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Reversed flow and return to radiator
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Lieutenant Scott
Mar 14, 2012, 9:34:13 PM3/14/12
to
Someone was telling me that it's important to connect the flow and return to the right ends of a radiator. But I cannot see a problem in water running the wrong way.
"The wrong way" would mean water flowing into the radiator through the balance valve and out through the thermostatic valve, but the radiator is symmetrical, and the valves are not one way (are they?), so what would be the problem?
The reason this came up is I'm plumbing in a new radiator and I've not marked which pipe is which that I've threaded out of sight under the floor. Although I can actually tell which is which as it's HEP pipe with metre markings on it, I wondered if I really have to know?
--
http://petersparrots.com
http://petersphotos.com
Women generally don't fart as much as men, because they never shut up long enough to build up pressure.
"The wrong way" would mean water flowing into the radiator through the balance valve and out through the thermostatic valve, but the radiator is symmetrical, and the valves are not one way (are they?), so what would be the problem?
The reason this came up is I'm plumbing in a new radiator and I've not marked which pipe is which that I've threaded out of sight under the floor. Although I can actually tell which is which as it's HEP pipe with metre markings on it, I wondered if I really have to know?
--
http://petersparrots.com
http://petersphotos.com
Women generally don't fart as much as men, because they never shut up long enough to build up pressure.
John Rumm
Mar 15, 2012, 12:18:20 AM3/15/12
to
On 15/03/2012 01:34, Lieutenant Scott wrote:
> Someone was telling me that it's important to connect the flow and
> return to the right ends of a radiator. But I cannot see a problem in
> water running the wrong way.
>
> "The wrong way" would mean water flowing into the radiator through the
> balance valve and out through the thermostatic valve, but the radiator
> is symmetrical, and the valves are not one way (are they?), so what
> would be the problem?
Some TRVs are one way. Some are described as two but work better on the
> Someone was telling me that it's important to connect the flow and
> return to the right ends of a radiator. But I cannot see a problem in
> water running the wrong way.
>
> "The wrong way" would mean water flowing into the radiator through the
> balance valve and out through the thermostatic valve, but the radiator
> is symmetrical, and the valves are not one way (are they?), so what
> would be the problem?
flow side, and some are fine either way.
> The reason this came up is I'm plumbing in a new radiator and I've not
> marked which pipe is which that I've threaded out of sight under the
> floor. Although I can actually tell which is which as it's HEP pipe with
> metre markings on it, I wondered if I really have to know?
(Some of them begin to whistle a bit as they throttle the flow when on
the return side).
--
Cheers,
John.
/=================================================================\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\=================================================================/
Brian Gaff
Mar 15, 2012, 1:21:29 AM3/15/12
to
Yes a place I use regularly has a radiator like that but its a rushing noise
not a whistle. we call it Hissing Sid.
I know its childish...
Brian
--
Brian Gaff....Note, this account does not accept Bcc: email.
graphics are great, but the blind can't hear them
Email: bri...@blueyonder.co.uk
______________________________________________________________________________________________________________
"John Rumm" <see.my.s...@nowhere.null> wrote in message
news:eJ6dnU_jb_cP8PzS...@brightview.co.uk...
not a whistle. we call it Hissing Sid.
I know its childish...
Brian
--
Brian Gaff....Note, this account does not accept Bcc: email.
graphics are great, but the blind can't hear them
Email: bri...@blueyonder.co.uk
______________________________________________________________________________________________________________
"John Rumm" <see.my.s...@nowhere.null> wrote in message
news:eJ6dnU_jb_cP8PzS...@brightview.co.uk...
Scion
Mar 15, 2012, 5:23:34 AM3/15/12
to
John Rumm spake thus:
> On 15/03/2012 01:34, Lieutenant Scott wrote:
>> Someone was telling me that it's important to connect the flow and
>> return to the right ends of a radiator. But I cannot see a problem in
>> water running the wrong way.
>>
>> "The wrong way" would mean water flowing into the radiator through the
>> balance valve and out through the thermostatic valve, but the radiator
>> is symmetrical, and the valves are not one way (are they?), so what
>> would be the problem?
>
> Some TRVs are one way. Some are described as two but work better on the
> flow side, and some are fine either way.
