe for the new bath today - solvent weld. Testing
>>> it all out I find I've got a little leak (a drip every 10 seconds type
>>> thing) on one elbow joint.
>>>
>>> Not had a leaky solvent weld before. Any tricks to seal it - dab a bit
>>> more adhesive around the joint? or just whack on a dab of LSX?
>>
>>
>> As it's under a bath and will be hidden from view, best remake the joint
>> for the sake of a new elbow and 2 straight connectors.
>>
>> When you made the joints, did you give them a twist? Doing that ensures
>> the solvent is spread all around the joins.
>
> I also clean the pipe and the inside of the joint with some alcohol first to
> remove any wax or grease.
>

Clean with MEK (Methyl ethyl ketone) that is what the primer is that is
supposed to be used before the solvent glue.

[Tim Watts]

On Tuesday 17 December 2013 00:53 Artic wrote in uk.d-i-y:

> Tim Watts scribbled...

>

>> I also clean the pipe and the inside of the joint with some alcohol first
>> to remove any wax or grease.
>
>
> That should be automatic.

?

[Nightjar]

On 16/12/2013 22:51, Artic wrote:

If you are adding a joint to a bit of pipe that is already fixed, it is
a good idea to do a dry assembly first and mark lines on both pipe and
joint, so you know where to stop twisting.

Colin Bignell

[dennis@home]

You need to keep it under pressure for a day or so before silicone will
have cured.

[harryagain]

"newshound" <news...@stevejqr.plus.com> wrote in message
news:ZoSdnZteOeQD5jLP...@brightview.co.uk...

When you insert the pipe into the fitting you are supposed to rotate the
pipe in the socket to "wipe" the solvent around the joint to prevent exactly
this problem.
Also good to put solvent on both pipe and socket.

It will be very hard to retro fix a leak.

[Ian Jackson]

In message <IhgY2gK9...@blackhole.familyfrench.co.uk>, chris French
<newspos...@familyfrench.co.uk> writes

Self amalgamating tape should work fine. Ensure it's kept under tension
(stretched) as you wrap it around the joint. For belt and braces, add a
couple of jubilee clips - or even simply cable ties - either side of the
wrap.
--
Ian

[chris French]

In message <o8Mru.48435$HU1....@fx30.am4>, The Medway Handyman
<davi...@blueyonder.co.uk> writes

Both, yes, and twisted , but must have just missed a little bit somewhow

--
Chris French

[chris French]

In message <4JWdnRdN0Oujny3P...@giganews.com>, Nightjar
<c...@insert.my.surname.here.me.uk> writes

Yeah, did that as well. The leak is just one of those things I guess.
Maybe a didn't twist enough, maybe I missed a bit of pipe with the glue,
who knows. It's just a bit annoying really.

The section of pipe is 2 bends taking the waste pipe below the
floorboards. I'll probably just remake that section. hopefully there is
enough waste pipe spare on the length that I won't need to extend it
with a coupler as well.

Thanks for your comments folks
--
Chris French

[RobertL]

On Monday, December 16, 2013 11:05:41 PM UTC, Tim Watts wrote:
> On Monday 16 December 2013 22:51 Artic wrote in uk.d-i-y:

> > When you made the joints, did you give them a twist? Doing that ensures
> > the solvent is spread all around the joins.

> I also clean the pipe and the inside of the joint with some alcohol first to
> remove any wax or grease.

I always roughen both the mating surfaces with fine sandpaper before applying the solvent, but nobody else has mentioned that. Is it frowned upon?

Robert

[chris French]

In message <da0241e2-8024-4ed5...@googlegroups.com>,
RobertL <rober...@yahoo.com> writes

It probably doesn't help, but I don't suppose it does any harm.

The solvent weld cement works buy dissolving the outer layer of the
plastic of the pipe fitting/pipe, which then sets, joining it altogether
(hence the name).

The is unlike a standard adhesive, which has to bond to disparate
materials, where roughening the surface can sometimes help.
--
Chris French

[Grimly Curmudgeon]

On Mon, 16 Dec 2013 22:58:05 +0000, chris French
<newspos...@familyfrench.co.uk> wrote:

>Access is fine at the moment, and not to bothered about appearance as
>it's under the end of the bath (double ended - waste is in the middle of
>the bath) where the pipe from drops down under the floorboards. Though
>will soon be behind some boxing in at end of the bath.

In that case, cut it off and re-do it with new bits. Not worth the
hassle to fiddle with it.

[newshound]

It's often quite difficult to re-make a joint on an installed system,
you may have to cut quite a bit out to get sufficient access. But in
this case if you can do that fairly easily it is certainly the best
solution. That said, I have a "taped" coupling which has been fine for
20 years. Not actually a failed solvent weld, it's where I have coupled
solvent weld to compression pipe (telescoped) and didn't have room for a
compression fitting. Have also used it on things like overflow pipes.
The thing it won't work on is pressurised pipes (although self
amalgamating tape plus jubilee clips will).

[Nightjar]

On 17/12/2013 09:08, chris French wrote:

One manufacturer's recommended way to make a solvent weld joint is:

Clean all surfaces thoroughly.

Apply primer to outside of pipe
Apply primer to inside of socket
Apply more primer to outside of pipe

Apply solvent weld to outside of pipe
Apply solvent weld to inside of socket
Apply more solvent weld to outside of pipe

Press pipe firmly into socket with a twisting action, ensuring that it
engages fully with the reduced diameter section deeper in the socket
(fitting a flange onto a 4" pipe I find a club hammer is needed for that
last bit)

Personally, as it doesn't need to hold against pressure, I would whack
an extra bit of solvent weld around the join, leave that to dry off,
then wrap it in a few layers of self-amalgamating tape.

Colin Bignell

[Artic]

Tim Watts scribbled...

>
> On Tuesday 17 December 2013 00:53 Artic wrote in uk.d-i-y:
>
> > Tim Watts scribbled...
> >
>
> >> I also clean the pipe and the inside of the joint with some alcohol first
> >> to remove any wax or grease.
> >
> >
> > That should be automatic.
>
> ?

All joints in all materials should be clean - I do them automatically.
It's not something you need to think about, is it?

[Artic]

RobertL scribbled...

Get carried away and you'd lose the snug fit. Drop a spot of solvent
onto some plastic, you'll see the reaction, it's more a weld than
gluing.

[Gazz]

>> I also clean the pipe and the inside of the joint with some alcohol first
>> to
>> remove any wax or grease.
>
>
> That should be automatic.

i'm sure some people prefer to drink the alcohol rather than waste it on
wiping pipe joints :)