Screwfix Vs Toolstation
Bob Minchin
Not only is there post free threshold 5 time that of Toolstation but
today I needed a few more galvanised wire nails to complete a job
(wouldn't be nice if they said roughly how many nails per kg!!)
Screwfix are about a couple of miles nearer so I thought for the sake of
a few pennies more on price compared to the cost of the diesel, I would
go to Screwfix rather than TS
Screwfix price £3.56 per kg Toolstation price £2.54kg
SF are really starting to take the piss and their counter service is so
slow.
Bob
Steve Eldridge
I agree, rarely use Screwfix these days. They seem to be getting more and
more expensive and I find that, apart from price, the Toolstation service
is much better. The staff seem happier!
--
Steve
Andy Burns
> Bob Minchin wrote:
>
>> SF are really starting to take the piss and their counter service is so
>> slow.
I've been to both a few times recently; At weekends T/S is deserted so
service is quick. In the week longer waiting to be served at T/S, but
picking is quick and by the same person, while S/F is quick at entering
order but it's then picked rather more leisurely by separate people
"round the back" a-la Argos
> the Toolstation service is much better. The staff seem happier!
Agreed, S/F staff seem pre-occupied with discussing their upcoming
tattoos and piercings, and taking each other's names and phone numbers,
which perhaps says something about how quick their staff turnover is ...
Bolted
I use both, but steer clear of unbranded stuff from TS because its a
bit too silverline for my liking. Screwfix tends to be better
quality, Toolstation unbranded stuff always seem to be very built down
to a price. Which is ok for nails probably. I guess it might be
interesting (well, ok, not really) to compare the thickness of
galvanising etc.
d...@gglz.com
Likewise, I've TS quality a bit iffy.
Mind you, so is the unbranded Screwfix stuff - especially hand tools.
Bolted
Yes, both are pretty junky for own brand tools
John Rumm
> It seems to me that Screwfix have really lost the plot on pricing.
Probably not too surprising when you remember that SF is now owned by
the folks who gave us B&Q, and TS is owned by the ones who gave us SF.
--
Cheers,
John.
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Bob Minchin
> On 13/04/2011 11:42, Bob Minchin wrote:
>
>> It seems to me that Screwfix have really lost the plot on pricing.
>
> Probably not too surprising when you remember that SF is now owned by
> the folks who gave us B&Q, and TS is owned by the ones who gave us SF.
>
>
Toolstation. TP are also linked to Wickes AFAIK.
Bob
The Medway Handyman
AIUI The bloke who started SF had a restrictive clause in the contract
when he sold SF to Kingfisher (who also own B&Q). When the time expired
he started TS.
--
Dave - The Medway Handyman www.medwayhandyman.co.uk
Bob Minchin
with a deal with TP.
April 2008 TP acquired 30% of TS and an option to buy the remaining 70%
in 4 years - April 2012.
Presumably after a few more years we will see Mark Goddard-Watts opening
up a new business. Could be Screw-Station or perhaps ToolFix will sound
better.
Bob
Tim Watts
Oh for gods sake.
Why do people start great businesses, just to sell them and let them get
fucked up?
At least he has the decency to start another business to replaced the fucked
up one...
--
Tim Watts
Bob Minchin
You can either work your socks off taking continual risk that the
business falls flat despite your efforts or you can sell to someone who
has the money, Bank a chunk of it and start up a new one. Once you have
had enough, open up the bank account and retire.
This time Mark GW has done a deal where TP provide the capital to grow
the business from mail order to trade counters, potentially beating SF
(if they carry on like they are at the moment) so that when he sell the
remaining 70% next year, he will make even more.
Just imagine having had to try and borrow capital from a bank 3 years ago??
Bob
Skipweasel
bob.minc...@YOURHATntlworld.com says...
> Presumably after a few more years we will see Mark Goddard-Watts opening
> up a new business. Could be Screw-Station or perhaps ToolFix will sound
> better.
You may well need a ToolFix after picking up an infestation of
crustaceans from a ScrewStation.
--
Skipweasel - never knowingly understood.
John Rumm
Its called having an exit strategy. It means you carry less risk, and it
easier to get investors to chip in since they know when they get their
money back and a return on their investment. Once you have a record of
being able to do it repeatedly you can start a business entirely with
OPM (other peoples money), then walk away after a few years pocketing a
substantial sum in the process ;-)
> At least he has the decency to start another business to replaced the fucked
> up one...
--
Tim Watts
> On 13/04/2011 19:47, Tim Watts wrote:
>> Oh for gods sake.
>>
>> Why do people start great businesses, just to sell them and let them get
>> fucked up?
>
> Its called having an exit strategy. It means you carry less risk, and it
> easier to get investors to chip in since they know when they get their
> money back and a return on their investment. Once you have a record of
> being able to do it repeatedly you can start a business entirely with
> OPM (other peoples money), then walk away after a few years pocketing a
> substantial sum in the process ;-)
>
>> At least he has the decency to start another business to replaced the
>> fucked up one...