Some are either way, but need to be adjusted for the correct direction -
this can be done after installation.
> On 15/03/2012 01:34, Lieutenant Scott wrote:
>> Someone was telling me that it's important to connect the flow and
>> return to the right ends of a radiator. But I cannot see a problem in
>> water running the wrong way.
>>
>> "The wrong way" would mean water flowing into the radiator through the
>> balance valve and out through the thermostatic valve, but the radiator
>> is symmetrical, and the valves are not one way (are they?), so what
>> would be the problem?
>
> Some TRVs are one way. Some are described as two but work better on the
> flow side, and some are fine either way.
this can be done after installation.
Lieutenant Scott
Mar 15, 2012, 5:37:14 AM3/15/12
to
On Thu, 15 Mar 2012 04:18:20 -0000, John Rumm <see.my.s...@nowhere.null> wrote:
> On 15/03/2012 01:34, Lieutenant Scott wrote:
>> Someone was telling me that it's important to connect the flow and
>> return to the right ends of a radiator. But I cannot see a problem in
>> water running the wrong way.
>>
>> "The wrong way" would mean water flowing into the radiator through the
>> balance valve and out through the thermostatic valve, but the radiator
>> is symmetrical, and the valves are not one way (are they?), so what
>> would be the problem?
>
> Some TRVs are one way. Some are described as two but work better on the
> flow side, and some are fine either way.
I've seen some which can be positioned with the knob vertically or horizontally, I assume these take it either way.
> On 15/03/2012 01:34, Lieutenant Scott wrote:
>> Someone was telling me that it's important to connect the flow and
>> return to the right ends of a radiator. But I cannot see a problem in
>> water running the wrong way.
>>
>> "The wrong way" would mean water flowing into the radiator through the
>> balance valve and out through the thermostatic valve, but the radiator
>> is symmetrical, and the valves are not one way (are they?), so what
>> would be the problem?
>
> Some TRVs are one way. Some are described as two but work better on the
> flow side, and some are fine either way.
(There's going to be a few naughty replies to the above line.....)
>> The reason this came up is I'm plumbing in a new radiator and I've not
>> marked which pipe is which that I've threaded out of sight under the
>> floor. Although I can actually tell which is which as it's HEP pipe with
>> metre markings on it, I wondered if I really have to know?
>
> Make sure the TRV is a two way one, and it should be ok.
>
> (Some of them begin to whistle a bit as they throttle the flow when on
> the return side).
The HEP pipe metre markings will tell me which is which, as I bought a 50 metre length of pipe and used the two ends of the length to enter the house, with the middle being in the garage. Therefore the metre markings increase in one direction on one pipe and decrease on the other.
I was on a Southwest flight once that was delayed at the gate after everyone boarded. The flight attendant said over the intercom, "We're sorry for the delay. The machine that normally rips the handles off your luggage is broken, so we're having to do it by hand. We should be finished and on our way shortly."
Lieutenant Scott
Mar 15, 2012, 5:39:04 AM3/15/12
to
On Thu, 15 Mar 2012 05:21:29 -0000, Brian Gaff <Bri...@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:
> Yes a place I use regularly has a radiator like that but its a rushing noise
> not a whistle. we call it Hissing Sid.
> I know its childish...
> Brian
Is there a way to stop a radiator going bang bang bang (well quieter than a bang) when it heats up? Only one of them does it and it's the same model of radiator, and has the same model of valves, as the rest. The only difference is it's always the one that needs bleeding - the rest never do. It still makes the noise immediately after bleeding.
> Yes a place I use regularly has a radiator like that but its a rushing noise
> not a whistle. we call it Hissing Sid.
> I know its childish...
> Brian
Seen in a health food store:
Shoplifters will be beaten over the head with an organic carrot.
Davey
Mar 15, 2012, 6:21:25 AM3/15/12
to
On Thu, 15 Mar 2012 01:34:13 -0000
"Lieutenant Scott" <n...@spam.com> wrote:
> Someone was telling me that it's important to connect the flow and
> return to the right ends of a radiator. But I cannot see a problem
> in water running the wrong way.
