Sonic watchman oil gauge?

[The Natural Philosopher]

Today a tanker arrived as arranged, and said that they had put 1000
liters of oil in my tank. With a delivery printout to prove it.


4 hours later the remote oil gauge is reporting that the tank is
completely empty..

yes, its getting signal - not a 'no signal' condition. But a 'tank empty
condition'

I will be going out into the murk with a dipstick of course, but can
anyone suggest WTF is happening, apart from the chilling prospect that
the tanker simply didn't put in anything at all?




--
To people who know nothing, anything is possible.
To people who know too much, it is a sad fact
that they know how little is really possible -
and how hard it is to achieve it.

[Davey]

On Mon, 11 Jun 2012 13:01:28 +0100
The Natural Philosopher <t...@invalid.invalid> wrote:

> Today a tanker arrived as arranged, and said that they had put 1000
> liters of oil in my tank. With a delivery printout to prove it.
>
>
> 4 hours later the remote oil gauge is reporting that the tank is
> completely empty..
>
> yes, its getting signal - not a 'no signal' condition. But a 'tank
> empty condition'
>
> I will be going out into the murk with a dipstick of course, but can
> anyone suggest WTF is happening, apart from the chilling prospect
> that the tanker simply didn't put in anything at all?
>
>
>
>

It is possible that the sender is not calibrated correctly, and the
level is now higher than what it thinks is the maximum possible,
causing the indication to 'flip over' to a default 'fault' reading.
If you find the dipstick reads 'very full', then I would say wait until
you have used some oil.
--
Davey.

[Alan Deane]

On 11/06/2012 13:01, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
> Today a tanker arrived as arranged, and said that they had put 1000
> liters of oil in my tank. With a delivery printout to prove it.
>
>
> 4 hours later the remote oil gauge is reporting that the tank is
> completely empty..
>
> yes, its getting signal - not a 'no signal' condition. But a 'tank empty
> condition'
>
> I will be going out into the murk with a dipstick of course, but can
> anyone suggest WTF is happening, apart from the chilling prospect that
> the tanker simply didn't put in anything at all?
>
>
>
>

Stuck float?

[The Natural Philosopher]

No. Its a 2500 liter tank and was calibrated correctly and has worked
perfectly for 9 months.

And I only put 1000 litres in. (allegedly)

No one holds stock in a falling market :-)

[The Natural Philosopher]

The key is in the use of the word 'sonic'

Use ultrasound as a depth gauge, not a float. measures time delay on
reflection of short sharp pulse.

[Dave Liquorice]

On Mon, 11 Jun 2012 13:55:26 +0100, Alan Deane wrote:

> Stuck float?

Doesn't have a float, "Sonic" is the clue. B-)

Does seem a bit of to indicate empty, you did order and not ask for
the tank to be emptied didn't you? Try retraining the Tx and Rx? Or
simply power cycle the Rx first to see if it's got confused.

--
Cheers
Dave.

[Davey]

On Mon, 11 Jun 2012 14:16:13 +0100

The Natural Philosopher <t...@invalid.invalid> wrote:

> Davey wrote:
> > On Mon, 11 Jun 2012 13:01:28 +0100
> > The Natural Philosopher <t...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
> >
> >> Today a tanker arrived as arranged, and said that they had put
> >> 1000 liters of oil in my tank. With a delivery printout to prove
> >> it.
> >>
> >>
> >> 4 hours later the remote oil gauge is reporting that the tank is
> >> completely empty..
> >>
> >> yes, its getting signal - not a 'no signal' condition. But a 'tank
> >> empty condition'
> >>
> >> I will be going out into the murk with a dipstick of course, but
> >> can anyone suggest WTF is happening, apart from the chilling
> >> prospect that the tanker simply didn't put in anything at all?
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> > It is possible that the sender is not calibrated correctly, and the
> > level is now higher than what it thinks is the maximum possible,
> > causing the indication to 'flip over' to a default 'fault' reading.
> > If you find the dipstick reads 'very full', then I would say wait
> > until you have used some oil.
> No. Its a 2500 liter tank and was calibrated correctly and has worked
> perfectly for 9 months.
>
> And I only put 1000 litres in. (allegedly)
>
> No one holds stock in a falling market :-)
>
>

How much was in it before the 1000 litre fill?
--
Davey.

