Making a door way wider

[comp.zrch.embedded]

I have a door way in a brick, non supporting wall. The stupid builder
when he put in the wall used a 27 inch door frame and I need to widen
the door frame to 30 inches, I did not specify door width, i.e. take 3
inches off one side of the frame. The old frame has a concrete lintel
above which seems to overhang 3 inches each side. My question is if I
cut the frame wider on one side do I need to replace the lintel or can
I get away with just the door frame? How much lintel overhang could I
get away with?
Thanks

[JimK]

On Mar 23, 12:11 pm, "comp.zrch.embedded" <sjo...@scannex.co.uk>
wrote:

"stupid builder" sounds like he had a "stupid" specification given to
him (if anything at all?)

technically it sounds like you need a new wider lintel.....Doesn't
holding a wall up with a door frame sound a bit iffy?

if you wanted a gamble can you not take 1.5inches of each side?
leaving a rather slim 1.5inches each side of the lintel (remaining in
the wall)??

If you get away with it the wall won;t fall down :>))

How do you propose to cut the slivers of brick/block from each side?

JimK

[Dave Starling]

On Mar 23, 12:30 pm, JimK <jk989...@googlemail.com> wrote:
> How do you propose to cut the slivers of brick/block from each side?
>
> JimK

Angle grinder? :)

dave

[comp.zrch.embedded]

Yes, I did not specify the required door width, I assumed, wrongly,
that he would put in a 30" door. I shall have to cut out the width,
and the lintel, with a angle grinder. Cutting out the old lintel I
assume will be more difficult and involve more plastering and possible
cracking brickwork above it.
Thanks

[george [dicegeorge]]

i'm not an expert,
but i'd stick 2 acro props under the lintel,
angle grind 1 1/2 inches off each side,
take out a few bricks at the top,
cement in good strong bricks under the 1 1/2 inch of lintel,
and cover it over quick before the bulding inspector notices
(if its really not load bearing)

or if you need a longer lintel
use acro props and 'strongboys'
which are easy to hire.

http://www.ejhire.co.uk/strongboypic.html

maybe best to do it properly like this.

[g]

[Phil]

On 23 Mar, 12:11, "comp.zrch.embedded" <sjo...@scannex.co.uk> wrote:
> I have a door way in a brick, non supporting wall. The stupid builder
> when he put in the wall used a 27 inch door frame and I need to widen
> the door frame to 30 inches, I did not specify door width, i.e. take 3
> inches off one side of the frame. The old frame has a concrete lintel
> above  which seems to overhang 3 inches each side. My question is if I
> cut the frame wider on one side do I need to replace the lintel or can
> I get away with just the door frame? How much lintel overhang could I
> get away with?
> Thanks

A lintel seems a bit of an overkill for only a 30" opening.
Assuming usual brick sizes and stretcher bond, there's about 6 bricks
unsupported above...

Phil.

[george [dicegeorge]]

second thoughts itd be a lot easier and less mess to only cut one side
of the opening to the width of a brick or half a brick,
using acrows and strongboys,
and you wouldnt have the nagging doubt of is it safe enough.

[g]

[JimK]

I'll knock em up, you pop em in :>)

[tin...@isbd.co.uk]

I know I get called pedantic *but* in this case the error causes
misunderstanding, it's a doorway, all one word.

"Making a door way wider" means (to me anyway) making a door *much*
wider, i.e. making it "way wider".

--
Chris Green

[Dave Starling]

On Mar 23, 5:39 pm, tinn...@isbd.co.uk wrote:
> I know I get called pedantic *but* in this case the error causes
> misunderstanding, it's a doorway, all one word.
>
> "Making a door way wider" means (to me anyway) making a door *much*
> wider, i.e. making it "way wider".

lol. The next thing will be to make the "door safe". I think safe is
chav slang for ok.

dave

[Falco]

tin...@isbd.co.uk wrote:
> comp.zrch.embedded <sjo...@scannex.co.uk> wrote:
>> I have a door way in a brick, non supporting wall. The stupid builder
>> when he put in the wall used a 27 inch door frame and I need to widen
>> the door frame to 30 inches, I did not specify door width, i.e. take
>> 3 inches off one side of the frame. The old frame has a concrete
>> lintel above which seems to overhang 3 inches each side. My
>> question is if I cut the frame wider on one side do I need to
>> replace the lintel or can I get away with just the door frame? How
>> much lintel overhang could I get away with?
>
> I know I get called pedantic *but* in this case the error causes
> misunderstanding, it's a doorway, all one word.