>
> "The wrong way" would mean water flowing into the radiator through
> the balance valve and out through the thermostatic valve, but the
> radiator is symmetrical, and the valves are not one way (are they?),
> so what would be the problem?
>
> The reason this came up is I'm plumbing in a new radiator and I've
> not marked which pipe is which that I've threaded out of sight under
> the floor. Although I can actually tell which is which as it's HEP
> pipe with metre markings on it, I wondered if I really have to know?
>
The online spec. for my valves says they can be used either way. In
"Lieutenant Scott" <n...@spam.com> wrote:
> Someone was telling me that it's important to connect the flow and
> return to the right ends of a radiator. But I cannot see a problem
> in water running the wrong way.
>
> "The wrong way" would mean water flowing into the radiator through
> the balance valve and out through the thermostatic valve, but the
> radiator is symmetrical, and the valves are not one way (are they?),
> so what would be the problem?
>
> The reason this came up is I'm plumbing in a new radiator and I've
> not marked which pipe is which that I've threaded out of sight under
> the floor. Although I can actually tell which is which as it's HEP
> pipe with metre markings on it, I wondered if I really have to know?
>
industrial pipework, the throttling valve is always put on the leaving
side.
--
Davey.
R D S
Mar 15, 2012, 8:19:58 AM3/15/12
to
On 15/03/12 01:34, Lieutenant Scott wrote:
> Someone was telling me that it's important to connect the flow and
> return to the right ends of a radiator. But I cannot see a problem in
> water running the wrong way.
There's 2 the wrong way around in our house.
> Someone was telling me that it's important to connect the flow and
> return to the right ends of a radiator. But I cannot see a problem in
> water running the wrong way.
One lets out a "thunk" when it opens or shuts (or both) and and the
other, in the bedroom, makes a whooshing noise.
If I could be asrsed i'd swap them round.
www.GymRatZ.co.uk
Mar 15, 2012, 9:11:10 AM3/15/12
to
On 15/03/2012 01:34, Lieutenant Scott wrote:
> Someone was telling me that it's important to connect the flow and
> return to the right ends of a radiator. But I cannot see a problem in
> water running the wrong way.
Nope.
> Someone was telling me that it's important to connect the flow and
> return to the right ends of a radiator. But I cannot see a problem in
> water running the wrong way.
Just check the radiator valve is bi-directional.
Whether the TRV is on one end or the other doesn't matter, in my mind
it's more important to have it closer to the centre or the room (rather
than in a corner or behind a wardrobe etc.
When I reversed the whole flow/return of my radiator circuit due to
messy connections in the airing cupboard I only had to change one
straight-connection TRV around all the rest were flow either way.
If you had radiators connected top in > bottom out then there might be a
little more reason but bottom in > bottom out makes it either way.
Cheers
Pete
--
http://www.GymRatZ.co.uk - Fitness+Gym Equipment.
http://www.bodysolid-gym-equipment.co.uk
http://www.trade-price-supplements.co.uk
http://www.water-rower.co.uk
Brian Gaff
Mar 15, 2012, 9:52:41 AM3/15/12
to
Well could be the mountings slipping as it expands I suppose.
Brian
--
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"Lieutenant Scott" <n...@spam.com> wrote in message
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Brian
--
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in the display name may be lost.
Blind user, so no pictures please!
"Lieutenant Scott" <n...@spam.com> wrote in message
news:op.wa7g3e0dytk5n5@i7-940...
Lobster
Mar 15, 2012, 10:50:44 AM3/15/12
to
On 15/03/2012 09:39, Lieutenant Scott wrote:
> Is there a way to stop a radiator going bang bang bang (well quieter
> than a bang) when it heats up?
Probably due to movement against its mounts as it heats up and expands.
> Is there a way to stop a radiator going bang bang bang (well quieter
> than a bang) when it heats up?
The mounts should normally have little u-shaped bits of plastic fitted
to support the radiator, to prevent metal-metal contact and enable the
rad to slide freely and noiselessly as it expands.