[Martin Brown]

I think I would be out with a dipstick PDQ if it showed zero after
refilling since a 1000L oil spill could be expensive to clean up.
The Watchman indicator might just be telling the truth.

More likely that the sensor has got knocked or something. Either way
visual inspection ought to sort it out one way or the other.

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

[The Natural Philosopher]

I have stuck a bamboo in the tank, and the oil is there.


The gauge receiver is not indicating 'no transmission'

The gauge itself was loose - possibly the oil man unscrewed it instead
of the actual filler?

I have tightened it but still proper indication.


I think I had better see if they have any tech support.

[The Natural Philosopher]

Martin Brown wrote:
> On 11/06/2012 14:20, Dave Liquorice wrote:
>> On Mon, 11 Jun 2012 13:55:26 +0100, Alan Deane wrote:
>>
>>> Stuck float?
>>
>> Doesn't have a float, "Sonic" is the clue. B-)
>>
>> Does seem a bit of to indicate empty, you did order and not ask for
>> the tank to be emptied didn't you? Try retraining the Tx and Rx? Or
>> simply power cycle the Rx first to see if it's got confused.
>
> I think I would be out with a dipstick PDQ if it showed zero after
> refilling since a 1000L oil spill could be expensive to clean up.
> The Watchman indicator might just be telling the truth.
>

I just did. Oil is there at about the right level.

> More likely that the sensor has got knocked or something. Either way
> visual inspection ought to sort it out one way or the other.
>

I think it may have been unscrewed..but its odd that would make it seem
empty.

[The Natural Philosopher]

Bugger all. Apart from a ten minute burn a day for hot water and a
trickle into the aga there is little need for it so I let it run very
low as the oil prices were falling fast.

Even the aga will go off if summer ever arrives.

DWP finally just decided to pay my winter fuel allowance...6 months too
bloody late!

[Paul D Smith]

"The Natural Philosopher" <t...@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
news:jr4t5f$3la$1...@news.albasani.net...

> Dave Liquorice wrote:
>> On Mon, 11 Jun 2012 13:55:26 +0100, Alan Deane wrote:
>>
>>> Stuck float?
>>
>> Doesn't have a float, "Sonic" is the clue. B-)
>>
>> Does seem a bit of to indicate empty, you did order and not ask for
>> the tank to be emptied didn't you? Try retraining the Tx and Rx? Or
>> simply power cycle the Rx first to see if it's got confused.
>>
>
> I have stuck a bamboo in the tank, and the oil is there.
>
>
> The gauge receiver is not indicating 'no transmission'
>
> The gauge itself was loose - possibly the oil man unscrewed it instead of
> the actual filler?
>
> I have tightened it but still proper indication.
>
>
> I think I had better see if they have any tech support.

Instructions here...

http://www.commercialfuelsolutions.co.uk/downloads/manuals/oil_watchman_sonic.pdf

...but apparently the next transmission might not be for a couple of hours
so a long nervous wait perhaps?

Paul DS

[The Natural Philosopher]

Paul D Smith wrote:
> "The Natural Philosopher" <t...@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
> news:jr4t5f$3la$1...@news.albasani.net...
>> Dave Liquorice wrote:
>>> On Mon, 11 Jun 2012 13:55:26 +0100, Alan Deane wrote:
>>>
>>>> Stuck float?
>>>
>>> Doesn't have a float, "Sonic" is the clue. B-)
>>>
>>> Does seem a bit of to indicate empty, you did order and not ask for
>>> the tank to be emptied didn't you? Try retraining the Tx and Rx? Or
>>> simply power cycle the Rx first to see if it's got confused.
>>>
>>
>> I have stuck a bamboo in the tank, and the oil is there.
>>
>>
>> The gauge receiver is not indicating 'no transmission'
>>
>> The gauge itself was loose - possibly the oil man unscrewed it instead
>> of the actual filler?
>>
>> I have tightened it but still proper indication.
>>
>>
>> I think I had better see if they have any tech support.
>
> Instructions here...
>
> http://www.commercialfuelsolutions.co.uk/downloads/manuals/oil_watchman_sonic.pdf
>