Hi John
I don't doubt that it's a good thing (TM) for Mr. ScrewStationStartup man -
good for him.
Scenario:
Starting a business, working hard, building it up in its own capacity by
giving customers what they want for a good price, then:
1) Keep exploring what customers want and tuning and maintaining the
business to be the best, possibly expanding overseas;
2) Flog it to the nearest rich tosser who will inevitably fuck it up, but
not before a million customers have been shafted in small but additive ways
before the word eventually gets round;
Mine was a gasp of exasperation for the whole state of the socio-economic
situation that favours 2 over 1.
Cue DABS, cue Worldpay, cue a small company I cannot mention due to inside
info, cue every other company that used to be good until it was aquired and
now is a steaming pile of crap.
I don;t know what you do about about it, but it just seems fundamentally
broken.
Cheers
Tim
--
Tim Watts
Theo Markettos
> 2) Flog it to the nearest rich tosser who will inevitably fuck it up, but
> not before a million customers have been shafted in small but additive ways
> before the word eventually gets round;
Bargains to ripoffs is a standard strategy. Start cheap, entice in the
punters, gain market share and brand awareness, push out the competition,
then gradually wind up the prices. You'll lose some customers along the
way, but the ones who can't be bothered to change will mean you get more
profit for less work. And you've increased the barrier to entry so that new
entrants find it hard to compete.
> Mine was a gasp of exasperation for the whole state of the socio-economic
> situation that favours 2 over 1.
>
> Cue DABS, cue Worldpay, cue a small company I cannot mention due to inside
> info, cue every other company that used to be good until it was aquired and
> now is a steaming pile of crap.
See eBay, Skype, most banks, phone companies, insurance, etc etc.
> I don;t know what you do about about it, but it just seems fundamentally
> broken.
It's business. What makes the most profit isn't necessarily the best for
the customers. The company's job is to upset the minimum number of
customers while making the maximum profit.
Theo
John Rumm
> John Rumm wrote:
>
>> On 13/04/2011 19:47, Tim Watts wrote:
>
>>> Oh for gods sake.
>>>
>>> Why do people start great businesses, just to sell them and let them get
>>> fucked up?
>>
>> Its called having an exit strategy. It means you carry less risk, and it
>> easier to get investors to chip in since they know when they get their
>> money back and a return on their investment. Once you have a record of
>> being able to do it repeatedly you can start a business entirely with
>> OPM (other peoples money), then walk away after a few years pocketing a
>> substantial sum in the process ;-)
>>
>>> At least he has the decency to start another business to replaced the
>>> fucked up one...
>
> Hi John
>
> I don't doubt that it's a good thing (TM) for Mr. ScrewStationStartup man -
> good for him.
>
> Scenario:
>
> Starting a business, working hard, building it up in its own capacity by
> giving customers what they want for a good price, then:
>
> 1) Keep exploring what customers want and tuning and maintaining the
> business to be the best, possibly expanding overseas;
Some do obviously - but for others they may not have the knowledge or
the available finance to move from small growing startup to
international etc. Hence the need for either a partner, and many years
of doing what you possibly don't do best, or selling up and going back
to what you know you can do well.
> 2) Flog it to the nearest rich tosser who will inevitably fuck it up, but
> not before a million customers have been shafted in small but additive ways
> before the word eventually gets round;
That obviously happens some of the time, but what about the times when
it does not? The problem is, you don't tend to notice the ones that
change hands and carry one as they were, or get better.
> Mine was a gasp of exasperation for the whole state of the socio-economic
> situation that favours 2 over 1.
>
> Cue DABS, cue Worldpay, cue a small company I cannot mention due to inside
> info, cue every other company that used to be good until it was aquired and
> now is a steaming pile of crap.
Indeed, but see my comment above - hence why I can't off the top of my
head give you a list of ones that have done ok. That may be there are
not many, or it might be they have not pee'd me off enough to take
notice that something changed!
> I don;t know what you do about about it, but it just seems fundamentally
> broken.
There is the other problem that as business get bigger, they often find
it hard to retain that personal touch with ever increasing numbers of
staff and management overhead.
Tim Watts
> It's business. What makes the most profit isn't necessarily the best for
> the customers. The company's job is to upset the minimum number of
> customers while making the maximum profit.
I would add another method:
Piss off your customers after 1,2 or 6 transactions as long as you think
they are a) stupid enough to keep coming back; or b) there are a large
number of "new" customers who you can shaft because there is no quick and
ubiquitous method to check on a company's performance[1]
[1] reviewcentre.com seems like the best bet - you should see the whining
about DABS there - but it is far from being a resource everyone periodically
checks, including me, up until now at least.
Massive, open and rammed-in-your-throat transparancy might be a solution for
the whole problem, but the implementation is non trivial, unless google
start adding a "customer review of the comapany" to all the search results.
--
Tim Watts
John Rumm
> Theo Markettos wrote:
>
>
>> It's business. What makes the most profit isn't necessarily the best for
>> the customers. The company's job is to upset the minimum number of
>> customers while making the maximum profit.