David
John Rumm
Mar 15, 2012, 12:06:30 PM3/15/12
to
On 15/03/2012 09:37, Lieutenant Scott wrote:
> On Thu, 15 Mar 2012 04:18:20 -0000, John Rumm
> <see.my.s...@nowhere.null> wrote:
>
>> On 15/03/2012 01:34, Lieutenant Scott wrote:
>>> Someone was telling me that it's important to connect the flow and
>>> return to the right ends of a radiator. But I cannot see a problem in
>>> water running the wrong way.
>>>
>>> "The wrong way" would mean water flowing into the radiator through the
>>> balance valve and out through the thermostatic valve, but the radiator
>>> is symmetrical, and the valves are not one way (are they?), so what
>>> would be the problem?
>>
>> Some TRVs are one way. Some are described as two but work better on the
>> flow side, and some are fine either way.
>
> I've seen some which can be positioned with the knob vertically or
> horizontally, I assume these take it either way.
Sounds like it...
> On Thu, 15 Mar 2012 04:18:20 -0000, John Rumm
> <see.my.s...@nowhere.null> wrote:
>
>> On 15/03/2012 01:34, Lieutenant Scott wrote:
>>> Someone was telling me that it's important to connect the flow and
>>> return to the right ends of a radiator. But I cannot see a problem in
>>> water running the wrong way.
>>>
>>> "The wrong way" would mean water flowing into the radiator through the
>>> balance valve and out through the thermostatic valve, but the radiator
>>> is symmetrical, and the valves are not one way (are they?), so what
>>> would be the problem?
>>
>> Some TRVs are one way. Some are described as two but work better on the
>> flow side, and some are fine either way.
>
> I've seen some which can be positioned with the knob vertically or
> horizontally, I assume these take it either way.
> (There's going to be a few naughty replies to the above line.....)
>
>>> The reason this came up is I'm plumbing in a new radiator and I've not
>>> marked which pipe is which that I've threaded out of sight under the
>>> floor. Although I can actually tell which is which as it's HEP pipe with
>>> metre markings on it, I wondered if I really have to know?
>>
>> Make sure the TRV is a two way one, and it should be ok.
>>
>> (Some of them begin to whistle a bit as they throttle the flow when on
>> the return side).
>
> I think I'll just connect the pipes correctly, in case of whistling
> (which would annoy the occupants (African Greys)) or future replacement
> of the valve by someone (or me being forgetful) who doesn't know the
getting a rad flowing the wrong way once. I was not particularly bother
about the direction since I was using reversible valves. However I found
that one became noisy as the valve did its thing, so ended up swapping
it round in the end since it was in a bedroom.
> pipes are backwards. I've been told by a plumber he's had to correct a
> flow/return mix-up which caused a radiator to only get luke warm.
> The HEP pipe metre markings will tell me which is which, as I bought a
> 50 metre length of pipe and used the two ends of the length to enter the
> house, with the middle being in the garage. Therefore the metre markings
> increase in one direction on one pipe and decrease on the other.
--
Lieutenant Scott
Mar 15, 2012, 3:20:12 PM3/15/12
to
Keyboard error - press any key to continue...
Dave Liquorice
Mar 15, 2012, 6:12:18 PM3/15/12
to
On Thu, 15 Mar 2012 19:20:12 -0000, Lieutenant Scott wrote:
> The new radiator which came with brackets had no such plastic, and I
> don't think any of the existing ones do either.
Can't say I've ever seen any plastci bits on the brackets or hoops on
> The new radiator which came with brackets had no such plastic, and I
> don't think any of the existing ones do either.
the back of radiators either.
> It only makes about 10-15 clonks about 1 a second.
Or if you can get at the bearing points with a long thin stick put a
tiny drop of engine oil on them.
--
Cheers
Dave.
Lieutenant Scott
Mar 15, 2012, 6:49:14 PM3/15/12
to
You can't please everyone. But it IS possible to piss 'em ALL off at the same time.
Alan Braggins
Mar 16, 2012, 5:39:03 AM3/16/12
to
In article <nyyfbegfubjuvyypb...@srv1.howhill.co.uk>, Dave Liquorice wrote:
>On Thu, 15 Mar 2012 19:20:12 -0000, Lieutenant Scott wrote:
>
>> The new radiator which came with brackets had no such plastic, and I
>> don't think any of the existing ones do either.
>
>Can't say I've ever seen any plastci bits on the brackets or hoops on
>the back of radiators either.