Have that already :-)

>
> ...but apparently the next transmission might not be for a couple of
> hours so a long nervous wait perhaps?
>

Its been 6 hours already.

AND I switched off the receiver and after the usual delay, it showed a
reading...EMPTY.



> Paul DS

[Grimly Curmudgeon]

On Mon, 11 Jun 2012 13:01:28 +0100, The Natural Philosopher
<t...@invalid.invalid> wrote:

>I will be going out into the murk with a dipstick of course, but can
>anyone suggest WTF is happening, apart from the chilling prospect that
>the tanker simply didn't put in anything at all?

Assuming the tanker driver and the gauge are honest, and there are no
leaks - pikeys.

[The Natural Philosopher]

Well right now the gauge is not being honest.

I've lodged a query with the (Oirish!!) manufacturers.

[Martin Brown]

On 11/06/2012 14:51, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
> Dave Liquorice wrote:
>> On Mon, 11 Jun 2012 13:55:26 +0100, Alan Deane wrote:
>>
>>> Stuck float?
>>
>> Doesn't have a float, "Sonic" is the clue. B-)
>>
>> Does seem a bit of to indicate empty, you did order and not ask for
>> the tank to be emptied didn't you? Try retraining the Tx and Rx? Or
>> simply power cycle the Rx first to see if it's got confused.
>>
>
> I have stuck a bamboo in the tank, and the oil is there.

Good news then.

> The gauge receiver is not indicating 'no transmission'

ISTR it says "r" lower case if it is no signal. Or rather mine does.

> The gauge itself was loose - possibly the oil man unscrewed it instead
> of the actual filler?
>
> I have tightened it but still proper indication.
>
>
> I think I had better see if they have any tech support.

Before you do that allow the receiver to be offline for about 5 minutes
and then plug it in again. I have known them get into a bit of a tizzy
after mains brownouts. A cold reboot will usually clear it though.

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

[The Natural Philosopher]

Too late, but I will do that anyway.

[Dave Liquorice]

On Mon, 11 Jun 2012 14:52:30 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

> I just did. Oil is there at about the right level.

Well that's a relief I guess having just forked out about 600
squid...

> I think it may have been unscrewed..but its odd that would make it seem
> empty.

Depends how clever it is with the "no signal" indication. Does that
just mean it can "see" a sonic watchman but not the one it's trained
with or does it mean it can see the RF, decode the data, and know
it's the one it's trained to.

Have you tried retraining, as I guess that will be first thing tech
support tell you to do.

Another possibility is that the delivery man swapped your Tx for
another, hence the wondering about how clever the "no signal"
detection is. Or he didn't know what it was unscrewed it to find out,
dropped it and naggered it.

--
Cheers
Dave.

[The Natural Philosopher]

Mm. The latter may be the case.

The problem is a flashing red light means both 'new battery please' and
'you have bloody nearly run out of oil'

I guess the next step is measure the battery voltage and if good
retrain the bloody thing...

Watchman have not bothered to reply to my cries for help..

<fx: accent="Irish"> Now you didn't think we would be doing that, would
you?</fx>

[Brian Gaff]

Unless he sucked it out instead of putting it in of course...

Brian

--
--
From the sofa of Brian Gaff -
bri...@blueyonder.co.uk
Blind user, so no pictures please!
"Davey" <da...@example.invalid> wrote in message
news:jr4pco$s39$1...@n102.xanadu-bbs.net...