>
> I would add another method:
>
> Piss off your customers after 1,2 or 6 transactions as long as you think
> they are a) stupid enough to keep coming back; or b) there are a large
> number of "new" customers who you can shaft because there is no quick and
> ubiquitous method to check on a company's performance[1]
>
> [1] reviewcentre.com seems like the best bet - you should see the whining
> about DABS there - but it is far from being a resource everyone periodically
> checks, including me, up until now at least.
The problems with reviews etc, is that bad news spreads fast, and good
news slowly. People with a grievance are far more likely to make a noise
about it than happy customers.
> Massive, open and rammed-in-your-throat transparancy might be a solution for
> the whole problem, but the implementation is non trivial, unless google
> start adding a "customer review of the comapany" to all the search results.
Which would then be "gamed" by the competition to gain advantage over
their rivals. Much the same as its not unknown for a company to post
glowing reviews of themselves posing as third parties on review sites etc.
Either way its a difficult problem to solve.
Case in point, I flogged a surplus to requirements electric motor on
ebay recently. In the process of getting it to the customer the courier
managed to drop it several times by the looks of what was delivered! I
contacted the company I booked the collection and delivery though
(parcel2go.com) to report this via their web site, and set the claims
procedure in motion. I then got rather concerned because I read a few
review sites pointing out just how bad their customer service was, and
how getting compensation out of them was impossible etc. The reality was
however that the process worked exactly as advertised and they refunded
the full purchase price of the sale, and also credited me with more than
the cost of the original courier fee. Hence the problem of what do you
believe? Was I lucky, have they recently got better, were the reviews
bogus?
Chade
<bob.minchinREM...@YOURHATntlworld.com> wrote:
>
Has anyone else heard of Toolstream? I saw a paper catalogue for them
and they were cheaper than Toolstation. I've never ordered from them
so I've no idea about the quality but they seem to sell a lot of
Silverline stuff. According to the catalogue the minimum order with
free delivery is one hundred pounds. I've had a quick look at the
website and it says you need an account to order and that they don't
deal with the public, but if you knew a suitable business owner...
The Other Mike
<see.my.s...@nowhere.null> wrote:
>Case in point, I flogged a surplus to requirements electric motor on
>ebay recently. In the process of getting it to the customer the courier
>managed to drop it several times by the looks of what was delivered! I
>contacted the company I booked the collection and delivery though
>(parcel2go.com) to report this via their web site, and set the claims
>procedure in motion. I then got rather concerned because I read a few
>review sites pointing out just how bad their customer service was, and
>how getting compensation out of them was impossible etc. The reality was
>however that the process worked exactly as advertised and they refunded
>the full purchase price of the sale, and also credited me with more than
>the cost of the original courier fee. Hence the problem of what do you
>believe? Was I lucky, have they recently got better, were the reviews
>bogus?
Parcels2go were a stinking pile of crap a few years ago who, while
providing a barely acceptable level of service (the bit that was
totally out of their hands was almost perfect) they proceeded to spam
and cold call me ad infinitum.
I wouldn't use them if they were the last courier company on the
planet.
--
Andy Dingley
> Has anyone else heard of Toolstream? I saw a paper catalogue for them
> and they were cheaper than Toolstation.
Has anyone found a supplier that's more expensive than Toolstation,
but sells a better quality product?
I've never had a complaint about Toolstation's prices. I've rarely
bought something that wouldn't cost far more in labour to install or
use it than its measly purchase price. I have though had quite a few
pieces (both tools and components) where I'd happily spend more to get
something a bit better.
mike
AFAIK it's Silverline's sales division selling to retailers/
wholesalers. It's probably far easier to return defective Silverline
junk to Toolsation (and keep your rights under SOGA) than dealing
direct with Silverline. The staff at the local Toolstation told me
the majority of their returns are duff Silverline power tools.
The Silverline/Toolstation owners are brothers, aren't they?
John Rumm
In this case the situation was reversed - they seemed to do their bit ok
and DHL dropped the ball (literally so to speak!)
> I wouldn't use them if they were the last courier company on the
> planet.
Are there others that you would recommend?
P2Gs main attraction from my point of view are: pricing, which seems
significantly better than that offered by any of the couriers directly
on their own web sites, and integration with ebay, so that one can have
them import all the delivery details directly from completed auctions.
Years ago I had an account with Amtrak before they folded, they were
quite good and could collect and deliver in any combination (a to b, b
to a, and even b to c), but were typically to to three times the cost
per parcel.
Tim..
"Andy Burns" <usenet....@adslpipe.co.uk> wrote in message
news:O5WdnQpxj-GkCTjQ...@brightview.co.uk...
Another vote for T/S here. Only use the other firm if I have to !
Andy Burns
> Has anyone found a supplier that's more expensive than Toolstation,
> but sells a better quality product?
Have you got a Cromwell nearby? They certainly have a wider range, a bit
more industrial than diy/tradesman, but sometimes handy for something
you would rather collect from a trade counter instead of waiting for
courier delivery ..