Mine came with little plastic clip on bits for the bracket.
>On Thu, 15 Mar 2012 19:20:12 -0000, Lieutenant Scott wrote:
>
>> The new radiator which came with brackets had no such plastic, and I
>> don't think any of the existing ones do either.
>
>Can't say I've ever seen any plastci bits on the brackets or hoops on
>the back of radiators either.
Lieutenant Scott
Mar 16, 2012, 1:50:10 PM3/16/12
to
A mistake is evidence that someone has tried to do something.
Andrew Gabriel
Mar 17, 2012, 7:23:53 AM3/17/12
to
In article <op.wa6unbmcytk5n5@i7-940>,
of the radiator. Flow can be into bottom or top.
--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]
"Lieutenant Scott" <n...@spam.com> writes:
> Someone was telling me that it's important to connect the flow and return to the right ends of a radiator. But I cannot see a problem in water running the wrong way.
>
> "The wrong way" would mean water flowing into the radiator through the balance valve and out through the thermostatic valve, but the radiator is symmetrical, and the valves are not one way (are they?), so what would be the problem?
>
> The reason this came up is I'm plumbing in a new radiator and I've not marked which pipe is which that I've threaded out of sight under the floor. Although I can actually tell which is which as it's HEP pipe with metre markings on it, I wondered if I really have to know?
>
The other important thing is that the return must be from the bottom
> Someone was telling me that it's important to connect the flow and return to the right ends of a radiator. But I cannot see a problem in water running the wrong way.
>
> "The wrong way" would mean water flowing into the radiator through the balance valve and out through the thermostatic valve, but the radiator is symmetrical, and the valves are not one way (are they?), so what would be the problem?
>
> The reason this came up is I'm plumbing in a new radiator and I've not marked which pipe is which that I've threaded out of sight under the floor. Although I can actually tell which is which as it's HEP pipe with metre markings on it, I wondered if I really have to know?
>
of the radiator. Flow can be into bottom or top.
--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]
Andrew Gabriel
Mar 17, 2012, 7:21:15 AM3/17/12
to
In article <op.wa9yhw1tytk5n5@i7-940>,
mine, but the other 8 or so have lasted 10 years so far (or at least,
don't make expansion/contraction noises), and 4 of them are heavy
triple panel radiators. (The ones that's failed is a double.)
"Lieutenant Scott" <n...@spam.com> writes:
> On Fri, 16 Mar 2012 09:39:03 -0000, Alan Braggins <ar...@chiark.greenend.org.uk> wrote:
>
>> In article <nyyfbegfubjuvyypb...@srv1.howhill.co.uk>, Dave Liquorice wrote:
>>> On Thu, 15 Mar 2012 19:20:12 -0000, Lieutenant Scott wrote:
>>>
>>>> The new radiator which came with brackets had no such plastic, and I
>>>> don't think any of the existing ones do either.
>>>
>>> Can't say I've ever seen any plastci bits on the brackets or hoops on
>>> the back of radiators either.
>>
>> Mine came with little plastic clip on bits for the bracket.
>
> I'm not convinced those would last long with the weight of the radiator and the sharpness of the metal brackets.
Sometimes the radiator does cut through them - has happened to one of
> On Fri, 16 Mar 2012 09:39:03 -0000, Alan Braggins <ar...@chiark.greenend.org.uk> wrote:
>
>> In article <nyyfbegfubjuvyypb...@srv1.howhill.co.uk>, Dave Liquorice wrote:
>>> On Thu, 15 Mar 2012 19:20:12 -0000, Lieutenant Scott wrote:
>>>
>>>> The new radiator which came with brackets had no such plastic, and I
>>>> don't think any of the existing ones do either.
>>>
>>> Can't say I've ever seen any plastci bits on the brackets or hoops on
>>> the back of radiators either.
>>
>> Mine came with little plastic clip on bits for the bracket.
>
> I'm not convinced those would last long with the weight of the radiator and the sharpness of the metal brackets.
mine, but the other 8 or so have lasted 10 years so far (or at least,
don't make expansion/contraction noises), and 4 of them are heavy
triple panel radiators. (The ones that's failed is a double.)
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