[Davey]

On Mon, 11 Jun 2012 16:53:55 +0100
"Brian Gaff" <bri...@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:

> Unless he sucked it out instead of putting it in of course...
>
> Brian
>

Valid point, except there wasn't enough in there beforehand to suck out
1000 litres, it seems. <g>
--
Davey.

[The Natural Philosopher]

well after a cold reboot, it seems to have discovered the oil.

Possible moving some of the metallic junk nearby has improved reception..

uk.d-i-y - 1
Watchman support - 0.

[harry]

On Jun 11, 1:01 pm, The Natural Philosopher <t...@invalid.invalid>
wrote:

The rain has f***d up the watchman.

[Dave Liquorice]

On Mon, 11 Jun 2012 18:32:34 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

> well after a cold reboot, it seems to have discovered the oil.

It's electronic and digital, cold boot cures far more things than it
should.

> Possible moving some of the metallic junk nearby has improved
> reception..
>
> uk.d-i-y - 1
> Watchman support - 0.

We have a Watchman Alarm, in the Rx's prefered for us location in the
bolier room it's about 12m from the Tx but also through a thick stone
wall and sort of along/through a similar wall for the 12m. It would
frequently but randomly false alarm. Got onto Kingspan (yes the same
Kingspan as insulation etc), not a great deal of help, sent it back
with covering letter with all my details, RMA number, fault
description etc. Waited, waited, waited some more, after a few months
rang 'em and they said glad you called we don't have your details to
return it, eh? they where on the covering letter and they had my
email address... "No Fault Found" of course. Since having it back
it's been faultless but it's not back in the boiler room yet and is
currently only about 2m from the Tx...

I'm not totally convinced about the alarm part either. I'm pretty
sure I unscrewed it from the top of the tank and carried it inside
without the alarm sounding, now if that isn't a sudden change in
"oil" level I don't know what is.

--
Cheers
Dave.

[Dave Liquorice]

On Mon, 11 Jun 2012 10:52:57 -0700 (PDT), harry wrote:

> The rain has f***d up the watchman.

You mean he's pulled the hood of his oil skins over his head,
retreated into his hut and put another shovel of coke into the
brazier.

--
Cheers
Dave.

[Rod Speed]

"The Natural Philosopher" <t...@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
news:jr4mmp$mag$1...@news.albasani.net...

> Today a tanker arrived as arranged, and said that they had put 1000
> liters of oil in my tank. With a delivery printout to prove it.
>
>
> 4 hours later the remote oil gauge is reporting that the tank is
> completely empty..
>
> yes, its getting signal - not a 'no signal' condition. But a 'tank empty
> condition'
>
> I will be going out into the murk with a dipstick of course, but can
> anyone suggest WTF is happening, apart from the chilling prospect that the
> tanker simply didn't put in anything at all?

Most likely the gauge has just failed.

[Rod Speed]

"Alan Deane" <alz_...@ajdeane.co.uk> wrote in message
news:5dd2c$4fd5eabe$c129607d$39...@usenext.xennanews.com...

It does say Sonic in the subject.

[Martin Brown]

On 11/06/2012 18:32, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
> Davey wrote:
>> On Mon, 11 Jun 2012 16:53:55 +0100
>> "Brian Gaff" <bri...@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>>> Unless he sucked it out instead of putting it in of course...
>>>
>>> Brian
>>>
>>
>> Valid point, except there wasn't enough in there beforehand to suck out
>> 1000 litres, it seems. <g>
>
> well after a cold reboot, it seems to have discovered the oil.

Good. There is something odd about the receiver when it gets into the
flashing red LED low oil state it doesn't always recover gracefully.

>
> Possible moving some of the metallic junk nearby has improved reception..
>
> uk.d-i-y - 1
> Watchman support - 0.

Might also have been the cessation of heavy rain or tightening the nut
on the sensor or ambient temperature rising bringing the battery voltage
up. Who can tell as long as it is working. It was 12C max outside here
yesterday - cold enough I was tempted to put the fire on!