Well you may be grammatically correct, but you are incorrect with your "in
this case the error causes misunderstanding" - I know what he means, and I
presume that all those reading the post understands what the OP is saying.

> "Making a door way wider" means (to me anyway) making a door *much*
> wider, i.e. making it "way wider".

Being a pedant myself, would *YOU* explain the differences between making an
opening wider, much wider and way wider, as to me, they all mean exactly the
same?

Keeping the subject in context: if you increase a "door way" or "doorway" by
1mm or 1000mm - you simply widen the damn thing!

Now a question for *you* - do you know how to resolve the problem stated in
the OP [1]?

[1] Original Post[er] if you are unsure of the acronym.

[Cash]

comp.zrch.embedded,

Ignoring the fact that you did not specify the opening size - and the
builder is not a mind reader *and* has a choice of several sizes of doors,
and the apportionment of blame may be resting in the wrong place.

1 Lintol bearings -- 3" of bearing on either side is the absolute minimum
(and it should be at least 4")

2 Door frame -- If the wall really is non-load bearing, then I would
suspect that you really have a door lining rather than a 'frame', and if
that is the case, then it is inadvisable to use this to support any
brickwork and the lintol should be replaced with one of the correct length
and size - and this should be done before any attempt is made to widen the
opening.

3 Lintol replacement -- There are several ways to do this safely.

4 But before any method of replacement can be suggested, more
information is needed from you as to the height of the brickwork above the
lintol, and is the opening near any corners or other obstructions - the more
(relevant) information you can supply the better.

This information is needed to ascertain as to whether the bricks above the
lintol need supporting with needles and props - or to simply remove a couple
of courses of bricks and replace them after the lintol is renewed

Hope this helps

Cash

[Matty F]

On Mar 24, 1:51 am, "comp.zrch.embedded" <sjo...@scannex.co.uk> wrote:

> Yes, I did not specify the required door width, I assumed, wrongly,
> that he would put in a 30" door. I shall have to cut out the width,
> and the lintel, with a angle grinder. Cutting out the old lintel I
> assume will be more difficult and involve more plastering and possible
> cracking brickwork above it.

Are you happy to have an archway? in which case leave the lintel where
it is (but not a serious suggestion!)
If the bricks were in NZ or other countries that have earthquakes, the
bricks would not be load bearing because they are not allowed to be.

[Nightjar]

Necertheless, I have a door without a lintel where the door frame has
bowed enough under the weight of those bricks to cause the door to jam.
One of my round tuit moments will be to jack them up and fit a bit of 1"
equal angle iron under them and against the door frame. However, as the
door is not really essential, that is some way down the list.

Colin Bignell

[d...@gglz.com]

On 23 Mar, 12:11, "comp.zrch.embedded" <sjo...@scannex.co.uk> wrote:

Are you really absolutely certain that the lintel has no serious
supporting role (other than a very small number of bricks above) and
is unnecessary?

If so, a modest timber beam/plate should be sufficient.

But then why would your builder have gone to the trouble of installing
a concrete lintel in the first place?

[Nightjar]

d...@gglz.com wrote:
> On 23 Mar, 12:11, "comp.zrch.embedded" <sjo...@scannex.co.uk> wrote:
>> I have a door way in a brick, non supporting wall. The stupid builder
>> when he put in the wall used a 27 inch door frame and I need to widen
>> the door frame to 30 inches, I did not specify door width, i.e. take 3
>> inches off one side of the frame. The old frame has a concrete lintel
>> above which seems to overhang 3 inches each side. My question is if I
>> cut the frame wider on one side do I need to replace the lintel or can
>> I get away with just the door frame? How much lintel overhang could I
>> get away with?
>> Thanks
>
> Are you really absolutely certain that the lintel has no serious
> supporting role (other than a very small number of bricks above) and
> is unnecessary?

You can see it in old properties where the lintel has failed and the
brickwork has needed to be repaired. The lintle only directly supports a
triangle of bricks above it. In the case of a 27" gap ina stretcher
bond wall, a maximum of three bricks lie on the lintle. Because the
bonding holds the outer bricks in the row above that in place, those
three bricks support two in that next row. They, in turn support one
brick above them.

> If so, a modest timber beam/plate should be sufficient.

That is often what was used and later failed in buildings that have
needed the brickwork above to be repaired.

> But then why would your builder have gone to the trouble of installing
> a concrete lintel in the first place?

They are cheap and readily available and do keep the weight of the
bricks off the door frame.

Colin Bignell