I keep wondering how long the battery in the transmitter lasts - mine
has been run for nearly 9 years it will genuinely run out sometime.

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

[Davey]

I read that it was supposed to be a ten-year battery, when I had mine
installed last year. I would reckon on that, to be sure. Amazing that
it can last that long, and still send out a radio signal.
--
Davey.

[The Natural Philosopher]

I think the thing is that mostly it does sweet FA. It has some very low
current timer that wakes up every two hours and fires an ultrasonic
pulse at the oil, measures the delay and fires a coded RF burst back to
the receiver,.. Then it goes back to sleep.

[charles]

In article <jr79hu$nve$2...@news.albasani.net>,

The Natural Philosopher <t...@invalid.invalid> wrote:

but, while asleep it must consume some power, otherwise it doesn't know how
long its been asleep.

--
From KT24

Using a RISC OS computer running v5.18

[Davey]

On Tue, 12 Jun 2012 12:35:26 +0100

The Natural Philosopher <t...@invalid.invalid> wrote:

Possibly. But how would it recognise a rapid fall in oil level if it
was in a sleep session? I also know that the 'alarm' noise made by the
mains-powered receiving unit is not very loud at all, more of a
frenzied clicking sound. It should have a dry contact for the addition
of lights, bells, whistles etc.
--
Davey.

[Davey]

That only needs the same power consumption that a clock battery in your
PC uses, though, and that will last a long time. But yes, you are
correct.
--
Davey.

[Martin Brown]

Although that is true these days the power during CPU sleep can be sub
microamp and so the battery self discharge rate is often higher. It may
also have wake on loud ambient noise a the tank trick to detect addition
or subtraction of fuel.

I have a hunch that may ping the oil every ten/fifteen minutes but only
transmits an rf pulse back to base if something changes or every couple
of hours (to keep the base station happy).

Whatever it does the battery life at 10y outdoors is phenomenal.

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

[The Natural Philosopher]

yes..but with CMOS that can be almost immesurable.

A relaxation oscillator driving a MOS transistor with a relay in its
drain.. and 20 megohms of resistance charging the capacitr? all of
three volts? not more than 100 nanoamps.

The batteries are around 300mAh. TYats 3,000,000 hours. Or about 300
years. They reckon around ten years - most likely that is shelf life on
the battery. And they are only a couple of quid.

A vast improvement over the previous design that cost 30 quid to re
battery and only lasted 5 years.

[The Natural Philosopher]

Mine does not. I have dogs for that.

But again, the ultrasonics might be no more than a piezo click and an
ceramic mic. If the pulse duration is short its very low average power -
even if its a milliwatt peak. Likewise the radio transmission - what a
64byte packet at 2,4Ghz?. That's phenomenally short even if it resends
it 100 times!

Its the old principle of using high peak to mean ratios to lower power
consumption because you only have a very limited data rate.

[Dave Liquorice]

On Tue, 12 Jun 2012 13:17:27 +0100, Martin Brown wrote:

> I have a hunch that may ping the oil every ten/fifteen minutes but only
> transmits an rf pulse back to base if something changes or every couple
> of hours (to keep the base station happy).

On the Watchman Alarm when you have just trained the Tx and Rx and
the Rx is showing the level the indication moves in realtime
following the distance from the Tx to a hard object. No perceptable
lag. I don't think it stays in this realtime mode though and falls
asleep after a while.

--
Cheers
Dave.

[Martin Brown]

That makes sense for installation testing. I suspect it may also use
microphonic pick up from the transducer to do a CPU wake on noise. There
are CMOS amplifiers that require next to no power.

It is obviously quite cunning about power saving!

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

[Rod Speed]

"charles" <cha...@charleshope.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
news:529ea6c6...@charleshope.demon.co.uk...

Sure, but that can be so low that you get the shelf life of the battery.

[Andrew Mawson]

"Huge" wrote in message news:a3ps9p...@mid.individual.net...

>
>On 2012-06-12, Davey <da...@example.invalid> wrote:
>
>> I read that it was supposed to be a ten-year battery, when I had mine
>> installed last year. I would reckon on that, to be sure. Amazing that
>> it can last that long, and still send out a radio signal.
>

>The answer being it only sends intermittently. Very intermittently.
>
>

I have three heating tanks, each with a Watchman, and the 'special
batteries' in each case are AA cells stacked in a length of 15 mm copper
pipe and soldered to (I think) and F type connector. Careful cutting of the
pipe allows replacement, and a slip coupler compression joint completes the
job.

AWEM

[The Natural Philosopher]

well if you want another of those with a dead battery say so

I decided I couldnt be arsed and a new watchman with a ten year battery
was almost as cheap as a new battery for one of those...

[tug...@gmail.com]

I have got the opposite gauge says full and I know it's half empty

[Martin Brown]

On 15/03/2017 13:45, tug...@gmail.com wrote:

> I have got the opposite gauge says full and I know it's half empty

Cobweb or something else obstructing the sensor path?

My old sight glass was way more unreliable.

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

[secb...@gmail.com]

On Wednesday, 15 March 2017 13:45:28 UTC, tug...@gmail.com wrote:
> I have got the opposite gauge says full and I know it's half empty

Did you find out why it was saying full when half empty? Having same problem at moment.

[bootman]

replying to The Natural Philosopher, bootman wrote:
Our sonic watchman always reads full


--
for full context, visit https://www.homeownershub.com/uk-diy/sonic-watchman-oil-gauge-813629-.htm

[alan_m]

On 28/03/2019 11:14, bootman wrote:
> replying to The Natural Philosopher, bootman wrote:
> Our sonic watchman always  reads full
>
>

Probably because the installer didn't drill a hole in the tank before
fitting the sensor.

--
mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk

[The Natural Philosopher]

On 29/03/2019 08:33, alan_m wrote:
> On 28/03/2019 11:14, bootman wrote:
>> replying to The Natural Philosopher, bootman wrote:
>> Our sonic watchman always  reads full
>>
>>
>
> Probably because the installer didn't drill a hole in the tank before
> fitting the sensor.
>

Interstingly enough I ended up buying a new one but it has not been 100%
relaible.


First of all it went on slightly on te skew and didnt work. I thne took
it out and suspneded it over the kitchen floor to sestablish it di sort
of work at 3 foot range frim te reveiver.

So I replaved the mounting plates as well.

Having got it exactly square to the oil surface - or as near as can be
done with a tank that slopes slightly - it now monitors oil level;
correctly , when it works at all.


I have found the one socket in the kichen (curiously close to te TV
socket thats sits behid a broadband amp that boosts everytng from
100Mhz-800Mz from two aerials in the roof) where it works *most* of the
time. Wind, low tempertures, heavy rain? - and it sits there saying 'no
signal'. Till I reboot it.

Frankly its crap compatred to the older ones with the captaitance sensors.

And a proper aerial.

- Its hyper critical on installation angle
- its very poorly sealed against rain and very hard to reassemble to get
a good O-ring seal after battery replacement
- Transmitter power is totally inadequate and so is its internal antenna
- Its fault reportng and fault recovery algortithms are not as decsribed
in the manual, nor are they effective. Ther peroid before 'no signal'
kicks in is MUCH less than the 24 hours they say, and the condition can
only be cleared by a reboot. I..e one missed signal and the thing stops
working permanently until power cycled.

It is however *just about* usable. compared with going out in the cold
climbing a ladder unscrewing te filler cap and sticking a rod in the tank.










--
I would rather have questions that cannot be answered...
...than to have answers that cannot be questioned

Richard Feynman

[Vir Campestris]

On 29/03/2019 10:46, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
> Interstingly enough I ended up buying a new one but it has not been 100%
> relaible.

<me too>
On my list of jobs is to re-pair the transmitter and receiver to try to
get them to go. And this is with a tank inside its own private room.

>
> It is however *just about* usable. compared with going out in the cold
> climbing a ladder unscrewing te filler cap and sticking a rod in the tank.

The old tank had a sight glass. Pull a tap on the side, and look at the
level in a plastic tube. Accurate to the mm, which I gradually worked
out was about a litre.

I wish I still had it.

Andy

[The Natural Philosopher]

On 01/04/2019 21:58, Vir Campestris wrote:
> On 29/03/2019 10:46, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>> Interstingly enough I ended up buying a new one but it has not been
>> 100% relaible.
>
> <me too>
> On my list of jobs is to re-pair the transmitter and receiver to try to
> get them to go. And this is with a tank inside its own private room.

Dont even try.

I think next time I will buid somethng with a raspberry Pi..

>
>>
>> It is however *just about* usable. compared with going out in the cold
>> climbing a ladder unscrewing te filler cap and sticking a rod in the
>> tank.
>
> The old tank had a sight glass. Pull a tap on the side, and look at the
> level in a plastic tube. Accurate to the mm, which I gradually worked
> out was about a litre.
>
> I wish I still had it.
>

IME one year on and the 'glass' is yellow and totally opaque.

> Andy


--
Socialism is the philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance and the
gospel of envy.

Its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery.

Winston Churchill

[Thomas Prufer]

On Mon, 1 Apr 2019 21:58:32 +0100, Vir Campestris
<vir.cam...@invalid.invalid> wrote:

>
>The old tank had a sight glass. Pull a tap on the side, and look at the
>level in a plastic tube. Accurate to the mm, which I gradually worked
>out was about a litre.
>
>I wish I still had it.

Just thinking: if you built a tank bubbler, and used a U-tube manometer with the
oil in the tank as the working fluid, wouldn't the height difference in the
U-bend be the level of oil in the tank?

<ttps://instrumentationforum.com/t/what-is-bubbler-level-meter-bubbler-level-principle/7230>

Like the second drawing in the link above, only with a rubber squeezyball or
such as an air supply... No extra holes in the tank, no leak if the contraption
fails.


Thomas Prufer

[Andy Burns]

Thomas Prufer wrote:

> Just thinking: if you built a tank bubbler, and used a U-tube manometer with the
> oil in the tank as the working fluid, wouldn't the height difference in the
> U-bend be the level of oil in the tank?
>
> <ttps://instrumentationforum.com/t/what-is-bubbler-level-meter-bubbler-level-principle/7230>
>
> Like the second drawing in the link above, only with a rubber squeezyball or
> such as an air supply... No extra holes in the tank, no leak if the contraption
> fails.

It seems like it relies on a regulated flow of gas, if you tried to
"pump" it from a small rubber ball (e.g. similar to a sphygmomanometer,
which is what I think you're suggesting) wouldn't you just set off an
oscillation in the 'U' tube than get a steady reading?

[Thomas Prufer]

On Wed, 3 Apr 2019 08:33:48 +0100, Andy Burns <use...@andyburns.uk> wrote:

>It seems like it relies on a regulated flow of gas, if you tried to
>"pump" it from a small rubber ball (e.g. similar to a sphygmomanometer,
>which is what I think you're suggesting) wouldn't you just set off an
>oscillation in the 'U' tube than get a steady reading?

Yes, possibly.(Though I was thinking of a rubber-ball-pump that inflates a
balloon-like thing inna net, and a small orifice lets through a steady stream of
air... my google-fu is insufficient to find a picture). But using a
non-return-valve and pumping until the maximum is reached would work, I think.


There's such thing, ready-made, Treznal, with an atrocious translation:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Afriso-Unitel-Pneumatische-F%C3%BCllstandsmessung-72500/dp/B00J2QFV52


Little pump thing an the right, pump it, and it reads 0%-100% (though I haven't
found if it's adjustable to read 100% for different tank depths...), and it has
a hose dropped to the bottom of the tank, nothing else.


Thomas Prufer